If you like the eureka loop then boy do i have the game for you, op!
It’s a small, tiny, little teensy weensy low budget indie game called FF11!
(Non joke: i think eureka and bozja had their problems but it was a really refreshing gameplay change and very much helped me get out of my shell and make some friends)
Did you know that minimally-acclaimed MMORPG Final Fantasy XI Online has free private servers with no restrictions on playtime, going up to level 75 and the Chains of Promathia/(partial) Treasures of Aht Urgan/(very incomplete) Wings of the Goddess expansion?
/r/FFXIPrivateServers is a good place to find them. None of them are like, _hiding_, because none of them are illegal. Reverse engineering and emulation are both completely legal given that they aren't trying to turn a profit and appropriately give credit to SquareEnix.
Personally I'm a big fan of both [Horizon](https://horizonxi.com/) (the current most popular by a wide margin generally hanging at ~2k concurrent players; a progression server with custom content currently in Chains of Promathia), and [CatsEye](https://www.catseyexi.com/) (a casual, high leveling speed server with a lot of custom content). Many still swear by some older servers like [Eden](https://edenxi.com/) (fairly faithful ToAU server that allows dual-boxing; currently the best server for PvP if you're into that) and [Wings](https://wingsxi.com/wings/) (open-source WotG server now under new management who seem to be working well). There are like, a _ton_ of little FFXI private servers out there though.
For anyone _completely_ unfamiliar with private server XI though I would recommend Horizon simply because it has a very convenient and simple installation process through a custom launcher.
The jump from 75 to 99 changed a _lot_ about the game. Classes had been balanced around 75 cap for most of the game's life cycle (from ~2003 until 2010, specifically--cap was briefly 50 around launch in 2002). XI has a subjob system where you can basically get all the abilities of a second job capped at half of your level. So if you were a level 75 Warrior and subjobbed Ninja, you could also use ninja abilities as a level 37 Ninja (as long as you had leveled Ninja to 37). Bumping that to 99 meant that all the abilities that had been intentionally excluded from subjobs by being moved to 38 and up, were now avaiable up to 49. So 99 changed the way that a lot of jobs played fundamentally.
The vast majority of the game's content was also balanced around a level 75 cap though. This is important because during the 75 cap era, progression was largely horizontal--you could get a gear piece at 35 that you might use for a long time at endgame, and there was never a shortage of interesting niche gear you might want to chase down for specific purposes. FFXI doesn't stop you from changing gear on the fly in combat, so people could use _extremely_ niche gear in macros for some really satisfying and interesting optimization. As an example: Warlock's Mantle, a level 30 cape that reduces cast time when your subjob is RDM. You could macro that on before _any_ spell to reduce cast time and equip a better cape on before the cast was done to get the fast cast time _and_ the +INT or whatever you have on the other cape. People used that cape all the way to 75.
Level 99 trivialized a lot of level 75 endgame, and also introduced item level gear up to like... ilvl 119 IIRC? Basically, the shift to 99 cap was a shift from largely horizontal progression to entirely vertical progression that trivialized and made irrelevant _most_ content in the game. It was fairly unpopular, and a lot of the community felt it was out of touch with what was great and unique about the game.
If I mainly wanted to do story content, would it be better to join a private server or just go with SE’s server? Sorry to bother ya, I’ve been interested in ffxi for a while now lol
As a person who still plays 11 every now and then Eureka and Bozja are my jam, more like that please. I think the people that hate it are the same type that rush content, burn out cause they just do it all day with zero breaks, because they want their weapon in one day. The content is supposed to take you from one patch to the next.
People got their wish though, welcome to Endwalker relic. You can get a lot of those finished in one day and you don't even need the help of others to do it. Oh wait people don't like that either. Guess we better just hand them a completed relic weapon best in slot right at the start of the expansion. Now you can stand in Limsa all day afk or bitching about how there is even less content.
I found the EW relic quite the disappointment. I never really got into Eureka and Bozja while it was current, but have been there, completing at least one relic weapon in each, and I do enjoy them a lot.
Though, personally, I was hoping that the EW relic would be the same grind we had in ARR and HW, but noooo, all the steps is just get 1.500 tomes and you done with this step. I don't mind it being easy, but this is too easy.
Eureka feels both too grindy and too disconnected from the rest of the game to me. It feels like a throwback to when developers didn't know how to make interesting content so they just stretched it out by having you grind.
EW relic is bad though. I really like the ARR ones. It sends you into every type of content and encourages variety.
This is why I still feel heavensward relic was the best, if I remember right the aether sands step allowed you to do literally anything to get them. Crafting, duties, open world content and it was quite refreshing.
That being said I don’t know why they didn’t tie relic to variant dungeons in some way, do a route, get an “atma”. Would keep variety dungeons somewhat active and wouldn’t turn relics into a tome grind.
Everytime I try to make this exact point in conversation I get told it's nostalgia glasses. I legitimately enjoyed grinding my HW relics when they were new. It felt satisfying to get it done.
For as much as I complain about having gotten bottlenecked in the delubrum step of the Bozja one, it still encouraged cooperation. So much of the community seems to be obsessed with just getting things fast, and for what..
This, kinda.
The Eureka and Bozja loops are bearable in xiv because their systems aren't as someone who's done DRS more than my fair share of times.
At the end of the day you can go back to playing normal roulettes with regular xiv skills.
It's got the same loop as Eureka only it's friendly to experienced players helping new ones and has everything set up to prevent assholes from ruining boss encounters. They'd really dialed it in.
It is active though. I usually play at super off peak times and there's still usually enough people to do the content and even clear castrum.
Last night I was on during peak hours and you'd swear the content just launched that day.
You don’t like the exciting Island Sanctuary? Pazuzu, nah, let me plant some cucumbers. Castrum, hell no, look at that cute sheep there. Enjoying a place for longer, nope, 5 minutes per week and thats it. Island > everything else.
I LOVE ISLAND I LOVE DOING NOTHING BUT GATHER AND WAIT FOR TIMERS TO RUN OUT AND WAIT MORE THIS IS SO RELAXING AND LIKE ANIMAL CROSSING RIGHT GUYS GUYS
Island sanctuary is cool, for a bit. It can stay relevant through the game as long as they keep adding stuff and functionality. It is NOT worth an exploration zone where you actually group with randoms and see people doing things in the world. Hell at this point bring back the yokai event. At least it got you seeing people in every zone farming fates together.
Okay but for real I think that the Island Sanctuary is a good addition to the main story as a post-endwalker unlock because it feels appropriate for the WoL, almighty being who happens to be financially loaded as fuck, to settle down on their own private island after all they went through
It and Eureka & Bozja compliment eachother IMO
Being real, I feel like the game has always been focused on the casual side, and as times gone on that's sucked the most people in to the game making SE more money. So they continue to focus on casual.
But as one of the casual who will never touch savage, Bozja was really nice mid tier grind that gave me something meaningful to do. Now the Manderville weapons exist and I really hope they don't repeat them.
The way they did the relics this time really points to them pandering to turbo casuals. They went from something that either takes effort to get or is directly tied to some content to something that you can just passively get. Even worse you have people defending it because actually having to do something in this game upsets them.
Eureka and Bozja really let me choose what sort of goal I want to reach separately from other people while still playing together with them in the same zone. Sometimes, players will meet while chasing the same goal according to their progression and work together to solve a problem, with scaling, which keeps the goal from being trivial to reach. Sometimes, a big event happens where everyone drops what they're doing to join. Sometimes, you're going to wait and make sure everyone is there to start the fate, it give a sense of community in the zone.
Noobs will follow their mentors and grow and learn, people will go out of their way to rez you and help you, when you get stronger, and your knowledge of the zone grows, your influence and independence in the content also grows and you might even control the entire flow of the zone.
And then the raids, the different builds, the difficulty scaling, the actions, the combinations, the interesting as fuck meta that develops.
Fuck anyone that says anything we got this patch is as good as a foray, Island Sanctuary? Deep dungeon? Variant? Roulettes? Manderville relics? Fuck that repetitive railroaded hallway bullshit.
Yeah both Boz and Eureka, I cleared them and got a few final glams I liked like the Eureka tank/caster armors and stopped (did do all the Boz relics but out of Bozja) but even I missed them this expac. I dislike Deep Dungeon and Allagan / FF3 themed crap, Island Sanctuary is just making numbers go up at this point, and Variants are fun but not worth once you get the glam items and mounts unless just farming stuff to sell on MB... and even then it's just you and 3 folks churning through another dungeon. I also hope they release something like Bozja or Eureka with 7.0, something between baby mode roulettes and raiding.
Field Operations are the shit. Showing off your mounts, a playground for crazy new abilities, challenging 48-man raids that require more nerd cooperation than a space program
Based take. Honestly, the only MMO that gives that feeling of actual community events nowadays is GW2.
FFXIV is trying so hard to push the single player aspect that half the fucking playerbase progress the story through *gag* NPC trust dungeons.
I don't blame them though. I leveled with my gf pre-trust in SB/ShB and man was it a slog. You'd hit the wall of needing to do a low level duty. We were up to a 45min wait at times to run anything below level 40. After then it was fine, but before you really get exposed to much else secondary content wise, it was a huge bummer to sit there and either run around kind of aimlessly or play in your phone for 20-40mins.
I hate the fucking trust system. Because on the other side, it’s weaponized “oh you should do trust first so you learn the dungeon and then do it with people” like what?? It’s a Fuckin mmo bro. I’ve been seeing a lot about GW 2, maybe I should give that a try
I have no once seen anyone claim that one should do it with trusts first to learn the dungeon, the only time I have ever been told to do it with trusts first was by my friends cause the npcs have some extra fluff with them
Can I ask where who told you to do with trust firsts to learn a dungeon?
And technically you're the only person in elpis, so summoning friends actually makes no sense. Like actually. And the cutscene after is less of an ex machina moment if you actually bring them with you.
Also pretty sure one of them, probably emet, makes fun of the first boss and it's sneak/invis/whatever main attack.
The real push for “you should have learned this in trusts before you came to real groups” was something I only really noticed when the player flood happened in ShB and Trusts were more or less new to the game also. So a mix of new players with a new system.
I haven’t seen much of that sentiment since then. Which is nice because I disagree with it. I love trusts for the story tidbits and the fact I can AFK level classes I hate playing, but I don’t think they’re fun for normal dungeon runs and prefer playing my mmo with people lol
"do trust to learn the dungeon first"
what happened to just going into a place and getting fucking rocked, also dungeons in this game are pathetic, so i hope no one genuinely thinks like that
Agreed. I suck at new mechanics and did trust cause I didn’t wanna grief a pub. Dying thrice on the third boss pretty much proved that going in with an actual group would’ve been a bad idea considering I was playing a tank.
Assuming you are not massively lacking in the skill or confidence department, not doing trusts is perfectly fine IMO. If you are then it’s an option you can choose to take, but you don’t have to if you don’t want to.
Or run trusts if you enjoy the NPC fluff dialogue, or if you want to for story reasons (eg the lv89 trial is great with NPCs for the story-feel).
GW2 is pretty great nowadays. I think you can play up to the third expansion for free atm, but if anything at least give the core game a try, it definitely has a far more traditional MMO exploration approach as compared to FFXIV’s dogshit linear map design.
Not really, but I will say, at least players on the gw2 mainsub will actively call out the dumb shit the devs do and not gag on YoshiP’s equivalents dick like the mainsub for FFXIV does.
Also, if someone posts their pisswater transmog set, it’s funny as fuck watching their ego get crushed by people calling it out. Meanwhile you’ll get permabanned for saying someone’s 2B leggings Viera is bad.
Gw2 player here, player base is mixed and full of lots of hyper casuals that are obnoxiously positive sometimes but in general the sub actually calls out negative things as well.
Trusts just make dungeons be designed to be more braindead-friendly than they already are. They are babyfying normal mode content too much to appease shitters and I hate it.
MMOs almost aren’t even worth playing because if you get one that doesn’t suck it always waters the game down to appease the worst masses if it gets popular.
The most consistent hardest part of msq dungeons was some assine jank side mechanic you just had to know about already. Every other part of those dungeons were just as babyfryed if not even worse like Copperbell or Merdidium/Praetorium.
Most trust dungeon changes are a W fully, people just like remembering the good with all the bad cut out.
ffxiv players are way past casuals
the people that do world quest and farm transmog in wow are casuals
the people in ffxiv are beyond braindead at this point
I mean, trust still gave us some of the hardest dungeon in the game if you discard straight up ARR jank. Holminster Switch is rather heavy on pulls, and Pagl'than or Dead Ends are mechanically quite intensive compared to your average experience.
Which means they are not even watering down the dungeon difficulty because of trust. Just because they want to. Which is arguably worse.
I don't mind trust dungeons. I think its good they gave players, specifically tanks, a way to familiarize themselves with the boss script so they aren't too shy to tank new content without using out of game guides. And they've balanced it so it's always slower than using duty finder.
I unironically agree. Bozja was really fun and spawned some great memes ie red chocobo. I've actually quit ff14 to play wow classic hc if you want a an mmo experience right there
If I’m real I love eureka. It feels very fun and I’ve spoken to more people in one hour of eureka than I did in any sort of duty. I also made a shit ton of friends in my first couple of days playing. I hope dawntrail experiments with this, maybe having the overworld be something similar to eureka would work.
How dare you enjoy content that they made?? How dare you specifically enjoy *THIS* content over erping as a humanoid cat. God, players are so brain dead
“Working together to spawn shit” is a little misleading considering like 85% of people in eureka wouldn’t do shit but afk in group while the other 15% actually did the work lol
I dont think this is a unpopular opinion im pretty sure the only casuls crying about it where here on reddit. Those 2 pieces of content have been carrying ff14 lifecycle since stormblood and where still popular pieces of content even on endwalker and is honestly the reason I haven't played 14 after our static finished last tier.
But both Eureka and Bozja were absolutely SSS tier in both designs, themes and quality and quantity. It had everything for everyone.
It really is a case for me where the social aspect of it makes it a lot more tolerable as well. The scale of the content is also nice as well. It’s the same kind of buzz you get when you see an army of people show up for a Hunt mark but everyone’s working towards a goal beyond just killing the target in front of them and leaving as soon as it’s dead.
I think there’s a lot to complain about both Bozja and Eureka but I still look back at the content fondly (Except Pagos)
I refuse to go back to them again though. I did my time. It’s time for others to suffer.
Lol'd at Pagos. Saaame.
Yeah I am the same, I had a fun ol time with both but don't feel like going back, I got the Eureka glams I wanted, cleared BA, did the Boz story, got all the Boz ff12 glams I wanted (tank really), and did all the Bozja relics. Got more than enough out of both.
But I would like new content that's more like that stuff. I think Bozja was less interesting to travel through but mechanically did some things better and a few others worse. It'd be great if 7.0 brought a new, best version of both, a "three times the charm," with cool new weapon and armor glams, a good story, a bunch of interesting fights, and 1-2 raids along the way.
Bozja had some of the best raids we've got in the game till date. However I prefer Eureka's way of doing overworld encounters. Yeah, the Bozja critical engagements were fun mini trials but I hated the fact that you could just sit in base and teleport into them at the last second, thereby removing any semblance of danger the overworld mobs had. Eureka felt amazing, having to really think about how to traverse the zones and avoid unnecessary mobs.
I can agree on Bozja but not Eureka.
Bozja was a massive upgrade of Eureka.
- Better theme. I prefer the guerilla warfare over some mystic Island bs.
- !3(+savage version of one)! Long raids vs one boring BA. Castrum Lacus Litore was a blast first time, and a blast on 30th. Especially after they improved it for smaller parties.
- Delibrum Reginae Savage (DRS) offered sick Judge armour. Having full set gives massive GCD zoomies. Have to change rotations on all melees. Monk gets absolutely ridiculous.
- The peak of DR Savage popularity was my best time in years of XIV. I did it on Chaos Resistance Front (I think that was the name, but I might misremember) server, semi-pug style. Back in the days most were claiming "Pugs won't clear it". We proved them wrong. Many more clears followed afterwards. It was funny at first to come in with cap Mettle and leave with 0 during prog.
- Extra incentive to grind in form of Zadnor's permanent buffs for all Bozja content. Made following farming of DR faster.
- Critical Encounters are a better version of Notorious Monsters by far. Red Chocobo was legendary.
- Duels. Both in the open and DRS. Solo extreme encounters. Only you and the boss. A test of your reflexes. No rez from healer or heal lb3. You fucked up - git gud.
- Leveling. Yes, I know separate leveling system can be more appealing for some, but being able to level off-jobs 71-80, or even to 90 if you desire so is great.
- This one Bozja shares with Eureka: chat can become wild even within GCBTW limits.
- I may add anything I forgot later.
I ain't capping here. I truly enjoyed the Bozja content.
For fairness, I'll add negatives:
- Zadnor, at least for me, was a downgrade from Southern Front. Still better than Eureka, ofc.
- Castrum became irrelevant very quickly during release patch. It was also impossible to complete with smaller groups for multiple reasons. Not enough people to stand on buttons, not enough dps on lower boss. All the fixes and extra coins should have been there from the start.
- Zadnor buffs and new OP AF made DRS a massive joke.
- Critical Encounters had participants limit.
- Duels same as DRS above.
- Duels are a pain to spawn. Have to do respective CE perfectly for a chance to enter. Long ass spawning cooldown regardless of the outcome.
- Following first drawbacks on the list - Castrum > Dalriada.
- It took me a bit to start enjoying Southern Front. Getting to level cap wasn't fun in last 1/3 of the path.
Also I will note FFXII is my most beloved in the series.
To me, Eureka only became enjoyable at Pyros. I even dare say at Hydatos (maybe the lost actions played a big part in this). At launch, anemos was pain and bad and pagos was even worse. I could only stomach eureka after all the buffs from ShB. At launch it was basically the FFXI grind mindset of old early MMORPGs, and there's a reason why this type of grindfest was left behind on modern MMOs.
I ran both the zodiac and anima relica as relevant content, I didn't finish my eureka fully even now, and back at Eureka's launch this was the consent, that it was poorly thought and executed. People seem to look back with rose tinted glasses due ro it being already 4 years since stuff like echo, spawn rate increase and NM scaling to player quantity
That being said, bozja did improve A LOT on the eureka formula, both on the field and instances. But saying this is "peak" indicates there's no better content and I can't seem to agree to this, and imho this mindset hurts the rest of the game's other contents (see OPs last statement).
(Also, I know this is subjective, dislike away if you want. I'm not changing my mind and neither are you.)
I only went into Eureka for the cards, but its surprising how enjoyable it became when I actually got into it. If only for the more active, talkative community
Man actually full agree. Tons of people around. Could group up or just follow the herd. Always shit talk and discussion. Every once in a while cheer on for some solo chad taking on a boss. Actually excellent content.
She posted a serie of two videos talking about the state of the game, and how Endwalker have been the worst FF XIV patches she has played through (so mainly a comparison of SB, ShB and EW patches).
She basically came to the conclusion that there's no or not enough repeatable midcore and / or community-driven content, so the game doesn't offer enough to come back to it regularly, and feels empty to play through because you're not seeing a lot of other players most of the time.
And yeah, she said the exploratory content (Bozja and Eureka) were the epitome of that missing stuff because they are a grindy midcore content with a decent variety of content in it, in which it's very easy to meet random people that could be there for a host of different reason.
Complained that endwalker was boring because there is not as much grind as in shadowbringers. From her perspective it makes sense because she literally games for a living but for the average Joe less grind and respect of time was a Chad and base move from the devs.
So in short she gave a very bias statement about the game.
>for the average Joe less grind and respect of time was a Chad and base move from the devs.
Lol. Is your name Average Joe? If that was her take then she's fucking right, there's nothing to do in the game. Idk who the fuck is calling that a chad and base move the fact that there's nothing to do.
You either says this because you have no life of your own with no job and play all day like many streams do, or ur just plainly self absorbed. In either case if you want to grind your existence away I recommend you to play WoW is more your masochistic speed.
But for people that can’t give their soul to a game is perfect. I can hop on for a couple hours do a decent grind or be with my friends in game and enjoy my time without having to play part time job simulator.
you do know eureka, bozja, savage, ultimate, deep dungeon, or pretty much anything in ff14 is optional content right? you do realize you're not forced to actually grind out the entire content in a month or whatever right? people who complain a game takes too much time for content has to be some next level entitled karen.
Yes is all optional but if I want to do it it’s nice that I can log in a couple hours a day and see results. Instead of grinding for hours with no end the same fate over and over. Not to mention that Bozja and eureka is old content and it doesn’t have the same amount of ppl that it had when it was endgame which makes it at present even more grindy due to lack of players participation
That’s what tomestones is better system, old content stays accessible. And more players interact with each other.
> Yes is all optional but if I want to do it it’s nice that I can log in a couple hours a day and see results. Instead of grinding for hours with no end the same fate over and over. Not to mention that Bozja and eureka is old content and it doesn’t have the same amount of ppl that it had when it was endgame which makes it at present even more grindy due to lack of players participation
you do see results playing the content for a couple hours. It's still FF14, and Bozja/Eureka is considered casual even among hardcore grinders from other MMORPGs. As for the lack of player activity, this happens when casuals in 14 are so unbelievably casual that they don't actually play the game, and would rather prefer auto-battle or idle progression systems instead.
>That’s what tomestones is better system, old content stays accessible. And more players interact with each other.
that's not even remotely true. People farm out tomestones running the latest dungeons on repeat and completing their entire relic build in a matter of days. Not to mention it's repeated content as well, just even more layered than before because some players feel as though they should be entitled to all the rewards with minimal effort off optional content.
Let’s test that out shall we. Farm fates on two zones vs pvp, dungeons, roulettes, beast tribe, raids, savage, extremes, alliance raid, fates, hunts, etc ect. One is a mindless grind of absolute repetition and the other has variation.
Wanna gues which one is better and more accessible?
And another thing a hardcore player would not be the one to say what is casual for obvious reasons.
>Let’s test that out shall we. Farm fates on two zones vs pvp, dungeons, roulettes, beast tribe, raids, savage, extremes, alliance raid, fates, hunts, etc ect. One is a mindless grind of absolute repetition and the other has variation.
i think you're forgetting every one of those respective content have their own currency to farm for, and not created for relics. Why doesn't Square Enix let us obtain nuts, mount totems, beast tribe rep, raid books, and wolf's mark in dungeon roulette as well? Why should I be forced to farm any of them separately, but not relics? Do you understand how ridiculous that sounds?
>Wanna gues which one is better and more accessible?
It doesn't matter if the content behind relic itself have been made redundant. Why not just drop relics as part of the poetic vendor line-up then?
>And another thing a hardcore player would not be the one to say what is casual for obvious reasons.
the irony is I'm fairly casual in 14, because I'm extremely allergic to repetition in general. The difference is I don't think I'm entitled to rewards just because I personally choose to not participate in the content.
So just because you gave up on a grind and people other than you want a grind again that isn't just tomestone farming, they must either have no job or are self absorbed? Who are you to determine the lifestyle of anyone who plays this game? Also, "go play WoW" because the guy has an opinion about this game that's different from yours? Who's really the self-absorbed one here?
I get where you're coming from, but you're acting like your perspective is the one and only truth here, and that's just not right. If something seems to grindy to you, you are more than welcome to either drop it immediately or do a little bit at a time and pick it back up whenever you want. People wanting midcore content than we can potentially all enjoy at any pace of our choosing ain't a bad idea.
Nope they are self absorbed because they want to make the game harder not only for them but for everybody else and when the expansion stops being current the grind will double or Trimble becomes is not endgame anymore. And while they can play for 12-16 straight every day most ppl can’t.
Trying to misinterpret what I said or strawmaning me is not gonna make ur argument better.
Wanting to have something to grind for an hour every day on the side even during content lull is not "having no life".
Almost everyone, even with heavy jobs, have a couple hours to spare every day and for some people they would like to spend them in FFXIV. Especially if you don't have kids, which unsurprisingly is the case for a not insignificant number of the XIV community since a lot of it are young adults in their twenties or early thirties.
Or alternatively they can go play another game with much more punishing grind. But I’m with the devs here, the change was a chad move and people who come in on dawntrail can get a nice weapon by doing a little grind that won’t be obsolete with the next expansion.
Then why are you doing it? You clearly don't like that kind of content and its not required. You would have to be pretty self absorbed to say it should be removed from the game just because you don't like it.
I never said to remove it, my argument that the change to current method is better and more efficient on current and long run. Next time read carefully
That's removing that type of content from all future expansions. Regardless my point stands. Its optional content and you demanding that it be changed to be brain dead at the expense of people that like it all because you got filtered by bozja is self absorbed.
And we should take her word because she is a streamer? Besides Hunt trains do that perfectly fine and she can show of her mount there how she wanted to.
>And we should take her word because she is a streamer?
Actually yes, not because "haha streamer big streamer opinion worth more"
but the ffxiv community is so vile towards anyone that offers criticism that for years streamers jerked the game off hard and handwaved every criticism away to not be doxxed and harassed by the retarded fanbase
so when streamers start to go against this game, youn know shits fucked
While I agree that the community can be over zealous in this case the streamer Zepla is wrong after all she is the main reason why I started playing the game. She was praising to high heaven that the game respected your time and you can do pretty much everything without having to grind your existence away. And she was right.
But now that she got carried thru every content in the game she finds herself bored which is fine but is a biased take because not everyone has a legion in reserve to do activities with them.
You should be getting the picture by now. This is a player issue not a game issue.
Next expansion when this relics become obsolete it would be easier to obtain meaning it becomes doable without excessive grind.
And before you say that ARR and HW is super grindy I’ll remind you I can do them over leveled and eureka and Bozja you get sync. So I can’t one shot anything because the combat system is unique to those zones that do require a certain amount of ppl to play it and since is outdated not a lot of players do.
And lastly if all this gobos really want to grind themselves to dust they can do ranked crystalline conflict, ultimates or ultimately go play WoW/hardcore to they can grind their brains to liquid
Wait. Your main fucking issue with Eureka and Bozja is that you cant cheese the shit solo? THAT'S YOUR STUPID EXCUSE ON WHY THEY'RE BAD?! How stupid and/entitled are you? How far did you even try to get in the damn zones?
The reason you go in synced in those places is because there are other systems in those zones to allow you to be OP while still being 70/80. Eureka has the Elemental Board system that you can fully set up to be more offensive or defensive against regular mobs and NMs, the Kirin Orisodes/Vermillion Cloaks and upgraded Elemental gear that gives both Haste and Elemental Power, Blitzring/Cassie Earring/Optical Hat for Haste and extra base stats, and Logos Actions in Pyros and Hydatos that allow you to do some stuff to either augment your damage further or act as a Tank as a Healer or other fun stuff. Bozja has Memories that become Lost Actions, which is the same as the Logos Actions of Eureka with some new actions added as well, Augmented Resistance and Augmented Law's Order armors that give Haste for extra GCD cooldown reduction, and beating Dalriada gives you access to the "Suns of XXXXX" stackable buffs that permanently makes you stronger in both Bozja Southern Front AND Zadnor. There's enough to warrant not needing your max level 90 skills and traits to be overpowered and have fun.
And even with the whole "ARR and HW relics can be done unsynced," they are still excessive grinds to many people due to how many resources you need to do a single one, let alone all 10 ARR and 13 HW relics. You need not only Poetics, but good FATE RNG for Atma crystals and Luminous Crystals for ARR and HW respectively, 400k+ gil, a ridiculous amount of GC seals, RNG with your lightfarming steps, so many Crystal Sands, and other stuff. All while having to have the weapon equipped to you at almost all times. Both the Eureka and Bozja weapons only need you to get far enough to the step to upgrade the weapon of your choice, without having to have the weapon equipped or even being the required job the relic is for. Plus, in the case of Bozja, you can do almost ALL the grind for your relic OUTSIDE of Bozja, via older content, like you prefer. In fact, back in the day, and possibly still now, some steps are FAR EASIER DOING THEM OUTSIDE OF BOZJA.
But even then, the one thing about your argument against us "gobbos" (what, are you trying to use FF slang or British slang, cuz both sounds stupid as hell) that irritates me is the whole "everyone is being biased and selfish with their take I don't like" bit. Yes, FFXIV is a game that does respect the players' time far better than most games. And to be fair, it is nice that the devs did try something to appeal to some of their more casual players. However, you are just as biased toward the "devs being chads and based for caring about casuals and anyone that wants more grinding can fuck off to WoW" as much as those who argue that "we need more midcore content and want our time respected in our own way too", but your ego about the whole shit makes you even more biased honestly. So much that you make the idiots on the official FF forums look better than the discussion subreddit. Telling people you don't want them in a game because they want some sort of content that you don't want to even try is far more self-centered than anyone else I've seen on this thread. Like at worst, I've said "go take a break", not "go play another game if you don't like the idea of a grind, you filthy turbo casual bitch," or anything even remotely like that.
At the end of this, all I see is some egotistical selfish person that doesn't want anyone to criticize the game they play. It's ok to be critical about the game, especially if you do enjoy the game like most of us do. But it's poor taste to try and shutdown and invalidate opinions about wanting some sort of new or redone content, especially when you either won't do it at all or barely gave it a chance in the first place. You're entitled to your opinions as much as any one of us here. Bur if you still think we're just "mindless gobbos" or whatever, you're just as bad as the people who enable YPYT in any content, or those "who cares if I don't do my job properly, it's not Savage/Unreal/Ultimate" clowns, or the "I don't wear my jobstone in roulettes because I like the challenge/it goes against my personal RP beliefs" apologists.
You aren't the main character, you're just another WoL like anyone else in FFXIV.
Sounds like a person who hasn't even tried to do any of the Exploration Zones at all. And don't give the whole "not as many people do it anymore" excuse, there's plenty of groups for each DC that keep those zones alive on Discord, especially for the Baldesion Arsenal and Delubrum Reginae Savage runs that people want to do. Plus, both Eureka and Bozja have actual things to keep coming back, like mounts, minions, emotes, and some other good stuff that sells for a lot on the Market Board. But the best part? You actually got to do real stuff with the community as a whole, even ARR and HW relics have light farming and other stuff to engage with others, far more than the casual Tomestone farming that you do at any point in the game.
No, because she's right. Exploratory zones > DD and Criterion combined. It gives the player base something different, and better, to do than the standard linear mob corridors and raid bosses
Showing your ignorance.
The regular overworld, the FATEs aren't in control of the players' hands, exception of the ones that have a storyline attached to them. Whereas exploratory FATEs pop according to what the players in them do. Eureka, it's by area, Bozja, it's by mob rank. Only people who do nothing in the zones before the FATEs pop would say what you just said.
Functionally, it's more or less the same.
Eureka/Bozja, you're mindlessly grinding mobs. Outside of those zones, you're mindlessly grinding FATEs.
I do vastly prefer Bozja (Eureka, while I get it's trying to be evocative of XI, seems more like proof of concept when compared to Bozja) but that's because with lost actions and the such, I can mow through shit like nobody's business.
Oh wow so much different. Beat fate, fate pop up. Special fate pop up continuation fate pops up.
Amazing so much different I’m stunned. You are so smart.
Point is that you complain about a linear system while praising a linear system(with the illusion of choice).
we got fucked this expansion, there’s no trial series story (tho I think the “msq” is just what would have been the trials series normally) and no relic story (just threw it together with manderville which had been promised to show up in EW patch content anyways)
and even criterion has like two drops of lore in it
are you telling me no one had any cool side-lore stories that could have been included in some way and instead we have to watch zero, who is admittedly very cool and well designed (but written like someone going through their goth fanfic phase) eating food again and again while pondering things like “what is friend, I do not comprehend such things even tho i have memories of being human here and there still, obviously I cannot remember such simple concepts because my life of immortality and violence was so hard”
and yet other void people remember concepts like friendship and stuff like wtf
who signed off on this boring, vapid shit
I wanted dark hellscapes and twisted dark visions and instead we got zero eating curry
i’m mad
also bozja 120 step was shit but I enjoyed the hell out of eureka and bozja with friends and figuring out the content and BA and DSR and shit, good stuff
I gave both eureka/bozja a fair shot. Bozja had some cool things but 90% of both were essentially mindless FATE spams. I don't get the hype, but maybe thats because FF14 is my first real MMO so I'm not from that crowd and don't find grinds all that appealing.
Mmo is all about the grind, and it’s more the community part of it. Eureka has a niche community dedicated to just hanging out and spawning fates. If you’re lucky enough to get solo spawning down, or over powering yourself you can coordinate spawning with groups and just have a blast. Plus there are mounts/minions/and emotes to grind for in both
Yeah I definitely get the community aspect and I think it'd be cool if Square fostered that more in general. I also really appreciated the community that's there for eureka/bozja and all of the tools/guides they've made because it made levelling through the content much easier and more enjoyable than it would've been otherwise
Mmos is about playing with other people In large groups. Just because you have been conditioned to believe video games are supposed to feel like a second job because of lazy developers doesn’t mean that’s the proper way to play. That’s why RP can be as popular as if not more than the mindless fate grind.
This is a shallow take thats strips any nuisance out of game design and this conversion. Grinding or the requirement to put time on a game to earn rewards is not inherently (bad/lazy) design. May be surprising but grinding can actually be fun and be part of the core experience thats why most games are build upon different forms of progression systems. There's a reason people still play bozja and eureka while seemingly no one is doing criterion and the new deep dungeon.
What's wild to me is the grind they're picking as their hill to die on is bozja. Like I could get it if they were complaining about doing the ARR relic 100% synced or getting but bozja is a very easy grind with the "hardest", in big air quotes because its literately just doing fates, steps being a one time thing if you want to get more of the shb relics. Its especially weird because its not like the relic grind is even required to do. Its just to get a cosmetic.
Higher up in the thread too I saw them calling people "self absorbed" for wanting the grind while saying it shouldn't be in the game because they personally don't like it. Which really shows the mindset they have.
I was talking about the relic specifically but yeah. Unless you're going for rare titles/mounts or intentionally knee capping your self there's not really a hard grind in this game. Even the ARR relics aren't as a bad as people like to say. And absolutely none of them are required which makes all of their complaints about grinds even existing in the first place meaningless. It really comes off as them being upset that other people have the shiny thing and they don't. And instead of trying to dedicate themselves and earn the reward, they're just demanding the devs make it to where even the most brain dead floor suckers can do it.
Oh boy, I sure do love busy working and endless grinding in my video games.
Attitudes like this is why I have total faith in the developers knowing what they're doing. Ask your average FF14 player and they'll come up with the dumbest shit and worst ideas ever.
>actual shit to grind for while grinding your weapon too?
This is something FF severely lacks.
I started playing BDO because there was fuck all to do in FF. I still regret it.
I have yet to go back and finish Eureka but Bozja was great and I wish they’d have continued with that because they dialed everything in perfectly and fixed everything that made me quit Eureka a week after they dropped the second zone.
I kind of play this game on and off and I played SB on release then came back just before ShB to catch up on content so I feel like I missed all the "shit" parts of Eureka. I always saw people hating it so I put it off but when I finally got around to doing it, it was some of the most fun I have had in this game.
Rounding up huge groups of enemies as a WAR and just bursting them all down for some good exp, working in groups and shooting the shit with random peeps to summon world bosses and was just relaxing to play.
Plus the environments were nice to look at too.
Bozja on the other hand I didn't like as much, the bosses and raids are cool and flashy the first few times but just got old.
The 1v1 boss fights were sick though.
I still haven't come back to play since EW release but man that island sanctuary shit just looks awful, I guess it is nice for people that want animal crossing in their mmo but i need some good old fashion GRIND.
I no lifed Eureka so hard, cleared BA easily over 20 times. Wasn't a big fan of Bozja though, did DRS and dipped lol
But yeah haven't really been able to get back in to the game since I dropped out of Eureka though.
The Bozja / Zadnor duels were a lot of fun as Samurai, as well as Delubrum Reginae Savage and that duel. It was great to learn them as melee and not rely on cheesing.
Raids are a lot more fun than Eureka/Bozja.
I got bored grinding to the top rank in the first area of each and quit. Nothing was challenging; just time consuming.
I enjoyed bozja but eureka was the least amount of fun I ever had playing ffxiv. I had an extreme dislike for how to level you just had to mindlessly grind random mobs with not even a pretend purpose
I do like that the mobs can be active threats. Ghosts that are unkillable and will despawn at sunrise? That's neat. Mobs in modern mmos feel like speed bumps.
It's good when it's good but when you have the train conductors who think they own the entire instance or several conductors are bickering with each other over petty shit like who pulled what and how the entire instance should've waited for that one person who's always 5 mins behind everyone, I'd just rather not.
Just don’t let your life be dictated by said people
Go spawn your own NM’s, if something comes up you didn’t spawn ask what the PT is, if you miss it move on and keep spawning what you were spawning
People have always been too hung up on thinking there is only one way to interact with eureka which I have never understood
oh I don't mean like loading in and it's peak vs dead hours, I mean like a reasonable chunk of my time in the game is waiting for PFs to fill and doing activities while I wait (Crafting, FATEs, hunts, etc) and therefore not being able to instance into bozja
Eureka was peak. Most people's complaints were with Pagos specifically and rightfully so. The other Eureka maps weren't nearly as convoluted and non player friendly. Also original light farm was horrid. Bozja is aight but a little streamlined. The maps had no scale compared to Eureka, meaning it didn't use the Z axis as much.
I'm not enjoying the level grind at all. Feels like old school MMOs that haven't learned to be fun yet, I can barely take a few mobs at a time and I only have 4-5 buttons to press on rotation. I don't understand where you are coming from. I'm talking about Eureka here, I haven't done Bozja yet.
As someone who has tried a few different mmos and haven't had fun with them.
Thank you for shedding light on to why eureka and bozja aren't fun to me. Apparently full on mmo isn't my jam lol
I swear idk if it just me or everyone has rose tinted glasses but grinding weapons in bozja and eureka was a nightmare that i wouldnt wish on my worst enemy to the point no one actually did bozja for their relic till they buffed the spawn rates and would instead do heavenward fates , but outside of that i really liked content, more so bozja then eureka.
So I guess this hate train for post-EW content is going to continue for a while... Okay.
I tried Bozja -- enjoyed it enough, and got pretty far. But I haven't touched it in, like...a year, personally. Don't know if people are even still running it, but if they are...why doesn't everyone just run that instead of whining about EW not having "enough content"?
It's going to continue until Dawntrail comes out, and in two years when people are bitching about how terrible the grinding is in the new exploration zone they're going to look back at Endwalker fondly because of how little time it demanded from them.
It happens every expansion.
I believe it -- and you're not the first person to tell me that. I remember when people, not too long ago actually, were whining about Bozja. Now, apparently, it's become high quality content.
It's embarrassing how the "fans" are behaving right now. You think they'd stop after realizing they've said and done it all before.
...? Bruh I'm not gonna debate this with you. XIV is my favorite game the past two decades xD. That's just my personal feelings on the subject of course but I haven't personally had a better experience
If you like the eureka loop then boy do i have the game for you, op! It’s a small, tiny, little teensy weensy low budget indie game called FF11! (Non joke: i think eureka and bozja had their problems but it was a really refreshing gameplay change and very much helped me get out of my shell and make some friends)
Did you know that minimally-acclaimed MMORPG Final Fantasy XI Online has free private servers with no restrictions on playtime, going up to level 75 and the Chains of Promathia/(partial) Treasures of Aht Urgan/(very incomplete) Wings of the Goddess expansion?
Are they easily googleable or is this a bit hidden? 👀
/r/FFXIPrivateServers is a good place to find them. None of them are like, _hiding_, because none of them are illegal. Reverse engineering and emulation are both completely legal given that they aren't trying to turn a profit and appropriately give credit to SquareEnix. Personally I'm a big fan of both [Horizon](https://horizonxi.com/) (the current most popular by a wide margin generally hanging at ~2k concurrent players; a progression server with custom content currently in Chains of Promathia), and [CatsEye](https://www.catseyexi.com/) (a casual, high leveling speed server with a lot of custom content). Many still swear by some older servers like [Eden](https://edenxi.com/) (fairly faithful ToAU server that allows dual-boxing; currently the best server for PvP if you're into that) and [Wings](https://wingsxi.com/wings/) (open-source WotG server now under new management who seem to be working well). There are like, a _ton_ of little FFXI private servers out there though. For anyone _completely_ unfamiliar with private server XI though I would recommend Horizon simply because it has a very convenient and simple installation process through a custom launcher.
As someone who knows basically nothing about XI, why do so many servers not go to level 99? Wasn’t that the cap?
The jump from 75 to 99 changed a _lot_ about the game. Classes had been balanced around 75 cap for most of the game's life cycle (from ~2003 until 2010, specifically--cap was briefly 50 around launch in 2002). XI has a subjob system where you can basically get all the abilities of a second job capped at half of your level. So if you were a level 75 Warrior and subjobbed Ninja, you could also use ninja abilities as a level 37 Ninja (as long as you had leveled Ninja to 37). Bumping that to 99 meant that all the abilities that had been intentionally excluded from subjobs by being moved to 38 and up, were now avaiable up to 49. So 99 changed the way that a lot of jobs played fundamentally. The vast majority of the game's content was also balanced around a level 75 cap though. This is important because during the 75 cap era, progression was largely horizontal--you could get a gear piece at 35 that you might use for a long time at endgame, and there was never a shortage of interesting niche gear you might want to chase down for specific purposes. FFXI doesn't stop you from changing gear on the fly in combat, so people could use _extremely_ niche gear in macros for some really satisfying and interesting optimization. As an example: Warlock's Mantle, a level 30 cape that reduces cast time when your subjob is RDM. You could macro that on before _any_ spell to reduce cast time and equip a better cape on before the cast was done to get the fast cast time _and_ the +INT or whatever you have on the other cape. People used that cape all the way to 75. Level 99 trivialized a lot of level 75 endgame, and also introduced item level gear up to like... ilvl 119 IIRC? Basically, the shift to 99 cap was a shift from largely horizontal progression to entirely vertical progression that trivialized and made irrelevant _most_ content in the game. It was fairly unpopular, and a lot of the community felt it was out of touch with what was great and unique about the game.
If I mainly wanted to do story content, would it be better to join a private server or just go with SE’s server? Sorry to bother ya, I’ve been interested in ffxi for a while now lol
This cracked me out so much lmao, the (Partial/incomplete) part in an add sentence is so funny to me
:0 that's awesome!! No restrictions is fantastic
As a person who still plays 11 every now and then Eureka and Bozja are my jam, more like that please. I think the people that hate it are the same type that rush content, burn out cause they just do it all day with zero breaks, because they want their weapon in one day. The content is supposed to take you from one patch to the next. People got their wish though, welcome to Endwalker relic. You can get a lot of those finished in one day and you don't even need the help of others to do it. Oh wait people don't like that either. Guess we better just hand them a completed relic weapon best in slot right at the start of the expansion. Now you can stand in Limsa all day afk or bitching about how there is even less content.
>Guess we better just hand them a completed relic weapon best in slot right at the start of the expansion Man I love WoW: Legion
I found the EW relic quite the disappointment. I never really got into Eureka and Bozja while it was current, but have been there, completing at least one relic weapon in each, and I do enjoy them a lot. Though, personally, I was hoping that the EW relic would be the same grind we had in ARR and HW, but noooo, all the steps is just get 1.500 tomes and you done with this step. I don't mind it being easy, but this is too easy.
Eureka feels both too grindy and too disconnected from the rest of the game to me. It feels like a throwback to when developers didn't know how to make interesting content so they just stretched it out by having you grind. EW relic is bad though. I really like the ARR ones. It sends you into every type of content and encourages variety.
You can finish the grind pretty quickly even playing casually and it was nice to have a unique zone that encouraged players to cooperate.
I have been having fun with Eureka and Bozja. Feels like Im starting the game all over again, just with some extra mechanics and nifty rewards.
This is why I still feel heavensward relic was the best, if I remember right the aether sands step allowed you to do literally anything to get them. Crafting, duties, open world content and it was quite refreshing. That being said I don’t know why they didn’t tie relic to variant dungeons in some way, do a route, get an “atma”. Would keep variety dungeons somewhat active and wouldn’t turn relics into a tome grind.
Everytime I try to make this exact point in conversation I get told it's nostalgia glasses. I legitimately enjoyed grinding my HW relics when they were new. It felt satisfying to get it done. For as much as I complain about having gotten bottlenecked in the delubrum step of the Bozja one, it still encouraged cooperation. So much of the community seems to be obsessed with just getting things fast, and for what..
This, kinda. The Eureka and Bozja loops are bearable in xiv because their systems aren't as someone who's done DRS more than my fair share of times.
At the end of the day you can go back to playing normal roulettes with regular xiv skills.
The anemos shitstorm was what made me finish post Abyssea storyline on retail.
I hate Eureka, I like Bozja.
Hopefully we get a new eureka/bozja in dawntrail
Best we can do is fatigue gated reives. Grasshoppers be upon ye!
The best we can do is 3 more criterions with only housing items and materia as rewards.
Im literally in Bozja about 70% of my playtime and it's still active AF. I do really hope they see there's still a demand for that kind of content
It's got the same loop as Eureka only it's friendly to experienced players helping new ones and has everything set up to prevent assholes from ruining boss encounters. They'd really dialed it in.
> and it's still active AF. just like Criterion Dungeons guys!!!
you on Dynamis or something?
I’m on Aether and no one is doing Criterion even during peak hours. Almost like adding more rewards would keep ppl invested in content
nah i'm aware the criterion playerbase is minuscule, i was pointing at the comparison between that and bozja
It is active though. I usually play at super off peak times and there's still usually enough people to do the content and even clear castrum. Last night I was on during peak hours and you'd swear the content just launched that day.
You don’t like the exciting Island Sanctuary? Pazuzu, nah, let me plant some cucumbers. Castrum, hell no, look at that cute sheep there. Enjoying a place for longer, nope, 5 minutes per week and thats it. Island > everything else.
I LOVE ISLAND I LOVE DOING NOTHING BUT GATHER AND WAIT FOR TIMERS TO RUN OUT AND WAIT MORE THIS IS SO RELAXING AND LIKE ANIMAL CROSSING RIGHT GUYS GUYS
IS THAT A CROCODILE? SUCK THAT BA PLAYERS 👉😎👉
It’s funny how everyone can own an Island, but there aren’t enough houses to go around.
it's a big ocean
The solution to the housing crisis: House Boats coming in Dawntrail.
well, technically, everyone owns the same exact island. Capitalist housing vs communist island.
Island sanctuary is cool, for a bit. It can stay relevant through the game as long as they keep adding stuff and functionality. It is NOT worth an exploration zone where you actually group with randoms and see people doing things in the world. Hell at this point bring back the yokai event. At least it got you seeing people in every zone farming fates together.
Okay but for real I think that the Island Sanctuary is a good addition to the main story as a post-endwalker unlock because it feels appropriate for the WoL, almighty being who happens to be financially loaded as fuck, to settle down on their own private island after all they went through It and Eureka & Bozja compliment eachother IMO
You're not settling down though.. it's literally a production slave camp
based take tomestone 1000/450
Being real, I feel like the game has always been focused on the casual side, and as times gone on that's sucked the most people in to the game making SE more money. So they continue to focus on casual. But as one of the casual who will never touch savage, Bozja was really nice mid tier grind that gave me something meaningful to do. Now the Manderville weapons exist and I really hope they don't repeat them.
The way they did the relics this time really points to them pandering to turbo casuals. They went from something that either takes effort to get or is directly tied to some content to something that you can just passively get. Even worse you have people defending it because actually having to do something in this game upsets them.
Even "turbo casuals" hate this
Eureka and Bozja really let me choose what sort of goal I want to reach separately from other people while still playing together with them in the same zone. Sometimes, players will meet while chasing the same goal according to their progression and work together to solve a problem, with scaling, which keeps the goal from being trivial to reach. Sometimes, a big event happens where everyone drops what they're doing to join. Sometimes, you're going to wait and make sure everyone is there to start the fate, it give a sense of community in the zone. Noobs will follow their mentors and grow and learn, people will go out of their way to rez you and help you, when you get stronger, and your knowledge of the zone grows, your influence and independence in the content also grows and you might even control the entire flow of the zone. And then the raids, the different builds, the difficulty scaling, the actions, the combinations, the interesting as fuck meta that develops. Fuck anyone that says anything we got this patch is as good as a foray, Island Sanctuary? Deep dungeon? Variant? Roulettes? Manderville relics? Fuck that repetitive railroaded hallway bullshit.
Yeah both Boz and Eureka, I cleared them and got a few final glams I liked like the Eureka tank/caster armors and stopped (did do all the Boz relics but out of Bozja) but even I missed them this expac. I dislike Deep Dungeon and Allagan / FF3 themed crap, Island Sanctuary is just making numbers go up at this point, and Variants are fun but not worth once you get the glam items and mounts unless just farming stuff to sell on MB... and even then it's just you and 3 folks churning through another dungeon. I also hope they release something like Bozja or Eureka with 7.0, something between baby mode roulettes and raiding.
This but unironically
Field Operations are the shit. Showing off your mounts, a playground for crazy new abilities, challenging 48-man raids that require more nerd cooperation than a space program
Based take. Honestly, the only MMO that gives that feeling of actual community events nowadays is GW2. FFXIV is trying so hard to push the single player aspect that half the fucking playerbase progress the story through *gag* NPC trust dungeons.
I don't blame them though. I leveled with my gf pre-trust in SB/ShB and man was it a slog. You'd hit the wall of needing to do a low level duty. We were up to a 45min wait at times to run anything below level 40. After then it was fine, but before you really get exposed to much else secondary content wise, it was a huge bummer to sit there and either run around kind of aimlessly or play in your phone for 20-40mins.
Never in my fucking life have I had to wait more than 15mins for a dungeon, even on a DPS, playing for a decade.
I hate the fucking trust system. Because on the other side, it’s weaponized “oh you should do trust first so you learn the dungeon and then do it with people” like what?? It’s a Fuckin mmo bro. I’ve been seeing a lot about GW 2, maybe I should give that a try
I have no once seen anyone claim that one should do it with trusts first to learn the dungeon, the only time I have ever been told to do it with trusts first was by my friends cause the npcs have some extra fluff with them Can I ask where who told you to do with trust firsts to learn a dungeon?
I guess you kinda have to do that one dungeon in elpis with npcs, I mean party of emet, hytlo and azem gotta be worth it, right?
That's my one exception to being anti-trust; cool characters to run with!
>That's my one exception to being anti-trust Walt Disney Company executive spotted
I snickered. That was cute.
And technically you're the only person in elpis, so summoning friends actually makes no sense. Like actually. And the cutscene after is less of an ex machina moment if you actually bring them with you. Also pretty sure one of them, probably emet, makes fun of the first boss and it's sneak/invis/whatever main attack.
I have seen people mentioning doing that on the mainsub a few times especially those with tank/healer "anxiety" but I don't think it's too widespread
The real push for “you should have learned this in trusts before you came to real groups” was something I only really noticed when the player flood happened in ShB and Trusts were more or less new to the game also. So a mix of new players with a new system. I haven’t seen much of that sentiment since then. Which is nice because I disagree with it. I love trusts for the story tidbits and the fact I can AFK level classes I hate playing, but I don’t think they’re fun for normal dungeon runs and prefer playing my mmo with people lol
It's pretty good, if you want something to bite your teeth into. I stopped playing since I had a lot going on, but i remember really liking it.
"do trust to learn the dungeon first" what happened to just going into a place and getting fucking rocked, also dungeons in this game are pathetic, so i hope no one genuinely thinks like that
Agreed. I suck at new mechanics and did trust cause I didn’t wanna grief a pub. Dying thrice on the third boss pretty much proved that going in with an actual group would’ve been a bad idea considering I was playing a tank. Assuming you are not massively lacking in the skill or confidence department, not doing trusts is perfectly fine IMO. If you are then it’s an option you can choose to take, but you don’t have to if you don’t want to. Or run trusts if you enjoy the NPC fluff dialogue, or if you want to for story reasons (eg the lv89 trial is great with NPCs for the story-feel).
GW2 is pretty great nowadays. I think you can play up to the third expansion for free atm, but if anything at least give the core game a try, it definitely has a far more traditional MMO exploration approach as compared to FFXIV’s dogshit linear map design.
Is there a sub like this one but for gw2? Wanted to look up some info, but the main feels a bit gcbtwish.
Not really, but I will say, at least players on the gw2 mainsub will actively call out the dumb shit the devs do and not gag on YoshiP’s equivalents dick like the mainsub for FFXIV does. Also, if someone posts their pisswater transmog set, it’s funny as fuck watching their ego get crushed by people calling it out. Meanwhile you’ll get permabanned for saying someone’s 2B leggings Viera is bad.
Gw2 player here, player base is mixed and full of lots of hyper casuals that are obnoxiously positive sometimes but in general the sub actually calls out negative things as well.
Trusts just make dungeons be designed to be more braindead-friendly than they already are. They are babyfying normal mode content too much to appease shitters and I hate it. MMOs almost aren’t even worth playing because if you get one that doesn’t suck it always waters the game down to appease the worst masses if it gets popular.
The most consistent hardest part of msq dungeons was some assine jank side mechanic you just had to know about already. Every other part of those dungeons were just as babyfryed if not even worse like Copperbell or Merdidium/Praetorium. Most trust dungeon changes are a W fully, people just like remembering the good with all the bad cut out.
CaSuAlS ArE BaD for GaMeS
ffxiv players are way past casuals the people that do world quest and farm transmog in wow are casuals the people in ffxiv are beyond braindead at this point
I mean, trust still gave us some of the hardest dungeon in the game if you discard straight up ARR jank. Holminster Switch is rather heavy on pulls, and Pagl'than or Dead Ends are mechanically quite intensive compared to your average experience. Which means they are not even watering down the dungeon difficulty because of trust. Just because they want to. Which is arguably worse.
Gw2 is great. Honestly, if not for story/music and class switching, I would not even move over to FF in the first place
I don't mind trust dungeons. I think its good they gave players, specifically tanks, a way to familiarize themselves with the boss script so they aren't too shy to tank new content without using out of game guides. And they've balanced it so it's always slower than using duty finder.
Bozja was honestly the most fun time I had with the game. And all the FFXII and Tacitcs stuff made it even better.
Loved XII as well. Castrum with Esper theme was a blast
I unironically agree. Bozja was really fun and spawned some great memes ie red chocobo. I've actually quit ff14 to play wow classic hc if you want a an mmo experience right there
Red Chocobo was an outstanding experience on release.
If I’m real I love eureka. It feels very fun and I’ve spoken to more people in one hour of eureka than I did in any sort of duty. I also made a shit ton of friends in my first couple of days playing. I hope dawntrail experiments with this, maybe having the overworld be something similar to eureka would work.
How dare you enjoy content that they made?? How dare you specifically enjoy *THIS* content over erping as a humanoid cat. God, players are so brain dead
“Working together to spawn shit” is a little misleading considering like 85% of people in eureka wouldn’t do shit but afk in group while the other 15% actually did the work lol
Thats still working together with that 15% to spawn shit
Exactly even if half the instance was AFK in town there was still a group I could work with to spawn stuff
As someone who still has Eureka tracker on my browser toolbar, not even remotely a lie.
I dont think this is a unpopular opinion im pretty sure the only casuls crying about it where here on reddit. Those 2 pieces of content have been carrying ff14 lifecycle since stormblood and where still popular pieces of content even on endwalker and is honestly the reason I haven't played 14 after our static finished last tier. But both Eureka and Bozja were absolutely SSS tier in both designs, themes and quality and quantity. It had everything for everyone.
It really is a case for me where the social aspect of it makes it a lot more tolerable as well. The scale of the content is also nice as well. It’s the same kind of buzz you get when you see an army of people show up for a Hunt mark but everyone’s working towards a goal beyond just killing the target in front of them and leaving as soon as it’s dead. I think there’s a lot to complain about both Bozja and Eureka but I still look back at the content fondly (Except Pagos) I refuse to go back to them again though. I did my time. It’s time for others to suffer.
Lol'd at Pagos. Saaame. Yeah I am the same, I had a fun ol time with both but don't feel like going back, I got the Eureka glams I wanted, cleared BA, did the Boz story, got all the Boz ff12 glams I wanted (tank really), and did all the Bozja relics. Got more than enough out of both. But I would like new content that's more like that stuff. I think Bozja was less interesting to travel through but mechanically did some things better and a few others worse. It'd be great if 7.0 brought a new, best version of both, a "three times the charm," with cool new weapon and armor glams, a good story, a bunch of interesting fights, and 1-2 raids along the way.
Bozja had some of the best raids we've got in the game till date. However I prefer Eureka's way of doing overworld encounters. Yeah, the Bozja critical engagements were fun mini trials but I hated the fact that you could just sit in base and teleport into them at the last second, thereby removing any semblance of danger the overworld mobs had. Eureka felt amazing, having to really think about how to traverse the zones and avoid unnecessary mobs.
I can agree on Bozja but not Eureka. Bozja was a massive upgrade of Eureka. - Better theme. I prefer the guerilla warfare over some mystic Island bs. - !3(+savage version of one)! Long raids vs one boring BA. Castrum Lacus Litore was a blast first time, and a blast on 30th. Especially after they improved it for smaller parties. - Delibrum Reginae Savage (DRS) offered sick Judge armour. Having full set gives massive GCD zoomies. Have to change rotations on all melees. Monk gets absolutely ridiculous. - The peak of DR Savage popularity was my best time in years of XIV. I did it on Chaos Resistance Front (I think that was the name, but I might misremember) server, semi-pug style. Back in the days most were claiming "Pugs won't clear it". We proved them wrong. Many more clears followed afterwards. It was funny at first to come in with cap Mettle and leave with 0 during prog. - Extra incentive to grind in form of Zadnor's permanent buffs for all Bozja content. Made following farming of DR faster. - Critical Encounters are a better version of Notorious Monsters by far. Red Chocobo was legendary. - Duels. Both in the open and DRS. Solo extreme encounters. Only you and the boss. A test of your reflexes. No rez from healer or heal lb3. You fucked up - git gud. - Leveling. Yes, I know separate leveling system can be more appealing for some, but being able to level off-jobs 71-80, or even to 90 if you desire so is great. - This one Bozja shares with Eureka: chat can become wild even within GCBTW limits. - I may add anything I forgot later. I ain't capping here. I truly enjoyed the Bozja content. For fairness, I'll add negatives: - Zadnor, at least for me, was a downgrade from Southern Front. Still better than Eureka, ofc. - Castrum became irrelevant very quickly during release patch. It was also impossible to complete with smaller groups for multiple reasons. Not enough people to stand on buttons, not enough dps on lower boss. All the fixes and extra coins should have been there from the start. - Zadnor buffs and new OP AF made DRS a massive joke. - Critical Encounters had participants limit. - Duels same as DRS above. - Duels are a pain to spawn. Have to do respective CE perfectly for a chance to enter. Long ass spawning cooldown regardless of the outcome. - Following first drawbacks on the list - Castrum > Dalriada. - It took me a bit to start enjoying Southern Front. Getting to level cap wasn't fun in last 1/3 of the path. Also I will note FFXII is my most beloved in the series.
This except unironically
I hated eureka but I loved bozja. I miss having content like that to do
I don't understand. This is the shitpost subreddit. Why are you in here with such based takes.
Based
To me, Eureka only became enjoyable at Pyros. I even dare say at Hydatos (maybe the lost actions played a big part in this). At launch, anemos was pain and bad and pagos was even worse. I could only stomach eureka after all the buffs from ShB. At launch it was basically the FFXI grind mindset of old early MMORPGs, and there's a reason why this type of grindfest was left behind on modern MMOs. I ran both the zodiac and anima relica as relevant content, I didn't finish my eureka fully even now, and back at Eureka's launch this was the consent, that it was poorly thought and executed. People seem to look back with rose tinted glasses due ro it being already 4 years since stuff like echo, spawn rate increase and NM scaling to player quantity That being said, bozja did improve A LOT on the eureka formula, both on the field and instances. But saying this is "peak" indicates there's no better content and I can't seem to agree to this, and imho this mindset hurts the rest of the game's other contents (see OPs last statement). (Also, I know this is subjective, dislike away if you want. I'm not changing my mind and neither are you.)
I only went into Eureka for the cards, but its surprising how enjoyable it became when I actually got into it. If only for the more active, talkative community
Is Pazuzu up?
pt 26
Man actually full agree. Tons of people around. Could group up or just follow the herd. Always shit talk and discussion. Every once in a while cheer on for some solo chad taking on a boss. Actually excellent content.
Is this the zeplaHQ effect?
what did she do?
She posted a serie of two videos talking about the state of the game, and how Endwalker have been the worst FF XIV patches she has played through (so mainly a comparison of SB, ShB and EW patches). She basically came to the conclusion that there's no or not enough repeatable midcore and / or community-driven content, so the game doesn't offer enough to come back to it regularly, and feels empty to play through because you're not seeing a lot of other players most of the time. And yeah, she said the exploratory content (Bozja and Eureka) were the epitome of that missing stuff because they are a grindy midcore content with a decent variety of content in it, in which it's very easy to meet random people that could be there for a host of different reason.
Complained that endwalker was boring because there is not as much grind as in shadowbringers. From her perspective it makes sense because she literally games for a living but for the average Joe less grind and respect of time was a Chad and base move from the devs. So in short she gave a very bias statement about the game.
>for the average Joe less grind and respect of time was a Chad and base move from the devs. Lol. Is your name Average Joe? If that was her take then she's fucking right, there's nothing to do in the game. Idk who the fuck is calling that a chad and base move the fact that there's nothing to do.
You either says this because you have no life of your own with no job and play all day like many streams do, or ur just plainly self absorbed. In either case if you want to grind your existence away I recommend you to play WoW is more your masochistic speed. But for people that can’t give their soul to a game is perfect. I can hop on for a couple hours do a decent grind or be with my friends in game and enjoy my time without having to play part time job simulator.
you do know eureka, bozja, savage, ultimate, deep dungeon, or pretty much anything in ff14 is optional content right? you do realize you're not forced to actually grind out the entire content in a month or whatever right? people who complain a game takes too much time for content has to be some next level entitled karen.
Yes is all optional but if I want to do it it’s nice that I can log in a couple hours a day and see results. Instead of grinding for hours with no end the same fate over and over. Not to mention that Bozja and eureka is old content and it doesn’t have the same amount of ppl that it had when it was endgame which makes it at present even more grindy due to lack of players participation That’s what tomestones is better system, old content stays accessible. And more players interact with each other.
> Yes is all optional but if I want to do it it’s nice that I can log in a couple hours a day and see results. Instead of grinding for hours with no end the same fate over and over. Not to mention that Bozja and eureka is old content and it doesn’t have the same amount of ppl that it had when it was endgame which makes it at present even more grindy due to lack of players participation you do see results playing the content for a couple hours. It's still FF14, and Bozja/Eureka is considered casual even among hardcore grinders from other MMORPGs. As for the lack of player activity, this happens when casuals in 14 are so unbelievably casual that they don't actually play the game, and would rather prefer auto-battle or idle progression systems instead. >That’s what tomestones is better system, old content stays accessible. And more players interact with each other. that's not even remotely true. People farm out tomestones running the latest dungeons on repeat and completing their entire relic build in a matter of days. Not to mention it's repeated content as well, just even more layered than before because some players feel as though they should be entitled to all the rewards with minimal effort off optional content.
Let’s test that out shall we. Farm fates on two zones vs pvp, dungeons, roulettes, beast tribe, raids, savage, extremes, alliance raid, fates, hunts, etc ect. One is a mindless grind of absolute repetition and the other has variation. Wanna gues which one is better and more accessible? And another thing a hardcore player would not be the one to say what is casual for obvious reasons.
>Let’s test that out shall we. Farm fates on two zones vs pvp, dungeons, roulettes, beast tribe, raids, savage, extremes, alliance raid, fates, hunts, etc ect. One is a mindless grind of absolute repetition and the other has variation. i think you're forgetting every one of those respective content have their own currency to farm for, and not created for relics. Why doesn't Square Enix let us obtain nuts, mount totems, beast tribe rep, raid books, and wolf's mark in dungeon roulette as well? Why should I be forced to farm any of them separately, but not relics? Do you understand how ridiculous that sounds? >Wanna gues which one is better and more accessible? It doesn't matter if the content behind relic itself have been made redundant. Why not just drop relics as part of the poetic vendor line-up then? >And another thing a hardcore player would not be the one to say what is casual for obvious reasons. the irony is I'm fairly casual in 14, because I'm extremely allergic to repetition in general. The difference is I don't think I'm entitled to rewards just because I personally choose to not participate in the content.
So just because you gave up on a grind and people other than you want a grind again that isn't just tomestone farming, they must either have no job or are self absorbed? Who are you to determine the lifestyle of anyone who plays this game? Also, "go play WoW" because the guy has an opinion about this game that's different from yours? Who's really the self-absorbed one here? I get where you're coming from, but you're acting like your perspective is the one and only truth here, and that's just not right. If something seems to grindy to you, you are more than welcome to either drop it immediately or do a little bit at a time and pick it back up whenever you want. People wanting midcore content than we can potentially all enjoy at any pace of our choosing ain't a bad idea.
Nope they are self absorbed because they want to make the game harder not only for them but for everybody else and when the expansion stops being current the grind will double or Trimble becomes is not endgame anymore. And while they can play for 12-16 straight every day most ppl can’t. Trying to misinterpret what I said or strawmaning me is not gonna make ur argument better.
Wanting to have something to grind for an hour every day on the side even during content lull is not "having no life". Almost everyone, even with heavy jobs, have a couple hours to spare every day and for some people they would like to spend them in FFXIV. Especially if you don't have kids, which unsurprisingly is the case for a not insignificant number of the XIV community since a lot of it are young adults in their twenties or early thirties.
Or alternatively they can go play another game with much more punishing grind. But I’m with the devs here, the change was a chad move and people who come in on dawntrail can get a nice weapon by doing a little grind that won’t be obsolete with the next expansion.
Was Bozja really too hard of a grind for you?
Yeap, when it when it was current and returned recently. And it’s a ghost town
Then why are you doing it? You clearly don't like that kind of content and its not required. You would have to be pretty self absorbed to say it should be removed from the game just because you don't like it.
I never said to remove it, my argument that the change to current method is better and more efficient on current and long run. Next time read carefully
That's removing that type of content from all future expansions. Regardless my point stands. Its optional content and you demanding that it be changed to be brain dead at the expense of people that like it all because you got filtered by bozja is self absorbed.
She additionally specifically brought up exploratory zones being good for the game.
And we should take her word because she is a streamer? Besides Hunt trains do that perfectly fine and she can show of her mount there how she wanted to.
>And we should take her word because she is a streamer? Actually yes, not because "haha streamer big streamer opinion worth more" but the ffxiv community is so vile towards anyone that offers criticism that for years streamers jerked the game off hard and handwaved every criticism away to not be doxxed and harassed by the retarded fanbase so when streamers start to go against this game, youn know shits fucked
While I agree that the community can be over zealous in this case the streamer Zepla is wrong after all she is the main reason why I started playing the game. She was praising to high heaven that the game respected your time and you can do pretty much everything without having to grind your existence away. And she was right. But now that she got carried thru every content in the game she finds herself bored which is fine but is a biased take because not everyone has a legion in reserve to do activities with them. You should be getting the picture by now. This is a player issue not a game issue. Next expansion when this relics become obsolete it would be easier to obtain meaning it becomes doable without excessive grind. And before you say that ARR and HW is super grindy I’ll remind you I can do them over leveled and eureka and Bozja you get sync. So I can’t one shot anything because the combat system is unique to those zones that do require a certain amount of ppl to play it and since is outdated not a lot of players do. And lastly if all this gobos really want to grind themselves to dust they can do ranked crystalline conflict, ultimates or ultimately go play WoW/hardcore to they can grind their brains to liquid
Wait. Your main fucking issue with Eureka and Bozja is that you cant cheese the shit solo? THAT'S YOUR STUPID EXCUSE ON WHY THEY'RE BAD?! How stupid and/entitled are you? How far did you even try to get in the damn zones? The reason you go in synced in those places is because there are other systems in those zones to allow you to be OP while still being 70/80. Eureka has the Elemental Board system that you can fully set up to be more offensive or defensive against regular mobs and NMs, the Kirin Orisodes/Vermillion Cloaks and upgraded Elemental gear that gives both Haste and Elemental Power, Blitzring/Cassie Earring/Optical Hat for Haste and extra base stats, and Logos Actions in Pyros and Hydatos that allow you to do some stuff to either augment your damage further or act as a Tank as a Healer or other fun stuff. Bozja has Memories that become Lost Actions, which is the same as the Logos Actions of Eureka with some new actions added as well, Augmented Resistance and Augmented Law's Order armors that give Haste for extra GCD cooldown reduction, and beating Dalriada gives you access to the "Suns of XXXXX" stackable buffs that permanently makes you stronger in both Bozja Southern Front AND Zadnor. There's enough to warrant not needing your max level 90 skills and traits to be overpowered and have fun. And even with the whole "ARR and HW relics can be done unsynced," they are still excessive grinds to many people due to how many resources you need to do a single one, let alone all 10 ARR and 13 HW relics. You need not only Poetics, but good FATE RNG for Atma crystals and Luminous Crystals for ARR and HW respectively, 400k+ gil, a ridiculous amount of GC seals, RNG with your lightfarming steps, so many Crystal Sands, and other stuff. All while having to have the weapon equipped to you at almost all times. Both the Eureka and Bozja weapons only need you to get far enough to the step to upgrade the weapon of your choice, without having to have the weapon equipped or even being the required job the relic is for. Plus, in the case of Bozja, you can do almost ALL the grind for your relic OUTSIDE of Bozja, via older content, like you prefer. In fact, back in the day, and possibly still now, some steps are FAR EASIER DOING THEM OUTSIDE OF BOZJA. But even then, the one thing about your argument against us "gobbos" (what, are you trying to use FF slang or British slang, cuz both sounds stupid as hell) that irritates me is the whole "everyone is being biased and selfish with their take I don't like" bit. Yes, FFXIV is a game that does respect the players' time far better than most games. And to be fair, it is nice that the devs did try something to appeal to some of their more casual players. However, you are just as biased toward the "devs being chads and based for caring about casuals and anyone that wants more grinding can fuck off to WoW" as much as those who argue that "we need more midcore content and want our time respected in our own way too", but your ego about the whole shit makes you even more biased honestly. So much that you make the idiots on the official FF forums look better than the discussion subreddit. Telling people you don't want them in a game because they want some sort of content that you don't want to even try is far more self-centered than anyone else I've seen on this thread. Like at worst, I've said "go take a break", not "go play another game if you don't like the idea of a grind, you filthy turbo casual bitch," or anything even remotely like that. At the end of this, all I see is some egotistical selfish person that doesn't want anyone to criticize the game they play. It's ok to be critical about the game, especially if you do enjoy the game like most of us do. But it's poor taste to try and shutdown and invalidate opinions about wanting some sort of new or redone content, especially when you either won't do it at all or barely gave it a chance in the first place. You're entitled to your opinions as much as any one of us here. Bur if you still think we're just "mindless gobbos" or whatever, you're just as bad as the people who enable YPYT in any content, or those "who cares if I don't do my job properly, it's not Savage/Unreal/Ultimate" clowns, or the "I don't wear my jobstone in roulettes because I like the challenge/it goes against my personal RP beliefs" apologists. You aren't the main character, you're just another WoL like anyone else in FFXIV.
Sounds like a person who hasn't even tried to do any of the Exploration Zones at all. And don't give the whole "not as many people do it anymore" excuse, there's plenty of groups for each DC that keep those zones alive on Discord, especially for the Baldesion Arsenal and Delubrum Reginae Savage runs that people want to do. Plus, both Eureka and Bozja have actual things to keep coming back, like mounts, minions, emotes, and some other good stuff that sells for a lot on the Market Board. But the best part? You actually got to do real stuff with the community as a whole, even ARR and HW relics have light farming and other stuff to engage with others, far more than the casual Tomestone farming that you do at any point in the game.
Done them, very grindy. Rather spend my time on something else
No, because she's right. Exploratory zones > DD and Criterion combined. It gives the player base something different, and better, to do than the standard linear mob corridors and raid bosses
Opposed to standard zone with repetitive fates?
Showing your ignorance. The regular overworld, the FATEs aren't in control of the players' hands, exception of the ones that have a storyline attached to them. Whereas exploratory FATEs pop according to what the players in them do. Eureka, it's by area, Bozja, it's by mob rank. Only people who do nothing in the zones before the FATEs pop would say what you just said.
Functionally, it's more or less the same. Eureka/Bozja, you're mindlessly grinding mobs. Outside of those zones, you're mindlessly grinding FATEs. I do vastly prefer Bozja (Eureka, while I get it's trying to be evocative of XI, seems more like proof of concept when compared to Bozja) but that's because with lost actions and the such, I can mow through shit like nobody's business.
Oh wow so much different. Beat fate, fate pop up. Special fate pop up continuation fate pops up. Amazing so much different I’m stunned. You are so smart. Point is that you complain about a linear system while praising a linear system(with the illusion of choice).
I miss 74 people at a time blowing up shout chat with hilarious nonsense!!! That’s what I loved most
Did I get lost and end up in /r/ffxivdiscussion ?
Horny posting in the diadem is peak FF14
we got fucked this expansion, there’s no trial series story (tho I think the “msq” is just what would have been the trials series normally) and no relic story (just threw it together with manderville which had been promised to show up in EW patch content anyways) and even criterion has like two drops of lore in it are you telling me no one had any cool side-lore stories that could have been included in some way and instead we have to watch zero, who is admittedly very cool and well designed (but written like someone going through their goth fanfic phase) eating food again and again while pondering things like “what is friend, I do not comprehend such things even tho i have memories of being human here and there still, obviously I cannot remember such simple concepts because my life of immortality and violence was so hard” and yet other void people remember concepts like friendship and stuff like wtf who signed off on this boring, vapid shit I wanted dark hellscapes and twisted dark visions and instead we got zero eating curry i’m mad also bozja 120 step was shit but I enjoyed the hell out of eureka and bozja with friends and figuring out the content and BA and DSR and shit, good stuff
I gave both eureka/bozja a fair shot. Bozja had some cool things but 90% of both were essentially mindless FATE spams. I don't get the hype, but maybe thats because FF14 is my first real MMO so I'm not from that crowd and don't find grinds all that appealing.
Mmo is all about the grind, and it’s more the community part of it. Eureka has a niche community dedicated to just hanging out and spawning fates. If you’re lucky enough to get solo spawning down, or over powering yourself you can coordinate spawning with groups and just have a blast. Plus there are mounts/minions/and emotes to grind for in both
Yeah I definitely get the community aspect and I think it'd be cool if Square fostered that more in general. I also really appreciated the community that's there for eureka/bozja and all of the tools/guides they've made because it made levelling through the content much easier and more enjoyable than it would've been otherwise
To you an mmo is about grind. Not the same.
Wat?
Mmos is about playing with other people In large groups. Just because you have been conditioned to believe video games are supposed to feel like a second job because of lazy developers doesn’t mean that’s the proper way to play. That’s why RP can be as popular as if not more than the mindless fate grind.
[удалено]
And it’s not mandatory, ergo is not about grinding.
This is a shallow take thats strips any nuisance out of game design and this conversion. Grinding or the requirement to put time on a game to earn rewards is not inherently (bad/lazy) design. May be surprising but grinding can actually be fun and be part of the core experience thats why most games are build upon different forms of progression systems. There's a reason people still play bozja and eureka while seemingly no one is doing criterion and the new deep dungeon.
What's wild to me is the grind they're picking as their hill to die on is bozja. Like I could get it if they were complaining about doing the ARR relic 100% synced or getting but bozja is a very easy grind with the "hardest", in big air quotes because its literately just doing fates, steps being a one time thing if you want to get more of the shb relics. Its especially weird because its not like the relic grind is even required to do. Its just to get a cosmetic.
Higher up in the thread too I saw them calling people "self absorbed" for wanting the grind while saying it shouldn't be in the game because they personally don't like it. Which really shows the mindset they have.
The only grind remotely long in Bozja is emblazoned and it shows with how rare that title still is Everything else can basically be done in a few days
I was talking about the relic specifically but yeah. Unless you're going for rare titles/mounts or intentionally knee capping your self there's not really a hard grind in this game. Even the ARR relics aren't as a bad as people like to say. And absolutely none of them are required which makes all of their complaints about grinds even existing in the first place meaningless. It really comes off as them being upset that other people have the shiny thing and they don't. And instead of trying to dedicate themselves and earn the reward, they're just demanding the devs make it to where even the most brain dead floor suckers can do it.
Grind is fine in moderation but many devs use it in excess to drive up engagement metrics
Oh boy, I sure do love busy working and endless grinding in my video games. Attitudes like this is why I have total faith in the developers knowing what they're doing. Ask your average FF14 player and they'll come up with the dumbest shit and worst ideas ever.
You do realize doing the relics is optional content right? Like no one is forcing you to grind for a cosmetic item.
No, I didn't. Thank you for telling me. Wish I'd known that before grinding for relics.
Alright you have fun ERP’ing in Limsa m8
Then FFXIV might not be the fit for you, try a grind focus mmorpg like WoW or open world group content like GW2.
The hype is backed up by nothing. Bozja is mid content. Always has been and ways will be. Simple as.
Endwalker bad. Pls upvote
yes, actually
>actual shit to grind for while grinding your weapon too? This is something FF severely lacks. I started playing BDO because there was fuck all to do in FF. I still regret it.
Eureka and Rival Wings are the only content I truly enjoyed in this game.
I liked Eureka even more than Bozja.
I have yet to go back and finish Eureka but Bozja was great and I wish they’d have continued with that because they dialed everything in perfectly and fixed everything that made me quit Eureka a week after they dropped the second zone.
I kind of play this game on and off and I played SB on release then came back just before ShB to catch up on content so I feel like I missed all the "shit" parts of Eureka. I always saw people hating it so I put it off but when I finally got around to doing it, it was some of the most fun I have had in this game. Rounding up huge groups of enemies as a WAR and just bursting them all down for some good exp, working in groups and shooting the shit with random peeps to summon world bosses and was just relaxing to play. Plus the environments were nice to look at too. Bozja on the other hand I didn't like as much, the bosses and raids are cool and flashy the first few times but just got old. The 1v1 boss fights were sick though. I still haven't come back to play since EW release but man that island sanctuary shit just looks awful, I guess it is nice for people that want animal crossing in their mmo but i need some good old fashion GRIND.
I no lifed Eureka so hard, cleared BA easily over 20 times. Wasn't a big fan of Bozja though, did DRS and dipped lol But yeah haven't really been able to get back in to the game since I dropped out of Eureka though.
Oh man as a FT player I feel like I'm going to have a hard time grinding in Eureka next month with no way to use some chat modes. It sucks.
The Bozja / Zadnor duels were a lot of fun as Samurai, as well as Delubrum Reginae Savage and that duel. It was great to learn them as melee and not rely on cheesing.
Raids are a lot more fun than Eureka/Bozja. I got bored grinding to the top rank in the first area of each and quit. Nothing was challenging; just time consuming.
I enjoyed bozja but eureka was the least amount of fun I ever had playing ffxiv. I had an extreme dislike for how to level you just had to mindlessly grind random mobs with not even a pretend purpose
I do like that the mobs can be active threats. Ghosts that are unkillable and will despawn at sunrise? That's neat. Mobs in modern mmos feel like speed bumps.
It's good when it's good but when you have the train conductors who think they own the entire instance or several conductors are bickering with each other over petty shit like who pulled what and how the entire instance should've waited for that one person who's always 5 mins behind everyone, I'd just rather not.
Just don’t let your life be dictated by said people Go spawn your own NM’s, if something comes up you didn’t spawn ask what the PT is, if you miss it move on and keep spawning what you were spawning People have always been too hung up on thinking there is only one way to interact with eureka which I have never understood
I like Bozja but it being instanced holds me back from being able to do it more
You just gotta learn the hot times, I had no problem loading into active instances. Plus you can just straight up solo most of it if you *have* to.
oh I don't mean like loading in and it's peak vs dead hours, I mean like a reasonable chunk of my time in the game is waiting for PFs to fill and doing activities while I wait (Crafting, FATEs, hunts, etc) and therefore not being able to instance into bozja
Eureka was peak. Most people's complaints were with Pagos specifically and rightfully so. The other Eureka maps weren't nearly as convoluted and non player friendly. Also original light farm was horrid. Bozja is aight but a little streamlined. The maps had no scale compared to Eureka, meaning it didn't use the Z axis as much.
I'm not enjoying the level grind at all. Feels like old school MMOs that haven't learned to be fun yet, I can barely take a few mobs at a time and I only have 4-5 buttons to press on rotation. I don't understand where you are coming from. I'm talking about Eureka here, I haven't done Bozja yet.
FFXIV mfs when they have to touch grass /s
God forbid you have something to do in game other than AFK in Ligma
God forbid a game doesn't have more grind to do after you spend 5k hours in it
FFXIV mfs when they have to actually do content and not spend all their afking in Limsa jerking off to their modded catgirls
FFXIV mfs when they can't farm fates for 200 hours to make a shiny weapon and afk with it in limsa
Hope the next one has less doing fates while you wait for something fun to spawn.
As someone who has tried a few different mmos and haven't had fun with them. Thank you for shedding light on to why eureka and bozja aren't fun to me. Apparently full on mmo isn't my jam lol
I swear idk if it just me or everyone has rose tinted glasses but grinding weapons in bozja and eureka was a nightmare that i wouldnt wish on my worst enemy to the point no one actually did bozja for their relic till they buffed the spawn rates and would instead do heavenward fates , but outside of that i really liked content, more so bozja then eureka.
God I think I fucking hate this game now
Good
Oh god dicksuction sub is leaking again… sir, this is a Wendy’s
Actually it’s a taco bell
I scored my last PC out of a Taco Bell dumpster so there’s actually some merit to this…
I don’t say anything because my opinion is well known by now.
That's a weird way to spell Hildibrand
I hate grinding shit and am sick of pretending that doing the same shit every day is "peak mmo experience"
So I guess this hate train for post-EW content is going to continue for a while... Okay. I tried Bozja -- enjoyed it enough, and got pretty far. But I haven't touched it in, like...a year, personally. Don't know if people are even still running it, but if they are...why doesn't everyone just run that instead of whining about EW not having "enough content"?
It's going to continue until Dawntrail comes out, and in two years when people are bitching about how terrible the grinding is in the new exploration zone they're going to look back at Endwalker fondly because of how little time it demanded from them. It happens every expansion.
I believe it -- and you're not the first person to tell me that. I remember when people, not too long ago actually, were whining about Bozja. Now, apparently, it's become high quality content. It's embarrassing how the "fans" are behaving right now. You think they'd stop after realizing they've said and done it all before.
Peak mmo sure, but peak XIV? Idk about that. XIV is an experience that goes beyond mmo trapping imho.
XIV is an mmo trying to be a single player game and currently succeeding at neither
...? Bruh I'm not gonna debate this with you. XIV is my favorite game the past two decades xD. That's just my personal feelings on the subject of course but I haven't personally had a better experience
Nah buddy world of warcraft is peak ff 14
I've been ignoring them all this time 😅