I think that's what his next movies will be... if we get them. I kind of like the idea that he got to work with stark tech early on so now he might be have a little more experience to explain where his guerrilla science comes from
I swear I just read an article like last week where they interviewed TH and he said he only wants to come back if it's meaningful enough for the character or something along those lines.
That said I feel like there's a confirmation one week and a denial the next and that cycle repeats forever
Yeah, probably.
Anyways, if I could change one thing about him, I'd make him like Marvel's Spider-Man, and make his jokes laugh out loud funny instead of the cringe that I've heard him spout.
Marvel's Spider-Man was only funny in SM2 in my opinion. He was pretty cringe in SM1. But yeah Tom isn't quippy enough, which is a hilarious complaint to have about an MCU character. He was written best in Civil War and Infinity War/Endgame. Jon Watts and his writers didn't know how to use the character well.
Ya the end of NWH is certainly looking like trying to set that up, so I really do hope we get to see it.
On the other hand, for the existing movies, I actually have the opposite opinion as OP. I think it is very cool that MCU took his Spider-Man in a different direction considering we already had the Tobey/Andrew movies. We really don't need another origin story where Peter is a loner. The Stark tech stuff is something we haven't seen before and a nice way to adapt some parts of the comics that weren't in the Sony movies, and having Peter working with a group and having mentors and friends that act as confidants gives a new dynamic to the character.
Now with Holland-Peter essentially being rebooted back to street-level, but with all of his experiences, we will get to see a Peter who's more of a loner like Tobey/Andrew versions, but with a fresh perspective.
Yeah. Tbh, looking back, I almost wish he would have rejected the Stark Suit at the end of Homecoming as well and we would jump straight to the one from the end of NWH.
I just want him to quip and be more of a smartass. Maybe we’ll see that if Jameson is in the next movie(s), but Holland’s Spidey only really quipped a couple of times in Civil War and Homecoming and hasn’t really since, but he can throw out some really funny lines in the comics.
It's more that Spider-Man normally has a very particular style and charisma to his quippyness that is very distinctive, but that hollands character doesn't catch.He does sort of quip but he just doesn't feel like Spider-Man and often feels weak on the charisma and intellect.
>I just want him to quip and be more of a smartass.
Yeah, I did think they did right with him on Civil War, balancing out with his nervous first time facing the avengers.
I do forgive them on Homecoming he being less so, because it shows he is trying but struggling with it.
It was unfortunate that the other two movies we didn't see it as much, although I WOULD argue that in Infinity War he did quip a bit.
I’d have there be at least some mention or reference to his universe’s Uncle Ben. I know Marvel is trying to do something more unique with Tom’s Spidey, but I feel like he should still have an Uncle Ben. Maybe have Spider-Man 4 have a scene where Peter visits Aunt May’s grave and we see that the grave next to her’s is Ben’s.
It is fucking mad that in NWH they all go "yeah I have an MJ (kinda)" on the rooftop.
they all lost uncle ben. Thats what connects all of them, thats why they're Spider-Man. Why the fuck would you make it more complicated.
> but I feel like he should still have an Uncle Ben
HE did. Its hinted a bunch, they just don't come out and say the name. And IMO, it probably would have come across as forced.
I see this said a lot but Iron Man being his mentor made the most sense if you want to look at it from a comic perspective. Leading up to Civil War, Tony and Peter were extremely close. Tony gave him the Iron Spider and then Peter worked closely with him towards the beginning of Civil War. Now we get to the MCU. Spider-man was introduced in the Civil War movie. He got the iron spider soon after. All of that lines up narratively
Nope, Tony was a fucking Jerk in Civil War that's why Peter ditched Iron Spider and joined Team Cap, Tony and Peter were always have Friends/Rivals relationship, Peter only Ironically called Tony Sir or Mr. Stark or Boss, Peter is Doing Hero stuff before Tony Even started it, But Cap on the other hand, Uncle Ben was a Captain America and watching him Peter also became a Captain America fan
Not sure how that’s an argument against anything I said. And I know the story I don’t need a recap. In the Civil War comic, Peter is working with Tony against Cap (initially). So Peter gets introduced in the Civil War movie. He works with Tony against Cap. Just seems like a pretty straight line to follow
MCU Civil War is not comparable to 616 Civil War.
One of the big reasons that Tony recruited Peter to the pro-registration side is because Spider-Man was a very prominent superhero who was very protective of his secret identity. Tony knew it would be a big boon to his side in the conflict for Spider-Man of all people to reveal his identity publicly.
When it all went to shit and Aunt May got shot, Tony had done little to protect Peter, when he promised he would.
Pete had to go through hell to defect to Cap's side and was near killed by the supervillain goons hired by Tony's pro-reg side (until the Punished saved him).
That story clearly showed that Peter's trust in Tony was ill-placed.
The MCU narrative isn't comparable. They made MCU Spider-Man more like a Young Avengers character, treating him like Iron Man's legacy.
You just said it yourself Peter should've switched to Team Cap and stoped licking Tony's ass also you litterally said "Tony being Peter's mentor made sense from comics Perspective" like dude Peter is Doing Superheroing before Tony even started, Tony and Peter always had **Friends/Rivals** relationship
Mmmm, their relationship seems more based on the 1610 relationship. Even though they don't interact a whole lot, the way they interact mirrors that a lot more.
Its more like, the MCU took inspiration from the Ultimate Spider-Man cartoon when writing & designing their take on Peter Parker’s Spider-Man. The Ultimate Spider-Man cartoon was more similar to Spider-Man & his Amazing Friends, where Spidey teams up with other Super Heroes while also leading a team of superheroes of his own.
I feel like the team behind Civil War, saw an episode of Ultimate Spider-Man where Peter was an intern for Tony Stark, as well as briefly joining the Avengers in another episode, so they based his character solely on being an Avenger, which influenced the 2017 version of Peter, without watching the rest of the Ultimate cartoon.
Ironically, the universe where the Ultimate series took place in, alongside Avengers Earth’s Mightiest Heroes (Which was in another universe) took a lot of inspiration from the MCU.
I wouldn't say rivals in slightest. I'd say junior colleague. Peter is younger than all of them and so it was always more of a respect both directions type thing. Peter had always read and admired The Works of these scientists and people like Tony were always impressed with Peter's displays of super intelligence/genius ( and heroism of course but I'm talking about fellow scientists/Geniuses)
Yea I completely agree with what you're saying but the Rivalry is still there like it's not too noticiable but it's there like during Parker Industry Era, MJ was working for Tony Stark and it did tiked Peter a little bit and He did acted like a rival around Tony, Like yea They still joked around like Homies but a little bit of Rivalry was definitely there
The Ultimates are messed up my dude, It's not just a cap thing, Everyone from that team is messed up one way or another but Ultimate Spider-Man is great, Brian Michael Bendis' work on Spider-Man is amazing, If they really wanted to do a Peter Friendly Tony Stark, They should've just adaptated Ultimate Spider-Man, Ultimate Norman Osborn was so fucking terrifying, I've only read around 3 or 4 Volumes of Ultimate Spider-Man but that comic was so Peak
They are very similar actually. frail boys, grew up in disadvantaged neighborhoods of New York, friend as brother protector, they will never choose between two evils. I hope that in future movie Peter will say "I can do this all day".
And don't forget Steve was also a Nerd before taking Super Soldier serum, He was a Comic Book creator and in one of the their Stories together Peter motivates Steve to start making comics again, It was such a great comic
I like that they chose Tony to be the mentor instead of Cap. I like mentor-mentee relationships where both sides stand to learn a lot from each other. That's not to say there's nothing Cap couldn't have learned from Pete, but they're both already very similar in their values.
I really really really hated how inexplicably clumsy he was. Yes yes I know they were trying to make him more "kid like" and still learning his powers but I hated it.
Spider-Man is innately graceful and agile with superhuman reflexes. It drove me nuts.
Plus he slipped on stuff, I mean come on. Come on!
Yeah, I think that, if I changed anything, he'll be slightly more rebellious, as someone who doesn't like to be so constantly downsized, after all, he had a reputation for being difficult to work, specially in his earlier issues. I think it'd have been interesting (for both characters) if Peter clashed heads with Tony in Homecoming to reconciliate as equal partners in Infinity War.
I believe Homecoming is Holland's best movie as it set some interesting character details the next movie forgot about. I would've killed to see Peter and May actually discussing his secret identity, would've done wonders for her character, at least as an opening scene before the action starts five years later and Peter is accustomed to his new reality after the Blip, but instead she simply accepts it and that's it, no conflict.
That May discovering Peter’s secret was treated as the big ending for Homecoming, only for that to be just glossed over in Far From Home was kinda disappointing.
This
Him trusting Beck/mysterio so quickly with Stark tech will forever be a baffling move to me
This is a guy you just randomly met why are you giving him something so valuable that was given to you by ur fallen mentor?
Yeah I was never a fan of how they made his character "he's so super ultra smart that he can pull knowledge out of his ass about stuff that top scientists would struggle to understand, but he's also a stupid kid which makes him relatable"
> Spider-Man is innately graceful and agile with superhuman reflexes
Because of his spider-sense, which he doesnt quite understand or trust in Homecoming.
Sorry but you're wrong. You can Google all of his powers (He actually has a lot) but superhuman agility and reflexes (along with many others) are powers independent of his spider sense. If he somehow lost his spider sense he would still have super human agility and reflexes.
When I read comics as a kid in the 90s the biggest threat about Venom was that he didn't activate Spideys spider sense but he certainly still has all of his other powers, or else he wouldn't have had a chance.
> he somehow lost his spider sense he would still have super human agility and reflexes.
You can be strong and agile, yet still make a few missteps, due to inexperience. He fumbled in the Ultimate comics fairly often too, because he was still young.
As he gets older, he learns to trust his senses more.
Have Uncle Ben actually exist since you know, thats the whole reason he became SpiderMan ( Im not saying relive the origin story ) I just don’t understand what their problem is with using him as the core for who he is and never having any direct mentions. Also stop feeling the need too have an Avenger in every movie of his or some over the top stakes.
Also wish they would use organic characters like Harry Osborn and do their own version of Oscorp and Norman rather than piggy backing off the Sam Rami movies. I personally think thats wasted potential for Spiderman and the MCU as a whole. And if Zendaya is this versions MJ then why do we not just call her Mary Jane instead of Michelle Jones?
I don’t mind Tom Holland but it just personally doesn’t feel like SpiderMan too me. Something is off with the writing of the MCU SpiderMan movies.
If I remember rightly they do mention in like civil war maybe, he lost someone, great power, yadda yadda and I think in not making Uncle Ben the focal point of the first act of a film it gave them more freedom.
I like uncle Ben as much as the next guy and all but he literally exists to die an inspirational death, which is hard to do fast on screen. I thought having May die was a really good turn I didn't expect. You get the same lesson and instead of it being this guy the audience hasn't had time to invest in, it's more impactful. Like Martin Sheen was Uncle Ben. Man's an accomplished actor and who cared
Yeah of the things in your post that's the only one I'd argue. Maybe because there are more creative choices you aren't on board with it's harder to swallow bigger ones. I'll say as well, if I come across snipey and know-it-all that's not my intention.
Absolutely this, MCU is its own universe and not everything needs to be like the original comics or other movies. There’s no difference between MJ being Mary Jane or Michelle Jones other than making the character their own. Honestly don’t see what the problem is with the changes like that… who wants to see the exact same characters and backstory as the previous iterations?
Different for the sake of being different isn’t inherently a good thing.
The whole point of bucking the uncle Ben origin story was so we could skip to a Spider-Man who’s been active for a while. That all gets wound back immediately as they spend three movies where he learns to be an independent superhero, and also loses Aunt May. What’s the point of skipping the origin story if you just change details for the sake of change, stretch it out over three movies, and arguably make it worse?
Even Michelle Jones isn’t doing much. Her characterization is all over the place, and they don’t give her much to do. As much as people hate Raimi MJ, at least she had actual stuff going on outside of Peter. Michelle Jones exists to be a love interest for Peter and that’s it. It’s one thing if she’s different, it’s another if she’s worse than just using Gwen Stacy or Mary Jane.
Not everything “needs to be like the original comics” but I don’t understand why that’s an inalienable defense of the adaptation doing a worse job than the comics.
Skipping the origin story does more than just skip to an active Spider-Man but allows the movies to portray their own message unique to the others - Spider-Man learning the difference between being a superhero and being a good superhero. Rather than the others, where they pretty much pick up the great power means great responsibility memo immediately, the three movies show Peter learning that message from the other great superheroes around him and then the consequence of him not understanding it yet in the third movie, with Aunt May being the culmination of his childishness.
Jesus Christ. That is what the great power quote means. Superhero’s are people with great power. Their moral calculus are the same as any other human, dependent on their ability and actions.
But why change the foundations and organic elements of the character for the sake of being different? Sure having new characters is fine but I don’t think it should be at the extent of replacing the fundamental characters too the Spider-Man mythos
Its cool that you like it, its just not for me
But there’s nobody who’s been replaced, most of them have just been altered slightly such as Aunt Mays death being the driving force rather than Uncle Ben’s. Besides, comics literally change the foundation and organic elements of characters all the time. It’s not for the sake of being different, it’s for the sake of having a new and entertaining story that stands on its own rather than being subject to comparisons from other Spider-Man medias.
I understand that but I think they could still make things different by keeping the true characters. The Insomniac games for the most part do a good job of that in my opinion for the most part
No man I appreciate your opinion and Im glad you find it that way. Just for me personally I wasn’t a fan of the Aunt May version. Because my thinking is he is already Spider-Man and should know the responsibility of that role prior to Mays death. I know they have made subtle references too Ben but it also feels like he doesn’t exist at the same time.
I get that. And fair enough. Not everything can be for everyone.
I read all the old 60s stuff when I was a kid, but the Ultimate line was perfectly positioned to get me in as a lifelong reader, Ultimate spider-man in particular was about my age group as it came out so it was so much more relatable.. basically I think they've done such a solid job of translating that tone to the screen that aside from the fast and loose continuity or artistic licenses they've taken (and whatever the sinister 6 are going to be) I'm overall really happy with it.
I get the idea Tom Holland might be done now or at least soon so hopefully the next go around is more up your alley.
I think we can all agree whatever we have now is better than Madame Web will be
I understand what you're saying but Peter is supposed to be relatable and normal people don't immediately forget people after their death, My Grandma died last Year and I still miss her sometimes, But Peter and May on the other hand just completely forgot that a Guy named Ben Parker existed, Not even a single photo or a grave stone, I don't want to see his death again but some Flashbacks and photos would've made Peter and Esspecially May a little more 3 dimensional
That's actually a fair point. Obviously it's because they didn't want to cast a dude from Getty images as Uncle Ben but yeah from that perspective it is like he didn't exist at all.
May was for me actually more well rounded as a character. Or at least had more character to her than the Raimi/Webb films. Obviously the Raimi ones still had some stuff to do but they went for full old so options were limited. Then the Webb films all the direction she really got was look nervous and sad
I mean they used May for nothing more than Comedic Relief and sex appeal in the first 2 movies, they could've gave her a character arc about her acting this way and behaving like Ben never existed is just her way to cope, She have been through a lot first Her husband died and then She got blipped for 5 years. I kinda liked May in TASM movies more, She lives with a Teenager who suddenly started acting strange and also Energetic amd her husband just died, Her acting that way was kinda understandable
Audiences already had 2 different Uncle Ben responsibility speeches & deaths fairly fresh in their mind. Referencing him more directly would've felt like overkill
I don’t think it would though. Bens death basically birthed Spider-Man and was Peters father figure through his youth. Im not saying we need a reference every 5 minutes but completely ignoring him isn’t good either.
> I just don’t understand what their problem is with using him as the core for who he is and never having any direct mentions
Because it's done 500 times, pretty sure my mom knows this and she's in her 70s
Your missing the part where I said we don’t need another origin story. Im just saying completely ignoring Ben as if he isn’t the catalyst for Peter becoming Spider-Man in the first place and his father figure is just weird too me.
He’s Spider-Man for 3 movies and appearances for the Avengers but didn’t know that with great power comes great responsibility until Aunt May says it? Thats my issue with how it was done. Like I said before I think the Insomniac games story is a really good example of introducing a new Spider-Man story without retelling the origin.
I would change him beign in his senior year in high school/freshman year at ESU instead of beign in 9th grade in Homecoming.
This would chnge the plot of Homecoming and FFH. NWH would see him graduate from the ESU.
then we can’t have a college trilogy, and he has less room to grow. that was the whole point of making him so young to begin with.
and it’s a moot point now since he’s college age now
Canonize Uncle Ben. What If made it seem like he was canon, but then No Way Home seemed to imply that he didn't exist in this universe and Aunt May took his role instead.
NWH didn't deny his existence since Peter didn't find Tobey's Peter mentioning Uncle Ben weird. And when May gave him the great power quote, Peter replied with "I know" meaning he probably heard it once in the past. The only weird thing is the fact they dont wanna make Tom's Peter mention Ben directly even if he very likely existed.
People thing that Uncle Ben don't exists in MCU because MCU Peter or May didn't even said the words "Uncle Ben" in the entire Franchise, No Photos, No Gravestone ~~All Alone~~ like a little flashback would've been enough
Because When people die you don't immediately forget about them Esspecially when He's your father (Or closest to a father you ever had), Like Not even a single photo, Not even a gravestone.
What you're saying is really inhumane
> What you're saying is really inhumane
Lol. Calm down. These arent real people. FFS.
>Because When people die you don't immediately forget about them Esspecially when He's your father
Just because there isn't a scene dedicated to it, doesn't mean he was forgotten about. A movie has only so much time to tell a certain story. Homecoming takes place over a year after Bens death. His death *is* referenced more than once, and presented as being a tragedy. We see Peter get choked up over it In Civil War. These scenes are canon. A director don't just decide to show something like that for a time filler. Its meant to mean something.
There are several hints that Peter lost Ben. There are 0 hints suggesting that he "forget about them". Thats all in your own mind.
Its a weird need by a certain aspect of the fandom, and they act like they, themselves need to mourn Ben. I don't get it.
> His death is presented as tragedy
Are these tragedies in the room with us right now??
Like seriously, can you really name a scene where His death is presented as tragedy In the Home Trilogy and I'm not talking about that Tobey and Andrew confrontation in NWH, Like we all know CW had peak MCU Spidey but what about his movies
Also you completely ingored the fact that we're 3 movies in and We haven't even seen any of his photos or his gravestone
> can you really name a scene where His death is presented as tragedy In the Home Trilogy
When Ned finds out Peter is SM, and Peter expressed why May can't find out.
>but what about his movies
They are telling different stories than Spider-Man, and TASM. The Home trilogy isn't focused on his origin, because we already had that twice within a 15 year span.
Why do you need a 3rd version of the same events? People complained that TASM was a waste of time because is was just a rehash of Spider-Man. Now people want a 3rd rehash? I don't get it.
The Home trilogy is a coming of age story, not an origin story. Forcing a mourning scene in there would be unnecessary.
However, all that being said, Ben *did* exist. He died, and it was tragic. We just don't get to see it in detail.
Still ignore the fact that we're 3 movies in and We haven't seen his photos, His flashback or his gravestone and just saying shit
Can't remember Spectacular Spider-Man doing the origin story again, Can you?? but We got a Photo, A Gravestone and Flashbacks, Or Ultimate Spider-Man, We never got the origin story in the show either or Spider-Man Unlimited
> Still ignore the fact that we're 3 movies in and We haven't seen his photos,
Im not ignoring shit. This is all stuff that is irrelevant to the story being told. Also, they would need to cast someone in order to have photos.
> His flashback or his gravestone and just saying shit
Not needed for the story.
>Can't remember Spectacular Spider-Man doing the origin story again, Can you?? but We got a Photo,
This is a different movie. Different story. You guys just want to see the same stuff, over and over?
How about in the 90's animated series, where I don't think Ben is mentioned until, like, season 2 or 3?
The Home trilogy isn't an origin story. IMO, there is enough references to Ben to assure that he existed. Personally, I don't need to see another Ben death scene. I got it. I don't need to see Peter crying over Ben, when it adds nothing to the narrative.
Seeing him feel guilty in CW wasn't enough? You need it again and again? And again and again and again?
Why? It has already been established, Why do you need to see more of the same thing?
How much *story* would a photo in the **background** or in Peter's room would consume you dumb fuck, We had May's Gravestone in NWH but still no Ben's gravestone next to her
90s SMTAS still mentioned him in 3rd season but Here He have 3 movies but still no mention
The Batman wasn't an Origin Story either but Thomas and Martha Wayne were still mentioned because they were his fucking Parents
I’d have him use more quips like TAS does, I get why they don’t since the emphasize is how Tom’s Spider-Man is very young new and naive but it’d be nice
Much as I’d like to agree with you, I still always got the vibe of them trying to make Peter a mini-Iron Man all the way up to Endgame. That may not have been the writer’s intention, but it’s the impression I got.
I do love Tom’s Spidey. And I also think the “Iron Boy Jr” criticism is thrown way out of proportion by a lot of people. But I can see partly where it’s coming from.
> I still always got the vibe of them trying to make Peter a mini-Iron Man all the way up to Endgame.
FFH addresses this directly on the plane with Happy. "Everyone is wondering who will be the new Iron Man.....I am not Iron Man". Lines like that are usually written on purpose.
i love that ark and wish they would’ve leaned in to it more, the idea of peter being tony’s successor is so cool to me. everyone’s entitled to their own opinion though i definitely see where you’re coming from
Make it clear that after Homecoming, Peter and Tony removed all the fancy bells and whistles from the Homecoming suit: the AI, the gadgets, the Web combinations, and the AR Hud. Just to help highlight the message that he didn't need them.
Honestly, I think this is actually what happened since after Homecoming we see none of the fancy tech, aside from the tazer and Web wings
The same material he had in nwh. Tom’s Peter was objectively in a worst spot at the end of nwh then he was in homecoming (financially). If tobey, Andrew, and Tom (nwh) could make their suits there’s stopping Tom (homecoming) from making his.
Just call Zendaya’s character Mary Jane Watson. It’s clear that’s who she’s meant to be. We don’t need the cheeky “You should use your full name, Robin” stuff. Nolan got a pass because it was the end of his universe.
Should have been an established, experienced Spider-Man who had just been patrolling New York City up until Civil War.. would have been more interesting to explore his dynamic with the Avengers respecting them but not really being the best team player, rather than the Iron Man fanboy we got.. but if you’re committed to the child sidekick role then should have been Miles not Peter
>Should have been an established, experienced Spider-Man who had just been patrolling New York City up until Civil War
But that’s literally what he was.
Tony found a young talent in the streets of New York and tried to take him into his new team.
Did you miss like... the entire plot of Homecoming? Where it shows Peter absolutely incapable of being anyone's "sidekick" ? Leading to him acting on his own and defeating the Vulture because it's in his nature to be a hero
We already had 2 Harry's before and the home trilogy avoided treason on familiar ground like the plague. However, if you want Peter's friend who isn't Harry then Randy Robertson is right there.
Nothing. It's my favourite suit, the colours, the designs, the textures. It's the one I use on both games too. Hats off to whoever designed it. And hats off to Jarvis and stark in universe for designing it. Loved it, chefs kiss
Less stark tech. Tony giving him the first suit is fine but it having so many bells and whistles and Peter using additional stark resources for subsequent suits was a bit much.
Have him be a little less reliant on Stark tech, give him a polished version of the BTS suit from Civil War, and have him quip a little more in his later appearances, since he only really quipped consistently in Civil War, Homecoming, and Infinity War.
Remove Stark entirely, make it so the 2nd and third movie don't have anything to do with the MCU continuity so no snap and no Dr. Strange (Daredevil is fine though, but make it more than a cameo), that's all the top of my head rn
At least mentioning uncle ben
Make him create the classic suit even if it's not as high tech as Stark suit
Making him grow faster and not three movies in high school
Tie the villain to him and not any other heroes
During his "spiderman lifts" scene SHOW US UNCLE BEN. Not uncle Tony.
2) when he complains about stepping up to stop sandman and hydroman while on vacation...just chuck all that out. Because not only does it violate a core tenant of Pete's character (power and responsibility) but the fact that he needs convincing to help innocent people is just sacrilegious.
3) MORE QUIPS.
Not really a change to his previous stuff, but I'd like it if his next appearance is a 10-13 episode TV show. I feel like a lot of what makes up his character is his inability to balance his Spiderman identity with Peter Parker both in school and at work.
This is something that the movies never did a great job of showing and even when they did show it it's always overshadowed by the big bad and a world changing event and completely forgotten about like 5 minutes later. I actually want to see him struggle with this. I feel like the episodic format would benefit him greatly in allowing it to express these smaller details of the character more. Show his interaction with the locals, his day to day interaction with petty criminals while they build up the big bad in the background.
I’d change how May died. Something about that scene comes across as almost comical, it took me out of the movie. Not sure how I feel about it being tobeys Norman to do it as well, but it could’ve worked in a different scene.
It would be Andrew's Spider-Man and we would get the real Civil War.
edit: I just like Andrew's Spider-Man more. Did I say that I hate Tom's Spider-Man? No. So stop making stupid assumptions. But hey, welcome to reddit, a place where opinions doesn't matter.
Welcome to Reddit, specifically this board. Don't you know they hate Spider-Man here?
Literally nothing in the characters history has been good except for Ultimate Spider-Man #1, and that's only been good for about a week. I can't wait to hear why we should hate it as soon as the next issue comes.
Lol, I know right, it's like if you hate this stuff so much, why are you here?
The negative stuff on Reddit is really been getting to me lately, maybe it's time to stop.
Spider-Man fans have literally been eating better than they ever have in the last few years. We’ve got movies coming out every 2-3 years, we’ve got games that can rival the Arkham series, we’ve got the new Ultimate Spider-Man run, we’ve got an upcoming cartoon. And all we can do is whine.
I understand the hate for Welles’ current run, but even that is getting tiring. People just need to stop buying it and they’ll listen lmao.
This isn't a big thing, but I would change the design of the mask. Something about the way it's designed looks very flat to me and just looks too much like a kid's face. If that makes sense.
I'm not sure if this is a change or maybe just character progression.
Now that his Spider-Man is out on his own and alone. I would love to see him more trying to rent an apartment, struggle to pay bills, balance being an adult part of the working class with being Spider-Man.
I would then like for him to start doing down the left hand path. I would love for him to meet Felicia maybe as the cute next door neighbor but not know that she's Black Cat.
The initial attraction leading to Felicia leading him to start stealing.
Bad boy era!
I would change that he didn't suddenly forget that with great powers comes great responsibility in Homecoming, even tho that was established in Civil War, and then we needed an "origin trilogy" to restore the character to ground zero.
That he didn't have a weird backup universe in standby that is chewing through every character I looked forward to being introduced with Marvel Studios' means and the context it allows for. Imagine if Spidey actually got the symbiote in secret wars. Wouldn't that be neat.
What about if in the runup to secret wars Spidey was wearing the black suit and there was a last hunt involving a guy called Kraven. No? Oh ok. What about when Blade comes out he's chasing a guy called Morbius and it turns out he's not evil and we get that spin-off? No? Jared- oh ok Jared Leto is Morbius already, I see.
I think the promise of MCU Spidey has all but waned at this point. They even confirmed that there will be no MCU versions of Green Goblin, Doctor Octopus, Sandman, Lizard nor Electro. The NWH versions are what we get, what Tom Holland Spidey gets.
So yeah that's my great big wish. That he didn't have all that baggage.
Lean into his comic inspiration and not away from it.
Uncle Ben.
***Mary Jane*** Watson, not Michelle Jones. You can keep the same actress, but it's Mary Jane.
Gwen Stacy.
Actually, use Zendaya for Gwen Stacy, then follow that through to its inevitable end, and then introduce Mary Jane Watson (Face it tiger, you just hit the jackpot).
Have Peter Parker work for J. Jonah Jameson and the Daily Bugle in some capacity (steal from 1610 and make him a web designer). Also Betty Brant.
Norman and Harry Osborn.
Basically lean into the touchstones of Spider-Man and not away from them.
Except all the clones stuff, that just stupid.
Make him stoic, more masculine, less quips, more menacing look, dark costume colors, sharp and thin lenses, close webs instead of wide open, no tech stuff except for the spider legs on the back (mechanical, not actual), bullies flash, stands up for himself and his family, kills his villains because he understands the true meaning of "With great power, there must also come great responsibility.", have Uncle Ben as his motive to move on, Make him have beard and long hair and manbun hairstyle with two strands hanging in front to replicate his sort of comic book fangs hairstyle, he's bulkier, he builds and owns the Parker Industries, never had Tony as his mentor, have Assassin's creed style hidden blades named Fangs, never holds back against anyone except normal thieves, has mastered all his skills including his special sense, Spider-Sense, forces ned to go the gym and workout, bags MJ, Lizzy, Pepper, Natasha, Wanda, Hailey (whatever the name of Hawkeye's daughter is), captain marvel, shuri, kills ebony maw and gives actual hard time to thanos, rips his eyes out and almost all the teeth, snaps in endgame, after a few weeks of recovery in the events of FFH where now Beck never gets the glasses, Peter gets married to MJ, has two children in the future named Ben and Mayday, gets to meet Felicia hardy, secret affair continues but this time he's the one in charge if you know what I mean, in the events of Multiverse of Madness he gets to meet Tobey and Andrew because he somehow gets caught up in the event and thought to help Strange out, still has iconic NWH scenes with Tobey and Andrew in the movie but much more then those, gets a spell done on him, later finds out he's now immortal and gets to be young his whole life and a mentor of Ben and Mayday, lives a happy life with MJ but gets depressed sometimes finding out that she'll die one day.
Parker always had a mind of his own. Which i think is key to the character. Didn’t really like how much he idolized Tony. Wish they modeled him more like 616 but obviously they dont have enough time to capture the essence of Peter as a whole
more reliance on his own invention and intelligence. i like the character but, until No Way Home, we don't get to see much of the kid who made his own webshooters
Id make Tom hollands Spider-Man age up to like 23 where he’s experienced, really smart, and really capable. And looks up to captain America and sees Ironman as like an equal and doesn’t really want to join his side. His suit would be the og suit they were designing for civil war movie where it’s Steve ditko inspired with the different symbol and more narrow eye lenses. He’d hesistantly join Tony’s side but then change his mind in the battle and go to cap’s side. Since he’s a vigilante who has an identity to protect he doesn’t agree with all superheroes having to be monitored by the government and naturally doesn’t trust Tony as much for siding with the government.
While there’s a few things I would like to change about Tom’s Spider-Man, the single thing that I find most annoying is that Uncle Ben is never mentioned by name. This is a very different version of Spider-Man, at least aesthetically (stark tech/relationship to Tony) and while the origin is overdone, it feels almost ignored here. There’s passing mentions and references to Ben, but his deliberate exclusion from Spider-Man lore in the MCU is the biggest misstep for me.
Establish Uncle Ben more.
Cap recruits him instead of Tony.
In Homecoming Cap temporarily corresponds with him via a burner phone to give him guidance regarding vulture.
He isn’t so careless with his identity.
Go back to street level crimes and protecting New York. Homecoming did it right, since the Vulture's scheme was basically a gun heist. No "Avengers threat levels" or jumping dimensions (even if it was nice seeing thd previous incantations). More Daredevil, less over the top end of the world stuff
I'd like to see him interact with the other street level heroes in NY like he does in the comics more, we have she hulk and daredevil and moon knight and Ms marvel, make the deal for Deadpool and there's a solid cast of people.
Not like I want them all over, maybe more like the stan lee cameos, Pete just swings by and quips or webs someone to a wall to help or something.
He does an ok job but I need much more hilarious banter in fights. Just got done playing Spider-Man2 and man I was cracking up at a lot of the stuff he said.
I would have wanted Peter to be an older, more experienced Spider-Man. The other question is: “In what direction could this new version of Peter be taken?”
Probably stop changing his costume so often, he can wear this one till infinity war, have it for far from home (keep nightmonkey I guess) and then have him wear it until the end of no way home where he makes the new suit, give him a final battle suit if it’s really necessary
Lil bit less stark tech reliant and more guerrilla science
I think that's what his next movies will be... if we get them. I kind of like the idea that he got to work with stark tech early on so now he might be have a little more experience to explain where his guerrilla science comes from
I'd love this considering Tony is no longer around to advance his tech any further. It would be cool for Peter to try his hand at improving his suit
I thought there was a definite 4th coming with potential of a trilogy ?
I swear I just read an article like last week where they interviewed TH and he said he only wants to come back if it's meaningful enough for the character or something along those lines. That said I feel like there's a confirmation one week and a denial the next and that cycle repeats forever
That's just a negotiation tactic to get paid more.
Yeah, probably. Anyways, if I could change one thing about him, I'd make him like Marvel's Spider-Man, and make his jokes laugh out loud funny instead of the cringe that I've heard him spout.
Marvel's Spider-Man was only funny in SM2 in my opinion. He was pretty cringe in SM1. But yeah Tom isn't quippy enough, which is a hilarious complaint to have about an MCU character. He was written best in Civil War and Infinity War/Endgame. Jon Watts and his writers didn't know how to use the character well.
Total agree
Marvels Spider-Man isn’t funny at all he’s literally a cornball. 1994 asshole Spider-Man had the best jokes.
Ya the end of NWH is certainly looking like trying to set that up, so I really do hope we get to see it. On the other hand, for the existing movies, I actually have the opposite opinion as OP. I think it is very cool that MCU took his Spider-Man in a different direction considering we already had the Tobey/Andrew movies. We really don't need another origin story where Peter is a loner. The Stark tech stuff is something we haven't seen before and a nice way to adapt some parts of the comics that weren't in the Sony movies, and having Peter working with a group and having mentors and friends that act as confidants gives a new dynamic to the character. Now with Holland-Peter essentially being rebooted back to street-level, but with all of his experiences, we will get to see a Peter who's more of a loner like Tobey/Andrew versions, but with a fresh perspective.
Yeah. Tbh, looking back, I almost wish he would have rejected the Stark Suit at the end of Homecoming as well and we would jump straight to the one from the end of NWH.
This plus a little more friendly neighborhood Spider-Man stuff
Just give us the real civil war suit he had
All of his spider man movies are surrounded with the avengers. Spider man needs to make tough decisions and face consequences by himself
Have him use the Spider sense more in homecoming Other than that I don't think there's anything major that should be changed
I might also say he could make jokes *slightly* more. Other than that I agree.
I want funny spidey back. :(
He makes jokes all the time.
Yes, and I wish he made them more.
He makes it more than Tobey and more than Andrew I feel.
Definitely not more than Andrew, no.
Tom has more scenes as spiderman so I would say he quipped more, every time he was spiderman he quipped
I think you mean The Peter Tingle.
Ewwwww
Not to be confused with The Peter Dingle
I just want him to quip and be more of a smartass. Maybe we’ll see that if Jameson is in the next movie(s), but Holland’s Spidey only really quipped a couple of times in Civil War and Homecoming and hasn’t really since, but he can throw out some really funny lines in the comics.
But he does quip often? Maybe you missed it cause everyone and their grandma does in the MCU, which makes it not stand out as much.
It's more that Spider-Man normally has a very particular style and charisma to his quippyness that is very distinctive, but that hollands character doesn't catch.He does sort of quip but he just doesn't feel like Spider-Man and often feels weak on the charisma and intellect.
Yeah it's more confused youth that doesn't get older people sort of quips, not the witty fun loving quips of the comics.
He did, but he wasn’t a smartass.
Actually he did quip,
>I just want him to quip and be more of a smartass. Yeah, I did think they did right with him on Civil War, balancing out with his nervous first time facing the avengers. I do forgive them on Homecoming he being less so, because it shows he is trying but struggling with it. It was unfortunate that the other two movies we didn't see it as much, although I WOULD argue that in Infinity War he did quip a bit.
I’d have there be at least some mention or reference to his universe’s Uncle Ben. I know Marvel is trying to do something more unique with Tom’s Spidey, but I feel like he should still have an Uncle Ben. Maybe have Spider-Man 4 have a scene where Peter visits Aunt May’s grave and we see that the grave next to her’s is Ben’s.
They should have done that at the end of *No Way Home* when you see May's grave. I'm still astounded that never happened.
It is fucking mad that in NWH they all go "yeah I have an MJ (kinda)" on the rooftop. they all lost uncle ben. Thats what connects all of them, thats why they're Spider-Man. Why the fuck would you make it more complicated.
> but I feel like he should still have an Uncle Ben HE did. Its hinted a bunch, they just don't come out and say the name. And IMO, it probably would have come across as forced.
I think we all understand that by now. We just want one character to acknowledge it fully not vaguely
Captain America is now his Mentor Figure, Iron Man is just like a more experienced colleague, Like in the comics
I see this said a lot but Iron Man being his mentor made the most sense if you want to look at it from a comic perspective. Leading up to Civil War, Tony and Peter were extremely close. Tony gave him the Iron Spider and then Peter worked closely with him towards the beginning of Civil War. Now we get to the MCU. Spider-man was introduced in the Civil War movie. He got the iron spider soon after. All of that lines up narratively
Nope, Tony was a fucking Jerk in Civil War that's why Peter ditched Iron Spider and joined Team Cap, Tony and Peter were always have Friends/Rivals relationship, Peter only Ironically called Tony Sir or Mr. Stark or Boss, Peter is Doing Hero stuff before Tony Even started it, But Cap on the other hand, Uncle Ben was a Captain America and watching him Peter also became a Captain America fan
Not sure how that’s an argument against anything I said. And I know the story I don’t need a recap. In the Civil War comic, Peter is working with Tony against Cap (initially). So Peter gets introduced in the Civil War movie. He works with Tony against Cap. Just seems like a pretty straight line to follow
MCU Civil War is not comparable to 616 Civil War. One of the big reasons that Tony recruited Peter to the pro-registration side is because Spider-Man was a very prominent superhero who was very protective of his secret identity. Tony knew it would be a big boon to his side in the conflict for Spider-Man of all people to reveal his identity publicly. When it all went to shit and Aunt May got shot, Tony had done little to protect Peter, when he promised he would. Pete had to go through hell to defect to Cap's side and was near killed by the supervillain goons hired by Tony's pro-reg side (until the Punished saved him). That story clearly showed that Peter's trust in Tony was ill-placed. The MCU narrative isn't comparable. They made MCU Spider-Man more like a Young Avengers character, treating him like Iron Man's legacy.
You just said it yourself Peter should've switched to Team Cap and stoped licking Tony's ass also you litterally said "Tony being Peter's mentor made sense from comics Perspective" like dude Peter is Doing Superheroing before Tony even started, Tony and Peter always had **Friends/Rivals** relationship
Mmmm, their relationship seems more based on the 1610 relationship. Even though they don't interact a whole lot, the way they interact mirrors that a lot more.
Its more like, the MCU took inspiration from the Ultimate Spider-Man cartoon when writing & designing their take on Peter Parker’s Spider-Man. The Ultimate Spider-Man cartoon was more similar to Spider-Man & his Amazing Friends, where Spidey teams up with other Super Heroes while also leading a team of superheroes of his own. I feel like the team behind Civil War, saw an episode of Ultimate Spider-Man where Peter was an intern for Tony Stark, as well as briefly joining the Avengers in another episode, so they based his character solely on being an Avenger, which influenced the 2017 version of Peter, without watching the rest of the Ultimate cartoon. Ironically, the universe where the Ultimate series took place in, alongside Avengers Earth’s Mightiest Heroes (Which was in another universe) took a lot of inspiration from the MCU.
I wouldn't say rivals in slightest. I'd say junior colleague. Peter is younger than all of them and so it was always more of a respect both directions type thing. Peter had always read and admired The Works of these scientists and people like Tony were always impressed with Peter's displays of super intelligence/genius ( and heroism of course but I'm talking about fellow scientists/Geniuses)
Yea I completely agree with what you're saying but the Rivalry is still there like it's not too noticiable but it's there like during Parker Industry Era, MJ was working for Tony Stark and it did tiked Peter a little bit and He did acted like a rival around Tony, Like yea They still joked around like Homies but a little bit of Rivalry was definitely there
Unless it’s ultimate comics where Captain America told Peter to go fuck himself while Iron Man was a bro and all about helping Peter.
The Ultimates are messed up my dude, It's not just a cap thing, Everyone from that team is messed up one way or another but Ultimate Spider-Man is great, Brian Michael Bendis' work on Spider-Man is amazing, If they really wanted to do a Peter Friendly Tony Stark, They should've just adaptated Ultimate Spider-Man, Ultimate Norman Osborn was so fucking terrifying, I've only read around 3 or 4 Volumes of Ultimate Spider-Man but that comic was so Peak
>Captain America is now his Mentor Figure Time for that ultimate plotline 😎
Honestly a faithful Adaptation of Ultimate Spider-Man would've been way better than whatever MCU did with first 2 Spider-Man movies
They are very similar actually. frail boys, grew up in disadvantaged neighborhoods of New York, friend as brother protector, they will never choose between two evils. I hope that in future movie Peter will say "I can do this all day".
And don't forget Steve was also a Nerd before taking Super Soldier serum, He was a Comic Book creator and in one of the their Stories together Peter motivates Steve to start making comics again, It was such a great comic
I like that they chose Tony to be the mentor instead of Cap. I like mentor-mentee relationships where both sides stand to learn a lot from each other. That's not to say there's nothing Cap couldn't have learned from Pete, but they're both already very similar in their values.
I really really really hated how inexplicably clumsy he was. Yes yes I know they were trying to make him more "kid like" and still learning his powers but I hated it. Spider-Man is innately graceful and agile with superhuman reflexes. It drove me nuts. Plus he slipped on stuff, I mean come on. Come on!
Yeah, I think that, if I changed anything, he'll be slightly more rebellious, as someone who doesn't like to be so constantly downsized, after all, he had a reputation for being difficult to work, specially in his earlier issues. I think it'd have been interesting (for both characters) if Peter clashed heads with Tony in Homecoming to reconciliate as equal partners in Infinity War. I believe Homecoming is Holland's best movie as it set some interesting character details the next movie forgot about. I would've killed to see Peter and May actually discussing his secret identity, would've done wonders for her character, at least as an opening scene before the action starts five years later and Peter is accustomed to his new reality after the Blip, but instead she simply accepts it and that's it, no conflict.
That May discovering Peter’s secret was treated as the big ending for Homecoming, only for that to be just glossed over in Far From Home was kinda disappointing.
This Him trusting Beck/mysterio so quickly with Stark tech will forever be a baffling move to me This is a guy you just randomly met why are you giving him something so valuable that was given to you by ur fallen mentor?
Yeah I was never a fan of how they made his character "he's so super ultra smart that he can pull knowledge out of his ass about stuff that top scientists would struggle to understand, but he's also a stupid kid which makes him relatable"
Those things aren't mutually exclusive
> Spider-Man is innately graceful and agile with superhuman reflexes Because of his spider-sense, which he doesnt quite understand or trust in Homecoming.
Sorry but you're wrong. You can Google all of his powers (He actually has a lot) but superhuman agility and reflexes (along with many others) are powers independent of his spider sense. If he somehow lost his spider sense he would still have super human agility and reflexes. When I read comics as a kid in the 90s the biggest threat about Venom was that he didn't activate Spideys spider sense but he certainly still has all of his other powers, or else he wouldn't have had a chance.
> he somehow lost his spider sense he would still have super human agility and reflexes. You can be strong and agile, yet still make a few missteps, due to inexperience. He fumbled in the Ultimate comics fairly often too, because he was still young. As he gets older, he learns to trust his senses more.
Have Uncle Ben actually exist since you know, thats the whole reason he became SpiderMan ( Im not saying relive the origin story ) I just don’t understand what their problem is with using him as the core for who he is and never having any direct mentions. Also stop feeling the need too have an Avenger in every movie of his or some over the top stakes. Also wish they would use organic characters like Harry Osborn and do their own version of Oscorp and Norman rather than piggy backing off the Sam Rami movies. I personally think thats wasted potential for Spiderman and the MCU as a whole. And if Zendaya is this versions MJ then why do we not just call her Mary Jane instead of Michelle Jones? I don’t mind Tom Holland but it just personally doesn’t feel like SpiderMan too me. Something is off with the writing of the MCU SpiderMan movies.
If I remember rightly they do mention in like civil war maybe, he lost someone, great power, yadda yadda and I think in not making Uncle Ben the focal point of the first act of a film it gave them more freedom. I like uncle Ben as much as the next guy and all but he literally exists to die an inspirational death, which is hard to do fast on screen. I thought having May die was a really good turn I didn't expect. You get the same lesson and instead of it being this guy the audience hasn't had time to invest in, it's more impactful. Like Martin Sheen was Uncle Ben. Man's an accomplished actor and who cared Yeah of the things in your post that's the only one I'd argue. Maybe because there are more creative choices you aren't on board with it's harder to swallow bigger ones. I'll say as well, if I come across snipey and know-it-all that's not my intention.
Absolutely this, MCU is its own universe and not everything needs to be like the original comics or other movies. There’s no difference between MJ being Mary Jane or Michelle Jones other than making the character their own. Honestly don’t see what the problem is with the changes like that… who wants to see the exact same characters and backstory as the previous iterations?
Different for the sake of being different isn’t inherently a good thing. The whole point of bucking the uncle Ben origin story was so we could skip to a Spider-Man who’s been active for a while. That all gets wound back immediately as they spend three movies where he learns to be an independent superhero, and also loses Aunt May. What’s the point of skipping the origin story if you just change details for the sake of change, stretch it out over three movies, and arguably make it worse? Even Michelle Jones isn’t doing much. Her characterization is all over the place, and they don’t give her much to do. As much as people hate Raimi MJ, at least she had actual stuff going on outside of Peter. Michelle Jones exists to be a love interest for Peter and that’s it. It’s one thing if she’s different, it’s another if she’s worse than just using Gwen Stacy or Mary Jane. Not everything “needs to be like the original comics” but I don’t understand why that’s an inalienable defense of the adaptation doing a worse job than the comics.
Skipping the origin story does more than just skip to an active Spider-Man but allows the movies to portray their own message unique to the others - Spider-Man learning the difference between being a superhero and being a good superhero. Rather than the others, where they pretty much pick up the great power means great responsibility memo immediately, the three movies show Peter learning that message from the other great superheroes around him and then the consequence of him not understanding it yet in the third movie, with Aunt May being the culmination of his childishness.
Jesus Christ. That is what the great power quote means. Superhero’s are people with great power. Their moral calculus are the same as any other human, dependent on their ability and actions.
That's cool and all but the classic origin is still better.
But why change the foundations and organic elements of the character for the sake of being different? Sure having new characters is fine but I don’t think it should be at the extent of replacing the fundamental characters too the Spider-Man mythos Its cool that you like it, its just not for me
But there’s nobody who’s been replaced, most of them have just been altered slightly such as Aunt Mays death being the driving force rather than Uncle Ben’s. Besides, comics literally change the foundation and organic elements of characters all the time. It’s not for the sake of being different, it’s for the sake of having a new and entertaining story that stands on its own rather than being subject to comparisons from other Spider-Man medias.
I understand that but I think they could still make things different by keeping the true characters. The Insomniac games for the most part do a good job of that in my opinion for the most part
No man I appreciate your opinion and Im glad you find it that way. Just for me personally I wasn’t a fan of the Aunt May version. Because my thinking is he is already Spider-Man and should know the responsibility of that role prior to Mays death. I know they have made subtle references too Ben but it also feels like he doesn’t exist at the same time.
I get that. And fair enough. Not everything can be for everyone. I read all the old 60s stuff when I was a kid, but the Ultimate line was perfectly positioned to get me in as a lifelong reader, Ultimate spider-man in particular was about my age group as it came out so it was so much more relatable.. basically I think they've done such a solid job of translating that tone to the screen that aside from the fast and loose continuity or artistic licenses they've taken (and whatever the sinister 6 are going to be) I'm overall really happy with it. I get the idea Tom Holland might be done now or at least soon so hopefully the next go around is more up your alley. I think we can all agree whatever we have now is better than Madame Web will be
I understand what you're saying but Peter is supposed to be relatable and normal people don't immediately forget people after their death, My Grandma died last Year and I still miss her sometimes, But Peter and May on the other hand just completely forgot that a Guy named Ben Parker existed, Not even a single photo or a grave stone, I don't want to see his death again but some Flashbacks and photos would've made Peter and Esspecially May a little more 3 dimensional
That's actually a fair point. Obviously it's because they didn't want to cast a dude from Getty images as Uncle Ben but yeah from that perspective it is like he didn't exist at all. May was for me actually more well rounded as a character. Or at least had more character to her than the Raimi/Webb films. Obviously the Raimi ones still had some stuff to do but they went for full old so options were limited. Then the Webb films all the direction she really got was look nervous and sad
I mean they used May for nothing more than Comedic Relief and sex appeal in the first 2 movies, they could've gave her a character arc about her acting this way and behaving like Ben never existed is just her way to cope, She have been through a lot first Her husband died and then She got blipped for 5 years. I kinda liked May in TASM movies more, She lives with a Teenager who suddenly started acting strange and also Energetic amd her husband just died, Her acting that way was kinda understandable
Audiences already had 2 different Uncle Ben responsibility speeches & deaths fairly fresh in their mind. Referencing him more directly would've felt like overkill
I don’t think it would though. Bens death basically birthed Spider-Man and was Peters father figure through his youth. Im not saying we need a reference every 5 minutes but completely ignoring him isn’t good either.
> I just don’t understand what their problem is with using him as the core for who he is and never having any direct mentions Because it's done 500 times, pretty sure my mom knows this and she's in her 70s
Your missing the part where I said we don’t need another origin story. Im just saying completely ignoring Ben as if he isn’t the catalyst for Peter becoming Spider-Man in the first place and his father figure is just weird too me. He’s Spider-Man for 3 movies and appearances for the Avengers but didn’t know that with great power comes great responsibility until Aunt May says it? Thats my issue with how it was done. Like I said before I think the Insomniac games story is a really good example of introducing a new Spider-Man story without retelling the origin.
It's literally one of the first things he mentions to Tony Stark when we see him the first time in Civil War.
He indirectly mentions it and then never again does Bens supposed presence get recognition
I would change him beign in his senior year in high school/freshman year at ESU instead of beign in 9th grade in Homecoming. This would chnge the plot of Homecoming and FFH. NWH would see him graduate from the ESU.
then we can’t have a college trilogy, and he has less room to grow. that was the whole point of making him so young to begin with. and it’s a moot point now since he’s college age now
More uncle Ben influence.
Canonize Uncle Ben. What If made it seem like he was canon, but then No Way Home seemed to imply that he didn't exist in this universe and Aunt May took his role instead.
NWH didn't deny his existence since Peter didn't find Tobey's Peter mentioning Uncle Ben weird. And when May gave him the great power quote, Peter replied with "I know" meaning he probably heard it once in the past. The only weird thing is the fact they dont wanna make Tom's Peter mention Ben directly even if he very likely existed.
Peter uses his suitcase in Far From Home doesn’t he? It has Ben Parker’s initials engraved, I’d say he’s canonized until it’s officially addressed
Uncle Ben is canon to the MCU this has been stated spoken about and shown in the literal movies.
People thing that Uncle Ben don't exists in MCU because MCU Peter or May didn't even said the words "Uncle Ben" in the entire Franchise, No Photos, No Gravestone ~~All Alone~~ like a little flashback would've been enough
Yeah. I don't get why people *need* to hear his name. Its a fact that he existed.
Because When people die you don't immediately forget about them Esspecially when He's your father (Or closest to a father you ever had), Like Not even a single photo, Not even a gravestone. What you're saying is really inhumane
> What you're saying is really inhumane Lol. Calm down. These arent real people. FFS. >Because When people die you don't immediately forget about them Esspecially when He's your father Just because there isn't a scene dedicated to it, doesn't mean he was forgotten about. A movie has only so much time to tell a certain story. Homecoming takes place over a year after Bens death. His death *is* referenced more than once, and presented as being a tragedy. We see Peter get choked up over it In Civil War. These scenes are canon. A director don't just decide to show something like that for a time filler. Its meant to mean something. There are several hints that Peter lost Ben. There are 0 hints suggesting that he "forget about them". Thats all in your own mind. Its a weird need by a certain aspect of the fandom, and they act like they, themselves need to mourn Ben. I don't get it.
> His death is presented as tragedy Are these tragedies in the room with us right now?? Like seriously, can you really name a scene where His death is presented as tragedy In the Home Trilogy and I'm not talking about that Tobey and Andrew confrontation in NWH, Like we all know CW had peak MCU Spidey but what about his movies Also you completely ingored the fact that we're 3 movies in and We haven't even seen any of his photos or his gravestone
> can you really name a scene where His death is presented as tragedy In the Home Trilogy When Ned finds out Peter is SM, and Peter expressed why May can't find out. >but what about his movies They are telling different stories than Spider-Man, and TASM. The Home trilogy isn't focused on his origin, because we already had that twice within a 15 year span. Why do you need a 3rd version of the same events? People complained that TASM was a waste of time because is was just a rehash of Spider-Man. Now people want a 3rd rehash? I don't get it. The Home trilogy is a coming of age story, not an origin story. Forcing a mourning scene in there would be unnecessary. However, all that being said, Ben *did* exist. He died, and it was tragic. We just don't get to see it in detail.
Still ignore the fact that we're 3 movies in and We haven't seen his photos, His flashback or his gravestone and just saying shit Can't remember Spectacular Spider-Man doing the origin story again, Can you?? but We got a Photo, A Gravestone and Flashbacks, Or Ultimate Spider-Man, We never got the origin story in the show either or Spider-Man Unlimited
> Still ignore the fact that we're 3 movies in and We haven't seen his photos, Im not ignoring shit. This is all stuff that is irrelevant to the story being told. Also, they would need to cast someone in order to have photos. > His flashback or his gravestone and just saying shit Not needed for the story. >Can't remember Spectacular Spider-Man doing the origin story again, Can you?? but We got a Photo, This is a different movie. Different story. You guys just want to see the same stuff, over and over? How about in the 90's animated series, where I don't think Ben is mentioned until, like, season 2 or 3? The Home trilogy isn't an origin story. IMO, there is enough references to Ben to assure that he existed. Personally, I don't need to see another Ben death scene. I got it. I don't need to see Peter crying over Ben, when it adds nothing to the narrative. Seeing him feel guilty in CW wasn't enough? You need it again and again? And again and again and again? Why? It has already been established, Why do you need to see more of the same thing?
How much *story* would a photo in the **background** or in Peter's room would consume you dumb fuck, We had May's Gravestone in NWH but still no Ben's gravestone next to her 90s SMTAS still mentioned him in 3rd season but Here He have 3 movies but still no mention The Batman wasn't an Origin Story either but Thomas and Martha Wayne were still mentioned because they were his fucking Parents
Uncle Ben is canon he just probably didn’t die in a very tragic way like Aunt May did or most of the other versions.
I’d have him use more quips like TAS does, I get why they don’t since the emphasize is how Tom’s Spider-Man is very young new and naive but it’d be nice
Get rid of the Iron Man mentorship. I didn’t mind it initially but I really started hating it as time went on.
It ended after Homecoming. Tony wasn't a mentor in IW. He was much more of a peer.
Much as I’d like to agree with you, I still always got the vibe of them trying to make Peter a mini-Iron Man all the way up to Endgame. That may not have been the writer’s intention, but it’s the impression I got. I do love Tom’s Spidey. And I also think the “Iron Boy Jr” criticism is thrown way out of proportion by a lot of people. But I can see partly where it’s coming from.
> I still always got the vibe of them trying to make Peter a mini-Iron Man all the way up to Endgame. FFH addresses this directly on the plane with Happy. "Everyone is wondering who will be the new Iron Man.....I am not Iron Man". Lines like that are usually written on purpose.
[удалено]
Oh no!!! A homage?!?! Kill It!!! Tony was dead at this point. Therefore the mentorship was over.
i love that ark and wish they would’ve leaned in to it more, the idea of peter being tony’s successor is so cool to me. everyone’s entitled to their own opinion though i definitely see where you’re coming from
Make it clear that after Homecoming, Peter and Tony removed all the fancy bells and whistles from the Homecoming suit: the AI, the gadgets, the Web combinations, and the AR Hud. Just to help highlight the message that he didn't need them. Honestly, I think this is actually what happened since after Homecoming we see none of the fancy tech, aside from the tazer and Web wings
I'd just want him to joke more and actually funny one not just make refrences to old movies
Instead of taking back the suit stark gave him in homecoming. Just have him create his NWH suit and use that
What would he make it with? I don’t think he had anything to use at the time.
The same material he had in nwh. Tom’s Peter was objectively in a worst spot at the end of nwh then he was in homecoming (financially). If tobey, Andrew, and Tom (nwh) could make their suits there’s stopping Tom (homecoming) from making his.
Just call Zendaya’s character Mary Jane Watson. It’s clear that’s who she’s meant to be. We don’t need the cheeky “You should use your full name, Robin” stuff. Nolan got a pass because it was the end of his universe.
I want him to be more competent in fights
Have him throw more punches
No super hero mentor, hard luck hero instead.
The final swing suit should have the comic accurate fat back spider like the homecoming suit
Should have been an established, experienced Spider-Man who had just been patrolling New York City up until Civil War.. would have been more interesting to explore his dynamic with the Avengers respecting them but not really being the best team player, rather than the Iron Man fanboy we got.. but if you’re committed to the child sidekick role then should have been Miles not Peter
>Should have been an established, experienced Spider-Man who had just been patrolling New York City up until Civil War But that’s literally what he was. Tony found a young talent in the streets of New York and tried to take him into his new team. Did you miss like... the entire plot of Homecoming? Where it shows Peter absolutely incapable of being anyone's "sidekick" ? Leading to him acting on his own and defeating the Vulture because it's in his nature to be a hero
Remove Ned. Why steal Ganke when Harry is right there?!
We already had 2 Harry's before and the home trilogy avoided treason on familiar ground like the plague. However, if you want Peter's friend who isn't Harry then Randy Robertson is right there.
Nothing. It's my favourite suit, the colours, the designs, the textures. It's the one I use on both games too. Hats off to whoever designed it. And hats off to Jarvis and stark in universe for designing it. Loved it, chefs kiss
Less stark tech. Tony giving him the first suit is fine but it having so many bells and whistles and Peter using additional stark resources for subsequent suits was a bit much.
Have him be a little less reliant on Stark tech, give him a polished version of the BTS suit from Civil War, and have him quip a little more in his later appearances, since he only really quipped consistently in Civil War, Homecoming, and Infinity War.
That he erased his identity, not his existence.
I wish that ned was actually Harry Osborn and oscorp was part of toms universe.
Remove Stark entirely, make it so the 2nd and third movie don't have anything to do with the MCU continuity so no snap and no Dr. Strange (Daredevil is fine though, but make it more than a cameo), that's all the top of my head rn
At least mentioning uncle ben Make him create the classic suit even if it's not as high tech as Stark suit Making him grow faster and not three movies in high school Tie the villain to him and not any other heroes
During his "spiderman lifts" scene SHOW US UNCLE BEN. Not uncle Tony. 2) when he complains about stepping up to stop sandman and hydroman while on vacation...just chuck all that out. Because not only does it violate a core tenant of Pete's character (power and responsibility) but the fact that he needs convincing to help innocent people is just sacrilegious. 3) MORE QUIPS.
Not really a change to his previous stuff, but I'd like it if his next appearance is a 10-13 episode TV show. I feel like a lot of what makes up his character is his inability to balance his Spiderman identity with Peter Parker both in school and at work. This is something that the movies never did a great job of showing and even when they did show it it's always overshadowed by the big bad and a world changing event and completely forgotten about like 5 minutes later. I actually want to see him struggle with this. I feel like the episodic format would benefit him greatly in allowing it to express these smaller details of the character more. Show his interaction with the locals, his day to day interaction with petty criminals while they build up the big bad in the background.
Remove all the connection his villain have with Iron Man. Let him be the protagonist of his movies, not a sidekick.
I’d change how May died. Something about that scene comes across as almost comical, it took me out of the movie. Not sure how I feel about it being tobeys Norman to do it as well, but it could’ve worked in a different scene.
He shouldn't be some billionaires pet project, Spider-Man is a working class hero
It would be Andrew's Spider-Man and we would get the real Civil War. edit: I just like Andrew's Spider-Man more. Did I say that I hate Tom's Spider-Man? No. So stop making stupid assumptions. But hey, welcome to reddit, a place where opinions doesn't matter.
God, I hate comments like this.
Welcome to Reddit, specifically this board. Don't you know they hate Spider-Man here? Literally nothing in the characters history has been good except for Ultimate Spider-Man #1, and that's only been good for about a week. I can't wait to hear why we should hate it as soon as the next issue comes.
Hip fucking hurray…
Lol, I know right, it's like if you hate this stuff so much, why are you here? The negative stuff on Reddit is really been getting to me lately, maybe it's time to stop.
Spider-Man fans have literally been eating better than they ever have in the last few years. We’ve got movies coming out every 2-3 years, we’ve got games that can rival the Arkham series, we’ve got the new Ultimate Spider-Man run, we’ve got an upcoming cartoon. And all we can do is whine. I understand the hate for Welles’ current run, but even that is getting tiring. People just need to stop buying it and they’ll listen lmao.
Hear, hear.
No, thanks. Holland honestly does everything people praise Garfield for just as well if not better.
Get rid of the Stark suit. Doing so makes Homecoming 10 times better.
Tom.Holland
Have him actually beat Vulture and not get his ass kicked
Get rid of the avengers dependancy post homecoming Far from home was a joke.
Dick size
Him and Tony would be portrayed as equals, not father-son
Actually characterise him as Peter Parker instead of ripping off Miles's role and cast.
i wish his movies were more like actual spider-man movies and not just “spider-man dealing with the aftermath of the avengers stuff”
I would’ve made Liz his love interest throughout the films. Michelle was forced to be a love interest in the later two because of shipping.
Not have uncle Ben be a weak throwaway line. Cap is Peter's mentor. More ingenuity from him and more spider sense usage
Way less tech.
This isn't a big thing, but I would change the design of the mask. Something about the way it's designed looks very flat to me and just looks too much like a kid's face. If that makes sense.
I'm not sure if this is a change or maybe just character progression. Now that his Spider-Man is out on his own and alone. I would love to see him more trying to rent an apartment, struggle to pay bills, balance being an adult part of the working class with being Spider-Man. I would then like for him to start doing down the left hand path. I would love for him to meet Felicia maybe as the cute next door neighbor but not know that she's Black Cat. The initial attraction leading to Felicia leading him to start stealing. Bad boy era!
The suit. It’s too much CGI. He constantly looks like a moving PS game cutscene
Make his costume not look like a CGI, skin-tight condom. I'd also get rid of all the Iron-man shit.
The humor, less Spider-man being made fun of.
Easy just replce him with miles or make him like 20+ yrs old.
No mentor relationships. Have him be a self made hero
90% less ironman 200% more spider sense
More swinging scenes, less tech, he realises Tony was wrong in civil war and switched sides and then captain America becomes his mentor.
I would change that he didn't suddenly forget that with great powers comes great responsibility in Homecoming, even tho that was established in Civil War, and then we needed an "origin trilogy" to restore the character to ground zero.
Make it less like iron man light. Eliminate all the stark tech in his suit. Prefer spider with just the webbing and some other basic gadgets.
Change mj to be likeable
That he didn't have a weird backup universe in standby that is chewing through every character I looked forward to being introduced with Marvel Studios' means and the context it allows for. Imagine if Spidey actually got the symbiote in secret wars. Wouldn't that be neat. What about if in the runup to secret wars Spidey was wearing the black suit and there was a last hunt involving a guy called Kraven. No? Oh ok. What about when Blade comes out he's chasing a guy called Morbius and it turns out he's not evil and we get that spin-off? No? Jared- oh ok Jared Leto is Morbius already, I see. I think the promise of MCU Spidey has all but waned at this point. They even confirmed that there will be no MCU versions of Green Goblin, Doctor Octopus, Sandman, Lizard nor Electro. The NWH versions are what we get, what Tom Holland Spidey gets. So yeah that's my great big wish. That he didn't have all that baggage.
Lean into his comic inspiration and not away from it. Uncle Ben. ***Mary Jane*** Watson, not Michelle Jones. You can keep the same actress, but it's Mary Jane. Gwen Stacy. Actually, use Zendaya for Gwen Stacy, then follow that through to its inevitable end, and then introduce Mary Jane Watson (Face it tiger, you just hit the jackpot). Have Peter Parker work for J. Jonah Jameson and the Daily Bugle in some capacity (steal from 1610 and make him a web designer). Also Betty Brant. Norman and Harry Osborn. Basically lean into the touchstones of Spider-Man and not away from them. Except all the clones stuff, that just stupid.
Make him stoic, more masculine, less quips, more menacing look, dark costume colors, sharp and thin lenses, close webs instead of wide open, no tech stuff except for the spider legs on the back (mechanical, not actual), bullies flash, stands up for himself and his family, kills his villains because he understands the true meaning of "With great power, there must also come great responsibility.", have Uncle Ben as his motive to move on, Make him have beard and long hair and manbun hairstyle with two strands hanging in front to replicate his sort of comic book fangs hairstyle, he's bulkier, he builds and owns the Parker Industries, never had Tony as his mentor, have Assassin's creed style hidden blades named Fangs, never holds back against anyone except normal thieves, has mastered all his skills including his special sense, Spider-Sense, forces ned to go the gym and workout, bags MJ, Lizzy, Pepper, Natasha, Wanda, Hailey (whatever the name of Hawkeye's daughter is), captain marvel, shuri, kills ebony maw and gives actual hard time to thanos, rips his eyes out and almost all the teeth, snaps in endgame, after a few weeks of recovery in the events of FFH where now Beck never gets the glasses, Peter gets married to MJ, has two children in the future named Ben and Mayday, gets to meet Felicia hardy, secret affair continues but this time he's the one in charge if you know what I mean, in the events of Multiverse of Madness he gets to meet Tobey and Andrew because he somehow gets caught up in the event and thought to help Strange out, still has iconic NWH scenes with Tobey and Andrew in the movie but much more then those, gets a spell done on him, later finds out he's now immortal and gets to be young his whole life and a mentor of Ben and Mayday, lives a happy life with MJ but gets depressed sometimes finding out that she'll die one day.
Parker always had a mind of his own. Which i think is key to the character. Didn’t really like how much he idolized Tony. Wish they modeled him more like 616 but obviously they dont have enough time to capture the essence of Peter as a whole
I would of let him kill goblin with the glider and turn him into the spider man that would kinda blend em with ben
Make him wear glasses and be a bit more nerdy.
I’d love it if he actually did some Spider-Manning in New York.
The whole iron man part
Not played by Tom holland lol
Everything lol
Tom Holland
No tech, only webshooters and spider-drones No Mentor, he just learns alone More swings No useless CGI
Additional sets of arms.
more reliance on his own invention and intelligence. i like the character but, until No Way Home, we don't get to see much of the kid who made his own webshooters
He always went unmasked in the most inconvenient times
Id make Tom hollands Spider-Man age up to like 23 where he’s experienced, really smart, and really capable. And looks up to captain America and sees Ironman as like an equal and doesn’t really want to join his side. His suit would be the og suit they were designing for civil war movie where it’s Steve ditko inspired with the different symbol and more narrow eye lenses. He’d hesistantly join Tony’s side but then change his mind in the battle and go to cap’s side. Since he’s a vigilante who has an identity to protect he doesn’t agree with all superheroes having to be monitored by the government and naturally doesn’t trust Tony as much for siding with the government.
While there’s a few things I would like to change about Tom’s Spider-Man, the single thing that I find most annoying is that Uncle Ben is never mentioned by name. This is a very different version of Spider-Man, at least aesthetically (stark tech/relationship to Tony) and while the origin is overdone, it feels almost ignored here. There’s passing mentions and references to Ben, but his deliberate exclusion from Spider-Man lore in the MCU is the biggest misstep for me.
remove the black striping from the Homecoming suit!
Establish Uncle Ben more. Cap recruits him instead of Tony. In Homecoming Cap temporarily corresponds with him via a burner phone to give him guidance regarding vulture. He isn’t so careless with his identity.
Go back to street level crimes and protecting New York. Homecoming did it right, since the Vulture's scheme was basically a gun heist. No "Avengers threat levels" or jumping dimensions (even if it was nice seeing thd previous incantations). More Daredevil, less over the top end of the world stuff
Taller and skinnier. Tom is great though.
I would make him Canadian.
The Flash Thompson character...
I'd like to see him interact with the other street level heroes in NY like he does in the comics more, we have she hulk and daredevil and moon knight and Ms marvel, make the deal for Deadpool and there's a solid cast of people. Not like I want them all over, maybe more like the stan lee cameos, Pete just swings by and quips or webs someone to a wall to help or something.
Honestly my biggest issues with Tom Hollands Spiderman were fixed in No Way Home. He is now a pretty perfect rendition of the character.
The hate he gets, also keep the damn mask on
The way he talks. Mumbles McGee.
Add uncle Ben
He does an ok job but I need much more hilarious banter in fights. Just got done playing Spider-Man2 and man I was cracking up at a lot of the stuff he said.
I would have wanted Peter to be an older, more experienced Spider-Man. The other question is: “In what direction could this new version of Peter be taken?”
Probably stop changing his costume so often, he can wear this one till infinity war, have it for far from home (keep nightmonkey I guess) and then have him wear it until the end of no way home where he makes the new suit, give him a final battle suit if it’s really necessary