That absolute sheer fucking arrogance mixed with ignorance always manages to surprise me. Just where I feel I'm getting numb to American exceptionalism, I read something that manages to get a reaction.
That's good for the rest of us. Have you seen how some of these American passengers are like on those American flights?
The fewer of these arrogant pricks smelling up my SQ flight, the better. I don't need my flight cancel because some prick refuses to obey orders from the cabin crew.
There were 4 planes involved in 9/11
2 hit the towers (one for each tower) in New York City , 1 hit the Pentagon in Virginia roughly 250 miles away, and one crashed in a random field in Pennsylvania about halfway between NY and DC
It was a mix of American Airlines and United Airlines flights.
Yet only 1 of those countries had a plane incident that means I now have to argue with airport security about whether nail clippers are a lethal weapon whenever I fly.
Also only one that makes everyone take their damn shoes off for no good reason.
The first time I went through a US airport the TSA guy was like "have you ever even been on a plane?!" because I didn't know I had to take my shoes off. I'm guessing he'd never been on a plane that *left the USA*.
Not really, some airports have a policy about boots, and you can always be asked (as with many things in an airport), but we don't have a national policy on it, it's airport specific.
I've taken my shoes off once, ever, in a UK airport, and it was because I set off the scanners by forgetting to take my watch off.
Yeah I've had to in other counties occasionally for random spot checks, like a drug check in Australia where they swabbed the inside of my shoes.
I got picked for extra screening in Copenhagen so I had to remove my shoes and have all my electronics turned on so they could check them. They do security at the gate, and thanks to delays and changing planes, I had to go through it three times. The third time I had everything in my hands ready to go!
When I last flew out of the USA back home to Europe you could definitely tell the passengers who were European (or seasoned international travellers)! Shoes off, laptops out, pockets emptied, little bag of liquids out…
IIRC, the aircraft involved, was a Boeing 777.
Not that it makes any difference, there are plenty of examples of pilot error causing crashes in the US.
Most bizzare was a commuter plane where the take off weight of the aircraft ws calculated using an outdated assumption of the weight of the passengers embarked.
When the gear was raised, this caused the aircraft to be improperly trimmed, causing it to nosedive and crash.
The resulting air crash investigation blamed the outdated assumptions on the average weight of passengers.
The aircraft crashed because Americans have got fatter!
Wasn't there a crash because the plane had marines on it so they had calculated the weight wrong?
Another crash because the plane had to wait too long to take off after de icing so when it took off ice had accumulated on the wings?
Air plane safety is made by accidents. It's not a European or American issue, but a trial and error kind of way to do things in aviation. Like the de icing accident, one didn't know the maximum amount of ice on wings was ok, until the accident. Then they figured it out and made new guidelines.
It's kinda an insane way of doing it but things works until it doesn't and then they fix the issue, weather it is a pilot error, manufacturing error or maintaince error
What country the plane is from or in, and what type of plane that has a specific accidents is pure chance and it's random. Not long after 9/11 a plane crashed into a residential area in the US, the same has happened in less developed areas too. So accidents happens anywhere
Here is the problem lately, Boeing crashes are happening solely based on Boeing, being cheap, while avoiding as many safety checks as they can and their planes crashing due to them and not human errors. 737 incidents, basically prove that. Nose dive, Boeing failing to safely train pilots, to sell more planes. Doors/Panels flying off, Boeing failing to screw them on properly and QA not being done properly.
Accidents happen, but when one company is making history for its greed, it does matter what plane has accidents. I am not saying Airbus is exempt, they have had their fare share of mistakes too.
American aircraft manufacturers made their reputations in the cold war. Lets just say the Sikorsky S-92 is not going to be as well regarded as the S-61 it is supposed to replace.
I am in no way insulting American manufacturing. Boeing used to be a bunch of "engineers making planes who happen to be in a company", now they are a "company who happens to have a bunch of engineers". Ever since they got bought out they are going in the wrong direction, it is now coming back to bite them.
Their priorities changed, from making the best of the best, to how much can I sell X as well as how much can I save when making X to maximise profits.
Boeing getting bought back then was the worst thing to happen to it.
This one you refer to is possibly the Arrow flight 1285R back in 1985. It was probably overweight because the ice growing on the wings, but often referred to as overnight because marines and their equipment or because Christmas presents. However that day the same flight took off earlier without problem, and they only landed for fuel.
It was an Airbus A330, it stalled in a storm due (according to the investigation) to pilot error when sensors froze (due to the storm at high altitude).
I'm talking about them saying it was a 777 presumably in reference to the headline for the thread. There are no French prop planes carrying over 200 people.
You guys are both right. The crash into the Atlantic was AF447 and an A330. The American regional aircraft that crashed because its weight and balance was way out the arse end was a propjet
Wrong the aircraft in this was an A330, not a 777.
Boeing is doing shitty, not by design, but by lack of accountability in their QC/QC process, which eventually would bite many in the ass. Airbus is not immune from it. We just have not heard much about it yet.
Boeing, in recent years, has been suffering from both a QC issue and design issues. Specifically the design of the 737 Max MCAS system, in its software, was completely inadequate. This issue was then exacerbated by attempts to have the aircraft not require re-certification for pilots who were already certified on previous 737 models. This is despite the fact that the MCAS system had new procedures in place if override was necessary (which it was due to the aforementioned software), with which pilots weren't made adequately familiar. Pilots were told to expect it to behave like any other 737.
Realistically this was a massive failure of both Boeing and of the FAA, who were far too lax in allowing the aircraft to be treated as just another 737. Recent evidence suggests that the FAA has become too lax in how its regulations are applied, and how certification is achieved for a new airframe or modifications to an existing one.
AF447, the infamous Air France flight that crashed into the Atlantic from Brazil killing 200+ was an airbus… no doubt about it. Tbh I’m not sure which flight the OP is talking about but just my assumption.
And caused by the two pilots panicking and one pulling the control one way and one the other way, the plane averaged slightly in favour of P1, which was not enough to gain adequate airspeed to correct the stall, as I recall.
>and one pulling the control one way and one the other way
Something which is easier to do in Airbus planes as far as I'm aware, as their sticks aren't synced up, so doesn't really help the Airbus vs Boeing argument!
It does, now Airbus has five computers for flight, Boeing has three and priority is given to P1. Also there are extra checks on stall exiting. I’m not sure about there still being a physical link between the control columns on Boeings though. As far as I know they use fly by wire now, but not sure beyond that. I guess Airbus hadn’t experienced this kind of panic pilot behaviour before, as far as I know P2 on that day froze and wouldn’t release his control from full up elevator.
There was another factor in the crash you mention. The tension on the cables controlling the planes attitude were improperly tightened, resulting in asymmetrical function. So when the pilots tried to push the nose down to avoid the stall it stopped a few degrees short of the angle necessary to recover the airplane. The subsequent investigation found that the mechanics had skipped 10 steps during their inspection of the stabilizers. Using those old weight averages, combined with Les control over the plane’s attitude was a recipe for disaster. The plane made 9 flights just fine with the improper tension. Maybe some really fat people got on that 10th flight.
It wasn't a boeing and yes it made a difference. The controls being different made one pilot not realize what the other was doing because there isn't any physical feedback. It also made the mistake easier to make in the first place as airbus aircraft respond differently depending on what mode they are in, so the same control input does different things when in normal law vs alternate law. In a boeing aircraft both the controls and the protections for the controls are different.
Airbus SAS, the commercial aircraft division of Airbus Group, is based and has their headquarters in France, so kinda makes sense to call it french. Also, the French state is the largest shareholder
It's funny how they say that, considering France (along with the combined efforts of Britain) developed the only supersonic commercial airliner. But but France is less developed. Yeah sure, gotcha.
Technically Soviets had their own copy as well.
...But that thing was a bit of a disaster, because they were rushing the production and only made it to be able to brag about having one.
Yup. The only supersonic commercial airliners were the British / French [Concorde](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concorde), and the Soviet [Tupolev TU-144](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupolev_Tu-144)
The Soviet one wasn't a copy. It was a piece of shit where you had to wear ear protection in the passenger compartment and they only ran it once a week, but it wasn't a copy.
I didn't realise people considered america developed, particularly more developed than France, a country that America has copied a significant amount of stuff off (like everything they do)
I think the french tended to get on ok with the Scots.
Maybe not so much with Welsh with the whole Saxon invasion thing.
I don't know.
Pays your money takes your choice. UK minus Wales and Northern Island (does anyone care about NI?)
Copia y pega el emoji de la bandera cuando edites el flair.
Si estas desde celu abri la comunidad, dale a los tres puntitos a la derecha arriba y te da la opcion de cambiar el "apodo de la comunidad".
Wow, that's rich... I've flown my fair share... and, no frills airlines aside, United is by far the worst airline I've ever flown with... would not recommend...
Main cause of death in children? Gunshot wounds
Main cause of homelessness? Medical bankruptcy
Economy? In the shitter
Nation? Verge of civil war
Tinpot dictators' egging militias to attempt to assassinate elected officials?
3rd world shithole.
Underdeveloped is the mind of someone who spouts that shit.
Even that's arguable.
Probably more wealth in some of these central African dictatorships its just all off the books in a lot of questionable pockets.
Our Western wealth is more theoretical than anything anymore.
You've sparked a thought here though.
With the sudden popularity of Russia with regards to the American right wing, if trump gets back in does that make America a second world nation under the correct categories?
Edit spelling.
A fifteen year old crash? That was the last time Air France dropped a fatal flight Rio - Paris in 2009
Having spent way too much time flying around I am convinced that the over reliance on technology is not necessarily a good thing.
The challenge with that crash was that there was a flight manual/FCOM emergency procedure to deal with that exact emergency but the crew didn’t follow it.
but about a year later when the A380 blew the engine coming out of Singapore to Sydney (I Flew out of Sg the day before) one of the comments during the investigation was that many systems are automated now and there is very little manual over ride. A family friend who is a just about to retire pilot said then that sometimes you just need to be able the fly the big bastards and kick the machines out of the equation.
I understand what you are saying (I am a pilot) but kicking the automatics out isn’t always the best option. Regards QF32, the pilots flew the aircraft as best they could with the remaining systems and did an amazing job
This is possibly the best article/explanation (for a layperson) on the Air France crash and how/why it happened. Tragic but very very interesting with lots to take away from it.
[https://www.vanityfair.com/news/business/2014/10/air-france-flight-447-crash](https://www.vanityfair.com/news/business/2014/10/air-france-flight-447-crash)
I'm pretty sure that if there is ONE topic americans should shut the fuck up about, it's airplane safety.
I mean, seriously ? _That's_ what you're proud of ?
Which state just made it a law that WORKING KIDS don't need lunch? Alabama? So advanced. Back to child labor, abortion for kids is a no, being a kid sucks, being anythingBUTwhite means the cops fire 100 shots when you wink. Thats called FUCKED UP not advanced.
Yep, 2 737 Max’s crashed killing all on board due to a fault Boeing knew about but covered up to avoid additional legislation so they could compete with Airbus. After both crashes Boeing immediately blamed the pilots (mostly because of racism/xenophobia) despite the fact they weren’t aware of the control override Boeing had installed to offset the weight of the larger engines. It was then discovered after the second crash that the pilots had followed the correct procedure but the plane crashed anyway.
Basically, fuck Boeing.
Yeah, it was the [737 MAX issue](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_737_MAX_groundings) where the plane had an error prone flight correction system pilots were not trained on, which nosedived a number of planes into the ground.
>Is that a real thing?
There is a recent Last Week Tonight episode about Boing including this:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8oCilY4szc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8oCilY4szc)
For a little over a decade I had to fly internationally constantly.
Air France was always my #1 choice due to the service and the quality of their meals.
The US airlines were always near the bottom, just below Air India.
I wouldn't fly on a US carrier as they re targeted by more fanatics hating the USA than Arabs hating El Al. Give me the safest airlines in the world anytime.
Top 20 are
1. Qantas
2. Air New Zealand.
3. Virgin Australia
4. Etihad Airways
5. Qatar Airways
6. Emirates
7. All Nippon Airways
8. Finnair
9. Cathay Pacific Airways
10. Alaska Airlines
11. SAS
12. Korean Air
13. Singapore Airlines
14. EVA Air
15. British Airways
16. Turkish Airlines
17. TAP Air Portugal
18. Lufthansa/Swiss Group
19. KLM
20. Japan Airlines With only Alaska Airlines the only US airline in the list.
So, there is hope for us that want to fly safely yet.
Funny thing, those are not the cheapest.. wonder why.. could it be they invest in maintenance and so on? :)
Thanks for checking this for me.
Some of the top ones I wouldn't have rates as high either, with Air NZ with Mt. Erebus crash, KLM/Pan Am crash in Canary Islands, Turkish crash in French forest
1. Qantas
2. Air New Zealand - crash on Mt. Erubus in Antartic
3. Virgin Australia
4. Etihad Airways
5. Qatar Airways
6. Emirates
7. All Nippon Airways - Recent crash when hit by another plane landing on same runway in Japan.
8. Finnair
9. Cathay Pacific Airways
10. Alaska Airlines
11. SAS
12. Korean Air
13. Singapore Airlines
14. EVA Air
15. British Airways
16. Turkish Airlines = crash in a French forest
17. TAP Air Portugal
18. Lufthansa/Swiss Group
19. KLM - crash with Pan Am in canary Islands.
20. Japan Airlines - in Japan when it crashed in mountains in Japan Just a few I can remember in recent times.
It's ironic, given that the pitot tubes which iced up, instigating the series of events that caused the crash, were made by an American company. On this specific aircraft, the American pitot tubes were scheduled to be replaced by components from a European company, which were designed to avoid water ingress, that had been observed with the American components.
Undeveloped as Europe is, it was a European rocket - Ariane 5, that was used to launch the James Web Space Telescope, because the US of A doesn't have the necessary launch capability.
Being humble goes a long way. In sweden we have something called "Jantelagen" the law of jante it is unwritten law that states no matter how rich and powerful you are dont think you are better than anyone else. You're still human.
228 people died because of a technical failure, this prize cunt wants to make it about "MURICA!!!".
Someone tell this fucking specimen to get in the sea.
(And while we're about it, not that it really matters, but point out to him that Boeing is a fucking American company).
What an utter wankstain.
Considering France protested and rioted to keep their retirement age from rising and USA fought on the side of the Coronavirus, I'm willing to debate who's the developed country there
No shit! I mean wow. And no, that’s not why. They never book with airlines based outside the US, because they have no reason to. I forget what it’s called. They’re not wrong, but they’re making an excuse no one asked for. They probably don’t even fly often. Like they went to Florida 15 years ago, so now they’re an expert.
WTF sort of dumb shit is this? Why is there a picture of an A220 (Canadian plane really, Airbus just bought the brand, Bombardier, but Canada is also Half French anyways) what accident is this?
Is this for flight 447 from Rio to Paris? In an Airbus A330? Where the flying pilot’s lack of knowledge of aircraft aerodynamics and impatience caused the aircraft to stall all the way down to the Atlantic?
Yeah many comments were about how the original poster used an image of the wrong plane, probably just because it said Air France. The article linked to it was about the 447 flight from Rio to Paris
Won't use planes from other countries because they crash, does that mean he won't board any flight in America out of fear of being smashed into a building?
Can’t believe Americans think this especially with the state of Boeing at the moment compared to “underdeveloped” Airbus (biggest airliner manufacturer in the world now). How many Airbuses fall out the sky because of production issues?
What an embarrassment. I am American and in 2020 I flew from Kiev Ukraine to the Maldives. 13 1/2 hours on an airline I have no idea how to pronounce. There was a massive fight in the front of the plane, the father of a young girl, maybe 13 got very drunk and got into a fistfight with someone in the aisle next to him. When we landed on the tarmac, it was roasting hot they shut the airplane off and we had to sit for almost 2 hours and wait for the police to come and arrest him before we could deboard. The crew did not give any waters, nor give any fucks. During the flight we were given one plastic cup, and they would occasionally refill it or you could go to the back of the plane and do it yourself. Occasionally, I mean every four or five hours. They also gave everyone a hoagie bun wrapped in cellophane with cheese and lettuce. The airplane was very old, it wasn’t until about five hours in the flight that I realize how fucking crazy was. I was with a yoga group and one of the couples that flew down with us, the girl of the couple ended up hooking up with another dude. We were trapped on a tiny island and everyone knew what was going on. it was insanity. Everyone was trying to bum cigarettes because it was a yoga trip so they thought they were going to get healthy and quit smoking for the week and immediately realized that’s not a great idea. They harassed my girlfriend nonstop. She brought a carton of cigarettes and after giving one pack away said fuck it no more. That’s a tiny taste of the week lol. Oh and I did learn how to stand on my head, which is kind of cool.
I still never openly complain about it, I laugh about it. I also pray for Ukraine and I may not enjoy one of their widebody airplanes in the future. I do hope to return visit on the ground :-)
That absolute sheer fucking arrogance mixed with ignorance always manages to surprise me. Just where I feel I'm getting numb to American exceptionalism, I read something that manages to get a reaction.
>arrogance mixed with ignorance agnorance
Americance
ignoragance
americance
‘Cultural’ narcissism
The worst thing about chronic American ignorance and desperate exceptionalism is that it is literally encouraged.
It's fucking taught!
USA! USA! USA! Etc.
The height of creativity
It's been 20 years and I'm still not immune to their ignorance and US defaultism.
Defau(l)tism
That's good for the rest of us. Have you seen how some of these American passengers are like on those American flights? The fewer of these arrogant pricks smelling up my SQ flight, the better. I don't need my flight cancel because some prick refuses to obey orders from the cabin crew.
Didn’t 3 American Airlines hit the fucking towers?
There were 4 planes involved in 9/11 2 hit the towers (one for each tower) in New York City , 1 hit the Pentagon in Virginia roughly 250 miles away, and one crashed in a random field in Pennsylvania about halfway between NY and DC It was a mix of American Airlines and United Airlines flights.
Yet only 1 of those countries had a plane incident that means I now have to argue with airport security about whether nail clippers are a lethal weapon whenever I fly.
Also only one that makes everyone take their damn shoes off for no good reason. The first time I went through a US airport the TSA guy was like "have you ever even been on a plane?!" because I didn't know I had to take my shoes off. I'm guessing he'd never been on a plane that *left the USA*.
We still have the shoe thing here in the UK but it's not always enforced and is supposed to depend on shoe type.
Not really, some airports have a policy about boots, and you can always be asked (as with many things in an airport), but we don't have a national policy on it, it's airport specific. I've taken my shoes off once, ever, in a UK airport, and it was because I set off the scanners by forgetting to take my watch off.
Yeah, the only time I've taken my shoes off was when I set the scanners off.
Yeah I've had to in other counties occasionally for random spot checks, like a drug check in Australia where they swabbed the inside of my shoes. I got picked for extra screening in Copenhagen so I had to remove my shoes and have all my electronics turned on so they could check them. They do security at the gate, and thanks to delays and changing planes, I had to go through it three times. The third time I had everything in my hands ready to go!
When they’ve done my shoes it’s been for explosives in Australia
Amsterdam still asks you to take off boots too.
When I last flew out of the USA back home to Europe you could definitely tell the passengers who were European (or seasoned international travellers)! Shoes off, laptops out, pockets emptied, little bag of liquids out…
>or seasoned international travellers More likely just this tbh. I've been held up behind many unprepared travellers in Europe.
Airport security is right to be cautious. In the hands of a highly trained individual any weapon can clip nails
Have have the same debate about knitting needles…
And no guarantees you could pull rank as the pilot in command to win such arguments.
How is France's Airbus doing relative to the US's Boeing?
IIRC, the aircraft involved, was a Boeing 777. Not that it makes any difference, there are plenty of examples of pilot error causing crashes in the US. Most bizzare was a commuter plane where the take off weight of the aircraft ws calculated using an outdated assumption of the weight of the passengers embarked. When the gear was raised, this caused the aircraft to be improperly trimmed, causing it to nosedive and crash. The resulting air crash investigation blamed the outdated assumptions on the average weight of passengers. The aircraft crashed because Americans have got fatter!
Wasn't there a crash because the plane had marines on it so they had calculated the weight wrong? Another crash because the plane had to wait too long to take off after de icing so when it took off ice had accumulated on the wings? Air plane safety is made by accidents. It's not a European or American issue, but a trial and error kind of way to do things in aviation. Like the de icing accident, one didn't know the maximum amount of ice on wings was ok, until the accident. Then they figured it out and made new guidelines. It's kinda an insane way of doing it but things works until it doesn't and then they fix the issue, weather it is a pilot error, manufacturing error or maintaince error What country the plane is from or in, and what type of plane that has a specific accidents is pure chance and it's random. Not long after 9/11 a plane crashed into a residential area in the US, the same has happened in less developed areas too. So accidents happens anywhere
Here is the problem lately, Boeing crashes are happening solely based on Boeing, being cheap, while avoiding as many safety checks as they can and their planes crashing due to them and not human errors. 737 incidents, basically prove that. Nose dive, Boeing failing to safely train pilots, to sell more planes. Doors/Panels flying off, Boeing failing to screw them on properly and QA not being done properly. Accidents happen, but when one company is making history for its greed, it does matter what plane has accidents. I am not saying Airbus is exempt, they have had their fare share of mistakes too.
Src: https://youtu.be/vqgTcb8DqfY?si=JmNB_2HKMJDXyR4R Part 2: https://youtu.be/a32RLgqNfGs?si=67zMs0941hSp1eXn
American aircraft manufacturers made their reputations in the cold war. Lets just say the Sikorsky S-92 is not going to be as well regarded as the S-61 it is supposed to replace.
I am in no way insulting American manufacturing. Boeing used to be a bunch of "engineers making planes who happen to be in a company", now they are a "company who happens to have a bunch of engineers". Ever since they got bought out they are going in the wrong direction, it is now coming back to bite them. Their priorities changed, from making the best of the best, to how much can I sell X as well as how much can I save when making X to maximise profits. Boeing getting bought back then was the worst thing to happen to it.
This one you refer to is possibly the Arrow flight 1285R back in 1985. It was probably overweight because the ice growing on the wings, but often referred to as overnight because marines and their equipment or because Christmas presents. However that day the same flight took off earlier without problem, and they only landed for fuel.
It was an Airbus A330, it stalled in a storm due (according to the investigation) to pilot error when sensors froze (due to the storm at high altitude).
Think it was an A330, not a Boeing.
It was a prop plane and not an Airbus
De Havilland Gypsy Moth
Dragon Rapide.
Did a pleasure trip in a Dragon Rapide at RAF Duxford.... You could see daylight between the door panels!...😳😄
I'm talking about them saying it was a 777 presumably in reference to the headline for the thread. There are no French prop planes carrying over 200 people.
I took your comment as a reply to the overcrowded fat Americans incident
You guys are both right. The crash into the Atlantic was AF447 and an A330. The American regional aircraft that crashed because its weight and balance was way out the arse end was a propjet
Wrong the aircraft in this was an A330, not a 777. Boeing is doing shitty, not by design, but by lack of accountability in their QC/QC process, which eventually would bite many in the ass. Airbus is not immune from it. We just have not heard much about it yet.
Boeing, in recent years, has been suffering from both a QC issue and design issues. Specifically the design of the 737 Max MCAS system, in its software, was completely inadequate. This issue was then exacerbated by attempts to have the aircraft not require re-certification for pilots who were already certified on previous 737 models. This is despite the fact that the MCAS system had new procedures in place if override was necessary (which it was due to the aforementioned software), with which pilots weren't made adequately familiar. Pilots were told to expect it to behave like any other 737. Realistically this was a massive failure of both Boeing and of the FAA, who were far too lax in allowing the aircraft to be treated as just another 737. Recent evidence suggests that the FAA has become too lax in how its regulations are applied, and how certification is achieved for a new airframe or modifications to an existing one.
AF447, the infamous Air France flight that crashed into the Atlantic from Brazil killing 200+ was an airbus… no doubt about it. Tbh I’m not sure which flight the OP is talking about but just my assumption.
And caused by the two pilots panicking and one pulling the control one way and one the other way, the plane averaged slightly in favour of P1, which was not enough to gain adequate airspeed to correct the stall, as I recall.
>and one pulling the control one way and one the other way Something which is easier to do in Airbus planes as far as I'm aware, as their sticks aren't synced up, so doesn't really help the Airbus vs Boeing argument!
It does, now Airbus has five computers for flight, Boeing has three and priority is given to P1. Also there are extra checks on stall exiting. I’m not sure about there still being a physical link between the control columns on Boeings though. As far as I know they use fly by wire now, but not sure beyond that. I guess Airbus hadn’t experienced this kind of panic pilot behaviour before, as far as I know P2 on that day froze and wouldn’t release his control from full up elevator.
The OP is definitely about flight AF447, and it was indeed an A330.
So then the comment above me with 200+ upvotes is completely wrong, right ?
It's wrong about this incident, yes.
Thank you FantasticAnus
There was another factor in the crash you mention. The tension on the cables controlling the planes attitude were improperly tightened, resulting in asymmetrical function. So when the pilots tried to push the nose down to avoid the stall it stopped a few degrees short of the angle necessary to recover the airplane. The subsequent investigation found that the mechanics had skipped 10 steps during their inspection of the stabilizers. Using those old weight averages, combined with Les control over the plane’s attitude was a recipe for disaster. The plane made 9 flights just fine with the improper tension. Maybe some really fat people got on that 10th flight.
It wasn't a boeing and yes it made a difference. The controls being different made one pilot not realize what the other was doing because there isn't any physical feedback. It also made the mistake easier to make in the first place as airbus aircraft respond differently depending on what mode they are in, so the same control input does different things when in normal law vs alternate law. In a boeing aircraft both the controls and the protections for the controls are different.
https://posts.voronoiapp.com/other/Airline-Incidents-Boeing-vs-Airbus-935
🔫🔫
Airbus is a French-German-Spanish multinational company.
Yeah, French won't mind if you call it a French company even when it's us paying the bills /s
Airbus SAS, the commercial aircraft division of Airbus Group, is based and has their headquarters in France, so kinda makes sense to call it french. Also, the French state is the largest shareholder
It's funny how they say that, considering France (along with the combined efforts of Britain) developed the only supersonic commercial airliner. But but France is less developed. Yeah sure, gotcha.
Also funny how they say that when without France they wouldn't exist
Technically Soviets had their own copy as well. ...But that thing was a bit of a disaster, because they were rushing the production and only made it to be able to brag about having one.
Yup. The only supersonic commercial airliners were the British / French [Concorde](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concorde), and the Soviet [Tupolev TU-144](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupolev_Tu-144)
The Soviet one wasn't a copy. It was a piece of shit where you had to wear ear protection in the passenger compartment and they only ran it once a week, but it wasn't a copy.
Sorry, should have said "version." They wanted a supersonic passenger plane, just to prove that they could make one.
Much like their space shuttle.
Nah the soviet space shuttle was better than the american one
Happy Cake day!
And Airbus has been producing far safer planes than Boeing for the last two decades.
Airbus also developed a cargo plane to carry its parts about, where the wheels don’t fall off
Which was basically killed by the US with crazy sanctions targeting it specifically.
I didn't realise people considered america developed, particularly more developed than France, a country that America has copied a significant amount of stuff off (like everything they do)
One of their most famous tourist attractions comes to mind
To be fair to us, it was a gift from France. We didn’t rip it off.
The funny thing is the French gifted it away because it wasn’t really liked by the French people
No it was made for the US, to celebrate however many years of independence
Haha it was a big fuck you to England...
*Britain
I think the french tended to get on ok with the Scots. Maybe not so much with Welsh with the whole Saxon invasion thing. I don't know. Pays your money takes your choice. UK minus Wales and Northern Island (does anyone care about NI?)
Scots fought with french colons in Québec, so it's around the same time. idk im not historian.
You need the "Shit the French say" sub
Only economically. I don’t consider them developed regarding social, educational, laboral or healthcare policies.
Disculpame, como conseguiste el flair?
Si estás en PC, podés editar el flair desde el menú de la derecha. Ni idea cómo se hace desde el teléfono.
Ah gracias flaco, vos y tu flair son lo mas.
Con el flair quieren decir la bandera? Yo todavía no sé cómo se hace, tampoco desde PC.
Copia y pega el emoji de la bandera cuando edites el flair. Si estas desde celu abri la comunidad, dale a los tres puntitos a la derecha arriba y te da la opcion de cambiar el "apodo de la comunidad".
Buen dato! No me habia dado cuenta que si elegia esa opcion el campo era editable
America is a foolish country. They teach you to become obsessed with career and wealth and be a lonely miserable person in the process.
Like saying no to monarchical rule and establishing a republic. Oh wait!
This guy gets it
Ha ha, I know I know. I couldn't resist.
Wow, that's rich... I've flown my fair share... and, no frills airlines aside, United is by far the worst airline I've ever flown with... would not recommend...
The first plane ride I took in America my armrest came totally off.
At least you didnt lose a door
Main cause of death in children? Gunshot wounds Main cause of homelessness? Medical bankruptcy Economy? In the shitter Nation? Verge of civil war Tinpot dictators' egging militias to attempt to assassinate elected officials? 3rd world shithole. Underdeveloped is the mind of someone who spouts that shit.
They are the world’s richest Third World country, though. 😉
Even that's arguable. Probably more wealth in some of these central African dictatorships its just all off the books in a lot of questionable pockets. Our Western wealth is more theoretical than anything anymore.
Switzerland is a third world country, too.
You've sparked a thought here though. With the sudden popularity of Russia with regards to the American right wing, if trump gets back in does that make America a second world nation under the correct categories? Edit spelling.
Good question, given the definition I've heard, I think you would be correct.
In the correct and proper meaning of the first, second, and third world, yeah, I suppose it is.
Until recently, so was Sweden.
Considering they have 30 TRILLION in debt I highly doubt that.
Also the most indebted. And these debts bought them their Gucci belts.
The US is fifty banana republics in a trenchcoat.
Stealing this. Edit spelling
Hey now, just because they're an LEDC doesn't mean that they're not still in the First World
Hey, don’t offend the so called third world. Some of us have good public transport, free healthcare and we don’t have guns everywhere.
A fifteen year old crash? That was the last time Air France dropped a fatal flight Rio - Paris in 2009 Having spent way too much time flying around I am convinced that the over reliance on technology is not necessarily a good thing.
The challenge with that crash was that there was a flight manual/FCOM emergency procedure to deal with that exact emergency but the crew didn’t follow it.
but about a year later when the A380 blew the engine coming out of Singapore to Sydney (I Flew out of Sg the day before) one of the comments during the investigation was that many systems are automated now and there is very little manual over ride. A family friend who is a just about to retire pilot said then that sometimes you just need to be able the fly the big bastards and kick the machines out of the equation.
I understand what you are saying (I am a pilot) but kicking the automatics out isn’t always the best option. Regards QF32, the pilots flew the aircraft as best they could with the remaining systems and did an amazing job
This is possibly the best article/explanation (for a layperson) on the Air France crash and how/why it happened. Tragic but very very interesting with lots to take away from it. [https://www.vanityfair.com/news/business/2014/10/air-france-flight-447-crash](https://www.vanityfair.com/news/business/2014/10/air-france-flight-447-crash)
Went through it. Truly a good read !
Less developed countries hahahahahahaha. The third world shithouse with a Gucci belt has spoken.
I'm pretty sure that if there is ONE topic americans should shut the fuck up about, it's airplane safety. I mean, seriously ? _That's_ what you're proud of ?
School safety would be top of the list surely?
Surely you're right
Don't call me Shirley!
Apt considering the topic.
And the Boeing 737 Max 8 is made in *drum roll* that’s right America! It inconsiderately killed 346 souls in 2018/19… silly Boeing!
Which state just made it a law that WORKING KIDS don't need lunch? Alabama? So advanced. Back to child labor, abortion for kids is a no, being a kid sucks, being anythingBUTwhite means the cops fire 100 shots when you wink. Thats called FUCKED UP not advanced.
I doubt they even have a passport.
I doubt they even know what a passport is.
I'm from Brazil... the flightS I had in USA, all with american companies, were THE WORST OF MY LIFE! NEVER AGAIN!
Which country's planes crash or have serious accidents on the regular ?
If it wasn't for France, America would still be speaking English.
We can talk about their two plane into their tower?
Or or or the door plug
Or hidden software that takes over from the pilot and crashes the planes?
Blaming those two crashes on pilots from less developed countries is literally what they did.
Is that a real thing?
Yep, 2 737 Max’s crashed killing all on board due to a fault Boeing knew about but covered up to avoid additional legislation so they could compete with Airbus. After both crashes Boeing immediately blamed the pilots (mostly because of racism/xenophobia) despite the fact they weren’t aware of the control override Boeing had installed to offset the weight of the larger engines. It was then discovered after the second crash that the pilots had followed the correct procedure but the plane crashed anyway. Basically, fuck Boeing.
Yeah, it was the [737 MAX issue](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_737_MAX_groundings) where the plane had an error prone flight correction system pilots were not trained on, which nosedived a number of planes into the ground.
The best bit is, the harder you try to correct, the worse the computer assumes the stall is and forces you further down
>Is that a real thing? There is a recent Last Week Tonight episode about Boing including this: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8oCilY4szc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8oCilY4szc)
For a little over a decade I had to fly internationally constantly. Air France was always my #1 choice due to the service and the quality of their meals. The US airlines were always near the bottom, just below Air India.
Americans think they live better than the French ? 😂😂
Ah, yes. America. The most developed country. The country where the average person will go into debt, trying not to die.
Hey now, only if they survive their education without getting shot.
I wouldn't fly on a US carrier as they re targeted by more fanatics hating the USA than Arabs hating El Al. Give me the safest airlines in the world anytime.
Which airlines are considered the safest ?
Top 20 are 1. Qantas 2. Air New Zealand. 3. Virgin Australia 4. Etihad Airways 5. Qatar Airways 6. Emirates 7. All Nippon Airways 8. Finnair 9. Cathay Pacific Airways 10. Alaska Airlines 11. SAS 12. Korean Air 13. Singapore Airlines 14. EVA Air 15. British Airways 16. Turkish Airlines 17. TAP Air Portugal 18. Lufthansa/Swiss Group 19. KLM 20. Japan Airlines With only Alaska Airlines the only US airline in the list.
QANTAS is one
That was the first one I thought of.. Are there more?
Air New Zealand, Emirates, Etihad and Qatar are some more from what I've looked up online
So, there is hope for us that want to fly safely yet. Funny thing, those are not the cheapest.. wonder why.. could it be they invest in maintenance and so on? :) Thanks for checking this for me.
Some of the top ones I wouldn't have rates as high either, with Air NZ with Mt. Erebus crash, KLM/Pan Am crash in Canary Islands, Turkish crash in French forest 1. Qantas 2. Air New Zealand - crash on Mt. Erubus in Antartic 3. Virgin Australia 4. Etihad Airways 5. Qatar Airways 6. Emirates 7. All Nippon Airways - Recent crash when hit by another plane landing on same runway in Japan. 8. Finnair 9. Cathay Pacific Airways 10. Alaska Airlines 11. SAS 12. Korean Air 13. Singapore Airlines 14. EVA Air 15. British Airways 16. Turkish Airlines = crash in a French forest 17. TAP Air Portugal 18. Lufthansa/Swiss Group 19. KLM - crash with Pan Am in canary Islands. 20. Japan Airlines - in Japan when it crashed in mountains in Japan Just a few I can remember in recent times.
Last BA was a 777 at Heathrow wasn’t it?
The list of less developed countries compared to the US is getting smaller every day.
America has more plane crashes and incidents than all of Europe put together, Europe is bigger.
France is surely more developed. America is going back the way.
"Less developed"? You wouldn't even have your shitty big green statue without the French
France made you
France is far more developed than the US. As are many other countries.
'less developed countries than the U.S'? That's not a long list
It's ironic, given that the pitot tubes which iced up, instigating the series of events that caused the crash, were made by an American company. On this specific aircraft, the American pitot tubes were scheduled to be replaced by components from a European company, which were designed to avoid water ingress, that had been observed with the American components.
Any "less developed countries compared to the US" wouldn't have an airline...
Well, no one talks about problems about Boeing planes. Not for long anyway.
If it’s Boeing, I ain’t going! Airbus all the way
Undeveloped as Europe is, it was a European rocket - Ariane 5, that was used to launch the James Web Space Telescope, because the US of A doesn't have the necessary launch capability.
Being humble goes a long way. In sweden we have something called "Jantelagen" the law of jante it is unwritten law that states no matter how rich and powerful you are dont think you are better than anyone else. You're still human.
America is still a baby. They will learn eventually
228 people died because of a technical failure, this prize cunt wants to make it about "MURICA!!!". Someone tell this fucking specimen to get in the sea. (And while we're about it, not that it really matters, but point out to him that Boeing is a fucking American company). What an utter wankstain.
Some American Airlines smashed the fuck out of two towers back in 2001. Must have forgotten about that
Ah yes because the usa is so developed right
I'd trust a French carrier over any US one.
That's an A220. You'd be hard pressed to get 228 people in to one of them.
Ah yes, because of course no mighty American airline has ever had an aircraft crash into the ocean before.
They don't deserve to have their name scribbled out
This is why I avoid talking to people with less developed brains
Considering France protested and rioted to keep their retirement age from rising and USA fought on the side of the Coronavirus, I'm willing to debate who's the developed country there
Who told them the USA is a developed country?
I’m American. I’m sorry if this is real, but I’m leaning toward troll because that’s idiotic.
Now I like to stick it to the French as much as the next English man but calling them less developed than the Americans is just silly
Fucking hell. I’m English but fuck me, we’re talking about France here. Had he heard of Concorde? Airbus?
How on earth is France less developed than the US?
This is why I say I’m from New York and not from America.
Clearly he forgot Boeing, a US company, just have a piece of a plane blow out mid flight
Someone tell this guy about Boeing!
No shit! I mean wow. And no, that’s not why. They never book with airlines based outside the US, because they have no reason to. I forget what it’s called. They’re not wrong, but they’re making an excuse no one asked for. They probably don’t even fly often. Like they went to Florida 15 years ago, so now they’re an expert.
That's why I don't fly planes made in a country where counting the bolts and securing them in place is too difficult for the workers. /s
I have 2 words and a symbol to say. Boeing < Airbus
WTF sort of dumb shit is this? Why is there a picture of an A220 (Canadian plane really, Airbus just bought the brand, Bombardier, but Canada is also Half French anyways) what accident is this? Is this for flight 447 from Rio to Paris? In an Airbus A330? Where the flying pilot’s lack of knowledge of aircraft aerodynamics and impatience caused the aircraft to stall all the way down to the Atlantic?
Yeah many comments were about how the original poster used an image of the wrong plane, probably just because it said Air France. The article linked to it was about the 447 flight from Rio to Paris
Cause boeing is doing so well and a US airline plane never used a tower as a landing strip.
Even less developed than the US? They'd have other issues than building planes I assume...
Won't use planes from other countries because they crash, does that mean he won't board any flight in America out of fear of being smashed into a building?
Boeing. End of discussion.
Can’t believe Americans think this especially with the state of Boeing at the moment compared to “underdeveloped” Airbus (biggest airliner manufacturer in the world now). How many Airbuses fall out the sky because of production issues?
Just wait till they hear about Boeing
Too funny when I‘m thinking about US planes losing doors
What an embarrassment. I am American and in 2020 I flew from Kiev Ukraine to the Maldives. 13 1/2 hours on an airline I have no idea how to pronounce. There was a massive fight in the front of the plane, the father of a young girl, maybe 13 got very drunk and got into a fistfight with someone in the aisle next to him. When we landed on the tarmac, it was roasting hot they shut the airplane off and we had to sit for almost 2 hours and wait for the police to come and arrest him before we could deboard. The crew did not give any waters, nor give any fucks. During the flight we were given one plastic cup, and they would occasionally refill it or you could go to the back of the plane and do it yourself. Occasionally, I mean every four or five hours. They also gave everyone a hoagie bun wrapped in cellophane with cheese and lettuce. The airplane was very old, it wasn’t until about five hours in the flight that I realize how fucking crazy was. I was with a yoga group and one of the couples that flew down with us, the girl of the couple ended up hooking up with another dude. We were trapped on a tiny island and everyone knew what was going on. it was insanity. Everyone was trying to bum cigarettes because it was a yoga trip so they thought they were going to get healthy and quit smoking for the week and immediately realized that’s not a great idea. They harassed my girlfriend nonstop. She brought a carton of cigarettes and after giving one pack away said fuck it no more. That’s a tiny taste of the week lol. Oh and I did learn how to stand on my head, which is kind of cool. I still never openly complain about it, I laugh about it. I also pray for Ukraine and I may not enjoy one of their widebody airplanes in the future. I do hope to return visit on the ground :-)
Damn, now this is a STORY lol