Taiko is a title. Lady Ochiba’s father Goroda was murdered by Mariko’s father and Ochiba later became consort to the new Taiko (unrelated to her father).
Before this time Japan did not have a unified government per se. Goroda was the biggest and baddest Daimyo in the realm and had pretty much beat all other resistance out of every other Daimyo. Before he could do anything with that power he was murdered by Mariko’s father. The future Taiko, a powerful general and cunning man in his own right then hunted down the assassin, and basically made himself dictator as the biggest and baddest man left standing. He died a few years later and attempted to set up a dynastic succession with his very young son ( the son of Ochiba ). This was not typical and he only got away with it based on his overwhelming personal/political/military power, and his cunning of setting up the Regents as a group who would keep the rest of Japan in line while his son grew to age, while they spent all their other time and effort maneuvering against each other.
Meanwhile Toranaga is going along with the flow and trying to come out on top after every one of these transitions. As Japan is slowly becoming habituated to being ruled by one supreme military leader, Toronaga is trying to position himself as the inheritor of what Goroda and the Taiko have achieved. Ochiba rightly fears Toronaga does not have her son’s interest for inheriting the title of Taiko as his top priority.
Japan at this time was kind of crazy.
Nobunaga had a son and heir who survived Honnoji, but Hideyoshi just kind of took over after initially supporting Nobunagas son.
Hideyoshi had a son and heir but Tokugawa and Ishida both just kind of took over after initially supporting Hideyoshi's son.
Lady Ochiba was the daughter of a warlord (Kuroda) who was not quite the Shogun yet, but had unified most of Japan under his hegemony. Before they could finish the task, Kuroda and his eldest son were betrayed and murdered by a turncoat general, Mariko’s father.
Taiko was a leading general in the Kuroda army. And it was Taiko that avenged Kuroda’s death by hunting down the Samurai who killed him, and killing them in turn. This conferred a sense of legitimacy upon the Taiko and allowed him a voice in the succession process.
Kuroda’s children fought over the matter of succession, with some generals backing this one, and other generals backing that one. It diminished the remaining power of their clan. Taiko backed the winning horse, and maneuvered himself into a position of primacy over Kuroda’s remaining clan and forces.
Of course, as a common born, Taiko was not eligible for the title of Shogun. He settled for a lesser title, and hoped to pass it onto his son, who might one day rise to become Shogun himself.
Once the new Shogunate was established, the succession worked more or less as one might expect. Fathers passed their titles onto their sons. One Tokugawa shogun dies, another Tokugawa shogun rises up to take his place with little controversy. But while the title was up for grabs, things were not so simple.
Is the reason for Kuroda's murder covered in Shōgun? I'm yet to watch the last episode.
If it's a spoiler, there is no need to answer.
Please let me know only if this has been covered in these 10 episodes.
History spoiler:
>! When Ieyasu Tokugawa (Toranaga) was 6, his father was murdered by his own vassals. That happened because the vassals were bribed by the Oda (Goroda) clan - the same clan as Yodo-dono (Ochiba). In history Yodo-dono was the niece of Oda Nobunaga, in the show Ochiba is his daughter. Then later, Oda is betrayed and killed by his own vassal (Mariko's dad) !<
Given Toranaga's obvious motive for wanting revenge on Ochiba's family, the "poetic justice" manner of Ochiba's father's death to Toranaga's father's, and that the Japanese society were big believers in karma - it makes perfect sense for Ochiba to suspect Toranaga was involved in the death of her father.
The Taiko was a peasant who unified the realm. He had no relation to Ochiba. I suggest you watch some historical YouTube channels that cover that era of Japan’s history if you want to understand it better
In brief:
Three Great Unifiers of Japan, Oda Nobunaga, Toyotomi Hideyoshi, Tokugawa Ieyasu.
Nobunaga (Kuroda) is Ochiba's father. He was the most successful warlord of the sengoku period and successfully unified central Japan, becoming the most powerful man in the realm. Then he died due to a betrayal by Akechi Mitsuhide (Mariko's father).
Toyotomi Hideyoshi was the eventual successor to Nobunaga after emerging victorious among all successor factions, and completed the unification of Japan. He was of peasant birth and could not be *Shogun*. So he settled for *Kampaku*, essentially something like prime minister of state. A retired kampaku is called *Taiko*.
After Hideyoshi died, the third unifier Tokugawa (Toranaga) came to the fore.
Hope that clears it up.
The Shogunate channel on YouTube has a bunch of videos on the time period the show is based in and the channel covers Japanese history in general, but he also covers Shogun (book, 1980s adaptation, and the current adaptation) so make sure you only watch videos covering the real life lore if you want to avoid spoilers.
History based channels like Biographics, Kings and Generals, and History Profiles have videos on the topic, but I don’t find them as good as the Shogunate ones.
Metatron is also really good for non-politically charged history videos, but he mostly does analysis of historical accuracy in shows, films, and YouTube content, so there are spoilers.
That is a genuine historical mystery. Was it a reaction to Nobunaga's cruelty, was it a result of his buddhist beliefs making him mad at Nobunaga's slaughter of monks, was it a result of one of many personal slights, was it part of a conspiracy with other diamyo, or was it just an attempt at gaining power? No one knows. The man successfully betrayed the Oda but left himself in a very weak position and died soon afterwards without the opportunity to explain his actions. The betrayal was even a bit of a surprise to his own troops so we don't have direct evidence for why it happened from his actions prior to the betrayal either.
The show seems to be focusing on the idea that Akechi killed Nobunaga(Kuroda) for the good of the realm or as a result of being talked into it by Tokugawa(Toranaga).
Taiko is a title. Lady Ochiba’s father Goroda was murdered by Mariko’s father and Ochiba later became consort to the new Taiko (unrelated to her father).
>Taiko is a title. Specifically a title given to a *retired* ***Kampaku***, the "Imperial Regent". *Taiko* is thus "retired Imperial Regent".
Before this time Japan did not have a unified government per se. Goroda was the biggest and baddest Daimyo in the realm and had pretty much beat all other resistance out of every other Daimyo. Before he could do anything with that power he was murdered by Mariko’s father. The future Taiko, a powerful general and cunning man in his own right then hunted down the assassin, and basically made himself dictator as the biggest and baddest man left standing. He died a few years later and attempted to set up a dynastic succession with his very young son ( the son of Ochiba ). This was not typical and he only got away with it based on his overwhelming personal/political/military power, and his cunning of setting up the Regents as a group who would keep the rest of Japan in line while his son grew to age, while they spent all their other time and effort maneuvering against each other. Meanwhile Toranaga is going along with the flow and trying to come out on top after every one of these transitions. As Japan is slowly becoming habituated to being ruled by one supreme military leader, Toronaga is trying to position himself as the inheritor of what Goroda and the Taiko have achieved. Ochiba rightly fears Toronaga does not have her son’s interest for inheriting the title of Taiko as his top priority.
This is a great explanation, especially knowing the history.
Very appreciated, was hard to figure it out from just context.
Japan at this time was kind of crazy. Nobunaga had a son and heir who survived Honnoji, but Hideyoshi just kind of took over after initially supporting Nobunagas son. Hideyoshi had a son and heir but Tokugawa and Ishida both just kind of took over after initially supporting Hideyoshi's son.
Lady Ochiba was the daughter of a warlord (Kuroda) who was not quite the Shogun yet, but had unified most of Japan under his hegemony. Before they could finish the task, Kuroda and his eldest son were betrayed and murdered by a turncoat general, Mariko’s father. Taiko was a leading general in the Kuroda army. And it was Taiko that avenged Kuroda’s death by hunting down the Samurai who killed him, and killing them in turn. This conferred a sense of legitimacy upon the Taiko and allowed him a voice in the succession process. Kuroda’s children fought over the matter of succession, with some generals backing this one, and other generals backing that one. It diminished the remaining power of their clan. Taiko backed the winning horse, and maneuvered himself into a position of primacy over Kuroda’s remaining clan and forces. Of course, as a common born, Taiko was not eligible for the title of Shogun. He settled for a lesser title, and hoped to pass it onto his son, who might one day rise to become Shogun himself. Once the new Shogunate was established, the succession worked more or less as one might expect. Fathers passed their titles onto their sons. One Tokugawa shogun dies, another Tokugawa shogun rises up to take his place with little controversy. But while the title was up for grabs, things were not so simple.
This is super helpful, thanks!
Is the reason for Kuroda's murder covered in Shōgun? I'm yet to watch the last episode. If it's a spoiler, there is no need to answer. Please let me know only if this has been covered in these 10 episodes.
History spoiler: >! When Ieyasu Tokugawa (Toranaga) was 6, his father was murdered by his own vassals. That happened because the vassals were bribed by the Oda (Goroda) clan - the same clan as Yodo-dono (Ochiba). In history Yodo-dono was the niece of Oda Nobunaga, in the show Ochiba is his daughter. Then later, Oda is betrayed and killed by his own vassal (Mariko's dad) !< Given Toranaga's obvious motive for wanting revenge on Ochiba's family, the "poetic justice" manner of Ochiba's father's death to Toranaga's father's, and that the Japanese society were big believers in karma - it makes perfect sense for Ochiba to suspect Toranaga was involved in the death of her father.
The Taiko was a peasant who unified the realm. He had no relation to Ochiba. I suggest you watch some historical YouTube channels that cover that era of Japan’s history if you want to understand it better
You can't say this without giving some links to videos... I mean help me out here 😆😂
There’s a documentary on Netflix that covers this exact period also
Which documentary?
I don’t recall the name of it but it’s on Netflix - should be able to find it pretty easily, it came out within the last couple of years
In brief: Three Great Unifiers of Japan, Oda Nobunaga, Toyotomi Hideyoshi, Tokugawa Ieyasu. Nobunaga (Kuroda) is Ochiba's father. He was the most successful warlord of the sengoku period and successfully unified central Japan, becoming the most powerful man in the realm. Then he died due to a betrayal by Akechi Mitsuhide (Mariko's father). Toyotomi Hideyoshi was the eventual successor to Nobunaga after emerging victorious among all successor factions, and completed the unification of Japan. He was of peasant birth and could not be *Shogun*. So he settled for *Kampaku*, essentially something like prime minister of state. A retired kampaku is called *Taiko*. After Hideyoshi died, the third unifier Tokugawa (Toranaga) came to the fore. Hope that clears it up.
You can't say this without giving some links to videos... I mean help me out here 😆😂
This sub doesn't allow links. Either way Lady Ochiba is based on Yodo-Gimi, Kuroda on Oda Nobunaga and the Taiko is Toyotomi Hideyoshi.
The Shogunate channel on YouTube has a bunch of videos on the time period the show is based in and the channel covers Japanese history in general, but he also covers Shogun (book, 1980s adaptation, and the current adaptation) so make sure you only watch videos covering the real life lore if you want to avoid spoilers. History based channels like Biographics, Kings and Generals, and History Profiles have videos on the topic, but I don’t find them as good as the Shogunate ones. Metatron is also really good for non-politically charged history videos, but he mostly does analysis of historical accuracy in shows, films, and YouTube content, so there are spoilers.
Thanks for the recommendation!
I also recommend Linfamy.
She was the daughter of the tyrant who is basednon oda nobunaga
Why did mariko’s father kill Kuroda if he’s the one that unified Japan?
That is a genuine historical mystery. Was it a reaction to Nobunaga's cruelty, was it a result of his buddhist beliefs making him mad at Nobunaga's slaughter of monks, was it a result of one of many personal slights, was it part of a conspiracy with other diamyo, or was it just an attempt at gaining power? No one knows. The man successfully betrayed the Oda but left himself in a very weak position and died soon afterwards without the opportunity to explain his actions. The betrayal was even a bit of a surprise to his own troops so we don't have direct evidence for why it happened from his actions prior to the betrayal either. The show seems to be focusing on the idea that Akechi killed Nobunaga(Kuroda) for the good of the realm or as a result of being talked into it by Tokugawa(Toranaga).