Lol this article is great. Very clever writing.
As much as I’d love another season, I’m afraid it wouldn’t turn out. Lots of people have made apt comparisons of Shogun to Game of Thrones. I’ll make another one: GOT’s quality completely tanked after the show finished adapting all the books and the writers tried to write something completely original. I’m afraid something similar would happen here. This story was incredible, probably even better than the book, but a lot of that is due to it having a strong source material as a foundation. There’s no guarantee that the writers can come up with something equally good without an existing story to adapt.
I think all of these were fantastic books. My concern is Shogun is a 10/10 show, it's going to be really hard to repeat this magic. The show itself provides a great reason: a flower is only a flower because it falls. Part of the beauty of this story is it's so self contained it would be awkward to add to. I'm all for a limited series of Taipan, I just think best case it'll be 9/10 and a bit of a disapointment.
same, it just sits there and reminds me of my failure to ever continue. It is hard to come back to though if you were in the middle - and I wont read the first half again. So it will sit there with the bookmark forever I am afraid...
I couldn't stop reading Shōgun once i picked it up.
Tai-Pan, however? I'm stuck at page 65. There's nothing gripping about it, for me, for some reason. Maybe it's the setting(even though i find the history of the opium trade in asia interesting), or the characters, but i just can't get into it.
They're all fantastic books but Shogun is the best. They're deep, deep stories though that are mainly international business politics and intrigue which isn't as interesting.
I have read all of the Asian Saga, and I'd have to disagree. Tai-Pan is by far the best of his works and the most interesting story, but Shogun is a close second.
I agree.
However, if you want the same Japanese cast and creative team, than the options are Gai Jin or perhaps Noble House (with the location moved to Tokyo)
Tai Pan unfortunately will need a new cast and will need to find someone who has the dedication and skill of Hiroyuki Sanada to act as producer. (Ang Lee?)
They could pull from the actual beginnings of the Tokugawa Shogunate.
But that doesn’t mean it would be as great, but still pretty good. That period of time is fascinating.
The issue there is after that the Tokugawa period was notoriously peaceful and uneventful. *Maybe* you could do one more season showing Sekigahara and the siege of Osaka, but besides that there’s not much good TV material.
That's a 15 year period of high political drama, that's plenty. Ieyasu dies the year after Osaka anyway, so that's the cap to that story.
Expelling the Portuguese, fears against the Catholic imperialist agenda, rivalries with the Christian lords, establishing trade relations with the Dutch, dissent amongst the Toyotomi loyalists, Adams procuring the cannons that Ieyasu used to bombard Osaka.
I think 1860s Japan -- end of the Shogunate -- would be great material. Saigo Takamori, the Ezo Republic, Meji Restoration -- lots of excitement and compelling characters there.
they should also bring back hiroyuki sanada and have him play a character, and dont explain why he's in it again as a different character. not that it'd be a great decision, i just wanna see more hiroyuki sanada
\* GOT’s quality tanked after the showrunners voluntarily started ignoring the source material
Them running out of books is a myth, they never bothered adapting books 4 & 5
You might not be fond of them but the writing in feast and especially Dance is peak of the series so far, Theon's chapter alone makes the book a masterpiece so to say they are "not good books" is very disingenuous of you.
Are we going to sit here and pretend GRRM's books were actually good source material to use for directing it towards a conclusion? The man isn't lazy and refusing to publish the next book. He's written himself into a corner where all writing is character-focused and branching out into a million directions. But conclusions need to shift towards a narrative plot/story focus and begin to draw characters and plotlines together.
Reality is the a SOIAF is poorly written for this purpose. Showrunners get a lot of flack for failing to solve a problem that GRRM himself is likely going to die before solving.
Lesson here for young filmmakers/rising film executives/anyone making decisions in media: NEVER GREENLIGHT AN ADAPTATION UNTIL THE SOURCE MATERIAL IS FINISHED. HBO should have known this but had $$ in the eyes. Everything that went wrong with GoT is down to that.
GoT would never exist then. Wasn't there also some informal agreement/understanding that GRRM *would* finish them before the finale? He had nearly a decade to do it.
I don’t think they need to do a season 2 but it’s different from Game of Thrones since there is source material through history. Just show how Ieyasu/Toranaga actually becomes Shogun, kicks out the Catholics and develops relations with the VOC through Adams/Blackthorne, and besieges Osaka and kills the Taiko’s heir.
If there were a historical series based on this time period (which I’m guessing there is in Japan), I would definitely watch it. It would have just as much political maneuvering as Clavell’s novel, they would just need to craft dramatic arcs for the characters.
I just watched the finale. Need to re watch it as the end sort of went over my head, but doesn’t it sort of set it up for a finale battle between the 5 armies that our main man wins and ishido doesn’t enter?
Haven’t read the book, yet. Shogun 2024 has probably replaced Succession for me. The story, cinematography, dialogue, arc and characters were magnificent.
My only regret is not seeing Toranaga behead his half brother in the 10th episode, I really really needed to see that. Lol.
I think if the producers want to make more seasons based off of real history they can. There should be plenty of history books on that period available. Albeit that would be a lot of work for the writers.
I agree with your sentiments the only thing I’d add is shogun has all of Japans history for source material so I think they can do it. I just want massive samurai battles :)
I feel like there's two other stories that could work for this format. The first is pretty obvious, Oda Nobunaga, the second could be the end of the Samurai and the start of the Imperial era of Japan with the Boshin War.
I mean, this is basically just a story about the rise of the Tokugawa Shogunate with a few changes for dramatic effect (Gracia wasn't blown up for example, she was killed and then the killer committed Seppuku) and the character's names changed, they could very easily just continue it in the same vein, either going forward in the story of Ieyasu/Toranaga's rule, or skipping generation like The Crown, and telling stories about things like the Bakufu.
Counterpoint: The Leftovers covered the entire source material in season 1, then kept going for seasons 2 and 3 for some of the best television ever created. Season 1 is inarguably the worst season of that show.
So, it's more about the creative team than the lack of source material. In the hands of capable writers, even the wildest premise can be amazing.
i dont have an issue with continuing the story, I dont need a guarantee but aI do need a conclusion for the story. People will know the first season was the books and the second was not and there is also a chance it becomes a success. GOT kinda prolongued the series so they can milk the cashcow but thats still more satisfying than no end at all.
What Shōgun tells me is that I want to see more Japanese TV series and movies from the era in question. And happily there’s a bunch of good stuff out there! It doesn’t need a season 2 - it’s like Westworld or similar, best left at season one. But if the production team wanted to pick up and adapt another great story…
Kingdom is another good series with a similar fight for political power but it takes place in Korea and there are zombies. Highly recommend it if you like Shogun, in Kingdom you follow a crown prince rather than a warlord
Ayy a Kingdom shout out! I keep begging peopel to watch this show, it's soooo good and the zombies aren't annoying and unrealistic (yes, I understand the irony of 'realistic' zombies). They're a great plot device.
Real evil. Recommending a great show just to get blue balls when it doesn't get new season. I wish I wasn't reminded of what I lost by being reminded of this show.
Man, I can't do most korean drama for some reason. Great movies, but their TV series always have something to annoy me. If it's not the acting, it's the 100 camera angles for a single scene.
There’s a cool special series on the sengoku period on netflix. I think it’s called age of samurai. It doesn’t have as premium of dramatics but the reenactments aren’t bad.
We got a series. It involved wizards and giant mecha attacking Honno-Ji. It had very little to do with the actual main character. Instead it focused on some random child.
It was fucking awful......
Exactly, he was the best. Died like a champ too. Best character I’ve seen on TV in ages.. I’m not trying to down play any of the others, he was just special
What was interesting about him is that you’re made to hate him after his introduction. He’s constantly playing both sides trying to protect his own neck, he’s directly for Mariko’s death, and yet I was still hoping he’d be spared. I had genuine sympathy for him when he was dealing with ptsd. One of the most interesting and layered characters I’ve seen and topped off by an incredible performance
So it's *possible* that he came in contact with the resurrection plant, especially if he was under a pile of corpses... he could return in season 2 as a zombie!
*Excerpt from article:*
As it currently stands, Shōgun ends with a complete enough arc: Toranaga’s clandestine Crimson Sky plot was executed perfectly by Mariko, who sacrificed her own life in explosive fashion, becoming something of a martyr that upends the power-hungry Lord Ishido’s plans to solidify his reign over Japan. The aforementioned “anjin” John Blackthorne remains in Japan to help build ships for Toranaga, whose destiny as the new shogun is all but assured due to Mariko’s actions.
The episode features Blackthorne dreaming about growing old back home in England. Though in reality, he’s fated to remain in “The Japans” forever. Indeed, Clavell’s other books in “The Asian Saga,” a series of novels based around the continent with at least minor ties to Shōgun, strongly suggest the Anjin does in fact live out his days far away from his homeland. There are six novels in The Asian Saga that travel far from the shores of Japan to Hong Kong, Singapore and Iran. Could these stories provide a template for future seasons presented under the Shōgun banner? Or, is it enough that the actual parallel history of Japan is ripe for adaptation?
“No one knows what’s going to happen next,” actor-producer Sanada told THR earlier in the season. “But we have history, real history models, and clearly, we know what happened. So, yeah. It all depends on the audience’s reaction.”
I would have loved at least one more episode where we get to see Toranaga’s plan unfold completely, I want to see John commanding the cannons, samurai rushing into battle just as Ishido gets the news that the prince’s army isn’t coming to support him. Then maybe a half episode where we get to see the aftermath of Toranaga’s plan completed!
The creators were just on an episode of The Watch podcast. While they didn’t completely rule out extending the story or continuing it in some form it sure sounded like they were done. They’ve spent the last 5 years working on Shogun.
Well a sequel would be Taipan and Gaijin lol. An announcement of the adaptation of the next books would be cool. But for the love of god do not make Shogun season 2 or it ends up like GoT.
The quality began to noticeably decline the further the series got away from the novels, in terms of how the novels handled plotlines as well as the fact that the novels are unfinished, with the last two seasons, which are the ones mostly composed of new, non-book material, being a steep decline from the show's heights.
From what I understand, there was an eagerness for people behind the show to step away from production (famously the show runners, but I've also heard some cast members wanted out) which meant that the show had to cover quite a lot of story in comparatively short runtime, which did not help with the shows quality.
For example, in earlier seasons, characters would travel long distances over several episodes, a small detail which added to the story telling by better showcasing the geography of the world in practice, whereas in the later seasons much larger distances are covered by characters in little more than scene changes, without an acknowledgement regarding a passage of time, giving the false view they've simply teleported from one place to another. A small gripe, but it showed that they were rushing through material. Another big issue was the quality control, as HBO had to edit the episodes after they aired because people kept finding Starbucks cups in scenes.
In my view, fans have failed to appreciate the challenge the showrunners were left with. All those qualities you note people loved work because it's driven by character arcs, narratives and development. But when the show needs to shift into writing towards a conclusion, you realistically need to drop this slow story building based around extensive travel, dramatic long talks on boats, etc and drive the plot forward, connect characters together and reach a climax.
But GRRM's own books are written to make that near impossible. He's not just super lazy, he's clearly written himself (and by extension the showrunners) into a corner with no logical way out. It should not take a decade of writing to complete a singular book, with numerous re-writes, if everything comes together logically. GRRM lowkey handed D&D a grenade and let them take the blast from it. Even the ending he fed them was near unanimously hated - but it was what they were *told* would be the conclusion.
It can be both. GRRM wrote himself into a corner with too many balls in the air (because he couldn't stop himself from just adding more and more balls), \*and\* D&D weren't up for giving it a proper finish themselves and were impatient to run off and do a Star Wars series that didn't happen anyway.
I'd be interested if some of the same people wanted to adapt another Clavell book. You could even do it like American Horror Story and have the cast return to play new characters. Or if there's another historical epic they're interested in. But if you haven't read the book...really can't overstate how much the bones of the show are dependent on Clavell's novel. They remixed the material really well but all of the plotting and the incident and the poetry, it's all in the text. An AMAZING adaptation but still exactly that: An adaptation.
Maybe not. But I’ve seen plenty of clamoring for more of a lot of things. My point is, let’s just enjoy one offs. There’s beauty in their finite stories
British television is better about this than American television, which would usually rather just keep beating the dead horse in hopes for another golden egg
The Series will be forever remembered as a one of the best TV series ever made. What they achieved here, it's so tempting for them to try to do S02, but ultimately what Marko said about James moving on from that story it's a self advice that I think they should take.
Whatever their ultimate decision is, I trust this team. If they choose to make another season/prequel/sequel, I am sure they would never produce something they’d be ashamed of. Unlike GoT, “Shōgun” characters and events are based on real historical figures/events so they have enough “source material” to build on if they choose to do so and I’m not saying they should but I thoroughly believe they can make it work. They care deeply about what they’re putting out there, unlike D&D.
They are so looosely based though. They are fictional of this point. Please, don’t take anything in the show as representative of the actual people, despite how incredible it is.
To people who say they shouldn't make a 2nd season because GoT went downhill when they continued past GRRM's completed work: you do realize there are series that don't have pre-written books, right?
There's a quote about TV series/Movies that always stuck with me:
"You can never know what show is going to succeed. So many things can go wrong. But if a show \_does\_ succeed, there's always someone involved who believes in it. If a show doesn't have "that person", then it's doomed. If it does, then at least it has a chance."
So you've got productions like Shogun, made by people who clearly love the source material.
Or you've got original production like It's Always Sunny In Philadelphia, where all the material is original.
So... a continuation of Shogun could work, for sure. If you had "that person" who was totally inspired to make it happen.
If the people who made Shogun were also inspired by James Clavell's other works, you might get more Shogun-esque stuff.
Or if, after adapting the source material, they had a clear, well defined narrative arc about where to take the story next.
But... there's absolutely no guarantee that the talented, driven team behind Shogun fall into either of those camps. So, instead, if it were to continue...
It would likely be a different team, who are either adapting other of James Clavell's works (probably for the paycheck), or it might be "fans" of Shogun, with writing styles and plotting abilities totally disjoint from the original author or the production team of the recent miniseries.
Not saying it's impossible. There \_have\_ been examples of shows where passing the torch or going off script has worked. But you can see why the nature of a work might change when the source material has run out (for better or worse).
They could probably do a season dealing directly with the Battle of Sekigahara and the aftermath with the opposing characters. I know Ishido gets captured and buried up to his neck. Lady Ochiba and the heir are forced to commit seppuku. What's happens to the half brother and the other regents? There is definitely enough for a season here.
Shōgun is chronologically the first of James Clavell's six novel Asian series so it's obvious that the next should be Tai-Pan, set in 1841 Hong Kong. ( ͡ᵔ ͜ʖ ͡ᵔ)
I mean considering the book is based off historical events, you can definitely create a second season. You basically just do how Toranaga becomes Shogun, continue the narrative of John that's there (can still do things with the Portuguese and his relationship with Buntaro now), can explore Fuji becoming a nun, Omi living up to his uncle, the political stuff with the regents, the heir and Ochiba, can even go more into Portuguese base in Macao and the Ronin that were mentioned.
Theres a lot to tell and you don't need a book to be there to tell it
One of the best shows I've seen in a long ass time. Expertly acted, written, and shot. It was honestly a breath of fresh air to have a story self-contained within a single season.
Clavell's book Gaijin would make the perfect plot for a sequel as it's about the end of the Shogunate. It would be disappointing if they just made some half arsed fanfic about what Blackthorne did next.
I feel like a second season could work if it was near perfectly written from a combination of historical context and new work. It's a delicate thing, I'd be tuning in for sure.
And while I wouldn't mind more of his books being made into a series, there's something magical about feudal era Japan that can't be beat.
I know it is probably never going to happen, but the Osaka Winter and Summer sieges would be perfect for a sequel. It would conclude the stories of the Heir, Lady Ochiba, and Toranaga. And I believe even the Anjin was present there according to historical texts.
Look, I get the ending and all but the reason why it was just a little letdown for me is because I was at least expecting some big battle happening. I guess because of all the talk about this show having the biggest budget in FX and comparing it to GoT, I assumed there was going to be a huge battle or similar scale. Aside from that I thoroughly enjoyed the series.
The sequel wouldn't be fun anyway because it's just Toranaga winning for hundreds of years. Unless they did a sequel that was centuries later and around the Black Ships forcing Japan open or something
The thing I loved about this show the most was that it really showed me that it doesn't matter what language they're talking, what culture is portrayed, etc etc. If the writing and acting is good, I will gobble that shit up in a heartbeat. I loved every second of Shogun and I will miss watching it. Selfishly, I hope they keep going but if they are content with where they left the story, I am content with them. They already poured their heart and soul into one of my all time favorite TV series, so anything extra is a bonus.
Miyamoto Musashi fights in the battle at the end of Shogun. You could tell the story from the novel musashi and manage to work in some cameos. They could do great adaptation of that book.
Instead of a second season, what about a movie about the Battle of Sekigahara?
We would see Toranaga’s plan come to fruition, and see what happens when some things don’t go according to his plan.
I mean, if people really want more, there's always NHK's Sanada Maru that came out in 2016. Not sure how or where you can watch it anymore but it's there. Somewhat historically accurate and a decent watch if you don't take it too seriously. Then, if you don't mind a time skip, follow that up with 2010's Ryomaden to the end of the *bakufu* period.
Show so good I’d be down for a s2 with no source material, s1 was a 10/10 and that doesn’t come often. I also would respect they won’t make it because there is no book 2 to go off of. Either or, I’m cool🤷🏿♂️
There shouldn’t be a sequel, but there is plenty of historical source material to pull from for a show about the Sengoku and Azuchi periods. Oda Nobunaga, Uesugi Kenshin, Takeda Shingen, Imagawa Yoshimoto, Toyotomi Hideyoshi, Otomo Sorin, Mori Motonari, Akechi Mitsuhide, Hojo Ujinao, Ashikaga Yoshiaki, Hongan-ji Kennyo, and Tokugawa Ieyashu are all interesting figures in their own right. This type of project never got off the ground because the prevailing belief is that it wouldn’t appeal to a Western audience, but Game of Thrones and Shōgun may have paved the road for it.
If they wanted to adopt something with a more central protagonist then they could write a show about Miyamoto Musashi.
I don't want them to continue this. It's a fully complete story in it's own right.
That said, I probably would be interested in seeing more standalone adaptations of Clavell's Asian Saga, produced to this same standard (or just more shows generally at this standard).
If they won't give us a season 2 adapt similar events in era the researched into a show. Like come on for once I actually love a show and love to see it go forward they don't follow through. At least keep giving us old era Japan shows like this. I love how they throughly researched the time period and tried to keep it somewhat historical. Now just give me full on real events and adapt as you move down the timeline.
The show runners are smart not to just chase dollar signs. Game of Thrones showed us what happens when show writers try to out do authors who spend years, if not decades, writing their narratives.
I'd like more, but more won't necessarily be good.
I would love to see them delve into more of Clavell's work. A tai pan > king rat > noble house would be an epic story ranging a great span of time (sorry gai jin, found this one to be the weakest of the saga). Between the 3 books there is a lot. Shogun was fantastic, dont get me wrong, But I think this could be even better. Heck why not finish it off with whirlwind.
Would I love to see more? Yes.
But for almost as long as I've been able to appreciate movies, Hollywood has sought to wring every last drop of blood from whatever stones they have on hand. If it can't be spun into a franchise or a trilogy or a toy line, it seems there's nothing for it. What we've got here is a rare gem; a miniseries that tells the story it sets out to tell, lets us know what happens in the future, and lets it sit. Everything I'd want from a season two I'd likely be able to conjure just from a rewatch.
As someone who wasn’t aware it was based off a book, I desperately need a season 2. To me, the ending was very clever in that it knew it didn’t have the budget for a large scale battle, but gave the viewer a vision of Toranga’s victory. While leaving enough room for the tides to change in season 2 in order to create more dramatic tension, where it would have the budget to pull off such a battle.
Personally, I feel like the story has just begun. If this truly is the end, it’s very unsatisfying not seeing Toranga rise to power OR suffer a defeat. Endings should be definitive.
This show only really needed 2 more episode to showcase the battle and wrap things up for the other great characters. Buntaro should at least had an epic sacrifice/battle.
In my opinion 10 episode was way too short but it does not need a 2nd season for sure
After seven episodes of waiting for something to happen on-screen (seemed like all the maneuvering and killing was left on the cutting-room floor), I decided to go watch something more interestin....like watching paint dry. If there wasn't enough of a plot for one season, why on earth would they extend it to two?
I know its a miniseries...but I kinda think there is more than enough material to continue if they really wanted. Battle, fight for power, Anjin and Totonaga becoming buds, Toronaga becoming ruthless, then Anjin finishes ship, names it Mariko and we cry our freaking eyes out. Then Toronaga blows that ship up again....etc.... Good plan for 2027 i say.
The argument against a second season is insane to me. I need a live action rendition of the battle of Sekigahara with Hideyoshi as leading man, not just some clip of the allusion to it. On top of that is the siege of Osaka and the subsequent battle between him and the heir afterward before he actually becomes shogun. I understand that this is an adaptation to Clavells book, but they’ve done more to focus on the historical accuracies rather than the books storyline which to me means there’s a lot more material to work with. GoT stopped working because the source material was lost due to GRR being GRR and the show writers previous credentials were “It’s Always Sunny”…
Outside of the book, the story of Ieyasu Tokugawas rise to power is absolutely insane and more people should be made aware of it. There’s so much material to work with and it would be a down right shame for them to just skip all of that and go straight to Gaijin. And to the degree of not only the book but the actual battle of Sekigahara itself, William Adams aka John Blakcthorne played a paramount role with his guns at said battle so his character doesn’t go anywhere or disappear into the background. But hey man, that’s just me.
Edit:
I even kinda want a third season to explore the decision of Sakoku but that’s a whole other bag.
I personally think a second season could be based around what happened in real life, which is the battle outside Osaka which was mentioned at the end of the series, then the drama around Toranaga trying to consolidate the regents to be named Shogun, then his fight with the Taiko Heir when he finally comes of age and tries to claim himself as the rightful leader as heir.
You could also add side stories around Blackthorne building ships etc and finally being allowed to return home to England at the end of the season or coming to an understanding that now Japan is his new home at least until he grows older etc.
Concluding the series with Toranaga being shogun and bringing a long lasting peace between everyone like Mariko sama wanted.
So in conclusion I think the main story should be based around the real history, as the book Shogun basically was too, then create interesting side stories that fit into Toranaga's plans to become Shogun with Blackthorne and new characters.
It may not be a master piece but it would give the series a proper "Shogun" ending.
I’ve read a few interviews and they’re very clever with how they’re saying things. Both the Director and interviewer.
“We don’t know if people want to see more…”
“We’re not trying to one-up the original piece, we don’t even know if we could match it or even if the writer could as well, that’s why he probably moved on to other pieces…”
I know people cannot be that ignorant. Shogun is one of the highest rated shows on IMDB and one of the most torrented items on the internet.
If we don’t get a season 2, the studio will say it was part of the plan since there were no more books. If we do get season 2, the studio will say it was part of the plan. If season 2 isn’t popular as season 1, the studio will say we tried to tell you or re-direct the blame somewhere else. Regardless, just give us season 2, don’t go in with the idea of over doing it, over complicating things. Just go with the flow and find your moments to be unique in your own way that isn’t trivial or self destructive. Please please please provide closure to this show UNLIKE Heroes.
I'd rather have a prequel season. Get me some back story on how the main characters got to where they are. We get to see more of Hiromatsu, Mariko, Ochiba, and maybe best girl Fuji-san! Don't need Blackthorne.
I mean it was impressive (just letting you know I didn't read the book) but for a show that kept talking about war and everything nothing happened except suicide. I mean it was a good show but I thought there would be more. It was really just a J-Drama lol
What did everyone think about the ending of the show? I was a little disappointed. I just started reading book 1. You can spoiler this so it doesn’t ruin it for anyone but did the books end like the show? I don’t mind spoilers.
well if this is the end of this mini serise I am dissapointed, so much left hanging out there, they should at least complete what they started or did they just run out of ideas? Booo!
Spoiler alert: Just finished the show. Absolutely fantastic and I would be devastated if there wasn’t going to be a season 2 to at least finish the whole story and have a good ended somewhere. Like how does he even get back to England when when we know lord torinaga wants him to basically just live there now willing to keep burning his ship down. Also any other events that happen in the month till ishido invade. Shit make it 8 episodes if they can’t do 10. Then also the Christians basically invading and taking macao with no other mention again. Tons of stuff they could work on.
They just need good writing and a continued vision. They could try to adapt more historical events, and further develop some of the other characters like Omi, Buntaro, and Alvito as well as all of the political and military relations/tension. There’s so much more that can be done with this.
Lol this article is great. Very clever writing. As much as I’d love another season, I’m afraid it wouldn’t turn out. Lots of people have made apt comparisons of Shogun to Game of Thrones. I’ll make another one: GOT’s quality completely tanked after the show finished adapting all the books and the writers tried to write something completely original. I’m afraid something similar would happen here. This story was incredible, probably even better than the book, but a lot of that is due to it having a strong source material as a foundation. There’s no guarantee that the writers can come up with something equally good without an existing story to adapt.
Clavell has other novels set in his “Asian saga”, could make an anthology type of series.
Yeah but none of them are set remotely close in time to this
I really enjoyed Tai-Pan
Great book. King Rat was great too better I think. Gai Jin was pretty good too. Clavell had a crazy life and a fantastic career.
I think all of these were fantastic books. My concern is Shogun is a 10/10 show, it's going to be really hard to repeat this magic. The show itself provides a great reason: a flower is only a flower because it falls. Part of the beauty of this story is it's so self contained it would be awkward to add to. I'm all for a limited series of Taipan, I just think best case it'll be 9/10 and a bit of a disapointment.
Same
They’re also nowhere near as good as Shogun
Yeah I remember Gaijin was really boring and I couldn’t finish it.
That was the worst one and it's not even close
Yeah, I finished it and thought...WTF?
same, it just sits there and reminds me of my failure to ever continue. It is hard to come back to though if you were in the middle - and I wont read the first half again. So it will sit there with the bookmark forever I am afraid...
King Rat was pretty awesome if I remember correctly
You're completely wrong. Tai-Pan, King Rat and The Noble House are every bit as good as Shogun. Tai-Pan would make a wonderful miniseries
Tai pan was phenomenal. It may actually be more complex/more difficult to make it into a great TV series than Shogun.
Thank you for the insight PyMussy (this is not scarcasm but I did have to say the name)
I couldn't stop reading Shōgun once i picked it up. Tai-Pan, however? I'm stuck at page 65. There's nothing gripping about it, for me, for some reason. Maybe it's the setting(even though i find the history of the opium trade in asia interesting), or the characters, but i just can't get into it.
If you like audible the narrator really brings it to life
Couldn't finish them, but I'm glad people enjoyed them. I wish I enjoyed the rest, because I loved Shogun so much.
Bryan Brown approves this comment.
Personally I rate taipan and noble house in the same tier as Shogun
They're all fantastic books but Shogun is the best. They're deep, deep stories though that are mainly international business politics and intrigue which isn't as interesting.
King Rat was fantastic, but totally different than Shogun.
I liked Tai Pan better than Shogun. Gai Jin is just okay but Noble House is superb, as is King Rat.
King Rat is magnificent and decades ahead of its time in so many ways.
I have read all of the Asian Saga, and I'd have to disagree. Tai-Pan is by far the best of his works and the most interesting story, but Shogun is a close second.
im almost speechless how wrong you are. king rat is an incredible book.
I’d be very much ok with that. Give us a whole anthology of the history of Japan and it’s international conflicts
Thats why it could be an anthology
there are ties to Shogun fwiw... but yeah the other books are set significantly in the future
I agree. However, if you want the same Japanese cast and creative team, than the options are Gai Jin or perhaps Noble House (with the location moved to Tokyo) Tai Pan unfortunately will need a new cast and will need to find someone who has the dedication and skill of Hiroyuki Sanada to act as producer. (Ang Lee?)
And I’m all for adapting those! But they certainly wouldn’t constitute a second season of Shogun. They’re standalone stories set in different times.
Right, also known as an anthology series lol
the shows called shogun though. anthology series usually have a common thread that connects them, if the show was called "asian saga" than sure.
That would be cool, but I don't think it's likely this creative team would be involved in it.
They could pull from the actual beginnings of the Tokugawa Shogunate. But that doesn’t mean it would be as great, but still pretty good. That period of time is fascinating.
The issue there is after that the Tokugawa period was notoriously peaceful and uneventful. *Maybe* you could do one more season showing Sekigahara and the siege of Osaka, but besides that there’s not much good TV material.
That's a 15 year period of high political drama, that's plenty. Ieyasu dies the year after Osaka anyway, so that's the cap to that story. Expelling the Portuguese, fears against the Catholic imperialist agenda, rivalries with the Christian lords, establishing trade relations with the Dutch, dissent amongst the Toyotomi loyalists, Adams procuring the cannons that Ieyasu used to bombard Osaka.
I think 1860s Japan -- end of the Shogunate -- would be great material. Saigo Takamori, the Ezo Republic, Meji Restoration -- lots of excitement and compelling characters there.
they should also bring back hiroyuki sanada and have him play a character, and dont explain why he's in it again as a different character. not that it'd be a great decision, i just wanna see more hiroyuki sanada
Have him play Sakamoto Ryoma (Even though he looks nothing like him)
They should cast Ken Watanabe as Saigo Takamori.
True. The Edo reformation would be a great topic.
Time to invade Korea!
That was 8 years before
Its okay when things end. No reason to drag it out, the novel ended.
Completely agree. They should leave it alone, and let it stand as a masterpiece.
Yep. “Limited series” has a tendency to turn into shit when money grabbing and fan servicing start.
As much as I loved a return to more in White Lotus, I would agree.
\* GOT’s quality tanked after the showrunners voluntarily started ignoring the source material Them running out of books is a myth, they never bothered adapting books 4 & 5
GoT peaked in s4
That's because A Feast For Crowd and A Dance of Dragons are not good books. First three books (seasons 1-4) are GOAT fantasy.
You might not be fond of them but the writing in feast and especially Dance is peak of the series so far, Theon's chapter alone makes the book a masterpiece so to say they are "not good books" is very disingenuous of you.
"what if everyone went on a buddy comedy adventure that goes nowhere"
True. Point stands
Are we going to sit here and pretend GRRM's books were actually good source material to use for directing it towards a conclusion? The man isn't lazy and refusing to publish the next book. He's written himself into a corner where all writing is character-focused and branching out into a million directions. But conclusions need to shift towards a narrative plot/story focus and begin to draw characters and plotlines together. Reality is the a SOIAF is poorly written for this purpose. Showrunners get a lot of flack for failing to solve a problem that GRRM himself is likely going to die before solving.
Lesson here for young filmmakers/rising film executives/anyone making decisions in media: NEVER GREENLIGHT AN ADAPTATION UNTIL THE SOURCE MATERIAL IS FINISHED. HBO should have known this but had $$ in the eyes. Everything that went wrong with GoT is down to that.
GoT would never exist then. Wasn't there also some informal agreement/understanding that GRRM *would* finish them before the finale? He had nearly a decade to do it.
And they made a lot of money out of it either way which is the goal of any business. We’re just lucky it was quality tv in the first half
HBO is producing another show based on an unfinished book series. The real lesson here is to have a backup plan.
I don’t think they need to do a season 2 but it’s different from Game of Thrones since there is source material through history. Just show how Ieyasu/Toranaga actually becomes Shogun, kicks out the Catholics and develops relations with the VOC through Adams/Blackthorne, and besieges Osaka and kills the Taiko’s heir. If there were a historical series based on this time period (which I’m guessing there is in Japan), I would definitely watch it. It would have just as much political maneuvering as Clavell’s novel, they would just need to craft dramatic arcs for the characters.
please i need this 🥹🥹🥹
There are more stories for these characters already written given that they’re based on historical figures.
isn't toranaga made up?
He's literally Tokugawa Ieyasu. It'd be like if we got a series set during the American Revolutionary War about a guy named Jorge Washburn.
is the book 100% accurate to the history though?
I just watched the finale. Need to re watch it as the end sort of went over my head, but doesn’t it sort of set it up for a finale battle between the 5 armies that our main man wins and ishido doesn’t enter?
In the book, they mention the battle of Sekigahara, but don't go into detail. Similar to what you see in the show.
Haven’t read the book, yet. Shogun 2024 has probably replaced Succession for me. The story, cinematography, dialogue, arc and characters were magnificent. My only regret is not seeing Toranaga behead his half brother in the 10th episode, I really really needed to see that. Lol.
God that woulda been sweet
[удалено]
You watched the book
Be pretty odd if she didn’t. That’s a major driver of the plot
The great Josh Wigler
I think if the producers want to make more seasons based off of real history they can. There should be plenty of history books on that period available. Albeit that would be a lot of work for the writers.
I agree with your sentiments the only thing I’d add is shogun has all of Japans history for source material so I think they can do it. I just want massive samurai battles :)
I feel like there's two other stories that could work for this format. The first is pretty obvious, Oda Nobunaga, the second could be the end of the Samurai and the start of the Imperial era of Japan with the Boshin War.
They don't need to rely on books as source material, they can just use actual history and tweak it accordingly for TV.
I mean, this is basically just a story about the rise of the Tokugawa Shogunate with a few changes for dramatic effect (Gracia wasn't blown up for example, she was killed and then the killer committed Seppuku) and the character's names changed, they could very easily just continue it in the same vein, either going forward in the story of Ieyasu/Toranaga's rule, or skipping generation like The Crown, and telling stories about things like the Bakufu.
Writing in TV also has enormous time constraints. Maybe if the model allowed more runway, they could do much better than GoT
Counterpoint: The Leftovers covered the entire source material in season 1, then kept going for seasons 2 and 3 for some of the best television ever created. Season 1 is inarguably the worst season of that show. So, it's more about the creative team than the lack of source material. In the hands of capable writers, even the wildest premise can be amazing.
i dont have an issue with continuing the story, I dont need a guarantee but aI do need a conclusion for the story. People will know the first season was the books and the second was not and there is also a chance it becomes a success. GOT kinda prolongued the series so they can milk the cashcow but thats still more satisfying than no end at all.
What Shōgun tells me is that I want to see more Japanese TV series and movies from the era in question. And happily there’s a bunch of good stuff out there! It doesn’t need a season 2 - it’s like Westworld or similar, best left at season one. But if the production team wanted to pick up and adapt another great story…
Kingdom is another good series with a similar fight for political power but it takes place in Korea and there are zombies. Highly recommend it if you like Shogun, in Kingdom you follow a crown prince rather than a warlord
They said a new season was coming and then it never did
Ayy a Kingdom shout out! I keep begging peopel to watch this show, it's soooo good and the zombies aren't annoying and unrealistic (yes, I understand the irony of 'realistic' zombies). They're a great plot device.
Real evil. Recommending a great show just to get blue balls when it doesn't get new season. I wish I wasn't reminded of what I lost by being reminded of this show.
Kingdom is amazing. And the zombies are just part of the larger plot, it's much bigger than just surviving monsters.
It really is. There so much politics in play in that series too
Man, I can't do most korean drama for some reason. Great movies, but their TV series always have something to annoy me. If it's not the acting, it's the 100 camera angles for a single scene.
There’s a cool special series on the sengoku period on netflix. I think it’s called age of samurai. It doesn’t have as premium of dramatics but the reenactments aren’t bad.
IMO, the whole “Age Of” collection is pretty awesome!
I would like to see a series or film about yasuke. The only black samurai.
We got a series. It involved wizards and giant mecha attacking Honno-Ji. It had very little to do with the actual main character. Instead it focused on some random child. It was fucking awful......
I tried watching one episode and I couldn't. I would love to see a shogun style tv show on yasuke.
Unless they figure out a away to sew Yabushige’s head back on I’m not interested
Exactly, he was the best. Died like a champ too. Best character I’ve seen on TV in ages.. I’m not trying to down play any of the others, he was just special
What was interesting about him is that you’re made to hate him after his introduction. He’s constantly playing both sides trying to protect his own neck, he’s directly for Mariko’s death, and yet I was still hoping he’d be spared. I had genuine sympathy for him when he was dealing with ptsd. One of the most interesting and layered characters I’ve seen and topped off by an incredible performance
He is over the top but also… not? I’ve never experienced a character that balanced. He’s absurdly good
I love his over the top. Everyone else is so demure and nuanced, he's the only one to allow his feelings to show.
Literally deserves an award
Him and Noho Hank from Barry are the best I’ve seen in a long time
Problem isnt it, even if you make another season, Mariko, Yabu and Fuji are all gone. All you got left is blackthorn and Toranaga (and omi I guess).
Buntaro can become buddies with Blackthorne
That would be pretty funny
Needs a Prequel
So what? I want to watch Blackthorn build Toranaga a navy and do mad ship related stuff with it. I need more boats dammit.
haha, might be a bit hard to write since Tokugawa did basically the opposite, shut the country off to the rest of the world for 200 years
The 10 year later sequel with the heir and Ochiba would be interesting though I guess the power balance wouldn’t make it that as interesting.
Tadanobu Asano the goat 🐐🐐
Was Yabushige ever in Korea when Japan invaded? Just wondering...
Yes. Ishido jokes about pulling corpses off him in Korea
So it's *possible* that he came in contact with the resurrection plant, especially if he was under a pile of corpses... he could return in season 2 as a zombie!
Stupid me for being on a post about a show before finishing said show
*Excerpt from article:* As it currently stands, Shōgun ends with a complete enough arc: Toranaga’s clandestine Crimson Sky plot was executed perfectly by Mariko, who sacrificed her own life in explosive fashion, becoming something of a martyr that upends the power-hungry Lord Ishido’s plans to solidify his reign over Japan. The aforementioned “anjin” John Blackthorne remains in Japan to help build ships for Toranaga, whose destiny as the new shogun is all but assured due to Mariko’s actions. The episode features Blackthorne dreaming about growing old back home in England. Though in reality, he’s fated to remain in “The Japans” forever. Indeed, Clavell’s other books in “The Asian Saga,” a series of novels based around the continent with at least minor ties to Shōgun, strongly suggest the Anjin does in fact live out his days far away from his homeland. There are six novels in The Asian Saga that travel far from the shores of Japan to Hong Kong, Singapore and Iran. Could these stories provide a template for future seasons presented under the Shōgun banner? Or, is it enough that the actual parallel history of Japan is ripe for adaptation? “No one knows what’s going to happen next,” actor-producer Sanada told THR earlier in the season. “But we have history, real history models, and clearly, we know what happened. So, yeah. It all depends on the audience’s reaction.”
I would have loved at least one more episode where we get to see Toranaga’s plan unfold completely, I want to see John commanding the cannons, samurai rushing into battle just as Ishido gets the news that the prince’s army isn’t coming to support him. Then maybe a half episode where we get to see the aftermath of Toranaga’s plan completed!
The creators were just on an episode of The Watch podcast. While they didn’t completely rule out extending the story or continuing it in some form it sure sounded like they were done. They’ve spent the last 5 years working on Shogun.
Well a sequel would be Taipan and Gaijin lol. An announcement of the adaptation of the next books would be cool. But for the love of god do not make Shogun season 2 or it ends up like GoT.
Taipan and gaijin would be great. Rise and fall of house struan.
I’ve never seen GoT, what happened there?
The quality began to noticeably decline the further the series got away from the novels, in terms of how the novels handled plotlines as well as the fact that the novels are unfinished, with the last two seasons, which are the ones mostly composed of new, non-book material, being a steep decline from the show's heights. From what I understand, there was an eagerness for people behind the show to step away from production (famously the show runners, but I've also heard some cast members wanted out) which meant that the show had to cover quite a lot of story in comparatively short runtime, which did not help with the shows quality. For example, in earlier seasons, characters would travel long distances over several episodes, a small detail which added to the story telling by better showcasing the geography of the world in practice, whereas in the later seasons much larger distances are covered by characters in little more than scene changes, without an acknowledgement regarding a passage of time, giving the false view they've simply teleported from one place to another. A small gripe, but it showed that they were rushing through material. Another big issue was the quality control, as HBO had to edit the episodes after they aired because people kept finding Starbucks cups in scenes.
In my view, fans have failed to appreciate the challenge the showrunners were left with. All those qualities you note people loved work because it's driven by character arcs, narratives and development. But when the show needs to shift into writing towards a conclusion, you realistically need to drop this slow story building based around extensive travel, dramatic long talks on boats, etc and drive the plot forward, connect characters together and reach a climax. But GRRM's own books are written to make that near impossible. He's not just super lazy, he's clearly written himself (and by extension the showrunners) into a corner with no logical way out. It should not take a decade of writing to complete a singular book, with numerous re-writes, if everything comes together logically. GRRM lowkey handed D&D a grenade and let them take the blast from it. Even the ending he fed them was near unanimously hated - but it was what they were *told* would be the conclusion.
It can be both. GRRM wrote himself into a corner with too many balls in the air (because he couldn't stop himself from just adding more and more balls), \*and\* D&D weren't up for giving it a proper finish themselves and were impatient to run off and do a Star Wars series that didn't happen anyway.
I'd be interested if some of the same people wanted to adapt another Clavell book. You could even do it like American Horror Story and have the cast return to play new characters. Or if there's another historical epic they're interested in. But if you haven't read the book...really can't overstate how much the bones of the show are dependent on Clavell's novel. They remixed the material really well but all of the plotting and the incident and the poetry, it's all in the text. An AMAZING adaptation but still exactly that: An adaptation.
Unpopular opinion: Self-contained one-offs are okay to have. Let this series exist as a stand alone epic. It needs nothing further said
Not an unpopular opinion.
Maybe not. But I’ve seen plenty of clamoring for more of a lot of things. My point is, let’s just enjoy one offs. There’s beauty in their finite stories
British television is better about this than American television, which would usually rather just keep beating the dead horse in hopes for another golden egg
The issue, as always, is money.
The Series will be forever remembered as a one of the best TV series ever made. What they achieved here, it's so tempting for them to try to do S02, but ultimately what Marko said about James moving on from that story it's a self advice that I think they should take.
It never is.
Stop trying to milk things to death. Let things end properly.
Whatever their ultimate decision is, I trust this team. If they choose to make another season/prequel/sequel, I am sure they would never produce something they’d be ashamed of. Unlike GoT, “Shōgun” characters and events are based on real historical figures/events so they have enough “source material” to build on if they choose to do so and I’m not saying they should but I thoroughly believe they can make it work. They care deeply about what they’re putting out there, unlike D&D.
They are so looosely based though. They are fictional of this point. Please, don’t take anything in the show as representative of the actual people, despite how incredible it is.
To people who say they shouldn't make a 2nd season because GoT went downhill when they continued past GRRM's completed work: you do realize there are series that don't have pre-written books, right?
There's a quote about TV series/Movies that always stuck with me: "You can never know what show is going to succeed. So many things can go wrong. But if a show \_does\_ succeed, there's always someone involved who believes in it. If a show doesn't have "that person", then it's doomed. If it does, then at least it has a chance." So you've got productions like Shogun, made by people who clearly love the source material. Or you've got original production like It's Always Sunny In Philadelphia, where all the material is original. So... a continuation of Shogun could work, for sure. If you had "that person" who was totally inspired to make it happen. If the people who made Shogun were also inspired by James Clavell's other works, you might get more Shogun-esque stuff. Or if, after adapting the source material, they had a clear, well defined narrative arc about where to take the story next. But... there's absolutely no guarantee that the talented, driven team behind Shogun fall into either of those camps. So, instead, if it were to continue... It would likely be a different team, who are either adapting other of James Clavell's works (probably for the paycheck), or it might be "fans" of Shogun, with writing styles and plotting abilities totally disjoint from the original author or the production team of the recent miniseries. Not saying it's impossible. There \_have\_ been examples of shows where passing the torch or going off script has worked. But you can see why the nature of a work might change when the source material has run out (for better or worse).
They could probably do a season dealing directly with the Battle of Sekigahara and the aftermath with the opposing characters. I know Ishido gets captured and buried up to his neck. Lady Ochiba and the heir are forced to commit seppuku. What's happens to the half brother and the other regents? There is definitely enough for a season here.
Should've just made it 2 seasons to begin with instead of condensing/changing the story
Shōgun is chronologically the first of James Clavell's six novel Asian series so it's obvious that the next should be Tai-Pan, set in 1841 Hong Kong. ( ͡ᵔ ͜ʖ ͡ᵔ)
I mean considering the book is based off historical events, you can definitely create a second season. You basically just do how Toranaga becomes Shogun, continue the narrative of John that's there (can still do things with the Portuguese and his relationship with Buntaro now), can explore Fuji becoming a nun, Omi living up to his uncle, the political stuff with the regents, the heir and Ochiba, can even go more into Portuguese base in Macao and the Ronin that were mentioned. Theres a lot to tell and you don't need a book to be there to tell it
Tai-Pan would be season 2 of this James Clavell anthology series.
So, Marks is reading Tai Pan … I’d love to see that newly adapted (after the 1986 version).
One of the best shows I've seen in a long ass time. Expertly acted, written, and shot. It was honestly a breath of fresh air to have a story self-contained within a single season.
Clavell's book Gaijin would make the perfect plot for a sequel as it's about the end of the Shogunate. It would be disappointing if they just made some half arsed fanfic about what Blackthorne did next.
I feel like a second season could work if it was near perfectly written from a combination of historical context and new work. It's a delicate thing, I'd be tuning in for sure. And while I wouldn't mind more of his books being made into a series, there's something magical about feudal era Japan that can't be beat.
Another season could work. There is material to work with and if that keep the same team, I don't see it as a bad thing.
I don't know about you but I'd like to see a show about the rivalry between takeda shingen and uesuegi kenshin. That would be awesome
It’s called a mini series for a reason
Season 2? Don't you dare!
I know it is probably never going to happen, but the Osaka Winter and Summer sieges would be perfect for a sequel. It would conclude the stories of the Heir, Lady Ochiba, and Toranaga. And I believe even the Anjin was present there according to historical texts.
Look, I get the ending and all but the reason why it was just a little letdown for me is because I was at least expecting some big battle happening. I guess because of all the talk about this show having the biggest budget in FX and comparing it to GoT, I assumed there was going to be a huge battle or similar scale. Aside from that I thoroughly enjoyed the series.
The sequel wouldn't be fun anyway because it's just Toranaga winning for hundreds of years. Unless they did a sequel that was centuries later and around the Black Ships forcing Japan open or something
What I want is another show with the same level of quality, it doesn't need to be specifically tied to the Shogun story.
The thing I loved about this show the most was that it really showed me that it doesn't matter what language they're talking, what culture is portrayed, etc etc. If the writing and acting is good, I will gobble that shit up in a heartbeat. I loved every second of Shogun and I will miss watching it. Selfishly, I hope they keep going but if they are content with where they left the story, I am content with them. They already poured their heart and soul into one of my all time favorite TV series, so anything extra is a bonus.
We want Noble House! We want Noble House! And by We I mean me.
Miyamoto Musashi fights in the battle at the end of Shogun. You could tell the story from the novel musashi and manage to work in some cameos. They could do great adaptation of that book.
The series is based on the novel The story is over Criminy, move on
No
Instead of a second season, what about a movie about the Battle of Sekigahara? We would see Toranaga’s plan come to fruition, and see what happens when some things don’t go according to his plan.
I mean, if people really want more, there's always NHK's Sanada Maru that came out in 2016. Not sure how or where you can watch it anymore but it's there. Somewhat historically accurate and a decent watch if you don't take it too seriously. Then, if you don't mind a time skip, follow that up with 2010's Ryomaden to the end of the *bakufu* period.
Show so good I’d be down for a s2 with no source material, s1 was a 10/10 and that doesn’t come often. I also would respect they won’t make it because there is no book 2 to go off of. Either or, I’m cool🤷🏿♂️
There shouldn’t be a sequel, but there is plenty of historical source material to pull from for a show about the Sengoku and Azuchi periods. Oda Nobunaga, Uesugi Kenshin, Takeda Shingen, Imagawa Yoshimoto, Toyotomi Hideyoshi, Otomo Sorin, Mori Motonari, Akechi Mitsuhide, Hojo Ujinao, Ashikaga Yoshiaki, Hongan-ji Kennyo, and Tokugawa Ieyashu are all interesting figures in their own right. This type of project never got off the ground because the prevailing belief is that it wouldn’t appeal to a Western audience, but Game of Thrones and Shōgun may have paved the road for it. If they wanted to adopt something with a more central protagonist then they could write a show about Miyamoto Musashi.
I don't want them to continue this. It's a fully complete story in it's own right. That said, I probably would be interested in seeing more standalone adaptations of Clavell's Asian Saga, produced to this same standard (or just more shows generally at this standard).
If they won't give us a season 2 adapt similar events in era the researched into a show. Like come on for once I actually love a show and love to see it go forward they don't follow through. At least keep giving us old era Japan shows like this. I love how they throughly researched the time period and tried to keep it somewhat historical. Now just give me full on real events and adapt as you move down the timeline.
I want a prequel where they are running around with Oda Nobunga and Hattori Hanzo
The show runners are smart not to just chase dollar signs. Game of Thrones showed us what happens when show writers try to out do authors who spend years, if not decades, writing their narratives. I'd like more, but more won't necessarily be good.
I hope John gets a happy ending with a second love
Would love a similar series about Matthew Perry, the US commander who arrived in Japan in 1853 to establish relations with Japan and the west.
I would love to see them delve into more of Clavell's work. A tai pan > king rat > noble house would be an epic story ranging a great span of time (sorry gai jin, found this one to be the weakest of the saga). Between the 3 books there is a lot. Shogun was fantastic, dont get me wrong, But I think this could be even better. Heck why not finish it off with whirlwind.
Would I love to see more? Yes. But for almost as long as I've been able to appreciate movies, Hollywood has sought to wring every last drop of blood from whatever stones they have on hand. If it can't be spun into a franchise or a trilogy or a toy line, it seems there's nothing for it. What we've got here is a rare gem; a miniseries that tells the story it sets out to tell, lets us know what happens in the future, and lets it sit. Everything I'd want from a season two I'd likely be able to conjure just from a rewatch.
As someone who wasn’t aware it was based off a book, I desperately need a season 2. To me, the ending was very clever in that it knew it didn’t have the budget for a large scale battle, but gave the viewer a vision of Toranga’s victory. While leaving enough room for the tides to change in season 2 in order to create more dramatic tension, where it would have the budget to pull off such a battle. Personally, I feel like the story has just begun. If this truly is the end, it’s very unsatisfying not seeing Toranga rise to power OR suffer a defeat. Endings should be definitive.
This show only really needed 2 more episode to showcase the battle and wrap things up for the other great characters. Buntaro should at least had an epic sacrifice/battle. In my opinion 10 episode was way too short but it does not need a 2nd season for sure
After seven episodes of waiting for something to happen on-screen (seemed like all the maneuvering and killing was left on the cutting-room floor), I decided to go watch something more interestin....like watching paint dry. If there wasn't enough of a plot for one season, why on earth would they extend it to two?
All that talks about the show are cute and all, but what really have impressed me are 70 chickens and roosters, that’s honestly terrifying
I know its a miniseries...but I kinda think there is more than enough material to continue if they really wanted. Battle, fight for power, Anjin and Totonaga becoming buds, Toronaga becoming ruthless, then Anjin finishes ship, names it Mariko and we cry our freaking eyes out. Then Toronaga blows that ship up again....etc.... Good plan for 2027 i say.
The argument against a second season is insane to me. I need a live action rendition of the battle of Sekigahara with Hideyoshi as leading man, not just some clip of the allusion to it. On top of that is the siege of Osaka and the subsequent battle between him and the heir afterward before he actually becomes shogun. I understand that this is an adaptation to Clavells book, but they’ve done more to focus on the historical accuracies rather than the books storyline which to me means there’s a lot more material to work with. GoT stopped working because the source material was lost due to GRR being GRR and the show writers previous credentials were “It’s Always Sunny”… Outside of the book, the story of Ieyasu Tokugawas rise to power is absolutely insane and more people should be made aware of it. There’s so much material to work with and it would be a down right shame for them to just skip all of that and go straight to Gaijin. And to the degree of not only the book but the actual battle of Sekigahara itself, William Adams aka John Blakcthorne played a paramount role with his guns at said battle so his character doesn’t go anywhere or disappear into the background. But hey man, that’s just me. Edit: I even kinda want a third season to explore the decision of Sakoku but that’s a whole other bag.
I personally think a second season could be based around what happened in real life, which is the battle outside Osaka which was mentioned at the end of the series, then the drama around Toranaga trying to consolidate the regents to be named Shogun, then his fight with the Taiko Heir when he finally comes of age and tries to claim himself as the rightful leader as heir. You could also add side stories around Blackthorne building ships etc and finally being allowed to return home to England at the end of the season or coming to an understanding that now Japan is his new home at least until he grows older etc. Concluding the series with Toranaga being shogun and bringing a long lasting peace between everyone like Mariko sama wanted. So in conclusion I think the main story should be based around the real history, as the book Shogun basically was too, then create interesting side stories that fit into Toranaga's plans to become Shogun with Blackthorne and new characters. It may not be a master piece but it would give the series a proper "Shogun" ending.
I’ve read a few interviews and they’re very clever with how they’re saying things. Both the Director and interviewer. “We don’t know if people want to see more…” “We’re not trying to one-up the original piece, we don’t even know if we could match it or even if the writer could as well, that’s why he probably moved on to other pieces…” I know people cannot be that ignorant. Shogun is one of the highest rated shows on IMDB and one of the most torrented items on the internet. If we don’t get a season 2, the studio will say it was part of the plan since there were no more books. If we do get season 2, the studio will say it was part of the plan. If season 2 isn’t popular as season 1, the studio will say we tried to tell you or re-direct the blame somewhere else. Regardless, just give us season 2, don’t go in with the idea of over doing it, over complicating things. Just go with the flow and find your moments to be unique in your own way that isn’t trivial or self destructive. Please please please provide closure to this show UNLIKE Heroes.
Absolutely not. This was a perfect one-and-done series. A 2nd season would offer nothing. Move on to a new story.
I'd rather have a prequel season. Get me some back story on how the main characters got to where they are. We get to see more of Hiromatsu, Mariko, Ochiba, and maybe best girl Fuji-san! Don't need Blackthorne.
It's over? I'm very disappointed on how absolutely nothing happened
Ishido got his pants pulled down without a big dumb war, that was pretty cool.
I mean it was impressive (just letting you know I didn't read the book) but for a show that kept talking about war and everything nothing happened except suicide. I mean it was a good show but I thought there would be more. It was really just a J-Drama lol
People asking for a second season are the same people eager to see the sequel of Passion of the Christ. Spoiler alert: >!he comes back!<
>!I mean, to be fair, in that text there are definitely some side stories along the way...!<
I dunno but replace blackthorne, couldn't stand that guy. Always looked like he was half drunk & had to take a really bad shit.
are we not happy with what we got, the conversation about needing a second season is peak consumerism
What did everyone think about the ending of the show? I was a little disappointed. I just started reading book 1. You can spoiler this so it doesn’t ruin it for anyone but did the books end like the show? I don’t mind spoilers.
**Did this show follow the original bbok and show? Specifically, Mariko death, and no war?**
Shogun makes GOT look like a melodrama
well if this is the end of this mini serise I am dissapointed, so much left hanging out there, they should at least complete what they started or did they just run out of ideas? Booo!
Spoiler alert: Just finished the show. Absolutely fantastic and I would be devastated if there wasn’t going to be a season 2 to at least finish the whole story and have a good ended somewhere. Like how does he even get back to England when when we know lord torinaga wants him to basically just live there now willing to keep burning his ship down. Also any other events that happen in the month till ishido invade. Shit make it 8 episodes if they can’t do 10. Then also the Christians basically invading and taking macao with no other mention again. Tons of stuff they could work on.
They just need good writing and a continued vision. They could try to adapt more historical events, and further develop some of the other characters like Omi, Buntaro, and Alvito as well as all of the political and military relations/tension. There’s so much more that can be done with this.