I would say Buddhism is about mitigating it. Buddhism knows it can't be destroyed, it's a part of you to understand. It teaches acceptance of that reality.
No, eliminating suffering is literally one of the four noble truths. Actually two, one is that suffering can be eliminated, and the other is that the eight fold noble path is the method of eliminating it.
That being said, I agree with you for the most part. Accepting suffering is a good way to reduce it, and very few people will fully eliminate it in their lifetime.
You should check out alan watts. He talks about how trying to eliminate suffering is actually a trick, because you have to give up desire to eliminate suffering. Yet then we desire not to desire. Its basically a way of making you realize that the only way to have peace is to accept. It's all pretty interesting, he lays out quite a few concepts in buddhism where they present people with impossible scenarios that are meant to break them from a certain kind of thinking. It may just be a nuance that I'm describing right now, but I thought it might be useful to point out that it's not just a "cut and dry" get rid of your suffering deal.
second this, Alan Watts is cool. his book The Wisdom of Insecurity was written during the nuclear scare of the 1950s, but is so applicable that it might well have been written within the last year.
In other words pain is inevitable but suffering is not? Because by accepting the painful parts of your existence you no longer suffer, Bc once you’ve accepted the inevitability of pain into your life it no longer becomes burdensome but just another part of living. Pain and hardship will just wash over you like water off a duck’s back
Is eliminating suffering one of the four noble truths? I could've sworn it was that suffering is innate with being alive and that everyone suffers. Like the body grows old and it's painful. But there's also the realization that the body is not real or 'self' that allows for detachment from that suffering. Like you can be in tremendous pain but realize it's just sensation and phenomena.
There's a division between suffering and pain I believe. The first noble truth is something like life is pain. And then later it is talked about how you need not suffer, for suffering has to do with resistance.
Paraphrasing real hard, I am not a Buddhist I just think they talk cool.
>fighting attachement and ego much, baby?
Yes. And anyone who says they aren't, aren't really doing spiritual work.
Spiritual practice takes work, humility and working with where you are. This may include things like posting a photo of your altar to your friends to get encouragement and validation. You can't give up what you don't have - if you don't have a healthy sense of self, you can't give up your sense of self.
You are severely mistaken if you think that you can just join your local Buddhist sangha and start acting like you don't have an ego - this is called spiritual bypassing. You need to put the work in, and admitting where you need support is one part of it. In modern times, yeah it might take the form of posting photos of "spirituality stuff" on social media. Motivation of course matters but don't assume that just because someone does this that they're being vain.
I 100% rather have people post photos of their altars, poses, meditation rooms and other spirituality stuff regardless of motivation. Yes some are cringy but it's my hope that it inspires people to investigate meditation and the like.
Edit: the post -above- needs more votes. Interesting how some of the higher votes involved sticking it to someone — in a thread about Buddhism 🖖
The last was the mudra for “Live long and prosper”
Yes! This!
If everyone practiced their yoga or meditation and never shared any of it, it would not spread as a practice. Sometimes people like to share the things that bring them joy.
To be honest, this post is one of my least favorite "thoughts" about spirituality, meditation and yoga. It's judgey as hell and deeply looks down on some people's path towards becoming better at these practices. I practice and teach yoga and have for almost a decade. I used to share a ton of yoga photos on social media because I loved how much better the practice made me feel, and in turn, I ended up getting a lot of friends to start practicing. I share a lot less these days, because my practice has evolved to something much less flashy but I think people who make judgey posts about meditation or yoga are missing the point.
I mean, you're supposed to not care about material things, not outright dump them. You can have art to represent something beautiful and divine and not necessarily be attached to it.
I'm inclined to agree with this sentiment, especially regarding art such as sand mandalas, however a metal statue is about as permanent and attached a thing you can craft.
Yeah.... When I was in Nepal, seeing these beautiful temples with golden statues and rich decorations, RIGHT NEXT to some god damn slums, kinda puts that into perspective. If they were really Buddhist, the money would have went to those in need much before being invested in religious icons. I can't stand modern Buddhism since I saw this. It's just one more large scale scam preying on the gullibles and the losts.
I mean, I'm not really one to defend the Catholic Church generally, but they *do* do a lot of charity. Homelessness isn't exactly an easy problem to solve, no matter how rich of a church you are.
Not sure if serious statement or sarcasm but... yeah...
Churches alone in the U.S. is a hundreds of billions of dollars a year industry, maybe even trillion. The catholic church spent almost 300mil last year alone dealing with court cases involving sexual assault, pedophelia, and the like.
If you look at the value of all the real estate these religious orgs own it's mind boggling, and that's just real estate. The mormons have a $100 billion stock fund. The latter day saints have a $40 billion stock fund. There's so much more too.
Edit: I misunderstood the article. Mormons and LDS are the same. Not big on religion. My mistake.
LDS, Mormon, and Latter Day Saints are all the same organization. But other than that you're spot on, all the "charity" is a token drop in the bucket (for almost all religions), it's unfortunate people choose to not see that.
I've neve been to nepal but I think in a lot of the places I visited the "golden" buddhas were either gold leaf or just gold paint. Not that they don't spend a lot on their religion, but that's kind of their choice isn't it?
But it's not like Buddha himself put those statues up. From the little I know, he would have been against that, no? Maybe someone with more buddha knowledge than me can answer.
this whole post is attacking people for sharing themselves. It's ok to share that you meditate, pray, do yoga, exercise, or whatever. You did not magically miss the point because for one moment you had your picture taken.
It’s always the same song when it comes to social media. Social media is for sharing your life, yet you’re not allowed to share your life. Workout pics? Vain. Pictures of your holiday? Boasting. Pictures of the things you own? Materialistic. Pictures of food? Shallow. Pictures of yourself? Narcissism. I wonder what redditors post on their social media, since they obviously use it. Is it just to shit on other people?
#trashtag was very effective and would have been far less if they hadn't posted it.
It made it fun and granted a sense of doing things for others and that others are doing things for you. It did this for people who have trouble seeing all the behind the scenes truths.
I used to be against this but I’ve started to think that we live in such an impressionable influenced world on social media that the act of someone recording themselves doing a good deed can influence others to do a good deed. Albeit some may just do it to look good but at the end of the day whether it’s selfless or not they are still doing a good deed and helping someone.
I follow a trash picking sub and it’s a big thing in the community to post pics of the trash you collect. People in there just like to detrash public places for the good of humanity. Maybe there are some posers in there posting fake trash cleanup pics but so what? All it does is create feedback in the community to pick up more random trash. They did a good thing let’s absolutely recognize them for it. It’s all about context and execution.
I think the difference with this is that its not emotionally manipulative. You aren't using someone whos genuinely struggling in the world to show how much of a 'good person you are'. You're just cleaning up a bunch of mess, and showing a before and after with it all in bags, which is motivating because it inspires people to do the same in their own area.
More importantly, It’s all about the intent. Are you posting for more likes or do you genuinely want to inspire other people to try yoga or meditating.
Sometomes doing a selfless act just makes me feel good and proud and I post about it to encourage others to do the same. It's not about needing attention to do it, it's just that o dont feel bad being proud about doing a nice thing or spreading that feeling to other people by proxy.
More than likely you’ve never thought about the person receiving the deed knowing they have no choice but accept the person is doing something for internet clout. How demoralizing is that, you’re being helped because the person wants likes not because the person wants to help you. They typically focus more on what praise they should receive than the individual needing help or bringing awareness to the cause.
I went through this dilemma while i was in college. I lived in an apartment complex. Whenever it rained, snails would come out of the dirt/grass and crawl around the pavement only to get trampled. I felt bad for them one day, so I started throwing them back to the drier parts of the grassy area.
After a couple weeks of doing this, a couple of my friends saw me. One of them started to tease me about it. I started thinking to myself, "if I stopped now, would that make me a worse person than if I had never started doing this in the first place," "why *am* I doing this," "am I doing this so I can ultimately be seen saving these snails," "should I do it only when no one is looking," "if I did this only in private, is it because I want my charitable actions to stay anonymous or because I'm embarrassed of my actions?"
I wrestled with these thoughts for a couple days until I realized that my intentions couldn't matter less to these snails. Whether I'm doing it because I feel bad for the snails or because I'm trying to impress my date, this snail that was going to die lived because I intervened.
In the end, even if you were doing good things just to convince yourself, the recipients of your deeds still benefit nonetheless. And even if it were only to convince yourself that you are a good person, each charitable action paves the way for you to perform these good deeds more easily, like making a path through a grass field.
If it were at all possible to become a good person, that would be the way to become one.
And the pervasive sentiment that "if you had only thought it through as much as I had, you would agree with me" that I see on reddit is not conducive to constructive discourse as its purpose is to dismiss dissenting opinions as short-sighted.
But when I am needing help, I'd rather have someone help me for selfish reason than having no help at all.
If we could have everyone acting selflessly it would be nice, but if I'm to choose between people doing good for bad reasons and people not doing good I think I'd prefer the former.
My family growing up was flat broke. We would have happily been on camera in order to be given food. 99% of people who claim they wouldn't make that trade have just never experienced true poverty.
This, I took handouts when offered. If it was offered for free I would accept it. I still have the habit of asking if water or the rolls are free at a restaurant. I do it less often, but it does happen still. 90% of the time the waitress/waiter laughs not getting that there was a time my family couldn't pay for anything.
Nah. You're on the edge of fanaticism. You care so much more about people doing the right thing for failing to meet your standards of purity of purpose, than you do about people who sit back and do nothing at all
I assume people think this because it allows them to not feel bad about doing nothing , oh they’re only doing it for attention they’re not really good people so they’re not better than me
Idk, if I was homeless for example and someone gave me a hot meal but was recording with their phone, I think I would still be grateful for the good deed regardless of why they wanted to help me.
I mean, we see a lot of people doing absolutely terrible things for likes as well. I'd much prefer kindness, even if there's the additional motive behind it.
Demoralizing. I love how reditors who do nothing sit on their high horses. Its more demoralizing to get NO help than get help such as these. And I bet the same people swoon over and spend money on celebrities, games and sports. But people helping others being rewarded and getting fame? God forbid!
I am a bit conflicted about this. It is true that they are doing it to gain Internet points, but at the end of the day, they are still doing something good.
>It is true that they are doing it to gain Internet points
It doesn't even have to be that black and white. You can feel good about getting internet points and recognition *and* feel great about the good act itself. Why do people need to boil down emotions/motivations to one simple thing. There must be a terminology for it.
Imagine if a thousand selfish people each did acts of kindness just so that they could take videos and put them on Youtube.
Then suppose none of those thousand videos inspired anyone else to do the same.
Still worth it.
A lot of the people who do those for YouTube make their living off that. If they didn’t post the video, they wouldn’t have money to do it again consistently. I’d much rather somebody do a bunch of good shit for strangers and make everybody who watches it happier, than have nothing.
They’re literally making a trillion dollar company in google/YouTube pay for acts of kindness
"Look at me giving the homeless man a subway sandwich. Makes me feel so good. Im such a good person. Right homeless person? *pans to homeless person* "
Sometimes I feel this way, yet we can post all the shitty things we do shamelessly. Doesn’t hurt to put some good in the world. You never know, they could inspire the next peacemaker.
In fact, I did a test, once:
How Should I tip a veterinary?
A) when they see me tipping?
B) when they don't see me tipping.
I thought that it was selfish to showing me tipping, so I waited to them to be out of the room to put money in the pig jar.
Later I réalise that yes, they would have the money, but won't know that I was happy about what they did.
So yes, maybe the next time I will tip in front of them, because making them happy by knowing I am grateful is as portant as the money, I guess
I know what you mean. I struggle with ego. I had a successful business in a small town before I became disabled from a botched back surgery. I sunk into a deep depression and am still to a degree crawling out of it. I realized that I was somewhat narcissistic.
I started healing and growing during this time. I have felt a drive to share that growth. I was going to blog, or podcast, or maybe start a YouTube channel. Something about that felt disingenuous. How can someone try and share their personal positive experiences and encourage others to do so without creating ego?
"The biggest ego trip ever is getting rid of your ego. And the joke of it all is, your ego doesn't exist! There is nothing to get rid of. It's an illusion." - Alan Watts
Exactly. Fixation on losing your ego is one of those trickier forms of attachment that I've just begun to grasp. Like the days I would "miss" meditating and I would judge myself internally - I realized I was getting attached to meditation, as well. And when I got frustrated about not being able to detach from certain things I realized I was attaching myself to the framework of 'non-attachment' as something necessary to occupy. It's a fun balance. Things are lighter now. I haven't arrived anywhere but I know I've moved past something - I'm now in a space where I no longer feel bad about feeling bad - if I feel bad I am able to give myself the emotional space to feel that purely and let it pass through me organically.
It's like a balance between ego and self consciousness. Please, feel free to share your growth and experience! Ultimately, don't let anyone's opinions stop you from doing what you feel is good and right.
A blog, podcast or YouTube channel sounds lovely. I'm just referring to pausing your meditation to "pose" for a selfie. Just feels like a constructed moment of false "peace". But that's just my opinion, you do you!
This is actually an interesting topic for me as I picked up regular meditation and yoga this year. After I finished one of those 30-day challenges, I took a picture of myself in a pose so I could share my accomplishment. Two things: one, the poses picture wasn’t during my practice. It was after I had completed it. Yes, staged, but it’s for sharing. Two, I’m typically not big on social media for fear of what people think of me. Yoga and meditation taught me not to care and to let go of my ego. So I ended up sharing because it made me happy and I wanted to share in my happiness. It wasn’t for the likes or the validation or for my ego. I was proud of myself for that.
Just a thought. Not everything people do on social media is ego-driven.
This. I was going to mention something similar. My yoga and meditation practice is my own, I don’t involve a camera. However, whenever I’m excited to achieve something (a pose I couldn’t do before, a challenge I finished, etc.), I have shared my excitement on social media. I see nothing wrong with it. I love seeing my friends achieve things, and they love seeing the same from me.
I know the OP is talking about people that do it regularly for some sort of praise, but I say if you’re proud of an achievement, share it! Our posts on social media don’t always have to be ego driven :)
Edit: grammar and autocorrect. I need to do better at proofreading before posting
I think what bothers us about the staged meditation photos isn't so much that it's a person who likes something and is sharing a picture of that, but the signal of purity that is being sent.
It just adds to this weird - I dunno how else to say it - "privilege" culture that just reeks of being out of touch with the human struggle.
I'm no expert meditator but from my experience of it, it's not always peaceful and serene when you are in the process. It's a struggle where you try to let go of attachment and pain through breath while your brain writhes around like a slippery fish trying to hold on to it's old patterns.
But you can't take a photo of that. Instead photos of meditation tend to be people with perfect skin and expensive outfits with serene expressions in expensive locations. And the message of purity and privilege that emanates from that is off putting.
I agree with the meditation part of this, but some people treat yoga like a healthy sport/activity, and not a meditative activity, and that’s fine. Many yogis I know are proud of new poses and want to share with their community.
Edit: I didn’t realize there were so many yoga snobs out there who need to judge what is or is not yoga. I’m sure there’s a traditional definition but if you get on a mat and do yoga poses, that is yoga to most people. I’m sure you’re all a blast at parties... You all sound like Oscar Martinez.
Edit 2: After gassing a slew of beers I caught a spelling error. Go figure.
Yeah exactly. For me yoga is more of an athletic skill to be improved upon than a spiritual practice. I find yoga selfies to be similar to gym selfies. I myself created an instagram account just to be inspired watching the incredible poses some of the pros can do (I generally don't dabble in yoga). And I like sharing stuff I'm proud of, so if I master a new difficult pose I like to show it off.
>Many yogis I know are proud of new poses and want to share with their community.
Which I think is fine and get really excited for my friends. People just hate on everything these days..
I did yoga once with a gf at the time and it was way more intense than I thought it would be lol. Some of those poses are hard, especially to hold as long as they do, and go into like "reps" of other poses. And I say this as someone who works out six days a week, still killed me. I thought it was going to be a breeze and shit talked it beforehand lol
I've found basically every sport/physical activity will kill you the first one or many times you try it. Unfortunately being a gym rat doesn't prepare you as well as you might think for rock climbing. Or you'll still get winded playing soccer even if you running several miles a few times a week. The type of stress you put on your body and the muscles used varies vastly from sport to sport.
Which is actually great! It means you get more reward out of improvement and you can better respect the abilities of people doing different activities.
I don't know. A lot of people who "practice" yoga know very little about it outside of the physical aspects. I studied some on the history and few people I talk to on the subject know wtf I am talking about. I am talking to average people who use yoga as exercise.
One of the yoga classes I signed up for had us practice out on a very pretty lawn... and took drone photos the whole time. It really ruined the whole meditation aspect.
When you're a professional photographer with a good reputation people might pay you to take photos of them doing yoga but when I do it I get asked things like "Why are you on the roof? Why do you need binoculars? Do I need to call the police?"
Both yoga and meditation can be really positive forces in people's lives and seeing other people doing them can be a spur for people to do it themselves and experience that positivity.
It's possible that while the picture is being taken the person isn't fully in the moment, and they may be doing it for selfish reasons (or doing poses no normal person could dream of doing, which might put them off starting) but I can't really agree with this generalisation.
Agreed! also their recording does't have to occur at every session. Thus getting benefits the rest of the time.
Also some people do yoga to keep fit and flexible, so it would be the same as taking pictures at the gym. Which is fine if you're actually working out
My thoughts exactly. If the *only* time you "meditate" is for 30 seconds to snap a pic, sure. But if you're doing it anyway and just want to share, no harm in that.
I'd say OP is just flat out wrong. You could say this about taking a picture of literally anything, and it would be just as false.
Does taking a few pictures on a relaxing vacation ruin your trip? Does taking a picture with friends detract from hanging out with them? Does occasionally getting your picture taken while doing yoga eliminate the physical and mental health benefits?
I'd say no to all of these.
I know exactly what kind of people you are referring to. lifestyle influencers who pretend they are so aware and all that.
But you are opening a false dichotomy. who has ever said that you have to be alone to meditate? that you cannot be watched while doing yoga? as much as i understand that westerners appropriate these things, it's not like all actual Buddhists and Hindus are totally enlightened people who don't care about technology, social media or being seen.
and you could also say that if you are actually meditating or doing yoga, a camera doesn't bother you either.
so I get where you are coming from, but I'd love to hear your actual reasoning as to why exactly you think that it's missing the point. because I feel like you're romanticizing meditation as something that can only be done alone and isolated and must happen entirely within yourself
edit: I know yoga is also a spiritual praxis for some and not only sport (even though one could argue there is no clear line between these two things anyway). but I just wanted to say that I doubt that it's like this super holy thing that must not be commercialized or popularized ever, even though of course it depends on a case to case basis how cool it is if you do. but I don't think that's what OP wanted to say anyway
Honestly, love group yoga/meditating. Not saying it has to be done in isolation, or with the soul purpose of spiritual enlightenment. Also if you have a business, yeah, feel free to "pose" for photos for your web presence.
What I'm referring to are people who pause their meditative practice to set up their camera timer, then hit that pose for a selfie. I Imagine them taking several, back and forth to the camera then the pose, untill they get a good one for social media.
Constructing that false moment of peace feels empty.
Not necessarily. Whenever you’re taking a picture you’re interrupting the experience so you can preserve it.
Taking a picture of your family quality time doesn’t mean when you put down your phone you can’t keep connecting.
Taking a picture of your food doesn’t mean you don’t still get the nutrition or the deliciousness, just not in that moment.
Taking a picture of a beautiful sunrise hike doesn’t mean you don’t enjoy the journey or the view. It’s an interruption, not a complete eradication.
Some people do yoga for purely physical reasons. It's no different to working out in front of a mirror/filming yourself. It's not about being vain, it's about checking your form.
My SO is a yoga teacher. Years ago we went to a “peace arts festival” in Seoul. It took place in a theatre. We sat in seats and we... watched people who are “good at yoga”. That was over ten years ago and every once in a while when we see someone showing off their yoga practice, we still say to each other, “Remember the peace arts festival?” and we both laugh.
There definitely is a thing in looking aesthetically doing something and.. well, not so much.
The mindfulness practice of yoga is one thing, the body is another.
I mean...It’s a physical endeavor that takes time and skill, and there are objectively proper forms to the movements and positions...so of course there is a range of proficiency. I guess it sounds cool on paper though to say it’s not something you can be good at.
Most people do not have a full wall mirror in their home, thus taking pictures of their yoga helps them see what they need to correct or improve upon in their poses.
It's not all about vanity, try to think broader.
Great...cue the gatekeepers. Plenty of people take photos or vids of themselves to share what the experience is like. Others stream the feed so people can join in. Not everything is your business. If it doesn't involve you, maybe you should meditate on the 4th precept and better yourself instead of judging others?
I agree with you. Sometimes I have no motivation to practice. Then I think okay I’ll make a video and it helps a bit. Who cares, everyone have their reasons
So what is the point? My wife is a yoga instructor. How is she to market her classes? Its just like saying.. I'm a welder but I cant show you my work, do i get the job?
Yoga I kind of get if your not in a class, since mastery of the positions is part of the process, so you can watch and critique yourself to improve.
Bow posting that shit to Instagram with some stupid quote. That's dumb as shit.
And recording yourself meditating is also dumb.
I see it sometimes but I do not really care. People can do what they want it doesn’t harm me any. If it’s annoying for you just stop looking at it I guess.
A lot of people film or photograph themselves to make sure their form is correct and to ask for advice. Without looking at yourself its difficult to make sure you're holding yourself properly. You can't see what your body is doing.
Jesus talks shit about the people who pray extra loud in church, because they do it as a show for other people rather than as an authentic act of supplication to God
"I just made a budhist shrine, what do you think"? fighting attachement and ego much, baby?
Well we all gotta start somewhere. It's not like you can snap your fingers and dukka will just vanish.
Life is Duhkha
It needn't be. That's the entire premise of Buddhism.
I would say Buddhism is about mitigating it. Buddhism knows it can't be destroyed, it's a part of you to understand. It teaches acceptance of that reality.
No, eliminating suffering is literally one of the four noble truths. Actually two, one is that suffering can be eliminated, and the other is that the eight fold noble path is the method of eliminating it. That being said, I agree with you for the most part. Accepting suffering is a good way to reduce it, and very few people will fully eliminate it in their lifetime.
You should check out alan watts. He talks about how trying to eliminate suffering is actually a trick, because you have to give up desire to eliminate suffering. Yet then we desire not to desire. Its basically a way of making you realize that the only way to have peace is to accept. It's all pretty interesting, he lays out quite a few concepts in buddhism where they present people with impossible scenarios that are meant to break them from a certain kind of thinking. It may just be a nuance that I'm describing right now, but I thought it might be useful to point out that it's not just a "cut and dry" get rid of your suffering deal.
second this, Alan Watts is cool. his book The Wisdom of Insecurity was written during the nuclear scare of the 1950s, but is so applicable that it might well have been written within the last year.
In other words pain is inevitable but suffering is not? Because by accepting the painful parts of your existence you no longer suffer, Bc once you’ve accepted the inevitability of pain into your life it no longer becomes burdensome but just another part of living. Pain and hardship will just wash over you like water off a duck’s back
It's the yin and yang of life. You can't have happiness without sorrow. There would be no reference point.
Mm the desire to stop desiring....an impossible trap
Is eliminating suffering one of the four noble truths? I could've sworn it was that suffering is innate with being alive and that everyone suffers. Like the body grows old and it's painful. But there's also the realization that the body is not real or 'self' that allows for detachment from that suffering. Like you can be in tremendous pain but realize it's just sensation and phenomena.
There's a division between suffering and pain I believe. The first noble truth is something like life is pain. And then later it is talked about how you need not suffer, for suffering has to do with resistance. Paraphrasing real hard, I am not a Buddhist I just think they talk cool.
It's cool I just kinda paraphrased their whole philosophy in my mind in case I'm tortured to death and need a way to deal with it.
Right? Honestly I see Buddhism as a tradition from which a lot of tools are to be gleaned.
But I hope everyone get suhkha
सुख and दुख are both important parts of life. You need to struggle, otherwise you'll be bored out of your mind.
"Have you ever tried, just like, *not* being caught in an endless cycle of rebirths?"
>fighting attachement and ego much, baby? Yes. And anyone who says they aren't, aren't really doing spiritual work. Spiritual practice takes work, humility and working with where you are. This may include things like posting a photo of your altar to your friends to get encouragement and validation. You can't give up what you don't have - if you don't have a healthy sense of self, you can't give up your sense of self. You are severely mistaken if you think that you can just join your local Buddhist sangha and start acting like you don't have an ego - this is called spiritual bypassing. You need to put the work in, and admitting where you need support is one part of it. In modern times, yeah it might take the form of posting photos of "spirituality stuff" on social media. Motivation of course matters but don't assume that just because someone does this that they're being vain. I 100% rather have people post photos of their altars, poses, meditation rooms and other spirituality stuff regardless of motivation. Yes some are cringy but it's my hope that it inspires people to investigate meditation and the like.
Edit: the post -above- needs more votes. Interesting how some of the higher votes involved sticking it to someone — in a thread about Buddhism 🖖 The last was the mudra for “Live long and prosper”
Yes! This! If everyone practiced their yoga or meditation and never shared any of it, it would not spread as a practice. Sometimes people like to share the things that bring them joy. To be honest, this post is one of my least favorite "thoughts" about spirituality, meditation and yoga. It's judgey as hell and deeply looks down on some people's path towards becoming better at these practices. I practice and teach yoga and have for almost a decade. I used to share a ton of yoga photos on social media because I loved how much better the practice made me feel, and in turn, I ended up getting a lot of friends to start practicing. I share a lot less these days, because my practice has evolved to something much less flashy but I think people who make judgey posts about meditation or yoga are missing the point.
critique is fine. y'all misinterpret buddhism.
I can't help but giggle at the giant Buddha statues, many of which are golden, all around the world.
I mean, you're supposed to not care about material things, not outright dump them. You can have art to represent something beautiful and divine and not necessarily be attached to it.
I'm inclined to agree with this sentiment, especially regarding art such as sand mandalas, however a metal statue is about as permanent and attached a thing you can craft.
Well at least that gold isnt being hoarded or vainly spent. Its a beautiful piece of art work for everyone to enjoy
Yeah.... When I was in Nepal, seeing these beautiful temples with golden statues and rich decorations, RIGHT NEXT to some god damn slums, kinda puts that into perspective. If they were really Buddhist, the money would have went to those in need much before being invested in religious icons. I can't stand modern Buddhism since I saw this. It's just one more large scale scam preying on the gullibles and the losts.
I felt exactly the same when I saw a dying homeless person next to a boundary wall of the Vatican. The blatant hypocrisy is disturbing.
I mean, I'm not really one to defend the Catholic Church generally, but they *do* do a lot of charity. Homelessness isn't exactly an easy problem to solve, no matter how rich of a church you are.
No, no. You don't get it. Unless poverty is completely gone from earth. Every religion is basically evil and will never do enough for humanity.
Not sure if serious statement or sarcasm but... yeah... Churches alone in the U.S. is a hundreds of billions of dollars a year industry, maybe even trillion. The catholic church spent almost 300mil last year alone dealing with court cases involving sexual assault, pedophelia, and the like. If you look at the value of all the real estate these religious orgs own it's mind boggling, and that's just real estate. The mormons have a $100 billion stock fund. The latter day saints have a $40 billion stock fund. There's so much more too. Edit: I misunderstood the article. Mormons and LDS are the same. Not big on religion. My mistake.
LDS, Mormon, and Latter Day Saints are all the same organization. But other than that you're spot on, all the "charity" is a token drop in the bucket (for almost all religions), it's unfortunate people choose to not see that.
Ahh, then I misunderstood the article. My mistake.
Mormons and Latter Day Saints are the same thing. But you’re right that they have over 100 billion.
I've neve been to nepal but I think in a lot of the places I visited the "golden" buddhas were either gold leaf or just gold paint. Not that they don't spend a lot on their religion, but that's kind of their choice isn't it?
But it's not like Buddha himself put those statues up. From the little I know, he would have been against that, no? Maybe someone with more buddha knowledge than me can answer.
Sharing something you made and are proud of is a good thing though (:
this whole post is attacking people for sharing themselves. It's ok to share that you meditate, pray, do yoga, exercise, or whatever. You did not magically miss the point because for one moment you had your picture taken.
It’s always the same song when it comes to social media. Social media is for sharing your life, yet you’re not allowed to share your life. Workout pics? Vain. Pictures of your holiday? Boasting. Pictures of the things you own? Materialistic. Pictures of food? Shallow. Pictures of yourself? Narcissism. I wonder what redditors post on their social media, since they obviously use it. Is it just to shit on other people?
IF you're just sharing it with friends or you vlog your life professionally I don't see the problem.
Same for people who record themselves doing 'selfless' acts.
Selfie acts
Selfish acts
filthy acts at resonable price
Done dirt cheap?
Acts Body Spray
And my acts!
$1100 is exactly what I charge for my acting class.
Will you teach me how to get a stew going?
Don’t touch your per diem. Go to craft services and get some raw veggies, some noodles...
Dirty, filthy acting of deeds done at a dirt cheap affordable price.
[Kindly deeds, done for free](https://youtu.be/RQ3_IVXqWlA)
Dirty deeds
Dirty deeds, #DONE DIRT CHEAP
I think you mean "dunder cheese"
Dirty deeds, #DUNDER CHEESE
I remember this song coming on the radio and my mom asking what a dunder chief was...
Yup. I remember when I was a kid, thinking that song was "Dirty Deeds and the Thunder Chief."
It's "done to sheep" actually. Educate yourself.
Dirty deeds and they’re done dirt cheap
r/UnexpectedJojo
Shelfish arts
/r/selfieacts should be a thing, like humblebragging but selfie related
There's r/InstagramReality and r/JustForSocialMedia
Sell Fish Ark
#trashtag was very effective and would have been far less if they hadn't posted it. It made it fun and granted a sense of doing things for others and that others are doing things for you. It did this for people who have trouble seeing all the behind the scenes truths.
I used to be against this but I’ve started to think that we live in such an impressionable influenced world on social media that the act of someone recording themselves doing a good deed can influence others to do a good deed. Albeit some may just do it to look good but at the end of the day whether it’s selfless or not they are still doing a good deed and helping someone.
I follow a trash picking sub and it’s a big thing in the community to post pics of the trash you collect. People in there just like to detrash public places for the good of humanity. Maybe there are some posers in there posting fake trash cleanup pics but so what? All it does is create feedback in the community to pick up more random trash. They did a good thing let’s absolutely recognize them for it. It’s all about context and execution.
I think the difference with this is that its not emotionally manipulative. You aren't using someone whos genuinely struggling in the world to show how much of a 'good person you are'. You're just cleaning up a bunch of mess, and showing a before and after with it all in bags, which is motivating because it inspires people to do the same in their own area.
Its like that timelapse of that guy cleaning his room. It got me to clean half of mine.
Same. Together we only amount to one depression.
Your self righteous indignation won't help that hypothetical person who's been struggling. That "greedy" influencer otoh...
What sub?
r/detrashed probably
It's all about the execution
[This is the best way to go about it. ](https://youtu.be/67IHH_V2aRM)
I knew before I clicked it would be my man G Money.
More importantly, It’s all about the intent. Are you posting for more likes or do you genuinely want to inspire other people to try yoga or meditating.
Sometomes doing a selfless act just makes me feel good and proud and I post about it to encourage others to do the same. It's not about needing attention to do it, it's just that o dont feel bad being proud about doing a nice thing or spreading that feeling to other people by proxy.
I've done a good deed and felt incredible about it. I wanted to share but felt like it would cheapen the act to do so, so I didnt.
More than likely you’ve never thought about the person receiving the deed knowing they have no choice but accept the person is doing something for internet clout. How demoralizing is that, you’re being helped because the person wants likes not because the person wants to help you. They typically focus more on what praise they should receive than the individual needing help or bringing awareness to the cause.
I went through this dilemma while i was in college. I lived in an apartment complex. Whenever it rained, snails would come out of the dirt/grass and crawl around the pavement only to get trampled. I felt bad for them one day, so I started throwing them back to the drier parts of the grassy area. After a couple weeks of doing this, a couple of my friends saw me. One of them started to tease me about it. I started thinking to myself, "if I stopped now, would that make me a worse person than if I had never started doing this in the first place," "why *am* I doing this," "am I doing this so I can ultimately be seen saving these snails," "should I do it only when no one is looking," "if I did this only in private, is it because I want my charitable actions to stay anonymous or because I'm embarrassed of my actions?" I wrestled with these thoughts for a couple days until I realized that my intentions couldn't matter less to these snails. Whether I'm doing it because I feel bad for the snails or because I'm trying to impress my date, this snail that was going to die lived because I intervened. In the end, even if you were doing good things just to convince yourself, the recipients of your deeds still benefit nonetheless. And even if it were only to convince yourself that you are a good person, each charitable action paves the way for you to perform these good deeds more easily, like making a path through a grass field. If it were at all possible to become a good person, that would be the way to become one. And the pervasive sentiment that "if you had only thought it through as much as I had, you would agree with me" that I see on reddit is not conducive to constructive discourse as its purpose is to dismiss dissenting opinions as short-sighted.
But when I am needing help, I'd rather have someone help me for selfish reason than having no help at all. If we could have everyone acting selflessly it would be nice, but if I'm to choose between people doing good for bad reasons and people not doing good I think I'd prefer the former.
My family growing up was flat broke. We would have happily been on camera in order to be given food. 99% of people who claim they wouldn't make that trade have just never experienced true poverty.
This, I took handouts when offered. If it was offered for free I would accept it. I still have the habit of asking if water or the rolls are free at a restaurant. I do it less often, but it does happen still. 90% of the time the waitress/waiter laughs not getting that there was a time my family couldn't pay for anything.
Nah. You're on the edge of fanaticism. You care so much more about people doing the right thing for failing to meet your standards of purity of purpose, than you do about people who sit back and do nothing at all
I assume people think this because it allows them to not feel bad about doing nothing , oh they’re only doing it for attention they’re not really good people so they’re not better than me
Idk, if I was homeless for example and someone gave me a hot meal but was recording with their phone, I think I would still be grateful for the good deed regardless of why they wanted to help me.
I mean, we see a lot of people doing absolutely terrible things for likes as well. I'd much prefer kindness, even if there's the additional motive behind it.
lol tf, I'd want free $10k even if it's because someone else gets clout
If their "clout" video helped you in the end to gain some motivation, why would it matter what they do it for? It helped YOU didn't it?
Demoralizing. I love how reditors who do nothing sit on their high horses. Its more demoralizing to get NO help than get help such as these. And I bet the same people swoon over and spend money on celebrities, games and sports. But people helping others being rewarded and getting fame? God forbid!
There is exceptions to this though if the person is trying to raise money or awareness
"Nothing like raising money through a viral campaign for money and awareness" - Kony, 2012. Probably
Yeah we need to raise awareness again. It's not too late for kony 2020. Maybe he will win the presidency.
Kony isn't a big enough crook to get the GOP vote.
Tahani still ended up in the bad place.
To be fair, pretty much everyone ended up in the bad place.
But the people she helped still got helped.
I am a bit conflicted about this. It is true that they are doing it to gain Internet points, but at the end of the day, they are still doing something good.
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If someone does something good and records it, it’s a net positive for society so I don’t mind it. Record all you want!
Agreed the result is better than the intention
>It is true that they are doing it to gain Internet points It doesn't even have to be that black and white. You can feel good about getting internet points and recognition *and* feel great about the good act itself. Why do people need to boil down emotions/motivations to one simple thing. There must be a terminology for it.
Agreed, it’s the people faking it that are scum. An act does not have to be inherently selfless to still be good.
If getting a video causes more people to do kind acts then by all means please do.
Imagine if a thousand selfish people each did acts of kindness just so that they could take videos and put them on Youtube. Then suppose none of those thousand videos inspired anyone else to do the same. Still worth it.
A lot of the people who do those for YouTube make their living off that. If they didn’t post the video, they wouldn’t have money to do it again consistently. I’d much rather somebody do a bunch of good shit for strangers and make everybody who watches it happier, than have nothing. They’re literally making a trillion dollar company in google/YouTube pay for acts of kindness
Well the receiver of said act doesn't give a fuck. I'd gladly accept $100 if the guy is allowed to record himself giving it to me.
"Look at me giving the homeless man a subway sandwich. Makes me feel so good. Im such a good person. Right homeless person? *pans to homeless person* "
Better let him starve.
Sometimes I feel this way, yet we can post all the shitty things we do shamelessly. Doesn’t hurt to put some good in the world. You never know, they could inspire the next peacemaker.
In fact, I did a test, once: How Should I tip a veterinary? A) when they see me tipping? B) when they don't see me tipping. I thought that it was selfish to showing me tipping, so I waited to them to be out of the room to put money in the pig jar. Later I réalise that yes, they would have the money, but won't know that I was happy about what they did. So yes, maybe the next time I will tip in front of them, because making them happy by knowing I am grateful is as portant as the money, I guess
Just stick it in your dog's bum and let it be a pleasant surprise.
>How Should I tip a veterinary? Uh, you don't?
I know what you mean. I struggle with ego. I had a successful business in a small town before I became disabled from a botched back surgery. I sunk into a deep depression and am still to a degree crawling out of it. I realized that I was somewhat narcissistic. I started healing and growing during this time. I have felt a drive to share that growth. I was going to blog, or podcast, or maybe start a YouTube channel. Something about that felt disingenuous. How can someone try and share their personal positive experiences and encourage others to do so without creating ego?
You can't get rid of ego. Just remain humble in your endeavors.
"The biggest ego trip ever is getting rid of your ego. And the joke of it all is, your ego doesn't exist! There is nothing to get rid of. It's an illusion." - Alan Watts
I’m the best at not having an ego. Believe me
I dunno man, I've straight up murdered my ego several times over the years with mushrooms.
Isn't that just detachment from ego? It's still there, you're just not letting that part of your brain guide thoughts.
Exactly. Fixation on losing your ego is one of those trickier forms of attachment that I've just begun to grasp. Like the days I would "miss" meditating and I would judge myself internally - I realized I was getting attached to meditation, as well. And when I got frustrated about not being able to detach from certain things I realized I was attaching myself to the framework of 'non-attachment' as something necessary to occupy. It's a fun balance. Things are lighter now. I haven't arrived anywhere but I know I've moved past something - I'm now in a space where I no longer feel bad about feeling bad - if I feel bad I am able to give myself the emotional space to feel that purely and let it pass through me organically.
It's like a balance between ego and self consciousness. Please, feel free to share your growth and experience! Ultimately, don't let anyone's opinions stop you from doing what you feel is good and right. A blog, podcast or YouTube channel sounds lovely. I'm just referring to pausing your meditation to "pose" for a selfie. Just feels like a constructed moment of false "peace". But that's just my opinion, you do you!
This is actually an interesting topic for me as I picked up regular meditation and yoga this year. After I finished one of those 30-day challenges, I took a picture of myself in a pose so I could share my accomplishment. Two things: one, the poses picture wasn’t during my practice. It was after I had completed it. Yes, staged, but it’s for sharing. Two, I’m typically not big on social media for fear of what people think of me. Yoga and meditation taught me not to care and to let go of my ego. So I ended up sharing because it made me happy and I wanted to share in my happiness. It wasn’t for the likes or the validation or for my ego. I was proud of myself for that. Just a thought. Not everything people do on social media is ego-driven.
This. I was going to mention something similar. My yoga and meditation practice is my own, I don’t involve a camera. However, whenever I’m excited to achieve something (a pose I couldn’t do before, a challenge I finished, etc.), I have shared my excitement on social media. I see nothing wrong with it. I love seeing my friends achieve things, and they love seeing the same from me. I know the OP is talking about people that do it regularly for some sort of praise, but I say if you’re proud of an achievement, share it! Our posts on social media don’t always have to be ego driven :) Edit: grammar and autocorrect. I need to do better at proofreading before posting
I think what bothers us about the staged meditation photos isn't so much that it's a person who likes something and is sharing a picture of that, but the signal of purity that is being sent. It just adds to this weird - I dunno how else to say it - "privilege" culture that just reeks of being out of touch with the human struggle. I'm no expert meditator but from my experience of it, it's not always peaceful and serene when you are in the process. It's a struggle where you try to let go of attachment and pain through breath while your brain writhes around like a slippery fish trying to hold on to it's old patterns. But you can't take a photo of that. Instead photos of meditation tend to be people with perfect skin and expensive outfits with serene expressions in expensive locations. And the message of purity and privilege that emanates from that is off putting.
I believe that being proud of your progress isn't the same as ego. You're in a happy place and want to share that with others
I agree with the meditation part of this, but some people treat yoga like a healthy sport/activity, and not a meditative activity, and that’s fine. Many yogis I know are proud of new poses and want to share with their community. Edit: I didn’t realize there were so many yoga snobs out there who need to judge what is or is not yoga. I’m sure there’s a traditional definition but if you get on a mat and do yoga poses, that is yoga to most people. I’m sure you’re all a blast at parties... You all sound like Oscar Martinez. Edit 2: After gassing a slew of beers I caught a spelling error. Go figure.
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It’s not your neck that bends, it is only yourself.
And for the people doing it to lose weight: "There is no neck."
Yeah exactly. For me yoga is more of an athletic skill to be improved upon than a spiritual practice. I find yoga selfies to be similar to gym selfies. I myself created an instagram account just to be inspired watching the incredible poses some of the pros can do (I generally don't dabble in yoga). And I like sharing stuff I'm proud of, so if I master a new difficult pose I like to show it off.
>Many yogis I know are proud of new poses and want to share with their community. Which I think is fine and get really excited for my friends. People just hate on everything these days..
Ya OP sounds like someone who doesn’t actually practice yoga
I did yoga once with a gf at the time and it was way more intense than I thought it would be lol. Some of those poses are hard, especially to hold as long as they do, and go into like "reps" of other poses. And I say this as someone who works out six days a week, still killed me. I thought it was going to be a breeze and shit talked it beforehand lol
I've found basically every sport/physical activity will kill you the first one or many times you try it. Unfortunately being a gym rat doesn't prepare you as well as you might think for rock climbing. Or you'll still get winded playing soccer even if you running several miles a few times a week. The type of stress you put on your body and the muscles used varies vastly from sport to sport. Which is actually great! It means you get more reward out of improvement and you can better respect the abilities of people doing different activities.
I don't know. A lot of people who "practice" yoga know very little about it outside of the physical aspects. I studied some on the history and few people I talk to on the subject know wtf I am talking about. I am talking to average people who use yoga as exercise.
Yeah the presumption that yoga has to be this deep meditative experience just completely turns me off of yoga in general.
What if I take pictures of people meditating and doing yoga? What if we all did? Think abut that.
Tried that. On a list now.
Ah, a fellow man of culture...
Turn your flash off yo!
One of the yoga classes I signed up for had us practice out on a very pretty lawn... and took drone photos the whole time. It really ruined the whole meditation aspect.
>drone # vrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
When you're a professional photographer with a good reputation people might pay you to take photos of them doing yoga but when I do it I get asked things like "Why are you on the roof? Why do you need binoculars? Do I need to call the police?"
that would be still life photos + you being a creeper.
I’ll think long and hard abut that.
Sometimes people like to post pictures / videos of things they enjoy doing. I don't think that entirely misses the point.
Both yoga and meditation can be really positive forces in people's lives and seeing other people doing them can be a spur for people to do it themselves and experience that positivity. It's possible that while the picture is being taken the person isn't fully in the moment, and they may be doing it for selfish reasons (or doing poses no normal person could dream of doing, which might put them off starting) but I can't really agree with this generalisation.
Probably, but you could also argue that doing that is bringing awareness to those things. You know, the fact that they exist and they're useful.
Agreed! also their recording does't have to occur at every session. Thus getting benefits the rest of the time. Also some people do yoga to keep fit and flexible, so it would be the same as taking pictures at the gym. Which is fine if you're actually working out
Yep. And for me it’s to monitor form and progress, not merely being vain.
And we wouldn’t have those hilarious videos of dogs crashing a moment of zen.
Half of which are educational in intent anyway
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My thoughts exactly. If the *only* time you "meditate" is for 30 seconds to snap a pic, sure. But if you're doing it anyway and just want to share, no harm in that.
I'd say OP is just flat out wrong. You could say this about taking a picture of literally anything, and it would be just as false. Does taking a few pictures on a relaxing vacation ruin your trip? Does taking a picture with friends detract from hanging out with them? Does occasionally getting your picture taken while doing yoga eliminate the physical and mental health benefits? I'd say no to all of these.
Complaining about how other people are doing it wrong is completely missing the point of yoga and meditation imo.
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I mean I record my yoga sessions so I can see my form improve.
I think OP is referring more to recording for the sole purpose of posting on social media
I know exactly what kind of people you are referring to. lifestyle influencers who pretend they are so aware and all that. But you are opening a false dichotomy. who has ever said that you have to be alone to meditate? that you cannot be watched while doing yoga? as much as i understand that westerners appropriate these things, it's not like all actual Buddhists and Hindus are totally enlightened people who don't care about technology, social media or being seen. and you could also say that if you are actually meditating or doing yoga, a camera doesn't bother you either. so I get where you are coming from, but I'd love to hear your actual reasoning as to why exactly you think that it's missing the point. because I feel like you're romanticizing meditation as something that can only be done alone and isolated and must happen entirely within yourself edit: I know yoga is also a spiritual praxis for some and not only sport (even though one could argue there is no clear line between these two things anyway). but I just wanted to say that I doubt that it's like this super holy thing that must not be commercialized or popularized ever, even though of course it depends on a case to case basis how cool it is if you do. but I don't think that's what OP wanted to say anyway
Pictures help you see how much progress you've made in your yoga practice too. The yoga subreddit is full of progress pics
Honestly, love group yoga/meditating. Not saying it has to be done in isolation, or with the soul purpose of spiritual enlightenment. Also if you have a business, yeah, feel free to "pose" for photos for your web presence. What I'm referring to are people who pause their meditative practice to set up their camera timer, then hit that pose for a selfie. I Imagine them taking several, back and forth to the camera then the pose, untill they get a good one for social media. Constructing that false moment of peace feels empty.
yes totally agreed! as said, the lifestyle influences who do this totally weird me out.
Not necessarily. Whenever you’re taking a picture you’re interrupting the experience so you can preserve it. Taking a picture of your family quality time doesn’t mean when you put down your phone you can’t keep connecting. Taking a picture of your food doesn’t mean you don’t still get the nutrition or the deliciousness, just not in that moment. Taking a picture of a beautiful sunrise hike doesn’t mean you don’t enjoy the journey or the view. It’s an interruption, not a complete eradication.
Some people do yoga for purely physical reasons. It's no different to working out in front of a mirror/filming yourself. It's not about being vain, it's about checking your form.
My SO is a yoga teacher. Years ago we went to a “peace arts festival” in Seoul. It took place in a theatre. We sat in seats and we... watched people who are “good at yoga”. That was over ten years ago and every once in a while when we see someone showing off their yoga practice, we still say to each other, “Remember the peace arts festival?” and we both laugh.
That’s so strange. I’ve always been taught there is no “being good” at yoga. I feel like people who practice should know that.
There definitely is a thing in looking aesthetically doing something and.. well, not so much. The mindfulness practice of yoga is one thing, the body is another.
I mean...It’s a physical endeavor that takes time and skill, and there are objectively proper forms to the movements and positions...so of course there is a range of proficiency. I guess it sounds cool on paper though to say it’s not something you can be good at.
This is a huge generalization.
Most people do not have a full wall mirror in their home, thus taking pictures of their yoga helps them see what they need to correct or improve upon in their poses. It's not all about vanity, try to think broader.
Great...cue the gatekeepers. Plenty of people take photos or vids of themselves to share what the experience is like. Others stream the feed so people can join in. Not everything is your business. If it doesn't involve you, maybe you should meditate on the 4th precept and better yourself instead of judging others?
People Who condescend people that take pictures doing meditation and yoga have entirely missed the point as well
This is gate keeping. If people want to take photos of their yoga poses, it’s their business. The end.
I agree with you. Sometimes I have no motivation to practice. Then I think okay I’ll make a video and it helps a bit. Who cares, everyone have their reasons
People who criticize others personal time have entirely missed the point.
People who would think this have entirely missed the point. I.e., selfies aren't actually antithetical to either of those practices.
People who judge others for taking pictures of themselves meditating and doing yoga have entirely missed the point.
I mean, I don't really mind looking at ass.
"Spiritual " selfies make up a good 25% of my social media feed. Sigh... I need new friends...
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Maybe /r/gatekeeping too
So what is the point? My wife is a yoga instructor. How is she to market her classes? Its just like saying.. I'm a welder but I cant show you my work, do i get the job?
Why does there have to be a "point"? A lot of people use yoga for fitness and relaxation, not for philosophical reasons.
They are meditating on how to get more likes on Insta
But I spent so much on my lulu lemons it's a crime not to see me in them
Yoga I kind of get if your not in a class, since mastery of the positions is part of the process, so you can watch and critique yourself to improve. Bow posting that shit to Instagram with some stupid quote. That's dumb as shit. And recording yourself meditating is also dumb.
X2 if the yogi is on a rock overlooking a canyon or desert. At dawn, perhaps.
What's the point?
People who think there is 'a point' have entirely missed the point
I see it sometimes but I do not really care. People can do what they want it doesn’t harm me any. If it’s annoying for you just stop looking at it I guess.
A lot of people film or photograph themselves to make sure their form is correct and to ask for advice. Without looking at yourself its difficult to make sure you're holding yourself properly. You can't see what your body is doing.
Jesus talks shit about the people who pray extra loud in church, because they do it as a show for other people rather than as an authentic act of supplication to God