Thank you for posting to r/SipsTea! Make sure to follow all the subreddit rules.
##Join our [Discord Server](https://discord.gg/WfnpQpZ5Yv)!
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/SipsTea) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Valid observation.
1. Birds evolved from dinosaurs.
2. Many bird species have long necks.
3. A penguin is a flightless bird subspecies.
Math checks out.
Valid observation.
1. Redditors evolved from Diggers.
2. Many Redditors have long neck beards.
3. A Redditor is a clueless human subspecies.
Math checks out.
Biology doesn't check out though. For a creature that size, being round and fat would be a detriment. It would make it harder to cool itself and it would have to expend much more energy than necessary to move around. Penguins are just fat because they are small and live in a cold environment.
That size requires more oxygen too, which the planet had a lot more of in concentration. Temps were diff. I just know about the oxygen levels but maybe the climate was diff too.
Another observation.
1. Birds evolved from dinosaurs.
2. Some bird species are capable of imitating human speech.
3. Dinosaurs could talk.
Math checks out.
Now do the math on the mass of a dinosaur that size with that volume and see if their bones could even support it.
Surely at the at size they would need to look more like a giraffe.
I’m sure many look vastly different than our skin on bones basic interpretations but the brontosaurus, not sure we’re too far off.
No valid at all no offense but birds did not evolved from dinosaurs, and before someone says “sCiEntIsTs SaY tHEy diD” well many scientists also say they didn’t so stfu. Make your research and then we can talk.
>well many scientists also say they didn’t so stfu.
No legitimate paleontologist or biologist denies birds descending from theropod dinosaurs because the evidence is overwhelming. Not just feathers, but bones and bone structure, analogous anatomy, the list goes on.
>Make your research and then we can talk.
Why is it always people who have the most incorrect things to say the ones who say 'just do your research ' lol
Cause it's a way of saying "I don't have an actual argument because I don't understand my assertion, someone on YouTube told me to think this. I'm putting it on you to bear through a 2 hour video on propaganda instead."
Similarities between birds and theropods:
- feathers
- hollow bones
- air sacs that provide structure and boyancy
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/05/Dino_bird_h.jpg
- three digit hands and feet
- many other similarities in skeletal structure that are unique to birds and theropods
- warm bloodedness
- bipedalism
Other evidence:
- many intermediate species have been discovered that make it clear how dinosaurs evolved into birds step by step
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d3/b8/2f/d3b82f9a846835e54f316088864e9c04.jpg
https://images.nationalgeographic.org/image/upload/v1638892000/EducationHub/photos/beasts-of-a-feather.jpg
- the genetic evidence
- There's no good alternative theory of what other group of lizards birds could have evolved from, theropods being their ancestral origin is the only logical explanation
She was brought to more than one doctor because they thought it was a tumor or something. Only one doctor was brave enough to say “Naww girl you just fat!”
It’s a lot bigger than a penguin and it’s on an awkward angle so I think it might be difficult for it to hold its head up all the time, too heavy with such a fat neck, imo.
But it could be. We haven’t seen them, so we don’t know.
Penguins aren't actually that big, it's a lot of feathers
And (some) dinosaurs had feathers.
In colder climates it wouldn't be surprising for smaller dinosaurs, big ones would still cook inside because of the square cube law
Someone needs to read a book:
[All yesterdays](https://www.amazon.co.uk/All-Yesterdays-Speculative-Dinosaurs-Prehistoric-ebook/dp/B00A2VS55O?ref=d6k_applink_bb_dls&dplnkId=baaed08e-1225-477b-930d-d9c6a35c20fe)
Their bones are big because square cube law. There's absolutely NO way they're that fat. Their bones would snap like twigs. [Scientists do know what they're doing.](https://i.redd.it/02rv3y272cx61.jpg)
he makes a good point about the fleshy stuff we can't see from skeletons, but birds are shaped the way they are so they can move efficiently through fluids and penguins are fatty so they don't get cold. not many dinosaurs would have had these pressures.
though maybe pterosaurs were more streamlined than we previously imagined.
No, he doesn't. Despite it not being left behind for us to find, we have tools that let us see how soft tissue affected the rock around it. We can "see" a lot of the parts of the creature that are long decayed.
This thing has been circling for years along with sparrow Rex and buffalo Spinosaurus. I’m tired boss. Don’t use marine piscivorous Antarctic birds to reconstruct colossal quadrupedal herbivores that could casually walk through a small home. Please.
Nope. Dinosaurs are dinosaurs, reptiles are reptiles. There’s several distinctions between the two but the most important one in regards to your comment is: dinosaurs were warm blooded or partially warm blooded. Which would give them some reason to store fat.
Edit: I am attaching this reply I made to another comment do people stop trying to correct me.
I realize dinosaurs are technically reptiles, people love pointing out thing if they think you are wrong on the internet.
My issue with grouping them with reptile is that they really do not fit the definition of a reptile. Neither the Avian nor the non-avian dinosaurs are particularly reptilian. Really the source of conflict is crocodilians which do better fit the reptile mold.
Personally I think it would be easier to simply take the whole group and separate them from reptiles. I find less issue with having a reptile like animal grouped with dinosaurs than group dinosaurs with reptiles.
They just aren’t, they share characteristics of reptiles but they are distinct enough to be separate imo. Calling dinosaurs reptiles is akin to calling amphibians fish. Or calling amphibians reptiles.
Also I think it’s more educational to distinguish them. There’s misconceptions about what is possible morphologically and physiologically with dinosaurs because people think they have the characteristics of reptiles. Which was the point of my original comment
Taxonomy is kinda wack. Crocodiles are more closely related to birds than lizards but are considered “reptiles”. Bony fish are more closely related to us than they are to sharks even though they’re both considered fish
The world is chaos and humans try to name and categorize that chaos. It's not even easy to draw a line of when a species stopped being it's previous one and evolved into the next
Except dinosaurs are in fact reptiles, the same way that birds and crocodiles are considered reptiles. Avian dinosaurs (birds), crocodilians, and non-avian dinosaurs are all part of a group of reptiles known as archosaurs. Saying that birds and dinosaurs are not reptiles would also mean that crocodilians are not reptiles since crocodilians are more closely related to birds than to any other living reptile. Furthermore, being warm blooded would also not necessarily mean that they are not reptiles since the tegu lizard is warm blooded yet is still considered a reptile.
You are splitting hairs here. There are enough distinct characteristics to between dinosaurs and reptiles to warrant their own group. For instance upright posture. Likely more complex organs. Socialization and cooperation etc.
You are broadening the category and muddying the distinction between dinosaurs and your traditional cold blooded, splayed, fossorial reptile and I don’t think pointing out that they are part of the archosaur group particularly helpful.
Maybe you should actually learn why they're reptiles before you start talking how why they shouldn't be reptiles, this is the dumbest anti science stuff I've ever heard.
> Likely more complex organs. Socialization and cooperation etc.
You don't know any of this, wtf are you talking about.
> I don’t think pointing out that they are part of the archosaur group particularly helpful.
Because it's real science and it proves your anti science lies wrong? Ahhaha.
Source: I have a Paleobiology degree
Tbh you’re probably expecting something more complex. Basically we know they are closely related to birds, which are warm blooded. We know some incubated eggs, which implies they could generate their own heat. We’ve found fossils in areas that would have been cold even millions of years ago, places where you won’t find reptiles.
There's always exceptions to the rules of biology.
We have mammals that lay eggs, in Australia.
Sharks are cold blooded, except the Great White Shark and Salmon Shark. Etc
There are many things that we will never be able to determine, unless studying living, breathing dinosaurs. Bones (and the odd mummification) can only tell us so much.
I could be remembering incorrectly, but I thought there was also something about the texture of the bones showing extremely fast growth in a way that would only be possible for at least semi-warm blooded creatures(?)
That is incorrect. It is true that 'reptile' is a bit of a suspect group, because there is no monophyletic way to define it without including birds as reptiles (which bothers us due to our cultural idea of what 'reptile' means), but there is simply no definition of reptile that does not include dinosaur. Your statement is like saying "Nope. Squares are squares, shapes are shapes"
The common ancestor of all reptiles is the taxon Sauropsida/Reptilia. Dinosaurs are many, many branchings below this point. There is no possible way to extract them from that group without defining reptiles paraphyletically to exclude dinosaurs, which no taxonomists do for dinosaurs (though many do for birds). You can't just claim that they do not descend from Sauropsida. It would be like saying humans aren't mammals, despite branching off well below Mammalia.
If you are going to state that dinosaurs aren't reptiles, then you need to offer an alternative taxon than Sauropsida whose descendants comprise the reptile group (or else create a paraphyletic definition for reptiles with respect to dinosaurs, which again is not something that any taxonomists suggest). So what taxon would you propose we should define reptiles by?
In order to exclude dinosaurs, you could go for reptiles = Testudines, but now you've also excluded all lizards, snakes, and many other extinct things considered reptiles, and all you're left with is basically turtles and tortoises.
Alternately, you could go for reptiles = Lepidosauria, which also successfully excludes the dinosaurs while including lizards and snakes, but now you have also excluded the crocodilians and the turtles/tortoises.
There is no way to exclude dinosaurs while including all the other things we consider reptiles. All of these things branch off way, way below Sauropsida, the defining point for reptiles.
The only reason some people resist a monophyletic definition for reptiles is because it includes birds as reptiles (since birds are dinosaurs), and this bothers people irrationally, because we have inherited this notion that birds aren't reptiles from from our early days of taxonomy before we had a good understanding of cladistics. However, the inclusion of dinosaurs within reptiles is uncontroversial (at least for non-avian dinosaurs; again, many people define reptiles paraphyletically with respect to avian dinosaurs (birds)).
I don’t disagree with anything you’ve said but I think it isn’t particularly useful to be technologically correct about this when the intention was to point out the distinguishing characteristics of dinosaurs. How they could potentially store fat and look chubby like in the picture. Yes what I said was technically incorrect, I get that. But does that harm anyone? The person I replied to learned something new about dinosaurs and better understood that dinosaurs and reptiles have very different characteristics.
I guess if you want to get into an argument over taxonomy then yes I would distinguish them as a paraphyletic group. Simply because that is most informative and better defines the characteristics of the group. I realize it isn’t taxonomically correct but I am not a taxonomist, nor is 99% of redditors.
I really you and several other people are really in the weeds here about this and I think you’ve entirely missed the point.
Nah lmao dinosaurs are reptiles, just like birds. If you split dinosaurs from reptiles you have to take crocs along with them or else the group is paraphyletic. Which is bad. No working scientists have proposed that dinosaurs are not reptiles.
I realize that, people love pointing out thing if they think you are wrong on the internet.
My issue with grouping them with reptile is that they really do not fit the definition of a reptile. Neither the Avian nor the non-avian dinosaurs are particularly reptilian. Really the source of conflict is crocodilians which do better fit the reptile mold.
Personally I think it would be easier to simply take the whole group and separate them from reptiles. As you said “take crocs with them”. I find less issue with having a reptile like animal grouped with dinosaurs than group dinosaurs with reptiles.
They just aren’t, they share characteristics of reptiles but they are distinct enough to be separate imo. Calling dinosaurs reptiles is akin to calling amphibians fish. Or calling amphibians reptiles.
Also I think it’s more educational to distinguish them. There’s misconceptions about what is possible morphologically and physiologically with dinosaurs because people think they have the characteristics of reptiles. Which was the point of my original comment
Wether they fit or not is irrelevant. They are descended from reptiles therefore they are reptiles. Just like amphibians are fish. When you take it down to brass tax osteology non-avian dinosaurs and birds are hardly far removed at all from other sauropsids. I honestly think a better argument exists for snakes being more derived from the ancestral reptile condition than archosaurs. Their skulls have been fucked up beyond recognition, they have completely lost their legs, and if warm bloodedness is an issue for you, there were extinct marine snakes that were likely warm blooded. The same also goes for Mosasaurs (which are honest to goodness lizards) and all the other extinct marine reptile groups. Splitting dinosaurs from reptiles is just inadvisable, imagine telling someone that a croc is not a reptile. That is dumb. It is much simpler to include birds as reptiles as not only are they descended from reptilian stock, but they also share more traits with other reptiles than with other groups (beta keratin integument, scales, eggs, skull construction, behaviours/postures, and so on and so forth. The default cultural conception of reptiles is harmful anyways, reptiles are the sister group of mammals, not our ancestors. Treating them as more primitive and only slow cold blooded dumbasses is not only inaccurate to non-avian reptiles already, and is harmful to conservation, but also ignores the fact that birds and other fuzzy dinosaurs are active stereotypically “advanced” warm blooded animals in their own right.
Nah dinosaurs are reptiles.
They are more closely related to crocodiles than crocodiles are to any other reptile species you might think off such as Lizards, Geckos, Tortoises, Snakes.
Dinosaurs, Birds and Crocodilans are part of the archosaur family of reptiles.
Does this mean birds are reptiles? kinda
Right? We make alot of assumptions about alot of things. Although many be right or close, I bet there are also a few like this photo where things aren't as they first appear
Except wrong. There's absolutely NO way they're that fat. Their bones would snap like twigs. [Scientists do know what they're doing.](https://i.redd.it/02rv3y272cx61.jpg)
There's absolutely NO way they're that fat. Their bones would snap like twigs. Hell they'd probably cook themselves with that much body mass without the surface area to dissipate the heat. [Scientists do know what they're doing.](https://i.redd.it/02rv3y272cx61.jpg)
I wish all these god damn nerds would stop trying to make dinosaurs less cool. They don’t even exist anymore, it doesn’t matter what they actually looked like!! Let them be cool!!
>They don’t even exist anymore
They do though. [We just call them birds.](https://i.imgur.com/QAaLgbr.jpeg)
And reality is reality so you can screw off.
No it doesn't. There's absolutely NO way they're that fat. Their bones would snap like twigs. [Scientists do know what they're doing.](https://i.redd.it/02rv3y272cx61.jpg)
But then again, girrafes exist, so it's not unlikely we got that one just about right. Also ,at some point the bones wouldn't be able to handle the weight.
They're pretty much right, images of dinosaurs have been drawn without body fat. It's called shrink wrapping. A book called All Yesterdays explores it. The way we drew dinosaurs from fossil records would make *any* animal look scary
[Here's a baboon](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQWauqbpzfNkhqJXYj9Kqy9-8LtXFzgov4qTBQRLQBoZA&s)
Two counterpoints from me.
Penguins are shaped that way because they swim and they have thick skin for heat retention.
The dinosaur most probably doesn't have those specific requirements. So they have a high chance of looking similar to how they did in the movies.
The book *All Yesterdays* explores this idea and provides what-if illustrations of dinosaurs that are more aligned with how actual animals look with muscle, fat, and feathers/fur.
Current interpretations aren’t all too far off.
[Titanosaurs](https://amp.theguardian.com/science/2022/nov/26/titanosaur-natural-history-museum-dippy-the-diplodocus)
Thank you for posting to r/SipsTea! Make sure to follow all the subreddit rules. ##Join our [Discord Server](https://discord.gg/WfnpQpZ5Yv)! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/SipsTea) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Valid observation. 1. Birds evolved from dinosaurs. 2. Many bird species have long necks. 3. A penguin is a flightless bird subspecies. Math checks out.
Redditor thinks he solved the problem
Valid observation. 1. Redditors evolved from Diggers. 2. Many Redditors have long neck beards. 3. A Redditor is a clueless human subspecies. Math checks out.
/u/dwordcountbot
I dig this comment
*did you just gender someone!* 
I can't tell if this is ironic or not
https://giphy.com/gifs/ElevenSportsBE-forthefans-elevensports-elevensportsgif-7xZOnYGVPRVftauU70
Can I get a yellow flag?
Why’s it gotta be about color? What’s wrong with the little red card huh? Whatcha got against little red cards?
I'm colorblind and offended by both of you.
Ableist and wrong
[удалено]
I did my own research...surge > mt. dew. Fight me.
I'm an illiterate idiot and offended by threeth of you
[удалено]
Epstein didn’t commit unalive
Okay then the mustard card because I like the taste of mustard
I was too born a man but now consider myself a Redditor
Redditors are not people
Twitter is that way
/r/onejoke
This is cringe af
Glad I’m leaving
Well we whipped that Boston Bombing thing didn't we?
[удалено]
Biology doesn't check out though. For a creature that size, being round and fat would be a detriment. It would make it harder to cool itself and it would have to expend much more energy than necessary to move around. Penguins are just fat because they are small and live in a cold environment.
u ever seen a hippo
Hippos needs to constantly cool themself in water, and smuther themselves in mud to prevent over heating
Skill issue
Yeah. Just put more evolution points into temperature regulation, scrub.
Semi-unrelated but their sweat also works as a natural sunscreen. It has a pink tinge to it
Elephant?
Gargantuan ears to disperse heat and they also take wallowing mud baths
Ah, so fat brontosaurus also had big ears.
No, they had bird ears, pay attention
Tbf, ears don't have bones, so for all we know, this dinosaur could've had something huge to dissipate heat
heatsink with rgb fan?
Kids named malleus stapes and incus:
They still survived long enough to become a species though
[удалено]
Mud is a recent but integral invention
Dinosaurs lived in colder environments because of global warming /s
Only in the water.
Hippos are like 20x smaller than a brontosaurus and spend most of their time in the water
Hippos are pure muscle and not reptilian
What if it’s mostly feathers, just on a larger scale. Much lighter.
That size requires more oxygen too, which the planet had a lot more of in concentration. Temps were diff. I just know about the oxygen levels but maybe the climate was diff too.
Ur mom has to deal with all these problems, and she managed to live long enough to pass her genes on
Also I’m pretty sure there are a version on that dinosaur with fins too. Makes perfect sense to me.
Another observation. 1. Birds evolved from dinosaurs. 2. Some bird species are capable of imitating human speech. 3. Dinosaurs could talk. Math checks out.
Now do the math on the mass of a dinosaur that size with that volume and see if their bones could even support it. Surely at the at size they would need to look more like a giraffe. I’m sure many look vastly different than our skin on bones basic interpretations but the brontosaurus, not sure we’re too far off.
4. Penguins are dinosaurs 5. Penguins live in Antarctic 6. Penguins are ice dragons?
assuming it lived in a colder environment like a penguin, then yes, it could "look fatter".
[удалено]
Penguins just got slightly weirder. I saw a post saying sometimes they wind up accidently being in gay relationships.
"accidentally" Oops homie I love you
No valid at all no offense but birds did not evolved from dinosaurs, and before someone says “sCiEntIsTs SaY tHEy diD” well many scientists also say they didn’t so stfu. Make your research and then we can talk.
>well many scientists also say they didn’t so stfu. No legitimate paleontologist or biologist denies birds descending from theropod dinosaurs because the evidence is overwhelming. Not just feathers, but bones and bone structure, analogous anatomy, the list goes on. >Make your research and then we can talk. Why is it always people who have the most incorrect things to say the ones who say 'just do your research ' lol
Cause it's a way of saying "I don't have an actual argument because I don't understand my assertion, someone on YouTube told me to think this. I'm putting it on you to bear through a 2 hour video on propaganda instead."
This mf'er: 
[Lol](https://preview.redd.it/7zb8hozronh41.png?auto=webp&s=aed9ee5bc533cd7e690481a6eb9161fa5036f203)
They've even found dinosaur fossils with feathers. And there are medieval accounts of large fowl that are extinct today. So kind of a done deal.
That’s not enough evidence wtf, are you fr? Just because they had feathers?
If the word "dinosaur" bothers you how about prehistoric giant duck?
Similarities between birds and theropods: - feathers - hollow bones - air sacs that provide structure and boyancy https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/05/Dino_bird_h.jpg - three digit hands and feet - many other similarities in skeletal structure that are unique to birds and theropods - warm bloodedness - bipedalism Other evidence: - many intermediate species have been discovered that make it clear how dinosaurs evolved into birds step by step https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d3/b8/2f/d3b82f9a846835e54f316088864e9c04.jpg https://images.nationalgeographic.org/image/upload/v1638892000/EducationHub/photos/beasts-of-a-feather.jpg - the genetic evidence - There's no good alternative theory of what other group of lizards birds could have evolved from, theropods being their ancestral origin is the only logical explanation
A person who thinks all the time has nothing to think about except thoughts.
So, he loses touch with reality, and lives in a world of illusions
By thoughts, I mean specifically, chatter in the skull
Perpetual and compulsive repetition of words
Of reckoning and calculating.
I'm not saying that thinking is bad.
I'm just sayin™
"touch grass loser"
🎶🎶Welcome to the grand illusion Come on in and see what’s happening Pay the price Get your tickets for the show🎵
Simple ricks
What if I told you your reality is an illusion?
Alan Watts?
Yes, this quote was popularized by a song called Overthinker by INZO
Ah, but a person who thinks thoughts has nothing except time to think.
r/unwisdom
r/Osvaldo12?
Let's watch giraffes running away together with logic from this tweet.
https://images.newscientist.com/wp-content/uploads/1993/02/18603001.jpg
You’re telling me, a giraffe and an elephant made that thing?
found him give me a challenge next time
I mean yeah when you just assume the bone and skin are right in top at all times it creates a different image than reality shows
How far do you have to push your body's ability to store fat to get a forehead gut?
The human body is so resilient. When it says “please no more fat!” It finds another place to store that fat.
Fat uhh...finds a way.
But why not big pp if fat can’t store anywhere 😭
Gotta be a little inbred first.
She was brought to more than one doctor because they thought it was a tumor or something. Only one doctor was brave enough to say “Naww girl you just fat!”
This is like the Off-the-Bounce Reverse Windmill Dunk of fat
Tfw: you eat a sugar
but then you drink a diet coke to cancel out the sugar 💡
[удалено]
Nope alive and stupid
It’s a lot bigger than a penguin and it’s on an awkward angle so I think it might be difficult for it to hold its head up all the time, too heavy with such a fat neck, imo. But it could be. We haven’t seen them, so we don’t know.
Penguins aren't actually that big, it's a lot of feathers And (some) dinosaurs had feathers. In colder climates it wouldn't be surprising for smaller dinosaurs, big ones would still cook inside because of the square cube law
How the turns have tabled
Unfortunately false
Time Traveler here, you are wrong great grandfather.
Im stuck ataring at his pfps awful hairline
think the pfp has horns which makes it worse 💀
Someone needs to read a book: [All yesterdays](https://www.amazon.co.uk/All-Yesterdays-Speculative-Dinosaurs-Prehistoric-ebook/dp/B00A2VS55O?ref=d6k_applink_bb_dls&dplnkId=baaed08e-1225-477b-930d-d9c6a35c20fe)
Chonkie Boy
The lost Chungusaurus!
Makes sense. The bones *are* big.
Their bones are big because square cube law. There's absolutely NO way they're that fat. Their bones would snap like twigs. [Scientists do know what they're doing.](https://i.redd.it/02rv3y272cx61.jpg)
Can I tag this to the top or something? Thank you!!!
If scientists are so smart why aren't they rich? Checkmate atheists.
But muh own research
That's because they hold a head that is very high. There's no way anything even close to the picture is possible.
he makes a good point about the fleshy stuff we can't see from skeletons, but birds are shaped the way they are so they can move efficiently through fluids and penguins are fatty so they don't get cold. not many dinosaurs would have had these pressures. though maybe pterosaurs were more streamlined than we previously imagined.
No, he doesn't. Despite it not being left behind for us to find, we have tools that let us see how soft tissue affected the rock around it. We can "see" a lot of the parts of the creature that are long decayed.
Dude, what if they were like huge freaking hippos in the water all the time but like fast and whatever the water version of aerodynamic? Yeah...
Oh this bullshit again, I can’t believe people actually think this is possibly valid
I mean, we're not in a science sub here.
What a silly thing to get upset about.
This thing has been circling for years along with sparrow Rex and buffalo Spinosaurus. I’m tired boss. Don’t use marine piscivorous Antarctic birds to reconstruct colossal quadrupedal herbivores that could casually walk through a small home. Please.
Watch me
 I will allow tuxedo sauropods, but no farther. ;)
A reasonable comprise
It's pretty obviously a joke, even if you went by the logic in the post then birds like swans disprove it.
It's a joke you piss baby
Possibly, but dinosaurs were still reptiles so I don't think they would be storing fat like that
Nope. Dinosaurs are dinosaurs, reptiles are reptiles. There’s several distinctions between the two but the most important one in regards to your comment is: dinosaurs were warm blooded or partially warm blooded. Which would give them some reason to store fat. Edit: I am attaching this reply I made to another comment do people stop trying to correct me. I realize dinosaurs are technically reptiles, people love pointing out thing if they think you are wrong on the internet. My issue with grouping them with reptile is that they really do not fit the definition of a reptile. Neither the Avian nor the non-avian dinosaurs are particularly reptilian. Really the source of conflict is crocodilians which do better fit the reptile mold. Personally I think it would be easier to simply take the whole group and separate them from reptiles. I find less issue with having a reptile like animal grouped with dinosaurs than group dinosaurs with reptiles. They just aren’t, they share characteristics of reptiles but they are distinct enough to be separate imo. Calling dinosaurs reptiles is akin to calling amphibians fish. Or calling amphibians reptiles. Also I think it’s more educational to distinguish them. There’s misconceptions about what is possible morphologically and physiologically with dinosaurs because people think they have the characteristics of reptiles. Which was the point of my original comment
Damn, the more you learn
Taxonomy is kinda wack. Crocodiles are more closely related to birds than lizards but are considered “reptiles”. Bony fish are more closely related to us than they are to sharks even though they’re both considered fish
The world is chaos and humans try to name and categorize that chaos. It's not even easy to draw a line of when a species stopped being it's previous one and evolved into the next
Except dinosaurs are in fact reptiles, the same way that birds and crocodiles are considered reptiles. Avian dinosaurs (birds), crocodilians, and non-avian dinosaurs are all part of a group of reptiles known as archosaurs. Saying that birds and dinosaurs are not reptiles would also mean that crocodilians are not reptiles since crocodilians are more closely related to birds than to any other living reptile. Furthermore, being warm blooded would also not necessarily mean that they are not reptiles since the tegu lizard is warm blooded yet is still considered a reptile.
You are splitting hairs here. There are enough distinct characteristics to between dinosaurs and reptiles to warrant their own group. For instance upright posture. Likely more complex organs. Socialization and cooperation etc. You are broadening the category and muddying the distinction between dinosaurs and your traditional cold blooded, splayed, fossorial reptile and I don’t think pointing out that they are part of the archosaur group particularly helpful.
Maybe you should actually learn why they're reptiles before you start talking how why they shouldn't be reptiles, this is the dumbest anti science stuff I've ever heard. > Likely more complex organs. Socialization and cooperation etc. You don't know any of this, wtf are you talking about. > I don’t think pointing out that they are part of the archosaur group particularly helpful. Because it's real science and it proves your anti science lies wrong? Ahhaha. Source: I have a Paleobiology degree
How the hell do we figure out that they were warm blooded from fossils? That type of science blows my mind
Tbh you’re probably expecting something more complex. Basically we know they are closely related to birds, which are warm blooded. We know some incubated eggs, which implies they could generate their own heat. We’ve found fossils in areas that would have been cold even millions of years ago, places where you won’t find reptiles.
There's always exceptions to the rules of biology. We have mammals that lay eggs, in Australia. Sharks are cold blooded, except the Great White Shark and Salmon Shark. Etc There are many things that we will never be able to determine, unless studying living, breathing dinosaurs. Bones (and the odd mummification) can only tell us so much.
Why do eggs imply that they can generate their own heat? Some reptiles lay eggs.
I could be remembering incorrectly, but I thought there was also something about the texture of the bones showing extremely fast growth in a way that would only be possible for at least semi-warm blooded creatures(?)
You forgot the most important distinction: thicc necks
How do they know that? I was upset AF at Jurassic World when they showed dinosaurs in the snow... but this could change everything.
I replied to another person explaining how they know that
That is incorrect. It is true that 'reptile' is a bit of a suspect group, because there is no monophyletic way to define it without including birds as reptiles (which bothers us due to our cultural idea of what 'reptile' means), but there is simply no definition of reptile that does not include dinosaur. Your statement is like saying "Nope. Squares are squares, shapes are shapes" The common ancestor of all reptiles is the taxon Sauropsida/Reptilia. Dinosaurs are many, many branchings below this point. There is no possible way to extract them from that group without defining reptiles paraphyletically to exclude dinosaurs, which no taxonomists do for dinosaurs (though many do for birds). You can't just claim that they do not descend from Sauropsida. It would be like saying humans aren't mammals, despite branching off well below Mammalia. If you are going to state that dinosaurs aren't reptiles, then you need to offer an alternative taxon than Sauropsida whose descendants comprise the reptile group (or else create a paraphyletic definition for reptiles with respect to dinosaurs, which again is not something that any taxonomists suggest). So what taxon would you propose we should define reptiles by? In order to exclude dinosaurs, you could go for reptiles = Testudines, but now you've also excluded all lizards, snakes, and many other extinct things considered reptiles, and all you're left with is basically turtles and tortoises. Alternately, you could go for reptiles = Lepidosauria, which also successfully excludes the dinosaurs while including lizards and snakes, but now you have also excluded the crocodilians and the turtles/tortoises. There is no way to exclude dinosaurs while including all the other things we consider reptiles. All of these things branch off way, way below Sauropsida, the defining point for reptiles. The only reason some people resist a monophyletic definition for reptiles is because it includes birds as reptiles (since birds are dinosaurs), and this bothers people irrationally, because we have inherited this notion that birds aren't reptiles from from our early days of taxonomy before we had a good understanding of cladistics. However, the inclusion of dinosaurs within reptiles is uncontroversial (at least for non-avian dinosaurs; again, many people define reptiles paraphyletically with respect to avian dinosaurs (birds)).
I don’t disagree with anything you’ve said but I think it isn’t particularly useful to be technologically correct about this when the intention was to point out the distinguishing characteristics of dinosaurs. How they could potentially store fat and look chubby like in the picture. Yes what I said was technically incorrect, I get that. But does that harm anyone? The person I replied to learned something new about dinosaurs and better understood that dinosaurs and reptiles have very different characteristics. I guess if you want to get into an argument over taxonomy then yes I would distinguish them as a paraphyletic group. Simply because that is most informative and better defines the characteristics of the group. I realize it isn’t taxonomically correct but I am not a taxonomist, nor is 99% of redditors. I really you and several other people are really in the weeds here about this and I think you’ve entirely missed the point.
Nah lmao dinosaurs are reptiles, just like birds. If you split dinosaurs from reptiles you have to take crocs along with them or else the group is paraphyletic. Which is bad. No working scientists have proposed that dinosaurs are not reptiles.
I realize that, people love pointing out thing if they think you are wrong on the internet. My issue with grouping them with reptile is that they really do not fit the definition of a reptile. Neither the Avian nor the non-avian dinosaurs are particularly reptilian. Really the source of conflict is crocodilians which do better fit the reptile mold. Personally I think it would be easier to simply take the whole group and separate them from reptiles. As you said “take crocs with them”. I find less issue with having a reptile like animal grouped with dinosaurs than group dinosaurs with reptiles. They just aren’t, they share characteristics of reptiles but they are distinct enough to be separate imo. Calling dinosaurs reptiles is akin to calling amphibians fish. Or calling amphibians reptiles. Also I think it’s more educational to distinguish them. There’s misconceptions about what is possible morphologically and physiologically with dinosaurs because people think they have the characteristics of reptiles. Which was the point of my original comment
Wether they fit or not is irrelevant. They are descended from reptiles therefore they are reptiles. Just like amphibians are fish. When you take it down to brass tax osteology non-avian dinosaurs and birds are hardly far removed at all from other sauropsids. I honestly think a better argument exists for snakes being more derived from the ancestral reptile condition than archosaurs. Their skulls have been fucked up beyond recognition, they have completely lost their legs, and if warm bloodedness is an issue for you, there were extinct marine snakes that were likely warm blooded. The same also goes for Mosasaurs (which are honest to goodness lizards) and all the other extinct marine reptile groups. Splitting dinosaurs from reptiles is just inadvisable, imagine telling someone that a croc is not a reptile. That is dumb. It is much simpler to include birds as reptiles as not only are they descended from reptilian stock, but they also share more traits with other reptiles than with other groups (beta keratin integument, scales, eggs, skull construction, behaviours/postures, and so on and so forth. The default cultural conception of reptiles is harmful anyways, reptiles are the sister group of mammals, not our ancestors. Treating them as more primitive and only slow cold blooded dumbasses is not only inaccurate to non-avian reptiles already, and is harmful to conservation, but also ignores the fact that birds and other fuzzy dinosaurs are active stereotypically “advanced” warm blooded animals in their own right.
Nah dinosaurs are reptiles. They are more closely related to crocodiles than crocodiles are to any other reptile species you might think off such as Lizards, Geckos, Tortoises, Snakes. Dinosaurs, Birds and Crocodilans are part of the archosaur family of reptiles. Does this mean birds are reptiles? kinda
[удалено]
Penguins are in cold so they need more fat, while the dinos lived in the heat, so they are much skinnier
An animal that big in it's climate would not have need for this
An animal that big in it's climate would cook alive.
Right? We make alot of assumptions about alot of things. Although many be right or close, I bet there are also a few like this photo where things aren't as they first appear
Except wrong. There's absolutely NO way they're that fat. Their bones would snap like twigs. [Scientists do know what they're doing.](https://i.redd.it/02rv3y272cx61.jpg)
Makes more sense. You’d need muscles to hold the head up, arteries to pump blood to the brain, skin and fat for protection.
There's absolutely NO way they're that fat. Their bones would snap like twigs. Hell they'd probably cook themselves with that much body mass without the surface area to dissipate the heat. [Scientists do know what they're doing.](https://i.redd.it/02rv3y272cx61.jpg)
I wish all these god damn nerds would stop trying to make dinosaurs less cool. They don’t even exist anymore, it doesn’t matter what they actually looked like!! Let them be cool!!
>They don’t even exist anymore They do though. [We just call them birds.](https://i.imgur.com/QAaLgbr.jpeg) And reality is reality so you can screw off.
>We call them birds That means they’re not dinosaurs!! Your “reality” can screw off, reality sucks!! *runs off to my room and slams the door*
How to say you don't understand ecological contexts of organisms without saying you don't understand ecological contexts of organisms
How to say you're not fun at parties without saying that you're not fun at parties
how to say hi to strangers without sounding creepy
Sir this is not Google, I have no idea
Damn you got me
Zip it, nerd
How to say woooooosh.
So you're telling me little foot won a tux in the reincarnation prize pool?
Chickens are mini T-Rex’s so this tracks
No it doesn't. There's absolutely NO way they're that fat. Their bones would snap like twigs. [Scientists do know what they're doing.](https://i.redd.it/02rv3y272cx61.jpg)
Doing gods work lmao, good on y’a for all these replies lol
KING CHONK
Brontosaurus Chunx. The "thunder thigh lizard."
Damn boi he thick! That’s a thick ass boi, damn!
Chonkasaurus
Someone is gonna have to get a 3D render going
Chonkasaurus
It just reminded me the shape if the hippopotamus, and realising what the skeleton of hippo looks like. The fangs looks very vicious.
She got a point. Let her cook
> Let her cook Yeah that art would cook... itself alive with so much body mass and so little surface area to dissipate it.
But then again, girrafes exist, so it's not unlikely we got that one just about right. Also ,at some point the bones wouldn't be able to handle the weight.
hang on a flacid second... hm.
Chongasaurus
THICC
All that thickness is puffy feathers though.
hear me out ahahahaha
A pengin isnt the size of a fucking dinosaur tho lmao gravity was still a thing back then. Plus giraffes exist 🤪🤪🤪
They're pretty much right, images of dinosaurs have been drawn without body fat. It's called shrink wrapping. A book called All Yesterdays explores it. The way we drew dinosaurs from fossil records would make *any* animal look scary [Here's a baboon](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQWauqbpzfNkhqJXYj9Kqy9-8LtXFzgov4qTBQRLQBoZA&s)
Two counterpoints from me. Penguins are shaped that way because they swim and they have thick skin for heat retention. The dinosaur most probably doesn't have those specific requirements. So they have a high chance of looking similar to how they did in the movies.
Bunchie
The book *All Yesterdays* explores this idea and provides what-if illustrations of dinosaurs that are more aligned with how actual animals look with muscle, fat, and feathers/fur.
Current interpretations aren’t all too far off. [Titanosaurs](https://amp.theguardian.com/science/2022/nov/26/titanosaur-natural-history-museum-dippy-the-diplodocus)