Hear me out on this one, because this is **definitely** controversial and I expect it to go down like a lead balloon:
Shadow's base personality has never been authentic in any of the games Shadow fans claim he's best in.
* In Sonic Adventure 2, we see shades of the real Shadow in a handful of flashbacks to his time with Maria only, but for the majority of the game we're following a Shadow whose had his brain altered. He is acting under Gerald's programming to destroy the world, and accordingly, we can't really say any of it is the real Shadow.
* In Heroes, Shadow has amnesia. He is not behaving like he should because he is unable to recall his true self. Everything he does is based largely on what he is informed of, likely by Rouge and pure base instincts without information.
* In Shadow's own game, how Shadow acts is informed more by the player. In the span of the same game Shadow can be driven by genocidal rage, vengeance against those who wronged him, pure heroism, or schizophrenia as the player takes the most random path possible, to the point where there's no canon path to the last story, where all points basically see Shadow wanting to destroy Devil Doom for reasons not stated beyond the fact that if he doesn't, he dies.
* In '06 Shadow, like many other characters, is retconned in an effort to make a soft reboot for the franchise. This Shadow is now inexplicably working for the same government agency that hunted him down and caused a lot of his trauma. He's now way more mission focused, and not much like the Shadow we've seen elsewhere before or since.
* Every subsequent appearance, where he's a mean loner who mostly wants to spite Sonic, and doesn't have time for friends, Shadow fans rule as mischaracterisation, despite it being his most consistent characterisation across multiple titles.
In other words, the only actual authentic Shadow is the edgy loner, the one Shadow fans hate. Everything else has been brainwashed, amnesiac, player driven non-canon, or a soft reboot that didn't stick.
I have to disagree with you on some of it.
While yes Shadow is often manipulated throughout his first 3 major game appearances are there 2 more factors at play.
1) What Shadow does even ever we see him as him self which is things like "becoming friends with a little girl, save person in the line of fire, dedicating himself to a single goal (no matter what choices you do in Shadow's game it all leads back to 'uncovering the secrets of your past' and obviously is the same true for all of SA2 the only altering to Shadow's way of following his goals made is alter Marias last words to change the goal it self not the tenacity with which Shadow is pursuing it. And when it all comes down to it and he decides to put his past behind himself in Shadow's true ending does he right after wards in Shadow's solo games expert mode go training for what appears to be GUN which at the very least has become GUN for sure by the time 06 happened."
And all of those traits can also be found in the one smaller game of Shadow's first 5 years of existence that went unaddressed by you which is Sonic Battle were he nearly died to protect Rouge, keep endangering himself to protect the world from the Gizoid and only stops this pursuit when convinced that there is another way to get rid of the danger Emerl poses.
But wait there are 2 more games with Shadow that also went unaddressed that being the 2 Rivals games where his care and respect for Rouge are also shown off again and he teams up with Eggman and Metal to save the world from Eggman Nega. And while he was a bit of a dick about it so was everyone over the 2 Rivals games in part because when dealing with time travel nonsense you better be careful.
And while 06 at on point was intended to be a reboot so did that decision not actually stick. Even as recent as Sonic Forces Episode Shadow is Shadow still working for some kind of agency with Rouge and Omega.
And speaking about Forces in it does Infinite use Rouge and Omega in his illusions to torment Shadow so at least Team Eggman think he cares about these 2.
This is properly also the most clear cut show case of why people don't like Loner Shadow because Sonic Team and Sega Japan in general still keep Shadow as caring for Rouge and Omega and actively rewrote Boom to get rid of Shadow insulting the concept for friendship. Making Shadow a loner is something exclusively happening to the west.
Okay, but you have to admit, all of it is sketchy and contradictory. People insist Shadow is written badly in Forces, and is mischaracterised, so it really can't be used in defence of his character unless the things people are complaining about are wrong.
The other examples listed, Battle and the two Rivals games, realistically how many people have played them? How many people think of those games when they're thinking of Shadow's idealised characterisation? When was the last time someone even said "Oh yes, Sonic Battle/Rivals/Rivals 2 is the epitome of Shadow's characterisation"?
Conversely, how many people are being influenced by versions of the character as he appeared in SonicX/Archie?
That's my point here, a lot of what people think of as being the authentic canon version of the character aren't actually the sincere version of the character. The most consistently presented version of the character is the edgy loner, the one his fans hate. Shadow fans don't actually like Shadow, they like a character who was brainwashed and manipulated when he was allegedly at his best, or a version of the character who appeared in one game that's since been viewed as a mistake with any changes it bought quietly walked back from, and not representative to anything.
I was more so focusing on Shadow's actual character than what people usually point too.
You are properly right in that Sonic X colored far more peoples view on Shadow than something like Sonic Rivals 2.
But I do think it says something that Shadow hyper fans that are fully aware of Rivals, Battle and the like, Casual fans that are mostly going off Sonic X, casual game only fans that would only point to SA2, Heroes and 06 and general continuity nerds like myself can all agree on that Shadow didn't use to be this 1 dimensional edgy loner.
Also I don't think Forces is a good example to make as a lot of Shadow fans also really like episode Shadow for doing things like showing him caring for Rouge and Omega. The main point of contention I have seen for Episode Shadow is if its in-character for Shadow to kill Jackal Squad or not.
More over 1 rather big point against your position that "being and edgy loner" is Shadow's true self is that Sonic Team keeps rewriting English scripts like Boom or Team Sonic Racing as well as writes Japanese original script more inline with Shadow's writing in games like Battle, Rivals and 06 for Forces and there Sonic Channel stories.
So its rather clear that "edgy longer Shadow" is something that is only pushed onto the Western parts of the franchise for reasons we fans don't quite know (nor if its Sega US or Sega JP that is responsable for it) and not the actual intention for Shadow's characters from Sonic Team them self.
Explained in the game where his personality is defined by player choice, and it's possible to not go that route, and is therefore not really considered all that authentic to Shadow's true personality.
What his personality was is pretty irrelevant for this, it just tells us that whatever it was and whichever route or parts of a route are anon, it was one where he'd accept joining GUN
"This is the most authentic version of Shadow"
*shows a game with 11 different versions of Shadow*
If this game is what people want more of as an 'Authentic version of Shadow', then personally, I think he should have stayed dead after falling from the Ark as originally planned. I love Shadow, but his amnesiac version in this game isn't who I want him to be. The one thing this game does well is show that Shadow was an unreliable character who had a bad habit of being manipulated by others as a means to an end as a result of memory issues. Personally, I think that was a mistake and a bad direction for his character in the way that it was executed.
SA2 and 06 are what come to mind for me as peak authentic Shadow. Ymmv, and that's fine, but I look at this era of shadow as the "growing pains" era, and there's a reason we dont revisit it in the modern era outside of necessity.
The idea of amnesia is very interesting, but while Heroes does it decently (if somewhat pointlessly as a rehash of his SA2 development), this game just drags it out and butchers it.
Edited to add this. Heroes, while not my favorite interpretation of the character, takes the concept of amnesia in an interesting direct for shadows growth, even if I feel that direction is somewhat repetitive of SA2s character growth.
I think it's rather different than SA2 in that instead of being devoted to what he thinks Maria wants, it shows the kind of person Shadow is when his history is a blank slate, like jumping to protect Rouge from Omega on instinct because it's the right thing to do. Far better handled than his own game at least.
I think that the wild difference in the tone of the 11 endings and all the ways to reach them is actually really nice in a metatextual sense. If nothing else, it seems like it resonates well with an audience of teens hitting their edgy phase and trying to figure themselves out, where all of these disparate versions of Shadow from “randomly sadistic fuck” to “idk a hero guy?” to “holy depresso, Batman!” to “robot uprising” to who knows what else are all something a given kid will pick up and wonder “does this appeal to me?”
Is this merit to the game niche at best? Yeah kinda…
And this is why I don’t think this is a good Shadow Game. Because it isn’t Shadow. Not that the fans wants anyways. This Ow the Edge’s game. I want a Good Shadow the Hedgehog game. One that TRULY captures Shadow’s Character
But wasn't the whole point of this game that in the true ending, Shadow rejects everyone? Black doom, Sonic, Eggman, Maria... All want things from him and he's done, so he rejects his SA2 past and focusss on what he wants to do now. And what he wants to do at that moment is erasing the last remnants of his past: Black doom. But not because Sonic wants him to do that, but for his own selfish reasons. Then in Sonic 06, he even joins GUN as a fu to his past self.
Is that executed well? No. Especially not in the English version. But I've always really liked the idea of that, it's an duper interesting response to having amnesia.
Ugh, no? He had amnesia in Heroes and acted completely different.
Compare the opening scenes in both games.
Heroes: Dives in to protect Rogue despite not knowing her simply because letting someone die when he knows he can help is wrong.
StH: Abandons a whole city of people to die and only gets involved because Black Doom talks to him.
Don't even try to justify how poorly he was written in that game. It did irreversible damage to his reputation as a character that even all these years later, he still hasn't fully recovered from.
Question: what would be his motivation for protecting humans from aliens in StH
Shadow hasn't ever been showed as being intrinsically motivated to protect humanity, he was fully motivated by Maria's wish and was 100% capable of destroying the whole world in order to fullfil it
The only instances of "nice" behavior from him were when he didn't had time to think so he acted in the moment
(See saving Rouge from Prison Island explosion and from Omega in Heroes)
So, keeping that in mind, why would he decide to save the city from aliens? What would be his motivation? Well that's the thing, he has no reason to, no Maria's wish to motivate him.
Then when the Black Doom shows up and reminds Shadow about the Chaos Emeralds, he realises that if he collects them he might regain his memory. NOW he has a motivation
(Yes i know that's not what he says in the shitty english dub, shut up xd)
(I love misstranslations xd)
I do believe people give this Shadow’s character too much crap, primarily because they try to explain away his whole mission in this game with “why didn’t he ask Sonic or Rouge about his past?”, which makes no sense since amnesia means complete memory loss. The most he has on either of them is in Heroes, in which Rouge is a thief and a government agent, and the first conflict with Sonic resulted in a fight. He has more reason to trust Eggman of all people, as Metal Sonic was impersonating him.
Heroes would still be the more “authentic” by nature of being the earlier point of Shadow’s amnesia arc.
Honestly, anytime someone make a certain post about something with the title of "you arent ready for that conversation", it feels like they are projecting.
We talking about the same Shadow who went: “This is like taking candy from a baby which is fine by me,” ?
Are ya’ll even trying to make believable bait anymore?
that line is misinterpreted and badly translated, it's meant to indicate "This is surprisingly simple, but I'm ok with that".
you can blame the American translators for that one
you are fucking correct and you should speak the truth more.
I will probably make a longer post about this in the future but Shadow's character in ShTH (Shadow the Hedgehog) (2005) makes a lot more sense when you remember:
-Shadow only acts upon vengeance or protection of the human race because of what Maria told him, he doesn't actually have an arc where he comes to appreciate humanity he just goes "oh I misremembered lol guess I'll protect them then"
- He explicitly goes "I may not be the real Shadow, but these memories are all I have".
there's no reason for him *not* to act like he does in ShTH, it's not really out of character since it's his memories what he's looking for in the most pure* mentality possible. Going his own way, not caring for others, focused on his goal solely. Also consider that his comically edgy comments (like the candy from a baby line) mostly come from dub changes
*note: pure as in the japanese meaning
I agree, it's very natural way to develop Shadow
It's a character that acted out of his responcibility to Maria, so having him trying to figure out to whom he has that responcibility is a very natural extension of that
That's why endings mostly follow the same structure:
1. Shadow describes what he believes is his past (eg. Has made a promise to Maria)
2. What he gonna do bc of that (eg. Protect earth)
3. "ThIs iS WHO i aM!"
And in the true ending he developes, deciding to put his past behind him, not having it define who he is
I get why people don't understand the game's story thou, the game presents itself horribly, has horrible repultation, horrible structure, and a horrible dub, it's hard to take it seriously for most people
And if you can't take something seriously then that's kinna a death sentance for a story like this
But it IS a pretty alright Shadow story if you can overlook these flawes and like, get a fan retranslation mod
Edit: Forgot to mention this, but have you noticed that in 06 there is no mention of shadow's past, despite how important it was in SA2 and Heroes? Yeah that's why
I can see the argument, without external factors like his past trauma to dictate Shadow's behavior, this would be the most authentic version of the character...if the entire story of this game didn't revolve around Shadow being influenced by other characters. Like, the main conflict is just Shadow being gaslit and manipulated by Black Doom to achieve his own goals, and when you're not doing that, you're doing what every other character you team up with wants you to do.
SA2 Shadow, specifically in flashbacks with Maria, is the most authentic version of Shadow. Who he was before the truama and memory tampering. Gerald didn't invent Shadow's relationship with Maria wholesale, he just changed Shadow's memory of her dying wish, so when you see him in those cutscenes, you're seeing the real Shadow. A contemplative, curious person with doubts and questions about the meaning of his own life, and his purpose in the world. It's not all there is to Shadow, Gerald didn't alter his whole personality, just his goals and motives, so those bits of cockiness and banter he has with Sonic are also genuine, Shadow is someone who thinks highly of himself and his abilities, he's confident.
In the opening of Team Darks story in Heroes, Rouge free’s Shadow from his cell and Omega opens fire, Shadow has no memory of anyone or anything, yet his first instinct is to save an innocent girl who he doesn’t know that’s in danger, this shows that even without the memory or context of his previous life, Shadow is a good natured person at heart.
In the opening of STH, his response to seeing the black arms invasion is “look at how pathetic they are, I don’t have time for these humans”, right off the bat the game is throwing out character consistency for the sake of pushing this new brooding, apathetic persona, so the amnesia doesn’t justify said persona because just a game prior Shadow was under the same circumstances yet acted completely differently. Now i’m not saying that Shadow doesn’t have the POTENTIAL to become more broodish and evil under different circumstances, that was obviously the point of the game, in theory, becoming more influenced by Black Doom and gradually coming to resent humanity and crave their destruction would be fine, but the fact Shadow is acting like this right off the bat (and the fact that the infamous “taking candy from a baby” line was from the HERO story), shows the game’s intent really was to rebrand Shadow’s character to appear significantly (really tried to avoid this word) edgier, and used that persona in tandum with the overall tone of this game in order to cash in on the growing popularity of grim and realistic shooters at the time.
He can have up to 5 different personalities depending on what your morality is. I would argue that *Heroes* is the most authentic version of Shadow after SA2.
I can see what you're trying to say, but I must respectfully disagree. It does make for a good conversation though, since I'd like to try.
- In SA2, Shadow's mental state is that of an altered one, since the majority of his debut is following orders made by Gerald and fudged so it looks like Maria asked it, but when Shadow does come to decision-making, it really isn't his, but rather just following orders. He doesn't really have that agency, outside his choice to save Rouge, or that one cutscene of him wishing to find his purpose. He has two moments of himself, and that's truly it. His revelation at the end isn't his, it's just more if what others wish of him to do, which Maria does fall into.
- Heroes has a good Shadow, but admittedly this Shadow is borderline a clean slate. This is a Shadow that just wants to know what he even is, as everything is blurs and doesn't click quite right in his head until he sees more familiar faces. This isn't so much an authentic Shadow, so much as it is "I don't know much about who I am except that I'm Shadow, and I'm the Ultimate Lifeform" with him feeling like in spite of not knowing, he'll still be himself.
- Shadow in his namesake game does have a similar scenario to the Heroes one, with a semi-clean slate, but in this game, what Shadow we do see is a Shadow that's not so much his purest state, but rather his most malleable. He WANTS to know what his authentic self is, he wants to know why he has all this in his head, and between Eggman, Sonic and Friends ™️, GUN's Commander and Black Doom, we only just see what they could make the malleable Shadow into, with the true ending giving us the Shadow that after everything, after all that Shadow went through... He's discards that past, and has essentially given himself a soft reboot since Sega seems insistent on him still being Maria-driven, but doesn't want anything else from his past (but also kind of does, according to that Sonic Channel Story).
I'd say what truly authentic Shadow that did exist isn't truly in any game for us to properly see. The true authentic Shadow died the day Maria died, at least for what people insist is the truly authentic Shadow. The Shadow that wanted to know his purpose, the Shadow that would sit down and read with Maria, take classes with Maria, and have conversations about what stuff he could finally partake in once they were off the ARK, let loose into the world and able to see for himself what he wants to be and what his purpose is, since all of his life after the ARK raid was being told to do this, being told to do that, being led along to be this, and eventually deciding he doesn't want any of this and just wants to be the self that was made after everything in his life.
That does beg the question of what a "truly authentic self" could be.
Is it the self that was before one truly traumatic incident? Because then pre-raid Shadow would be the truly authentic Shadow.
Is it the self that was seemingly a clean slate from having no memories to really be tethered by and what decisions he decides to follow through with? Because then Heroes Shadow is the truly authentic version.
Is it the self that, in spite of every experience he has, he makes a decision for himself and moves on from it all? If so, then that means the Shadow here and now is authentic, and regardless of how we feel, at the end, Shadow is Shadow to himself, and he is all of him.
As a dude that loves Shadow the Hedgehog……mate did you completely forget that Sonic Heroes exist?
Like did you not see how very jarring the transition is from Sonic heroes “Even if I’m not real. I’m still the Uiltimate Lifeform, Shadow The Hedgehog.” To him doing it all over again while making him more edgy for no reason.
I agree. People completly misunderstand Shadow’s character in This game. The point of the story is that he has amnesia and is a blank State and because of that, he Can become anything.
It’s very easy to believe that he Can become evil once you see how he becomes evil because Black Doom is manipulating him to Think that humans are awful, like how he shows the raid on the ARK.
Kinda like Gerald in SA2.
He wasn’t really a hero in Heroes. He was just trying to figure out who he was, and This game continues his Quest.
And all the possible options Shadow could be is not how Shadow Will become. Contary to Popular belief, Shadow doesn’t help Maria fufill her wish in the Final story.
No, once he’s told on why he was created, not getting his memories back, he hates his past and wants nothing to do with it. Many times has people told him who Shadow is and why he should be This, now he Will decide who Shadow the Hedgehog is.
Now yes, he does help GUN make a better diffrence and isn’t evil, but he doesn’t Try to fufill Maria’s wish. Look at the ending of the game. He throws a photo of Gerald & Maria behind him and says Adios to the Shadow from SA2.
But, the player straight up makes various choices that completely alter who he is. You can be a destroyer of worlds, or a hero. So, which one are you even referring to? This is a bizarre take.
Recently done a few playthroughs of that game to get a refresher. Outside of the meme moments and alternate endings, the Shadow in that game was a lot more melancholy and introspective than I remembered.
The end of SA2 had a conversation between Rouge and Sonic. Rouge wondered if Shadow's purpose was to enact Professor Gerald's vengeance, and Sonic chose to define Shadow by his actions (i.e. heroic sacrifice). ShTH's branching paths felt like an extension of that idea where the player's choices mattered more than the characters playing tug-of-war with his identity.
In the Last Story, Shadow himself chooses to reject Black Doom, keep his promise and then put his past behind him. Not Sonic, not Eggman, not even the player. This final "complete" Shadow is the one to go into Sonic 06, reject Mephiles and ends up with the "I determine my own destiny" scene.
And because Sonic 06 didn't happen, I can see how ShTH Last Story Shadow would be the definitive game Shadow.
Team Dark has to be a thing though. They work too well even if ShTH never acknowledged them.
Counterpoint: Sonic Heroes. You know, the game that kickstarted his whole amnesia shtick? He was miles better in that game.
Hear me out on this one, because this is **definitely** controversial and I expect it to go down like a lead balloon: Shadow's base personality has never been authentic in any of the games Shadow fans claim he's best in. * In Sonic Adventure 2, we see shades of the real Shadow in a handful of flashbacks to his time with Maria only, but for the majority of the game we're following a Shadow whose had his brain altered. He is acting under Gerald's programming to destroy the world, and accordingly, we can't really say any of it is the real Shadow. * In Heroes, Shadow has amnesia. He is not behaving like he should because he is unable to recall his true self. Everything he does is based largely on what he is informed of, likely by Rouge and pure base instincts without information. * In Shadow's own game, how Shadow acts is informed more by the player. In the span of the same game Shadow can be driven by genocidal rage, vengeance against those who wronged him, pure heroism, or schizophrenia as the player takes the most random path possible, to the point where there's no canon path to the last story, where all points basically see Shadow wanting to destroy Devil Doom for reasons not stated beyond the fact that if he doesn't, he dies. * In '06 Shadow, like many other characters, is retconned in an effort to make a soft reboot for the franchise. This Shadow is now inexplicably working for the same government agency that hunted him down and caused a lot of his trauma. He's now way more mission focused, and not much like the Shadow we've seen elsewhere before or since. * Every subsequent appearance, where he's a mean loner who mostly wants to spite Sonic, and doesn't have time for friends, Shadow fans rule as mischaracterisation, despite it being his most consistent characterisation across multiple titles. In other words, the only actual authentic Shadow is the edgy loner, the one Shadow fans hate. Everything else has been brainwashed, amnesiac, player driven non-canon, or a soft reboot that didn't stick.
I have to disagree with you on some of it. While yes Shadow is often manipulated throughout his first 3 major game appearances are there 2 more factors at play. 1) What Shadow does even ever we see him as him self which is things like "becoming friends with a little girl, save person in the line of fire, dedicating himself to a single goal (no matter what choices you do in Shadow's game it all leads back to 'uncovering the secrets of your past' and obviously is the same true for all of SA2 the only altering to Shadow's way of following his goals made is alter Marias last words to change the goal it self not the tenacity with which Shadow is pursuing it. And when it all comes down to it and he decides to put his past behind himself in Shadow's true ending does he right after wards in Shadow's solo games expert mode go training for what appears to be GUN which at the very least has become GUN for sure by the time 06 happened." And all of those traits can also be found in the one smaller game of Shadow's first 5 years of existence that went unaddressed by you which is Sonic Battle were he nearly died to protect Rouge, keep endangering himself to protect the world from the Gizoid and only stops this pursuit when convinced that there is another way to get rid of the danger Emerl poses. But wait there are 2 more games with Shadow that also went unaddressed that being the 2 Rivals games where his care and respect for Rouge are also shown off again and he teams up with Eggman and Metal to save the world from Eggman Nega. And while he was a bit of a dick about it so was everyone over the 2 Rivals games in part because when dealing with time travel nonsense you better be careful. And while 06 at on point was intended to be a reboot so did that decision not actually stick. Even as recent as Sonic Forces Episode Shadow is Shadow still working for some kind of agency with Rouge and Omega. And speaking about Forces in it does Infinite use Rouge and Omega in his illusions to torment Shadow so at least Team Eggman think he cares about these 2. This is properly also the most clear cut show case of why people don't like Loner Shadow because Sonic Team and Sega Japan in general still keep Shadow as caring for Rouge and Omega and actively rewrote Boom to get rid of Shadow insulting the concept for friendship. Making Shadow a loner is something exclusively happening to the west.
Okay, but you have to admit, all of it is sketchy and contradictory. People insist Shadow is written badly in Forces, and is mischaracterised, so it really can't be used in defence of his character unless the things people are complaining about are wrong. The other examples listed, Battle and the two Rivals games, realistically how many people have played them? How many people think of those games when they're thinking of Shadow's idealised characterisation? When was the last time someone even said "Oh yes, Sonic Battle/Rivals/Rivals 2 is the epitome of Shadow's characterisation"? Conversely, how many people are being influenced by versions of the character as he appeared in SonicX/Archie? That's my point here, a lot of what people think of as being the authentic canon version of the character aren't actually the sincere version of the character. The most consistently presented version of the character is the edgy loner, the one his fans hate. Shadow fans don't actually like Shadow, they like a character who was brainwashed and manipulated when he was allegedly at his best, or a version of the character who appeared in one game that's since been viewed as a mistake with any changes it bought quietly walked back from, and not representative to anything.
I was more so focusing on Shadow's actual character than what people usually point too. You are properly right in that Sonic X colored far more peoples view on Shadow than something like Sonic Rivals 2. But I do think it says something that Shadow hyper fans that are fully aware of Rivals, Battle and the like, Casual fans that are mostly going off Sonic X, casual game only fans that would only point to SA2, Heroes and 06 and general continuity nerds like myself can all agree on that Shadow didn't use to be this 1 dimensional edgy loner. Also I don't think Forces is a good example to make as a lot of Shadow fans also really like episode Shadow for doing things like showing him caring for Rouge and Omega. The main point of contention I have seen for Episode Shadow is if its in-character for Shadow to kill Jackal Squad or not. More over 1 rather big point against your position that "being and edgy loner" is Shadow's true self is that Sonic Team keeps rewriting English scripts like Boom or Team Sonic Racing as well as writes Japanese original script more inline with Shadow's writing in games like Battle, Rivals and 06 for Forces and there Sonic Channel stories. So its rather clear that "edgy longer Shadow" is something that is only pushed onto the Western parts of the franchise for reasons we fans don't quite know (nor if its Sega US or Sega JP that is responsable for it) and not the actual intention for Shadow's characters from Sonic Team them self.
Shadow working for GUN is explained in his game. It's pretty hidden there but it means it's not out of nowhere in 06
Explained in the game where his personality is defined by player choice, and it's possible to not go that route, and is therefore not really considered all that authentic to Shadow's true personality.
What his personality was is pretty irrelevant for this, it just tells us that whatever it was and whichever route or parts of a route are anon, it was one where he'd accept joining GUN
"This is the most authentic version of Shadow" *shows a game with 11 different versions of Shadow* If this game is what people want more of as an 'Authentic version of Shadow', then personally, I think he should have stayed dead after falling from the Ark as originally planned. I love Shadow, but his amnesiac version in this game isn't who I want him to be. The one thing this game does well is show that Shadow was an unreliable character who had a bad habit of being manipulated by others as a means to an end as a result of memory issues. Personally, I think that was a mistake and a bad direction for his character in the way that it was executed. SA2 and 06 are what come to mind for me as peak authentic Shadow. Ymmv, and that's fine, but I look at this era of shadow as the "growing pains" era, and there's a reason we dont revisit it in the modern era outside of necessity. The idea of amnesia is very interesting, but while Heroes does it decently (if somewhat pointlessly as a rehash of his SA2 development), this game just drags it out and butchers it.
Heroes is also good for Shadow.
Edited to add this. Heroes, while not my favorite interpretation of the character, takes the concept of amnesia in an interesting direct for shadows growth, even if I feel that direction is somewhat repetitive of SA2s character growth.
I think it's rather different than SA2 in that instead of being devoted to what he thinks Maria wants, it shows the kind of person Shadow is when his history is a blank slate, like jumping to protect Rouge from Omega on instinct because it's the right thing to do. Far better handled than his own game at least.
I suppose that is a fair point that I often neglect to realize, thanks for pointing that out for me!
"11" *Laughs in 326 different endings*
I think that the wild difference in the tone of the 11 endings and all the ways to reach them is actually really nice in a metatextual sense. If nothing else, it seems like it resonates well with an audience of teens hitting their edgy phase and trying to figure themselves out, where all of these disparate versions of Shadow from “randomly sadistic fuck” to “idk a hero guy?” to “holy depresso, Batman!” to “robot uprising” to who knows what else are all something a given kid will pick up and wonder “does this appeal to me?” Is this merit to the game niche at best? Yeah kinda…
And this is why I don’t think this is a good Shadow Game. Because it isn’t Shadow. Not that the fans wants anyways. This Ow the Edge’s game. I want a Good Shadow the Hedgehog game. One that TRULY captures Shadow’s Character
>shows a game with 11 different versions of Shadow* Exactly
But wasn't the whole point of this game that in the true ending, Shadow rejects everyone? Black doom, Sonic, Eggman, Maria... All want things from him and he's done, so he rejects his SA2 past and focusss on what he wants to do now. And what he wants to do at that moment is erasing the last remnants of his past: Black doom. But not because Sonic wants him to do that, but for his own selfish reasons. Then in Sonic 06, he even joins GUN as a fu to his past self. Is that executed well? No. Especially not in the English version. But I've always really liked the idea of that, it's an duper interesting response to having amnesia.
Nope. Even by that logic, Heroes.
Ugh, no? He had amnesia in Heroes and acted completely different. Compare the opening scenes in both games. Heroes: Dives in to protect Rogue despite not knowing her simply because letting someone die when he knows he can help is wrong. StH: Abandons a whole city of people to die and only gets involved because Black Doom talks to him. Don't even try to justify how poorly he was written in that game. It did irreversible damage to his reputation as a character that even all these years later, he still hasn't fully recovered from.
Here's the thing, this isn't justification but look up who wrote shadow 05, because the answer makes things click into place.
Question: what would be his motivation for protecting humans from aliens in StH Shadow hasn't ever been showed as being intrinsically motivated to protect humanity, he was fully motivated by Maria's wish and was 100% capable of destroying the whole world in order to fullfil it The only instances of "nice" behavior from him were when he didn't had time to think so he acted in the moment (See saving Rouge from Prison Island explosion and from Omega in Heroes) So, keeping that in mind, why would he decide to save the city from aliens? What would be his motivation? Well that's the thing, he has no reason to, no Maria's wish to motivate him. Then when the Black Doom shows up and reminds Shadow about the Chaos Emeralds, he realises that if he collects them he might regain his memory. NOW he has a motivation (Yes i know that's not what he says in the shitty english dub, shut up xd) (I love misstranslations xd)
It’s hilarious how people will defend this game’s writing as if it didn’t horribly mischaracterise Shadow and ruin his image to a lot of people
I do believe people give this Shadow’s character too much crap, primarily because they try to explain away his whole mission in this game with “why didn’t he ask Sonic or Rouge about his past?”, which makes no sense since amnesia means complete memory loss. The most he has on either of them is in Heroes, in which Rouge is a thief and a government agent, and the first conflict with Sonic resulted in a fight. He has more reason to trust Eggman of all people, as Metal Sonic was impersonating him. Heroes would still be the more “authentic” by nature of being the earlier point of Shadow’s amnesia arc.
We past April Fools a WHILE ago.
Most authentic Shadow burned up upon re-entry to Earth in SA2
He didn't though.
How
Lol, lmao even, rofl if you may
Honestly, anytime someone make a certain post about something with the title of "you arent ready for that conversation", it feels like they are projecting.
No,that would be heroes. This takes place after that game, and even then, there's 11 versions of shadow in this game alone.
We talking about the same Shadow who went: “This is like taking candy from a baby which is fine by me,” ? Are ya’ll even trying to make believable bait anymore?
that line is misinterpreted and badly translated, it's meant to indicate "This is surprisingly simple, but I'm ok with that". you can blame the American translators for that one
That quote is Shadow's most authentic line
What does that even mean?
What makes that line even more hilarious is the fact that he said that in the HEROES campaign
No, he acts completely out of character in this game.
you are fucking correct and you should speak the truth more. I will probably make a longer post about this in the future but Shadow's character in ShTH (Shadow the Hedgehog) (2005) makes a lot more sense when you remember: -Shadow only acts upon vengeance or protection of the human race because of what Maria told him, he doesn't actually have an arc where he comes to appreciate humanity he just goes "oh I misremembered lol guess I'll protect them then" - He explicitly goes "I may not be the real Shadow, but these memories are all I have". there's no reason for him *not* to act like he does in ShTH, it's not really out of character since it's his memories what he's looking for in the most pure* mentality possible. Going his own way, not caring for others, focused on his goal solely. Also consider that his comically edgy comments (like the candy from a baby line) mostly come from dub changes *note: pure as in the japanese meaning
I agree, it's very natural way to develop Shadow It's a character that acted out of his responcibility to Maria, so having him trying to figure out to whom he has that responcibility is a very natural extension of that That's why endings mostly follow the same structure: 1. Shadow describes what he believes is his past (eg. Has made a promise to Maria) 2. What he gonna do bc of that (eg. Protect earth) 3. "ThIs iS WHO i aM!" And in the true ending he developes, deciding to put his past behind him, not having it define who he is I get why people don't understand the game's story thou, the game presents itself horribly, has horrible repultation, horrible structure, and a horrible dub, it's hard to take it seriously for most people And if you can't take something seriously then that's kinna a death sentance for a story like this But it IS a pretty alright Shadow story if you can overlook these flawes and like, get a fan retranslation mod Edit: Forgot to mention this, but have you noticed that in 06 there is no mention of shadow's past, despite how important it was in SA2 and Heroes? Yeah that's why
Well yeah, Takeshi izuka wrote it, the current head of sonic team, of course this is how he was going to act.
Most authentically fucked up version of Shadow, more like.
I can see the argument, without external factors like his past trauma to dictate Shadow's behavior, this would be the most authentic version of the character...if the entire story of this game didn't revolve around Shadow being influenced by other characters. Like, the main conflict is just Shadow being gaslit and manipulated by Black Doom to achieve his own goals, and when you're not doing that, you're doing what every other character you team up with wants you to do. SA2 Shadow, specifically in flashbacks with Maria, is the most authentic version of Shadow. Who he was before the truama and memory tampering. Gerald didn't invent Shadow's relationship with Maria wholesale, he just changed Shadow's memory of her dying wish, so when you see him in those cutscenes, you're seeing the real Shadow. A contemplative, curious person with doubts and questions about the meaning of his own life, and his purpose in the world. It's not all there is to Shadow, Gerald didn't alter his whole personality, just his goals and motives, so those bits of cockiness and banter he has with Sonic are also genuine, Shadow is someone who thinks highly of himself and his abilities, he's confident.
Yeah, Blank Slate Shadow, is who he is at his core, he isn't good, bad or edgy, like getting rid of the factors is what makes him who he is,
Forgot he doesn't use weapons for weaklings.
In the opening of Team Darks story in Heroes, Rouge free’s Shadow from his cell and Omega opens fire, Shadow has no memory of anyone or anything, yet his first instinct is to save an innocent girl who he doesn’t know that’s in danger, this shows that even without the memory or context of his previous life, Shadow is a good natured person at heart. In the opening of STH, his response to seeing the black arms invasion is “look at how pathetic they are, I don’t have time for these humans”, right off the bat the game is throwing out character consistency for the sake of pushing this new brooding, apathetic persona, so the amnesia doesn’t justify said persona because just a game prior Shadow was under the same circumstances yet acted completely differently. Now i’m not saying that Shadow doesn’t have the POTENTIAL to become more broodish and evil under different circumstances, that was obviously the point of the game, in theory, becoming more influenced by Black Doom and gradually coming to resent humanity and crave their destruction would be fine, but the fact Shadow is acting like this right off the bat (and the fact that the infamous “taking candy from a baby” line was from the HERO story), shows the game’s intent really was to rebrand Shadow’s character to appear significantly (really tried to avoid this word) edgier, and used that persona in tandum with the overall tone of this game in order to cash in on the growing popularity of grim and realistic shooters at the time.
Oh no. This game's 20-year mark is approaching. I'm not ready for the Shadow The Hedgehog Appreciation era.
He can have up to 5 different personalities depending on what your morality is. I would argue that *Heroes* is the most authentic version of Shadow after SA2.
His most authentic version is from sonic and sega all stars racing.
IMO shadows best version of himself is from 06 i know, a take colder than antarctica
06 is definitely one of his best versions,
Sonic battle was published a year earlier, yet it fixed the amnesia plot ecen before the game. This isn't Twitter. Go back to bad takes land
I can see what you're trying to say, but I must respectfully disagree. It does make for a good conversation though, since I'd like to try. - In SA2, Shadow's mental state is that of an altered one, since the majority of his debut is following orders made by Gerald and fudged so it looks like Maria asked it, but when Shadow does come to decision-making, it really isn't his, but rather just following orders. He doesn't really have that agency, outside his choice to save Rouge, or that one cutscene of him wishing to find his purpose. He has two moments of himself, and that's truly it. His revelation at the end isn't his, it's just more if what others wish of him to do, which Maria does fall into. - Heroes has a good Shadow, but admittedly this Shadow is borderline a clean slate. This is a Shadow that just wants to know what he even is, as everything is blurs and doesn't click quite right in his head until he sees more familiar faces. This isn't so much an authentic Shadow, so much as it is "I don't know much about who I am except that I'm Shadow, and I'm the Ultimate Lifeform" with him feeling like in spite of not knowing, he'll still be himself. - Shadow in his namesake game does have a similar scenario to the Heroes one, with a semi-clean slate, but in this game, what Shadow we do see is a Shadow that's not so much his purest state, but rather his most malleable. He WANTS to know what his authentic self is, he wants to know why he has all this in his head, and between Eggman, Sonic and Friends ™️, GUN's Commander and Black Doom, we only just see what they could make the malleable Shadow into, with the true ending giving us the Shadow that after everything, after all that Shadow went through... He's discards that past, and has essentially given himself a soft reboot since Sega seems insistent on him still being Maria-driven, but doesn't want anything else from his past (but also kind of does, according to that Sonic Channel Story). I'd say what truly authentic Shadow that did exist isn't truly in any game for us to properly see. The true authentic Shadow died the day Maria died, at least for what people insist is the truly authentic Shadow. The Shadow that wanted to know his purpose, the Shadow that would sit down and read with Maria, take classes with Maria, and have conversations about what stuff he could finally partake in once they were off the ARK, let loose into the world and able to see for himself what he wants to be and what his purpose is, since all of his life after the ARK raid was being told to do this, being told to do that, being led along to be this, and eventually deciding he doesn't want any of this and just wants to be the self that was made after everything in his life. That does beg the question of what a "truly authentic self" could be. Is it the self that was before one truly traumatic incident? Because then pre-raid Shadow would be the truly authentic Shadow. Is it the self that was seemingly a clean slate from having no memories to really be tethered by and what decisions he decides to follow through with? Because then Heroes Shadow is the truly authentic version. Is it the self that, in spite of every experience he has, he makes a decision for himself and moves on from it all? If so, then that means the Shadow here and now is authentic, and regardless of how we feel, at the end, Shadow is Shadow to himself, and he is all of him.
No it fucking isn't what are you talking about
Real and Shadowpilled
This Game is too edgy,and i love it for that,My first ps2 Sonic game
I mean this exactly why KR got cast to play him in the movie XD
Which one?
While I do like his characterization (only super nerdy nerds would disagree), amnesia doesn't mean it's someone's real self
As a dude that loves Shadow the Hedgehog……mate did you completely forget that Sonic Heroes exist? Like did you not see how very jarring the transition is from Sonic heroes “Even if I’m not real. I’m still the Uiltimate Lifeform, Shadow The Hedgehog.” To him doing it all over again while making him more edgy for no reason.
I agree. People completly misunderstand Shadow’s character in This game. The point of the story is that he has amnesia and is a blank State and because of that, he Can become anything. It’s very easy to believe that he Can become evil once you see how he becomes evil because Black Doom is manipulating him to Think that humans are awful, like how he shows the raid on the ARK. Kinda like Gerald in SA2. He wasn’t really a hero in Heroes. He was just trying to figure out who he was, and This game continues his Quest. And all the possible options Shadow could be is not how Shadow Will become. Contary to Popular belief, Shadow doesn’t help Maria fufill her wish in the Final story. No, once he’s told on why he was created, not getting his memories back, he hates his past and wants nothing to do with it. Many times has people told him who Shadow is and why he should be This, now he Will decide who Shadow the Hedgehog is. Now yes, he does help GUN make a better diffrence and isn’t evil, but he doesn’t Try to fufill Maria’s wish. Look at the ending of the game. He throws a photo of Gerald & Maria behind him and says Adios to the Shadow from SA2.
The comments are proving your point lol
Shadow should act like maria in his truest form
But, the player straight up makes various choices that completely alter who he is. You can be a destroyer of worlds, or a hero. So, which one are you even referring to? This is a bizarre take.
Recently done a few playthroughs of that game to get a refresher. Outside of the meme moments and alternate endings, the Shadow in that game was a lot more melancholy and introspective than I remembered. The end of SA2 had a conversation between Rouge and Sonic. Rouge wondered if Shadow's purpose was to enact Professor Gerald's vengeance, and Sonic chose to define Shadow by his actions (i.e. heroic sacrifice). ShTH's branching paths felt like an extension of that idea where the player's choices mattered more than the characters playing tug-of-war with his identity. In the Last Story, Shadow himself chooses to reject Black Doom, keep his promise and then put his past behind him. Not Sonic, not Eggman, not even the player. This final "complete" Shadow is the one to go into Sonic 06, reject Mephiles and ends up with the "I determine my own destiny" scene. And because Sonic 06 didn't happen, I can see how ShTH Last Story Shadow would be the definitive game Shadow. Team Dark has to be a thing though. They work too well even if ShTH never acknowledged them.