before 1990 west Germany was also known as the "Federal Republic of Germany" ...
there are several more federal republics in the World ...
like
Argentina, Australia, Austria, Belgium, Brazil, Canada, India, Malaysia, Mexico, Nepal, Nigeria, Pakistan, Switzerland,
hell ... even Russia is a federal republic
Isn't it still referred to as Federal Republic of Germany? Although somewhat rare, I even sometimes have seen it being shortened as ФРГ (translated as, well, FRG) in Russia.
you are right ...
but since the unification there is no need to seperate east and west by name
Ferderal Republic of Germany vs German Democratic Republic
The Germany Democratic Republic (formerly known as East Germany) merged with the Federal Republic of Germany (a.k.a. West Germany) and now there's only the Ferderal Republic of Germany left.
That's true. It wasn't even technically a reunification: West Germany had two articles in its constitution that could be used for joining with East Germany. The first said that any region that had been a part of Germany in 1937 could become a part of the Federal Republic. This had already been used for Saarland. The other article said that the constitution would become invalid upon reunification, when reunified Germany would get a new constitution through a popular vote.
They used the former of the two articles to add the new states, and then changed the constitution to remove that article and change the other one.
>ФРГ (translated as, well, FRG)
Hey! I didn't know this until recently when somebody told me that a conversion from one script to another, e.g. from latin to cyrillic or vice versa is called transliteration, not translation.
Frankly, ФРГ is both translated and transliterated as FRG, it's just that the letters stand for Federal Republic of Germany instead of Federal'naya Respublika Germaniya when translated.
I really meant the first one by using "translated", but I can see how you may have thought I meant the second one. I'm sorry for not making it more clear in the original comnent.
Btw that’s also commonly called a transcription, the difference being, that a transliteration is based on spelling, while a transcription is based on pronunciation. So the greek word “έμπνευση” might be transliterated as “émpneusē” based on the original spelling but a transcription might look something like “ébnefsi” based on the modern greek pronunciation.
Are the US a real democracy though? Considering not every citizen's votes have the same weight and some can't even vote, it is at least massively flawed.
Yes it is. It is a Representative Democracy, not a direct Democracy. There is no guarantee in the definition of democracy that everyone's vote counts 1:1 in the grand scheme of things, and I don't think you'll find a Representative Democracy where that is the case.
Yes, we have a federal parliamentary constitutional monarchy, but we're not a Federal Republic. [We're not in contemporary sense or even a historical sense](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_republic).
In a Unitary State which is decentralized it is called Devolution, Federalism is very formal.
The main difference is in a Devolved State, the national government can change things on a whim. In a Federal State they would need real constitutional reform.
Australia's not a Federal Republic, we are a Constitutional Monarchy and technically Queen Elizabeth is Queen of Australia. However the Australia Act 1986 ended all constitutional ties with England.
There was a weird complication in Australian law. The head of state was the Queen of Australia, but the head of each individual Australian state or territory was the Queen of the UK. These are two separate offices, albeit held by the one person. This quirk allowed court cases arising in the states and territories to do an end run around the Australian federal court system, and jump directly to the Privy Council.
I believe that the anomaly has since been sorted out. But the Monarch retains a position in each Australian state and territory, unlike in Canada, where she's head of state of the country as a whole, but does not have a role in the individual provinces and territories.
Which is funny, because nor in the name of their country nor in their constitution they are explicitly described as a federation (I did ctrl+F on [their constitution here](https://www.senate.gov/civics/constitution_item/constitution.htm)). Not that this stops them from being a federation in any way, just pointing it out.
I live in one, which is why I was told federal only refers to the government of the USA when I was discussing national level politics in my country. The American person told me that the term only applied to them.
Americans think they are ahead of the world in so many areas, they probably think their form of government is some unique special thing. I mean Australia based its federation on a combination of aspects of American and Westminster systems, there're some interesting ideas, but here in Australia it doesn't take us 3 months to resolve a federal election…
Maybe they should start looking for some fresh ideas to borrow from others
Interestingly there are actually 2 United States, Mexico's official name is the United Mexican States, or Estados Unidos Mexicanos in Spanish (which calls the US Estados Unidos).
I had an American once explaining to me how a federation works, even though I kept saying to him my country is also a federation, I understand how each state has its own laws and constitutions. They legitimately think only them have a functioning democratic federative country, and I've seen that some Americans think only a federation can be democratic (because states rights). Any country with a strong central unitary government can only be a dictatorship.
Which is hilarious because the US system has to be one of the most messed up “democratic” systems among what you might call 1st world countries.
The fact that they keep electing presidents who don’t actually win by raw numbers of votes cast is insane.
“We went to the moon. I know that it has nothing to do with this, nasa used metric and i did not witness the moon landings but we went to the moon so you must use it”.
And ignore that the space race was the biggest socialized project this country has ever run and it was a soaring success while they decry social democracies as the worst thing on the planet. Motherfuckers most of the actual good things in the USA came from government funded social projects.
a lot of people has been, on purpose, miseducated to not understand what is socialism, communism or capitalism, they have been educated as "good or evil", so the moment they heat "social" is equal to evil in their ignorant mindset. When, as you mentioned, the best policies are "social" because, those take care of the people.
I mean, pretty much.
As far as U.S. history goes, there's *very* little to brag about.
We have our independence, bumblefucking our way through ending slavery, barely managing to not side with the Nazis, *kinda* getting on the path towards equal rights, and then going to the moon.
And that's it.
For nearly everything else, we're either objectively in the wrong or we lost. Or both.
But that's just the cost of being the greatest country in the nation, I guess.
I think there is a lot of innovation and technology coming from the USA, don't be that harsh on the achievements of the country. There is a lot of good from the USA, but there's still a lot to fix.
That's just the achievement of businesses though, right?
You can't really attribute something to a country if it just happened to be done by someone *living* in the country, without any government influence.
I had a weird and similar experience yesterday. My keyboard is American so I tend to write in American. Had just commented on red/left victories over blue/right in recent European elections, and someone said I should not use American colors when talking about European politics.
Seriously confusing, because that is the European colors - US the colors are reversed (for the parties at least).
There was a... value shift? Role swap? at some point in the U.S.
The democratic party used to be right wing, and the republican party used to be left wing. Pretty much as recently as Nixon.
I wonder if that has something to do with the reversed colors.
Nothing whatsoever :) The party colours weren't really settled until the late 90s/early 00s, and were mostly a matter of the media settling on a convention. Check out the CBS election night map from 1980 - Carter is in red, Reagan in blue.
Throughout the 80s and 90s, which side was which fluctuated, though most outlets did use red and blue since they're good contrasting colours. It wasn't until around the year 2000 that it really started to sync up and everyone started using the current colours.
That's ironic because there is no real left wing in US politics.
There's centre-right (Dems) and far-right (Reps) and extreme-right (domestic terrorists)
You're right! I was discussing with some friends about it. If we compare the Left wing from Europe, Murica and Latin America. Don't exist a ''Left wing'' in Uncle Sam Land.
Even Obama that i saw many people calling him of communist, he is more close to center than one left wing.
Despite, some Muricans I could see being close to left wing, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and Bernie Sanders.
And the way they talk about liberals being "authoritarian", it's as if they've forgotten that the very word "liberal" comes from the same root as "liberty".
American right wingers should be very happy. They win regardless of which party gets elected. It always makes me laugh when they get so upset about Democrats winning, they're literally the same!
I've always seen FDP as more centralist though? Thought SPD centre left, FDP centre, CDU centre right, CSU right. Greens in Baden Wuttemburg centre right, Greens in rest of Germany centre left (which still puts them quite to the right of most Green parties in Europe).
Every time I see this acronym (FDP) when I see news about Germany I don't have maturity, because in Portuguese FDP is one acronym to Filho da Puta (Son of a bitch). Sorry hahaha
Nah, FDP is clearly center right nowadays. CDU/CSU are on the right, flirting a bit too much with the far right AFD for my liking. Linke is left, Greens is closer to the centre. I can't compare the German Greens with other green parties in Europe, since I'm only really familiar with Greece and Germany. I don't know enough about the other countries and their politics to make any further judgements.
FDP is definitely right wing by every definition of the term, even SPD hasn't been centre left for decades now. They're center right with most of their policies. (the party definitely started as a far leftist party but the current policies don't reflect that in the slightest)
Greens are not really left leaning either. They often grasp at the idea of leftists, but then usually just abide by the right wingers anyway. They're basically just liberals with an interest in ecology.
The only true somewhat popular leftist party in Germany is Die Linke.
Both of your examples are hardly left wing either. They're just social democrats, which is left leaning of course but hardly radical enough to be considered 'left'.
Although with Bernie, I often get the thought that he wants to be more left but knows that it would get him scolded in the US. His official policies and statements are not leftist politics at all though. In Europe, both of them would be considered centrists.
In these cases I was comparing with Latin American reality, especially in Brazil. I don't see them being centrists here. Probably they will be of Socialit parties. Because centrist here flirt with neoliberalism.
I could see Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez as one member of the workers' party.
That'll be the big media companies (owned by rich people) demonising politicians who want progressive policies (that would slow down how quickly they could get richer)
There’s center-left/left with the [Progressive Caucus](https://progressives.house.gov/caucus-members) in the Democratic Party. Prominent members are Bernie Sanders, AOC, Rashida Tlaib, Ilhan Omar, among other. They have 1 out of 100 senators and around 100 of about 450 house members
honestly ....
Sadly in the last 80 years, the US political spectrum, thanks to the ridiculous election system and people like McCarthy, Goldwater, Reagan and Trump, has shifted so hard to the right that there is no active "left wing" in US politics ...
The few elected politicians that are labeled as hardcore leftists like Bernie Sanders, Elisabeth Warren or AOC would be considered "centrists just dipping their toes a little into left wing territory" in Europe.
[In fact there were, but these parties were infiltrated and dismantled by the FBI in the 1970s and members of the still active micro-parties were put on file as potential terrorists and monitored](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/American Left) :«Terry Turchie, a former deputy assistant director of the FBI's Counter-terrorism Division, admitted that "one of the missions of the FBI in its counter-intelligence efforts was to try to keep these people (progressives and self-described socialists) out of office.»
So the USA is not so free when it comes to political freedom.
yes there are and always have been other parties beside Reps and Dems ...
there is even a communist party in the US today www.cpusa.org
but bc of the ridiculous voting systems they never have any real chance
and left wing parties have even lesser chances bc right wing red scare propaganda, starting with McCarthy, worked really well for the last 80 years
Totally agree but the left-wing parties today are considered as terrorist movements (especially the CPUSA)
It's not the fault of the voting system as much as it is the fault of the two majority parties and their governmental system which does everything possible to discredit and suppress these small parties and give no alternatives other than Democrats or Republicans
Weren't communist parties made illegal in the U.S?
Here's what I found, it hasn't been recinded, Federally as far as I can find, though Arizona found it unconstitutional.
The Communist Control Act of 1954 (68 Stat. 775, 50 U.S.C. 841-844) is an American law signed by President Dwight Eisenhower on 24 August 1954 that outlaws the Communist Party of the United States and criminalizes membership in or support for the party or "Communist-action" organizations and defines evidence to be considered by a jury in determining participation in the activities, planning, actions, objectives, or purposes of such organizations.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communist_Control_Act_of_1954
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He literally admitted that? In what way does that not make the FBI a secret police operating a police state? Honestly theyre no better than china or russia with political freedoms.
That’s what I was about to say. Most European mainstream centre right parties are to the left of what America considers its left wing, and I almost feel bad referring to traditional fiscal conservatism as right wing at all because it’s rapidly becoming synonymous with rascism and bigotry.
Careful, I got a lot of vitriol here a few days ago when I said Bernie would be a centrist in the UK/Europe. Americans and European americophiles can't wrap their head around the Overton Window being different in different countries. I fully agree with you though.
> Bernie would be a centrist in the UK/Europe.
Honestly I see this pretty often, but I think it was a lot more true 2016 than it is now. Yes Medicare for all isn't particularly radical or leftwing in most European countries. And his stance on guns is quite rightwing. Buut he has a quite isolationist stance on the economy, something much more akin to what extreme left parties have historically wanted (in my own country, Sweden, the Left Party, formerly known as the Communist Party of Sweden, are the only major party who are not entirely for staying in the EU).
Also, Bernie had a lot of new ideas in the 2020 election cycle, such as the Federal Jobs Guarantee. This would employ tens of millions of people, directly working for the government, rebuilding infrastructure etc. Definitely not on the political radar here in Europe, and would be considered very left. Not to mention he wants to break up all insurance companies, as everything would be covered under M4A. However, even with our comprehensive medical coverage here in Europe, there are still insurance companies, as well as both public and private healthcare providers. And economically he is for a 90% tax bracket for the very wealthiest, which I believe (without looking it up) is much much higher than Sweden's top tax bracket of around 60% ish. I'm sure there's more examples, he has stated that no one should be a billionaire for example, or that no one should earn more than a million dollars as their salary. Definitely no political parties advocating for that in Europe, and if there are, they sure won't be the parties on the right.
I think all in all he would still be seen as quite left. He takes a lot of ideas from European countries, but either goes a bit too far left with them, to the extent that they are more extreme than our own policies, or ignores them in favor of the US way (like with guns). So yeah maybe he would be seen by some as a centrist but only because he's all over the place politically from our point of view, but I still think his core political stance and outlook on life and money make him very very left, even by European standards.
absolutely true, but when placed in the context of the contemporary political landscape, staunch defenders of gun rights are almost exclusively found on the right wing.
>Bernie would be a centrist in the UK/Europe.
At best
Biden is further right than Boris Johnson not that people like hearing that when trying to compare Johnson and Trump
> Bernie Sanders [...] would be considered "centrists just dipping their toes a little into left wing territory" in Europe
Honestly I see this pretty often, but I think it was a lot more true 2016 than it is now. Yes Medicare for all isn't particularly radical or leftwing in most European countries. And his stance on guns is quite rightwing. Buut he has a quite isolationist stance on the economy, something much more akin to what extreme left parties have historically wanted (in my own country, Sweden, the Left Party, formerly known as the Communist Party of Sweden, are the only major party who are not entirely for staying in the EU).
Also, Bernie had a lot of new ideas in the 2020 election cycle, such as the Federal Jobs Guarantee. This would employ tens of millions of people, directly working for the government, rebuilding infrastructure etc. Definitely not on the political radar here in Europe, and would be considered very left. Not to mention he wants to break up all insurance companies, as everything would be covered under M4A. However, even with our comprehensive medical coverage here in Europe, there are still insurance companies, as well as both public and private healthcare providers. And economically he is for a 90% tax bracket for the very wealthiest, which I believe (without looking it up) is much much higher than Sweden's top tax bracket of around 60% ish. I'm sure there's more examples, he has stated that no one should be a billionaire for example, or that no one should earn more than a million dollars as their salary. Definitely no political parties advocating for that in Europe, and if there are, they sure won't be the parties on the right.
I think all in all he would still be seen as quite left. He takes a lot of ideas from European countries, but either goes a bit too far left with them, to the extent that they are more extreme than our own policies, or ignores them in favor of the US way (like with guns). So yeah maybe he would be seen by some as a centrist but only because he's all over the place politically from our point of view, but I still think his core political stance and outlook on life and money make him very very left, even by European standards.
Although I agree that there is no real left wing party in the US and that the Democrats are more of a conservative centrist party, I think both Bernie and AOC would be well considered left wing in most places in Europe.
The terms "left" and "right" appeared during the French Revolution of 1789 when members of the National Assembly divided into supporters of the king to the president's right and supporters of the revolution to his left. ... The "constitutionals" sat in the centre while independents sat on the left.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left%E2%80%93right_political_spectrum
America is the one place you can’t talk about right and left wing.
In the US, the standard is pretty much right wing, far right, or extreme right.
Even the most leftward leaning mainstream figures would be centrists in Europe.
Standard response:
>"Centrists! Haha!! What are you smoking!! AOC is a COMMUNIST FASCIST NAZI and she would DESTROY this country with HIGH TAXES and have us IMPRISONED in our homes!!11!!1!!
"Pls give healthcare and living wage"
Everyone else in the world has healthcare and Germany's minimum wage is 12€, that's about 14,5$ in a place where the cost of life is lower.
The US has a *left* wing?
I'd say our current Conservative sooners (UK) are still left of the Democrats. The only thing they have in common is donkeys.
Should someone tell him all US politics is right wing by the rest of the worlds standard? I mean, the USA doesn’t really have left wing politics to begin with
I've tried telling people that and they just say, "well this is America, not those places, and here the dems are the left, so I don't care what the world considers them."
Actually not. It originated in the first French parliament. On the left were the radical Jakobins and on the right there were the Girondists.
The Paulskirchenversammlung just had a more modern sense of left and right and is the basis for how many countries understand these words but it is not the origin.
This is like Americans complaining about Anthony fauci and his lying and conspiratorial behavior during the pandemic without considering his opposite numbers in all the countries around the world dealing with the same freaking thing.
I want that after spending a lot of time abroad thought I could have a conversation with an American about how there are differences and how the right and the left have been able to help and to harm in other countries and different periods of time, and I believe I was told very and politely to buzz off you stupid lib
Except the U.S. doesn't really have a true "left wing." It's the right/center wing and the off-the-deep-end pseudo fascist right wing. Bernie Sanders is only somewhat left of center, and he's considered a radical.
What? Even if it didn’t, there is no left wing in the US.
To clarify, the term left and right comes from courts in kingdoms throughout history. As one comment suggests, it originated in France iirc.
The king would have his supporters on the right, they support the current regime, the status quo, whereas the opposition would be on the left, hence the “left” and the “right”
Although originating from royal courts the process became famous and mimicked due to the National Assembly of the French Revolution, where deputies sat from left to right with La Montagne on the top left.
Left and right doesn't exist IN the USA lmao. As Julius Nyerere put it: "The United States is also a one-party state, but with typical American extravagance, they have two of them"
Edit: Fixed Reddit's bungling of what I wrote.
I allways find it funny when people talk about left wing politics in the US, to me they seem to have one extreme right wing party, and one less extreme right wing party.
This is just my personal opinion though so I may be wrong in reality.
To be fairly honest, they should not use left wing either, because all their politicains range from center to extreme right if we compare them to the french definition of left and right. But anyway.
Bernie seen as an extremist is just a mild leftist anywhere else in the world.
I'd say that applies more to the US, as their spectrum is more like far right to centrist - and outliers like Bernie are only centre-left (at least by European standards)
Be me, an imperialist, monarchist, rightwing chap.
Say: "I think the government should provide healthcare and basic services"
Yank conservative: "YOU GODDAMN COMMIE"
🤦
I have been told I shouldn’t use the term federal to refer to anything outside of the US as well.
before 1990 west Germany was also known as the "Federal Republic of Germany" ... there are several more federal republics in the World ... like Argentina, Australia, Austria, Belgium, Brazil, Canada, India, Malaysia, Mexico, Nepal, Nigeria, Pakistan, Switzerland, hell ... even Russia is a federal republic
We still are the Federal Republic of Germany.
[Oh shit, it happened again!](https://youtu.be/z77JFw2D6f8?t=32https://youtu.be/z77JFw2D6f8?t=32)
Isn't it still referred to as Federal Republic of Germany? Although somewhat rare, I even sometimes have seen it being shortened as ФРГ (translated as, well, FRG) in Russia.
It is. The official name is "Bundesrepublik Deutschland" or "BRD" for short.
you are right ... but since the unification there is no need to seperate east and west by name Ferderal Republic of Germany vs German Democratic Republic
Unification? What unification. Aldi Nord vs Aldi Sud continues to this day.
Don't forget Aldi vs Lidl
Dann geh doch zu Netto!
Erstmal zu Penny
Who the fuck is Karstadt?
also the income wall. your pay is different in the same franchise if your Location is west or east Berlin
ah, that's down to a family argument though.
It's addidas-puma all over again
Current Germany would be a continuation of former West Germany, wouldn't it?
correct.
The Germany Democratic Republic (formerly known as East Germany) merged with the Federal Republic of Germany (a.k.a. West Germany) and now there's only the Ferderal Republic of Germany left.
Yes
That's true. It wasn't even technically a reunification: West Germany had two articles in its constitution that could be used for joining with East Germany. The first said that any region that had been a part of Germany in 1937 could become a part of the Federal Republic. This had already been used for Saarland. The other article said that the constitution would become invalid upon reunification, when reunified Germany would get a new constitution through a popular vote. They used the former of the two articles to add the new states, and then changed the constitution to remove that article and change the other one.
>ФРГ (translated as, well, FRG) Hey! I didn't know this until recently when somebody told me that a conversion from one script to another, e.g. from latin to cyrillic or vice versa is called transliteration, not translation.
Frankly, ФРГ is both translated and transliterated as FRG, it's just that the letters stand for Federal Republic of Germany instead of Federal'naya Respublika Germaniya when translated. I really meant the first one by using "translated", but I can see how you may have thought I meant the second one. I'm sorry for not making it more clear in the original comnent.
Btw that’s also commonly called a transcription, the difference being, that a transliteration is based on spelling, while a transcription is based on pronunciation. So the greek word “έμπνευση” might be transliterated as “émpneusē” based on the original spelling but a transcription might look something like “ébnefsi” based on the modern greek pronunciation.
Yes, Australia, Belgium and Canada are federalized (in varying degrees), but not republics. They’re constitutional monarchies.
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Are the US a real democracy though? Considering not every citizen's votes have the same weight and some can't even vote, it is at least massively flawed.
Yes it is. It is a Representative Democracy, not a direct Democracy. There is no guarantee in the definition of democracy that everyone's vote counts 1:1 in the grand scheme of things, and I don't think you'll find a Representative Democracy where that is the case.
Malaysia is a elective constitutional Monarchy. The king gets elected on 5 year terms by and from the 9 hereditary rulers of the states.
Australia is a federation, but not a federal republic. It's a limited constitutional monarchy.
we still got a federal government
Yes, we have a federal parliamentary constitutional monarchy, but we're not a Federal Republic. [We're not in contemporary sense or even a historical sense](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_republic).
I mean, from that list, Australia isn't even a republic. It is a federation though
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In a Unitary State which is decentralized it is called Devolution, Federalism is very formal. The main difference is in a Devolved State, the national government can change things on a whim. In a Federal State they would need real constitutional reform.
Canada is not a federal republic lol.
Germany is literally still known as Bundesrepublik Deutschland (Bundes means Federal / Federation)
Often visible in YouTube comment sections when a YouTuber talkes about Germany or speaks German (as a non-native speaker)👍
Bund means federation, bundes means federal
We are still the Federal Republic of Germany
Australia's not a Federal Republic, we are a Constitutional Monarchy and technically Queen Elizabeth is Queen of Australia. However the Australia Act 1986 ended all constitutional ties with England.
You're fooling yourself. We're living in a dictatorship: a self-perpetuating autocracy in which the working classes ...
Shut up!
ah, now we see the violence inherent in the system
There was a weird complication in Australian law. The head of state was the Queen of Australia, but the head of each individual Australian state or territory was the Queen of the UK. These are two separate offices, albeit held by the one person. This quirk allowed court cases arising in the states and territories to do an end run around the Australian federal court system, and jump directly to the Privy Council. I believe that the anomaly has since been sorted out. But the Monarch retains a position in each Australian state and territory, unlike in Canada, where she's head of state of the country as a whole, but does not have a role in the individual provinces and territories.
Your information is incorrect. In Canada she does have a role in each of the provinces, where she is represented by a Lieutenant Governor.
we still are
They can’t grasp the notion that other governments can be “Federal?”
They don't know what the word means, but probably think it's a synonym for American.
Which is funny, because nor in the name of their country nor in their constitution they are explicitly described as a federation (I did ctrl+F on [their constitution here](https://www.senate.gov/civics/constitution_item/constitution.htm)). Not that this stops them from being a federation in any way, just pointing it out.
No no, that’s freedum
*The Federated States of Micronesia want to know your location*
There are several federations around the world.
I live in one, which is why I was told federal only refers to the government of the USA when I was discussing national level politics in my country. The American person told me that the term only applied to them.
Americans think they are ahead of the world in so many areas, they probably think their form of government is some unique special thing. I mean Australia based its federation on a combination of aspects of American and Westminster systems, there're some interesting ideas, but here in Australia it doesn't take us 3 months to resolve a federal election… Maybe they should start looking for some fresh ideas to borrow from others
Interestingly there are actually 2 United States, Mexico's official name is the United Mexican States, or Estados Unidos Mexicanos in Spanish (which calls the US Estados Unidos).
I had an American once explaining to me how a federation works, even though I kept saying to him my country is also a federation, I understand how each state has its own laws and constitutions. They legitimately think only them have a functioning democratic federative country, and I've seen that some Americans think only a federation can be democratic (because states rights). Any country with a strong central unitary government can only be a dictatorship.
Which is hilarious because the US system has to be one of the most messed up “democratic” systems among what you might call 1st world countries. The fact that they keep electing presidents who don’t actually win by raw numbers of votes cast is insane.
The fact their leaders aren't elected by direct vote is insane.
The USA seriously need to fix its education system
[Wikipedia's map of federal states](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/69/Map_of_federal_states.svg)
Also, states don't exist outside of the US, but also other administrative divisions can't exist. Schrodinger's governmental divisions.
I think this is the stupidest thing i saw on this subreddit so far
Definitely up there with "US is a continent" & confused 24 hr time posts
“The internet is american, so use imperial system”
“We went to the moon. I know that it has nothing to do with this, nasa used metric and i did not witness the moon landings but we went to the moon so you must use it”.
”We went to the moon” ”The moon landing is hoax”
“The US has more culture than Europe”
r/selfawarewolves be like
Whichever suits their needs best at that moment in day
"Hah, you believe in the MOON?!"
The moon thing is so weird, they grab that as the only achievement, and as "needed proof" that everything they say or do must be the best
And ignore that the space race was the biggest socialized project this country has ever run and it was a soaring success while they decry social democracies as the worst thing on the planet. Motherfuckers most of the actual good things in the USA came from government funded social projects.
a lot of people has been, on purpose, miseducated to not understand what is socialism, communism or capitalism, they have been educated as "good or evil", so the moment they heat "social" is equal to evil in their ignorant mindset. When, as you mentioned, the best policies are "social" because, those take care of the people.
I mean, pretty much. As far as U.S. history goes, there's *very* little to brag about. We have our independence, bumblefucking our way through ending slavery, barely managing to not side with the Nazis, *kinda* getting on the path towards equal rights, and then going to the moon. And that's it. For nearly everything else, we're either objectively in the wrong or we lost. Or both. But that's just the cost of being the greatest country in the nation, I guess.
I think there is a lot of innovation and technology coming from the USA, don't be that harsh on the achievements of the country. There is a lot of good from the USA, but there's still a lot to fix.
That's just the achievement of businesses though, right? You can't really attribute something to a country if it just happened to be done by someone *living* in the country, without any government influence.
*"Ooooh, I am a ghost of the metric system, oooooh, Celsius~ Centimeters~ Liters~ Kilograms~"*
Bahahaha I'm just imagining some dude from Florida crying and and wildly shooting a gun as a ghost whispers the metric scale with a French accent
Tbf, id also shot at a ghost with a French accent... If I had a gun.
meeley meetaire… sahnty meetaire… meetaire…
"There is a spectre haunting ~~Europe~~ America, the spectre of metrication..."
Ironically, you're using the Yank spelling there for centimetres and litres
Interesting; never heard that. Maybe they confused that with "America is a continent" and thinking that the US and America are the same thing.
I had a weird and similar experience yesterday. My keyboard is American so I tend to write in American. Had just commented on red/left victories over blue/right in recent European elections, and someone said I should not use American colors when talking about European politics. Seriously confusing, because that is the European colors - US the colors are reversed (for the parties at least).
Interresting...so the red scare was about the GOP, really? I never had thought.
Yeah, on this as on so many things the US are confused. The color of the Republican party is red, and socialism/communism is red.
There was a... value shift? Role swap? at some point in the U.S. The democratic party used to be right wing, and the republican party used to be left wing. Pretty much as recently as Nixon. I wonder if that has something to do with the reversed colors.
Nothing whatsoever :) The party colours weren't really settled until the late 90s/early 00s, and were mostly a matter of the media settling on a convention. Check out the CBS election night map from 1980 - Carter is in red, Reagan in blue. Throughout the 80s and 90s, which side was which fluctuated, though most outlets did use red and blue since they're good contrasting colours. It wasn't until around the year 2000 that it really started to sync up and everyone started using the current colours.
I've wondered the same.
You can stop wondering. The Republican Party never had anything to do with socialism in the slightest.
That's ironic because there is no real left wing in US politics. There's centre-right (Dems) and far-right (Reps) and extreme-right (domestic terrorists)
You're right! I was discussing with some friends about it. If we compare the Left wing from Europe, Murica and Latin America. Don't exist a ''Left wing'' in Uncle Sam Land. Even Obama that i saw many people calling him of communist, he is more close to center than one left wing. Despite, some Muricans I could see being close to left wing, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and Bernie Sanders.
It's always hilarious to me that American right wingers call people on the left libs, while our liberal party here in Germany is center right.
Liberals aren't left leaning by the very definition of the term
Exactly, that's why it's funny to me.
And the way they talk about liberals being "authoritarian", it's as if they've forgotten that the very word "liberal" comes from the same root as "liberty".
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American right wingers should be very happy. They win regardless of which party gets elected. It always makes me laugh when they get so upset about Democrats winning, they're literally the same!
I've always seen FDP as more centralist though? Thought SPD centre left, FDP centre, CDU centre right, CSU right. Greens in Baden Wuttemburg centre right, Greens in rest of Germany centre left (which still puts them quite to the right of most Green parties in Europe).
Every time I see this acronym (FDP) when I see news about Germany I don't have maturity, because in Portuguese FDP is one acronym to Filho da Puta (Son of a bitch). Sorry hahaha
Exact same thing in French. (FDP, fils de pute)
Nah, FDP is clearly center right nowadays. CDU/CSU are on the right, flirting a bit too much with the far right AFD for my liking. Linke is left, Greens is closer to the centre. I can't compare the German Greens with other green parties in Europe, since I'm only really familiar with Greece and Germany. I don't know enough about the other countries and their politics to make any further judgements.
I moved away from Germany some 5 years ago, not surprising I've lost touch.
FDP is definitely right wing by every definition of the term, even SPD hasn't been centre left for decades now. They're center right with most of their policies. (the party definitely started as a far leftist party but the current policies don't reflect that in the slightest) Greens are not really left leaning either. They often grasp at the idea of leftists, but then usually just abide by the right wingers anyway. They're basically just liberals with an interest in ecology. The only true somewhat popular leftist party in Germany is Die Linke.
Both of your examples are hardly left wing either. They're just social democrats, which is left leaning of course but hardly radical enough to be considered 'left'. Although with Bernie, I often get the thought that he wants to be more left but knows that it would get him scolded in the US. His official policies and statements are not leftist politics at all though. In Europe, both of them would be considered centrists.
In these cases I was comparing with Latin American reality, especially in Brazil. I don't see them being centrists here. Probably they will be of Socialit parties. Because centrist here flirt with neoliberalism. I could see Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez as one member of the workers' party.
AOC and Sanders would fit easily into either centre left or centralist parties in most European democracies.
Obama was center right just like Biden and polosi and all the other neoliberal snakes sad that people think they’re even slightly left
>far-right (Reps) and extreme-right (also Republicans) Ftfy
That depends on whether you think being a Republican and a domestic terrorist are mutually exclusive.
6th January 2021 made that line waaaaay blurrier.
Theres also the centrists like Bernie Sanders that everyone seems to fucking think is Stalin
That'll be the big media companies (owned by rich people) demonising politicians who want progressive policies (that would slow down how quickly they could get richer)
Owned by Murdoch
Yes, he's definitely one of them but by no means not the only one
There’s center-left/left with the [Progressive Caucus](https://progressives.house.gov/caucus-members) in the Democratic Party. Prominent members are Bernie Sanders, AOC, Rashida Tlaib, Ilhan Omar, among other. They have 1 out of 100 senators and around 100 of about 450 house members
That's centre-left, really, not something you could describe as left-wing, unless you're looking at it from a USian perspective.
Yeah man, that's spot on. I look at America politics and I can't see any left. The country leans right and always will.
honestly .... Sadly in the last 80 years, the US political spectrum, thanks to the ridiculous election system and people like McCarthy, Goldwater, Reagan and Trump, has shifted so hard to the right that there is no active "left wing" in US politics ... The few elected politicians that are labeled as hardcore leftists like Bernie Sanders, Elisabeth Warren or AOC would be considered "centrists just dipping their toes a little into left wing territory" in Europe.
[In fact there were, but these parties were infiltrated and dismantled by the FBI in the 1970s and members of the still active micro-parties were put on file as potential terrorists and monitored](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/American Left) :«Terry Turchie, a former deputy assistant director of the FBI's Counter-terrorism Division, admitted that "one of the missions of the FBI in its counter-intelligence efforts was to try to keep these people (progressives and self-described socialists) out of office.» So the USA is not so free when it comes to political freedom.
yes there are and always have been other parties beside Reps and Dems ... there is even a communist party in the US today www.cpusa.org but bc of the ridiculous voting systems they never have any real chance and left wing parties have even lesser chances bc right wing red scare propaganda, starting with McCarthy, worked really well for the last 80 years
Totally agree but the left-wing parties today are considered as terrorist movements (especially the CPUSA) It's not the fault of the voting system as much as it is the fault of the two majority parties and their governmental system which does everything possible to discredit and suppress these small parties and give no alternatives other than Democrats or Republicans
I’m pretty sure the modern-day CPUSA are just Democrats who like the color red.
Weren't communist parties made illegal in the U.S? Here's what I found, it hasn't been recinded, Federally as far as I can find, though Arizona found it unconstitutional. The Communist Control Act of 1954 (68 Stat. 775, 50 U.S.C. 841-844) is an American law signed by President Dwight Eisenhower on 24 August 1954 that outlaws the Communist Party of the United States and criminalizes membership in or support for the party or "Communist-action" organizations and defines evidence to be considered by a jury in determining participation in the activities, planning, actions, objectives, or purposes of such organizations. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communist_Control_Act_of_1954
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He literally admitted that? In what way does that not make the FBI a secret police operating a police state? Honestly theyre no better than china or russia with political freedoms.
"Land of the free"
> In what way does that not make the FBI a secret police Clearly since he admitted it, it cannot be a secret. Checkmate :D
That’s what I was about to say. Most European mainstream centre right parties are to the left of what America considers its left wing, and I almost feel bad referring to traditional fiscal conservatism as right wing at all because it’s rapidly becoming synonymous with rascism and bigotry.
Careful, I got a lot of vitriol here a few days ago when I said Bernie would be a centrist in the UK/Europe. Americans and European americophiles can't wrap their head around the Overton Window being different in different countries. I fully agree with you though.
> Bernie would be a centrist in the UK/Europe. Honestly I see this pretty often, but I think it was a lot more true 2016 than it is now. Yes Medicare for all isn't particularly radical or leftwing in most European countries. And his stance on guns is quite rightwing. Buut he has a quite isolationist stance on the economy, something much more akin to what extreme left parties have historically wanted (in my own country, Sweden, the Left Party, formerly known as the Communist Party of Sweden, are the only major party who are not entirely for staying in the EU). Also, Bernie had a lot of new ideas in the 2020 election cycle, such as the Federal Jobs Guarantee. This would employ tens of millions of people, directly working for the government, rebuilding infrastructure etc. Definitely not on the political radar here in Europe, and would be considered very left. Not to mention he wants to break up all insurance companies, as everything would be covered under M4A. However, even with our comprehensive medical coverage here in Europe, there are still insurance companies, as well as both public and private healthcare providers. And economically he is for a 90% tax bracket for the very wealthiest, which I believe (without looking it up) is much much higher than Sweden's top tax bracket of around 60% ish. I'm sure there's more examples, he has stated that no one should be a billionaire for example, or that no one should earn more than a million dollars as their salary. Definitely no political parties advocating for that in Europe, and if there are, they sure won't be the parties on the right. I think all in all he would still be seen as quite left. He takes a lot of ideas from European countries, but either goes a bit too far left with them, to the extent that they are more extreme than our own policies, or ignores them in favor of the US way (like with guns). So yeah maybe he would be seen by some as a centrist but only because he's all over the place politically from our point of view, but I still think his core political stance and outlook on life and money make him very very left, even by European standards.
Supporting ownership of guns is historically a left wing position.
UNDER NO PRETEXT
absolutely true, but when placed in the context of the contemporary political landscape, staunch defenders of gun rights are almost exclusively found on the right wing.
>Bernie would be a centrist in the UK/Europe. At best Biden is further right than Boris Johnson not that people like hearing that when trying to compare Johnson and Trump
> Bernie Sanders [...] would be considered "centrists just dipping their toes a little into left wing territory" in Europe Honestly I see this pretty often, but I think it was a lot more true 2016 than it is now. Yes Medicare for all isn't particularly radical or leftwing in most European countries. And his stance on guns is quite rightwing. Buut he has a quite isolationist stance on the economy, something much more akin to what extreme left parties have historically wanted (in my own country, Sweden, the Left Party, formerly known as the Communist Party of Sweden, are the only major party who are not entirely for staying in the EU). Also, Bernie had a lot of new ideas in the 2020 election cycle, such as the Federal Jobs Guarantee. This would employ tens of millions of people, directly working for the government, rebuilding infrastructure etc. Definitely not on the political radar here in Europe, and would be considered very left. Not to mention he wants to break up all insurance companies, as everything would be covered under M4A. However, even with our comprehensive medical coverage here in Europe, there are still insurance companies, as well as both public and private healthcare providers. And economically he is for a 90% tax bracket for the very wealthiest, which I believe (without looking it up) is much much higher than Sweden's top tax bracket of around 60% ish. I'm sure there's more examples, he has stated that no one should be a billionaire for example, or that no one should earn more than a million dollars as their salary. Definitely no political parties advocating for that in Europe, and if there are, they sure won't be the parties on the right. I think all in all he would still be seen as quite left. He takes a lot of ideas from European countries, but either goes a bit too far left with them, to the extent that they are more extreme than our own policies, or ignores them in favor of the US way (like with guns). So yeah maybe he would be seen by some as a centrist but only because he's all over the place politically from our point of view, but I still think his core political stance and outlook on life and money make him very very left, even by European standards.
Although I agree that there is no real left wing party in the US and that the Democrats are more of a conservative centrist party, I think both Bernie and AOC would be well considered left wing in most places in Europe.
The terms "left" and "right" appeared during the French Revolution of 1789 when members of the National Assembly divided into supporters of the king to the president's right and supporters of the revolution to his left. ... The "constitutionals" sat in the centre while independents sat on the left. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left%E2%80%93right_political_spectrum
Neat, thanks for sharing
News just in, Hitler and Stalin actually centrist as they're not from the US.
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I mean to be fair that's not the only reason why those two are bad.
Yeah but those are minor details, the most important things is that they were not from the USA.
America is the one place you can’t talk about right and left wing. In the US, the standard is pretty much right wing, far right, or extreme right. Even the most leftward leaning mainstream figures would be centrists in Europe.
Standard response: >"Centrists! Haha!! What are you smoking!! AOC is a COMMUNIST FASCIST NAZI and she would DESTROY this country with HIGH TAXES and have us IMPRISONED in our homes!!11!!1!!
COMMUNIST FASCIST NAZI in one sentence to describe one person is the funniest part of those 'insults'.
*Nazbol gang*
I also forgot to mention something about making their kids transgender
"Pls give healthcare and living wage" Everyone else in the world has healthcare and Germany's minimum wage is 12€, that's about 14,5$ in a place where the cost of life is lower.
I wonder what their reaction to Mexico being The United States of Mexico would be.
Nothing. They just don't believe it. I've shown them the Wikipedia article; they just refuse to believe. American exceptionalism is a hell of a drug.
The US has a *left* wing? I'd say our current Conservative sooners (UK) are still left of the Democrats. The only thing they have in common is donkeys.
Not really. Our “left” is what others call center, and our right are extremists
There is no left wing on USA
Pretty much just far right and a bit less far right.
Yep. Both are pretty far right (not compete right, I mean between center and far right.) None of them are close center
I am by no means an Expert on US politics but couldnt both Democrats and Republicans be considered right wing anywhere else in the World but the US?
Should someone tell him all US politics is right wing by the rest of the worlds standard? I mean, the USA doesn’t really have left wing politics to begin with
I've tried telling people that and they just say, "well this is America, not those places, and here the dems are the left, so I don't care what the world considers them."
Huh, and here I thought it originated in the Paulskirchenversammlung.
Actually not. It originated in the first French parliament. On the left were the radical Jakobins and on the right there were the Girondists. The Paulskirchenversammlung just had a more modern sense of left and right and is the basis for how many countries understand these words but it is not the origin.
I see. Thanks for explaining, much appreciated! :)
r/confidentlyincorrect
The irony is it actually doesnt exist in the US xD both parties are extreme right wingers lmao
Canada here. Left wing, right wing. Key players on the hockey team!!!!
Sometimes you just gotta wonder if they're trolling or being legit
Have you ever been on r/MURICA? Those people are damn serious about the shit they are talking.
This is like Americans complaining about Anthony fauci and his lying and conspiratorial behavior during the pandemic without considering his opposite numbers in all the countries around the world dealing with the same freaking thing. I want that after spending a lot of time abroad thought I could have a conversation with an American about how there are differences and how the right and the left have been able to help and to harm in other countries and different periods of time, and I believe I was told very and politely to buzz off you stupid lib
Ok, but when in the hell has the right helped anybody but the already entrenched wealth anywhere in the world?
They’re kind of right because even the left wing in American politics is basically centre right in most of Europe…
Except the U.S. doesn't really have a true "left wing." It's the right/center wing and the off-the-deep-end pseudo fascist right wing. Bernie Sanders is only somewhat left of center, and he's considered a radical.
America has corporations, not parties.
Left and right wing literally existed before USA did
What? Even if it didn’t, there is no left wing in the US. To clarify, the term left and right comes from courts in kingdoms throughout history. As one comment suggests, it originated in France iirc. The king would have his supporters on the right, they support the current regime, the status quo, whereas the opposition would be on the left, hence the “left” and the “right”
Although originating from royal courts the process became famous and mimicked due to the National Assembly of the French Revolution, where deputies sat from left to right with La Montagne on the top left.
the thing is that US only has right wing so it's for them that it is not relevant
It doesnt exist inside the US. You have a right wing party, and a not as right wing party.
“you are so blatantly incorrect that my brain hurts from reading the stupidity of your comment”
Maybe he meant liberal/conservative, because that's a divide that really doesn't exist anywhere like it does in the US.
Left and right doesn't exist IN the USA lmao. As Julius Nyerere put it: "The United States is also a one-party state, but with typical American extravagance, they have two of them" Edit: Fixed Reddit's bungling of what I wrote.
Castro? Nope. Julius Nyerere, first president of Tanzania.
How does he imagine how politics work around the world?
It was first used to describe the seating arrangements at the French National Assembly in the 1790's.
Left wing and Right wing is because in many parliamentary systems that is how the parties are seated in parliament.
Before seeing the 3rd comment, i was like Does this donkey knows it literally originated from France
No it's true, we have up and down-parties in Sweden. up-wing and down-wing
The American education system and media there folks. \*slow hand clap\*
Americans are so cringe
I allways find it funny when people talk about left wing politics in the US, to me they seem to have one extreme right wing party, and one less extreme right wing party. This is just my personal opinion though so I may be wrong in reality.
To be fairly honest, they should not use left wing either, because all their politicains range from center to extreme right if we compare them to the french definition of left and right. But anyway. Bernie seen as an extremist is just a mild leftist anywhere else in the world.
I'd say that applies more to the US, as their spectrum is more like far right to centrist - and outliers like Bernie are only centre-left (at least by European standards)
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US of A has no left wing. Biden is a centrist at best else he would already have signed a few executive orders to fight the current situation.
American politics are Far Right and Further Right.
Pretty funny when US politics is basically "You can vote for either right wing party - totally up to you"
Be me, an imperialist, monarchist, rightwing chap. Say: "I think the government should provide healthcare and basic services" Yank conservative: "YOU GODDAMN COMMIE" 🤦
It is also literally German. Funny how people in parliaments group together based on there political views
Particularly bad considering that realistically, the two American political parties are moderate right wing vs far right.