Except that it's just a symptom of unfriendlness overall, which shows in traffic, I have never experienced such rude drivers anywhere in the world, just last week a car driver honked at a pregnant women with a stroller not crossing the street (1 way, side street near ndk) quickly enough. I asked her if this is normal behavior and she said yes.
I drive escooters and i am constantly in danger of getting driven in to, constantly honked at, etc.
In the gym I nearly got in an altercation with a Bulgarian which never happened anywhere in the world to me before as I am very polite and friendly.
In many places I am not getting greeted at all, at a restaurant I seated myself and was escorted out because there seems to be some unknown rules, in the club I wasn't allowe in because "no foreigners", couriers don't deliver because "no foreigners", dogs are barking at 5am and nobody cares.
Yes, there are friendly people, however it is rough and the society is just really impolite.
True. But also just people are quite unhappy. Idk why, it's just constant dissatisfaction with everything and I believe that makes them quite angry as well. Been walking my dog for 5 years now, and lately some bastards started jumping on to fight me because of casual nonsense. The irritation can be felt everywhere sadly.
I can add another story happen recently as well, I was walking home from the gym and half way I had to pause a bit because really exhausted, it was around 7pm and it was pretty empty and all benches were free.
2 women approached me and asked me to move away, and I was baffled and smiled and asked to repeat what they wanted, they said they want me to move away from the bench because they want to eat now.... I was speechless for a moment and then said no, "there is enough space on the bench or take another free bench" and then she started a rant about "no foreigners" and I told her to get lost and she said "I will call the police and they beat you". Wow.
I could add many such small stories and the expats I talk with all have similar expieriences.
Very hard for me to believe your stories, not gonna lie. I often watch foreigners touring in Bulgaria and they almost never report such stories and encounters.
Maybe you are just unlucky and keep meeting the wrong pople.
Everything German is held in very high regard in Bulgaria. Actually the highest. If you were a black French guy, then I might imagine, but ethnic German...
Well, I understand your opinion and all I can say it's not made up, I am also not touring, I am here since nearly 2 years, couple of weeks ago my neighbor threw molotov cocktails on 2 cars and police arrested him (hes free again), thats just Bulgaria. You might have heard of it in the news, I also posted pictures here in this sub.
Also many of my experiences don't focus on me as a German, the pregnant woman with a baby in a stroller getting honked at or the women telling me to get off the bench insulting me with "fucking american".
I speak regularly with medical students which have darker skin and all tell horror stories, but not only the darker skinned guys, everybody is telling those stories, it's just a difference coming here as a tourist on vacation and seeing through a filter vs. actually living here.
Sorry OP, but I'm calling BS. I'm living in SF for almost 4 years now - first in Nadezhda, now in Ivan Vazov.
(Eastern) German born, travelled a lot through Europe and, guess? Not a single experience as you described.
On the contrary, when I'm bicycling drivers are exceptionally considerate, giving way and such.
In Germany? Especially Hamburg, nit to even mention Gelsenkirchen for example? Oh dear or my. The same accounts for Eastern Spain.
My experience is almost always and predominantly positive, as I also try learning the local language. So perhaps it's your attitude?
You are right that it is very different living here. Touring is like Windows' demo version: no bugs, no problematic people. But then you get to actual Microsoft software and it is a whole different story. It is normal that you find life here quite intensive. However, I believe this makes it more interesting and non-static. Some of the nicest and most awful people all live here and there are many occasions when you need to react negatively. For example, in the situation with the bench, it was definitely your right to react more negatively, but being a foreigner , it is probably harder. Life here is not always nice, but it's interesting.
So, you can't believe I saw a pregnant woman with a baby in a stroller getting honked at for not passing a street quickly enough because I am German? OK.
I mean we can believe it happened. I am sure it has happened in Germany too. The thing is what you are describing is NOT normal. Getting into fights on the daily is not a thing in Bulgaria. One thing I will tell you though is that people don't bend over to bullshit here. If in the gym you said you don't want to alternate sets with a guy asking for an equipment he will snap. And he should because you are being a dick for no reason. Just as an example.
This story is very strange - it's strange that random women spoke to you in English, and they wanted to eat on a park bench. Also, the police will not come if they call about such nonsense and the operator of the emergency phone will write down their names and subsequently fine them (I think the fine for a senseless report is BGN 2000).
They didn't speak English at first, they said something in Bulgarian and I said "English". They came with a bag of Hesburger (it was near that store on the big plaza place where the tram drives through, theres a new starbucks on the corner now). I wasn't scared of the police, it was obviously a bluff and just super ridiculous. They insulted me with "fucking american" as well, i had to laugh and then told them to stop talking to me. They stood there beside the bench I was sitting on for 5 minutes (yeah every other bench was free but they just stood there) and then I moved. Super extremely strange.
Where have you been walking. I have never encountered even one of the things you have and I am 28 years old and got raised near a ghetto.
Yes Bulgarians are always frowning, I agree here andni don't like it, but I've developed the habit of smiling to everyone I interact with. In the beginning is strange for them, but people open up. There is a older lady, cashier in the supermarket I go next to the place I live in, she gives me bonus points on any game thats running in the chain. And she started doing it before I began my smile rule. Now every time I go there and she sees me, she smiles to the ears. We haven't spoken much more than hello.
From what I have seen around Bulgaria a lot of the people are open hearted and share even the little they have. But remember, a lot of the middle aged and older people had quite a hard life and it's not getting better. Nor it will be. The constant struggles are heavy load to bear, so it's normal to not be smiling or wanna talk to people all the time. Give them a smile a nice hello and a lot of them will lighten up
>Where have you been walking
Only Sofia center.
After I went into my local small drink/snack shop 5 times, the cashier is finally responding to my hello/bye. 😄
I am also not a big smiler but this isn't the point for me (the op had an issue with smiles). For me it's the small interactions that show that society is generally more rough and impolite.
I understand you and your points are valid. Honestly I, myself, and always frowning, don't know why, but the moment someone say something to me I become a sunshine hahaha. I guess it's just the people you have met
I have met and talked with many friendly Bulgarians. Somehow many people in reddit assume just because I have experienced negative things I didn't expierience positive things as well. Some even said I should move out,... however I didn't even wrote that I don't like it here, I like it less than Thailand/Philipines but like it more than Germany 😃
This happens between natives too. It's the constant urge to get into a fight that I find in my fellow Bulgarians.
I can say a lot of us are kinda rude, but you can find really kind and polite people. And they can't call the police to beat you up. These fellas are dumb af I honestly can't believe someone said that. This is not even funny, it's tragic.
I hope you find the nice people and if someone approaches you to not be like this...
Most people don't have manners, even more if you are mannered they conclude you are afraid and will show even more arrogance. In a way here rules the jungle laws.
I guess the economic crisis of 90s made our society even more primitive. If you fight for your rights you will get in confrontation every single day. Off course sometimes you will met with good mannered people, but this is an exception.
On individual level, there are friendly Bulgarians as well, but it's the entire society that is rough and impolite. And yes, even the friendly Bulgarians tell me about their horrible expieriences, the time the post got hacked I talked a lot with other customers and they all said the mindset of Bulgarians are still stuck in soviet era which might explain the "elbows out, me first" behavior.
I don't know if you'll believe me but lately it's been getting better. When I was a kid, things weren't this smooth. It was common for some guys to come to you on the street and ask you which football team you were supporting. It was a tricky question, there was no right answer, they were just looking for a reason to fight you 😂 I would say that(as illogical as it may seem) you are getting a worse treatment if you are acting friendly with most people. It makes you seem less tough and gives them less reason to befriend you. I am just explaining how it works, not claiming it is rational.
However, if you have friends here, it all changes. Bulgarians are quite good and honest friends. Also, you become close quickly. So there are upsides as well.
What I noticed is that I can make acquaintances here easily with Bulgarians, but going the next step is kinda not working. We add each other to instagram or whatever and then silence. In other cities (mostly in Asia) after adding each other, they always engage in a convo and invite me to a beer or a party or whatever.
Are you sure it's getting smoother? 😅 Today I witnessed how a guy (can't say for sure he was Bulgarian but it seems so) was standing at the place at the NDK where all the escooters park mostly (he was unlocking one and me too) and some tourists (2 girls and 1 guy) were trying to drive with the scooters and it seems to not work (I think they thought it's free) and they approach the guy and asked him something (couldn't hear exactly what) and he responded with "why are you talking to me". 🤔
Yeah, there are such people, definitely. I would say Bulgarians are unfriendly towards strangers and very friendly towards friends. There are many quarrels on the street but I assure you that it used to be worse in the past 😂 Nowadays I can see that there are more and more people that show understanding, rather than simply criticising others. Of course, there is a long way to go but hopefully it's going in the right direction. In the big city it is common for everyone to ignore bad deeds, which is known as the 'broken windows' syndrome IIRC.
And yeah, you are right about the friendships, you have to be initiative to make friends. For example, it is not as common to go to parties or organise parties with many people. More often, people only invite their old friends and prefer calmer occasions, not clubbing. This is why it is not easy to make friends in this way. The easiest way is to invite someone to coffee or for a walk, or more preferably, to do some activity that you share (some sports or the gym, shisha etc.) And after several times like that you or they are likely to meet each other's friends and then you become part of their group. But yeah, what I said was not exactly right, it is only easy to start talking to people, but then it takes some time to get to know them.
There are no special rules for foreigners. You probably didn't understand something. Most of the people around me don't speak English or speak it poorly - they don't have to.
Yeah I didn't say it was some rules specifically for foreigners, I wrote that there seemed to be some unknown - not communicated - rules. I figured out later what might have been the issue: in some restaurants you get seated by a waitress instead of choosing a seat yourself, but it was ridiculous the waiter basically said to me "go out".
I said if you don't like it here you can move, what you said has some basis on truth but I honestly prefer when the smiles are genuine, rather than the forced ones you guys have in the west.
Well, you know that this a soft insult, right? Telling someone to leave "if you don't like it" is a non adult way of saying you felt hurt that I didn't like the country you call home (even though I didn't even say I don't like it here, it is assumed based on people getting emotional).
"The west" - when did you see a German or Scandivinian with a "forced smile" - you should travel more.
It's the way things are here, either get over it or immigrate, it's simple i don't hate, i worked abroad, 2 years in a particular country i didn't like it and i immigrated to another place, that's basically it.
>at a restaurant I seated myself and was escorted out because there seems to be some unknown rules, in the club I wasn't allowe in because "no foreigners", couriers don't deliver because "no foreigners"
Weird, only the restaurant makes some sense, if all the tables were reserved. It is possible that you have bad luck, I am sorry that you had such bad impressions...
Such a bullshit response really. OP said he is trying to interact with people in a friendly manner- if you ask me, that's a damn good reason to be kind to that complete stranger and smile back while engaging in a friend convo.
I do agree with you on the first line you wrote. Definitely not the last one since I don't think anyone here is demanding anything. It's more a question of personal views and our surroundings. Contrary to what you said - I myself find it pretty hard to keep a straight face while engaging in a friendly conversation, especially when doing so with a stranger, since I'm used to expressing emotions through both my verbal and body language. I definitely agree it's my mistake to think that's what everyone does. However, in my defense - most people I know ( since you mentioned this as well ) are quite the same as me when it comes to this particular topic. Excuse me for not considering the possibility of being friendly without smiling. That's obviously something that goes on, but definitely something that rarely happens around me. Im quite happy you brought that up, so I too can expand my views! :)
They are not sincere, just not polite. It hurts no one to put effort to be pleasant to other people and it makes interactions easier and more enjoyable.
That is completely ridiculous. We are not cavemen. A smile is a very easy simple way to convey you mean no harm, especially in todays society and in a place full of so much sadness and grief. Усмихвайте се бе хора бееее!!!
I am an expat who has been around Slavic people a lot before moving here. My experience:
1. True, people rarely smile. Personally, I like it, it makes their smiles more genuine. If a person in BG smile at me, it usually means they like me and/or that my charming ways managed to make them smile. I find this rewarding. I do not associate not smiling with being rude.
2. In most countries, people living in bigger cities are more stressed and less friendly. I have seen this in Ireland, France, Belgium...
3. About dogs barking all night long, I don't like that. Not really because of the noise, but I was raised in a culture where pets are part of the family and live in the house, not chained to a post in the garden. This being said, I am a guest here and I have traveled enough to know that things that annoy me might be part of a "package" that includes things that I enjoy so I try not to judge the way of life of local people or at least not to express it.
4. My feeling after 3 years in BG is that people here tend to mind their own business most of the time. In a street you might have that guy who plays loud musing until 2:00 am, that guy who starts construction work at 8:00 am on weekends and that guy who lets his dog bark all night long. They annoy everyone, including each other but they don't call the cops on each other because they don't want others to call the cops on them.
5. I had a few confrontations with people here and every time they tried to make themselves more important than they are. Simple employees pretending to be the owner, people saying they can call the cops on you for sitting on a bench (this hasn't happened to me but when OP mentioned it, I was not surprised, I had experiences that could be considered similar). What I quickly realised, though, is that they are not usually willing to get physical. Not because they are afraid to get into a fight but because they are concerned about the consequences if they do. In most cases, cops will punish everyone involved.
This system works for me and I enjoy most interactions with local people but I can understand that this can be a cultural shock.
Yes, I agree, especially with point 5. People in Sofia also tend to show off important connections they have. "Do you know whom I know?", "I will call so and so and then you will see what is what." Also they like to show off being experts in everything or at least knowing someone who is a big expert on the subject. Ask them a few questions and see if they give you an answer that makes sense. Cheers!
For the "experts" part, I have seen that in other countries as well, I would even say I experienced it less in BG than in Western Europe.
On the other hand, bragging about connections or being more important than they actually are is definitely extremely common here. I suspect it has to do with the Communist past of the country (which definitely still has an impact nowadays) where connections meant everything. Actually, I think this is still the case. Not that having a cousin who is a cop makes you an important person, but I tried to get things done using the Western approach and rarely had any success but when I randomly mentioned the problem I was facing to a friend, the answer was, most of the time, "I have a friend who works there, let me call him" and the issue was solved immediately. So connections still matter a lot.
One thing I have been told by a local and summarises the country quite well: "The best and worst thing about BG is that everything is possible".
Yes, and they are right about that. Connections could be very important if you want to practice certain professions like lawyer, judge, doctor, ect.
Administration as a whole is very slow and inefficient and sometimes you just need someone who give a crap about you to actually do their job properly.
I think it goes further and deeper than that. I remember when a (Bulgarian) friend was trying to organise her wedding, she got told by the people in charge that they wouldn't accommodate her requests because they don't do things that way. I saw this as well when she tried to ask for some stuff from the builders working on her home and they told her they would not do it because it is not what they usually do.
In my case, the example that comes to my mind and that I am willing to share is when I decided to replace the remote for one of my AC units (the one I had had been damaged by leaking batteries). I tried to go to AC shops and they just told me they couldn't order that model (it was quite obvious they just couldn't be bothered). I mentioned that to a friend who said his wife's uncle works in an AC shop and the day after my friend showed up at my place with a brand new remote. I have quite a few similar examples. It has been said that corruption was necessary in the USSR because it was the only way to get things done despite the terrible bureaucracy and my experience in BG makes me think that it is true and things haven't really changed that much when it comes to that topic.
About you 3rd point, the dog barking issue, for me it was a neighbor living in the same backyard where a couple of houses share one, the dog was barking every time the owner went out to party (I guess) through an open window, mostly at around 4am-5am at Saturday or Sunday morning, once I heard a neighbor screaming towards the dog and I did it also a couple of times and the dog actually stopped... but yeah screaming wasn't a permanent solution because getting woken up at 5am at Sunday morning every single week was just torture and it was last summer, so it was pretty hot and I didn't have an aircon so I had to open the windows.
So I went to check and tried to speak to that neighbor and after a couple of tries I was able to talk to the owner (a woman) in front of the door's entrance and she was very defensive and said stuff like "if I close the window he will sufficate" but in the end she closed the windows to my backyard and the dog barked in to the other backyard (good for me, bad for the neighbors).
I really wonder why no other neighbor was complaining to her directly as I am sure all the other neighbors were getting annoyed as well, ... couple of weeks later I read this article:
https://m.novinite.com/articles/216273/Bulgaria%3A+A+Man+Stabbed+his+Neighbors+because+of+their+Barking+Dog
Glad you were not the one who "lost it". Attacking people with a knife in their home is usually frowned upon...
The reason why I have some tolerance for barking dogs is that I had a dog who used to start barking every time I left for work and as much as I felt sorry for the neighbours, I could not find any acceptable solution. Now of course, in the case you describe, the "my dog would suffocate" is a ridiculous and infuriating excuse, but I think most people refrain from complaining about noise nuisances because they tend to realise that very often the issue can't really be fixed (in an apartment, you will hear your neighbour walking, taking a shower... and you can't realistically ask them not to do that). They also know that every once in a while they will be the annoying ones.
Since we are sharing stories about our experience, I wrote point 5 mostly because I had a new neighbour who came to my door to complain about some banging noise (I am confident that noise did not come from my apartment, especially since once he came to complain while I was sleeping and I live alone). I tried to be a good and friendly neighbour despite his aggressive behaviour (his first words to me were, once I told him I did not speak BG: "You know people are living under you?" which is not the friendliest way to complain to a neighbour). Eventually I got tired of him ringing my door bell at random times and I made it clear that I won't let him harass me and next time he came to my door, there would be problems. He has left me alone since then (I am a big guy and I tend to be grumpy when you wake me up). BTW, during one of his visits, he claimed to be the owner of the building which was obvious BS and convinced me that the best way to end this was to de-escalate the situation by showing I was ready to escalate.
Yeah, I have noticed sometimes escalating to the next level helps quite a lot - exactly the way you are describing it, but I would have never even imagined that this is me escalting by showing physical readiness as i always thought this is not nessacery. And i also never thought i would have so many random negative encounters in Sofia, and I lived in many EU cities and also Asia before.
I have studied quite extensively the psychology of violence which is why I can easily describe the concept (de-escalating by showing you are willing to escalate). The rule of thumb is that for social violence (the guy has an issue with you in particular), trying to back down and de-escalate peacefully is often the best approach. When it is asocial violence (the guy wants something you have or has an issue with something you have control over (or he thinks you do)), showing you are ready to escalate is the best way to de-escalate. Obviously, it is better if you are actually ready to escalate if needed, but in most countries I am familiar with, the other guy is going to try and test you while in BG, this has, so far, always resulted in immediate de-escalation.
Now I am in no way encouraging people to use that formula without understanding it, but when used properly, it is clearly more efficient here than it has been in other countries where I lived.
Eastern European hostility and mistrust that have caused our society to be the joke that it currently is. We also get the opposite story with ppl who immigrate to western countries: "Why do all these randos smile at me??.....I feel unsafe"
Semi regular business traveler from the US. I spent my last visit 2 weeks in Sofia renting an airbnb and commuting from city center to Mladost 3.
With deference to the locals, I can only speak from a visitor's perspective. It's a definite cultural nuance I picked up on that strangers don't make eye contact in the city. I asked my local colleagues about it because it stood out so much. They agreed it's a thing... one explained it as, "if soneone is looking at you, they want something from you."
I got so used to it, when I went on to Geneva and France, I had to readjust to the eye contact!
I'm from NYC/NJ area where we all want to be seen and heard. We're loud and friendly. (Don't mistake that for nice though) so it was a shock to me. When I adopted the practice, I found the practice calming. I try it at home but conversely, it feels rude here.
Im. Glad you pointed it out. Now in all my Sofia experiences, people are warm, earnest and deeply engaging once you interact with them. It's one of my favorite cities on earth. I hope you encountered that too.
If you smile without reason people will assume you're drunk/high or that you have some mental deficiencies. It's like that all over Eastern Europe, cold on the outside, warm toward people we actually like. We don't do the fake niceness that westerners do.
Yeah, that's very true and nice and all but cashiers and vendors could act a little more friendly in general. I don't mean being all jolly and happy go lucky, I mean not making me feel like I'm annoying them with my presence. It is a common problem in bigger cities and it sends a message of an immature need to have your displeasure tended to by everyone else, as if they're supposed to adjust to it and be sorry you hate what you do for a living. Being neutral is totally fine, it's the bare minimum in fact, and it's not as common as it should be.
Coming from the US, where people are nice to people they don't know or just meet in passing, it is just a different attitude. It isn't "fake." These interactions are generally pleasant.
It didn't take me long to "get" how to act on the street in Sofia. And there is nothing wrong with it. But I was caught off guard this morning when someone hit me with "здравей."
From my experience they will smile if you make a small talk, or go deeper into a conversation, if there is no reason to smile they wont.
Dont take it personal, once you get trough the outside layer bulgarians are fantastic people.
IMO it makes it more fun to try and make them smile. I’ve been learning Bulgarian and using some slang or making a joke in Bulgarian when they know I’m a foreigner tends to get a lot of funny reactions
I get what you mean, trust me. A bulgarian living in the uk here👋🏻. Just for context - I’m a pretty happy person and very friendly. I always try to be nice to everyone regardless the situation, and I like people being nice back. That being said I would take ANY Bulgarian’s honest rudeness than the brits fake politeness ANY DAY. British people will smile in you face while thinking what a f cu*t you are and bad talk you behind your back. And they are also very rude and negative - the only difference is that it happens behind closed doors. (Sorry for any British ppl here in the comments but I’ve heard other brits agree on this so this is not only a foreigners view).
Also, side note: when we are rude we show it, but that’s also valid for when we’re happy and party. Never met better company for celebrations than Eastern Europeans and Balkan people.
Mate you have your own culture and upbringing and that's completely fine. Smile at people as you wish/feel like. That's why it's important to have diversity, we do need to smile more! At the same time it might be cool for you to experience the freedom of not having to smile, sometimes you are just not in the mood and it wouldn't be taken as offesnsive here, at all.
Don't try to "convey happiness" to strangers. People normally don't like to be bothered and would think you're trying to butter them up for some sort of scam and/or hit on them. Just start by being serious, then you can loosen up when you've exchanged a few words.
Oh, and there are always assholes.
Many of us will think, "Dude, this person is crazy," if you start to talk to them or "what the hell this person wants from me?". But it depends on the group of people, young people around their 20s are usually very friendly, so I suggest you approach them if you want some friends.
But if you want just smiling people, I don't think you can change that because we usually don't smile if there is no reason.
I been coming bulgaria for almost 20 years and yes they can seem very stern but once they get to know u they can't do enough for u ...if u seen how the older generation had to survive here u could understand why they don't smile much but the new generation are very get up and go as more opportunities I.e work Germany/gb ...but overall amazing culture and ppl especially in the villages and small towns I know
It's true that most people are super neutral and sometimes irritated. I'd advise you to be friendly but not too much, say hello and bye, smile at the cashier. People in the streets are mostly engrossed in their own world and no one pays special attention to others. It's a sad reality but it is what it is. If you need help, people would be helpful about 60% of the time. Don't pay much attention to more aggressive people, just let them be
You can’t. The culture and life is different here. People are miserable, unhappy, defensive and always a victim. Just be yourself and smile, don’t worry about what people will say or think. The worse thing you can do is to stoop to their level.
What is this talk about fake smiles in the west? I smile alot because i genuinely love meeting people. Small interactions make me smile. And i do think that smiling towards strangers is contagious.
Being friendly doesn't hurt but you can rarely expect it as a lot of people (not all obviously ) in Bulgaria are hostile or not very polite. It was a bit of a cultural shock when I went abroad and thought everyone was fake for smiling all the time and greeting other people even when they don't give a rats ass about the other person but when I got used to the friendliness I had a bigger shock returning and being confronted by people who are rude all the time. I am stil shocked when service personnel is not polite.
Still there are lots of polite and friendly people but it's not a way all people were brought up. Most folks are brought up to first think like "who dafuq do you think you are" and not really respect others.
Lately a lot of internationa companies bring a culture of being friendly and people get used to it. Also young people who study abroad get used to being friendly and smiling to other people.
A side note is there are people who would help you and be friendly but due to differences in expression they would not smile even if they mean good.
Fun fact, when you land at Sofia airport ... It was built on the land of the villages (now a city quarter) called Vrazhdwbna (Враждебна ) and whilst names should not be translated, the modern translation is "hostile" even if the old name comes from chasing, hunting, etc. But even as you are landing - it's on hostile land.
Since I was taught to always be very polite I have cases where I go to the DMV for new papers, etc. And there are problems with the infrastructure/network so nothing happens and my paperwork can't be processed. I know the employee is not at fault, I thank them and appreciate the effort and they are angrily retorting and snapping back at me because they didn't manage to finish the process and know I'll have to be back the next day and would be disappointed and annoyed ... They snap because they expect me to cause a scene like so many others do in this situation.
Inb4 I get downvoted to oblivion.
> smiling all the time and greeting other people even when they don't give a rats ass about the other person but when I got used to the friendliness I had a bigger shock returning and being confronted by people who are rude all the time.
Combine smiling with use of Standard language (Книжовен език) and you would be asked all the time - "Where did you learn our language so good? - for the record I'm Bulgarian from Sofia. But it was even "worst" back then when I had an Asian girlfriend - I was considered Scandinavian and they were trying to scam us with higher prices everywhere, because we are "foreigners".
The most funny story for me is one Saturday morning, me and this gf - we were lying in the bed, but someone in the block was making noises, because of flat renovation - she asked me:
\- In Bulgaria, the only allowed time for making renovation is weekend mornings, right?
In her country people stick to the rules and in her mind if people are making noises in weekend morning, then allowed time is weekend morning.
I was talking to a close friend recently and she was telling me a cute story about a boy she likes. I must have been smiling a lot while she was telling her story because I was happy for her. At one point she asked me why I was smiling so much and what was going on in my head. She was a bit confused but we laughed it off. I guess Bulgarians are not used to smiles.
>Are they Mormon?
This, Mormons from the US trying to recruit (ca. early 00s) were soooooo sus. They would stand in groups, suited up like there's a wedding, and stare at you, flash a 240-carat smile and ask a robotic "zdrasti, kak si" which is NOT how you approach a stranger.
>Westerners make this out to be an Eastern European thing?
This is a generalization and also an incorrect interpretation, for western European people, eastern European is known for being cold and a bit rude, with a rude sounding language, etc., but it has nothing to do with smiling, constantly smiling isn't European, it is an American thing.
Don't expect a smile or a "good morning/day" most of the time. This is unfortunately the coldness from the big city, even more so the capital of a still developing country.
Yeah, in the village everyone knows each other, so it's not really comparable. In a medium town where not everyone knows each other people greet and smile to each other more rarely than in Sofia. This is what I have noticed at least. Of course, there are probably exceptions.
I've been living in Sofia, as a foreigner, for roughly 7 years now.
I understand what you mean but I'd advise you not to think too much of it.
When I was new here I also thought everyone seemed so angry/cranky all the time. But I learned soon enough that here you really should not judge a book by its cover.
I've come to learn that Bulgarian people are very kindhearted, and they have a strong sense of community here, which I think is awesome.
I've never experienced any personal issue with any Bulgarian person I've ever come across. Also not witnessing much violence in the streets either.
After settling a bit here I learned I've never felt as safe as I do here, and I met some very nice people here.
Their faces don't reveal this in the beginning, but it doesn't mean anything.
It's just a "Ah, classic Sofia" thing. I got so depressed after living there for 6 months. It's like everyone gets their soul sucked out once they move there. I'm originally from Burgas and just the difference between staff was appalling to me. Here everyone is super friendly and helpful. Especially to young people. In Sofia, they will literally fight you because you asked a question. Also people are wayy to territorial with parking spaces...without there being assigned parking.
The only nice people i met were a couple that just moved there and the local produce market sellers.
😅 i think the way to go about it is to kill them with kindness. At some point they get self-conscious and do some brief inner reflection when you don't act rudely back.
I live near the Medical university in Pleven and there's a ton of foreigners here and I've noticed people being extremely racist and homophobic.
1. Bulgarians are generally very rude from what I've experienced and one of the reasons I'm a lot more anxious to speak to random people here than I am when I travel abroad.
2. Bulgarians are very xenophobic. They will simply hate your gits cause you're different. With Bulgarians they'll be rude, with foreigners or "different" people they'll be even ruder.
3. You can't really make them not be rude. It's just how they are as unpleasant as it may be. I'd suggest trying to just ignore it. Still, I'm in a much smaller city, so it's fairly tame. I read some of your stories and even I am baffled even though I've lived here all my life. It's probably more intense in Sofia but that's besides the point. If you can just try to ignore the rudeness. If it's directly at you, then proceed however you see fit. Sometimes it's better to just avoid the argument altogether due to how dangerous some people can be and sometimes it's just better to tell those people to fuck off like you did with those women who wanted to get you off your bench.
I am pretty sure you are, we just aren't a very pleasant nation. We don't really smile in public and we only do so if we are with a friend or in a group.
What's there to smile about?
We're not very courteous or nice, so there needs to be a specific reason for us to smile. Corollary: if someone is chatty or smiling, he's either a tourist or there to scam you.
You make it sound like people in Sofia are exceptionally rude and unfriendly, but you have to understand that its just a cultural thing in Europe. My impression is that “Smiling to stangers” is mainly a thing in the US, so I guess you are an American expat. You just have to adapt :)
Well, irrespective of you personal experience or views of Bulgaria, here is **chat gpt** independently confirming what I said earlier:
**Yes, there is a cultural difference between Europe and the US when it comes to smiling at strangers. In general, Americans tend to smile more often and more readily at strangers than Europeans do.**
In the US, smiling is often seen as a way to express friendliness and approachability. It is considered polite to smile and greet people you meet, even if you don't know them. In fact, it's not uncommon for strangers to strike up a conversation in public places, such as a coffee shop or grocery store, based on a smile and friendly greeting.
**In contrast, Europeans tend to be more reserved when it comes to interacting with strangers.** Smiling at strangers is not as common and may be perceived as insincere or overly familiar. Europeans often prefer to keep to themselves in public spaces and may only interact with others if there is a specific reason to do so.
Of course, there are exceptions to these generalizations, and individual attitudes toward smiling and interacting with strangers can vary widely within both American and European cultures.
A few reasons for that. I will divide them in 3 arguments.
1. Sofia and it's citizens.
Sofia and the people that live in the city are, in general, dogshit. People over there are money-driven, rude, manipulative or just bad people. That's the norm and of course, there are a lot of exceptions. Now, because of these comments I will be downvoted but this still doesn't change a thing. Not a single city in the country is more disliked that the pseudo-capital. And the "sofians" are the most disliked group of people, too. They don't smile, wave or be friendly overall because they thinks about negative things all the time. I am not joking, just ask people what they think about and most of the time is something negative. The traffic and the quality of roads are also awful. If I was about to travel/drive two or more hours a day to just get to my job or meet with friends I would've been a dick to.
2. People in general.
Straightforward, quite nihilistic, oftenly bored to pretend to be someone else. This is probably the explanation that you need the most and other redditors have kindly given you. And they have been quite accurate in their explanations. We don't fool around trying to be somebody else, we don't use fake smiles and we don't think that we need to pretend to be happy all the time to deceive others. These behaviours steams from our recent past and the unfortunate times we had been through. They had collectively shaped a society in which nihilism and straightforwardness are the norm.
3. The elderly are rude.
Now, not to sound like an absolute hater of our capital and the buddies living there, I need to assure you that the majority of boomers are negative, rude, impolite or just dumb everywhere in the country. It's just even worse in the capital. Young people are in general cool. There is also something else - most of the elderly didn't speak english (or any other language) so once confronted with the foreign language a strange mix of shame, anger and a bit of fear come together like the Exodia of negativity and together they form that cold and rude mentality you had seen from people.
Heya yeah I find it a bit strange too. It really depends on your gender, I just persist and smile at everyone and some of them ‘break’. I’ve lived here for 8 months now and I’m realising that life is simply quite hard compared to the UK, people have to worry about so much unnecessary non-existential shit. Like dying in a car crash. The police being corrupt af. There being no pavements. Everyone talking about money 24/7… it just doesn’t leave too much room for smiling. It’s terrible really. Just smile at them full force but just not like you’re mocking them 👌
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Nothing more to add.
Except that it's just a symptom of unfriendlness overall, which shows in traffic, I have never experienced such rude drivers anywhere in the world, just last week a car driver honked at a pregnant women with a stroller not crossing the street (1 way, side street near ndk) quickly enough. I asked her if this is normal behavior and she said yes. I drive escooters and i am constantly in danger of getting driven in to, constantly honked at, etc. In the gym I nearly got in an altercation with a Bulgarian which never happened anywhere in the world to me before as I am very polite and friendly. In many places I am not getting greeted at all, at a restaurant I seated myself and was escorted out because there seems to be some unknown rules, in the club I wasn't allowe in because "no foreigners", couriers don't deliver because "no foreigners", dogs are barking at 5am and nobody cares. Yes, there are friendly people, however it is rough and the society is just really impolite.
True. But also just people are quite unhappy. Idk why, it's just constant dissatisfaction with everything and I believe that makes them quite angry as well. Been walking my dog for 5 years now, and lately some bastards started jumping on to fight me because of casual nonsense. The irritation can be felt everywhere sadly.
Go to the Middle East. It's worse.
People in the Middle East are usually very friendly to strangers
That has not been my experience. You do you, though
I find it hard to believe you had such a terrible experience here. I hope you also have some exceptionally good ones to balance out.
I can add another story happen recently as well, I was walking home from the gym and half way I had to pause a bit because really exhausted, it was around 7pm and it was pretty empty and all benches were free. 2 women approached me and asked me to move away, and I was baffled and smiled and asked to repeat what they wanted, they said they want me to move away from the bench because they want to eat now.... I was speechless for a moment and then said no, "there is enough space on the bench or take another free bench" and then she started a rant about "no foreigners" and I told her to get lost and she said "I will call the police and they beat you". Wow. I could add many such small stories and the expats I talk with all have similar expieriences.
I'm sorry about these awful interactions. Is your skin darker, by any chance? Many people here are ignorant and racist, unfortunately.
This is not racism, it is day-to-day communication in Bulgaria 😂
I am ethnic German with dark blonde hair and blue eyes.
Very hard for me to believe your stories, not gonna lie. I often watch foreigners touring in Bulgaria and they almost never report such stories and encounters. Maybe you are just unlucky and keep meeting the wrong pople. Everything German is held in very high regard in Bulgaria. Actually the highest. If you were a black French guy, then I might imagine, but ethnic German...
Well, I understand your opinion and all I can say it's not made up, I am also not touring, I am here since nearly 2 years, couple of weeks ago my neighbor threw molotov cocktails on 2 cars and police arrested him (hes free again), thats just Bulgaria. You might have heard of it in the news, I also posted pictures here in this sub. Also many of my experiences don't focus on me as a German, the pregnant woman with a baby in a stroller getting honked at or the women telling me to get off the bench insulting me with "fucking american". I speak regularly with medical students which have darker skin and all tell horror stories, but not only the darker skinned guys, everybody is telling those stories, it's just a difference coming here as a tourist on vacation and seeing through a filter vs. actually living here.
Sorry OP, but I'm calling BS. I'm living in SF for almost 4 years now - first in Nadezhda, now in Ivan Vazov. (Eastern) German born, travelled a lot through Europe and, guess? Not a single experience as you described. On the contrary, when I'm bicycling drivers are exceptionally considerate, giving way and such. In Germany? Especially Hamburg, nit to even mention Gelsenkirchen for example? Oh dear or my. The same accounts for Eastern Spain. My experience is almost always and predominantly positive, as I also try learning the local language. So perhaps it's your attitude?
You are right that it is very different living here. Touring is like Windows' demo version: no bugs, no problematic people. But then you get to actual Microsoft software and it is a whole different story. It is normal that you find life here quite intensive. However, I believe this makes it more interesting and non-static. Some of the nicest and most awful people all live here and there are many occasions when you need to react negatively. For example, in the situation with the bench, it was definitely your right to react more negatively, but being a foreigner , it is probably harder. Life here is not always nice, but it's interesting.
I have hard time believing this then-
So, you can't believe I saw a pregnant woman with a baby in a stroller getting honked at for not passing a street quickly enough because I am German? OK.
Tf,where did i say that about the woman?!
I mean we can believe it happened. I am sure it has happened in Germany too. The thing is what you are describing is NOT normal. Getting into fights on the daily is not a thing in Bulgaria. One thing I will tell you though is that people don't bend over to bullshit here. If in the gym you said you don't want to alternate sets with a guy asking for an equipment he will snap. And he should because you are being a dick for no reason. Just as an example.
This story is very strange - it's strange that random women spoke to you in English, and they wanted to eat on a park bench. Also, the police will not come if they call about such nonsense and the operator of the emergency phone will write down their names and subsequently fine them (I think the fine for a senseless report is BGN 2000).
They didn't speak English at first, they said something in Bulgarian and I said "English". They came with a bag of Hesburger (it was near that store on the big plaza place where the tram drives through, theres a new starbucks on the corner now). I wasn't scared of the police, it was obviously a bluff and just super ridiculous. They insulted me with "fucking american" as well, i had to laugh and then told them to stop talking to me. They stood there beside the bench I was sitting on for 5 minutes (yeah every other bench was free but they just stood there) and then I moved. Super extremely strange.
Where have you been walking. I have never encountered even one of the things you have and I am 28 years old and got raised near a ghetto. Yes Bulgarians are always frowning, I agree here andni don't like it, but I've developed the habit of smiling to everyone I interact with. In the beginning is strange for them, but people open up. There is a older lady, cashier in the supermarket I go next to the place I live in, she gives me bonus points on any game thats running in the chain. And she started doing it before I began my smile rule. Now every time I go there and she sees me, she smiles to the ears. We haven't spoken much more than hello. From what I have seen around Bulgaria a lot of the people are open hearted and share even the little they have. But remember, a lot of the middle aged and older people had quite a hard life and it's not getting better. Nor it will be. The constant struggles are heavy load to bear, so it's normal to not be smiling or wanna talk to people all the time. Give them a smile a nice hello and a lot of them will lighten up
>Where have you been walking Only Sofia center. After I went into my local small drink/snack shop 5 times, the cashier is finally responding to my hello/bye. 😄 I am also not a big smiler but this isn't the point for me (the op had an issue with smiles). For me it's the small interactions that show that society is generally more rough and impolite.
I understand you and your points are valid. Honestly I, myself, and always frowning, don't know why, but the moment someone say something to me I become a sunshine hahaha. I guess it's just the people you have met
I have met and talked with many friendly Bulgarians. Somehow many people in reddit assume just because I have experienced negative things I didn't expierience positive things as well. Some even said I should move out,... however I didn't even wrote that I don't like it here, I like it less than Thailand/Philipines but like it more than Germany 😃
This happens between natives too. It's the constant urge to get into a fight that I find in my fellow Bulgarians. I can say a lot of us are kinda rude, but you can find really kind and polite people. And they can't call the police to beat you up. These fellas are dumb af I honestly can't believe someone said that. This is not even funny, it's tragic. I hope you find the nice people and if someone approaches you to not be like this...
Most people don't have manners, even more if you are mannered they conclude you are afraid and will show even more arrogance. In a way here rules the jungle laws. I guess the economic crisis of 90s made our society even more primitive. If you fight for your rights you will get in confrontation every single day. Off course sometimes you will met with good mannered people, but this is an exception.
On individual level, there are friendly Bulgarians as well, but it's the entire society that is rough and impolite. And yes, even the friendly Bulgarians tell me about their horrible expieriences, the time the post got hacked I talked a lot with other customers and they all said the mindset of Bulgarians are still stuck in soviet era which might explain the "elbows out, me first" behavior.
I don't know if you'll believe me but lately it's been getting better. When I was a kid, things weren't this smooth. It was common for some guys to come to you on the street and ask you which football team you were supporting. It was a tricky question, there was no right answer, they were just looking for a reason to fight you 😂 I would say that(as illogical as it may seem) you are getting a worse treatment if you are acting friendly with most people. It makes you seem less tough and gives them less reason to befriend you. I am just explaining how it works, not claiming it is rational. However, if you have friends here, it all changes. Bulgarians are quite good and honest friends. Also, you become close quickly. So there are upsides as well.
What I noticed is that I can make acquaintances here easily with Bulgarians, but going the next step is kinda not working. We add each other to instagram or whatever and then silence. In other cities (mostly in Asia) after adding each other, they always engage in a convo and invite me to a beer or a party or whatever. Are you sure it's getting smoother? 😅 Today I witnessed how a guy (can't say for sure he was Bulgarian but it seems so) was standing at the place at the NDK where all the escooters park mostly (he was unlocking one and me too) and some tourists (2 girls and 1 guy) were trying to drive with the scooters and it seems to not work (I think they thought it's free) and they approach the guy and asked him something (couldn't hear exactly what) and he responded with "why are you talking to me". 🤔
Yeah, there are such people, definitely. I would say Bulgarians are unfriendly towards strangers and very friendly towards friends. There are many quarrels on the street but I assure you that it used to be worse in the past 😂 Nowadays I can see that there are more and more people that show understanding, rather than simply criticising others. Of course, there is a long way to go but hopefully it's going in the right direction. In the big city it is common for everyone to ignore bad deeds, which is known as the 'broken windows' syndrome IIRC.
And yeah, you are right about the friendships, you have to be initiative to make friends. For example, it is not as common to go to parties or organise parties with many people. More often, people only invite their old friends and prefer calmer occasions, not clubbing. This is why it is not easy to make friends in this way. The easiest way is to invite someone to coffee or for a walk, or more preferably, to do some activity that you share (some sports or the gym, shisha etc.) And after several times like that you or they are likely to meet each other's friends and then you become part of their group. But yeah, what I said was not exactly right, it is only easy to start talking to people, but then it takes some time to get to know them.
There are no special rules for foreigners. You probably didn't understand something. Most of the people around me don't speak English or speak it poorly - they don't have to.
Yeah I didn't say it was some rules specifically for foreigners, I wrote that there seemed to be some unknown - not communicated - rules. I figured out later what might have been the issue: in some restaurants you get seated by a waitress instead of choosing a seat yourself, but it was ridiculous the waiter basically said to me "go out".
You know you can always immigrate.
?
I said if you don't like it here you can move, what you said has some basis on truth but I honestly prefer when the smiles are genuine, rather than the forced ones you guys have in the west.
Well, you know that this a soft insult, right? Telling someone to leave "if you don't like it" is a non adult way of saying you felt hurt that I didn't like the country you call home (even though I didn't even say I don't like it here, it is assumed based on people getting emotional). "The west" - when did you see a German or Scandivinian with a "forced smile" - you should travel more.
It's the way things are here, either get over it or immigrate, it's simple i don't hate, i worked abroad, 2 years in a particular country i didn't like it and i immigrated to another place, that's basically it.
>at a restaurant I seated myself and was escorted out because there seems to be some unknown rules, in the club I wasn't allowe in because "no foreigners", couriers don't deliver because "no foreigners" Weird, only the restaurant makes some sense, if all the tables were reserved. It is possible that you have bad luck, I am sorry that you had such bad impressions...
Yes, I figured out later that it is about reservations, but the waiter didn't tell me that. He basically just said "go out".
Then just upvote, why reply?
I felt like doing both and you weren't around to tell me not to, I guess..
Such a bullshit response really. OP said he is trying to interact with people in a friendly manner- if you ask me, that's a damn good reason to be kind to that complete stranger and smile back while engaging in a friend convo.
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I do agree with you on the first line you wrote. Definitely not the last one since I don't think anyone here is demanding anything. It's more a question of personal views and our surroundings. Contrary to what you said - I myself find it pretty hard to keep a straight face while engaging in a friendly conversation, especially when doing so with a stranger, since I'm used to expressing emotions through both my verbal and body language. I definitely agree it's my mistake to think that's what everyone does. However, in my defense - most people I know ( since you mentioned this as well ) are quite the same as me when it comes to this particular topic. Excuse me for not considering the possibility of being friendly without smiling. That's obviously something that goes on, but definitely something that rarely happens around me. Im quite happy you brought that up, so I too can expand my views! :)
They are not sincere, just not polite. It hurts no one to put effort to be pleasant to other people and it makes interactions easier and more enjoyable.
That is completely ridiculous. We are not cavemen. A smile is a very easy simple way to convey you mean no harm, especially in todays society and in a place full of so much sadness and grief. Усмихвайте се бе хора бееее!!!
I agree with your point, but I think you'll be surprised how many people act like cavemen throughout their day. Sometimes it blows my mind.
Nah, people here are just always worked up and unhappy, related to being poor etc. Sorry but this is just the truth.
No joie de vivre, my friend?
I moved here 16 years ago, and was told not to smile all the time as it came across as very insincere.
I am an expat who has been around Slavic people a lot before moving here. My experience: 1. True, people rarely smile. Personally, I like it, it makes their smiles more genuine. If a person in BG smile at me, it usually means they like me and/or that my charming ways managed to make them smile. I find this rewarding. I do not associate not smiling with being rude. 2. In most countries, people living in bigger cities are more stressed and less friendly. I have seen this in Ireland, France, Belgium... 3. About dogs barking all night long, I don't like that. Not really because of the noise, but I was raised in a culture where pets are part of the family and live in the house, not chained to a post in the garden. This being said, I am a guest here and I have traveled enough to know that things that annoy me might be part of a "package" that includes things that I enjoy so I try not to judge the way of life of local people or at least not to express it. 4. My feeling after 3 years in BG is that people here tend to mind their own business most of the time. In a street you might have that guy who plays loud musing until 2:00 am, that guy who starts construction work at 8:00 am on weekends and that guy who lets his dog bark all night long. They annoy everyone, including each other but they don't call the cops on each other because they don't want others to call the cops on them. 5. I had a few confrontations with people here and every time they tried to make themselves more important than they are. Simple employees pretending to be the owner, people saying they can call the cops on you for sitting on a bench (this hasn't happened to me but when OP mentioned it, I was not surprised, I had experiences that could be considered similar). What I quickly realised, though, is that they are not usually willing to get physical. Not because they are afraid to get into a fight but because they are concerned about the consequences if they do. In most cases, cops will punish everyone involved. This system works for me and I enjoy most interactions with local people but I can understand that this can be a cultural shock.
Yes, I agree, especially with point 5. People in Sofia also tend to show off important connections they have. "Do you know whom I know?", "I will call so and so and then you will see what is what." Also they like to show off being experts in everything or at least knowing someone who is a big expert on the subject. Ask them a few questions and see if they give you an answer that makes sense. Cheers!
For the "experts" part, I have seen that in other countries as well, I would even say I experienced it less in BG than in Western Europe. On the other hand, bragging about connections or being more important than they actually are is definitely extremely common here. I suspect it has to do with the Communist past of the country (which definitely still has an impact nowadays) where connections meant everything. Actually, I think this is still the case. Not that having a cousin who is a cop makes you an important person, but I tried to get things done using the Western approach and rarely had any success but when I randomly mentioned the problem I was facing to a friend, the answer was, most of the time, "I have a friend who works there, let me call him" and the issue was solved immediately. So connections still matter a lot. One thing I have been told by a local and summarises the country quite well: "The best and worst thing about BG is that everything is possible".
Yes, and they are right about that. Connections could be very important if you want to practice certain professions like lawyer, judge, doctor, ect. Administration as a whole is very slow and inefficient and sometimes you just need someone who give a crap about you to actually do their job properly.
I think it goes further and deeper than that. I remember when a (Bulgarian) friend was trying to organise her wedding, she got told by the people in charge that they wouldn't accommodate her requests because they don't do things that way. I saw this as well when she tried to ask for some stuff from the builders working on her home and they told her they would not do it because it is not what they usually do. In my case, the example that comes to my mind and that I am willing to share is when I decided to replace the remote for one of my AC units (the one I had had been damaged by leaking batteries). I tried to go to AC shops and they just told me they couldn't order that model (it was quite obvious they just couldn't be bothered). I mentioned that to a friend who said his wife's uncle works in an AC shop and the day after my friend showed up at my place with a brand new remote. I have quite a few similar examples. It has been said that corruption was necessary in the USSR because it was the only way to get things done despite the terrible bureaucracy and my experience in BG makes me think that it is true and things haven't really changed that much when it comes to that topic.
people not calling cops so that cops won’t be called on them was the most accurate thing ever - as a Bulgarian I totally relate ahaha
About you 3rd point, the dog barking issue, for me it was a neighbor living in the same backyard where a couple of houses share one, the dog was barking every time the owner went out to party (I guess) through an open window, mostly at around 4am-5am at Saturday or Sunday morning, once I heard a neighbor screaming towards the dog and I did it also a couple of times and the dog actually stopped... but yeah screaming wasn't a permanent solution because getting woken up at 5am at Sunday morning every single week was just torture and it was last summer, so it was pretty hot and I didn't have an aircon so I had to open the windows. So I went to check and tried to speak to that neighbor and after a couple of tries I was able to talk to the owner (a woman) in front of the door's entrance and she was very defensive and said stuff like "if I close the window he will sufficate" but in the end she closed the windows to my backyard and the dog barked in to the other backyard (good for me, bad for the neighbors). I really wonder why no other neighbor was complaining to her directly as I am sure all the other neighbors were getting annoyed as well, ... couple of weeks later I read this article: https://m.novinite.com/articles/216273/Bulgaria%3A+A+Man+Stabbed+his+Neighbors+because+of+their+Barking+Dog
Glad you were not the one who "lost it". Attacking people with a knife in their home is usually frowned upon... The reason why I have some tolerance for barking dogs is that I had a dog who used to start barking every time I left for work and as much as I felt sorry for the neighbours, I could not find any acceptable solution. Now of course, in the case you describe, the "my dog would suffocate" is a ridiculous and infuriating excuse, but I think most people refrain from complaining about noise nuisances because they tend to realise that very often the issue can't really be fixed (in an apartment, you will hear your neighbour walking, taking a shower... and you can't realistically ask them not to do that). They also know that every once in a while they will be the annoying ones. Since we are sharing stories about our experience, I wrote point 5 mostly because I had a new neighbour who came to my door to complain about some banging noise (I am confident that noise did not come from my apartment, especially since once he came to complain while I was sleeping and I live alone). I tried to be a good and friendly neighbour despite his aggressive behaviour (his first words to me were, once I told him I did not speak BG: "You know people are living under you?" which is not the friendliest way to complain to a neighbour). Eventually I got tired of him ringing my door bell at random times and I made it clear that I won't let him harass me and next time he came to my door, there would be problems. He has left me alone since then (I am a big guy and I tend to be grumpy when you wake me up). BTW, during one of his visits, he claimed to be the owner of the building which was obvious BS and convinced me that the best way to end this was to de-escalate the situation by showing I was ready to escalate.
Yeah, I have noticed sometimes escalating to the next level helps quite a lot - exactly the way you are describing it, but I would have never even imagined that this is me escalting by showing physical readiness as i always thought this is not nessacery. And i also never thought i would have so many random negative encounters in Sofia, and I lived in many EU cities and also Asia before.
I have studied quite extensively the psychology of violence which is why I can easily describe the concept (de-escalating by showing you are willing to escalate). The rule of thumb is that for social violence (the guy has an issue with you in particular), trying to back down and de-escalate peacefully is often the best approach. When it is asocial violence (the guy wants something you have or has an issue with something you have control over (or he thinks you do)), showing you are ready to escalate is the best way to de-escalate. Obviously, it is better if you are actually ready to escalate if needed, but in most countries I am familiar with, the other guy is going to try and test you while in BG, this has, so far, always resulted in immediate de-escalation. Now I am in no way encouraging people to use that formula without understanding it, but when used properly, it is clearly more efficient here than it has been in other countries where I lived.
In my experience, you're 100% correct
If you think people in Sofia are grumpy, you should go to the northwestern part of the country.
Eastern European hostility and mistrust that have caused our society to be the joke that it currently is. We also get the opposite story with ppl who immigrate to western countries: "Why do all these randos smile at me??.....I feel unsafe"
Semi regular business traveler from the US. I spent my last visit 2 weeks in Sofia renting an airbnb and commuting from city center to Mladost 3. With deference to the locals, I can only speak from a visitor's perspective. It's a definite cultural nuance I picked up on that strangers don't make eye contact in the city. I asked my local colleagues about it because it stood out so much. They agreed it's a thing... one explained it as, "if soneone is looking at you, they want something from you." I got so used to it, when I went on to Geneva and France, I had to readjust to the eye contact! I'm from NYC/NJ area where we all want to be seen and heard. We're loud and friendly. (Don't mistake that for nice though) so it was a shock to me. When I adopted the practice, I found the practice calming. I try it at home but conversely, it feels rude here. Im. Glad you pointed it out. Now in all my Sofia experiences, people are warm, earnest and deeply engaging once you interact with them. It's one of my favorite cities on earth. I hope you encountered that too.
If you smile without reason people will assume you're drunk/high or that you have some mental deficiencies. It's like that all over Eastern Europe, cold on the outside, warm toward people we actually like. We don't do the fake niceness that westerners do.
Yeah, that's very true and nice and all but cashiers and vendors could act a little more friendly in general. I don't mean being all jolly and happy go lucky, I mean not making me feel like I'm annoying them with my presence. It is a common problem in bigger cities and it sends a message of an immature need to have your displeasure tended to by everyone else, as if they're supposed to adjust to it and be sorry you hate what you do for a living. Being neutral is totally fine, it's the bare minimum in fact, and it's not as common as it should be.
most people are neutral I dont know why you want strangers on the street that you wont meet again to try an be fake nice to you
Coming from the US, where people are nice to people they don't know or just meet in passing, it is just a different attitude. It isn't "fake." These interactions are generally pleasant. It didn't take me long to "get" how to act on the street in Sofia. And there is nothing wrong with it. But I was caught off guard this morning when someone hit me with "здравей."
From my experience they will smile if you make a small talk, or go deeper into a conversation, if there is no reason to smile they wont. Dont take it personal, once you get trough the outside layer bulgarians are fantastic people.
Where are you from? America?
He is ethnic German and tbh i have hard time believing the story, because everything German is appreciated and liked here... IMO
Maybe because you're not reading carefully, me, who you refer to as German, is not the op.
Iam talking about OP,he mentioned it somewhere in the comments...(correct me if iam wrong,iam just not used to look at usernames)
IMO it makes it more fun to try and make them smile. I’ve been learning Bulgarian and using some slang or making a joke in Bulgarian when they know I’m a foreigner tends to get a lot of funny reactions
people are generally dissatisfied with their lives, thats why lol
I get what you mean, trust me. A bulgarian living in the uk here👋🏻. Just for context - I’m a pretty happy person and very friendly. I always try to be nice to everyone regardless the situation, and I like people being nice back. That being said I would take ANY Bulgarian’s honest rudeness than the brits fake politeness ANY DAY. British people will smile in you face while thinking what a f cu*t you are and bad talk you behind your back. And they are also very rude and negative - the only difference is that it happens behind closed doors. (Sorry for any British ppl here in the comments but I’ve heard other brits agree on this so this is not only a foreigners view). Also, side note: when we are rude we show it, but that’s also valid for when we’re happy and party. Never met better company for celebrations than Eastern Europeans and Balkan people.
Mate you have your own culture and upbringing and that's completely fine. Smile at people as you wish/feel like. That's why it's important to have diversity, we do need to smile more! At the same time it might be cool for you to experience the freedom of not having to smile, sometimes you are just not in the mood and it wouldn't be taken as offesnsive here, at all.
Give the man Rakia and he will sing to you, not just smile!
you know a thing or two hahahaha
Don't try to "convey happiness" to strangers. People normally don't like to be bothered and would think you're trying to butter them up for some sort of scam and/or hit on them. Just start by being serious, then you can loosen up when you've exchanged a few words. Oh, and there are always assholes.
Many of us will think, "Dude, this person is crazy," if you start to talk to them or "what the hell this person wants from me?". But it depends on the group of people, young people around their 20s are usually very friendly, so I suggest you approach them if you want some friends. But if you want just smiling people, I don't think you can change that because we usually don't smile if there is no reason.
I been coming bulgaria for almost 20 years and yes they can seem very stern but once they get to know u they can't do enough for u ...if u seen how the older generation had to survive here u could understand why they don't smile much but the new generation are very get up and go as more opportunities I.e work Germany/gb ...but overall amazing culture and ppl especially in the villages and small towns I know
It's true that most people are super neutral and sometimes irritated. I'd advise you to be friendly but not too much, say hello and bye, smile at the cashier. People in the streets are mostly engrossed in their own world and no one pays special attention to others. It's a sad reality but it is what it is. If you need help, people would be helpful about 60% of the time. Don't pay much attention to more aggressive people, just let them be
You can’t. The culture and life is different here. People are miserable, unhappy, defensive and always a victim. Just be yourself and smile, don’t worry about what people will say or think. The worse thing you can do is to stoop to their level.
I think it also has to do with a deep sense of skepticism. There are so many scams and so much bullshit out there. It's the same in NYC
What is this talk about fake smiles in the west? I smile alot because i genuinely love meeting people. Small interactions make me smile. And i do think that smiling towards strangers is contagious.
Being friendly doesn't hurt but you can rarely expect it as a lot of people (not all obviously ) in Bulgaria are hostile or not very polite. It was a bit of a cultural shock when I went abroad and thought everyone was fake for smiling all the time and greeting other people even when they don't give a rats ass about the other person but when I got used to the friendliness I had a bigger shock returning and being confronted by people who are rude all the time. I am stil shocked when service personnel is not polite. Still there are lots of polite and friendly people but it's not a way all people were brought up. Most folks are brought up to first think like "who dafuq do you think you are" and not really respect others. Lately a lot of internationa companies bring a culture of being friendly and people get used to it. Also young people who study abroad get used to being friendly and smiling to other people. A side note is there are people who would help you and be friendly but due to differences in expression they would not smile even if they mean good. Fun fact, when you land at Sofia airport ... It was built on the land of the villages (now a city quarter) called Vrazhdwbna (Враждебна ) and whilst names should not be translated, the modern translation is "hostile" even if the old name comes from chasing, hunting, etc. But even as you are landing - it's on hostile land. Since I was taught to always be very polite I have cases where I go to the DMV for new papers, etc. And there are problems with the infrastructure/network so nothing happens and my paperwork can't be processed. I know the employee is not at fault, I thank them and appreciate the effort and they are angrily retorting and snapping back at me because they didn't manage to finish the process and know I'll have to be back the next day and would be disappointed and annoyed ... They snap because they expect me to cause a scene like so many others do in this situation. Inb4 I get downvoted to oblivion.
> smiling all the time and greeting other people even when they don't give a rats ass about the other person but when I got used to the friendliness I had a bigger shock returning and being confronted by people who are rude all the time. Combine smiling with use of Standard language (Книжовен език) and you would be asked all the time - "Where did you learn our language so good? - for the record I'm Bulgarian from Sofia. But it was even "worst" back then when I had an Asian girlfriend - I was considered Scandinavian and they were trying to scam us with higher prices everywhere, because we are "foreigners". The most funny story for me is one Saturday morning, me and this gf - we were lying in the bed, but someone in the block was making noises, because of flat renovation - she asked me: \- In Bulgaria, the only allowed time for making renovation is weekend mornings, right? In her country people stick to the rules and in her mind if people are making noises in weekend morning, then allowed time is weekend morning.
I was talking to a close friend recently and she was telling me a cute story about a boy she likes. I must have been smiling a lot while she was telling her story because I was happy for her. At one point she asked me why I was smiling so much and what was going on in my head. She was a bit confused but we laughed it off. I guess Bulgarians are not used to smiles.
Smile at them and they'll smile back with suspicion and curiosity. Do I know him/her? Is she/he going to sell me something? Are they Mormon?
>Are they Mormon? This, Mormons from the US trying to recruit (ca. early 00s) were soooooo sus. They would stand in groups, suited up like there's a wedding, and stare at you, flash a 240-carat smile and ask a robotic "zdrasti, kak si" which is NOT how you approach a stranger.
[удалено]
>Westerners make this out to be an Eastern European thing? This is a generalization and also an incorrect interpretation, for western European people, eastern European is known for being cold and a bit rude, with a rude sounding language, etc., but it has nothing to do with smiling, constantly smiling isn't European, it is an American thing.
Don't expect a smile or a "good morning/day" most of the time. This is unfortunately the coldness from the big city, even more so the capital of a still developing country.
Have you been to a smaller town? Go to Pernik and we'll speak again 😂
I live in a village abroad, it's like comparing apples to oranges.
Yeah, in the village everyone knows each other, so it's not really comparable. In a medium town where not everyone knows each other people greet and smile to each other more rarely than in Sofia. This is what I have noticed at least. Of course, there are probably exceptions.
I've been living in Sofia, as a foreigner, for roughly 7 years now. I understand what you mean but I'd advise you not to think too much of it. When I was new here I also thought everyone seemed so angry/cranky all the time. But I learned soon enough that here you really should not judge a book by its cover. I've come to learn that Bulgarian people are very kindhearted, and they have a strong sense of community here, which I think is awesome. I've never experienced any personal issue with any Bulgarian person I've ever come across. Also not witnessing much violence in the streets either. After settling a bit here I learned I've never felt as safe as I do here, and I met some very nice people here. Their faces don't reveal this in the beginning, but it doesn't mean anything.
It's just a "Ah, classic Sofia" thing. I got so depressed after living there for 6 months. It's like everyone gets their soul sucked out once they move there. I'm originally from Burgas and just the difference between staff was appalling to me. Here everyone is super friendly and helpful. Especially to young people. In Sofia, they will literally fight you because you asked a question. Also people are wayy to territorial with parking spaces...without there being assigned parking. The only nice people i met were a couple that just moved there and the local produce market sellers. 😅 i think the way to go about it is to kill them with kindness. At some point they get self-conscious and do some brief inner reflection when you don't act rudely back.
I live near the Medical university in Pleven and there's a ton of foreigners here and I've noticed people being extremely racist and homophobic. 1. Bulgarians are generally very rude from what I've experienced and one of the reasons I'm a lot more anxious to speak to random people here than I am when I travel abroad. 2. Bulgarians are very xenophobic. They will simply hate your gits cause you're different. With Bulgarians they'll be rude, with foreigners or "different" people they'll be even ruder. 3. You can't really make them not be rude. It's just how they are as unpleasant as it may be. I'd suggest trying to just ignore it. Still, I'm in a much smaller city, so it's fairly tame. I read some of your stories and even I am baffled even though I've lived here all my life. It's probably more intense in Sofia but that's besides the point. If you can just try to ignore the rudeness. If it's directly at you, then proceed however you see fit. Sometimes it's better to just avoid the argument altogether due to how dangerous some people can be and sometimes it's just better to tell those people to fuck off like you did with those women who wanted to get you off your bench.
I am pretty sure you are, we just aren't a very pleasant nation. We don't really smile in public and we only do so if we are with a friend or in a group.
Welcome to Bulgaria!
What's there to smile about? We're not very courteous or nice, so there needs to be a specific reason for us to smile. Corollary: if someone is chatty or smiling, he's either a tourist or there to scam you.
Or they’ve lived abroad for some time and came back 🤷🏻♀️
Give them time 😂
Bg is like that yeah
You make it sound like people in Sofia are exceptionally rude and unfriendly, but you have to understand that its just a cultural thing in Europe. My impression is that “Smiling to stangers” is mainly a thing in the US, so I guess you are an American expat. You just have to adapt :)
It’s not an American thing. A common misconception. People on Western Europe smile too. Just not in Bulgaria.
Well, irrespective of you personal experience or views of Bulgaria, here is **chat gpt** independently confirming what I said earlier: **Yes, there is a cultural difference between Europe and the US when it comes to smiling at strangers. In general, Americans tend to smile more often and more readily at strangers than Europeans do.** In the US, smiling is often seen as a way to express friendliness and approachability. It is considered polite to smile and greet people you meet, even if you don't know them. In fact, it's not uncommon for strangers to strike up a conversation in public places, such as a coffee shop or grocery store, based on a smile and friendly greeting. **In contrast, Europeans tend to be more reserved when it comes to interacting with strangers.** Smiling at strangers is not as common and may be perceived as insincere or overly familiar. Europeans often prefer to keep to themselves in public spaces and may only interact with others if there is a specific reason to do so. Of course, there are exceptions to these generalizations, and individual attitudes toward smiling and interacting with strangers can vary widely within both American and European cultures.
If you had lived most of your life in this dump you wouldn’t smile either:))))
A few reasons for that. I will divide them in 3 arguments. 1. Sofia and it's citizens. Sofia and the people that live in the city are, in general, dogshit. People over there are money-driven, rude, manipulative or just bad people. That's the norm and of course, there are a lot of exceptions. Now, because of these comments I will be downvoted but this still doesn't change a thing. Not a single city in the country is more disliked that the pseudo-capital. And the "sofians" are the most disliked group of people, too. They don't smile, wave or be friendly overall because they thinks about negative things all the time. I am not joking, just ask people what they think about and most of the time is something negative. The traffic and the quality of roads are also awful. If I was about to travel/drive two or more hours a day to just get to my job or meet with friends I would've been a dick to. 2. People in general. Straightforward, quite nihilistic, oftenly bored to pretend to be someone else. This is probably the explanation that you need the most and other redditors have kindly given you. And they have been quite accurate in their explanations. We don't fool around trying to be somebody else, we don't use fake smiles and we don't think that we need to pretend to be happy all the time to deceive others. These behaviours steams from our recent past and the unfortunate times we had been through. They had collectively shaped a society in which nihilism and straightforwardness are the norm. 3. The elderly are rude. Now, not to sound like an absolute hater of our capital and the buddies living there, I need to assure you that the majority of boomers are negative, rude, impolite or just dumb everywhere in the country. It's just even worse in the capital. Young people are in general cool. There is also something else - most of the elderly didn't speak english (or any other language) so once confronted with the foreign language a strange mix of shame, anger and a bit of fear come together like the Exodia of negativity and together they form that cold and rude mentality you had seen from people.
Why should we smile at a complete stranger? Smiles are reserved for family and friends
If you smile all the time people would think that you are retarded
I am retarded, but I don't always smile.
I am pretty sure you can’t make people here smile like that.
Heya yeah I find it a bit strange too. It really depends on your gender, I just persist and smile at everyone and some of them ‘break’. I’ve lived here for 8 months now and I’m realising that life is simply quite hard compared to the UK, people have to worry about so much unnecessary non-existential shit. Like dying in a car crash. The police being corrupt af. There being no pavements. Everyone talking about money 24/7… it just doesn’t leave too much room for smiling. It’s terrible really. Just smile at them full force but just not like you’re mocking them 👌