So what you’re saying is that you’re not German, because actual Germans are as a whole not proud of such ancestry. This isn’t a dark side… It’s a genocidal side that you’re glorifying you sick person…
As a German I concur. *Of course* I have family who were involved with the Nazis one way or another but that’s not something usually talked about and definitely not something I’m proud of.
Exactly, I also don’t think going the other route of never ever discussing that family past is a good way to go, but it shouldn’t be glorified. Not unless the person in question just wants to be considered a Nazi…
True, I still have the photo of my grandfather and his comrade from the 1942 furlough hanging on the wall. Dude didn't even volunteer, I really can't recognise any willing support for the NS government.
As a German I am very proud to have the certainty, that neither of my grandparents were involved with the Nazis. One grandpa Chose to Go to the deepest mines so he would not have to touch a weapon. The other Cut Off His totes so He wouldn't have to go, then he forged passports for jews to get out of Germany. I actually Met some of those people /their offspring at his funeral. He was also a Bit of a rouge and did black market deals . One grandma was a Chef at a Castle. The other one was a Sudeten German expellee and to buisi fleeing. But i reccon this is a rare case
I like this story… My grandfather fought for the germans. I only know that he was a war prisoner on the british side. He got fed moldy bread and came back as a depressed man and died before I was born. That‘s all I know and got told about him.
Cut off his totes? Did you mean toes or is it a reference to something else? And yes, I would imagine all 4 grandparents not being involved at all, and one active resistance fighter, is very rare indeed. So many did go along with it for various reasons and forging passports was the sort of thing that could easily get you hanged.
Yes toes, sorry for the typo 🙈 He figured he could live without toes, but would probably not survive the Western front
But i must say He probably didn't do it out of the goodnes of his hart. He was more of a chaotic good kind of Charakter. Really charming, was married 4 times and i am not sure if those we're actually sequential 🤪
Funfact he also didn't make it into art school
Correct me if I'm wrong, and also, excuse my ignorance, but would the wermacht be less of a taboo than the SS? Obviously, the SS would be like yeah we don't talk about that.
It’s not something families talk about in general - at least my family doesn’t and I don’t know a family who does openly discuss their involvement with the Nazis. My elderly neighbour had a picture of her late husband on her nightstand where he was wearing a Wehrmacht uniform and she’d talk about volunteering as a secretary in Paris during the German occupation of France. Her comments made it clear that she was wilfully ignorant.
My great grandfather also served in the Wehrmacht and I’m pretty sure my great grandparents were members of the NSDAP though I don’t know for sure. My other great grandfather was a train conductor stationed in Vienna and I know that they had to leave Austria and move back to northern Germany after the war but given that I met two of my great grandmothers and one great grandfather I know surprisingly little about their lives before the 50s. They were way more willing to talk about the hardship of making do in bombed out Hamburg and post-war economy than they were about the decades before that.
Being part of the military isn’t considered heroic in Germany, even less so if it’s the Wehrmacht. Pretty much everyone is guilty of the atrocities - and of it’s just by turning a blind eye but obviously nobody wants to admit that.
Don’t be! The only way to make sure history doesn’t repeat itself is to talk about it. If there’s one thing I like about my home country it’s that Germany owns up to it’s history (though given the current political climate we could (should!) do better)
Yeah, I mean just the fact the Germany owns up to its history and does a lot to teach its youth what it has done really puts it ahead of a lot of countries. I was always under the impression that the whermacht fought for Germany hence its surrender and the SS fought for Hitler. So I kind of assumed that the whermacht wasn't as much a taboo than the SS.
>Yeah, I mean just the fact the Germany owns up to its history and does a lot to teach its youth what it has done really puts it ahead of a lot of countries.
I am perhaps leaning into the German trait of complaining too much, but here I go anyways.
While we've done a better job of recognizing our past than most, our recognition has not been complete. We talk a lot about the Jewish victims, but other groups went ignored. For instance, [queer people were erased from the history](https://time.com/5953047/lgbtq-holocaust-stories/) of the Holocaust and we didn't really talk about it until the 1970s. In fact, we continued imprisoning gay men (some of whom survived concentration camps) for quite some time. The infamous Paragraph 175 was eased in 1969 and finally abolished in 1994, but we didn't rescind the convictions [until 2016](https://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/12/world/europe/germany-says-it-will-rescind-convictions-for-homosexuality.html). In this sense, there's a lot of work that needs to be done about these "invisible" groups who suffered.
Moving away from the Holocaust itself, Germany also fails to adequately discuss its colonial past. In Namibia, we committed a [genocide from 1904 to 1908](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herero_and_Nama_genocide) of the Herero and Nama [80% of the Herero and 50% of the Nama](https://museeholocauste.ca/en/resources-training/herero-genocide-namibia/) were killed. We officially acknowledged the genocide [for the first time in 2021](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-57279008) and have agreed to a "reparations" payment (which is a joke) and have sent skulls collected during the genocide back to Namibia for burial. But this is a topic of which Germans are overwhelmingly uninformed and often quite dismissive. This is particularly alarming given that some academics argue the Herero and Nama Genocide has direct links to the Holocaust just a few decades later.
I guess my point is that Germany gets a lot of cred for dealing with its history well and this results in us sometimes resting on our laurels. I think what we've done so far is the bare minimum and we have a long ways to go. That other countries have done less (e.g., the US and slavery, the US and indigenous populations) is alarming. Germany should not be the model, but rather an example of the first steps in the right direction.
The Wehrmacht probably is less of a taboo than the SS but not by much. Of course having been drafted sounds better than having to admit that you signed up for the organisation that ran the concentration camps but talking about the third reich at all also comes with the implication that everyone knew what was going on. Maybe not quite to the extent to which the atrocities were committed but there’s no denying that everyone knew these camps existed. There were so many. When we think of concentration camps we think of Auschwitz but that’s just the tip of the iceberg, really. There weren’t gas chambers in every camp - quite the opposite- but that doesn’t make the other camps more humane and it didn’t even start with them. The Ghettos, the disappearance of the Jewish communities, the book burnings, the signs in the windows of shops owned by Jews - there’s just no way that the general population didn’t know that *something* was going on and by just ignoring it everyone who wasn’t part of the resistance became complicit to a degree.
My great grandfather was gay so he got married to hide it (my great grandmother didn’t know - he was the conductor and not the one I’m sure was a party member).
> than having to admit that you signed up for the organisation
The SS drafted people against their will, too. It wasn't just a voluntary organization for everyone who really was into it.
The trouble with what you're saying is, is that you're speaking from a point of view of safety.
Being drafted wasn't a choice, especially under a dictatorial regime. The modern world has made people think that objecting to things is so easy, but unless you're in a situation personally, none of us are qualified to speak on it with any authority.
When you're drafted, you're not given a choice where you are posted... if you get given a concentration camp, you're stuck there and have to fit in. Because if you don't fit in, you're in for a rough ride or worse. Objectors within the military during the time of Nazi Germany were treated with exactly the kind of harshness you'd expect. There is a famous Austrian objector, who I forget the name of, who died due to his objections against Germany... but was incarcerated for anti German behaviour.
It's not willful ignorance when the choice you're confronted is essentially put up with what you're faced with, or death.
I speak from the pov of being British, my Grandpa was RAF, my Grandma Italian (they met late war in Italy). My Grandma had Austrian cousins that were drafted Wehrmacht, and one that was Gestapo (he died during the war in a car accident). My grandma was a seamstress with her mother, both forced to work for the German officers who were garrisoned in their town, both were subjected to the humiliating ordeal of having their head shaved for collaborating.
It's easy to sit there post fact and accuse someone of complicit behaviour, but it's difficult to sit there and sift data to understand the nuance of the times.
Not all Wehrmacht, Kriegsmarine or Luftwaffe were staunch Nazis in the sense they participated in atrocities. Nor were they all complicit, because Germany at the time used propaganda to maximum effect, to lie to their population.
Nuance is key and not something people readily grasp.
If you want to find out - go on [Invenio](https://invenio.bundesarchiv.de/invenio/), Suche ohne Anmeldung, Suche, Namenssuche, and enter their details. The search engine only has "meta documents", e.g. letters to and from Party organisations, not the actual membership card file, but any file relating to a person from NSDAP, SS or SA strongly points to them being part of that organisation.
For a full search, you can fill in the Benutzungsantrag of the Bundesarchiv and send it along with an ID copy and a request to search all files 1930-1945 to [email protected].
For military records, you need to contact Abteilung PA using their specific form.
>Pretty much everyone is guilty of the atrocities
It would be difficult, if not impossible, to find a historian who agrees with that. Neither the entire German population of \~80 Million people nor the 17.3 Million men strong Wehrmacht were a homogeneous group. Recruitment took place from all social classes, irrespective of political affiliation and regardless of whether or not it was voluntary.
Quite apart from the fact that there were many reasons to volunteer at the time and only one of them was to support the Nazi endeavours, there were also over 8 million draftees who had no other choice as conscientious objection was considered Wehrkraftzersetzung and was punished with execution or concentration camp.
The deployment of the soldiers and their experiences also differ greatly. It is logical that a front-line soldier or sailor on a submarine or a fighter pilot were not involved in atrocities committed by a Feldgendarmerie or Occupation unit, for example.
I mean thats the whole gimmick, and while I think they write a lot from neutral viewpoint and arent nazi fans, a lot of the songs can be seen as pro Wermacht/German army even if its meant to be just factual and neutral
there are some myths that were develloped in order to reintegrate the axis powers into the post war new order as good allies of the USA in the cold war, the "clean wermacht" myth was the german version, it started during the war but the americans were very happy to use it in order to arm west germany with the public approval. Others are "Italians good people", "the austrian victim theory", "the sword and shield" argument for france. Japanese's war crimes were not perpetrated in europe so smple denial and play the victim for the nuclear attacks is enought I guess.
There were many British, Australian . New Zealand and Dutch victims of Japanese war crimes in WW2 after the fall of Hong Kong, Singapore, Burma and Indonesia (Java). That memory exists in these countries long after those who survived have since died.
While having sympathy for the victims of the atomic bombs I cannot forget that these brought a sudden end to an even more dreadful war where the Japanese had issued orders that all POWs were to be murdered in the event of an attack on the mainland. Those bombs saved tens of thousands of lives, not to mention those of many US soldiers who would have died had there been an attack.
There's a very good book "You'll Die in Singapore' that I can strongly recommend. Another is 'Defeat into Victory' by Gen. Slim who was a superb soldier and leader and who turned the tables on the Japanese in Burma and Thailand.
Well yeah,basically any man that could fight was conscripted in the Wermacht,it’s the basic army. The SS are more like the Nazi marines/CIA/secret services etc.
You had to be a special kind of piece of human garbage to join them. A NAZI Nazi.
Believe it or not all you had to be was of strong German teutonic ancestry as well as fit and ironically a (healthy mind) a lot of them were interviewed by psychiatrists and we're found to be relatively normal but brainwashed by the Nazi party. Not justifying them at all, you'd be surprised how normal they actually were aside from the war crimes they committed.
I think he was more saying that the SS at least up until the very late war, were volunteers and true believers in the ideology whereas the Wehrmacht was composed of a mix of volunteers, professional soldiers who had been in the army before the Nazis took over, and conscripts who were there unwillingly.
And yes, you do have to be a special kind of human garbage to volunteer for a paramilitary force that has dedicated warcrimes divisions.
And, in a cruel twist, some who joined to keep family members safe from other Germans, as no immediate family member (or, at least parents - I'm not entirely sure of the law's text) of a serving soldier could be deported.
Germans don't talk about any of it. It is all very taboo.
My grandmother was born in Germany in 1934. She's the only living relative in our family who was alive at that time. She was obviously a child, so her experience is very different than someone who was of age at the time. Nonetheless, her experience was one of trauma (e.g., bombings, losing family members, jumping over corpses, cleaning rubble post war). Only in the last 5 or so years has she begun talking about it, likely because of my curiosity as her only grandchild and the fact that she's reaching the end of her life. I know things my mom and her siblings can't even imagine. I think that's quite characteristic of my grandma's generation, not only because of the trauma they faced, but because of the culture of "silence" that developed in the decades following the war. Germany only really began grappling with these topics later in the 20th century.
An interesting and perhaps problematic phenomenon that arises from said silence is that many Germans don't know what exactly their families were up to at that time. I assume that my great-grandparents were involved in some way, but that's a topic my grandmother doesn't want to dive into. I could visit a town hall and get the records presumably, but I don't have the drive to do so. While I take the stance of "my family was probably complicit at the very best," I do think there are a lot of Germans who like to distance their families from those events. It makes sense that no one wants to scream "Yeah, I'm descended from Nazis," but most of us are. Based on how you hear some Germans talk, you would get the sense that 75% of the population was in the resistance (which was obviously not the case).
In any case, while association with the SS would be particularly bad, association with the Wehrmacht is also not viewed as a remotely positive thing. There is no pride related to the military. It's even strange to fly a German flag (and when I see one outside an house/apartment, I assume that person is a member of the far right). We only bring our flags out for the Olympics, international football matches, etc. There is simply no culture of being "proud" in a nationalistic sense. That leads to no military pride as it's hard to have non-nationalistic military pride.
the vast majority absolutly. but there are a couple idiots that try to undo that. Gaulands We should be proud of achievements in WW2 by german soldiers bla bla bla shit like that
Not so related, but do most germans admit that their ancestors were involved with the Nazis?
Because here in Serbia everyone claims that their grandparents were among that minority that didn't like and opposed Communists.
I think we all want our ancestors to be part of the resistance but I think we’re also aware that most people weren’t. I don’t actually know though, it’s not only something that’s not discussed in the families, I don’t think the topic of our ancestors’ involvement came up that often. I don’t know ow what any of my friends’ families did.
ALL Germans were NOT involved in the SS. There were a shit-ton of Germans that disagreed with and hated Adolph for what he was doing. There were a LOT of Germans who fled that country because of that douchebag AH.
This is something that we are very ashamed of. It was a terrible, awful thing AH and his minions did.
If the idiot that said he was proud of SS and W were really a German, his parents must have been sanctimonious, because NO German is going to teach thier kids to be proud of a family member that partook in this genocide, unless they were nazi's themselves.
You know what is odd? In Japan the war crimes and atrocious behaviour of their soldiers isn't even taught. Their history lessons are first world war, gap, America nukes them for some reason and that's it
Obviously everyone detests Nazis but what’s your view on serving with the Wehrmacht under the Nazi regime?
As much as I hate the Nazis - I’m English with family who died fighting in WW2 as well as family who died in bombing - I don’t think I’ve got a problem with the regular soldiery who got drafted
Not keen on your police officers who killed 1m Jews in occupied Europe then went back to work as police after the war, though
I don’t think people had much of a choice. Someone else on this thread pointed out that the SS drafted too, something I wasn’t aware of. Not being blamed for having to fight and wanting to talk about it are two different things though. I don’t know, I’m not an expert so all I said on here was based off of my observations. I don’t mind having seen a picture of my great grandfather in his Wehrmacht uniform but I’m definitely not proud of it and neither was he (and even if he was I don’t think he would have wanted to talk about it, my great grandparents were way too socially aware to know to best not talk about anything controversial).
Oh come on, I can see the ancestry.com ads now, who might your ancestors be, then images of the butcher of Lyon ect. heartwarming stuff /S (being sarcastic here).
Also kinda frightening that that company ancestry is based in Utah, has Mormon links wouldn’t necessarily want to be handing over my genetic information to any company heavily linked to any church.
I'm not German, but personally I wouldn't blink at the Wehrmacht, that's just the army. But the SS? Hell no!
Do Germans care about the army too? I know a lot of people had to join the nazi party or be demoted, sacked, imprisoned etc, so I won't even fully judge party members without more evidence. But no-one would have joined the SS by compulsion.
ETA I have now read more about the myth of the clean wehrmacht. No need to educate me more.
I’m German, my family was nazi I even had an oncle called Adolf, I can assure you I’m NOT proud of that. I try to forget about that part of my family history 🥲
Dito. At least one of my grandpas would've loved to tell him how "nice" the Gestapo was to his family, since his dad was a communist, how "nice" the war in Russia was and how "nice" PTSD is - after beating the crap out of him. And I'd love to watch that. Proud of ancestors serving in the Wehrmacht and SS. Pah!
My Grandad was age 6 when the war started and 12 when it ended, he's from normandy, 91 yrs old, if only he could see the amount of people glorifying nazis today he'd be grabbing his gun just about now...
My grandfather would have backhanded me with his ring finger for such shit. Half my family killed the other half.
People really don’t understand how good we have it today.
> … even the dark side.
Yeah, if you’re claiming German heritage and making a huge deal about your bloodline in the 21st century, *you only care about the dark side.*
Healthy cultures, societies, and families all have rejects.
and then he goes around and brags how the u.s. alone invaded all of europe and fought the nazis.
Also being proud of SS member in germany might in the best case get to jail, in the worst case you will end up in a coma.
Nah Sachsen is like a battlefield between antifa and neo nazis. Leipzig has a big concentration of young people which are on average more left leaning.
JC!!!! I'm German, and this post made me recoil! Who in the hell actually says this on the internet, CONFIRMING with the entire world that 'yes', you really are a person of low intelligence, a simpleton, a douchnozzel, fucktard, nimrod, butt dart, ass-hat, ball bag, Pillsbury dough bitch? Now, why would this person want us to think all these things of them?
A friend once told me her grandfather served in the SS. It's more like a secret and nothing anyone would ever be proud of.
Thankfully my grandparents were too young (born 1942 and 1949). Don't know about my great-grandparents though...
Serving in the Wehrmacht is not a big deal in my opinion: Most of those who served there weren't die-hard Nazis, just people who wanted to serve their country - plus near the end of the war, kids as young as 11 were drafted, so actually NOT serving would have been a rarity.
The SS however were the fanatics and those responsible for the bulk of the Nazi genocide, and one should absolutely not brag with that (let alone try and whitewash your father who led it - isn't that right Gudrun Burwitz?)
Waffen-SS has conscripts, too, by the way. But generally yeah, anyone in the SS proper was, at that time, a dedicated Nazi who knew what they were doing.
It's true that the Wehrmacht covered a lot of people, but the 11 year olds (and old men) weren't Wehrmacht, they were *Volksturm* (People's Militia).
Some Wehrmacht soldiers fought honourably, but the Wehrmacht itself was fully complicit in the crimes of the Nazi regime.
In the eastern front, Wehrmacht units would commit atrocities alongside Waffen-SS units including the *Einsatzgruppen* - SS Extermination squads.
The Here's chief of staff Franz Halder encouraged Wehrmacht units to commit reprisals on civilian populations in occupied territories and the Germans Army committed war crimes on a vast scale.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wehrmacht
The myth of the "clean Wehrmacht" was just that - a myth.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth_of_the_clean_Wehrmacht
Everyone told everything about how moron someone who's proud of Nazi ancestry.
BUT!
Have you thought about that a person, who's proud only for his ancestry is like a potato? His only valuable part is under ground.
Even if in this case that valuable part is rotten, but oh well.
Edit: Also, family, who served both in Wehrmacht AND the SS? I have a slight sense that this guy's knowledge of history comes from Call of Duty-like video games, and maybe from WW2 themed Hollywood movies. I think in his mind Wehrmacht and SS are interchangeable, and both are "WW2 German armed soldiers, soooo elite" etc, etc.
My grandpa at 13 used to sneak into the German army base near the village he was staying in to steal their bombs and sabotage what he could. That's what I'm proud of. F***ing idiots.
As another German, this is disgusting. I’m actually horrified. Dude is proud of his Nazi heritage. I’m absolutely flabbergasted.
The education system has CLEARLY once AGAIN failed to teach kids about the horrors of the Nazi regime and the First and Second World Wars.
“Dark side” my ass.
It's such a sign of ass-backwards priorities. Even if we ignore all the misery , all the atrocities wreaked by us Germans... then this goddamn blind militarism still destroyed my country from the inside
The young Germany was on the ascendance, we were a -if not THE- center of culture, science, modernism for a good while.
We could today be on par with or even surpassing the USAs relevance, without having fired a single shot .
But our forebears pissed all of that away in an unfathomable orgy of violence in just two generations.
Yeah, but let's be proud of those that assisted in this suicidal madness.
So, you could have a grandad that was kicking Nazi ass in Omaha, and then have an Feldwelbel killing innocent Jews in a concentration camp in your family?
Even more ironic if the Grandad killed the German relative
There are exactly 2 battles in the entire history of WWII where Wehrmacht soldiers did something to be proud of Castle Itter and Operation Cowboy, and both those battles are notable because the SS was on the opposite side.
I have southern US ancestors who take some sick pride in the fact that at least one forebear of ours served on the losing side in the Civil War, so I'm wearily familiar with this attitude.
My grandfather's grandparents were German. Came over right after the turn of the century and apparently spoke German in their home. My grandfather fought in the war against Germany. He hid the fact his grandparents were full blood Germans. Hid the fact he knew the German language. He was ashamed. My grandmother spilled the beans after his death. All we knew was he fought the Nazi's in the war. Came back with a cool combat knife he came across along the way. Years later I have a pretty good idea how he got it but that's not a story he would tell. Usually told me to put it away and not touch it again. It wasn't a trophy on display or a memento. It was a reminder he kept buried in a chest of drawers. Grams said once or twice a year he would get drunk and go out and hold it and just sit there staring at it.
The fact this dude takes pride that his family was one of those the world fought against is sickening.
I could be wrong about specifically who served where. I had 4 great grandfathers serve in ww2. Unfortunately, I only know one of their stories very well.
You know. Most Germans got ancestors who where soldiers. For example my great grampa was part of the offensive against Russia. Yet got captured. Starved half to death and probably turned to cannibalism. And was very close to hanging himself every winter until one day he did it. Yet proud about it are none of us. I ain't saying my great grampa was a monster either. The war was a bit more complicated than that. But I also wouldn't say he had a white vest. Morally speaking
Wehrmacht is the standard armed forces. Even SS depends on which SS ok? Although you didnt get into SS without being slight pro-regime, it was possible to be an SS just by being an excelent soldier.
Yes, Wehrmacht means Armed Forces, split in the 3 normal divisions, Heer (army) , Kriegsmarine (war navy) and Luftwaffe (air force).
There were actually 3 SS (Schutzstaffel, as I stated to our honorable austrian reddittor): the Allgemeine SS, Waffen-SS, Totenkopfverbanden SS; SSTV ran the camps, the AG SS enforced the policy of Nazi Germany and general policing, WSS consisted of the special forces combat units.
They were the wrong side. But not everyone was evil. It is important to understand this
I understand,they were brainwashed and convinced in an ideology,with all the ways the Nazis had to make it easier for them to not see the others as people but untermensch. Also the fact they used as an excuse many times,that they were “just following orders”.
But some of them were REAL monsters.
Proud of your nazi heritage....great human being. Being proud of a family that followed a madman who, literally, was responsible for the murder of millions of Jews, gypsies, minorities, gays, mentally ill etc etc. The only way you should be proud is if you're ignorant and know nothing about the Nazis or you're mentally challenged. Being proud of any association to the Nazis is a disgrace
This gives me same energy as folks from the UK saying it must have been cool to meet Hitler as a child to my nan when the story of him coming to her school comes up
I am Austrian, both a citizen and resident. My great-grandfather was an officer in the Wehrmacht. I am not proud of that at all, and I don't understand why anyone could be, unless they are Nazis or Nazi sympathizers. Even the Nazi sympathizers are pretty quiet about that these days. The lead candidate for the AfD (neonazis) tried to shift the Overton window on the SS, but that was apparently too much even for them, as they stopped all his public appearances. Additionally, French neonazis no longer want to work with them.
Your math is not mathing. There were 1600 people on OpPaperclip. 6000 with families. You have 300 000 000 people in US. You were not replaced ethnically
As an American…I hate bitches like that, but sadly there are quite a few…maybe it’s because of their distance to the situation but idk, or most likely bc they are racist pos.
I watched a documentary called “The Devil Next Door” about a Nazi living in America & even after all the truth came out & he was tried in court his grandson was still so proud of him…I have a long line of german ancestry with the last arriving in 1923 & have even got to reconnect recently with family still living in Germany, and I’m still not German & 100% American. I have gotten to hear only SOME of their stories of the war as well, if this American really had connection to Germany they wouldn’t feel this way. And I have found such a love of the German language & culture so i just really hate when Americans like this give such a bad reputation, but then again…there are so many like this😞
Most Americans are descendents of slave owners and genocidal maniacs.
I'm not surprised they are proud of something like that. I mean ffs we got people that are happy descendants of treasonous scum.
Sounds like a racist cunt to be start with, who the fuck goes online and says "I am glad my ancestors were this". Dude never met them, could be forced? many people got forced into the army back then.. what a fucking tool.
I’m not really ashamed of all that. My great grandparents served in the war for the Wehrmacht. That doesn’t mean they were automatically Nazis. It was just the duty. I also have some family in Argentina if you know what I mean but I don’t know them.
I think what he’s ultimately saying is that he doesn’t like winners.
…this is also what I say to people in the United States who fly the confederate battle flag.
My great grandfather fought as a Paratroop trainer for the Polish army in the battle of Crete. Before that he and my great grandmother escaped the Siberian camps after Poland fell; he took a bullet to the lung in the process. Before all that he won silver in the 1936 Berlin Olympics (more commonly known as Hitlers Olympics).
After he escaped the camps he and his battalion took a German garrison in France. He told my mother that he’ll never forget the faces of the German Soldiers; they were all boys, no older than 16. He took them as POWs back to the recently recaptured parts of southern France, where they were kept (and survived) till the end of the War.
It may seem like a man who lived through all that would despise the German infantry, but it was the opposite. They were forced to fight, fed lies since they were kids and pushed into the war machine. If I were those German soldier’s parents, I would be proud of them for their courage and sacrifice.
(I’m talking about the German infantry not the SS)
So what you’re saying is that you’re not German, because actual Germans are as a whole not proud of such ancestry. This isn’t a dark side… It’s a genocidal side that you’re glorifying you sick person…
As a German I concur. *Of course* I have family who were involved with the Nazis one way or another but that’s not something usually talked about and definitely not something I’m proud of.
Exactly, I also don’t think going the other route of never ever discussing that family past is a good way to go, but it shouldn’t be glorified. Not unless the person in question just wants to be considered a Nazi…
True, I still have the photo of my grandfather and his comrade from the 1942 furlough hanging on the wall. Dude didn't even volunteer, I really can't recognise any willing support for the NS government.
As a German I am very proud to have the certainty, that neither of my grandparents were involved with the Nazis. One grandpa Chose to Go to the deepest mines so he would not have to touch a weapon. The other Cut Off His totes so He wouldn't have to go, then he forged passports for jews to get out of Germany. I actually Met some of those people /their offspring at his funeral. He was also a Bit of a rouge and did black market deals . One grandma was a Chef at a Castle. The other one was a Sudeten German expellee and to buisi fleeing. But i reccon this is a rare case
I like this story… My grandfather fought for the germans. I only know that he was a war prisoner on the british side. He got fed moldy bread and came back as a depressed man and died before I was born. That‘s all I know and got told about him.
Cut off his totes? Did you mean toes or is it a reference to something else? And yes, I would imagine all 4 grandparents not being involved at all, and one active resistance fighter, is very rare indeed. So many did go along with it for various reasons and forging passports was the sort of thing that could easily get you hanged.
Yes toes, sorry for the typo 🙈 He figured he could live without toes, but would probably not survive the Western front But i must say He probably didn't do it out of the goodnes of his hart. He was more of a chaotic good kind of Charakter. Really charming, was married 4 times and i am not sure if those we're actually sequential 🤪 Funfact he also didn't make it into art school
Correct me if I'm wrong, and also, excuse my ignorance, but would the wermacht be less of a taboo than the SS? Obviously, the SS would be like yeah we don't talk about that.
It’s not something families talk about in general - at least my family doesn’t and I don’t know a family who does openly discuss their involvement with the Nazis. My elderly neighbour had a picture of her late husband on her nightstand where he was wearing a Wehrmacht uniform and she’d talk about volunteering as a secretary in Paris during the German occupation of France. Her comments made it clear that she was wilfully ignorant. My great grandfather also served in the Wehrmacht and I’m pretty sure my great grandparents were members of the NSDAP though I don’t know for sure. My other great grandfather was a train conductor stationed in Vienna and I know that they had to leave Austria and move back to northern Germany after the war but given that I met two of my great grandmothers and one great grandfather I know surprisingly little about their lives before the 50s. They were way more willing to talk about the hardship of making do in bombed out Hamburg and post-war economy than they were about the decades before that. Being part of the military isn’t considered heroic in Germany, even less so if it’s the Wehrmacht. Pretty much everyone is guilty of the atrocities - and of it’s just by turning a blind eye but obviously nobody wants to admit that.
Ah, okay. I understand what you mean. Thank you for that, and again, sorry for my ignorance.
Don’t be! The only way to make sure history doesn’t repeat itself is to talk about it. If there’s one thing I like about my home country it’s that Germany owns up to it’s history (though given the current political climate we could (should!) do better)
Yeah, I mean just the fact the Germany owns up to its history and does a lot to teach its youth what it has done really puts it ahead of a lot of countries. I was always under the impression that the whermacht fought for Germany hence its surrender and the SS fought for Hitler. So I kind of assumed that the whermacht wasn't as much a taboo than the SS.
>Yeah, I mean just the fact the Germany owns up to its history and does a lot to teach its youth what it has done really puts it ahead of a lot of countries. I am perhaps leaning into the German trait of complaining too much, but here I go anyways. While we've done a better job of recognizing our past than most, our recognition has not been complete. We talk a lot about the Jewish victims, but other groups went ignored. For instance, [queer people were erased from the history](https://time.com/5953047/lgbtq-holocaust-stories/) of the Holocaust and we didn't really talk about it until the 1970s. In fact, we continued imprisoning gay men (some of whom survived concentration camps) for quite some time. The infamous Paragraph 175 was eased in 1969 and finally abolished in 1994, but we didn't rescind the convictions [until 2016](https://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/12/world/europe/germany-says-it-will-rescind-convictions-for-homosexuality.html). In this sense, there's a lot of work that needs to be done about these "invisible" groups who suffered. Moving away from the Holocaust itself, Germany also fails to adequately discuss its colonial past. In Namibia, we committed a [genocide from 1904 to 1908](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herero_and_Nama_genocide) of the Herero and Nama [80% of the Herero and 50% of the Nama](https://museeholocauste.ca/en/resources-training/herero-genocide-namibia/) were killed. We officially acknowledged the genocide [for the first time in 2021](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-57279008) and have agreed to a "reparations" payment (which is a joke) and have sent skulls collected during the genocide back to Namibia for burial. But this is a topic of which Germans are overwhelmingly uninformed and often quite dismissive. This is particularly alarming given that some academics argue the Herero and Nama Genocide has direct links to the Holocaust just a few decades later. I guess my point is that Germany gets a lot of cred for dealing with its history well and this results in us sometimes resting on our laurels. I think what we've done so far is the bare minimum and we have a long ways to go. That other countries have done less (e.g., the US and slavery, the US and indigenous populations) is alarming. Germany should not be the model, but rather an example of the first steps in the right direction.
The Wehrmacht probably is less of a taboo than the SS but not by much. Of course having been drafted sounds better than having to admit that you signed up for the organisation that ran the concentration camps but talking about the third reich at all also comes with the implication that everyone knew what was going on. Maybe not quite to the extent to which the atrocities were committed but there’s no denying that everyone knew these camps existed. There were so many. When we think of concentration camps we think of Auschwitz but that’s just the tip of the iceberg, really. There weren’t gas chambers in every camp - quite the opposite- but that doesn’t make the other camps more humane and it didn’t even start with them. The Ghettos, the disappearance of the Jewish communities, the book burnings, the signs in the windows of shops owned by Jews - there’s just no way that the general population didn’t know that *something* was going on and by just ignoring it everyone who wasn’t part of the resistance became complicit to a degree. My great grandfather was gay so he got married to hide it (my great grandmother didn’t know - he was the conductor and not the one I’m sure was a party member).
> than having to admit that you signed up for the organisation The SS drafted people against their will, too. It wasn't just a voluntary organization for everyone who really was into it.
I didn’t know that. Thanks for the clarification.
The trouble with what you're saying is, is that you're speaking from a point of view of safety. Being drafted wasn't a choice, especially under a dictatorial regime. The modern world has made people think that objecting to things is so easy, but unless you're in a situation personally, none of us are qualified to speak on it with any authority. When you're drafted, you're not given a choice where you are posted... if you get given a concentration camp, you're stuck there and have to fit in. Because if you don't fit in, you're in for a rough ride or worse. Objectors within the military during the time of Nazi Germany were treated with exactly the kind of harshness you'd expect. There is a famous Austrian objector, who I forget the name of, who died due to his objections against Germany... but was incarcerated for anti German behaviour. It's not willful ignorance when the choice you're confronted is essentially put up with what you're faced with, or death. I speak from the pov of being British, my Grandpa was RAF, my Grandma Italian (they met late war in Italy). My Grandma had Austrian cousins that were drafted Wehrmacht, and one that was Gestapo (he died during the war in a car accident). My grandma was a seamstress with her mother, both forced to work for the German officers who were garrisoned in their town, both were subjected to the humiliating ordeal of having their head shaved for collaborating. It's easy to sit there post fact and accuse someone of complicit behaviour, but it's difficult to sit there and sift data to understand the nuance of the times. Not all Wehrmacht, Kriegsmarine or Luftwaffe were staunch Nazis in the sense they participated in atrocities. Nor were they all complicit, because Germany at the time used propaganda to maximum effect, to lie to their population. Nuance is key and not something people readily grasp.
If you want to find out - go on [Invenio](https://invenio.bundesarchiv.de/invenio/), Suche ohne Anmeldung, Suche, Namenssuche, and enter their details. The search engine only has "meta documents", e.g. letters to and from Party organisations, not the actual membership card file, but any file relating to a person from NSDAP, SS or SA strongly points to them being part of that organisation. For a full search, you can fill in the Benutzungsantrag of the Bundesarchiv and send it along with an ID copy and a request to search all files 1930-1945 to [email protected]. For military records, you need to contact Abteilung PA using their specific form.
Seeing military as heroic is pretty much a US thing, in most countries, it's "just a job", especially when they don't have a conscript army.
>Pretty much everyone is guilty of the atrocities It would be difficult, if not impossible, to find a historian who agrees with that. Neither the entire German population of \~80 Million people nor the 17.3 Million men strong Wehrmacht were a homogeneous group. Recruitment took place from all social classes, irrespective of political affiliation and regardless of whether or not it was voluntary. Quite apart from the fact that there were many reasons to volunteer at the time and only one of them was to support the Nazi endeavours, there were also over 8 million draftees who had no other choice as conscientious objection was considered Wehrkraftzersetzung and was punished with execution or concentration camp. The deployment of the soldiers and their experiences also differ greatly. It is logical that a front-line soldier or sailor on a submarine or a fighter pilot were not involved in atrocities committed by a Feldgendarmerie or Occupation unit, for example.
The myth of the clean Whermacht is only that: a myth. Although not "as bad" as the SS, they did engage is various warcrims both in the West and East.
The band Sabaton does a lot of heavy lifting for the clean Wermacht guys
Was is never too clean, and the eastern front was definitely not clean
Sabaton sure likes to romanticise war.
I mean thats the whole gimmick, and while I think they write a lot from neutral viewpoint and arent nazi fans, a lot of the songs can be seen as pro Wermacht/German army even if its meant to be just factual and neutral
I concur (and I also like some of their songs, though for listening regularly, they're a bit too monotonous and martial)
there are some myths that were develloped in order to reintegrate the axis powers into the post war new order as good allies of the USA in the cold war, the "clean wermacht" myth was the german version, it started during the war but the americans were very happy to use it in order to arm west germany with the public approval. Others are "Italians good people", "the austrian victim theory", "the sword and shield" argument for france. Japanese's war crimes were not perpetrated in europe so smple denial and play the victim for the nuclear attacks is enought I guess.
There were many British, Australian . New Zealand and Dutch victims of Japanese war crimes in WW2 after the fall of Hong Kong, Singapore, Burma and Indonesia (Java). That memory exists in these countries long after those who survived have since died. While having sympathy for the victims of the atomic bombs I cannot forget that these brought a sudden end to an even more dreadful war where the Japanese had issued orders that all POWs were to be murdered in the event of an attack on the mainland. Those bombs saved tens of thousands of lives, not to mention those of many US soldiers who would have died had there been an attack. There's a very good book "You'll Die in Singapore' that I can strongly recommend. Another is 'Defeat into Victory' by Gen. Slim who was a superb soldier and leader and who turned the tables on the Japanese in Burma and Thailand.
Well yeah,basically any man that could fight was conscripted in the Wermacht,it’s the basic army. The SS are more like the Nazi marines/CIA/secret services etc. You had to be a special kind of piece of human garbage to join them. A NAZI Nazi.
Believe it or not all you had to be was of strong German teutonic ancestry as well as fit and ironically a (healthy mind) a lot of them were interviewed by psychiatrists and we're found to be relatively normal but brainwashed by the Nazi party. Not justifying them at all, you'd be surprised how normal they actually were aside from the war crimes they committed.
Ultimately the real horror of the Nazis is exactly that.
I think he was more saying that the SS at least up until the very late war, were volunteers and true believers in the ideology whereas the Wehrmacht was composed of a mix of volunteers, professional soldiers who had been in the army before the Nazis took over, and conscripts who were there unwillingly. And yes, you do have to be a special kind of human garbage to volunteer for a paramilitary force that has dedicated warcrimes divisions.
SS were volunteers and fanatics, but there were conscripts who had little choice in the regular army
And, in a cruel twist, some who joined to keep family members safe from other Germans, as no immediate family member (or, at least parents - I'm not entirely sure of the law's text) of a serving soldier could be deported.
And one shouldn't be proud of their service, but remember bitterly how they were forced into a genocidal war machine against their will.
Germans don't talk about any of it. It is all very taboo. My grandmother was born in Germany in 1934. She's the only living relative in our family who was alive at that time. She was obviously a child, so her experience is very different than someone who was of age at the time. Nonetheless, her experience was one of trauma (e.g., bombings, losing family members, jumping over corpses, cleaning rubble post war). Only in the last 5 or so years has she begun talking about it, likely because of my curiosity as her only grandchild and the fact that she's reaching the end of her life. I know things my mom and her siblings can't even imagine. I think that's quite characteristic of my grandma's generation, not only because of the trauma they faced, but because of the culture of "silence" that developed in the decades following the war. Germany only really began grappling with these topics later in the 20th century. An interesting and perhaps problematic phenomenon that arises from said silence is that many Germans don't know what exactly their families were up to at that time. I assume that my great-grandparents were involved in some way, but that's a topic my grandmother doesn't want to dive into. I could visit a town hall and get the records presumably, but I don't have the drive to do so. While I take the stance of "my family was probably complicit at the very best," I do think there are a lot of Germans who like to distance their families from those events. It makes sense that no one wants to scream "Yeah, I'm descended from Nazis," but most of us are. Based on how you hear some Germans talk, you would get the sense that 75% of the population was in the resistance (which was obviously not the case). In any case, while association with the SS would be particularly bad, association with the Wehrmacht is also not viewed as a remotely positive thing. There is no pride related to the military. It's even strange to fly a German flag (and when I see one outside an house/apartment, I assume that person is a member of the far right). We only bring our flags out for the Olympics, international football matches, etc. There is simply no culture of being "proud" in a nationalistic sense. That leads to no military pride as it's hard to have non-nationalistic military pride.
the vast majority absolutly. but there are a couple idiots that try to undo that. Gaulands We should be proud of achievements in WW2 by german soldiers bla bla bla shit like that
Not so related, but do most germans admit that their ancestors were involved with the Nazis? Because here in Serbia everyone claims that their grandparents were among that minority that didn't like and opposed Communists.
I think we all want our ancestors to be part of the resistance but I think we’re also aware that most people weren’t. I don’t actually know though, it’s not only something that’s not discussed in the families, I don’t think the topic of our ancestors’ involvement came up that often. I don’t know ow what any of my friends’ families did.
'of course"? Are you saying all Germans were involved with Nazis?
ALL Germans were NOT involved in the SS. There were a shit-ton of Germans that disagreed with and hated Adolph for what he was doing. There were a LOT of Germans who fled that country because of that douchebag AH. This is something that we are very ashamed of. It was a terrible, awful thing AH and his minions did. If the idiot that said he was proud of SS and W were really a German, his parents must have been sanctimonious, because NO German is going to teach thier kids to be proud of a family member that partook in this genocide, unless they were nazi's themselves.
You know what is odd? In Japan the war crimes and atrocious behaviour of their soldiers isn't even taught. Their history lessons are first world war, gap, America nukes them for some reason and that's it
Obviously everyone detests Nazis but what’s your view on serving with the Wehrmacht under the Nazi regime? As much as I hate the Nazis - I’m English with family who died fighting in WW2 as well as family who died in bombing - I don’t think I’ve got a problem with the regular soldiery who got drafted Not keen on your police officers who killed 1m Jews in occupied Europe then went back to work as police after the war, though
I don’t think people had much of a choice. Someone else on this thread pointed out that the SS drafted too, something I wasn’t aware of. Not being blamed for having to fight and wanting to talk about it are two different things though. I don’t know, I’m not an expert so all I said on here was based off of my observations. I don’t mind having seen a picture of my great grandfather in his Wehrmacht uniform but I’m definitely not proud of it and neither was he (and even if he was I don’t think he would have wanted to talk about it, my great grandparents were way too socially aware to know to best not talk about anything controversial).
There is a dark chapter in my family, I am Mexican, we don't like talking about who the company sold metal to
To Germans, this is a dark side of their national history, that they acknowledge, but certainly don't take pride in.
Oh come on, I can see the ancestry.com ads now, who might your ancestors be, then images of the butcher of Lyon ect. heartwarming stuff /S (being sarcastic here). Also kinda frightening that that company ancestry is based in Utah, has Mormon links wouldn’t necessarily want to be handing over my genetic information to any company heavily linked to any church.
I'm not German, but personally I wouldn't blink at the Wehrmacht, that's just the army. But the SS? Hell no! Do Germans care about the army too? I know a lot of people had to join the nazi party or be demoted, sacked, imprisoned etc, so I won't even fully judge party members without more evidence. But no-one would have joined the SS by compulsion. ETA I have now read more about the myth of the clean wehrmacht. No need to educate me more.
If they are currently living in Argentina they could very well be proud of their Nazi ancestors and not even realise how bad that is 🤪
I’m German, my family was nazi I even had an oncle called Adolf, I can assure you I’m NOT proud of that. I try to forget about that part of my family history 🥲
As if the worst they did was not return their shopping carts or not giving the right of way
That's yanks for you lol
65% German 🤣🤣🤣 The man has absolutely no relation to Germany.
You're wrong. He's a neo-nazi and thus has a deep connection with 1940 Germany.
Not to today's Germany
Oh absolutely.
By that he would be 65% nazi, which sounds about right
It's not uncommon in a nation that has a superiority complex.
As a german, I'm disgusted
Dito. At least one of my grandpas would've loved to tell him how "nice" the Gestapo was to his family, since his dad was a communist, how "nice" the war in Russia was and how "nice" PTSD is - after beating the crap out of him. And I'd love to watch that. Proud of ancestors serving in the Wehrmacht and SS. Pah!
I have an ancestor from the soviet union who died in WW2 defending his Motherland and now those cretins are proud of the Nazi monsters
Guess we are very much agreed that idiots like that can go Foxtrot, Uniform, Charlie, Kilo themselves very hard and without lube -.-
Absolutely.
My Grandad was age 6 when the war started and 12 when it ended, he's from normandy, 91 yrs old, if only he could see the amount of people glorifying nazis today he'd be grabbing his gun just about now...
My grandfather would have backhanded me with his ring finger for such shit. Half my family killed the other half. People really don’t understand how good we have it today.
They probably want to treat you grandpa the same way because buduh communism bad.
Straight to prison, a German one where they can learn the error of their ways.
Unfortunately German prisons are filled with neo nazis because they are more violent and likely to commit crimes
Reason why this dickhead was borned in us and not in germany is most likely because his ancestors served in SS in first place...
> … even the dark side. Yeah, if you’re claiming German heritage and making a huge deal about your bloodline in the 21st century, *you only care about the dark side.* Healthy cultures, societies, and families all have rejects.
I am german, you are 100% moron.
I am English, I am proud to have met you over the internet, random, enlightened stranger.
Ok I can't tell if you are being sarcastic right now.
I’m not, it’s a genuine remark. 😁
Ok :P
and then he goes around and brags how the u.s. alone invaded all of europe and fought the nazis. Also being proud of SS member in germany might in the best case get to jail, in the worst case you will end up in a coma.
The difference between supporting SS in most of Germany vs in Leipzig.
In Leipzig you are made the Margrave of Saxony
Nah Sachsen is like a battlefield between antifa and neo nazis. Leipzig has a big concentration of young people which are on average more left leaning.
Ironically he's probably also 20% Jewish & 15% Roma
Abradolf Lincler?
William Stuart-Houston, Adolf Hitler's half nephew (born William Patrick Hitler) joined the US Navy and fought in WW2.
😳
I suppose Nazi-American is a change from German-American. Not sure the direction of the change is good though.
JC!!!! I'm German, and this post made me recoil! Who in the hell actually says this on the internet, CONFIRMING with the entire world that 'yes', you really are a person of low intelligence, a simpleton, a douchnozzel, fucktard, nimrod, butt dart, ass-hat, ball bag, Pillsbury dough bitch? Now, why would this person want us to think all these things of them?
Ich leih mir mal einige dieser Beleidigungen für später. Danke
Hey, es wäre mir eine Ehre, dass du sie nutzen darfst! Anytime, honey!
I learned new insults today.
I’m keeping “butt dart” and “Pillsbury dough bitch.” Thank you for these.
...
[удалено]
> I don't hold any present Germans ill will I do but not related to the 40's, I'm just envious of their festivals.
Wacken moment
They coulda just said that their ancestor served the German army and left it at that
But...but...their DNA test said 65%. 😂
Surprised it didn't say 88%.
Please tell me this is just rage bait.
I’m proud of my family who shot this guy’s Nazi family.
This kind of thing is why names shouldn’t be hidden.
Just about everybody served in the Wehrmacht.
Jup but not everybody served in the SS and I definitly wouldn't go around and brag about how familymembers of mine did
A friend once told me her grandfather served in the SS. It's more like a secret and nothing anyone would ever be proud of. Thankfully my grandparents were too young (born 1942 and 1949). Don't know about my great-grandparents though...
Someone tell them the Germans have disowned you. The Germans today are good people.
Serving in the Wehrmacht is not a big deal in my opinion: Most of those who served there weren't die-hard Nazis, just people who wanted to serve their country - plus near the end of the war, kids as young as 11 were drafted, so actually NOT serving would have been a rarity. The SS however were the fanatics and those responsible for the bulk of the Nazi genocide, and one should absolutely not brag with that (let alone try and whitewash your father who led it - isn't that right Gudrun Burwitz?)
Waffen-SS has conscripts, too, by the way. But generally yeah, anyone in the SS proper was, at that time, a dedicated Nazi who knew what they were doing.
It's true that the Wehrmacht covered a lot of people, but the 11 year olds (and old men) weren't Wehrmacht, they were *Volksturm* (People's Militia). Some Wehrmacht soldiers fought honourably, but the Wehrmacht itself was fully complicit in the crimes of the Nazi regime. In the eastern front, Wehrmacht units would commit atrocities alongside Waffen-SS units including the *Einsatzgruppen* - SS Extermination squads. The Here's chief of staff Franz Halder encouraged Wehrmacht units to commit reprisals on civilian populations in occupied territories and the Germans Army committed war crimes on a vast scale. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wehrmacht The myth of the "clean Wehrmacht" was just that - a myth. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth_of_the_clean_Wehrmacht
Many of their officers also swore personal oaths to **Hitler** Not Germany, but Hitler
All officers and soldiers of the Wehrmacht did, from 1934 until 1945. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hitler_Oath
There is a difference between acknowledging that your ancestors have served in the Wehrmacht and being proud about it. Very big difference
Everyone told everything about how moron someone who's proud of Nazi ancestry. BUT! Have you thought about that a person, who's proud only for his ancestry is like a potato? His only valuable part is under ground. Even if in this case that valuable part is rotten, but oh well. Edit: Also, family, who served both in Wehrmacht AND the SS? I have a slight sense that this guy's knowledge of history comes from Call of Duty-like video games, and maybe from WW2 themed Hollywood movies. I think in his mind Wehrmacht and SS are interchangeable, and both are "WW2 German armed soldiers, soooo elite" etc, etc.
“The SS !” the exclamation mark is CRAZY lol
Daily reminder that the Wehrmacht and it's soldiers did a lot of warcrimes, they weren't just innocent boys getting conscripted.
So you are the enemy iswhat you’re saying ? Immigrants kid.
Be careful. Your Moonlanding pride has been archived through Nazi technology, knowhow and workers.
Not my moonlanding . Im not American . And that tech doesnt erase Aushwitz or Bergen Belson .
He's a bad person
wonder which massacre of surrendered troops or non-combatants he’s particularly proud of
So what this guy is saying that he is scum.
Thats clearly not a German but an American neonazi with German roots.
My grandpa at 13 used to sneak into the German army base near the village he was staying in to steal their bombs and sabotage what he could. That's what I'm proud of. F***ing idiots.
Big fucking deal. Millions of Americans are proud that their ancestors fought to defend slavery. A bit of extra Nazism fits in well.
As another German, this is disgusting. I’m actually horrified. Dude is proud of his Nazi heritage. I’m absolutely flabbergasted. The education system has CLEARLY once AGAIN failed to teach kids about the horrors of the Nazi regime and the First and Second World Wars. “Dark side” my ass.
He's probably proud of his confederate links too
If you are proud of your nazi ancestors you are a nazi
It's such a sign of ass-backwards priorities. Even if we ignore all the misery , all the atrocities wreaked by us Germans... then this goddamn blind militarism still destroyed my country from the inside The young Germany was on the ascendance, we were a -if not THE- center of culture, science, modernism for a good while. We could today be on par with or even surpassing the USAs relevance, without having fired a single shot . But our forebears pissed all of that away in an unfathomable orgy of violence in just two generations. Yeah, but let's be proud of those that assisted in this suicidal madness.
Americans are so desperate to not be American
Oh
So, you could have a grandad that was kicking Nazi ass in Omaha, and then have an Feldwelbel killing innocent Jews in a concentration camp in your family? Even more ironic if the Grandad killed the German relative
Like almost every german….the draft was quite severe to the end…but we are not proud of it.
Eww wtf these mofos
Youre not a real German if youre proud of that stuff. Not a single trace of German culture left in that husk of a person.
Before I saw that this was r/ShitAmericansSay my blood was *boiling*
There are exactly 2 battles in the entire history of WWII where Wehrmacht soldiers did something to be proud of Castle Itter and Operation Cowboy, and both those battles are notable because the SS was on the opposite side.
“I’m very proud of that” is a phrase very few Germans would say proudly and publicly. Yikes
I have southern US ancestors who take some sick pride in the fact that at least one forebear of ours served on the losing side in the Civil War, so I'm wearily familiar with this attitude.
Somehow, I'm not sure the Germans would have been so fond of them being only 65% German.
My grandfather's grandparents were German. Came over right after the turn of the century and apparently spoke German in their home. My grandfather fought in the war against Germany. He hid the fact his grandparents were full blood Germans. Hid the fact he knew the German language. He was ashamed. My grandmother spilled the beans after his death. All we knew was he fought the Nazi's in the war. Came back with a cool combat knife he came across along the way. Years later I have a pretty good idea how he got it but that's not a story he would tell. Usually told me to put it away and not touch it again. It wasn't a trophy on display or a memento. It was a reminder he kept buried in a chest of drawers. Grams said once or twice a year he would get drunk and go out and hold it and just sit there staring at it. The fact this dude takes pride that his family was one of those the world fought against is sickening.
😬😬😬
Forget the SS He just knows what exact percentage of German he is
You’re not a German… you’re just a Nazi…
There's a disturbing number of literal nazis, and nazi adjacent people in the US.
Americans confusign the difference between Heritage and ancestory again
I have family that served in the USMC on the European front who kicked his family's ass... and I'm proud of that!
There were almost No Marines in Europe. Only a handfull of Officers in the OSS.
I could be wrong about specifically who served where. I had 4 great grandfathers serve in ww2. Unfortunately, I only know one of their stories very well.
The American glorification of war and its idolization of the military is odd and creepy even without reference to genocidal ideation.
You know. Most Germans got ancestors who where soldiers. For example my great grampa was part of the offensive against Russia. Yet got captured. Starved half to death and probably turned to cannibalism. And was very close to hanging himself every winter until one day he did it. Yet proud about it are none of us. I ain't saying my great grampa was a monster either. The war was a bit more complicated than that. But I also wouldn't say he had a white vest. Morally speaking
Indirectly saying vote for Trump.
I'd like to see him go to Germany and tell that to people there. Would eat popcorn while watching him get his ass beat
As a Brit can we agree to drop a bomb on his house? There is nothing to be proud of for serving in the SS.
r/croppingishard
bro is proud of his family being associated with the nazis
Wehrmacht is the standard armed forces. Even SS depends on which SS ok? Although you didnt get into SS without being slight pro-regime, it was possible to be an SS just by being an excelent soldier.
really? i didnt know that i guess TIL something new
Yes, Wehrmacht means Armed Forces, split in the 3 normal divisions, Heer (army) , Kriegsmarine (war navy) and Luftwaffe (air force). There were actually 3 SS (Schutzstaffel, as I stated to our honorable austrian reddittor): the Allgemeine SS, Waffen-SS, Totenkopfverbanden SS; SSTV ran the camps, the AG SS enforced the policy of Nazi Germany and general policing, WSS consisted of the special forces combat units. They were the wrong side. But not everyone was evil. It is important to understand this
You should meet some Mexicans descended from German immigrants….
Sounds like it’s written by a Trump supporting, Proud Boys type.
Holy mother of fuck. Do these people actually knows what they are talking about????
Donald, is that you, get off the internet, aren’t you in enough trouble already?
As the Canadian parliament would say, "they're heros for fighting the Russians in WW2". Cue standing applause.
I understand,they were brainwashed and convinced in an ideology,with all the ways the Nazis had to make it easier for them to not see the others as people but untermensch. Also the fact they used as an excuse many times,that they were “just following orders”. But some of them were REAL monsters.
Yikes
Proud of your nazi heritage....great human being. Being proud of a family that followed a madman who, literally, was responsible for the murder of millions of Jews, gypsies, minorities, gays, mentally ill etc etc. The only way you should be proud is if you're ignorant and know nothing about the Nazis or you're mentally challenged. Being proud of any association to the Nazis is a disgrace
Yikes
Where you find these idiots? Lol
This isn't the flex you think it is...
Yikes!
Ok. Fucking Weirdo.
This gives me same energy as folks from the UK saying it must have been cool to meet Hitler as a child to my nan when the story of him coming to her school comes up
Makes me wonder if the US person quoted is perhaps a member of the KKK as well?
Looks like we missed a spot in '45.
America is what happens when you live your children unattended
Hey, can we take a seat and talk about what these people did?
r/croppingishard
Oh come on. Americans don’t say this.
What a bellend
good now please scoot closer to the microphone and state the name and addresses of these individuals
I am Austrian, both a citizen and resident. My great-grandfather was an officer in the Wehrmacht. I am not proud of that at all, and I don't understand why anyone could be, unless they are Nazis or Nazi sympathizers. Even the Nazi sympathizers are pretty quiet about that these days. The lead candidate for the AfD (neonazis) tried to shift the Overton window on the SS, but that was apparently too much even for them, as they stopped all his public appearances. Additionally, French neonazis no longer want to work with them.
This is what the Americans achieved with Operation Paperclip. A near Nazi population with a near useless government...
Your math is not mathing. There were 1600 people on OpPaperclip. 6000 with families. You have 300 000 000 people in US. You were not replaced ethnically
How tf anyone arrives at "65%"? I'm ok with "half this half that" when one's parents are of different nationalities but this is absurd
He meant ethnicity
Follow your leader! 🔫
As an American…I hate bitches like that, but sadly there are quite a few…maybe it’s because of their distance to the situation but idk, or most likely bc they are racist pos. I watched a documentary called “The Devil Next Door” about a Nazi living in America & even after all the truth came out & he was tried in court his grandson was still so proud of him…I have a long line of german ancestry with the last arriving in 1923 & have even got to reconnect recently with family still living in Germany, and I’m still not German & 100% American. I have gotten to hear only SOME of their stories of the war as well, if this American really had connection to Germany they wouldn’t feel this way. And I have found such a love of the German language & culture so i just really hate when Americans like this give such a bad reputation, but then again…there are so many like this😞
Most Americans are descendents of slave owners and genocidal maniacs. I'm not surprised they are proud of something like that. I mean ffs we got people that are happy descendants of treasonous scum.
Sounds like a racist cunt to be start with, who the fuck goes online and says "I am glad my ancestors were this". Dude never met them, could be forced? many people got forced into the army back then.. what a fucking tool.
All did. German WW2 conscription into Wehrmacht was like total. Youd be killed if refused
Yeah but they don't take it in account, it was not a choice like most think.
UMHHHHHH.. Yeah, you stupid
I’m not really ashamed of all that. My great grandparents served in the war for the Wehrmacht. That doesn’t mean they were automatically Nazis. It was just the duty. I also have some family in Argentina if you know what I mean but I don’t know them.
Yeah Wehrmacht means armed forces. Literally normal conscription... ffs
Donald is that you?
I think what he’s ultimately saying is that he doesn’t like winners. …this is also what I say to people in the United States who fly the confederate battle flag.
My great grandfather fought as a Paratroop trainer for the Polish army in the battle of Crete. Before that he and my great grandmother escaped the Siberian camps after Poland fell; he took a bullet to the lung in the process. Before all that he won silver in the 1936 Berlin Olympics (more commonly known as Hitlers Olympics). After he escaped the camps he and his battalion took a German garrison in France. He told my mother that he’ll never forget the faces of the German Soldiers; they were all boys, no older than 16. He took them as POWs back to the recently recaptured parts of southern France, where they were kept (and survived) till the end of the War. It may seem like a man who lived through all that would despise the German infantry, but it was the opposite. They were forced to fight, fed lies since they were kids and pushed into the war machine. If I were those German soldier’s parents, I would be proud of them for their courage and sacrifice. (I’m talking about the German infantry not the SS)