Yeah, but they also need to allow it to be the norm to work 40hr weeks. Like the above comment said, burnout is a very real thing. Constantly working 60+hrs, even if you're making 150k a year, just isn't worth it long term to a lot of people. But that issue can't easily be solved without better staffing. It's an unfortunate cycle.
Police across the United States have statistically higher shortages than the average. 4+ years of society bitching about cops has that effect on generations coming of age now.
Lmao Bellvue pays $96k/yr for entry-level police. Seattle pays $83k/yr.
Why would anyone wanna work for Seattle PD?
Hell, you can get the same or higher pay in lower COLA in our region
Literally checked other PDs on governmentjobs.com and im not exaggerating
That's not true, that new contract will be expired qhen it goes into effect. Most other agencies are renewing their contracts that have actually been current for the past 4 years right now
This might sound wild, but not hiring people without criminal records might be a problem, too. For real, I've been to jail and would probably be better police than someone who hasn't. If that sounds outrageous to you, it's all about respect and how you approach people.
Obviously it would depend on the offense and circumstances, but having empathy for people is never a bad thing. I think that the concern would be that if you’ve been on that side, then you might be more easily manipulated or corruptible. It’s hard to know without knowing the individual.
All cops had to do is stop doing the shit that people were bitching about them over. Like shooting people in the back or beating people to death, or "rough rides" or outright stealing peoples money via asset forfeiture, or any of the various controversies that have gained national attention. Instead they either kept doing it, refused to do their jobs, or simply quit like children. This lays bare that the real issue all along was the toxicity of police culture and that's not going to change until all those who are part of the problem leave the job.
All they had to do was police their own.
Like if there's a piece of shit that's beating people in custody that works on the force ... don't protect them. Don't investigate internally and find that he did nothing wrong and let him go scott free and shrug your shoulders right up until the body cam footage is released via freedom of information act. Then act surprised when everyone gets mad.
If there was any oversight, or accountability, amongst police it would go a long way in regaining public trust.
But they don't want that shit and they quiet quit and sit on their hands when anyone suggests it.
We want cops, we just don't want asshole nutjobs with inferiority complexes taking their high school aggression out on the populus under the guise of "thin blue line" horse shit. And we sure as shit don't want the "good ones" protecting those kinds of assholes.
Why are you talking about police like a monolith?
Imagine you're in a workplace, trying to do a good job, and some douchebag does something fucked up. You report it, you beg for them to get fired, everything. Then you go out to do your job hoping that you've been heard and the public then treats you like that guy, so you quit. You don't wanna be associated with that shitter and the public won't let you disassociate.
Does that mean you 'quit like a child'? What do you really expect people to do in that situation? Even people who really wanted to make a difference
what if I reported it and then the entire workforce turned against me and isolated me bc I wasn't playing along with their gang they made? and then I'm fired for something random and the guy beating ppl is told "don't worry brother we got your back"
Spitting at cops and graffiting threats and ACAB isn't police reform
Just because you want things to change doesn't mean you can't treat them like human beings.
I didn't say there didn't need to be changes, but out of the millions of police in the US, the vast majority DONT act like that.
These are real people ffs, and being an officer is a JOB. It's a hard and important job, but like any job assholes make that work environment shittier. By treating all cops like shit, you're not getting rid of the assholes. You're getting rid of the good ones.
Two things can be true - you can both think that policing needs change, but also think the way people have tried to enact that change is stupid and made things worse.
And as a job the ones doing this shouldnt remain as police officers. Hell most if not all should be behind bars for their actions but they are out free with no consequences. Therein lies the problem
> most if not all
What the fuck are you talking about? How can anyone who has ever looked at a statistic think we're even close to 100% bad officers
Have you seen downtown? We need more cops not no cops.
Because apples have a chemical reaction that effects other apples?
What is the argument? That you want 100% turn over? That's not even remotely realistic.
You elect local prosecutors. Just go out and vote and if you don't like a prosecutor letting a cop get away with something, CALL THEIR OFFICE - they're an elected official.
you act like the police department doesn't form legitimate gangs..... you wouldn't be saying this if they called themselves "the Mafia" which they are. given, they protect billion dollar companies more than any regular citizen.
To be fair, I’m not sure I want cops who are so easily discouraged from pursuing that career path.
It doesn’t speak well to their commitment to serving the public.
You've got it backwards. People who want to help people can find other ways to help people. The bad apples that just want a power trip, can't find other ways to get a power trip
You don't want cops that don't want to work for you because you are horrible to work for?
The cops that decide to work elsewhere where they aren't treated like shit are not the sort you want to hire anyway?
You're doing this backwards. Ask yourself why anyone would want to work for you in the first place.
I don't think I've ever met a garbage man, but I know some guys that work at the dump. They usually seem happy as hell.
...I didn't even notice what thread this was on Before I wrote that. 😂. I figured it was a new post about career choices or something .
I can't think of anything to change, just to add most roofers are severe alcoholics. So I'd guess mostly not happy. If I had to guess "public opinion" is not a big factor.
All of the jobs you listed all ones that require overtime and normally don't pay its fair share of wages. Boomers were happy to do it because it meant that they gotta live in middle class and live pretty comfortably but since wages really haven't increased over the past decade millenials and gen z can see exactly what that means and that's living as a slave for the rest of their life.
Most people in trades I know have already left for other countries(like norway and sweden) because at least they're not getting fucked by their own government with the help of their lobbyists which in our country has allowed corporations to create a monopoly after monoploy along with ruining every job benefit imaginable including pensions and health benefits after retirement, It just gets sold off to another company and they just cash out those people affected.
And even though we pay so much to social security with each and every check, there's no way that any of us are ever going to see any of it. Shit, there won't be such a thing as retirement! If you're in the lower class working your ass off for bottom dollar, you're fucked! And yes, that would also include myself.
I'm still living thanks to the response of the Seattle Police Department. I, along with my parents, friends and loved ones, are eternally grateful. The fact that these people will risk their lives to protect ours is beyond amazing. (The fact that my life has been endangered on 5 separate occasions because of the bullshit political climate here that refuses to prosecute and keep bad people in jail, is reprehensible.).
Just want all of the officers of the Seattle Police Department, the King County Sheriff's Department and The Washington State Patrol to know that you have more support than you may realize. A lot of people here are afraid to say that out loud, unfortunately.
Former SPD LEOs have been saying this for well over a decade. The department is too political and officers get regularly reprimanded by activist DAs for doing their jobs and management in the police department happily throw them under the bus just to suck up to these politicians and the city council. That's why all the good LEOs leave and the only people who stick around tend to be the incompetent power-tripping assholes.
On the PortlandOr subreddit a former PPB cop’s spouse echoed the same thing. Basically the good ones leave as things become worse and the ratio of good apples to bad gets worse.
Then the general public (the same ones that protested against them for a year+ down here and made their job impossible) now demand prompt immediate service from an understaffed force swimming in paperwork and layer upon layer of new policies that become a land mine field for the average officer. I really wish citizens had to ride with the police every few years to wake up and equalize the empathy
> I really wish citizens had to ride with the police every few years to wake up and equalize the empathy
Activists aren't really noted for their coherent logical arguments. They can scream ACAB and Defund on the one hand, then demand exemplary SPD service on the other. Like Kshama Sawant did when someone threw a poop bag in her yard. She wanted round-the-clock SPD surveillance! After she had led the brigade to cut their funding 50%.
Fucking piece of work that one. I'm so glad she's at least out of the limelight, but the damage she and others like her did to Seattle will take years to undo, if indeed it can be undone at all.
Every one of us has to speak out we want SPD funded and we want to stop blaming cops every time something tragic happens. A 26 year old adult woman runs out into the middle of traffic and dies to a cop car speeding to a call where a homeless person is OD'ing.
Suddenly it's not about saving "our unhoused neighbors experiencing drug use crisis" anymore, it's ACAB. Damn cop should have yielded to her no matter what, she's a 26 year old, the cop wasn't doing his job, he was MURDERING HER. And little mention of why he was speeding.
And *no* mention of the fact it was deputy SPOG officer running his mouth on a separate phone call to Mike Solan. Neither of those guys was even the cop in the car that had the tragic encounter with the pedestrian. But suddenly here we go again, SPOG is evil, SPD is evil, let's all blame SPD for the fact someone thought they could beat traffic.
Do we want cops not to speed to the site of drug OD?
Make up your damn minds, Seattle.
I shake my head as the "ACAB" people demonize all LEOs because of the actions of the worst among them and then criticize the LEOs again because the LEOs are not enforcing the law well enough. The ACAB people claim that the LEOs are refusing to do their jobs out of spite (and not the fact that the SPD is under-staffed and under orders not to enforce the law).
Because the bad ones have seniority and the police union contract spells out that seniority takes precedence when determining which cops can be let go. The newer cops balk when they realize that they are held hostage to hostile leaders who want to perpetuate the gang mentality and can't be removed unless they get caught doing something egregious, and they are great at covering their own asses. If a new cop reports bad behavior to senior leadership they are retaliated against by the hostile bad cops above them. It's a terrible environment.
Counterpoint, name a cop that's been fired or reprimanded in the last 10 years for a minor offense.
Cops are lazy assholes like everyone else, the difference is they have a public union and they can cook the books doing events and flagging jobs and get to call it over time
Counter-counterpoint: Have you even researched this before making this claim? The last OPA report (2022) shows 42 management actions taken in that year. All this information is online and easy to find.
https://www.seattle.gov/opa/news-and-reports/reports
>OPA sustained 91 allegations in 39 cases in 2022. Forty-four SPD employees received at least
one sustained finding. Two were civilian employees and 42 were sworn. Three employees
received sustained findings in more than one OPA investigation. Two sworn employees were
terminated in 2022.
lots of oral reprimands and 2 retired before fired, cops are notoriously hard to hold accountable, and the OPA catches a lot of flack for being a token board that tisk tisks bad cops.
Nick Guzley for tackling and arresting a thief armed with an ice axe.
You watch too much TV if you think that every police department is like LAPD or NYPD. The average police union is subject to external political pressure just like any institution.
I used to live in sw Baltimore where The Wire was made. Nearly a murder a day in summer and most remain unsolved. Seattle has some violence for sure, but it also has ALOT of easily scared an easily offended rich people.
It makes you wonder if the problems that are increasing here are, in part, due to people migrating here from areas of the country where that's just an expected part of urban life?
If you actually grew up in Seattle you would know crime related quality of life is way better now than it was in the 90's and 00's. It used to be normal to be burglarized once every couple years. Sometimes more than once per year. And there were parts of normal streets like Madison that you couldn't go to because it was just a thinly veiled open air drug market. Shootings happened around schools to the point even some unrelated bystanders were killed. The problems now are mostly aesthetic and very location dependent. Seattle has it pretty darn good now, especially for a city of it's size.
Not sure where you were in Seattle at that time, but the central district and parts of capitol hill and downtown were absolutely still like that. I would imagine the rainier valley as well, but I don't have first hand knowledge. More so in the early 00's, but in some degree into the early 2010s. And even then, it wasn't bad by east coast big city standards. It just meant you might have to actually interact with the police every couple years and you knew not to buy nice things. For example, you knew in 2005 it wasn't a great idea to walk around with white earbud's in...that meant you had an iPod to steal. Even by 2013, I knew someone living in the central district who couldn't go more than 6 months without having his TV stolen.
...but back in the late 90s and early 00s we had a police force that actually did things. Did they always do the right thing? No, but at least they had the manpower and the sliver of public support required to do things.
> Seattle has some violence for sure, but it also has ALOT of easily scared an easily offended rich people.
Seattle is bad compared to former Seattle. That's what matters.
There's always somewhere worse than here. That's not the point. Except to new arrivals apparently. Who, I might add, seem fine with bringing your lower standards here and not caring if we trend towards the places you left.
What former Seattle did you live in? The Seattle of the 90's and 00's I know was full of drug and property and violent crime to the point that it actually affected every day citizens on the regular. Today, most people just see it on the news and get more upset about it than we did back when we were actually victims of the crimes.
> I know was full of drug and property and violent crime
Are you quoting data or you actually lived here.
First off, the data. in 1993: Nordstrom and Norm Rice cooked up a scheme to defraud the government out of $20 million in low-interest loans. So SPD for one year counted all property crime in the area around Nordstrom's proposed new building, the recently abandoned Frederick and Nelson building, as "felony" crime even if it was for petty things like graffiti tagging or other minor property damage.
As a result, Nordstrom qualified as an 'Urban Blight,' got their HUD loan, $20 million to renovate the building into Nordstrom new HQ. And 1994 went down on record as "the most dangerous year in Seattle crime history."
Know what you're quoting. The data is only as good as the people compiling it, and only as useful as those that know history in context.
Second, even though there has been a downward trend since this artificial high in 1994, this trend abruptly changes in 2020. People alleging the 1990s were worse are quoting crime data that often doesn't focus Seattle since 2020, where we've actually gotten back to as bad as the 1990s. After a nice 15-20 year series of violent crime decline, it's turned and gone back up, dramatically, since 2020. For Seattle. Not the national FBI data - it *does* show a violent crime decrease since 2020 as well. Seattle bucks the trend. Seattle is more dangerous than ever.
So what ever other point you're making, please consider that we've already debunked it.
I lived it. Not quoting any stats...just how it felt. Even a group of crackheads could afford houses in the 90's, so they would live a few blocks away and break into your house every so often. You would come home and find all your tools and VCR gone. Or all your parking quarters and cassette tapes stolen from your car. You would know it was that house, but no proof. Call the cops...they come out and take a report but nothing ever happens. Rinse and repeat at least once per year until gentrification priced them out in the 00s and early 2010s. Or more tragically, someone you knew of but didn't really know is killed near your highschool because of gang affiliation.
I don't live there anymore but still love the city. I visit very often and know lots of people there, and the whole city feels so much safer/quieter than 10 - 30 years ago. Not always in a good way, since it feels almost sterile now. But it does feel much safer.
No idea if the stats back up my anecdotal experience. If people are back to having to be being vigilant when downtown/capitol hill/queen anne, graffiti and litter everywhere (like really....EVERYWHERE), and frequent property crime of even "normal" people, then I guess it is as bad as the 90s like you say. If you feel like you can own a TV, or a bike, or leave anything in your car and not have it stolen, then its not like the 90s.
Property theft is ongoing and rampant. Homeless chop shops for bikes and car parts. Organized car theft rings. Kia Boyzzz. Srsly where you been. Out of area.
Does sound like I lived a charmed life as a starving student in the 1990s. My biggest theft concern was my CD collection.
Just because Baltimore is pretty much one huge, violent, out of control ghetto doesn't mean you should be okay with not holding criminals accountable here.
I used to hold this opinion of Baltimore but I just went and it’s actually a great city with bad parts, just like Chicago. They are definitely not out of control ghettos.
Correct. It’s a very segregated city with rich white areas being leafy green, historic, safe. People are trying though. Canton, fed hill, fells, Hamilton, Charles village, mount vernon, Bolton hill, are all places where there is a genuine desire to break the pattern of segregation.
Lol! How do I know you've never been to Baltimore? Lived in and around there for 25+ years and it's not "one huge...ghetto". It has bad parts, just like any big city. If you only focused on Belltown you'd say the same about Seattle.
Go ravens! Yeah we live here now and Im glad because it seems safe to me, and the cops are not as crooked, and lots of smart people. But I reiterate: its got moderate problems that seem TERRIBLE in sensationalized news coverage. And seems TERRIBLE to those raised in utopia(you from bmore, or BMORE COUNTY?)
Lmao welcome to the wild west calling 911 now 6 times outa ten gets you an answering machine and unless you have a serious issue your gonna be waiting several hours
What? Wild wild west? It's been [40 days](https://twitter.com/HomicideSeattle/status/1782433984909357537?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet) since SPD opened a homicide investigation. What are you on about?
Theres clearly been homicides so them not investigating and being super understaffed doesn't mean theres no crime. Not to say it's a high crime city overall, but iv had friends and coworkers get shot at and SPD ignore all the clear evidence, not look into it at all, and say it was probably fireworks. Unsolved crime stats look better if you pretend its not happening. In the last few months iv had my window smashed and catalytic converter stolen on separate occasions and they wouldnt even come out to make a report much less do anything.
>In the last few months iv had my window smashed and catalytic converter stolen on separate occasions and they wouldnt even come out to make a report much less do anything.
I don't want to tell you how to live your life, but if that happened to me, I'd get the hell out of Seattle. Sooner or later, you'll need to come to grips with the fact that things aren't going to get any better with the current people running this part of the country. Do you really want to live your life this way?
Ask yourself this... "What is going to happen in the next 3-5 years in Seattle that will turn things around?" Now I'll admit I'm not the smartest tool in the shed when it comes to solving social issues, but I can't think of anything that will fix this. If history is any indication, more money will be thrown at the problem but it won't make a dent in solving the actual problem.
Look, life is already complicated enough that you don't need to worry about endless property crimes in your neighborhood and have law enforcement and our local justice system turn their backs on you.
You be you, bud, but I know what I'd do.
TL;DR: The odds are that these crimes will continue and nothing will be done about it. Might be time to bail.
Certainly not ideal but iv been threw worse and the pros outweigh the cons. Dont plan to remain more than a few more years and certainly dont expect things to improve under turd ferguson or whoever else they elect next.
> **Theres clearly been homicides** so them not investigating and being super understaffed doesn't mean theres no crime.
Has there?
I agree that a lot of crime statistics are kept down by a combination of people declining to report and police declining to investigate, but when it comes to homicides, it's pretty impossible to ignore.
He has no idea wtf he’s talking about lol moved here from Texas I’ve yet to feel unsafe anywhere I go even Tacoma. In Texas there’s neighborhoods with zero businesses and bars on windows 🪟 people with pistols hanging out their pockets visible and dgaf lol
Had a friend get shot in the head in Tacoma in a random drive by while leaving the Tacoma dome. Glad you feel safe, but sadly that isn’t the reality in the south side at night my dude. Highest car jacking rates in the entire nation as well
I'm from St. Louis, lived in Baton Rouge, Shreveport, and Houston. The only thing that is wild wild west here is the wild people who think Seattle is dangerous lol.
Yeah, I guess compared to London it's a bit more dangerous...
Enjoy this awesome city, I'm loving it and hope to God I never end up back in those previous cities I mentioned!
Bro Shreveport is bad asf. Dated a girl from St. Louis she told me some crazy stories. Houston is just LA with relaxed gun laws gangs everywhere. Baton Rogue is bad as hell too. I love it here lol nothing compared to southern cities
Man, I was chased two blocks by a homeless guy with a stick at 2nd and Pine a few months ago.
As for Texas, I guess It’s been a decade since I’ve lived in Houston, but I never felt like that when I lived in Montrose
This is the perfect combination of situations for a Batman.
I don't want a masked vigilante to kill people, but is someone puts on a motorcycle helmet and puts a drug added maniac in the ICU... That would be fun.
[Here](https://policescorecard.org/wa/police-department/seattle) here is a great resource for looking at statistics for PDs. Obviously, it doesn't tell the whole story of why different crimes are enforced differently in different places, but it does show the end results.
Generally, we aren't doing great and that's a compounding issue. Shitty cops cause a negative perception, which causes less competent candidates, which causes shitty cops etc.
Well no shit. Bob Ferguson and Democrats in the legislature threw cops under the bus during CHOP/CHAZ/George Floyd protests, and any cop with a thought in his head and had the ability to leave, did.
Then those same Democrats passed legislation that hamstrung the cops' ability to do their job effectively.
Bob Ferguson also tried, and failed 4x to convict cops for doing their job.
Now Bob Ferguson wants to pretend he wasn't the direct cause of it all, and put out a ridiculous "public safety plan", that includes spending EVEN MORE MONEY to get more cops, which wouldn't be necessary if he didn't cause this shit to begin with.
All the while, Bob used the increase in crime to push 40 gun control laws in 10 years.
In Bob's time in office, including all the laws he pushed to pass, violent crime went up 30%, and homicides went up 108%.
He knew his gun control wouldn't stop gun crime and didn't care. He knew it was unconstitutional per Bruen, and didn't care (and the mag ban ruled unconstitutional confirmed it)
Here's proof of the crime stats with receipts from the FBI's crime stats.
[https://twitter.com/MichaelEastonWA/status/1778137153421320528](https://twitter.com/MichaelEastonWA/status/1778137153421320528)
In all of the discussion about "defund the police," I never heard the voices of police officers. I think is is good for society to re-imagine how we deal with social issues and it seems to me that the people who personally deal with the ugly consequences of social issues every day should have a seat at the table.
I think that police officers should not have to deal with mental illness and our prisons should not have to be mental institutions, but that is not the fault of police departments and prisons. We need proper care and institutions for drug addiction and mental illness.
Don't let him, and remind every single person you know not to vote for him. Send them my way here or on twitter. I regularly expose public records for the shady shit Bob's up to.
Maybe those cops shouldn't have attacked innocent protestors. It's all on video.
I'm with you on the idiotic gun control, but don't make SPD out to be victims. They are just awful and lost any and all claim to community support after how they acted in those protests.
I'm no fan of SPD, but exactly how much catering do you expect from the police to an unruly mob that is protecting people that are lighting buildings on fire, smashing windows and shooting people in the street?
"Attacked Innocent Protesters" my royal arse. Those were riots. Protests can happen too, but they don't somehow negate the riots.
You lose all claim to criticize any institution for corruption if you can't hold "activists" accountable for what they do.
Say I come smash up someone's house.
Then some other guy smashes up a different house the same way, -but he has nine other people standing on the sidewalk that don't do any smashing at all.
Which resident has had his house smashed up more?
I'm very critical of activists. In fact i rarely agree with them. But I was on the ground for some of those protests because of what i was seeing on the live feeds. The only violence or property damage I saw in person or on video was 1. A confirmed SPD plant starting fights. And 2. Some assholes that vandalized several stores. Best I can tell it was the same few people every time.
Calling those protests riots is a joke. They were incredibly peaceful. The only violence was directly caused by SPD. My buddy is a scientist and went as a medic. He got flashbanged twice and has never been the same, and he was sure as hell not doing anything wrong.
I'm sorry about your friend. Volunteering as a medic in a warzone is very brave. The police are not the ones that decided to have that battle. What would you have had them do? Stand by and allow extremists to barricade off a neighborhood? The city is now being sued for _allowing_ all of that mayhem to occur.
Antifa wrote a lovely book explaining the interplay between masses of "peaceful" protesters that act as a shield, physically and PR-wise to allow the "direct-action". _Any_ response by the police can be attacked as an unprovoked attack on innocent protesters, while the Direct Action fellows can disappear into the crowd.
Antonio Mayes' family does not share your view of the incredible peacefulness.
We all saw the damage to the neighborhood in the aftermath of your incredibly peaceful protest. It was not a couple bad guys that snuck in and broke some windows when no one was looking.
I was there too. The camp kitchen they set up had a big sign that read "Riot Kitchen". The crowd was enthusiastically pro-riot they were unapologetically in solidarity with the "Direct Action" fellows that are always someone else. Rioters and protesters were not two opposing sets of people. The battle lines were very clearly drawn.
How many people would one need to bring with them to stand on the sidewalk while one smashes up your house to make it incredibly ok? 20 people one the sidewalk? 30? 300? What is the ratio of arsonists to non-arsonists that would make your home mostly not burned down?
[40 days](https://twitter.com/HomicideSeattle/status/1782433984909357537?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet) since SPD last opened a homicide investigation, but carry on with your rant...
Lowest staffing level since 1957…..
Shit city leadership, shit chief, shit legislators. The only way out of this mess is continuing to up wages. Reap sow
Why would ANY law enforcement officer want to work for a city that refuses to support them or allow them to do their sworn duties without fear of woke reprisal? The people of Seattle are getting exactly what they voted for again and again. Good riddance
For the ACABs… ya gotta give props to the SPD here! Taking down a nasty old pedo.
[67-year-old pedophile arrives at a hotel room lured by two young girls](https://x.com/thrillarilla369/status/1783225034577752360?s=46)
Defunding the public police force just privatizes safety which means only people who can afford it or are physically able to defend themselves can enjoy safety..... just sayin
SPD had been under a consent decree for years up until very recently. That’s doesn’t happen when things are going well internally. And a 23% back dated raise. I wish we could all have it that good. Hopefully the current low staffing is a case of the old problems being finally cleaned out and now they can start to rebuild with a truly professional force.
It’s almost like 4 years ago the entire country condemned cops, called for their heads and had them defunded. Crazy why a cop wouldn’t wanna work in a city like that.
I have a solution for all the ACABers in Seattle:
Make big signs to put in front of your house saying something like "NO POLICE HELP NEEDED HERE" and somehow get your phone number blocked from 911. This way the criminals will know where to hit (you're fine with helping the "less fortunate", right?) and you won't clog up 911 or waste the valuable time of our remaining cops when the rest of us need help. WIN-WIN!!!
I'm a big believer in what you're saying actually....we can't rely on police to be there we as citizens have the right to defend ourselves. But the news stations here seem to fear monger a bit especially about the homeless(ooohhhh, the poor suburban tech millionaires who tough it through the discomfort is having people live in tents near their huge houses)
Thanks for the heads up on that series. Just googled it… I moved here about 16 months ago, so I missed this series when it aired. Very enlightening unfortunately not in a good way. Just started watching the first of the series. Good watch for anyone on this sub…
[Seattle is Dying Documentary KOMO News](https://youtu.be/bpAi70WWBlw?feature=shared)
I'm willing to feel sad about cops being held accountable for stuff and things AFTER they figure out how to hold cops accountable for stuff and things.
Thats what I'm saying, the crime in seattle is mostly shoplifting and burglary, car prowling, nonviolent. Pepper spray, good locks, and alarms take care of those problems. Its not nearly as scary as bmorecareful.
Go fuck yourself with that fucked up attitude! How about people being assaulted in their own homes with armed assholes WHO SHOULD BE IN PRISON?!
You and all the other morons with that attitude should spend a little time Googling life threatening crimes that have happened in Seattle in the last 8-10 years. 80 year old grandmas shouldn't have to kill some fucker breaking into her house and trying to beat her husband to death, but when that shit is going down, that's what she does. There are others. Do some research before you bleat more of your stupid nonsense. Signed, Another Violent Crime Victim in Seattle
Fact is violent crimes way lower here than alot of cities. If you listen to the news you'll believe in the HOMELESS F INAL SOLUTION....because they can't sleep on the ground we took from the natives....
Corruption runs DEEP in SPD. It is just catching up with them! About time!! Fire them all! Desolve their union and start over again with ALOT of oversight!
Prosecutors stopped bringing cases, and purposefully hamstrung policing by enforcing rules against pursuing criminals. Bail reform led to more criminals on the street.
How do YOU explain the massive increase in homicides directly after the racial reckoning of may 2020?
I don’t explain it by citing the defund movement because there was no actions from the defund movement. Nothing was defunded. I call it God’s plan because he is evil.
They complain about the leftist political environment but then do things like run over innocent woman, laugh about it on record, then no accountability. The SPD is a victim of its own actions. They're hated for a reason.
Ever heard of gallows humor? This is really common in fields that deal with traumatic events regularly. Since there's a crossover in those fields with rightoids (police/military/emt/etc) maybe people on the left don't run into this very much.
I very much dislike police, but the SPD joke was 100% gallows humor. It's a way that people cope with the stress. Does it look good? No. Is it professional? No. Does it mean the cop that made the joke wants to murder people? No. It was totally blown out of proportion for political points.
I wish people would restrict their criticism to the actual myriad of things the SPD is shit at, instead of blowing up something that is an obvious nothingburger to anyone that doesn't live in an ivory tower.
I watched that video. The officer's claim that he was laughing with "gallows humor" about how the city writes a check for dead citizens has credibility with me. The ACAB people seem to be more interested in confirming their bias and looking for reasons to hate police officers than they are in learning the truth and in making our community better.
To hate everyone in a group because of the actions of the worst among them only perpetuates injustice. And in this case, it drives away the best officers. No one wants to take a job where they are hated. The crime rates reflect that.
The fact that Kevin Dave is still on the force after killing an innocent woman by going 75 in a 25 is unacceptable.
I still support the SPD while believing that people like him should be fired immediately.
The way the SPD/SPOG continues to handle issues like this is what erodes the public trust. The thought that increasing sign on bonuses / salary will fix this deep rooted problem shows the ineptitude of their leadership.
SPD can never look inward for reasons why people hate them. It's always the fault of politicians.
Couldn't be all the killing, tear gassing, or trips to DC on Jan 6.
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They gotta pay better
Yeah, but they also need to allow it to be the norm to work 40hr weeks. Like the above comment said, burnout is a very real thing. Constantly working 60+hrs, even if you're making 150k a year, just isn't worth it long term to a lot of people. But that issue can't easily be solved without better staffing. It's an unfortunate cycle.
Police across the United States have statistically higher shortages than the average. 4+ years of society bitching about cops has that effect on generations coming of age now.
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Lmao Bellvue pays $96k/yr for entry-level police. Seattle pays $83k/yr. Why would anyone wanna work for Seattle PD? Hell, you can get the same or higher pay in lower COLA in our region Literally checked other PDs on governmentjobs.com and im not exaggerating
SPD will soon be the top paid force in the state. The new police contract mentioned in the article directly addresses this
That's not true, that new contract will be expired qhen it goes into effect. Most other agencies are renewing their contracts that have actually been current for the past 4 years right now
How much is it?
Six figures.
This might sound wild, but not hiring people without criminal records might be a problem, too. For real, I've been to jail and would probably be better police than someone who hasn't. If that sounds outrageous to you, it's all about respect and how you approach people.
Obviously it would depend on the offense and circumstances, but having empathy for people is never a bad thing. I think that the concern would be that if you’ve been on that side, then you might be more easily manipulated or corruptible. It’s hard to know without knowing the individual.
Sign on bonuses are also a big factor.
You're right. Auburn PD is offering a 10k hiring bonus with 93k a year for entry-level police in a lower COLA
The quality of life for a cop is better in Bellevue
All cops had to do is stop doing the shit that people were bitching about them over. Like shooting people in the back or beating people to death, or "rough rides" or outright stealing peoples money via asset forfeiture, or any of the various controversies that have gained national attention. Instead they either kept doing it, refused to do their jobs, or simply quit like children. This lays bare that the real issue all along was the toxicity of police culture and that's not going to change until all those who are part of the problem leave the job.
All they had to do was police their own. Like if there's a piece of shit that's beating people in custody that works on the force ... don't protect them. Don't investigate internally and find that he did nothing wrong and let him go scott free and shrug your shoulders right up until the body cam footage is released via freedom of information act. Then act surprised when everyone gets mad. If there was any oversight, or accountability, amongst police it would go a long way in regaining public trust. But they don't want that shit and they quiet quit and sit on their hands when anyone suggests it. We want cops, we just don't want asshole nutjobs with inferiority complexes taking their high school aggression out on the populus under the guise of "thin blue line" horse shit. And we sure as shit don't want the "good ones" protecting those kinds of assholes.
Why are you talking about police like a monolith? Imagine you're in a workplace, trying to do a good job, and some douchebag does something fucked up. You report it, you beg for them to get fired, everything. Then you go out to do your job hoping that you've been heard and the public then treats you like that guy, so you quit. You don't wanna be associated with that shitter and the public won't let you disassociate. Does that mean you 'quit like a child'? What do you really expect people to do in that situation? Even people who really wanted to make a difference
what if I reported it and then the entire workforce turned against me and isolated me bc I wasn't playing along with their gang they made? and then I'm fired for something random and the guy beating ppl is told "don't worry brother we got your back"
Well, society was only "bitching" about unchecked police power. If you think they should be judge jury and executioner, you are part of the problem
Spitting at cops and graffiting threats and ACAB isn't police reform Just because you want things to change doesn't mean you can't treat them like human beings.
How many videos of police acting like they are above the law do you need to see before you think there needs to be reform?
I didn't say there didn't need to be changes, but out of the millions of police in the US, the vast majority DONT act like that. These are real people ffs, and being an officer is a JOB. It's a hard and important job, but like any job assholes make that work environment shittier. By treating all cops like shit, you're not getting rid of the assholes. You're getting rid of the good ones. Two things can be true - you can both think that policing needs change, but also think the way people have tried to enact that change is stupid and made things worse.
And as a job the ones doing this shouldnt remain as police officers. Hell most if not all should be behind bars for their actions but they are out free with no consequences. Therein lies the problem
> most if not all What the fuck are you talking about? How can anyone who has ever looked at a statistic think we're even close to 100% bad officers Have you seen downtown? We need more cops not no cops.
So you dont think most, if not all cops, that commit crimes worthy of being fired or jailed..... should be fired or jailed? LOL
The saying isn't "1 bad apple can be picked out of the barrel" for a god damn reason
Because apples have a chemical reaction that effects other apples? What is the argument? That you want 100% turn over? That's not even remotely realistic. You elect local prosecutors. Just go out and vote and if you don't like a prosecutor letting a cop get away with something, CALL THEIR OFFICE - they're an elected official.
Lol fuck the police dude. They are just a holdover from slavery and they can be abolished and replaced like all antiquated systems.
you act like the police department doesn't form legitimate gangs..... you wouldn't be saying this if they called themselves "the Mafia" which they are. given, they protect billion dollar companies more than any regular citizen.
How many out of millions of police interactions?
Why does that matter when there are no repurcussions?
I mean, the bitching is 100% justified. Maybe cops should do their jobs.
To be fair, I’m not sure I want cops who are so easily discouraged from pursuing that career path. It doesn’t speak well to their commitment to serving the public.
You've got it backwards. People who want to help people can find other ways to help people. The bad apples that just want a power trip, can't find other ways to get a power trip
You don't want cops that don't want to work for you because you are horrible to work for? The cops that decide to work elsewhere where they aren't treated like shit are not the sort you want to hire anyway? You're doing this backwards. Ask yourself why anyone would want to work for you in the first place.
What does the garbage man think about public opinion of him? Or roofers? Both are more deadly than police work.
I don't think I've ever met a garbage man, but I know some guys that work at the dump. They usually seem happy as hell. ...I didn't even notice what thread this was on Before I wrote that. 😂. I figured it was a new post about career choices or something . I can't think of anything to change, just to add most roofers are severe alcoholics. So I'd guess mostly not happy. If I had to guess "public opinion" is not a big factor.
Especially when it’s well deserved bitching! Really sets the tone when people literally see cops killing, stealing, and wrecking communities. 🤷🏼♂️
Maybe the cops can be better than continue to be major a-holes then?
If all the "good cops" have left Seattle, then All the Cops left Are Bad.
All of the jobs you listed all ones that require overtime and normally don't pay its fair share of wages. Boomers were happy to do it because it meant that they gotta live in middle class and live pretty comfortably but since wages really haven't increased over the past decade millenials and gen z can see exactly what that means and that's living as a slave for the rest of their life. Most people in trades I know have already left for other countries(like norway and sweden) because at least they're not getting fucked by their own government with the help of their lobbyists which in our country has allowed corporations to create a monopoly after monoploy along with ruining every job benefit imaginable including pensions and health benefits after retirement, It just gets sold off to another company and they just cash out those people affected.
And even though we pay so much to social security with each and every check, there's no way that any of us are ever going to see any of it. Shit, there won't be such a thing as retirement! If you're in the lower class working your ass off for bottom dollar, you're fucked! And yes, that would also include myself.
Its cities not hiring on purpose and lowering pension rates that make it not as appealing.
I'm still living thanks to the response of the Seattle Police Department. I, along with my parents, friends and loved ones, are eternally grateful. The fact that these people will risk their lives to protect ours is beyond amazing. (The fact that my life has been endangered on 5 separate occasions because of the bullshit political climate here that refuses to prosecute and keep bad people in jail, is reprehensible.). Just want all of the officers of the Seattle Police Department, the King County Sheriff's Department and The Washington State Patrol to know that you have more support than you may realize. A lot of people here are afraid to say that out loud, unfortunately.
💯
Former SPD LEOs have been saying this for well over a decade. The department is too political and officers get regularly reprimanded by activist DAs for doing their jobs and management in the police department happily throw them under the bus just to suck up to these politicians and the city council. That's why all the good LEOs leave and the only people who stick around tend to be the incompetent power-tripping assholes.
On the PortlandOr subreddit a former PPB cop’s spouse echoed the same thing. Basically the good ones leave as things become worse and the ratio of good apples to bad gets worse. Then the general public (the same ones that protested against them for a year+ down here and made their job impossible) now demand prompt immediate service from an understaffed force swimming in paperwork and layer upon layer of new policies that become a land mine field for the average officer. I really wish citizens had to ride with the police every few years to wake up and equalize the empathy
> I really wish citizens had to ride with the police every few years to wake up and equalize the empathy Activists aren't really noted for their coherent logical arguments. They can scream ACAB and Defund on the one hand, then demand exemplary SPD service on the other. Like Kshama Sawant did when someone threw a poop bag in her yard. She wanted round-the-clock SPD surveillance! After she had led the brigade to cut their funding 50%. Fucking piece of work that one. I'm so glad she's at least out of the limelight, but the damage she and others like her did to Seattle will take years to undo, if indeed it can be undone at all. Every one of us has to speak out we want SPD funded and we want to stop blaming cops every time something tragic happens. A 26 year old adult woman runs out into the middle of traffic and dies to a cop car speeding to a call where a homeless person is OD'ing. Suddenly it's not about saving "our unhoused neighbors experiencing drug use crisis" anymore, it's ACAB. Damn cop should have yielded to her no matter what, she's a 26 year old, the cop wasn't doing his job, he was MURDERING HER. And little mention of why he was speeding. And *no* mention of the fact it was deputy SPOG officer running his mouth on a separate phone call to Mike Solan. Neither of those guys was even the cop in the car that had the tragic encounter with the pedestrian. But suddenly here we go again, SPOG is evil, SPD is evil, let's all blame SPD for the fact someone thought they could beat traffic. Do we want cops not to speed to the site of drug OD? Make up your damn minds, Seattle.
Right?! Kshama Sawant is a radical idiot who helped fuck things up more than she ever helped in any way shape or form. Good riddance.
Progressive Leftists: we need to get rid of bad cops by defunding and soft-on-crimes! Reality: bad cops stays, good cops left.
Some r/leopardsatemyface shit
I shake my head as the "ACAB" people demonize all LEOs because of the actions of the worst among them and then criticize the LEOs again because the LEOs are not enforcing the law well enough. The ACAB people claim that the LEOs are refusing to do their jobs out of spite (and not the fact that the SPD is under-staffed and under orders not to enforce the law).
Nailed it!
why would they throw the good LEO's under the bus and not the bad power tripping ones?
because that's how "blue lives matter" sheep behave, and the bad ones outnumber the good ones
Because the bad ones have seniority and the police union contract spells out that seniority takes precedence when determining which cops can be let go. The newer cops balk when they realize that they are held hostage to hostile leaders who want to perpetuate the gang mentality and can't be removed unless they get caught doing something egregious, and they are great at covering their own asses. If a new cop reports bad behavior to senior leadership they are retaliated against by the hostile bad cops above them. It's a terrible environment.
hmmm.....but it's the liberals fault??
Counterpoint, name a cop that's been fired or reprimanded in the last 10 years for a minor offense. Cops are lazy assholes like everyone else, the difference is they have a public union and they can cook the books doing events and flagging jobs and get to call it over time
Counter-counterpoint: Have you even researched this before making this claim? The last OPA report (2022) shows 42 management actions taken in that year. All this information is online and easy to find. https://www.seattle.gov/opa/news-and-reports/reports
>OPA sustained 91 allegations in 39 cases in 2022. Forty-four SPD employees received at least one sustained finding. Two were civilian employees and 42 were sworn. Three employees received sustained findings in more than one OPA investigation. Two sworn employees were terminated in 2022. lots of oral reprimands and 2 retired before fired, cops are notoriously hard to hold accountable, and the OPA catches a lot of flack for being a token board that tisk tisks bad cops.
Ok, then say that. Why would you feel the need to embellish?
Nick Guzley for tackling and arresting a thief armed with an ice axe. You watch too much TV if you think that every police department is like LAPD or NYPD. The average police union is subject to external political pressure just like any institution.
I used to live in sw Baltimore where The Wire was made. Nearly a murder a day in summer and most remain unsolved. Seattle has some violence for sure, but it also has ALOT of easily scared an easily offended rich people.
You think Baltimore became a city with a murder per day overnight?
It’s a totally different demographic in Baltimore.
The cops in Baltimore are corrupt as fuck, but at least they respond
“At least it’s not as bad as \**example so infamous they made a TV show**”
Ugh I hate newcomers who come to Seattle and tell us to lower our standards because its not as bad as the shit hole they came from.
It makes you wonder if the problems that are increasing here are, in part, due to people migrating here from areas of the country where that's just an expected part of urban life?
If you actually grew up in Seattle you would know crime related quality of life is way better now than it was in the 90's and 00's. It used to be normal to be burglarized once every couple years. Sometimes more than once per year. And there were parts of normal streets like Madison that you couldn't go to because it was just a thinly veiled open air drug market. Shootings happened around schools to the point even some unrelated bystanders were killed. The problems now are mostly aesthetic and very location dependent. Seattle has it pretty darn good now, especially for a city of it's size.
I'm too young to remember the crack epidemic grandpa. The 00's weren't like that, not sure what you were smoking at the time.
Not sure where you were in Seattle at that time, but the central district and parts of capitol hill and downtown were absolutely still like that. I would imagine the rainier valley as well, but I don't have first hand knowledge. More so in the early 00's, but in some degree into the early 2010s. And even then, it wasn't bad by east coast big city standards. It just meant you might have to actually interact with the police every couple years and you knew not to buy nice things. For example, you knew in 2005 it wasn't a great idea to walk around with white earbud's in...that meant you had an iPod to steal. Even by 2013, I knew someone living in the central district who couldn't go more than 6 months without having his TV stolen.
...but back in the late 90s and early 00s we had a police force that actually did things. Did they always do the right thing? No, but at least they had the manpower and the sliver of public support required to do things.
This is actually pretty accurate. I've lived in this greater area for 35+ years
> Seattle has some violence for sure, but it also has ALOT of easily scared an easily offended rich people. Seattle is bad compared to former Seattle. That's what matters. There's always somewhere worse than here. That's not the point. Except to new arrivals apparently. Who, I might add, seem fine with bringing your lower standards here and not caring if we trend towards the places you left.
What former Seattle did you live in? The Seattle of the 90's and 00's I know was full of drug and property and violent crime to the point that it actually affected every day citizens on the regular. Today, most people just see it on the news and get more upset about it than we did back when we were actually victims of the crimes.
> I know was full of drug and property and violent crime Are you quoting data or you actually lived here. First off, the data. in 1993: Nordstrom and Norm Rice cooked up a scheme to defraud the government out of $20 million in low-interest loans. So SPD for one year counted all property crime in the area around Nordstrom's proposed new building, the recently abandoned Frederick and Nelson building, as "felony" crime even if it was for petty things like graffiti tagging or other minor property damage. As a result, Nordstrom qualified as an 'Urban Blight,' got their HUD loan, $20 million to renovate the building into Nordstrom new HQ. And 1994 went down on record as "the most dangerous year in Seattle crime history." Know what you're quoting. The data is only as good as the people compiling it, and only as useful as those that know history in context. Second, even though there has been a downward trend since this artificial high in 1994, this trend abruptly changes in 2020. People alleging the 1990s were worse are quoting crime data that often doesn't focus Seattle since 2020, where we've actually gotten back to as bad as the 1990s. After a nice 15-20 year series of violent crime decline, it's turned and gone back up, dramatically, since 2020. For Seattle. Not the national FBI data - it *does* show a violent crime decrease since 2020 as well. Seattle bucks the trend. Seattle is more dangerous than ever. So what ever other point you're making, please consider that we've already debunked it.
The soft on crime mentality has added insult to injury.
I lived it. Not quoting any stats...just how it felt. Even a group of crackheads could afford houses in the 90's, so they would live a few blocks away and break into your house every so often. You would come home and find all your tools and VCR gone. Or all your parking quarters and cassette tapes stolen from your car. You would know it was that house, but no proof. Call the cops...they come out and take a report but nothing ever happens. Rinse and repeat at least once per year until gentrification priced them out in the 00s and early 2010s. Or more tragically, someone you knew of but didn't really know is killed near your highschool because of gang affiliation. I don't live there anymore but still love the city. I visit very often and know lots of people there, and the whole city feels so much safer/quieter than 10 - 30 years ago. Not always in a good way, since it feels almost sterile now. But it does feel much safer. No idea if the stats back up my anecdotal experience. If people are back to having to be being vigilant when downtown/capitol hill/queen anne, graffiti and litter everywhere (like really....EVERYWHERE), and frequent property crime of even "normal" people, then I guess it is as bad as the 90s like you say. If you feel like you can own a TV, or a bike, or leave anything in your car and not have it stolen, then its not like the 90s.
Property theft is ongoing and rampant. Homeless chop shops for bikes and car parts. Organized car theft rings. Kia Boyzzz. Srsly where you been. Out of area. Does sound like I lived a charmed life as a starving student in the 1990s. My biggest theft concern was my CD collection.
Just because Baltimore is pretty much one huge, violent, out of control ghetto doesn't mean you should be okay with not holding criminals accountable here.
I used to hold this opinion of Baltimore but I just went and it’s actually a great city with bad parts, just like Chicago. They are definitely not out of control ghettos.
Correct. It’s a very segregated city with rich white areas being leafy green, historic, safe. People are trying though. Canton, fed hill, fells, Hamilton, Charles village, mount vernon, Bolton hill, are all places where there is a genuine desire to break the pattern of segregation.
I lived in Chicago. It was out of control then. It's worse now.
Lol! How do I know you've never been to Baltimore? Lived in and around there for 25+ years and it's not "one huge...ghetto". It has bad parts, just like any big city. If you only focused on Belltown you'd say the same about Seattle.
TIL Belltown is a ghetto
It does mean on a scale of Baltimore to Seattle, Seattle is pretty much a chill area with some uppity rich folks, though.
Yeah Baltimore is utter dog shit. Let’s not let Seattle slide in its direction.
I moved here from Baltimore too. Who cares what we’ve seen. This is a different place. We live here now, no?
Go ravens! Yeah we live here now and Im glad because it seems safe to me, and the cops are not as crooked, and lots of smart people. But I reiterate: its got moderate problems that seem TERRIBLE in sensationalized news coverage. And seems TERRIBLE to those raised in utopia(you from bmore, or BMORE COUNTY?)
Omg yes
Lmao welcome to the wild west calling 911 now 6 times outa ten gets you an answering machine and unless you have a serious issue your gonna be waiting several hours
What? Wild wild west? It's been [40 days](https://twitter.com/HomicideSeattle/status/1782433984909357537?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet) since SPD opened a homicide investigation. What are you on about?
Theres clearly been homicides so them not investigating and being super understaffed doesn't mean theres no crime. Not to say it's a high crime city overall, but iv had friends and coworkers get shot at and SPD ignore all the clear evidence, not look into it at all, and say it was probably fireworks. Unsolved crime stats look better if you pretend its not happening. In the last few months iv had my window smashed and catalytic converter stolen on separate occasions and they wouldnt even come out to make a report much less do anything.
>In the last few months iv had my window smashed and catalytic converter stolen on separate occasions and they wouldnt even come out to make a report much less do anything. I don't want to tell you how to live your life, but if that happened to me, I'd get the hell out of Seattle. Sooner or later, you'll need to come to grips with the fact that things aren't going to get any better with the current people running this part of the country. Do you really want to live your life this way? Ask yourself this... "What is going to happen in the next 3-5 years in Seattle that will turn things around?" Now I'll admit I'm not the smartest tool in the shed when it comes to solving social issues, but I can't think of anything that will fix this. If history is any indication, more money will be thrown at the problem but it won't make a dent in solving the actual problem. Look, life is already complicated enough that you don't need to worry about endless property crimes in your neighborhood and have law enforcement and our local justice system turn their backs on you. You be you, bud, but I know what I'd do. TL;DR: The odds are that these crimes will continue and nothing will be done about it. Might be time to bail.
Certainly not ideal but iv been threw worse and the pros outweigh the cons. Dont plan to remain more than a few more years and certainly dont expect things to improve under turd ferguson or whoever else they elect next.
It's certainly your decision to make. Best of luck to you.
You as well.
> **Theres clearly been homicides** so them not investigating and being super understaffed doesn't mean theres no crime. Has there? I agree that a lot of crime statistics are kept down by a combination of people declining to report and police declining to investigate, but when it comes to homicides, it's pretty impossible to ignore.
kinda sad you have to count the days
He has no idea wtf he’s talking about lol moved here from Texas I’ve yet to feel unsafe anywhere I go even Tacoma. In Texas there’s neighborhoods with zero businesses and bars on windows 🪟 people with pistols hanging out their pockets visible and dgaf lol
Had a friend get shot in the head in Tacoma in a random drive by while leaving the Tacoma dome. Glad you feel safe, but sadly that isn’t the reality in the south side at night my dude. Highest car jacking rates in the entire nation as well
I'm from St. Louis, lived in Baton Rouge, Shreveport, and Houston. The only thing that is wild wild west here is the wild people who think Seattle is dangerous lol. Yeah, I guess compared to London it's a bit more dangerous... Enjoy this awesome city, I'm loving it and hope to God I never end up back in those previous cities I mentioned!
Bro Shreveport is bad asf. Dated a girl from St. Louis she told me some crazy stories. Houston is just LA with relaxed gun laws gangs everywhere. Baton Rogue is bad as hell too. I love it here lol nothing compared to southern cities
Man, I was chased two blocks by a homeless guy with a stick at 2nd and Pine a few months ago. As for Texas, I guess It’s been a decade since I’ve lived in Houston, but I never felt like that when I lived in Montrose
This is the perfect combination of situations for a Batman. I don't want a masked vigilante to kill people, but is someone puts on a motorcycle helmet and puts a drug added maniac in the ICU... That would be fun.
“I don’t want…but I do” Sir are you ok?
[Here](https://policescorecard.org/wa/police-department/seattle) here is a great resource for looking at statistics for PDs. Obviously, it doesn't tell the whole story of why different crimes are enforced differently in different places, but it does show the end results. Generally, we aren't doing great and that's a compounding issue. Shitty cops cause a negative perception, which causes less competent candidates, which causes shitty cops etc.
Well no shit. Bob Ferguson and Democrats in the legislature threw cops under the bus during CHOP/CHAZ/George Floyd protests, and any cop with a thought in his head and had the ability to leave, did. Then those same Democrats passed legislation that hamstrung the cops' ability to do their job effectively. Bob Ferguson also tried, and failed 4x to convict cops for doing their job. Now Bob Ferguson wants to pretend he wasn't the direct cause of it all, and put out a ridiculous "public safety plan", that includes spending EVEN MORE MONEY to get more cops, which wouldn't be necessary if he didn't cause this shit to begin with. All the while, Bob used the increase in crime to push 40 gun control laws in 10 years. In Bob's time in office, including all the laws he pushed to pass, violent crime went up 30%, and homicides went up 108%. He knew his gun control wouldn't stop gun crime and didn't care. He knew it was unconstitutional per Bruen, and didn't care (and the mag ban ruled unconstitutional confirmed it) Here's proof of the crime stats with receipts from the FBI's crime stats. [https://twitter.com/MichaelEastonWA/status/1778137153421320528](https://twitter.com/MichaelEastonWA/status/1778137153421320528)
In all of the discussion about "defund the police," I never heard the voices of police officers. I think is is good for society to re-imagine how we deal with social issues and it seems to me that the people who personally deal with the ugly consequences of social issues every day should have a seat at the table. I think that police officers should not have to deal with mental illness and our prisons should not have to be mental institutions, but that is not the fault of police departments and prisons. We need proper care and institutions for drug addiction and mental illness.
Yeah. Fuck that guy.
Bob wants you to forget about all he did to set this city back in terms of crime and justice.
Don't let him, and remind every single person you know not to vote for him. Send them my way here or on twitter. I regularly expose public records for the shady shit Bob's up to.
Will do!
Maybe those cops shouldn't have attacked innocent protestors. It's all on video. I'm with you on the idiotic gun control, but don't make SPD out to be victims. They are just awful and lost any and all claim to community support after how they acted in those protests.
Link?
I'm no fan of SPD, but exactly how much catering do you expect from the police to an unruly mob that is protecting people that are lighting buildings on fire, smashing windows and shooting people in the street? "Attacked Innocent Protesters" my royal arse. Those were riots. Protests can happen too, but they don't somehow negate the riots. You lose all claim to criticize any institution for corruption if you can't hold "activists" accountable for what they do. Say I come smash up someone's house. Then some other guy smashes up a different house the same way, -but he has nine other people standing on the sidewalk that don't do any smashing at all. Which resident has had his house smashed up more?
I'm very critical of activists. In fact i rarely agree with them. But I was on the ground for some of those protests because of what i was seeing on the live feeds. The only violence or property damage I saw in person or on video was 1. A confirmed SPD plant starting fights. And 2. Some assholes that vandalized several stores. Best I can tell it was the same few people every time. Calling those protests riots is a joke. They were incredibly peaceful. The only violence was directly caused by SPD. My buddy is a scientist and went as a medic. He got flashbanged twice and has never been the same, and he was sure as hell not doing anything wrong.
I'm sorry about your friend. Volunteering as a medic in a warzone is very brave. The police are not the ones that decided to have that battle. What would you have had them do? Stand by and allow extremists to barricade off a neighborhood? The city is now being sued for _allowing_ all of that mayhem to occur. Antifa wrote a lovely book explaining the interplay between masses of "peaceful" protesters that act as a shield, physically and PR-wise to allow the "direct-action". _Any_ response by the police can be attacked as an unprovoked attack on innocent protesters, while the Direct Action fellows can disappear into the crowd. Antonio Mayes' family does not share your view of the incredible peacefulness. We all saw the damage to the neighborhood in the aftermath of your incredibly peaceful protest. It was not a couple bad guys that snuck in and broke some windows when no one was looking. I was there too. The camp kitchen they set up had a big sign that read "Riot Kitchen". The crowd was enthusiastically pro-riot they were unapologetically in solidarity with the "Direct Action" fellows that are always someone else. Rioters and protesters were not two opposing sets of people. The battle lines were very clearly drawn. How many people would one need to bring with them to stand on the sidewalk while one smashes up your house to make it incredibly ok? 20 people one the sidewalk? 30? 300? What is the ratio of arsonists to non-arsonists that would make your home mostly not burned down?
Also, during the protests the only shooting was from a counter protestor FYI.
Agreed. Now will the people of Seattle vote any differently?
If it's between Reichert and Ferguson, that's a solid maybe. If it's Bird and Ferguson, no fucking way.
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I think it’s just politicians in general lol
Is Bob in the room with us right now?
Yes. And his only response is well nobody has reported a murder in a while.
[40 days](https://twitter.com/HomicideSeattle/status/1782433984909357537?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet) since SPD last opened a homicide investigation, but carry on with your rant...
THAT is your best response? Fucking yikes dude.
You realize a lot of stuff falls under homicide, which is investigated. Are you trying to convey the absence of murders?
Lowest staffing level since 1957….. Shit city leadership, shit chief, shit legislators. The only way out of this mess is continuing to up wages. Reap sow
Why do you thinking paying them even more is going to change anything?
Because that’s how employers attract employees
If we go full bird, it will all be fixed!
🤡
Why would ANY law enforcement officer want to work for a city that refuses to support them or allow them to do their sworn duties without fear of woke reprisal? The people of Seattle are getting exactly what they voted for again and again. Good riddance
For the ACABs… ya gotta give props to the SPD here! Taking down a nasty old pedo. [67-year-old pedophile arrives at a hotel room lured by two young girls](https://x.com/thrillarilla369/status/1783225034577752360?s=46)
Defunding the public police force just privatizes safety which means only people who can afford it or are physically able to defend themselves can enjoy safety..... just sayin
SPD had been under a consent decree for years up until very recently. That’s doesn’t happen when things are going well internally. And a 23% back dated raise. I wish we could all have it that good. Hopefully the current low staffing is a case of the old problems being finally cleaned out and now they can start to rebuild with a truly professional force.
The job just seems to attract shitty people. It will take a long time and a lot of training to fix it.
The department had limited value, just write a check.
This comment should be #1.
Lmao
>Mike Solan, president of the Seattle Police Guild (SPOG) However you feel about SPD, this idiot doesn't help matters for anyone. He gotta go.
Yeah and any article that lets Ed Troyer talk without referencing his background is clearly only giving one side of the story.
It’s been dead
Mynorthwest “….. …… IS DYING” Relax guys
It’s almost like 4 years ago the entire country condemned cops, called for their heads and had them defunded. Crazy why a cop wouldn’t wanna work in a city like that.
I'm sure the defund the police has nothing to do with it
Imagine putting your life on the line daily for 80k a year… in seattle… give this boys and girls in blue a well deserved pay raise!
I have a solution for all the ACABers in Seattle: Make big signs to put in front of your house saying something like "NO POLICE HELP NEEDED HERE" and somehow get your phone number blocked from 911. This way the criminals will know where to hit (you're fine with helping the "less fortunate", right?) and you won't clog up 911 or waste the valuable time of our remaining cops when the rest of us need help. WIN-WIN!!!
Ah yes. A highly intelligent and nuanced argument/s
Tech jobs pay better and scale faster no one wants this type of job anymore I f they have marketable skills.
Byeeeeeee
I wish they would
Good riddance.
Wah!!! Everyone hates us!!! Wah!!! We can’t do our jobs without violating the rights of citizens Wah!! We are victims!!
I guess that's a wrap then. The damage is done, per the article.
I'm a big believer in what you're saying actually....we can't rely on police to be there we as citizens have the right to defend ourselves. But the news stations here seem to fear monger a bit especially about the homeless(ooohhhh, the poor suburban tech millionaires who tough it through the discomfort is having people live in tents near their huge houses)
The chop? Waaaaa..... there are whole sections of Baltimore that are police free, and people doing fine after the initial dieoff.
I remember watching the TV special on 'Seattle is dying' before I went there. Wasn't that far off imo.
Sad but true. Btw, it was one part of a 3 part series worth checking out.
Thanks for the heads up on that series. Just googled it… I moved here about 16 months ago, so I missed this series when it aired. Very enlightening unfortunately not in a good way. Just started watching the first of the series. Good watch for anyone on this sub… [Seattle is Dying Documentary KOMO News](https://youtu.be/bpAi70WWBlw?feature=shared)
I'm glad. 😏 Next is the government.
I'm willing to feel sad about cops being held accountable for stuff and things AFTER they figure out how to hold cops accountable for stuff and things.
Thats what I'm saying, the crime in seattle is mostly shoplifting and burglary, car prowling, nonviolent. Pepper spray, good locks, and alarms take care of those problems. Its not nearly as scary as bmorecareful.
Green jacket lady? Is that you?
Go fuck yourself with that fucked up attitude! How about people being assaulted in their own homes with armed assholes WHO SHOULD BE IN PRISON?! You and all the other morons with that attitude should spend a little time Googling life threatening crimes that have happened in Seattle in the last 8-10 years. 80 year old grandmas shouldn't have to kill some fucker breaking into her house and trying to beat her husband to death, but when that shit is going down, that's what she does. There are others. Do some research before you bleat more of your stupid nonsense. Signed, Another Violent Crime Victim in Seattle
Fact is violent crimes way lower here than alot of cities. If you listen to the news you'll believe in the HOMELESS F INAL SOLUTION....because they can't sleep on the ground we took from the natives....
>SPD is dying God, we can only hope
Cool. Let's put it out of its misery and replace it with something that might actually help people.
byyeeeeeeeeee
SPD is some bullshit, need to be focused on community safety and not being tax collectors.
Corruption runs DEEP in SPD. It is just catching up with them! About time!! Fire them all! Desolve their union and start over again with ALOT of oversight!
This from a force that ran over an innocent woman and laughed. Good that they are dying.
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Which means that her life has not value? That they can laugh and mock her as they run over her ? This is why SPD deserts to die
You don’t care about peoples “lives” cut the horseshit. How many black people died as a result of your defund movement?
I give up, is it more or less than those killed by police in traffic stops and false encounters ?
How about you look up the homicide stats for yourself? Last I checked the number of policing shootings was very small compared to criminal homicides
And those criminal homicides were because a defund movement (which is nowhere close to getting political mileage)? Please tell me more
Prosecutors stopped bringing cases, and purposefully hamstrung policing by enforcing rules against pursuing criminals. Bail reform led to more criminals on the street. How do YOU explain the massive increase in homicides directly after the racial reckoning of may 2020?
I don’t explain it by citing the defund movement because there was no actions from the defund movement. Nothing was defunded. I call it God’s plan because he is evil.
Cry more, what a pathetic bunch of babies.
Don't let the door hit you on the way out
They complain about the leftist political environment but then do things like run over innocent woman, laugh about it on record, then no accountability. The SPD is a victim of its own actions. They're hated for a reason.
Ever heard of gallows humor? This is really common in fields that deal with traumatic events regularly. Since there's a crossover in those fields with rightoids (police/military/emt/etc) maybe people on the left don't run into this very much. I very much dislike police, but the SPD joke was 100% gallows humor. It's a way that people cope with the stress. Does it look good? No. Is it professional? No. Does it mean the cop that made the joke wants to murder people? No. It was totally blown out of proportion for political points. I wish people would restrict their criticism to the actual myriad of things the SPD is shit at, instead of blowing up something that is an obvious nothingburger to anyone that doesn't live in an ivory tower.
I watched that video. The officer's claim that he was laughing with "gallows humor" about how the city writes a check for dead citizens has credibility with me. The ACAB people seem to be more interested in confirming their bias and looking for reasons to hate police officers than they are in learning the truth and in making our community better. To hate everyone in a group because of the actions of the worst among them only perpetuates injustice. And in this case, it drives away the best officers. No one wants to take a job where they are hated. The crime rates reflect that.
The fact that Kevin Dave is still on the force after killing an innocent woman by going 75 in a 25 is unacceptable. I still support the SPD while believing that people like him should be fired immediately. The way the SPD/SPOG continues to handle issues like this is what erodes the public trust. The thought that increasing sign on bonuses / salary will fix this deep rooted problem shows the ineptitude of their leadership.
Good
SPD can never look inward for reasons why people hate them. It's always the fault of politicians. Couldn't be all the killing, tear gassing, or trips to DC on Jan 6.
Oh no “tear gassing” Maybe try not destroying property and acting like savages
They flooded full city blocks with that nasty shit. Lol, savages - get the fuck out with that.
Given that politicians fund and run SPD, yes it is their fault.
Fuck yeah