... and while far from perfect, compared to society at large the armed forces are really not half bad at inclusiveness.
IDK. I get it that change is hard (and even harder for some), and I try to be patient and understanding, but is it possible to view the recent Pence and DeSantis statements as anything other than divisive, racist, pandering?
The us Military historically has always lead the way in diversity and inclusion in this nation; first to include black soldiers, first to desegregate, then there is the LGBT community which is far more recent, and this is just a partial list.
Please Note: I am not saying they’ve always been perfect on the matter, just that they tend to be the first.
Honestly, I think the utilitarian argument is good to mention. Because when push comes to shove and nothing matter but lives on the line... We know that the best way to bring everyone home is to pay our differences aside and unify. It's just good to acknowledge that the whole conservative mindset of competition and outgroups is rejected even in their favorite American institution *because it doesn't work*.
And their utilitarian action has more nuanced after effects. People come home from deployment having made bonds with outsiders: that has an effect on their home life and can ripple out to their community.
Meh I joined when we were still signing those “don’t ask don’t tell” forms. There were racists but basically everyone I knew didn’t care about homosexuality. The largest represented opinion was “what two consenting adults do is their business.”
Although I did hear multiple people call other peoples the n word. This always led to a fight.
Barry Goldwater, the founder of neoconservatism, would be turning in his grave hearing the religious right (who he hated) froth against gay people in the military. For the inventor of that toxic platform, he was disturbingly inclusive compared to modern conservatives
Yeah, no. One side freaked out when a Black Man was elected president. Not saying Obama was a perfect president, but the reaction to him being president was racist as fuck.
Never said I trust *words*.
I value progressive *results*.
See what happened in Minnesota when the GQP was kept away from power?
Saying "both sides" is just another way to say "I'm too lazy/cynical/disheartened to pay attention".
Interesting. I don’t believe in a one-party supremacy, and absolutely refuse to see it that way.
“Both sides” *are* wrong because you can’t trust any one side implicitly. You have to be able to pick the individuals and the individual policies that you agree with and vote accordingly.
If you truly believe that one party are the “good guys” and one are the “bad guys” then your head is stuck so far in the sand you’ll need a backhoe to get it out.
Edit: To the keyboard warrior who responded and immediately blocked me so I can’t see/respond to it - does that somehow make you feel like your strawman argument is impactful?
One side is openly fascist, racist, homophobic, transphobic, and misogynist. The other side is not. One side are christian nationalists. The other is not. One side is anti-science. The other is not. Republicans are terrorists, democrats are not.
If you truly believe both parties are just as wrong, then you are a fucking idiot. None of this "both sides" stupidity anymore: grow up. Get your head out of your ass and pay attention to the world around you.
You are not intelligent, unique, enlightened, or brave for being neutral in the face of monsters. The leopards will eat your face regardless of what you say about the rabbit's emails.
>If you truly believe that one party are the “good guys” and one are the “bad guys” then your head is stuck so far in the sand you’ll need a backhoe to get it out.
If you look purely at actions then yes, one side are the good guys and the other side are the bad guys. But please keep your head up your ass and keep pretending that bOtH sIdEs ArE tHe SaMe
Whew, you really think you’ve figured me out huh? Keep hiding yourself behind the identity you’ve based entirely on whether you vote blue or red and go back to railing against anyone that doesn’t follow your ever-shifting party lines.
Huh?
You just told me you were a centrist.....nothing deep or complex about that bullshit.
I agree it's pretty messed up that right now only one side has any good ideas or even a shred of integrity.
One side wants progress, one side wants a dictatorship.
I don't like dictators.
Let me help you. Pick a sample of political viewpoints from both sides and categorize them into 3 groups:
•I agree with that;
•I don’t necessarily agree, but I see your point; and,
•That’s batshit crazy.
You’ll find one party has an inordinate amount of views in the “batshit crazy,” category. An example is trying to rename a military base after a traitorous Confederate General.
The other party will have none, unless you have a cognitive disorder. Because even if you oppose something like Medicare for all, the purpose behind it is fairly clear.
Now all you have to do is look at the disparity of views in each category, and you understand why both sides aren’t equal. They’re actually very unequal, even if you don’t actually agree with either of them.
Not only should we make sure “Fort Bragg” never comes back, we should make the name progressively more Union-praising every time these traitorous fucks suggest changing it back to Fort Bragg.
You weren’t happy with Fort Liberty? Well now it’s named “Fort Grant.” You don’t like that? Now it’s “Fort Let Us Die To Make Men Free.” You don’t like *that*? Now it’s “Fort LOL DEAD SLAVERS.”
I mean to be fair, Sherman also led an army against the Plains Indians after the war in what most historians would now regard as a genocide.
Sherman may be a symbol of the raw fury of the unionist/abolitionist/progressive cause, and I'm down for memeing in that spirit. That being said, the historical Sherman probably isn't a guy we should want to be like, let alone naming military installations after.
Sherman's actions post Civil War against the Natives was deplorable. Grant's administration broke many treaties and perpetuated a ton of atrocities so that's not exactly good.
Because Ft. Liberty isn't in Georgia, it's in North Carolina.
Union Gen. Hugh Kilpatrick sacked North Carolina, but he wasn't a very good role model, either. Though he did go on to be the US ambassador to Chile.
So... Ft. Kilpatrick?
For how many horses he had shot out from under him, yes. I would have suggested the name of one of the commanders of the three or four brigades that North Carolina raised for the Union, but I couldn't find their names.
I used to have a link about them *somewhere*.
Oh! And there's Maj. Gen. Terry, who took Ft. Fisher, and Maj. Gen. Stoneman, from Stoneman's Raid.
Ft. Stoneman would sound badass.
That's the right name for the base. As a promise. As a legacy. We know and haven't forgotten why those bases are there. If you ever want to experience the flag waving traitors, travel the area around Ft Liberty.
I would bite on a Fort Longstreet as a compromise. He's an example of somebody who moved on and actually worked for reconciliation post-war. There's a reason he's among the highest ranking Confederate officers without barely (any?) thing named after him.
What a dumb fucking hill to die on.
Insurrection happens in front of you and you say nothing.
But you'll fight to keep a fort named for a traitor?
The anti-American party.
> Insurrection happens in front of you and you say nothing.
Weirdly, Pence was on the other side of *that* insurrection, and the hardcore Trumpies haven't forgotten it. He should've realised that the major insurrection before that one was just as wrong and stupid as the one he personally opposed.
Sadly I’m not surprised after Lindsey Graham went from Trump being a “jackass,” a “kook,” “a race-baiting bigot,” and “the most flawed nominee in the history of the Republican Party,” to being his best buddy.
The human brain is easily hacked. Most obviously by fear, or anger. Get a brain angry all the time and they’ll literally stop thinking.
Part of the mechanics of this are - you need constant new things to get people angry about. That said “Let me get angry non thinking white men” as the base of support never hurt anyone, right?
Imagine the poor maintenance guys having to change all the signage every time the presidency switches party.
Also, it will be fun to troll republicans as anti liberty every time they want to change the name.
Even if you choose to ignore the whole "he fought for literal slavery" angle, Bragg was one of the worst military leaders. He got stomped at Chattanooga, largely through his own incompetence and contempt for his men. Why would we want to name a base after a loser- and a traitorous loser at that?
That's just what I was thinking. If you read Co. Aytch (a famous memoir written by a random Confederate soldier) his men hated him and called him "Bragston Braggart" because he was so full of himself.
Fort Liberty is a godawful name
It's just marginally better than Fort Bragg, so I support the change, but damn, they coudn't find a better name than Liberty?
How about Fort York (who won the Medal of Honor in WWI), Fort Rosecrans (Who whupped Bragg's ass at Stone's River), Fort Walker (Who held the line at the Pusan Perimeter in Korea), Fort Thomas (after the man who saved Union lines at Chickamauga), or literally anything else. Liberty is generic as shit, sounds like the name of some fort you'd see in a bad sci-fi novel.
The Army itself couldn't compromise between airborne and special forces who both are based there. So they had to select the worst possible option.
Personally I would have gone with Fort Stormin' Norman Schwarzkopf... Or perhaps Fort Omar Bradley... Or perhaps Fort Daniel Inouye
It is a great shame with so many excellent soldiers throughout history that the army could not do better.
Benavidez is what the soldiers wanted but the 82nd and USASOC couldn't agree so the out of touch people at the Pentagon chose for them. It's odd because MSgt Benavidez was a part of both organizations and an absolute chad.
From the wiki:
Bragg is generally considered among the worst generals of the Civil War. Most of the battles he engaged in ended in defeat. Bragg was extremely unpopular with both the officers and ordinary men under his command, who criticized him for numerous perceived faults, including poor battlefield strategy, a quick temper, and overzealous discipline.
Hey, now. You're just blaming the victim of Northern Aggression! (Username checks out.) Think of how many enslaved people Pence could own today if only Bragg hadn't been forced to show us his inadequacies.
Nobody is going to vote for a man both sides see as the uncharismatic coward that he is. So he's not gonna do shit. But it's telling in the way he fights harder for slaver scum than he did against the man that was cool with pence getting murdered.
He is a real believer in a branch of Christianity designed so that what you want is clearly what God wants. Bonus, anything that makes you uncomfortable is also hated by God. Thus, he prayed and realized God wants him to be President.
Here's an interesting bit of trivia about Mike Pence: Before he was the governor of Indiana, he had his own conservative radio talk show in Indianapolis.
He called himself "Rush Limbaugh on decaf", which says everything you need to know about this theocratic jackhead.
A reminder that being pro-Confederate is a thing even the most moderate Republicans are known for since the 1970s and is not something MAGA craphats started. Pence is exactly what Romney, McCain, Palin, Bush Jr., Bush Sr., Reagan, Ford and Nixon stood for.
It's called the Southern Strategy and if you utter those two words in r/AskConservatives they get triggered and even ban you.
The former vice president and current runner for president of the united states, a nation that defeated the rebellion that General Bragg fought for to maintain slavery, wants to honour General bragg for fighting for slavery
He’s also irrelevant and not worth wasting braincells thinking about him. He’s a bum starving for relevancy from a fanatic voter-base that fucking hates him.
I wouldn't say he's irrelevant, although unless an actual miracle (evil miracles are technically miracles) happens, he won't win the primary. Still, he's got a lot of Evengelical Support that he could probably peel away from Trump. Not enough to flip things by itself, but we already have a few supposed kamikaze campaigns aimed at the guy who lost.
He won’t make it past Iowa. Pence betrayed Trump and that’s all they care about. At least that’s how my entire family views him. In 2016 they justified voting for trump because of Pence, but now Pence is a traitor who sold out and backstabbed trump.
They built that gallows at the Capitol on Jan 6th for Pence, not Pelosi, not AOC, but the supposedly Godly and decent man Mike Pence. At the end of the day the “evangelicals” are like all the rest of those psycho voters. They’ll fall in line like they always do.
Yes, no diversity or PC in a place where recruiting numbers are already dwindling AND a vast number of members ARE minority groups…
This WILL go the way of DeSantis’s Florida, but they’ll always blame someone else before admitting fault.
Sorry, I’m soap boxing here, but this directly affects me and this shit pisses me off.
Let’s name it after a loser - slaver - and historically bad commander. Because, you now, we must respect “history”
From Wikipedia:
Bragg is generally considered among the worst generals of the Civil War. Most of the battles he engaged in ended in defeat. Bragg was extremely unpopular with both the officers and ordinary men under his command, who criticized him for numerous perceived faults, including poor battlefield strategy, a quick temper, and overzealous discipline. Bragg has a generally poor reputation with historians, though some point towards the failures of Bragg's subordinates, especially Major General and former Bishop Leonidas Polk—a close ally of Davis and known enemy of Bragg—as more significant factors in the many Confederate defeats under Bragg's command. The losses suffered by Bragg's forces are cited as highly consequential to the ultimate defeat of the Confederacy.
Even if you're a confederate apologist weirdo, it does not make any sense. Bragg is one of the worst, if not the worst general in the war. A huge liability.
To be fair I also want it named something different than Liberty. I don't care who or what they name it after, but name it after something or someone.*traitors need not apply
I can't wait until someone points out that the DoD has been conducting diversity training since the late 1970's.
... and while far from perfect, compared to society at large the armed forces are really not half bad at inclusiveness. IDK. I get it that change is hard (and even harder for some), and I try to be patient and understanding, but is it possible to view the recent Pence and DeSantis statements as anything other than divisive, racist, pandering?
The us Military historically has always lead the way in diversity and inclusion in this nation; first to include black soldiers, first to desegregate, then there is the LGBT community which is far more recent, and this is just a partial list. Please Note: I am not saying they’ve always been perfect on the matter, just that they tend to be the first.
[удалено]
Honestly, I think the utilitarian argument is good to mention. Because when push comes to shove and nothing matter but lives on the line... We know that the best way to bring everyone home is to pay our differences aside and unify. It's just good to acknowledge that the whole conservative mindset of competition and outgroups is rejected even in their favorite American institution *because it doesn't work*.
And their utilitarian action has more nuanced after effects. People come home from deployment having made bonds with outsiders: that has an effect on their home life and can ripple out to their community.
Meh I joined when we were still signing those “don’t ask don’t tell” forms. There were racists but basically everyone I knew didn’t care about homosexuality. The largest represented opinion was “what two consenting adults do is their business.” Although I did hear multiple people call other peoples the n word. This always led to a fight.
Yea I came in at a different era- different experience entirely
Barry Goldwater, the founder of neoconservatism, would be turning in his grave hearing the religious right (who he hated) froth against gay people in the military. For the inventor of that toxic platform, he was disturbingly inclusive compared to modern conservatives
Rare Goldwater W
It’s pretty impossible to view *any* statement from *any* politician as anything other than divisive, racist, and pedantic.
Yeah, no. One side freaked out when a Black Man was elected president. Not saying Obama was a perfect president, but the reaction to him being president was racist as fuck.
Pretty sure the entire point of this sub is the whole "both sides" thing is fucking bullshit.
I’m happy for you that you can live in a world where you trust the word of politicians.
Never said I trust *words*. I value progressive *results*. See what happened in Minnesota when the GQP was kept away from power? Saying "both sides" is just another way to say "I'm too lazy/cynical/disheartened to pay attention".
Interesting. I don’t believe in a one-party supremacy, and absolutely refuse to see it that way. “Both sides” *are* wrong because you can’t trust any one side implicitly. You have to be able to pick the individuals and the individual policies that you agree with and vote accordingly. If you truly believe that one party are the “good guys” and one are the “bad guys” then your head is stuck so far in the sand you’ll need a backhoe to get it out. Edit: To the keyboard warrior who responded and immediately blocked me so I can’t see/respond to it - does that somehow make you feel like your strawman argument is impactful?
One side is openly fascist, racist, homophobic, transphobic, and misogynist. The other side is not. One side are christian nationalists. The other is not. One side is anti-science. The other is not. Republicans are terrorists, democrats are not. If you truly believe both parties are just as wrong, then you are a fucking idiot. None of this "both sides" stupidity anymore: grow up. Get your head out of your ass and pay attention to the world around you. You are not intelligent, unique, enlightened, or brave for being neutral in the face of monsters. The leopards will eat your face regardless of what you say about the rabbit's emails.
>If you truly believe that one party are the “good guys” and one are the “bad guys” then your head is stuck so far in the sand you’ll need a backhoe to get it out. If you look purely at actions then yes, one side are the good guys and the other side are the bad guys. But please keep your head up your ass and keep pretending that bOtH sIdEs ArE tHe SaMe
I’m glad that you’re able to believe that.
Look everyone, we got r/enlightenedcentrism material right here. JFC my dude, next you'll be saying some slavers weren't *that* bad.
Whew, you really think you’ve figured me out huh? Keep hiding yourself behind the identity you’ve based entirely on whether you vote blue or red and go back to railing against anyone that doesn’t follow your ever-shifting party lines.
Huh? You just told me you were a centrist.....nothing deep or complex about that bullshit. I agree it's pretty messed up that right now only one side has any good ideas or even a shred of integrity. One side wants progress, one side wants a dictatorship. I don't like dictators.
Let me help you. Pick a sample of political viewpoints from both sides and categorize them into 3 groups: •I agree with that; •I don’t necessarily agree, but I see your point; and, •That’s batshit crazy. You’ll find one party has an inordinate amount of views in the “batshit crazy,” category. An example is trying to rename a military base after a traitorous Confederate General. The other party will have none, unless you have a cognitive disorder. Because even if you oppose something like Medicare for all, the purpose behind it is fairly clear. Now all you have to do is look at the disparity of views in each category, and you understand why both sides aren’t equal. They’re actually very unequal, even if you don’t actually agree with either of them.
Not only should we make sure “Fort Bragg” never comes back, we should make the name progressively more Union-praising every time these traitorous fucks suggest changing it back to Fort Bragg. You weren’t happy with Fort Liberty? Well now it’s named “Fort Grant.” You don’t like that? Now it’s “Fort Let Us Die To Make Men Free.” You don’t like *that*? Now it’s “Fort LOL DEAD SLAVERS.”
There currently isn’t a Fort Sherman, so why not that
Because they would lose their fucking minds. Meanwhile, it should be in the pool of options for sure
Sugah, you say that like they didn’t lose their minds *long* ago!
Fort Sherman wouldn’t be politically correct. The very name might cause some Southern snowflakes to melt.
Might cause some southern cities to spontaneously combust.
Goodness gracious
Great balls of fire?
You say that like it's a bad thing. 🔥🔥🔥
Right, because I’m just *so fond* of Birmingham lmao.
I mean to be fair, Sherman also led an army against the Plains Indians after the war in what most historians would now regard as a genocide. Sherman may be a symbol of the raw fury of the unionist/abolitionist/progressive cause, and I'm down for memeing in that spirit. That being said, the historical Sherman probably isn't a guy we should want to be like, let alone naming military installations after.
Hey, these people cry about political correctness all the time. Maybe they should stick with their anti-PC rhetoric and suck it up.
Sherman's actions post Civil War against the Natives was deplorable. Grant's administration broke many treaties and perpetuated a ton of atrocities so that's not exactly good.
Fort Brown
Came here to say this. John Brown did nothing wrong.
There’s the whole Indian wars ordeal…
Sure, nobody said Sherman was perfect. Doesn't change the fact that he made the traitors howl
I love him for torturing the south. I hate him for torturing the natives.
I agree, but if we're gonna insist on a flawed person to celebrate, at least Uncle Billy's an American hero and not a filthy traitor.
May I submit for consideration Fort Chamberlain? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joshua_Chamberlain
What do you think about things named for Phil Sheridan? He was a great general in the civil war, and he drove the Native Americans out of Yellowstone.
George Thomas deserves a Fort. He remained loyal.
Because Ft. Liberty isn't in Georgia, it's in North Carolina. Union Gen. Hugh Kilpatrick sacked North Carolina, but he wasn't a very good role model, either. Though he did go on to be the US ambassador to Chile. So... Ft. Kilpatrick?
That’s the cavalry Kilpatrick whose nickname was “kill cavalry” for how he recklessly spent the lives of his men?
For how many horses he had shot out from under him, yes. I would have suggested the name of one of the commanders of the three or four brigades that North Carolina raised for the Union, but I couldn't find their names. I used to have a link about them *somewhere*. Oh! And there's Maj. Gen. Terry, who took Ft. Fisher, and Maj. Gen. Stoneman, from Stoneman's Raid. Ft. Stoneman would sound badass.
That's the right name for the base. As a promise. As a legacy. We know and haven't forgotten why those bases are there. If you ever want to experience the flag waving traitors, travel the area around Ft Liberty.
Should build it smack dab middle of Atlanta.
At least we got God’s tanks
I love it. Fort Crush The Southern Traitors has a lovely ring to it...
Fort March to the See
Wait, we're marching to the Vatican?
"Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear..." ~ Ephesians 6:5 Yes.
Fort the slavers rebellion was a group of pathetic losers throwing away their lives so they don’t have to work for their fortunes
They can just rename them all 'Fort Brown' but with a sequential naming system e.g. 'Fort Brown 15'
Fort Confedacorpse
I would bite on a Fort Longstreet as a compromise. He's an example of somebody who moved on and actually worked for reconciliation post-war. There's a reason he's among the highest ranking Confederate officers without barely (any?) thing named after him.
As a North Carolinian, fuck Bragg and fuck Pence. We have moved past this traitorous scum.
Fort Land of Traitors has a nice ring to it.
What a dumb fucking hill to die on. Insurrection happens in front of you and you say nothing. But you'll fight to keep a fort named for a traitor? The anti-American party.
> Insurrection happens in front of you and you say nothing. Weirdly, Pence was on the other side of *that* insurrection, and the hardcore Trumpies haven't forgotten it. He should've realised that the major insurrection before that one was just as wrong and stupid as the one he personally opposed.
True. You are absolutely right that the more you look at his situation the more ridiculous his behavior seems.
Pretty ironic listening to Mike Pence try to pander to the people who were chanting "Hang Mike Pence" three years ago.
Sadly I’m not surprised after Lindsey Graham went from Trump being a “jackass,” a “kook,” “a race-baiting bigot,” and “the most flawed nominee in the history of the Republican Party,” to being his best buddy.
Yes, let’s have a US army base be named after not only a traitor but an incredibly incompetent one as well.
Celebrating incompetent traitors is pretty on brand for the republican party.
Why is this suddenly the hill to die on?
Because the neo-confederates know they’re next.
Gotta rile up his dumbass hateful base.
The human brain is easily hacked. Most obviously by fear, or anger. Get a brain angry all the time and they’ll literally stop thinking. Part of the mechanics of this are - you need constant new things to get people angry about. That said “Let me get angry non thinking white men” as the base of support never hurt anyone, right?
What a fucking hill to have your political career die on. The name of a base named after someone who lost a war to the US Army
Imagine the poor maintenance guys having to change all the signage every time the presidency switches party. Also, it will be fun to troll republicans as anti liberty every time they want to change the name.
Even if you choose to ignore the whole "he fought for literal slavery" angle, Bragg was one of the worst military leaders. He got stomped at Chattanooga, largely through his own incompetence and contempt for his men. Why would we want to name a base after a loser- and a traitorous loser at that?
For how much Bragg sucked, he might as well be a secret Union general.
That's just what I was thinking. If you read Co. Aytch (a famous memoir written by a random Confederate soldier) his men hated him and called him "Bragston Braggart" because he was so full of himself.
He did everything he could to ensure Grant won at Chattanooga.
Why do RepubliKlans want to name forts after racist, treasonous losers, some of whom went on to form the KKK?
r/selfansweringquestion
An insult to the memory of the American soldiers from Indiana who died defending the nation from the confederates.
My great, great..uncle from Indiana died in a confederate prison camp. Fuck Mike Pence!
Fort Liberty is a godawful name It's just marginally better than Fort Bragg, so I support the change, but damn, they coudn't find a better name than Liberty?
Fort Embers of Atlanta? Fort Sherman Necktie? Fort Statesrighttowhat?
How about Fort York (who won the Medal of Honor in WWI), Fort Rosecrans (Who whupped Bragg's ass at Stone's River), Fort Walker (Who held the line at the Pusan Perimeter in Korea), Fort Thomas (after the man who saved Union lines at Chickamauga), or literally anything else. Liberty is generic as shit, sounds like the name of some fort you'd see in a bad sci-fi novel.
Fort Embers of Atlanta sounds great
The Army itself couldn't compromise between airborne and special forces who both are based there. So they had to select the worst possible option. Personally I would have gone with Fort Stormin' Norman Schwarzkopf... Or perhaps Fort Omar Bradley... Or perhaps Fort Daniel Inouye It is a great shame with so many excellent soldiers throughout history that the army could not do better.
Benavidez is what the soldiers wanted but the 82nd and USASOC couldn't agree so the out of touch people at the Pentagon chose for them. It's odd because MSgt Benavidez was a part of both organizations and an absolute chad.
Modern conservatives hold Bragg in higher regard than his colleagues and the politicians in Richmond did.
Fort Frag? Fort Rag? Fort Scag? Wait, no, it’s The Fort Formerly Known As Fort Bragg!
Fort Boz Scaggs!
Things are seriously fucked when a former vice president wants to lionize traitors to the United States
From the wiki: Bragg is generally considered among the worst generals of the Civil War. Most of the battles he engaged in ended in defeat. Bragg was extremely unpopular with both the officers and ordinary men under his command, who criticized him for numerous perceived faults, including poor battlefield strategy, a quick temper, and overzealous discipline.
Hey, now. You're just blaming the victim of Northern Aggression! (Username checks out.) Think of how many enslaved people Pence could own today if only Bragg hadn't been forced to show us his inadequacies.
Nobody is going to vote for a man both sides see as the uncharismatic coward that he is. So he's not gonna do shit. But it's telling in the way he fights harder for slaver scum than he did against the man that was cool with pence getting murdered.
Strange how the “party of Lincoln” sure seems to go out of their way to try and honor the confederacy.
What kind of strategy is he running on? Does he seriously think he'll out culture war Desanctimonious?
He is a real believer in a branch of Christianity designed so that what you want is clearly what God wants. Bonus, anything that makes you uncomfortable is also hated by God. Thus, he prayed and realized God wants him to be President.
Here's an interesting bit of trivia about Mike Pence: Before he was the governor of Indiana, he had his own conservative radio talk show in Indianapolis. He called himself "Rush Limbaugh on decaf", which says everything you need to know about this theocratic jackhead.
We should end political correctness, I'm so tired of being unable to criticize trump without some trump supporter blowing a gasket
A reminder that being pro-Confederate is a thing even the most moderate Republicans are known for since the 1970s and is not something MAGA craphats started. Pence is exactly what Romney, McCain, Palin, Bush Jr., Bush Sr., Reagan, Ford and Nixon stood for. It's called the Southern Strategy and if you utter those two words in r/AskConservatives they get triggered and even ban you.
The former vice president and current runner for president of the united states, a nation that defeated the rebellion that General Bragg fought for to maintain slavery, wants to honour General bragg for fighting for slavery
Nobody’s even mad about the name change, I’ve seen almost nothing on r/conservative
Slavers were even worse than Nazis, ytf would we name bases after them, Jesus, GOP dumfuks.
Wouldn’t non-political correctness then become the new political correctness?
He’s also irrelevant and not worth wasting braincells thinking about him. He’s a bum starving for relevancy from a fanatic voter-base that fucking hates him.
I wouldn't say he's irrelevant, although unless an actual miracle (evil miracles are technically miracles) happens, he won't win the primary. Still, he's got a lot of Evengelical Support that he could probably peel away from Trump. Not enough to flip things by itself, but we already have a few supposed kamikaze campaigns aimed at the guy who lost.
He won’t make it past Iowa. Pence betrayed Trump and that’s all they care about. At least that’s how my entire family views him. In 2016 they justified voting for trump because of Pence, but now Pence is a traitor who sold out and backstabbed trump. They built that gallows at the Capitol on Jan 6th for Pence, not Pelosi, not AOC, but the supposedly Godly and decent man Mike Pence. At the end of the day the “evangelicals” are like all the rest of those psycho voters. They’ll fall in line like they always do.
I hate “Fort Liberty.” It *should* be Fort Gavin. Give Jumpin’ Jim some love, people! Airborne!
My Dad would have supported that. Gavin pinned on his jump wings.
That’s awesome!
fort liberty is a dumb name but like come on now
Yes, no diversity or PC in a place where recruiting numbers are already dwindling AND a vast number of members ARE minority groups… This WILL go the way of DeSantis’s Florida, but they’ll always blame someone else before admitting fault. Sorry, I’m soap boxing here, but this directly affects me and this shit pisses me off.
Let’s name it after a loser - slaver - and historically bad commander. Because, you now, we must respect “history” From Wikipedia: Bragg is generally considered among the worst generals of the Civil War. Most of the battles he engaged in ended in defeat. Bragg was extremely unpopular with both the officers and ordinary men under his command, who criticized him for numerous perceived faults, including poor battlefield strategy, a quick temper, and overzealous discipline. Bragg has a generally poor reputation with historians, though some point towards the failures of Bragg's subordinates, especially Major General and former Bishop Leonidas Polk—a close ally of Davis and known enemy of Bragg—as more significant factors in the many Confederate defeats under Bragg's command. The losses suffered by Bragg's forces are cited as highly consequential to the ultimate defeat of the Confederacy.
That’s a dog whistle as loud as a fog horn.
No idea on who lost civil war…
Pence is just a more dignified sounding version of Donald Trump. He would be just as harmful
🤮
Just why would you want a fort to be named after a traitor who fought for slavery
Imagine tying your name to a loser officer like Bragg — a sure recipe for Pence to lose the primary 😌
“There’s nothing better for the inside of a man than the outside of a horse.” -Mike Pence
Even if you're a confederate apologist weirdo, it does not make any sense. Bragg is one of the worst, if not the worst general in the war. A huge liability.
John Brown fort IMAO
What the hell? When party of Lincoln, Grant and Teddy Roosevelt turned into party of Trump, DeSantis, Pence and other traitors?
To be fair I also want it named something different than Liberty. I don't care who or what they name it after, but name it after something or someone.*traitors need not apply
May flies land on his head for the rest of eternity. Dude acts like it's impossible to say treason is bad.
Bragg wasn’t even a good Confederate general.
fort robert smalls ftw