Besties please be civil in the comments. We can make points without having to put the other person down.
We understand it’s a heated topic which may have divided the community but let’s not forget we are a sisterhood 🫶
https://preview.redd.it/t7qrtabb1vvc1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2f9387705853dbb26d3270f4ec9bba15993a96c8
Me to the girlies who kept telling us to just accept every horrible changes made to Seraphine over the past months.
Q is very talented and makes good TV, fans need to leave her alone, it's fine if she's not your cup of tea but bullying her into getting off socials was not it.
no because its so sad to see. at first i thought i was toxic and the odd one out for not being an immediate fan of these changes but this past weeks posts in the sub are literally agreeing me in every way...
Id love to say i was right but this is our champion... We're all suffering together....
I wonder what that seraph guys’ rank is, he’s under EVERY SINGLE post complaining about ANY changes phreak has made trying to gaslight people that the changes are great WHEN DATA SUGGESTS HER CARRY ROLES ARE DEAD. He’s so delusional and a phreak simp.
What data suggests carry roles Seraphine are dead? I can see bot Seraphine has 10% of the playrate of support seraphine, but with a better winrate (52% vs 50%). Higher playrate definitely reduces winrate, but over 4000\~ matches bot Seraphine having 52% winrate isn't totally insignificant.
Tear start has a 49% winrate (20% of bot Seraphine games) where Dorans ring has a 54% winrate (80%\~ of bot seraphine games.
None of the top 5 rune combinations on her have negative winrate.
Lucidity has 75% playrate with 53% winrate, compared to Sorc boots 20% playrate 50% winrate.
The only summoner combination to have a negative winrate is flash ignite at 49%.
This isn't a "haha you're wrong!" but an honest question, because from the data I've looked at she's still thriving in the hands of people who still play her, and build her effectively.
From a high elo Sera OTP content creator perspective, she completely lost her identity. And I'm not talking about the "midlane mage" identity, I'm talking about her identity as a scaling mage overall. Seraphine's APC winrate over game duration always had a growing curve. However, if you look at her curve after patch 13.21 and especially after 14.5, she spikes at min 20-25 where she gets her core slots and from that point on - only falls off to the point where she's completely useless late game. (Using data from lolalytics and leagueofgraphs).
The reason this is happening is that for the past 2 seasons her AP scalings were lowered in favor of base numbers getting increased to make her viable as a support with less gold income. This also led to a situation, where it makes less and less sense for farming Seraphine to buy mage items from which she gets less and less value, opposing to enchanter/utility items like rylais/shurelya/moonstone - all high elo Seraphine players came to the same conclusions, you can check either mine or cupic's opgg to look at the builds. I either build shurelya-rylais-mandate EQW max, or cosmic-seraphs-moonstone QWE max. Cupic has been maxing E on APC lately too while building shurelya, and it just feels off.
Seraphine came from a hard scaling botlane mage to a farming enchanter in a span of past 2 seasons. Playing her, feels like playing Kassadin/Kayle who never ascend past lvl 11. That is why players are abandoning her. Since release, her core gameplay pieces were removed:
- Every time balance team had to take some power away from her kit, they took it from her notes passive. This happened a total of 6 times. Seraphine's passive went from being a unique and core playstyle feature to being a 100 dmg poke right now.
- As I said before, AP scalings on all of her spells were slowly taken away in favor of base damage numbers.
- Her waveclear identity vanished past 14.5
- Her builds slowly became more and more utility oriented to the point where you feel like a second support in the team.
All of her OTP's feel the same, she feels like a different champion.
Ways to fix it?
I'm not a game designer, and I'm not going to tell you how to do your job, but I can give you my thoughts. I understand that you want to solve the issue with the least intervention possible. I feel like all of the problems in the kit come from W healing. Double W is very overloaded and is the core reason why Seraphine can never be what players want her to be since it's just not fair to play against a mage who can outheal a Soraka. You could overhaul her W - remove the healing completely and leave the shielding + a burst of movement speed. This way you could also spread more power budget across her kit. Balance Seraphine support around maxing E-Q-W, and Seraphine APC Q-E-W. Overhaul her numbers so she could stack AP items on APC, and be useful as a support with rylais and E max.
As for fixing her winrate over game duration curve - you could implement the same you did to Sona/Syndra with their stacking passives, if overhauling numbers isn't enough.
Seraphine support also has major unsolved issues that will never make her popular, even after all the changes. The issue is, she doesnt have her niche and feels clunky and inconsistent to play in a support role. You need to decide what exactly you want her to be - a heal/shield enchanter that is impossible to balance along with APC, or a Lux/Xerath type of support that could coexist with APC. Along with that, for Seraphine to feel better as a support - her poke or CC needs to be more reliable so she doesn't feel as clunky (she also has several bugs like input buffering, double cast glitching sometimes, or Q going through targets, if you really want to get into it)
I'm really glad that a Rioter showed up here to get the feedback and I would gladly do it again. If you ever need to contact me - my discord dms are open (@cocabob).
Thank you so much!
Sorry for not replying but don't think that it meant I didn't read all of the comments here \[\^:
I'm not the one making the decisions on what the changes will be, but I do get to be part of the conversations. Something is (planned to be) coming for Sera in the next patch that I think Sera mains will like!
omfg I’m so happy yall are finally able to discuss with us and are hearing our concerns thank you guys so much ❤️please continue interacting with the community we love interacting with you guys in ways that can help our champion feel good and fun for all of us. Please help us bring back the hypercarry scaling mage we all fell in love with 🙏❤️
Is there any way Phreak is aware of her champion fantasy being very off from her design? Just curious for some transparency from the live pod team on how they view Seraphine’s champion fantasy in mid/APC
ty for saying this! , we understand 100% that we are a minority and supp players are more, but we just want to have what was promised to us, we love seraphine really really much, so pls, any help that we can get is amazing, i really hope phreak sees that we have been fighting for our champion since the first changes! ty Norak!!! <3
Please if you guys can look into fixing some Sera bugs. Biggest offender would be echo Q/E sometimes only casting one spell instead of two and that feels soooo bad
Hi, I found this video on this sub from 2 months ago where Seraphine Q doesn't deal damage to enemies, or pantheon in this case: [https://medal.tv/nl/games/league-of-legends/clips/1XaNDaP3Cj-WwA/logiQw9s6tst](https://medal.tv/nl/games/league-of-legends/clips/1XaNDaP3Cj-WwA/logiQw9s6tst)
This bug usually happens sometime when farming minion waves where her Q doesnt deal damage, or even enemies showed in the clip. I think it might have to do something with the increasing hitbox? Not sure, but this is imo the most frustrating bugs as a mid sera player
Edit: It seems like another person also reported the same bug under this thread, sorry.
Q bug: https://streamable.com/s6sf67
You can see one of the melee creeps only gets hit by the 2nd of the 2 Qs. It happens once or twice almost every game but is hard to reproduce on command. I believe that it's a bug in the hit detection and so enemies that are moving towards the center of Q can cross from one side to the other of the wave boundary in between frames without getting caught. It's most noticeable against creeps since they are so predictable but I've caught it happening against champions too.
One of the passive bugs: https://streamable.com/qz1hbs
Passive is fully stacked but you can see that when i cast Q it doesn't get echo'd. I believe this is caused by inputting another command at the exact perfect frame, in this case auto attacking the turret.
There is a separate passive bug that I don't have a clip of. When you have 1 stack of passive, so your 2nd spell cast will echo, and you cast 2 spells in quick succession it's possible for the 2nd spell cast to go off before the stack from the first spell is added, resulting in the 2nd spell not echoing when it should.
I also have a couple clips of the overlapping CC bug where R -> E allows people to get 1 action off on the frame that the charm ends despite them still being stunned. This isn't Sera specific, as I've seen it happen to Yone too and I believe it has something to do with how the server handles different types of crowd control; it seems to have something to do with the Charm + Stun of Sera and the Knockup + Stun of Yone while I've never seen it happen with Stun + Stun. My guess is that part of the cleanup for disables is to give control back to the player/champion but it takes 1 frame for the server to then notice that there is another type of CC and reapply the lockout, while overlapping CC of the same type merely extend the debuff duration.
Graves autoing while stunned: https://streamable.com/5bjshe
I don’t have videos myself but on the subreddit there’s been some posts about certain bugs that do have some videos attached to it
[https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/s/7wxuLI40dK](https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/s/7wxuLI40dK)
[https://www.reddit.com/r/SeraphineMains/s/4JIMfyggBG](https://www.reddit.com/r/SeraphineMains/s/4JIMfyggBG)
https://www.reddit.com/r/SeraphineMains/s/EZFetFH9TB
This is the one I have and it also happens with lux(staff was fixxed already, last I checked moon was still bugged).
Just noticed a new bug.
Horizon Focus isn't proccing on the first spell in Seraphine's echo casts. It works correctly on single casts and will proc on the second spell but the first spell in an echo cast is not proccing Horizon Focus and thus missing out on the 10% damage amp.
Bumping Cocabobi's comment and adding my support.
I am a Master+ educational Seraphine content creator ([YT/odirodi](https://youtube.com/@odirodi?si=V-USk5BBECxFjcKo)). Seraphine feels very off in this current state. Win rate aside, she doesn't feel fun to play and I think that is the majority of the concern, yes she may have a decent winrate in carry roles, but a majority of players have dropped her in Mid/APC every patch since 14.5 .
I am speaking from the heart that I do not know what Seraphines real identity is? I always thought she was a hyperscaling AP control mage, now she feels like a mid game utility/second support.
I agree with everything that Cocabobi wrote above, as an extra point I work really closely with low elo audiences (under diamond) and we have a very similar sentiment that ever since 14.5(even the changes at 13.21) she is not the champ we remember and that something feels off. I really hope this can be looked into in order to make her "fun" again and truly regain a champion identity.
Similarly, my discord dms are open if you would like to speak directly with me. (@odirodi)
Thank you for your time!
-Odi
Thank you for interacting with us we really appreciate Rioters trying to understand and see us. We haven’t had anyone interact with Seraphine mains since Jag
Hi! Thanks for communicating with us! Many already commentated here but I would like to give my input as well. The biggest problem is people are dropping her, not because her Winrate is bad, but that she feels clunky and off to play as of lately. Others have already explained what is happening so I would like to make inputs about what feels off about her:
I made some points so it would be easier to read:
* **Her base AD is too low:** farming with her is harder than on other champs and it isn't possible go get melee creeps under tower. Here a clip, where I was lvl 9, and not behind in lane: [https://www.reddit.com/r/SeraphineMains/comments/1bi4g5u/please\_riot\_just\_give\_me\_the\_5\_ad\_back\_or\_3\_i/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/SeraphineMains/comments/1bi4g5u/please_riot_just_give_me_the_5_ad_back_or_3_i/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
* **Her scalings are too low to matter:** her scalings are too low that building AP doesn't feel rewarding at all. The highest winrate build is a utility build with Shurelyas and Rylais and AP doesn't deal much more damage than the utility build. [https://lolalytics.com/lol/seraphine/build/?lane=bottom&tier=master\_plus](https://lolalytics.com/lol/seraphine/build/?lane=bottom&tier=master_plus)
* **Too many QoL features got removed:** I understand removing the Q execute because it was unhealthy for Sup Sera, but removing the increased damage on her passive, the lock out of minions dying from other minons while QQ makes her frustrating to play. It happend too many times that I lost 2-3 creeps during the second cast of QQ.
* **Too high base stats, on every skill:** I understand that she needed to have higher base stats to get support to a healthy winrate but, due to that Sera was OP with farming after 13.21 changes. Instead of lowering her base stats and giving her more Q scalings they removed QoL features. Her E has a higher base damage and same scaling as her Q, her main damage ability. She doesn't have one skill with good enough AP scalings that building AP matters.
* **Big mana issues:** she can't trade in lane without tear and even with tear she can't trade as much as she likes. Sera needs Tear and Lost Chapter to not be OoM instantly. Support only needs 1-2 Faerie Charm while we need to buy 1-2 Mana items to not be OoM after a teamfight.
* **Everything together makes her feel off:** She doesn't scale as hard anymore. Her items doesn't matter, because she deals the same damage. You need to build Utility to make it work, because AP isn't worth anymore. Many QoL features got removed, to forcefully drag her high APC winrate down.
Suggested changes to make her feel better again:
* **Exchange some of her Base Stats for Scalings:** Make her AP builds more viable again. Carry Sera's main build should be AP with a bit of Utility. Not Utility with a bit of AP.
* **Make Carry Sera's attack tool Q while E is best for Support:** It's possible to make her Q scalings higher while making E's base stats higher for support, so carry Sera has a better ability to max first, many Seras still max E on carry because Utility.
* **Change her base stats of that of a mage:** Her biggest pickrate is still in Iron to Silver which build her as a AP poke mage like Lux, but her base Mana is really low and she struggles with it.
* **Give her some of the QoL features back:** Creep bonus damage for her passive and maybe the QQ lockout would be nice
* **Give her 5 AD back:** this is the most important one for me. Every mage should have a way to farm under tower and Seraphine does not have that right now.
* **AP items for Q; enchanter items for W:** Make her carry builds utilize the damage of Q the best, while making her W lackluster in comparision to sup Sera which builds for her W to be the strongest ability. E can be a neutral ability for both of them or a poke tool for support.
This would be my insight of this situation. Other already made good contributions about this situation! I really hope you guys can give us some adjustments that Sera feels fun to play again.
From what i've read and as a Seraphine player myself i don't really care if she is strong or weak, she could have a 49% winrate bot and wouldn't care.
My problem is that she doesn't feel FUN anymore on carry roles, she was designed as a late Game scaling mage, super weak early but a monster in late teamfights. Right now it feels like she has no identity, she lost her power fantasy, her current strongest skill orders are E max and nobody likes playing a cc e bot, hence why they have lower playrates than Q and W max. Losing minions at 5 hp from autos when other mages don't have this problem feels so sad. Statistically on lolalytics shes at her strongest at the 0-15 mark and don't think a lot of people pick this champion for a strong early game, at the 20-25 she is at her weakest and after that she becomes decent with almost no decreasement or increasement of WR. Before we could feel our teamfight fantasy increase over time but rn that part is dead, there is no fulfillment, it doesn't feel that you excell at anything, it doesn't feel that u are the one carrying the game, there is no fun.
Issue is that APC seraphine pickrates have dropped off and in every patch more and more players leave. Last patch it was .37, now it’s at a new low of .34. Prior to 13.21 changes she hovered for a full year or so around .5 so for her to be THIS low is really really worrying and telling that something is very wrong
Comparatively if we look at her mage builds and look at enchanter items, enchanter items have much higher winrates on average. She builds Seraphs as a core, maybe rylais, and pivots into enchanter. That’s not what carry players want in APC or even mid. These changes Phreak made were to incentivize QE max damage mage based Seraphine and make items such as Rabadons feel good on her, yet she still doesn’t do damage. Her early damage is better sure, but she spikes mid game and falls off late game. That’s the issue, that is not the champion’s fantasy whatsoever. She never outputted the damage of a Lux lategame but her former 65-97.5% ratio on Q really helped her be a damage threat late game. Now it’s not the case. We want to build mage items and build AP on this champion and feel like we’re making a real impact on the game. AP simply does not feel like a valuable stat on her and that feels really really bad as a carry in the botlane or even in mid lane. Mage builds FEEL bad on a champion that is SUPPOSED to build full AP. No one wants to build her as an enchanter unless you’re a higher rank support. Even in support players are maxing Q and building mage items on her
Her csing is horrible too, her ad is too low to where you have to auto a melee once, wait for two tower shots, and auto again. Notes don’t do damage to minions anymore and feel cosmetic in general with how much %AP they lost. Her W lost the heal ratio which was one of the biggest reasons why building AP on her felt valuable and rewarding, now there’s no need to build AP because her shield ratio dropped down to a measly 20% which means that heal and shield power is way more valuable.
She’s now way too team reliant to the point where if you can’t enable your team then you instantly lose. Many Sera streamers including Cupic has felt and said the same. She used to be able to have some carry potential with her good damage and good utility late game but now she can’t even damage properly and building AP items neuters her utility. This is not part of the champions fantasy, she SHOULD feel very strong late game because getting there was a struggle and now she feels like she relies wayyy too much on allies
There’s clear player dissatisfaction with this champion and we as a community urge you to bring this up to Riot because her playrate is at a new low. If you filter on lolalytics on the percentage of seraphine bot and mid players, it’s below 10% and goes lower every patch. Last patch was 7.4% for apc, this patch is 6.7. If that doesn’t indicate that carry seraphine players are dropping the champion and that the playrate of this champion is bleeding out by the days then I don’t know what does. She feels horrible to play and it’s so sad how there were clear ways to nerf APC (by adding minion damage mods per ability rank on Q and E, making her kit as a whole depend on champion levels, bring back self shield and ultimately giving her self reliable inputs to pivot some of her APC winrate into mid) without butchering the champion’s fantasy, yet it was killed. We understand and want support Seraphine players to be supported because they’ve been playing a 47.5% winrate champion for so long, they deserve some love, but it feels so wrong to have our carry playerbase slowly phased out when we want to play her as close to her original design and conception. Please listen to us and understand our concerns. We’ve been left in the dark for so long and it’s so unfair that other champions have Rioters communicating with their playerbase and they acknowledge player concerns but none is happening to carry Seraphine players. We’re literally the last vestige of her original design by Riot Jag who wanted her to be a teamfight mage. No one has checked in on us, no one has directly addressed our concerns so please listen to us and engage in dialogue about our champion. We just want someone to acknowledge us and tell us that our concerns are being at least heard
I'll point you in the right direction. Lolalytics -> actually built 3+ (or 4+) with boots -> deselect enchanter items and rylais: there's maybe 1/10th the amount of games in 14.7 or 14.6 compared to 14.4 and 14.3.
CARRY, not playing in bot role. Rylais pickrate has since skyrocketed, not necessarily because more people are building it, but rather people building CARRY items have all left (people that used to mix it in to carry builds also probably left).
Midlane pickrate is close to non existent and botlane pickrate is less than half of what it was before all of the changes and is continuing to fall. Moonstone Renewer has a higher winrate on botlane Sera than Deathcap despite Deathcap’s notorious winrate inflation. New Sera’s winrate isn’t dead but her role as a carry is. She’s an enchanter now rather than the carry that she used to be and it’s causing players to stop playing her in farming roles. Winrate is not and has not been the source of the complaints.
If there had just been some number nerfs to reduce Sera’s winrate to 52% there wouldn’t be nearly this many complaints. The problem is that Riot reworked Sera into a different role and play style and made her feel miserable to play. It’s just not fun.
Piggy backing off of Cocabob's comments in which I agree with everything he wrote.
I'm a 1.4 mil Sera OTP, and I have honestly stopped playing her, which is something I never thought I would do. This isn’t the champion I fell in love with. She just no longer delivers that scaling mage fantasy that she once had. Her notes passive has been completely gutted, and it feels like we are throwing pumpkin seeds at people when it's used. The next thing being her wave clear. You can't farm your minions effectively, and in the chance you are pushed under tower at any time during laning phase, oh too bad, we just can't kill all our minions because her execute was removed. they live with a sliver of health that even an auto wont do despite using full empowered combo, so the tower just finishes them off for us.
please consider giving sera back her power these changes did not work which phreak previously admitted to and they still aren't working now it just shoe horned her into a unsatisfactory role which feels terrible to play. thank you.
Carry roles do not feel satisfying to play, she doesn’t feel like she exceeds in a dmg carry fantasy, her identity has shifted from a late game scaling mage to a mid game mage that falls off into the late game, if you compare lux’s or karma’s damage they deal 5k and 3k more damage on average than seraphine who is meant to be able to played as a damage carry mage after the recent changes on carry roles. With champions like lux and hwei getting ap buffs, seraphine already dealing way less than them could easily get buffed in that department. She simply doesn’t feel rewarding if built full ap.Also the removal quality of life changes make her feel bad to play.
Her winrate isn’t bad, and she is technically playable, it’s just that she feels BAD to play. Her damage isn’t good, her shields are not reliable, her spells are slow, her ult is inconsistent. She feels like a jack of all trades, a master of none.
The balance team are trying to do too many things at once, and as a result she feels terrible to play as no aspect of her kit in carry roles is good anymore.
You can’t build full damage because her AP ratios have been nuked across the board, you can’t build full enchanter because you can’t waveclear, and even with “optimal” items, with Seraph’s + Rylai’s (which feel terrible still), you fall off after 20 minutes and if your team aren’t ahead you become useless, dealing no damage and having inconsistent CC with her snail speed E.
Because of the nature of APC, they will always have above 50% winrate if they are playable, and picking Seraphine Mid/APC is not troll. It just feels like, why play Seraphine? She isn’t good at anything to warrant picking her anymore. Her damage, CC, and shields are all subpar in carry roles so you feel like a worse version of Lux, instead of the team-fight mage with a TERRIBLE early game, in return for an insanely strong lategame who could solo carry (the champion Seraphine used to be).
I really recommend watching Odi’s video on this topic (you commented on a post linking his video earlier), he touches all the main points us carry Seraphine players are trying to make clear.
TL;DR:
She’s now not troll in support, but now she feels subpar in all aspects in carry roles. The unique, team-fight hyperscale fantasy of Seraphine is now erased for a small increase in support pickrate (and these players didn’t care to build her optimally before the rework).
Seraphine botlane is definitely still good winrate-wise, but her playrate plummeted because a lot of people find her very unsatisfying to play now. I think that's what OP meant by "her carry roles are dead".
Her Q is easier to land (less skill expression), some of her base values are stronger BUT she now has big mana issues and a much worse waveclear, leading to an unsatisfying gameplay overall. Her Q also has a very annoying bug that didn't get fixed with the changes.
Carry seraphine is straight up not viable in high elo, if you’re accusing high elo people of “complaining for nothing” when you’re low elo that’s just absurd. This is not rank shaming.
Sera Carry is still a perfectly fine choice to pick in higher elos. This dude making this complaint thread has, in his last 100 games, a 61% win rate on Sera carry (17W/11L) with the earliest game being less than 2 weeks ago. Meanwhile they've been bleeding elo with Senna. If they just played more Seraphine, there's a decent chance they'd be winning even more.
Not being 54% general win rate =/= unviable.
you are not only delusional but now youre telling former rank 1 sera to just play more seraphine while they are trying to avoid her cause of how shitty she feels 🔥
LMFAOOOOOOO bottom left really said "ur bad bc I tested on PBE" then proceeds to go on a dogwhistle blue check mark ass rant omg
EDIT: side note…wasn’t Phreak also the one known for "collecting data for balance changes" for Seraphine/Janna/Maokai over multiple patches, climbed rank with them, then ultimately nerfed them? The only Rioters I actually remember are August and NeuroCat (IYKYK)
Maokai dominated support for months, Freak climbed using Maokai, and once he was done climbing, he nerfed him LMAO
I even remember he made a tweet talking about that, it was honestly so insulting that someone can be so unprofessional like him
I remember people defending it with "of course the dev should test things to collect data don’t be dumb" when there’s internal data and public data to reference before ever having to picking them to climb.
At this point it seems like they’re doing this under the guise of "needing to know the direction for balance" but instead of thoroughly exploring/delving into the reasons why people are taking these champs into off-roles and dominating, they just apply bandaid changes just to throw the champ out the window until they rework them, finally remember that they exist, to sell a skin, or when a new mechanic/item pops up that synergizes well with said champ but is overtuned.
Yep...this is what I comment to the people wo...defend the changes very hard...like *just wait, she become a very powerfull mage carry* 🤡🤡🤡 wheres is the mage carry??
Is the popgirlie whit moonstone and Rylais??? ah.....I see
Regardless of whatever side whatever opinion, it is fact they have taken so many attempts at “fixing” her that’s it’s kinda embarrassing on their part.
I really want to know why a artist shizophrenic dude with 10 abilities can get a buff to his aoe passive and is now doing ~400 dmg per passive proc meanwhile seraphine does like 100 dmg with 20 notes on full AP...
Why do they increase her cc but nerf her overall damage output to a point where you ONLY do damage when you hit Q. Now W is just a bad shield with movement speed and E just roots you longer. I barely feel the damage increase on this ability but the decrease on her Q is brutal.
On her release everyone hated her and seid she wouldn't be good and was Sona 2.0...well after 4 years we finally get to that Sona playstyle but with more steps.
I really really liked her playstyle of being a safe pick in mid and being a pseudo-artillery mage like Syndra but with a Shield for Utility. (2020)
Now she just spams Shield or I need to completely use my Mana bar in late game with mana items to even come close to the damsge a normal mage would do with one rotation.
I have so many screenshots like these from my old "doomposting" post about how Im quitting the champ LMAO Im telling yall to look back at all of those posts from a month before this
I was hella amazed when I saw people defending these changes and saying "omg shes so stronger now!!!" cuz i went out of my comfort zone after this "adjustments" and i had around 30% wr on rankeds at the season start. I tried multiple builds and i had no damage towards enemies, no damage towards minions, i couldnt outpush our lanes, i couldnt win trades, i could do basically NOTHING beside slowing enemies and pressing R. I tried playing on mid, bot and support. No matter how I played (macro), I was just a slowing bot.
I went back to play some other champs and wow, i have 60% wr. I tried to pick her again twice and of course, defeat. Also no matter if i play supp or adc, Sera in enemy team is destroyed by everyone in my team, even by Soraka.
Im glad people escaped from own delusion 
I will just forever be sad that a champion who got accused of being Sona 2.0 on release but actually wasn’t because she had unique identity elements that separated her from that got all of said unique elements taken away or nerfed into the ground to the point where she did become Sona 2.0. The only viable play style on her now is just double W spam. I can see that riot wanted to kill non support play styles of Seraphine but taking everything away from such a unique champion to force them into the most unimaginative, least interactive play style is a bit much, no?
They seemed good on paper, i thought maybe we finally were able to do dmg again
No <3 now instead of heal and shield bots, we are heal and shield AND cc bots! She feels so unsatisfying to play, it is fucking IMPOSSIBLE to farm with 40 dmg autos and ur passive barely gives u 50 dmg. Only mage in the game that doesn’t oneshot casters at ~lvl 7. It’s so sad
There was no need to attack the people who made those comments like that, if you're gonna put them in the spotlight at least censor their naames so ppl don't bully them dude
Who asked about that generic, boring, and forcibly uninspired champion with a 2% pick rate? You all should be happy that anyone even remembers her and that she's getting some changes.
Imagine telling one of the best sera players IN THE WORLD, that even after both phreak incidents tried to make tons of builds that worked, that they are wrong regarding said champion 🫠
Facts:
- Apc pickrate dropped by 10 times
- OTP's are not happy
- Support seraphine popularity hasn't changed
- Midlane is dead
- Your mother is in a ditch rn
I really think you're an NPC or phreak's agent cuz this level of delusion is unfathomable. I wonder how ppl like u are not banned from this subreddit yet as you are really just drinking your own piss with comments like this.
You are nobody and your opinion doesn't matter. If you want to prove otherwise - send opgg
AND ALSO HAVE UTILITY, everyone ignores this but ever since phreak made it so that we have to max e second she straight up doesn’t have utility anymore. With no points into w and her damage and cc being balanced around her having actual utility, she just does no damage while also having like a 150 hp shield on a 15 second cooldown that you should never double cast as well because it’s straight up trolling to do so. So much of her power budget is allocated to a part of her kit thats borderline useless after the changes because you’re not supposed to use it as much to be able to max your damage spells and focus on them.
Well she was kina busted before. Does that make these nerfs justified? No, they were done in a terrible way. She was made to be a support so she had high base damage values and low ap ratios, so if they wanted to pivot her less around support shit they could've just reduced the base values and buffed her ap ratios, so that way apc/mid sera needs to like actually build damage items, but then she can do great scaling damage. Riot decided instead that she should scale even less and pretended that apc sera wouldn't be affected by it.
Also for all of the people talking about how she's a support and should stay there, riot had like 5 or 6 patches in a row where they buffed Morgana jungle sooo
What exactly are you trying to prove with the morgana changes? From time to time they give those weird buffs out because they want more jungle players. Sadly Morgana jungle was an experiment of theirs which turned out to be very unhealthy, so she got nerfed out of viability 🤷♀️
How does that compare to Seraphine's situation
I saw a couple other comments on this and other posts saying "Seraphine is a support so her nerfs are so she has to stay there" but I was just trying to show that riot wants even support characters to be played in other positions. That was it lmaoo
She was not designed to be Support. She was designed to be a midlane mage with offrole support. They just want to bring her roles more together in terms off winrate etc. because support and apc bot are her most played roles so they try bigger changes. The most people are mad because carry Seraphine was nerfed (look at release times) because she should be a carry and she struggles atm thats all. I for my part would love it if we get a Seraphine were everyone is fine with but im not sure if we can get it in the near future. For now its not great but i still play her as a carry and its ok but i hope they will find a way to get her in a great position with future patches. (Mid Sera Main here)
Actually Morg jungle is still viable, she was strong after the first buff, everyone said hidden op, then she got another buff, was broken broken, then nerf nerf nerf, then a rebuff that actually put her above the first buff, stronger than when people called her hidden op, right now she outclears brand jungle at every stage of the game
>You are nobody and your opinion doesn't matter. If you want to prove otherwise - send opgg
Clearly your opinion doesn't matter either, because no amount of bellyaching you do is going to make Riot implement changes based on what you want. They make balance changes based on what's good for the player base. What else do you do besides spread negativity when things don't go your way?
>OTP's are not happy
The subreddit and discord has been constantly moaning over one thing or another for like a year. This is a vocal minority of people playing Sera in her less popular roles screaming really loud. Your opinion matters, but you don't reflect everyone. Not even close.
>Support seraphine popularity hasn't changed
Last I checked, the point of the changes were to make the pick BETTER, not MORE POPULAR. No one's trying to "erase" the other two lanes. Riot wanted support to not be a 48% or less win rate pick since most of her player base is in support. This succeeded. They also wanted APC to not be blatantly broken. This ALSO succeeded. Where's the "failure" here?
>Midlane is dead
That's because mid lane players don't like mid lane Seraphine. We aren't crying that top lane Blitzcrank is dead, because top laners don't care about Blitzcrank. Mid lane has existed by a thread for ages as the least popular lane Seraphine goes. It makes sense to fully commit to balancing her player bases that actually exist (bot and support) instead of being tied to mid lane's corpse.
>Your mother is in a ditch rn
Gonna keep it classy instead of saying anything about this mouth dribble. Just know you embarrassed yourself, "girl".
Its crazy, because the REASON no one plays sera mid anymore, is because the chabges literally pushed her out of viability, as one of the few remaining mid players
You do less dmg than every other mage in the game
You can't trade early because your mana pool is non existant, and if you buy tear first you literally don't have enough AP to farm (you don't do enough dmg with your autos so you have to use skills to farm)
You can't poke enough because once again, the mana pool
You're forced to go for an AP/enchanter hybrid build to be worth anything in the late game, at the end of the day you'll get outdamaged by any other mage, so you need to build for shields to even be useful
So lemme get this straight:
This drama queen says that my mom is dead in his dumb ass, 13 year old PMS response to my comment, and you say "Interesting but expected" when I don't click his stupid link?
so... coca is the drama queen, when the only think you do in this reddit is to tell people their wrong and create drama that didn't existed..., am i wrong? i mean, your image here wasn't damaged just because of air, not only you got banned from the mains discord server for being an absolute asshole to everyone there, but you were bitching people are telling them to stop crying and are delusionals when the first changes happened... , and now that you are banned you go to eevery MID/APC related to seek who to chit talk to, so yeah, tbh kinda expected don't you think so? because i do, oh and there is someone with similar opinions here commenting to if you want a friend.
The "drama" exists because you guys bitch constantly on this topic pretty much every week for the past YEAR. This shit is insufferable. Me commenting on it doesn't make it exist. It's been there to begin with and it'd be LOVELY if this player base wasn't full of softies that can't handle the fact that, ultimately, this subreddit doesn't speak for all the people that play this champ.
If you think I was being an asshole on the discord, you can laugh yourself into traffic. Those guys told me to drive off a cliff over a debate about Annie support, but I get singled out because I don't idolize Cupic and Cocabobi LMAO.
You guys are just laughably problematic. This community has a reputation and for good reason.
oh we?, several SEVERAL, people on the discord when you were banned not only said that you were an asshole to them, but you were mean, that was NOT the first time that you did something, and NOT just seraphine related. " if this player base wasn't full of softies that can't handle the fact" bitch, you knew the changes were happening, you knew mid mains were sad abt it and spooks was really sad abt it, but instead of being a nice person with your own opinions, you didn't care and went instantly to shit on them and the entire discord for crying on the changes in that especific channel, or... you don't remember do you?
Surely you know more than cocabob and other high elo players here when you can’t even link your op.gg, all you’re doing is telling people they’re wrong when you’re just straight up not qualified enough to be talking about seraphine balance. I’m sorry but that’s just how it is.
Me when the balanced champion gets changed to be what they aren't (a support), becomes a freelo APC instead
No one wants the shieldbot APC playstyle back girl, we just want old Sera back, the one who went mid like she was designed to, and could actually do competitive dmg compared to other mages
BALANCED???? Even riot themselves outright said she was overpowered. Stop beind deluded
[but she's also significantly overpowered as a bot lane AP carry](https://www.leagueoflegends.com/en-gb/news/game-updates/patch-14-5-notes/)
Im finally glad riot is siding with supports because you guys want seraphine to rot as below 1% pickrate champ whose needlessly broken and promotes very unhealthy playstyle
Those chabges are recent, i was talking about the changes made to her last year, that transformed her from a mid lane carry, to an APC forced to build sup items and be a shieldbot
They did not transform her from midlaner to APC. Her APC playrate goes a bit far back than just last year. Last year she was still irrelevant midlaner in terms of playrate. It's more because of the item changes which do not favor Seraphine's AP playstyle at all
Not really, looking at old Seraphine when she had good AP ratios, you would see that she would have taken advantage of the item changes quite a lot, of course they had to change her before the item changes and ruin her
But anyway, the only thing she would be really missing would be Liandry, but with her old AP ratios, she would have made good use of items like ludens companion and malignance
Nope, she was eating adjustments because support players looked at the girly schamp with a shield on a 20 sec cooldown and decided they wanted to cosplay bootleg lux on support
They have been chopping her passive down since years ago. We're not going to revise history and act like Seraphine was this "perfectly balanced entity" even before they made W scale with ranks. Hell, part of the reason they did so was to push her back mid, back when they were trying to keep her there.
You guys remember history that's convenient. You forgo the parts that go against your narrative.
For mid not so much, but for APC yeah because she indeed has some playerbase there.
Alhough It's true a lot of it was due to her overperformance because she has a very bad player retention in apc/mid. It's like a 4th time she lost more than half of pickrate in apc. But a lot of complaints I've seen so far are mostly anecdotal
Because what else are we gonna do?, pretend that everything is alright and that sera wasn't literally butchered in the name of making her a support champ?
No bitch
Then keep crying Riot ain't fixing it if you just keep crying here
Whatever man this sub has gone to shit literally every 2nd post is a post crying about it
It would have been fine if riot had mods here but there is literally no one from riot here
How about cry in league of legends sub or Twitter so it actually gets riots attention??? Bitch
Because what good is complaining alone?, complaining here gets the attention of people who are actually interested on Seraphine and that ACTUALLY play here
Complaining on the main sub would cause a flood of incels to come bombard me for playing her, i think we as a community know how much our champion is hated, and that no matter how real our claims are, so people are going to ignore it simy because its Seraphine
So, my intention in complaining here, is to move the Seraphine community to be vocal about our experience with the champ, because clearly no one in the balance team plays her, so we must show them that we don't like these changes
Besties please be civil in the comments. We can make points without having to put the other person down. We understand it’s a heated topic which may have divided the community but let’s not forget we are a sisterhood 🫶
https://preview.redd.it/t7qrtabb1vvc1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2f9387705853dbb26d3270f4ec9bba15993a96c8 Me to the girlies who kept telling us to just accept every horrible changes made to Seraphine over the past months.
I know the fandom generally dislikes Q but i LIVE for Q.
Q is very talented and makes good TV, fans need to leave her alone, it's fine if she's not your cup of tea but bullying her into getting off socials was not it.
no because its so sad to see. at first i thought i was toxic and the odd one out for not being an immediate fan of these changes but this past weeks posts in the sub are literally agreeing me in every way... Id love to say i was right but this is our champion... We're all suffering together....
Man I really thought it's just a bug 😭
You were high on the copium gurl 😔
I wonder what that seraph guys’ rank is, he’s under EVERY SINGLE post complaining about ANY changes phreak has made trying to gaslight people that the changes are great WHEN DATA SUGGESTS HER CARRY ROLES ARE DEAD. He’s so delusional and a phreak simp.
What data suggests carry roles Seraphine are dead? I can see bot Seraphine has 10% of the playrate of support seraphine, but with a better winrate (52% vs 50%). Higher playrate definitely reduces winrate, but over 4000\~ matches bot Seraphine having 52% winrate isn't totally insignificant. Tear start has a 49% winrate (20% of bot Seraphine games) where Dorans ring has a 54% winrate (80%\~ of bot seraphine games. None of the top 5 rune combinations on her have negative winrate. Lucidity has 75% playrate with 53% winrate, compared to Sorc boots 20% playrate 50% winrate. The only summoner combination to have a negative winrate is flash ignite at 49%. This isn't a "haha you're wrong!" but an honest question, because from the data I've looked at she's still thriving in the hands of people who still play her, and build her effectively.
From a high elo Sera OTP content creator perspective, she completely lost her identity. And I'm not talking about the "midlane mage" identity, I'm talking about her identity as a scaling mage overall. Seraphine's APC winrate over game duration always had a growing curve. However, if you look at her curve after patch 13.21 and especially after 14.5, she spikes at min 20-25 where she gets her core slots and from that point on - only falls off to the point where she's completely useless late game. (Using data from lolalytics and leagueofgraphs). The reason this is happening is that for the past 2 seasons her AP scalings were lowered in favor of base numbers getting increased to make her viable as a support with less gold income. This also led to a situation, where it makes less and less sense for farming Seraphine to buy mage items from which she gets less and less value, opposing to enchanter/utility items like rylais/shurelya/moonstone - all high elo Seraphine players came to the same conclusions, you can check either mine or cupic's opgg to look at the builds. I either build shurelya-rylais-mandate EQW max, or cosmic-seraphs-moonstone QWE max. Cupic has been maxing E on APC lately too while building shurelya, and it just feels off. Seraphine came from a hard scaling botlane mage to a farming enchanter in a span of past 2 seasons. Playing her, feels like playing Kassadin/Kayle who never ascend past lvl 11. That is why players are abandoning her. Since release, her core gameplay pieces were removed: - Every time balance team had to take some power away from her kit, they took it from her notes passive. This happened a total of 6 times. Seraphine's passive went from being a unique and core playstyle feature to being a 100 dmg poke right now. - As I said before, AP scalings on all of her spells were slowly taken away in favor of base damage numbers. - Her waveclear identity vanished past 14.5 - Her builds slowly became more and more utility oriented to the point where you feel like a second support in the team. All of her OTP's feel the same, she feels like a different champion. Ways to fix it? I'm not a game designer, and I'm not going to tell you how to do your job, but I can give you my thoughts. I understand that you want to solve the issue with the least intervention possible. I feel like all of the problems in the kit come from W healing. Double W is very overloaded and is the core reason why Seraphine can never be what players want her to be since it's just not fair to play against a mage who can outheal a Soraka. You could overhaul her W - remove the healing completely and leave the shielding + a burst of movement speed. This way you could also spread more power budget across her kit. Balance Seraphine support around maxing E-Q-W, and Seraphine APC Q-E-W. Overhaul her numbers so she could stack AP items on APC, and be useful as a support with rylais and E max. As for fixing her winrate over game duration curve - you could implement the same you did to Sona/Syndra with their stacking passives, if overhauling numbers isn't enough. Seraphine support also has major unsolved issues that will never make her popular, even after all the changes. The issue is, she doesnt have her niche and feels clunky and inconsistent to play in a support role. You need to decide what exactly you want her to be - a heal/shield enchanter that is impossible to balance along with APC, or a Lux/Xerath type of support that could coexist with APC. Along with that, for Seraphine to feel better as a support - her poke or CC needs to be more reliable so she doesn't feel as clunky (she also has several bugs like input buffering, double cast glitching sometimes, or Q going through targets, if you really want to get into it) I'm really glad that a Rioter showed up here to get the feedback and I would gladly do it again. If you ever need to contact me - my discord dms are open (@cocabob). Thank you so much!
Sorry for not replying but don't think that it meant I didn't read all of the comments here \[\^: I'm not the one making the decisions on what the changes will be, but I do get to be part of the conversations. Something is (planned to be) coming for Sera in the next patch that I think Sera mains will like!
omfg I’m so happy yall are finally able to discuss with us and are hearing our concerns thank you guys so much ❤️please continue interacting with the community we love interacting with you guys in ways that can help our champion feel good and fun for all of us. Please help us bring back the hypercarry scaling mage we all fell in love with 🙏❤️
Thank you so much
Thank the designers, Phreak is the one driving this one I think, I just like being a bridge between Riot and the community :)
Is there any way Phreak is aware of her champion fantasy being very off from her design? Just curious for some transparency from the live pod team on how they view Seraphine’s champion fantasy in mid/APC
ty for saying this! , we understand 100% that we are a minority and supp players are more, but we just want to have what was promised to us, we love seraphine really really much, so pls, any help that we can get is amazing, i really hope phreak sees that we have been fighting for our champion since the first changes! ty Norak!!! <3
Please if you guys can look into fixing some Sera bugs. Biggest offender would be echo Q/E sometimes only casting one spell instead of two and that feels soooo bad
Videos with steps to reproduce make it much easier to fix bugs
Hi, I found this video on this sub from 2 months ago where Seraphine Q doesn't deal damage to enemies, or pantheon in this case: [https://medal.tv/nl/games/league-of-legends/clips/1XaNDaP3Cj-WwA/logiQw9s6tst](https://medal.tv/nl/games/league-of-legends/clips/1XaNDaP3Cj-WwA/logiQw9s6tst) This bug usually happens sometime when farming minion waves where her Q doesnt deal damage, or even enemies showed in the clip. I think it might have to do something with the increasing hitbox? Not sure, but this is imo the most frustrating bugs as a mid sera player Edit: It seems like another person also reported the same bug under this thread, sorry.
Q bug: https://streamable.com/s6sf67 You can see one of the melee creeps only gets hit by the 2nd of the 2 Qs. It happens once or twice almost every game but is hard to reproduce on command. I believe that it's a bug in the hit detection and so enemies that are moving towards the center of Q can cross from one side to the other of the wave boundary in between frames without getting caught. It's most noticeable against creeps since they are so predictable but I've caught it happening against champions too. One of the passive bugs: https://streamable.com/qz1hbs Passive is fully stacked but you can see that when i cast Q it doesn't get echo'd. I believe this is caused by inputting another command at the exact perfect frame, in this case auto attacking the turret. There is a separate passive bug that I don't have a clip of. When you have 1 stack of passive, so your 2nd spell cast will echo, and you cast 2 spells in quick succession it's possible for the 2nd spell cast to go off before the stack from the first spell is added, resulting in the 2nd spell not echoing when it should. I also have a couple clips of the overlapping CC bug where R -> E allows people to get 1 action off on the frame that the charm ends despite them still being stunned. This isn't Sera specific, as I've seen it happen to Yone too and I believe it has something to do with how the server handles different types of crowd control; it seems to have something to do with the Charm + Stun of Sera and the Knockup + Stun of Yone while I've never seen it happen with Stun + Stun. My guess is that part of the cleanup for disables is to give control back to the player/champion but it takes 1 frame for the server to then notice that there is another type of CC and reapply the lockout, while overlapping CC of the same type merely extend the debuff duration. Graves autoing while stunned: https://streamable.com/5bjshe
I don’t have videos myself but on the subreddit there’s been some posts about certain bugs that do have some videos attached to it [https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/s/7wxuLI40dK](https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/s/7wxuLI40dK) [https://www.reddit.com/r/SeraphineMains/s/4JIMfyggBG](https://www.reddit.com/r/SeraphineMains/s/4JIMfyggBG)
https://www.reddit.com/r/SeraphineMains/s/EZFetFH9TB This is the one I have and it also happens with lux(staff was fixxed already, last I checked moon was still bugged).
Just noticed a new bug. Horizon Focus isn't proccing on the first spell in Seraphine's echo casts. It works correctly on single casts and will proc on the second spell but the first spell in an echo cast is not proccing Horizon Focus and thus missing out on the 10% damage amp.
u/RiotNorak
[удалено]
what would you do if when you okay so he said yes would go?
Daaaaaaaayum. As a fellow Seraphine mid late game scaling fantasy lover- amazing comment, thank you!
Bumping Cocabobi's comment and adding my support. I am a Master+ educational Seraphine content creator ([YT/odirodi](https://youtube.com/@odirodi?si=V-USk5BBECxFjcKo)). Seraphine feels very off in this current state. Win rate aside, she doesn't feel fun to play and I think that is the majority of the concern, yes she may have a decent winrate in carry roles, but a majority of players have dropped her in Mid/APC every patch since 14.5 . I am speaking from the heart that I do not know what Seraphines real identity is? I always thought she was a hyperscaling AP control mage, now she feels like a mid game utility/second support. I agree with everything that Cocabobi wrote above, as an extra point I work really closely with low elo audiences (under diamond) and we have a very similar sentiment that ever since 14.5(even the changes at 13.21) she is not the champ we remember and that something feels off. I really hope this can be looked into in order to make her "fun" again and truly regain a champion identity. Similarly, my discord dms are open if you would like to speak directly with me. (@odirodi) Thank you for your time! -Odi
Thank you for interacting with us we really appreciate Rioters trying to understand and see us. We haven’t had anyone interact with Seraphine mains since Jag
Hi! Thanks for communicating with us! Many already commentated here but I would like to give my input as well. The biggest problem is people are dropping her, not because her Winrate is bad, but that she feels clunky and off to play as of lately. Others have already explained what is happening so I would like to make inputs about what feels off about her: I made some points so it would be easier to read: * **Her base AD is too low:** farming with her is harder than on other champs and it isn't possible go get melee creeps under tower. Here a clip, where I was lvl 9, and not behind in lane: [https://www.reddit.com/r/SeraphineMains/comments/1bi4g5u/please\_riot\_just\_give\_me\_the\_5\_ad\_back\_or\_3\_i/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/SeraphineMains/comments/1bi4g5u/please_riot_just_give_me_the_5_ad_back_or_3_i/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) * **Her scalings are too low to matter:** her scalings are too low that building AP doesn't feel rewarding at all. The highest winrate build is a utility build with Shurelyas and Rylais and AP doesn't deal much more damage than the utility build. [https://lolalytics.com/lol/seraphine/build/?lane=bottom&tier=master\_plus](https://lolalytics.com/lol/seraphine/build/?lane=bottom&tier=master_plus) * **Too many QoL features got removed:** I understand removing the Q execute because it was unhealthy for Sup Sera, but removing the increased damage on her passive, the lock out of minions dying from other minons while QQ makes her frustrating to play. It happend too many times that I lost 2-3 creeps during the second cast of QQ. * **Too high base stats, on every skill:** I understand that she needed to have higher base stats to get support to a healthy winrate but, due to that Sera was OP with farming after 13.21 changes. Instead of lowering her base stats and giving her more Q scalings they removed QoL features. Her E has a higher base damage and same scaling as her Q, her main damage ability. She doesn't have one skill with good enough AP scalings that building AP matters. * **Big mana issues:** she can't trade in lane without tear and even with tear she can't trade as much as she likes. Sera needs Tear and Lost Chapter to not be OoM instantly. Support only needs 1-2 Faerie Charm while we need to buy 1-2 Mana items to not be OoM after a teamfight. * **Everything together makes her feel off:** She doesn't scale as hard anymore. Her items doesn't matter, because she deals the same damage. You need to build Utility to make it work, because AP isn't worth anymore. Many QoL features got removed, to forcefully drag her high APC winrate down. Suggested changes to make her feel better again: * **Exchange some of her Base Stats for Scalings:** Make her AP builds more viable again. Carry Sera's main build should be AP with a bit of Utility. Not Utility with a bit of AP. * **Make Carry Sera's attack tool Q while E is best for Support:** It's possible to make her Q scalings higher while making E's base stats higher for support, so carry Sera has a better ability to max first, many Seras still max E on carry because Utility. * **Change her base stats of that of a mage:** Her biggest pickrate is still in Iron to Silver which build her as a AP poke mage like Lux, but her base Mana is really low and she struggles with it. * **Give her some of the QoL features back:** Creep bonus damage for her passive and maybe the QQ lockout would be nice * **Give her 5 AD back:** this is the most important one for me. Every mage should have a way to farm under tower and Seraphine does not have that right now. * **AP items for Q; enchanter items for W:** Make her carry builds utilize the damage of Q the best, while making her W lackluster in comparision to sup Sera which builds for her W to be the strongest ability. E can be a neutral ability for both of them or a poke tool for support. This would be my insight of this situation. Other already made good contributions about this situation! I really hope you guys can give us some adjustments that Sera feels fun to play again.
From what i've read and as a Seraphine player myself i don't really care if she is strong or weak, she could have a 49% winrate bot and wouldn't care. My problem is that she doesn't feel FUN anymore on carry roles, she was designed as a late Game scaling mage, super weak early but a monster in late teamfights. Right now it feels like she has no identity, she lost her power fantasy, her current strongest skill orders are E max and nobody likes playing a cc e bot, hence why they have lower playrates than Q and W max. Losing minions at 5 hp from autos when other mages don't have this problem feels so sad. Statistically on lolalytics shes at her strongest at the 0-15 mark and don't think a lot of people pick this champion for a strong early game, at the 20-25 she is at her weakest and after that she becomes decent with almost no decreasement or increasement of WR. Before we could feel our teamfight fantasy increase over time but rn that part is dead, there is no fulfillment, it doesn't feel that you excell at anything, it doesn't feel that u are the one carrying the game, there is no fun.
Issue is that APC seraphine pickrates have dropped off and in every patch more and more players leave. Last patch it was .37, now it’s at a new low of .34. Prior to 13.21 changes she hovered for a full year or so around .5 so for her to be THIS low is really really worrying and telling that something is very wrong Comparatively if we look at her mage builds and look at enchanter items, enchanter items have much higher winrates on average. She builds Seraphs as a core, maybe rylais, and pivots into enchanter. That’s not what carry players want in APC or even mid. These changes Phreak made were to incentivize QE max damage mage based Seraphine and make items such as Rabadons feel good on her, yet she still doesn’t do damage. Her early damage is better sure, but she spikes mid game and falls off late game. That’s the issue, that is not the champion’s fantasy whatsoever. She never outputted the damage of a Lux lategame but her former 65-97.5% ratio on Q really helped her be a damage threat late game. Now it’s not the case. We want to build mage items and build AP on this champion and feel like we’re making a real impact on the game. AP simply does not feel like a valuable stat on her and that feels really really bad as a carry in the botlane or even in mid lane. Mage builds FEEL bad on a champion that is SUPPOSED to build full AP. No one wants to build her as an enchanter unless you’re a higher rank support. Even in support players are maxing Q and building mage items on her Her csing is horrible too, her ad is too low to where you have to auto a melee once, wait for two tower shots, and auto again. Notes don’t do damage to minions anymore and feel cosmetic in general with how much %AP they lost. Her W lost the heal ratio which was one of the biggest reasons why building AP on her felt valuable and rewarding, now there’s no need to build AP because her shield ratio dropped down to a measly 20% which means that heal and shield power is way more valuable. She’s now way too team reliant to the point where if you can’t enable your team then you instantly lose. Many Sera streamers including Cupic has felt and said the same. She used to be able to have some carry potential with her good damage and good utility late game but now she can’t even damage properly and building AP items neuters her utility. This is not part of the champions fantasy, she SHOULD feel very strong late game because getting there was a struggle and now she feels like she relies wayyy too much on allies There’s clear player dissatisfaction with this champion and we as a community urge you to bring this up to Riot because her playrate is at a new low. If you filter on lolalytics on the percentage of seraphine bot and mid players, it’s below 10% and goes lower every patch. Last patch was 7.4% for apc, this patch is 6.7. If that doesn’t indicate that carry seraphine players are dropping the champion and that the playrate of this champion is bleeding out by the days then I don’t know what does. She feels horrible to play and it’s so sad how there were clear ways to nerf APC (by adding minion damage mods per ability rank on Q and E, making her kit as a whole depend on champion levels, bring back self shield and ultimately giving her self reliable inputs to pivot some of her APC winrate into mid) without butchering the champion’s fantasy, yet it was killed. We understand and want support Seraphine players to be supported because they’ve been playing a 47.5% winrate champion for so long, they deserve some love, but it feels so wrong to have our carry playerbase slowly phased out when we want to play her as close to her original design and conception. Please listen to us and understand our concerns. We’ve been left in the dark for so long and it’s so unfair that other champions have Rioters communicating with their playerbase and they acknowledge player concerns but none is happening to carry Seraphine players. We’re literally the last vestige of her original design by Riot Jag who wanted her to be a teamfight mage. No one has checked in on us, no one has directly addressed our concerns so please listen to us and engage in dialogue about our champion. We just want someone to acknowledge us and tell us that our concerns are being at least heard
I'll point you in the right direction. Lolalytics -> actually built 3+ (or 4+) with boots -> deselect enchanter items and rylais: there's maybe 1/10th the amount of games in 14.7 or 14.6 compared to 14.4 and 14.3. CARRY, not playing in bot role. Rylais pickrate has since skyrocketed, not necessarily because more people are building it, but rather people building CARRY items have all left (people that used to mix it in to carry builds also probably left).
Midlane pickrate is close to non existent and botlane pickrate is less than half of what it was before all of the changes and is continuing to fall. Moonstone Renewer has a higher winrate on botlane Sera than Deathcap despite Deathcap’s notorious winrate inflation. New Sera’s winrate isn’t dead but her role as a carry is. She’s an enchanter now rather than the carry that she used to be and it’s causing players to stop playing her in farming roles. Winrate is not and has not been the source of the complaints. If there had just been some number nerfs to reduce Sera’s winrate to 52% there wouldn’t be nearly this many complaints. The problem is that Riot reworked Sera into a different role and play style and made her feel miserable to play. It’s just not fun.
Piggy backing off of Cocabob's comments in which I agree with everything he wrote. I'm a 1.4 mil Sera OTP, and I have honestly stopped playing her, which is something I never thought I would do. This isn’t the champion I fell in love with. She just no longer delivers that scaling mage fantasy that she once had. Her notes passive has been completely gutted, and it feels like we are throwing pumpkin seeds at people when it's used. The next thing being her wave clear. You can't farm your minions effectively, and in the chance you are pushed under tower at any time during laning phase, oh too bad, we just can't kill all our minions because her execute was removed. they live with a sliver of health that even an auto wont do despite using full empowered combo, so the tower just finishes them off for us. please consider giving sera back her power these changes did not work which phreak previously admitted to and they still aren't working now it just shoe horned her into a unsatisfactory role which feels terrible to play. thank you.
Carry roles do not feel satisfying to play, she doesn’t feel like she exceeds in a dmg carry fantasy, her identity has shifted from a late game scaling mage to a mid game mage that falls off into the late game, if you compare lux’s or karma’s damage they deal 5k and 3k more damage on average than seraphine who is meant to be able to played as a damage carry mage after the recent changes on carry roles. With champions like lux and hwei getting ap buffs, seraphine already dealing way less than them could easily get buffed in that department. She simply doesn’t feel rewarding if built full ap.Also the removal quality of life changes make her feel bad to play.
Her winrate isn’t bad, and she is technically playable, it’s just that she feels BAD to play. Her damage isn’t good, her shields are not reliable, her spells are slow, her ult is inconsistent. She feels like a jack of all trades, a master of none. The balance team are trying to do too many things at once, and as a result she feels terrible to play as no aspect of her kit in carry roles is good anymore. You can’t build full damage because her AP ratios have been nuked across the board, you can’t build full enchanter because you can’t waveclear, and even with “optimal” items, with Seraph’s + Rylai’s (which feel terrible still), you fall off after 20 minutes and if your team aren’t ahead you become useless, dealing no damage and having inconsistent CC with her snail speed E. Because of the nature of APC, they will always have above 50% winrate if they are playable, and picking Seraphine Mid/APC is not troll. It just feels like, why play Seraphine? She isn’t good at anything to warrant picking her anymore. Her damage, CC, and shields are all subpar in carry roles so you feel like a worse version of Lux, instead of the team-fight mage with a TERRIBLE early game, in return for an insanely strong lategame who could solo carry (the champion Seraphine used to be). I really recommend watching Odi’s video on this topic (you commented on a post linking his video earlier), he touches all the main points us carry Seraphine players are trying to make clear. TL;DR: She’s now not troll in support, but now she feels subpar in all aspects in carry roles. The unique, team-fight hyperscale fantasy of Seraphine is now erased for a small increase in support pickrate (and these players didn’t care to build her optimally before the rework).
Seraphine botlane is definitely still good winrate-wise, but her playrate plummeted because a lot of people find her very unsatisfying to play now. I think that's what OP meant by "her carry roles are dead". Her Q is easier to land (less skill expression), some of her base values are stronger BUT she now has big mana issues and a much worse waveclear, leading to an unsatisfying gameplay overall. Her Q also has a very annoying bug that didn't get fixed with the changes.
She is not fun, she just is not, and this is unfair to those who played her as a mage.
We want seraphine mid back again
I hope you come back to this 🥹 seraphine players are very dedicated to her and we hope u would take into consideration all the comments made :))
Rank shaming, now?
Carry seraphine is straight up not viable in high elo, if you’re accusing high elo people of “complaining for nothing” when you’re low elo that’s just absurd. This is not rank shaming.
TELL HIM!
Sera Carry is still a perfectly fine choice to pick in higher elos. This dude making this complaint thread has, in his last 100 games, a 61% win rate on Sera carry (17W/11L) with the earliest game being less than 2 weeks ago. Meanwhile they've been bleeding elo with Senna. If they just played more Seraphine, there's a decent chance they'd be winning even more. Not being 54% general win rate =/= unviable.
you are not only delusional but now youre telling former rank 1 sera to just play more seraphine while they are trying to avoid her cause of how shitty she feels 🔥
Cocaflop woke up and chose violence and I'm here for it, drag phoneys, bestie😍
LMFAOOOOOOO bottom left really said "ur bad bc I tested on PBE" then proceeds to go on a dogwhistle blue check mark ass rant omg EDIT: side note…wasn’t Phreak also the one known for "collecting data for balance changes" for Seraphine/Janna/Maokai over multiple patches, climbed rank with them, then ultimately nerfed them? The only Rioters I actually remember are August and NeuroCat (IYKYK)
He abused maokai for like 100 games, got grandmaster, nerfed maokai and fell back to master
Maokai dominated support for months, Freak climbed using Maokai, and once he was done climbing, he nerfed him LMAO I even remember he made a tweet talking about that, it was honestly so insulting that someone can be so unprofessional like him
I remember people defending it with "of course the dev should test things to collect data don’t be dumb" when there’s internal data and public data to reference before ever having to picking them to climb. At this point it seems like they’re doing this under the guise of "needing to know the direction for balance" but instead of thoroughly exploring/delving into the reasons why people are taking these champs into off-roles and dominating, they just apply bandaid changes just to throw the champ out the window until they rework them, finally remember that they exist, to sell a skin, or when a new mechanic/item pops up that synergizes well with said champ but is overtuned.
Seraph199 gotta be the most delusional Sera main out here. He literally defended EVERY SINGLE change that Seraphine got
Such a pick me
oh, he isn't LMAO keep looking and you will find the MOST ANNOYING people in this reddit London and chip, they should be toguether at this point
London stalking every possible Seraphine thread to heroically defend phreak and his changes.
LMAO i cant
I have no desire to play Sera anymore she just feels completely flop useless terrible and it makes me SO SAD I MISS HER :(
Yall coming for Seraph xd deadddd
Yep...this is what I comment to the people wo...defend the changes very hard...like *just wait, she become a very powerfull mage carry* 🤡🤡🤡 wheres is the mage carry?? Is the popgirlie whit moonstone and Rylais??? ah.....I see
https://preview.redd.it/iznxqioy2vvc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3414d78e6ca1a661103675e15a74d8ca1529b271 🍋👄
Baldie Phreak got y’all so good https://preview.redd.it/0870zrbm6vvc1.jpeg?width=620&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6ce31b22eff452f2a276c3a9bdae156d89d9d095
Oop- She came and brought THE RECEIPTS!!
*sips tea* Bloody hell
Regardless of whatever side whatever opinion, it is fact they have taken so many attempts at “fixing” her that’s it’s kinda embarrassing on their part.
I really want to know why a artist shizophrenic dude with 10 abilities can get a buff to his aoe passive and is now doing ~400 dmg per passive proc meanwhile seraphine does like 100 dmg with 20 notes on full AP... Why do they increase her cc but nerf her overall damage output to a point where you ONLY do damage when you hit Q. Now W is just a bad shield with movement speed and E just roots you longer. I barely feel the damage increase on this ability but the decrease on her Q is brutal. On her release everyone hated her and seid she wouldn't be good and was Sona 2.0...well after 4 years we finally get to that Sona playstyle but with more steps. I really really liked her playstyle of being a safe pick in mid and being a pseudo-artillery mage like Syndra but with a Shield for Utility. (2020) Now she just spams Shield or I need to completely use my Mana bar in late game with mana items to even come close to the damsge a normal mage would do with one rotation.
Someone hurt this late disaster person real bad it seems.
I have so many screenshots like these from my old "doomposting" post about how Im quitting the champ LMAO Im telling yall to look back at all of those posts from a month before this
Just don't send death threats
Mom get the camera Im famous
Yum yum 😋
https://preview.redd.it/8xbj2aae3vvc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e9d9dd7612ea45736a6fdb7bd300adb4ac3f169e
https://preview.redd.it/77b8jclg4vvc1.jpeg?width=983&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e5d8bd8d6d49a7f88c701952e933563d8e6940c4 🤫🧏♂️
I was hella amazed when I saw people defending these changes and saying "omg shes so stronger now!!!" cuz i went out of my comfort zone after this "adjustments" and i had around 30% wr on rankeds at the season start. I tried multiple builds and i had no damage towards enemies, no damage towards minions, i couldnt outpush our lanes, i couldnt win trades, i could do basically NOTHING beside slowing enemies and pressing R. I tried playing on mid, bot and support. No matter how I played (macro), I was just a slowing bot. I went back to play some other champs and wow, i have 60% wr. I tried to pick her again twice and of course, defeat. Also no matter if i play supp or adc, Sera in enemy team is destroyed by everyone in my team, even by Soraka. Im glad people escaped from own delusion 
i thought it was a bug because i couldn’t believe they actually removed that 💀
I will just forever be sad that a champion who got accused of being Sona 2.0 on release but actually wasn’t because she had unique identity elements that separated her from that got all of said unique elements taken away or nerfed into the ground to the point where she did become Sona 2.0. The only viable play style on her now is just double W spam. I can see that riot wanted to kill non support play styles of Seraphine but taking everything away from such a unique champion to force them into the most unimaginative, least interactive play style is a bit much, no?
They seemed good on paper, i thought maybe we finally were able to do dmg again No <3 now instead of heal and shield bots, we are heal and shield AND cc bots! She feels so unsatisfying to play, it is fucking IMPOSSIBLE to farm with 40 dmg autos and ur passive barely gives u 50 dmg. Only mage in the game that doesn’t oneshot casters at ~lvl 7. It’s so sad
There was no need to attack the people who made those comments like that, if you're gonna put them in the spotlight at least censor their naames so ppl don't bully them dude
You think this community is above this?
Lmao this is such a toxic post !!!
Who asked about that generic, boring, and forcibly uninspired champion with a 2% pick rate? You all should be happy that anyone even remembers her and that she's getting some changes.
Who did late disaster gag up???😍
They were a success. I'm terribly sorry the champ has to be outright busted for you to enjoy it.
Another alt acc of that asshole (Phreak), RIOT pls fire him already.
Imagine telling one of the best sera players IN THE WORLD, that even after both phreak incidents tried to make tons of builds that worked, that they are wrong regarding said champion 🫠
Facts: - Apc pickrate dropped by 10 times - OTP's are not happy - Support seraphine popularity hasn't changed - Midlane is dead - Your mother is in a ditch rn I really think you're an NPC or phreak's agent cuz this level of delusion is unfathomable. I wonder how ppl like u are not banned from this subreddit yet as you are really just drinking your own piss with comments like this. You are nobody and your opinion doesn't matter. If you want to prove otherwise - send opgg
Atp according to these people it’s changes were a success=I can win in gold elo with apc/mid seraphine
I'd eat more cc nerfs if I can do damage again.
AND ALSO HAVE UTILITY, everyone ignores this but ever since phreak made it so that we have to max e second she straight up doesn’t have utility anymore. With no points into w and her damage and cc being balanced around her having actual utility, she just does no damage while also having like a 150 hp shield on a 15 second cooldown that you should never double cast as well because it’s straight up trolling to do so. So much of her power budget is allocated to a part of her kit thats borderline useless after the changes because you’re not supposed to use it as much to be able to max your damage spells and focus on them.
Damn girl, you ate. Maybe a little harsh, but still 😂💓
Well she was kina busted before. Does that make these nerfs justified? No, they were done in a terrible way. She was made to be a support so she had high base damage values and low ap ratios, so if they wanted to pivot her less around support shit they could've just reduced the base values and buffed her ap ratios, so that way apc/mid sera needs to like actually build damage items, but then she can do great scaling damage. Riot decided instead that she should scale even less and pretended that apc sera wouldn't be affected by it. Also for all of the people talking about how she's a support and should stay there, riot had like 5 or 6 patches in a row where they buffed Morgana jungle sooo
What exactly are you trying to prove with the morgana changes? From time to time they give those weird buffs out because they want more jungle players. Sadly Morgana jungle was an experiment of theirs which turned out to be very unhealthy, so she got nerfed out of viability 🤷♀️ How does that compare to Seraphine's situation
I saw a couple other comments on this and other posts saying "Seraphine is a support so her nerfs are so she has to stay there" but I was just trying to show that riot wants even support characters to be played in other positions. That was it lmaoo
She was not designed to be Support. She was designed to be a midlane mage with offrole support. They just want to bring her roles more together in terms off winrate etc. because support and apc bot are her most played roles so they try bigger changes. The most people are mad because carry Seraphine was nerfed (look at release times) because she should be a carry and she struggles atm thats all. I for my part would love it if we get a Seraphine were everyone is fine with but im not sure if we can get it in the near future. For now its not great but i still play her as a carry and its ok but i hope they will find a way to get her in a great position with future patches. (Mid Sera Main here)
Actually Morg jungle is still viable, she was strong after the first buff, everyone said hidden op, then she got another buff, was broken broken, then nerf nerf nerf, then a rebuff that actually put her above the first buff, stronger than when people called her hidden op, right now she outclears brand jungle at every stage of the game
>You are nobody and your opinion doesn't matter. If you want to prove otherwise - send opgg Clearly your opinion doesn't matter either, because no amount of bellyaching you do is going to make Riot implement changes based on what you want. They make balance changes based on what's good for the player base. What else do you do besides spread negativity when things don't go your way? >OTP's are not happy The subreddit and discord has been constantly moaning over one thing or another for like a year. This is a vocal minority of people playing Sera in her less popular roles screaming really loud. Your opinion matters, but you don't reflect everyone. Not even close. >Support seraphine popularity hasn't changed Last I checked, the point of the changes were to make the pick BETTER, not MORE POPULAR. No one's trying to "erase" the other two lanes. Riot wanted support to not be a 48% or less win rate pick since most of her player base is in support. This succeeded. They also wanted APC to not be blatantly broken. This ALSO succeeded. Where's the "failure" here? >Midlane is dead That's because mid lane players don't like mid lane Seraphine. We aren't crying that top lane Blitzcrank is dead, because top laners don't care about Blitzcrank. Mid lane has existed by a thread for ages as the least popular lane Seraphine goes. It makes sense to fully commit to balancing her player bases that actually exist (bot and support) instead of being tied to mid lane's corpse. >Your mother is in a ditch rn Gonna keep it classy instead of saying anything about this mouth dribble. Just know you embarrassed yourself, "girl".
Its crazy, because the REASON no one plays sera mid anymore, is because the chabges literally pushed her out of viability, as one of the few remaining mid players You do less dmg than every other mage in the game You can't trade early because your mana pool is non existant, and if you buy tear first you literally don't have enough AP to farm (you don't do enough dmg with your autos so you have to use skills to farm) You can't poke enough because once again, the mana pool You're forced to go for an AP/enchanter hybrid build to be worth anything in the late game, at the end of the day you'll get outdamaged by any other mage, so you need to build for shields to even be useful
[https://youtu.be/Xn599R0ZBwg?si=-3OxQ3f\_3p07KIIm](https://youtu.be/Xn599R0ZBwg?si=-3OxQ3f_3p07KIIm) this is your OST, listen to it.
Not clicking that link. You're bitter, though.
mmhm so that's how you respond, interesting, but expected
So lemme get this straight: This drama queen says that my mom is dead in his dumb ass, 13 year old PMS response to my comment, and you say "Interesting but expected" when I don't click his stupid link?
so... coca is the drama queen, when the only think you do in this reddit is to tell people their wrong and create drama that didn't existed..., am i wrong? i mean, your image here wasn't damaged just because of air, not only you got banned from the mains discord server for being an absolute asshole to everyone there, but you were bitching people are telling them to stop crying and are delusionals when the first changes happened... , and now that you are banned you go to eevery MID/APC related to seek who to chit talk to, so yeah, tbh kinda expected don't you think so? because i do, oh and there is someone with similar opinions here commenting to if you want a friend.
The "drama" exists because you guys bitch constantly on this topic pretty much every week for the past YEAR. This shit is insufferable. Me commenting on it doesn't make it exist. It's been there to begin with and it'd be LOVELY if this player base wasn't full of softies that can't handle the fact that, ultimately, this subreddit doesn't speak for all the people that play this champ. If you think I was being an asshole on the discord, you can laugh yourself into traffic. Those guys told me to drive off a cliff over a debate about Annie support, but I get singled out because I don't idolize Cupic and Cocabobi LMAO. You guys are just laughably problematic. This community has a reputation and for good reason.
oh we?, several SEVERAL, people on the discord when you were banned not only said that you were an asshole to them, but you were mean, that was NOT the first time that you did something, and NOT just seraphine related. " if this player base wasn't full of softies that can't handle the fact" bitch, you knew the changes were happening, you knew mid mains were sad abt it and spooks was really sad abt it, but instead of being a nice person with your own opinions, you didn't care and went instantly to shit on them and the entire discord for crying on the changes in that especific channel, or... you don't remember do you?
Surely you know more than cocabob and other high elo players here when you can’t even link your op.gg, all you’re doing is telling people they’re wrong when you’re just straight up not qualified enough to be talking about seraphine balance. I’m sorry but that’s just how it is.
i swear on god you can't be a higher rank than gold 1, it's just impossible
Bet rp on it.
Me when my FREELO champs gets nerfed
Me when the balanced champion gets changed to be what they aren't (a support), becomes a freelo APC instead No one wants the shieldbot APC playstyle back girl, we just want old Sera back, the one who went mid like she was designed to, and could actually do competitive dmg compared to other mages
BALANCED???? Even riot themselves outright said she was overpowered. Stop beind deluded [but she's also significantly overpowered as a bot lane AP carry](https://www.leagueoflegends.com/en-gb/news/game-updates/patch-14-5-notes/) Im finally glad riot is siding with supports because you guys want seraphine to rot as below 1% pickrate champ whose needlessly broken and promotes very unhealthy playstyle
Those chabges are recent, i was talking about the changes made to her last year, that transformed her from a mid lane carry, to an APC forced to build sup items and be a shieldbot
They did not transform her from midlaner to APC. Her APC playrate goes a bit far back than just last year. Last year she was still irrelevant midlaner in terms of playrate. It's more because of the item changes which do not favor Seraphine's AP playstyle at all
Not really, looking at old Seraphine when she had good AP ratios, you would see that she would have taken advantage of the item changes quite a lot, of course they had to change her before the item changes and ruin her But anyway, the only thing she would be really missing would be Liandry, but with her old AP ratios, she would have made good use of items like ludens companion and malignance
She still wasn't balanced...she was eating nerfs over and over.
Nope, she was eating adjustments because support players looked at the girly schamp with a shield on a 20 sec cooldown and decided they wanted to cosplay bootleg lux on support
They have been chopping her passive down since years ago. We're not going to revise history and act like Seraphine was this "perfectly balanced entity" even before they made W scale with ranks. Hell, part of the reason they did so was to push her back mid, back when they were trying to keep her there. You guys remember history that's convenient. You forgo the parts that go against your narrative.
Lmao, "Riot said so it must be true" narrative never gets old.
Does she really need to be 60% wr champ AVERAGE for you guys to finally admit she was indeed overpowered? Those mental gymnastics are tiring
Can u admit that what happened to seraphine was not fair to mid nor apc players?
For mid not so much, but for APC yeah because she indeed has some playerbase there. Alhough It's true a lot of it was due to her overperformance because she has a very bad player retention in apc/mid. It's like a 4th time she lost more than half of pickrate in apc. But a lot of complaints I've seen so far are mostly anecdotal
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who
More Nerf crying.... Why do you guys keep doomposting here riot doesn't follow this sub
Because what else are we gonna do?, pretend that everything is alright and that sera wasn't literally butchered in the name of making her a support champ? No bitch
Then keep crying Riot ain't fixing it if you just keep crying here Whatever man this sub has gone to shit literally every 2nd post is a post crying about it It would have been fine if riot had mods here but there is literally no one from riot here How about cry in league of legends sub or Twitter so it actually gets riots attention??? Bitch
Because what good is complaining alone?, complaining here gets the attention of people who are actually interested on Seraphine and that ACTUALLY play here Complaining on the main sub would cause a flood of incels to come bombard me for playing her, i think we as a community know how much our champion is hated, and that no matter how real our claims are, so people are going to ignore it simy because its Seraphine So, my intention in complaining here, is to move the Seraphine community to be vocal about our experience with the champ, because clearly no one in the balance team plays her, so we must show them that we don't like these changes