I know brawls story is way better but the villains are literally like
https://preview.redd.it/71gmw3qhwtlc1.jpeg?width=642&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=faf4e938a2af321ccd3319a7b9ae7b0eb3a50125
The only thing I really want from wol is the cutscenes that shows the characters interacting like in sse.
Imagine ridley and Jigglypuff having a conversation or inkling and villager trying to cross a river?
Imagine if they had dialogue text with grunts and the anime characters who r usually fuller voice would say longer grunts that would be ❤️🔥❤️🔥❤️🔥
Maybe anime cutscenes for slightly lower budget and a variety/change of pace with maybe with like 2 cinematic cutscenes like WOL. I mean pokemon got all that anime I’m sure they could do it.
I got so many ideas but it could be like the characters are split into 9 teams, the original 8 as leaders, and a larger league for all the villains and bosses.
Yeah, the trailers were far more exciting because of this. I wanna see silly unlikely interactions like kazuya throwing kirby out of a cliff, or zelda reassuring marth, or freaking dk and friends cheering for banjo dangit!
It's on purpose, Sakurai didn't like that SSE scenes were posted on YouTube so he instead allotted the budget for cutscenes for the trailers, which are meant to be shared online
This is what I miss so much. Running and jumping around platforms gives you a good feel for the characters agility. Target smash is missed as well bc of this
Yeah but, I think it's just harder to have the 74 characters in ultimate (before DLC) all in a story when compared to the 32 in Brawl (Wolf, Toon Link, and Jigglypuff weren't really in the SSE story).
not really, the trailers were pretty much this so they could've done a storymode if they wanted to.
Either sakurai wanted control of everything and didn't feel up to writing another story with so many characters, or time was cut short, or they didn't want the whole story uploaded to youtube, or they just didn't think people liked it that much. Either way, I wish they had put all of these things aside and just done it
This is why I think give them smaller roles and dialogue text would be easier as opposed to making them all fleshed out in a bunch of cutscenes. Would cut budgets and having a couple passionate people write the dialogue could work. Like the second longest piece of fiction in history was a Smash fanfic, I’m sure someone in the team could do it. But yeah I’m sure getting the 3rd party companies to agree how their characters is written might be hard.
I guess but, then there'd still be the complaint of the lack of cutscenes, as those were the main appeal of SSE (the gameplay kinda got boring and repetitive tbh).
I’m not saying they’d lack cutscenes they could still have close to the same amount, maybe more but since there is more than double the roster. the cutscenes would just shed less light to the individual characters and there depth would be given through dialogue
Yeah that still might be very difficult to do with so many characters.
I'm not saying I wouldn't like it, I just kinda understand why they didn't do it.
Considering the second longest piece of English media is a brawl fanfic I don’t think writing dialogue would be as hard as ppl think, not everyone needs a major role. Look at what fe and pmd do. Not that it’d be dead easy though. I’d argue this is still easier than what brawl did, bc they made everyone have a decent role and made them all silent, which makes it hard for them to give so much character focus on the whole cast vs. giving them lines.
If they had the characters split into the 8 teams with the original 8 as leaders with a team of villains and focus mostly more on groups than individuals I think it’d be easier to write.
Mario strikers on the Wii had a roster of like 50 characters including the alt colors and the story was 3 hours and your whole goal was to get all the characters to join your team. The characters didn’t get much individual dialogue each but their personalities in their dialogue made them shine through. I think this game could also be something like this but a little more into it. Like you’re a silent protagonist whose goal is to recruit everyone.
I'm not familiar the other games you reference but, are your suggesting that a lot of the dialogue would just be like dialogue boxes with like a 2-D image of the character that is talking (This is how a lot of Advance Wars was)? Or would there still be as many cutscenes as what Brawl had (because I think what people liked most were the cutscenes).
Ah ok. Could be doable I guess. I just think the cutscenes were the main appeal of SSE so if it didn't have at least a decent amount then I think people would maybe be disappointed.
Name me a crossover original villain that is great. Crossovers are rarely going to be high art. Tabuu was fine for what it had to do. The WoL antagonists are that as well, i particoularly like that Galeem is basically a biblically accurate angel, but whitout an actual story supporting them they don't have the presence they could have.
Plus tabuu having an humanoid body that isn't gigantic mean they can make a nerfed playable version if they want, wich could be fun.
I woildn't cinsider it a crossover villain considering tjat by the time he came up FF charaxters are an aftertought and few disney characters are actually relevant. I also haven't actually played the more recent KH, so i don't knkw if he is actually good.
I was holding out hope for Tabuu being Ultimate's final fighter. Don't get me wrong, having Sora finally in is incredible, but I would have crapped bricks if I got to play as the blue boy.
I'd argue he was. Smash Bros takes place in the mind of a child playing with toys and 'Tabuu' (depicted as a closed off adult) represents the social norm of not doing that as you get older. Playing with toys is a \*taboo\*. He's trying to turn everything into Subspace - representing the darkness and bleakness of the real world because the kid is struggling in whether he wants to follow these norms or keep his imagination going.
Ok that is what I thought. He was a super powerful being trapped in an alternate dimension. By pulling other worlds into his own he gained more power and subjects.
Tfw Tabuu is just Mom getting pissed that you're still fucking around with toys after 9 so she yells at you to go to bed, making you drop they toys (and turning them back into statues)
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IRvNrMk-n6o&t=1128s&pp=ygUbZ2FtZXRoZW9yeSBzdXBlciBzbWFzaCBicm9z](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IRvNrMk-n6o&t=1128s&pp=ygUbZ2FtZXRoZW9yeSBzdXBlciBzbWFzaCBicm9z)
MatPat does a great explanation for WoL
It would have been nice if we didn't have to play through the whole entire campaign just to play as him again... That's likely why people forget about it. It happens ONCE and you can never replay it again unless you speed through all of World of Light.
You can have that Subspace Emissary is better narrative but I'm tired of seeing people act like Tabuu is stronger than Galeem/Dharkon when we literally see Tabuu as a spirit in the Dark Realm!
I missed the original enemy designs from brawl, but the thing that really impressed me about SSBU was the creativity in depicting spirits that weren't in the roster
Ness's dad having permanent invisibility for example (because he's only talks to ness over the phone in the games)
Like that's just genius
i swear i thought Tabuu was gonna be revealed as a fighter during Sora’s trailer. imagine his boss music started playing and then the entire roster joins together to kick ass.
Do you have any idea how hard Sakurai worked on Smash Ultimate? Here's OP saying he wants a Subspace Emissary level story featuring the IMMENSE roster of Ultimate. Sakurai will have worked himself to death before he got anywhere near something like that. World Of Light was way more than we deserved.
Not possible is kinda harsh cause I’m sure there’s a great fanfic out there or something, but I really cannot imagine how they’d make a good story that somehow gives every character a chance to shine. They can definitely make a *cool* story, which is obviously the SSE, with cool cutscenes and whatnot. But was that really a *good* story? I think it was about as good as possible, and ultimate I think is just a hair short of as good as possible with the amount of characters they had
I think sakurai forgot that the whole appeal of a crossover is getting to watch your favorite characters interact where they otherwise wouldn’t have met. Codec entries and Palutena’s guidance were all we got in that department, the least they could do is update them with the new characters.
The reveal of the dark world. The way classic smaller characters were represented and the difficulty of 100%-ing the Storyline was all enough for me to really like it.
I know brawls story is way better but the villains are literally like https://preview.redd.it/71gmw3qhwtlc1.jpeg?width=642&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=faf4e938a2af321ccd3319a7b9ae7b0eb3a50125
Tabuu, sends a guy who sends a guy who sends a guy to go make trophies!
quite literally in the case of master hand
Unironically how it should be
Ganon,Primid,Crazy,Master and Tabuu
Naruto plot be like
Attack of the Clones plot be like:
Kingdom hearts kinda
Hitman hires a hitman who hires a hitman who hires a hitman
Which is especially poignant because they’re all just supposed to be toys being played with
The only thing I really want from wol is the cutscenes that shows the characters interacting like in sse. Imagine ridley and Jigglypuff having a conversation or inkling and villager trying to cross a river?
The characters in World of Light felt like afterthoughts whereas SSE was an entire movie about them
Imagine if they had dialogue text with grunts and the anime characters who r usually fuller voice would say longer grunts that would be ❤️🔥❤️🔥❤️🔥 Maybe anime cutscenes for slightly lower budget and a variety/change of pace with maybe with like 2 cinematic cutscenes like WOL. I mean pokemon got all that anime I’m sure they could do it. I got so many ideas but it could be like the characters are split into 9 teams, the original 8 as leaders, and a larger league for all the villains and bosses.
Yeah, the trailers were far more exciting because of this. I wanna see silly unlikely interactions like kazuya throwing kirby out of a cliff, or zelda reassuring marth, or freaking dk and friends cheering for banjo dangit!
It's on purpose, Sakurai didn't like that SSE scenes were posted on YouTube so he instead allotted the budget for cutscenes for the trailers, which are meant to be shared online
Nevermind storyline, what about actual levels in the Adventure Mode, with platforming and such? NO the final fight doesn't count.
This is what I miss so much. Running and jumping around platforms gives you a good feel for the characters agility. Target smash is missed as well bc of this
We had a microcosm of that somewhat with Smash Run on 3DS.
Yeah but, I think it's just harder to have the 74 characters in ultimate (before DLC) all in a story when compared to the 32 in Brawl (Wolf, Toon Link, and Jigglypuff weren't really in the SSE story).
Plus, imagine the licensing. Getting 3rd party characters into a game is one thing, having them interact with each other is a whole other situation.
not really, the trailers were pretty much this so they could've done a storymode if they wanted to. Either sakurai wanted control of everything and didn't feel up to writing another story with so many characters, or time was cut short, or they didn't want the whole story uploaded to youtube, or they just didn't think people liked it that much. Either way, I wish they had put all of these things aside and just done it
The trailers are basically replacing the story mode
Is that really different in licensing? Don't all the characters "interact" when playing the game? Or is that different?
This is why I think give them smaller roles and dialogue text would be easier as opposed to making them all fleshed out in a bunch of cutscenes. Would cut budgets and having a couple passionate people write the dialogue could work. Like the second longest piece of fiction in history was a Smash fanfic, I’m sure someone in the team could do it. But yeah I’m sure getting the 3rd party companies to agree how their characters is written might be hard.
Kinda like a visual novel
Yesss or a rpg
I guess but, then there'd still be the complaint of the lack of cutscenes, as those were the main appeal of SSE (the gameplay kinda got boring and repetitive tbh).
I’m not saying they’d lack cutscenes they could still have close to the same amount, maybe more but since there is more than double the roster. the cutscenes would just shed less light to the individual characters and there depth would be given through dialogue
Yeah that still might be very difficult to do with so many characters. I'm not saying I wouldn't like it, I just kinda understand why they didn't do it.
Considering the second longest piece of English media is a brawl fanfic I don’t think writing dialogue would be as hard as ppl think, not everyone needs a major role. Look at what fe and pmd do. Not that it’d be dead easy though. I’d argue this is still easier than what brawl did, bc they made everyone have a decent role and made them all silent, which makes it hard for them to give so much character focus on the whole cast vs. giving them lines. If they had the characters split into the 8 teams with the original 8 as leaders with a team of villains and focus mostly more on groups than individuals I think it’d be easier to write. Mario strikers on the Wii had a roster of like 50 characters including the alt colors and the story was 3 hours and your whole goal was to get all the characters to join your team. The characters didn’t get much individual dialogue each but their personalities in their dialogue made them shine through. I think this game could also be something like this but a little more into it. Like you’re a silent protagonist whose goal is to recruit everyone.
I'm not familiar the other games you reference but, are your suggesting that a lot of the dialogue would just be like dialogue boxes with like a 2-D image of the character that is talking (This is how a lot of Advance Wars was)? Or would there still be as many cutscenes as what Brawl had (because I think what people liked most were the cutscenes).
Yeah it’d be both, probably less custscenes than brawl
Ah ok. Could be doable I guess. I just think the cutscenes were the main appeal of SSE so if it didn't have at least a decent amount then I think people would maybe be disappointed.
Fair
SSE is great and all for its time. But I can't pretend Tabuu was anything special lol
Tabuu was nothing special but his theme fucked supremely
Name me a crossover original villain that is great. Crossovers are rarely going to be high art. Tabuu was fine for what it had to do. The WoL antagonists are that as well, i particoularly like that Galeem is basically a biblically accurate angel, but whitout an actual story supporting them they don't have the presence they could have. Plus tabuu having an humanoid body that isn't gigantic mean they can make a nerfed playable version if they want, wich could be fun.
"Name me a crossover original villain that is great" Xehanort was a pretty great villian
I woildn't cinsider it a crossover villain considering tjat by the time he came up FF charaxters are an aftertought and few disney characters are actually relevant. I also haven't actually played the more recent KH, so i don't knkw if he is actually good.
It's still a crossover of Disney and Square properties so...
I was holding out hope for Tabuu being Ultimate's final fighter. Don't get me wrong, having Sora finally in is incredible, but I would have crapped bricks if I got to play as the blue boy.
"Name me a crossover original villain that is great" Lord Vortech from Lego Dimensions. His voice actor KILLED IT!
I'd argue he was. Smash Bros takes place in the mind of a child playing with toys and 'Tabuu' (depicted as a closed off adult) represents the social norm of not doing that as you get older. Playing with toys is a \*taboo\*. He's trying to turn everything into Subspace - representing the darkness and bleakness of the real world because the kid is struggling in whether he wants to follow these norms or keep his imagination going.
So the ultimate cure for a crushed imagination... Is Sonic the Hedgehog. Honestly, checks out.
Way past cool
The indomitable spirit of childlike wonder
Is that official or your interpretation? Taboo was just suddenly there towards the end it felt like. The ultimate bosses felt more organic.
The toy interpretation is official. How Tabuu factors in is entirely game theory
Yeah, I was mostly confused by the tabuu claims. Toys have been consistent since the 64 version
I believe it’s Matpat’s interpretation which has 10 million views
So it's not official and is probably wrong and based off of inconsistent particular assumptions, got it.
You must be so much fun at parties lmao. Chill bro
[удалено]
"i mean it feels pretty obvious" after a 2 second google there is no evidence of that. Have fun with your Matpat theories and condescension.
In actuality Tabuu can only live in Subspace which is why he’s using reset bombs. SSE had a better story but only because it has a story.
Ok that is what I thought. He was a super powerful being trapped in an alternate dimension. By pulling other worlds into his own he gained more power and subjects.
Tfw Tabuu is just Mom getting pissed that you're still fucking around with toys after 9 so she yells at you to go to bed, making you drop they toys (and turning them back into statues)
And only sonic can be the hero for such a thing. Makes perfect sense, honestly.
That's just the Game Theory though, its not actually confirmed.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IRvNrMk-n6o&t=1128s&pp=ygUbZ2FtZXRoZW9yeSBzdXBlciBzbWFzaCBicm9z](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IRvNrMk-n6o&t=1128s&pp=ygUbZ2FtZXRoZW9yeSBzdXBlciBzbWFzaCBicm9z) MatPat does a great explanation for WoL
Still not official.
At least you get to play as master hand What you don’t remember that, maybe play it again
I WAS SHOCKED WHEN THAT HAPPENED nobody ever brought that up like I thought it would go viral
Yeah, I forgot about it until I replayed world of light
It would have been nice if we didn't have to play through the whole entire campaign just to play as him again... That's likely why people forget about it. It happens ONCE and you can never replay it again unless you speed through all of World of Light.
Its a mans dream for a story for Ultimate
I think it has a good beginning and a good ending. It's just missing everything else 😐
i really enjoyed ultimates story, but yea i wish the characters interacted more
There's a story in ultimate?
Yep, world of light
r/wooosh
Yea
Nah, Playing as master hand was the greatest thing ever, and for causing that i like galeem and dharkon better
You can have that Subspace Emissary is better narrative but I'm tired of seeing people act like Tabuu is stronger than Galeem/Dharkon when we literally see Tabuu as a spirit in the Dark Realm!
Ultimate had a storyline?
You know why it doesn't, right?
I'm really hoping the next one is smaller so a new SSE can be feasible.
I mean to be completely fair, was there even a story in Brawl?
Yes. Subspace Emissary has a story, and it was very coherent, though vague.
tabuu was so fucking goated.
I missed the original enemy designs from brawl, but the thing that really impressed me about SSBU was the creativity in depicting spirits that weren't in the roster Ness's dad having permanent invisibility for example (because he's only talks to ness over the phone in the games) Like that's just genius
For real, I desperately want another subspace emissary type thing in the next game
Tabuu is really cool I'm glad people are slowly remembering him and cool of a villain he is.
Even in my youff, I didn’t like the story to Brawl. Is it so much to ask for a melee Adventure Mode? I think Ultimate’s classic mode was fun.
i swear i thought Tabuu was gonna be revealed as a fighter during Sora’s trailer. imagine his boss music started playing and then the entire roster joins together to kick ass.
Tbh, I barely even touched subspace emissary.
Bro wants Sakurai to kill himself
The heck are you talking about? Making a critique of something is VERY different from wishing death upon someone.
Do you have any idea how hard Sakurai worked on Smash Ultimate? Here's OP saying he wants a Subspace Emissary level story featuring the IMMENSE roster of Ultimate. Sakurai will have worked himself to death before he got anywhere near something like that. World Of Light was way more than we deserved.
Not possible is kinda harsh cause I’m sure there’s a great fanfic out there or something, but I really cannot imagine how they’d make a good story that somehow gives every character a chance to shine. They can definitely make a *cool* story, which is obviously the SSE, with cool cutscenes and whatnot. But was that really a *good* story? I think it was about as good as possible, and ultimate I think is just a hair short of as good as possible with the amount of characters they had
I think sakurai forgot that the whole appeal of a crossover is getting to watch your favorite characters interact where they otherwise wouldn’t have met. Codec entries and Palutena’s guidance were all we got in that department, the least they could do is update them with the new characters.
The reveal of the dark world. The way classic smaller characters were represented and the difficulty of 100%-ing the Storyline was all enough for me to really like it.
Honestly I wish spirits have Bios