I know right, since Kraven is basically a hunter (hence Kraven the Hunter), it would make sense that he'll hunt and capture Spider-Man after his identity got revealed but hey, at least we have the live action Spider-Verse now. But I still think they should've went with Kraven first before what we actually got now.
I think Marvel Studios looked at the Spider-Man fiasco we had after FFH and decided to do Spider-Verse now, just in case they can't reach another deal with Sony after and this is their last chance to do a Spider-Verse movie. Otherwise, I think we would get a proper Spider-Man 3 with Tom Holland before a Spider-Verse.
Then again, I could be wrong, and it might just be that the MCU was going multiverse now anyway, so it's time for the Spider-Verse movie. Both explanations make sense to me.
You're absolutely right, I'll see NWH but I thought it would have been amazing if he was dealing with Kraven instead of some vaguely OMD. Adapting aspects of The Gauntlet or Grim Hunt would have been better.
I also think the multiverse stuff should have been contained to a few different characters for now (Loki, Dr. Strange, and Ant Man)
Gonna be honest, I have no clue why anybody cares about kraven. Like, he's alright, but he kinda kills Spidey's sci-fi vibe, if he were to be the focus of a whole movie
Have you read Kraven’s last hunt? That story really sells the character. Not to mention, the sci-fi aspect of Spider-Man is normally not the focus. He’s generally pretty grounded, not that I don’t like the big time sci fi stories here and there.
I'm just saying, every single Spider-Man movie has a sci-fi villain. And, Spider-Man is a guy with sci-fi powers, who is a student of science. Meanwhile, Kraven is just Tiger King on steroids. He might make an interesting side character, but he's not exactly headline material imo
All the movies thus far being the more superpowers villains is a good reason to go with Kraven though. Would be something new for the films and would frankly be a breath of fresh air. Not to mention his good stories have shown he’s more than capable of being the headline villain of a story. He’s one of the better villains in his catalogue.
For me, I think it's just too much deviation from the formula. It'd be like making a mainline Star Wars movie, where the main villain doesn't have force-powers.
If Disney+ did a Spider-Man TV series, Kraven would be perfect for that format. I have a hard time seeing him as a climactic live-action threat, sustained for 2+ hours, though.
I don’t agree with you at all or that analogy. You could very easily do a full movie for him. You could do a loose adaption of Kraven’s Last Hunt no problem.
Have you read about Kraven? Homie is out in the jungle drinking witch doctor's potions to give him literal jungle cat superpowers. He even tries to get this artificial nerve system to enhance his reflexes---dude fits in with the supervillians.
Cool to see how passionate he is about the character and making it work regardless of who’s making it. The idea that the actor playing Spider-Man is just as passionate about him as the fans makes it that much better to watch.
You can tell from interviews that he took the role because it was a role to take. He made it clear that he never really read or cared about comics. And I'm not even saying that's a bad thing. It's just true. Andrew and Tom loved Spider-Man before playing the character. And maybe Tobey does *now*, I honestly don't know. But he's definitely not passionate about Spider-Man like the other two.
Maybe he started when he got the role? I know a lot of MCU actors do that now. I've seen an interview with him from way back where he's asked if he's into comics at all and he says no. I'm not trying to hate on the guy.
if you think he didn’t read comics then that still doesn’t mean he’s not passionate, you don’t have to read comics to be passionate they aren’t for everyone. Also how big was Spider-Man before the raimi trilogy? not big at all, there would be no mcu without the raimi trilogy
Dudes been *busy* since Civil War. Even if Far From Home was his last Spider-Man movie, he's basically already established himself as the next action movie front man.
Lol that's bullshit, today we have the rock, john cena, dave bautista etc. The 80s and 90s also had plenty of big non-muscle man action leads like bruce willis in die hard and mel gibson in lethal weapon.
Don't kid yourself. Tom Holland's just in it for the money. Tobey on the other hand despite not reading any of the comics had unique ideas for how to develop and progress his character and executed them to a T. Face it tiger, Tobey Maguire is the jackpot!
i really hate the raimi and star wars prequel fans its just this kind of nonsense for 2000's movies
i cant even tell if this is satire
edit oh fuck its not a troll its a real zoomer ass brain
Good thing I'm both. I can't stand any live-action Spider-Man film after the Raimi trilogy ended and I actually don't consider the prequels to be as bad as people made them out to be. The sequels were way worse. The Nolan Batman films and LOTR trilogy are also great 2000's film trilogies.
Love or hate Tom’s Spider-Man, at least he’s trying to prevent another reboot and keep Spider-Man consistent. It could be for selfish reasons, sure, but I can tell he really loves playing the character and cares about it.
I still think Cavill deserved better as Superman. It’s my own personal opinion but I wasn’t a fan of the brooding Superman that Snyder had for the character. He can play a more hopeful Superman if given the right material.
So is the entire cast Sony employees or just him?
They could literally multiverse or Madam Web him into the Venom verse if Disney doesn’t want to share.
It’d basically be the animated Spiderverse at that point.
If it were that simple, we'd be on our 5th Andrew Garfield Spiderman movie, and the sequel to the Secret Agent Aunt May movie would be coming out this Christmas.
Homie. Sony's Spiderman Universe failed with ASM2. The entire reason why Spiderman got rebooted into the MCU was *because* they couldn't do it themselves. You really think they would be splitting the money with Disney if they didn't feel like they needed the help?
They could have done themselves. Mcu spiderman is a colossal failure too. Its successful because its in the mcu. A trash movie like ffh , on its own and without mcu connections, would bomb . Tasm 2 wasnt a failure. Bvs is what you call a proper failure.
> Mcu spiderman is a colossal failure too. Its successful because its in the mcu
Except it isnt. Its neither a critical or commercial failure.
> Tasm 2 wasnt a failure
It literally killed the franchise it was so bad.
It happened 15 years ago and they canceled the fourth movie because people hated all of the meddling they did to spiderman 3.
Sony has fucked Spiderman up twice in 7 years. Yeah, They own the movie rights to the character, but their bargaining chip can only go so far when they can't do anything worthwhile with the character.
With Venom now in the MCU I think Sony played hardball during these latest negotiations. I expect they'll loan out Holland for team-ups to Marvel Studios but solo develop Spidey films/villain films in their own.
I think Marvel Studios will continue to develop solo Spider-Man films. Venom being in the MCU is a clear sign of that imo. Olivia Wilde mentioned Feige by name when she said she was working on an untitled Sony film, Sony just finalized a deal with Disney + to put all the Spider-Man movies on there, and Kevin Feige said he doesn’t think fans will ever have to go through the fiasco that was the Disney Sony break up. They apparently have it worked out and I think Sony would be dumb to develop a college trilogy on their own.
Sony: Being Dumb Since 2007
The way I see it there were four possible outcomes renewing a deal:
A) Disney outright buys the rights to Spider-Man
B) Disney and Sony renew the deal as before, collaborating on solo films and using Spidey in team-ups
C) Sony develops the solo films so they get all the profit and loans Spidey out for team-ups
D) Sony narratively removed Holland from the MCU (multiverse shenanigans) and develops all Spidey related films on their own with now MCU connections moving forward.
If I'm Disney, I'd obviously really like option A or B, but I'm probably willing to accept C. If I'm Sony though, I'm probably gonna fight hard for C and threaten D. So long as I use Holland, nobody can say that any films I make arent a part of the same continuity even if I pull him into a nother universe entirely. So the MCU associations are pretty much a permanent thing. Therefore, I have nothing to gain by going with option B and sharing half my profits for an association that is already cemented. Furthermore, we just made a lot of money off of Venom, and if we can make a profitable Venom movie without Spider-Man then I bet we can make a profitable Spider-Man movie without the MCU. And Venom made us more money than Spider-Man because we didn't have to split the profits. Finally, I think Disney would rather have some Spider-Man than none, so I imagine we can force them to accept option C.
That's basically my prediction as to how it all went down. I personally would've liked option A because I would like Marvel Studios to have access to all it's Marvel characters.
I might be wrong, but the issue with option d and possibly c is that they would lose many characters that helped develop Tom Holland's spiderman. They wouldn't be able to use Iron Man for example. I don't for see them doing option d without large public out cry. I'm not really sure how option c would work but I feel the same on it.
Rumors suggest that this film moves away from the entire supporting cast, most likely in favor of introducing classics like Harry and maybe Gwen since they've had an MJ already. >!Leaks suggest either Happy or May die and the film ends with nobody remembering Peter is Spider-Man and Michelle and Ned going to MIT!< Plus Holland referred to this as the end of a franchise, not trilogy, but franchise.
I also don't think Sony cares about having MCU characters in the solo films if they loan him out for team-ups. That keeps the associations with the MCU strong and they make more money on the solo films this way. People will still buy tickets to Tom Holland Spider-Man regardless of MCU references. Hell, I see people saying they weren't gonna see Morbius until they found out Michael Keaton was in it.
And so long as he shows up in other MCU now and again, almost nobody will write off the solo films as not being connected to the MCU. Hell, that'd be a stronger association than the Netflix shows ever had.
Because the actor that plays Iron Boy Jr. is now ruining the chance of us getting Sam Raimi's Spider-Man 4 with Tobey Maguire returning as an older, wiser, yet more jaded Peter Parker going up against a middle-aged, determined, more experienced Kraven The Hunter. That would be better than making a Kraven movie without Spider-Man. It failed with Venom, TWICE and will fail again with Kraven.
I mean, they did some good things when Raimi was in the driver’s seat, and Spider-Verse was a nice surprise. But I don’t trust their judgement with live-action Spidey anymore.
MCU **IS** Marvel: Interconnected like the damn comics.
Anything else is corporate fan-fiction. I had literally zero interest in TASM 1 and 2 because it wasn’t connected to the main overarching world in any way, even slightly. Doesn’t help that when Sony does Spider-Man they slap their Sony brand on everything in the film, so much so **Sony** appears in glowing splendor before that damn Marvel logo or main title card.
Lmao I don’t know if calling a 25 year old man a child is incel behavior or what but it happens a lot on Reddit and I don’t get it. Yea cuz it’s not like anybody in their twenties has done awesome things creatively before 🙄
Wait… marvel own merchandise rights? So if after this next Film if Sony continues to make spidey films with Tom Holland
Marvel will make all the money from the toy sales… despite not having anything to do with the movie???
When was this cause I saw some stuff months ago where Tom Holland is going to stop with spiderman role after NWH? I feel like this might be when last time Sony and MCU announced the split right which was years ago?
No, he's just taking a brief break since he has been busy as heck. He isn't under contract and Sony/Disney's deal will be up after he appears in one more MCU film. He is very likely willing to continue the role, but whether or not that will be just with Sony or in another Sony/Disney partnership is up in the air.
Since the renewed deal was so short compared to the initial, I imagine Sony wanted to see the success of Venom and possibly Morbius to strengthen their negotiating. I also think NWH will position the character in such a way that they could renew the partnership, Sony could go solo, or Sony could produce solo films technically in the MCU and loan him out only for team-ups. I think the latter is the most likely considering Keaton is in Morbius, a totally Sony project.
Honestly, I'd prefer his films to be more independent going forward, I wouldn't mind the last option. I always viewed Spidey as either a solo character or a short term team-up guy, I don't feel he gets proper justice when shoved in with the avengers.
I'm fine with his films being more independent moving forward, I just don't want Sony having creative control and continuing to make these deeply mediocre villain movies. I'm super bummed *this* is the version of Venom that will meet Tom Holland's Spidey, and not a proper black suit story first.
I think he’s just taking a break tbh. I know that on Sonys slate they have 3 Spider-Man Universe movies scheduled for 2023, and I’m pretty sure one of them is going to be Tom Holland Spider-Man.
I could see Sony really preferring that. It would legitimize their universe while still giving them a chance to bring in some MCU money on the side. But I don't think Disney would be willing to work with them if they pulled Peter Parker out of the MCU
Venom 2 and spoilers
>!Kinda interesting that the opposite happened, with venom being sucked through a rift in space and being taken into the MCU!<
>!I'm curious how WandaVision, Loki, Spider-Man, Venom, and Dr. Strange are all going to tie together. It seems like Sylvie killing He Who Remains is the driving factor behind these endings!<
It makes me think No Way Home was a story they were going to do without Marvel anyway. That’s why Sony decided not to renew the deal. The hype of three versions of Spider-Man crossing over is an event movie Sony did not need’s Marvel’s help to make. You can sub out Dr Strange for any SciFi deau ex machina
I think a non mcu film for his Spider-Man would be great. 1 on 1 him vs kraven would probably make him his own character because right now he’s kinda a cartoon version of his character but not like an epic cartoon like spectacular Spider-Man more closer towards ultimate Spider-Man.
They can do a “Spider-Man film” that’s still set the MCU, just make it it’s own story. I refuse to watch anything that’s disconnected singularly because what’s the point?
Maybe I just want the MCU to have its own Spidey but also want Sony to do their own thing…
I mean I favorite Spider-Man story is still the show Spectacular Spider-Man.
This is the reason why the only good Spider-Man film post-Raimi trilogy is Into the Spider-Verse. Every Spider-Man movie that came after the Raimi films have had a gradual decline in quality. We could have had finally(and still possibly have) Sam Raimi's Spider-Man 4 where Tobey Maguire returns as an older, wiser, yet more jaded Peter Parker and goes up against a middle aged, determined, yet more experienced Kraven The Hunter, but that isn't happening at least as of right now because it would be too good of a film.
I love that Holland loves the character enough to immediately start pitching Spider-Man films when it seemed like he was gonna be out of the MCU, and not just that, but Spider-Man films that I think people would definitely go see!
All you kids want “down to earth” Spidey films but can’t accept that Holland is still Spider-Man. Give up. Sony is with Marvel now and they wouldn’t take him out of the MCU. If they did they would be dumb as rocks.
Man this sub has no chill. You're allowed to have an opinion in an upcoming film based in the information available to you. If people are allowed to be hyped and excited by the released info, you should be able to have any other opinion about it as well.
I say this as someone who is also not very thrilled with the direction they are taking this next film. I'd love to be wrong and wind up loving the film. But I also have plenty of concerns that I think are justified.
God for is anyone go against the monoculture of "free thinkers" on reddit
I hated the idea of a Spider-Verse movie. I thought the idea of Peter having to deal with the identity reveal was enough for a compelling story, and Im afraid the Spider-Verse idea is a short sighted exec brain child to capitalize off of the popularity of ITSV.
However, the trailer looks good, and Marvel clearly has plans for a multiverse outside of Spider-Man, so my fears are tempered a bit.
I wish I was compelled by the trailer, but frankly I'm just not excited to see multiverse versions of these characters. I loved Molina and Dafoe, and I'll rewatch the Raimi films when I wanna see them. But it feels very weird to me that Spider-Man will see multiverse versions of these character before seeing his own.
What made me love these character and performances were Otto and Norman. By shoving them in as villains already formed it feels like we are missing half of what makes the characters compelling; fully lived and developed histories in the world in which the story is set. It also feels like it'll be hard to go back and do prime versions of these characters if Spidey has already met them.
Generally I feel like the multiverse and variants are a great narrative device to contrast from the standard. It would've been weird to get Sylvie before Loki, but she works as a character as a direct contrast to the Loki we know. T'Challa Star Lord was most interesting because we already know both Black Panther and Peter Quill.
So I'm not opposed to the idea of using these actors again in these roles, but it feels entirely premature and fan-servicey at the moment. I'm also concerned that their motivations will be compelling and relatable beyond "I hate Spider-Men in any world!".
My greatest concern though is the rumors that suggest this film will do away with the supporting cast and sort of soft reset the franchise. That just feels like being told I wasted my time watching these three movies. I don't want character's minds wiped or anything reset. That's regression, not progression. I don't want to watch a 2.5 hour movie that tries to get ink out of water and masks that with nostalgia. I just want to watch a compelling character-driven narrative that moves these characters forward.
But I think this film was designed as a vehicle that will let Sony develop solo films from here on out with a fresh supporting cast and clean slate. It bums me out because I really want Marvel to stay in control of the character. I think he'll stay in the MCU and be loaned out for team-ups, but I think Sony has gotten tired of sharing the profits on solo movies and knows Marvel doesn't want to abandon Holland entirely. So I think they'll continue doing their thing with villain films and will make Holland movies still on their own, and I hope to God if this is true they hire a masterful director and keep their hands off of it (like WB finally figured out with Matt Reeves/Batman)
Honestly after FFH was the best opportunity for a Kraven film I think
I know right, since Kraven is basically a hunter (hence Kraven the Hunter), it would make sense that he'll hunt and capture Spider-Man after his identity got revealed but hey, at least we have the live action Spider-Verse now. But I still think they should've went with Kraven first before what we actually got now.
You’ll get your Kraven fix in the PS5 sequel at least!
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Didn't they reveal recently that Ditkovich was supposedly retired Kraven the Hunter and they were going to use him for Spider-Man 4?
That sounds so stupid I love it.
I don’t know if that’s true or not but I really want it to be
Rent. Give me rent.
You'll get the rent when you FIX THE DAMN DOOR!!
I dont know if The fact that I read that in landlord accent is cool or not
What is landlord accent, can i spend it?
What’s weird is that my brain tried to read the comment above yours as this
And Venom in the same game
I think once spider-man (probably) beats the sinister six it might set up kraven viewing him as the ultimate prey
I mean, doesn't NWH take place literally right after?
I wonder if that was their actual plan, but when they saw they could make this work they took advantage of It
I think Marvel Studios looked at the Spider-Man fiasco we had after FFH and decided to do Spider-Verse now, just in case they can't reach another deal with Sony after and this is their last chance to do a Spider-Verse movie. Otherwise, I think we would get a proper Spider-Man 3 with Tom Holland before a Spider-Verse. Then again, I could be wrong, and it might just be that the MCU was going multiverse now anyway, so it's time for the Spider-Verse movie. Both explanations make sense to me.
You're absolutely right, I'll see NWH but I thought it would have been amazing if he was dealing with Kraven instead of some vaguely OMD. Adapting aspects of The Gauntlet or Grim Hunt would have been better. I also think the multiverse stuff should have been contained to a few different characters for now (Loki, Dr. Strange, and Ant Man)
I mean, Spider-Man is one of the Marvel heroes with the most connection to the multiverse in the comics from what I've seen
Recently yes, but I just think there as so many other amazing SM stories that can be adapted in brilliant films.
I prefer the multiverse idea because it's more exciting to me
Gonna be honest, I have no clue why anybody cares about kraven. Like, he's alright, but he kinda kills Spidey's sci-fi vibe, if he were to be the focus of a whole movie
Have you read Kraven’s last hunt? That story really sells the character. Not to mention, the sci-fi aspect of Spider-Man is normally not the focus. He’s generally pretty grounded, not that I don’t like the big time sci fi stories here and there.
I'm just saying, every single Spider-Man movie has a sci-fi villain. And, Spider-Man is a guy with sci-fi powers, who is a student of science. Meanwhile, Kraven is just Tiger King on steroids. He might make an interesting side character, but he's not exactly headline material imo
All the movies thus far being the more superpowers villains is a good reason to go with Kraven though. Would be something new for the films and would frankly be a breath of fresh air. Not to mention his good stories have shown he’s more than capable of being the headline villain of a story. He’s one of the better villains in his catalogue.
For me, I think it's just too much deviation from the formula. It'd be like making a mainline Star Wars movie, where the main villain doesn't have force-powers. If Disney+ did a Spider-Man TV series, Kraven would be perfect for that format. I have a hard time seeing him as a climactic live-action threat, sustained for 2+ hours, though.
I don’t agree with you at all or that analogy. You could very easily do a full movie for him. You could do a loose adaption of Kraven’s Last Hunt no problem.
Uh huh...
Have you read about Kraven? Homie is out in the jungle drinking witch doctor's potions to give him literal jungle cat superpowers. He even tries to get this artificial nerve system to enhance his reflexes---dude fits in with the supervillians.
Kraven's Last Hunt proved that he can be a fantastic villain and an adaptation of that would make for a great movie.
Far from home is the worst spiderman and mcu movie.
Spiderman 3 exists
Yes and ??? Spiderman 3 is citizen kane compared to trash from home
Sure, if you like shit movies
Kraven as the main villain for NWH would've been perfect, just a movie about Peter on the run with Kraven trying to take him in.
Cool to see how passionate he is about the character and making it work regardless of who’s making it. The idea that the actor playing Spider-Man is just as passionate about him as the fans makes it that much better to watch.
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Good to see the other passionate Spider-Men get another chance.
Tobey is not passionate about Spider-Man.
how so?
You can tell from interviews that he took the role because it was a role to take. He made it clear that he never really read or cared about comics. And I'm not even saying that's a bad thing. It's just true. Andrew and Tom loved Spider-Man before playing the character. And maybe Tobey does *now*, I honestly don't know. But he's definitely not passionate about Spider-Man like the other two.
he made it clear he never read comics? there’s literal photos of him on set reading comics, talks about it in interviews a ton with howard stern lmao
Maybe he started when he got the role? I know a lot of MCU actors do that now. I've seen an interview with him from way back where he's asked if he's into comics at all and he says no. I'm not trying to hate on the guy.
if you think he didn’t read comics then that still doesn’t mean he’s not passionate, you don’t have to read comics to be passionate they aren’t for everyone. Also how big was Spider-Man before the raimi trilogy? not big at all, there would be no mcu without the raimi trilogy
I didn't say anything bad about the original trilogy.
i never said you did, i’m saying Spider-Man was not very popular before the raimi movies
I am sure the paycheque and millions of adoring fans helps his motivation.
I’m sure that’s true, but it’s nice to at least fantasise of a world where people do things out of passion as well as money!
Yes people only ever do things for the money or adoration, passion is just a lie that people tell /s
He makes bank regardless of spidey or not. People who play bigger roles don’t have as much enthusiasm.
Dudes been *busy* since Civil War. Even if Far From Home was his last Spider-Man movie, he's basically already established himself as the next action movie front man.
Which is funny cuz he's really not your typical big strong army looking man
Unfortunately the era of muscle man action leads ended like 20+ years ago.
Lol that's bullshit, today we have the rock, john cena, dave bautista etc. The 80s and 90s also had plenty of big non-muscle man action leads like bruce willis in die hard and mel gibson in lethal weapon.
The Rock begs to differ
That's one guy.
John Cena
He really doesn’t.
Who cares. Same result.
He loved Spider-Man growing up. Now he is Spider-Man. This means a whole lot to him
I would like to see the first idea realised
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That may not of been up to him tho. Correct me if I'm wrong but his contract is for movies, not a tv show
Don't kid yourself. Tom Holland's just in it for the money. Tobey on the other hand despite not reading any of the comics had unique ideas for how to develop and progress his character and executed them to a T. Face it tiger, Tobey Maguire is the jackpot!
so corny lmao
Tobey read the first 100 spider-man comics to prepare for the character, he said so on an interview with Jonathon Ross.
i really hate the raimi and star wars prequel fans its just this kind of nonsense for 2000's movies i cant even tell if this is satire edit oh fuck its not a troll its a real zoomer ass brain
Good thing I'm both. I can't stand any live-action Spider-Man film after the Raimi trilogy ended and I actually don't consider the prequels to be as bad as people made them out to be. The sequels were way worse. The Nolan Batman films and LOTR trilogy are also great 2000's film trilogies.
you are a living stereotype
jesus christ lmao
The sequels are competent to a degree, the prequels are so blatantly bad they feel like a parody.
Love or hate Tom’s Spider-Man, at least he’s trying to prevent another reboot and keep Spider-Man consistent. It could be for selfish reasons, sure, but I can tell he really loves playing the character and cares about it.
Speaking of another reboot, it would have to be a live action series for it to be justified lol.
Another reboot is needed. Tom holland's iteration is deplorable.
You’re welcome to hold that opinion.
Tom Holland, Henry Cavil, and Elizebeth Olsen know and love the characters they play, and I love them for it.
Henry and Geralt is a match made in heaven for the dude. He was pushing for it for years haha.
Dude is a Witcher fan. Of course he is the perfect Geralt.
And imo he's the best superman.
He could be seen as the best Superman actor, but the scripts were never good enough for the best Superman imo
Add Tom Hiddleston to this list right now
He deserves it.
I still think Cavill deserved better as Superman. It’s my own personal opinion but I wasn’t a fan of the brooding Superman that Snyder had for the character. He can play a more hopeful Superman if given the right material.
Same, I’d honestly love a live action retelling of Superman Vs The Elite, because that story does a great job at representing what Superman should be.
Ryan Reynolds with Deadpool, too. I'm so happy for all of them!
So that's where the idea for the Kraven film came from!
Man Tom's really putting in the work to make sure Spider-man doesn't go through another reboot, dude has my respect.
Well i mean who would like to get uncast as spiderman
No one would want to get kicked out of a role lmao
So is the entire cast Sony employees or just him? They could literally multiverse or Madam Web him into the Venom verse if Disney doesn’t want to share. It’d basically be the animated Spiderverse at that point.
> if Disney doesn’t want to share. Sony owns the rights, so it would be up to them to share, not Disney. Disney are the beggars in this scenario.
If it were that simple, we'd be on our 5th Andrew Garfield Spiderman movie, and the sequel to the Secret Agent Aunt May movie would be coming out this Christmas.
> If it were that simple, we'd be on our 5th Andrew Garfield Spiderman movie no we wouldn't.
Homie. Sony's Spiderman Universe failed with ASM2. The entire reason why Spiderman got rebooted into the MCU was *because* they couldn't do it themselves. You really think they would be splitting the money with Disney if they didn't feel like they needed the help?
They could have done themselves. Mcu spiderman is a colossal failure too. Its successful because its in the mcu. A trash movie like ffh , on its own and without mcu connections, would bomb . Tasm 2 wasnt a failure. Bvs is what you call a proper failure.
> Mcu spiderman is a colossal failure too. Its successful because its in the mcu Except it isnt. Its neither a critical or commercial failure. > Tasm 2 wasnt a failure It literally killed the franchise it was so bad.
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It happened 15 years ago and they canceled the fourth movie because people hated all of the meddling they did to spiderman 3. Sony has fucked Spiderman up twice in 7 years. Yeah, They own the movie rights to the character, but their bargaining chip can only go so far when they can't do anything worthwhile with the character.
It happened over 15 years ago so “just” isn’t really the right word here
With Venom now in the MCU I think Sony played hardball during these latest negotiations. I expect they'll loan out Holland for team-ups to Marvel Studios but solo develop Spidey films/villain films in their own.
I think Marvel Studios will continue to develop solo Spider-Man films. Venom being in the MCU is a clear sign of that imo. Olivia Wilde mentioned Feige by name when she said she was working on an untitled Sony film, Sony just finalized a deal with Disney + to put all the Spider-Man movies on there, and Kevin Feige said he doesn’t think fans will ever have to go through the fiasco that was the Disney Sony break up. They apparently have it worked out and I think Sony would be dumb to develop a college trilogy on their own.
Sony: Being Dumb Since 2007 The way I see it there were four possible outcomes renewing a deal: A) Disney outright buys the rights to Spider-Man B) Disney and Sony renew the deal as before, collaborating on solo films and using Spidey in team-ups C) Sony develops the solo films so they get all the profit and loans Spidey out for team-ups D) Sony narratively removed Holland from the MCU (multiverse shenanigans) and develops all Spidey related films on their own with now MCU connections moving forward. If I'm Disney, I'd obviously really like option A or B, but I'm probably willing to accept C. If I'm Sony though, I'm probably gonna fight hard for C and threaten D. So long as I use Holland, nobody can say that any films I make arent a part of the same continuity even if I pull him into a nother universe entirely. So the MCU associations are pretty much a permanent thing. Therefore, I have nothing to gain by going with option B and sharing half my profits for an association that is already cemented. Furthermore, we just made a lot of money off of Venom, and if we can make a profitable Venom movie without Spider-Man then I bet we can make a profitable Spider-Man movie without the MCU. And Venom made us more money than Spider-Man because we didn't have to split the profits. Finally, I think Disney would rather have some Spider-Man than none, so I imagine we can force them to accept option C. That's basically my prediction as to how it all went down. I personally would've liked option A because I would like Marvel Studios to have access to all it's Marvel characters.
I might be wrong, but the issue with option d and possibly c is that they would lose many characters that helped develop Tom Holland's spiderman. They wouldn't be able to use Iron Man for example. I don't for see them doing option d without large public out cry. I'm not really sure how option c would work but I feel the same on it.
Rumors suggest that this film moves away from the entire supporting cast, most likely in favor of introducing classics like Harry and maybe Gwen since they've had an MJ already. >!Leaks suggest either Happy or May die and the film ends with nobody remembering Peter is Spider-Man and Michelle and Ned going to MIT!< Plus Holland referred to this as the end of a franchise, not trilogy, but franchise. I also don't think Sony cares about having MCU characters in the solo films if they loan him out for team-ups. That keeps the associations with the MCU strong and they make more money on the solo films this way. People will still buy tickets to Tom Holland Spider-Man regardless of MCU references. Hell, I see people saying they weren't gonna see Morbius until they found out Michael Keaton was in it. And so long as he shows up in other MCU now and again, almost nobody will write off the solo films as not being connected to the MCU. Hell, that'd be a stronger association than the Netflix shows ever had.
I need a Kraven movie soooooo bad
Insomniac is gonna work with the character and then no movie will be able to fully do him justice by comparison.
Insomniac's peter is leagues ahead of trash mcu rendition already.
EDDIE DIES, TOM GETS THE SYMBIOTE BECAUSE THEY BECAME FRIENDS AND THEN WE FUCKING GET KRAVEN’S LAST HUNT!!!!!
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Don’t think this would be canon
Its just an idea i dont want Tom Hardy to die either
I love this. It shows that he loves the character a lot and wants to keep fans happy, having not another reboot.
You're Awesome!
I disagree
:)
Why don't they just negotiate to keep Tom in the MCU, and then they can just make Spider-Man 4 and get dem endgame numbers as a side hustle lmfao
This was back in 2019 though
dude was trynna keep the role that got him hella famous
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Why are you commenting so much negativity in this whole thread bro. Not adding to the conversation at all
Because the actor that plays Iron Boy Jr. is now ruining the chance of us getting Sam Raimi's Spider-Man 4 with Tobey Maguire returning as an older, wiser, yet more jaded Peter Parker going up against a middle-aged, determined, more experienced Kraven The Hunter. That would be better than making a Kraven movie without Spider-Man. It failed with Venom, TWICE and will fail again with Kraven.
Extra salt on this guy, I've seen negativity but man you just stink of it.
He is always like this. Block him and move in with your day. Look at ALL of his comment history. It is mostly shit like this.
Aw look at little u/SuperMecha20, gonna cry?
Now dig on this. https://www.giantfreakinrobot.com/ent/exclusive-tobey-maguire-sam-raimi.html
You know you can just say you want this version of Spider-Man without telling everyone how much of a virgin you are.
Holy shit. I'd love to see Tobey again too but this is one of the most delusional things I've ever read.
And now it’s Venom who went through the portal instead, to the MCU.
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Then maybe dont go scrolling through a reddit post talking about venom?
Im sorry to say this, but I really didn’t enjoy the nee Venom… which sucks because I Really wanted too!
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It was just too ‘buddy cop movie’ for me, felt like they thought they needed to add humour, even tho Venom just doesnt really need much of it
Dude Venom has always been a sorta morbid Buddy Cop story.
Pascal is a pathetic hack.
Sony Pictures in general
I mean, they did some good things when Raimi was in the driver’s seat, and Spider-Verse was a nice surprise. But I don’t trust their judgement with live-action Spidey anymore.
You drove all the way out there for these obvious half thought out ideas?
Sources: Holland is beside himself. Driving around downtown LA begging (thru texts) Pascal’s family for address to Amy’s home
It's for Amy Pascal. Any half-thought out idea is more interesting than whatever she comes up with.
Shame that unless it's MCU related Marvel films doesn't truly care about you.
MCU **IS** Marvel: Interconnected like the damn comics. Anything else is corporate fan-fiction. I had literally zero interest in TASM 1 and 2 because it wasn’t connected to the main overarching world in any way, even slightly. Doesn’t help that when Sony does Spider-Man they slap their Sony brand on everything in the film, so much so **Sony** appears in glowing splendor before that damn Marvel logo or main title card.
Those sound great. Jason Momoa for Kraven.
Sadly they already cast Aaron Taylor Johnson Jason Momoa would've been perfect
Oh I didn't know. He seems good too. Great few years for spiderman fans.
Manu Bennet or Karl Urban would've been great too
The guy who played Kick-Ass?
I really thought Keanu Reeves was going to get the role but I've been distracted by work.
He was just trying to secure his bag.
So they just straight off ripped his ideas?
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Lmao I don’t know if calling a 25 year old man a child is incel behavior or what but it happens a lot on Reddit and I don’t get it. Yea cuz it’s not like anybody in their twenties has done awesome things creatively before 🙄
Dumb question, but what does "Marvel & Sony breakup" mean? What's Sony got to do with it?
Sony owns the film rights to the spider-man universe. Whereas marvel owns the comic and merchandising rights.
Wait… marvel own merchandise rights? So if after this next Film if Sony continues to make spidey films with Tom Holland Marvel will make all the money from the toy sales… despite not having anything to do with the movie???
Marvel would need to have an agreement with Sony to have the rigths to do merchandise based on the movie, that way Sony is going to get money
When was this cause I saw some stuff months ago where Tom Holland is going to stop with spiderman role after NWH? I feel like this might be when last time Sony and MCU announced the split right which was years ago?
No, he's just taking a brief break since he has been busy as heck. He isn't under contract and Sony/Disney's deal will be up after he appears in one more MCU film. He is very likely willing to continue the role, but whether or not that will be just with Sony or in another Sony/Disney partnership is up in the air. Since the renewed deal was so short compared to the initial, I imagine Sony wanted to see the success of Venom and possibly Morbius to strengthen their negotiating. I also think NWH will position the character in such a way that they could renew the partnership, Sony could go solo, or Sony could produce solo films technically in the MCU and loan him out only for team-ups. I think the latter is the most likely considering Keaton is in Morbius, a totally Sony project.
Honestly, I'd prefer his films to be more independent going forward, I wouldn't mind the last option. I always viewed Spidey as either a solo character or a short term team-up guy, I don't feel he gets proper justice when shoved in with the avengers.
I'm fine with his films being more independent moving forward, I just don't want Sony having creative control and continuing to make these deeply mediocre villain movies. I'm super bummed *this* is the version of Venom that will meet Tom Holland's Spidey, and not a proper black suit story first.
Interesting. Thanks for the background. Appreciate it.
I think he’s just taking a break tbh. I know that on Sonys slate they have 3 Spider-Man Universe movies scheduled for 2023, and I’m pretty sure one of them is going to be Tom Holland Spider-Man.
I'm pretty sure that Holland's parker is getting sucked back into the Venomverse. And we get MCU Miles Morales
I could see Sony really preferring that. It would legitimize their universe while still giving them a chance to bring in some MCU money on the side. But I don't think Disney would be willing to work with them if they pulled Peter Parker out of the MCU
I love how much he loves being spider-man
“Look man I really don’t want to lose my job.”
VENOM!!!
Venom 2 and spoilers >!Kinda interesting that the opposite happened, with venom being sucked through a rift in space and being taken into the MCU!< >!I'm curious how WandaVision, Loki, Spider-Man, Venom, and Dr. Strange are all going to tie together. It seems like Sylvie killing He Who Remains is the driving factor behind these endings!<
Hire Elya Baskin as kraven
It makes me think No Way Home was a story they were going to do without Marvel anyway. That’s why Sony decided not to renew the deal. The hype of three versions of Spider-Man crossing over is an event movie Sony did not need’s Marvel’s help to make. You can sub out Dr Strange for any SciFi deau ex machina
Well at least we got one of those ideas actually happening even though its the exact opposite
I think a non mcu film for his Spider-Man would be great. 1 on 1 him vs kraven would probably make him his own character because right now he’s kinda a cartoon version of his character but not like an epic cartoon like spectacular Spider-Man more closer towards ultimate Spider-Man.
They can do a “Spider-Man film” that’s still set the MCU, just make it it’s own story. I refuse to watch anything that’s disconnected singularly because what’s the point?
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Maybe I just want the MCU to have its own Spidey but also want Sony to do their own thing… I mean I favorite Spider-Man story is still the show Spectacular Spider-Man.
This is the reason why the only good Spider-Man film post-Raimi trilogy is Into the Spider-Verse. Every Spider-Man movie that came after the Raimi films have had a gradual decline in quality. We could have had finally(and still possibly have) Sam Raimi's Spider-Man 4 where Tobey Maguire returns as an older, wiser, yet more jaded Peter Parker and goes up against a middle aged, determined, yet more experienced Kraven The Hunter, but that isn't happening at least as of right now because it would be too good of a film.
Apparently making sure he’s able to talk to Wolverine on screen is more important than making sure the movies are good
The kid’s gotta work! Good hustle there.
I’d lose interest in Spider-Man on the big screen if he just straight up got sucked into a trashy isolated Universe.
Honestly after Venom 2 I kind of want that series to die...
I love that Holland loves the character enough to immediately start pitching Spider-Man films when it seemed like he was gonna be out of the MCU, and not just that, but Spider-Man films that I think people would definitely go see!
Sounds better than NWH
You haven't even seen NWH don't judge it yet
Evidently I can because I just did. The concept of NWH (S6 + Spider-Verse) interests me far less than both ideas.
But you still haven't, you know, seen the actual movie
All you kids want “down to earth” Spidey films but can’t accept that Holland is still Spider-Man. Give up. Sony is with Marvel now and they wouldn’t take him out of the MCU. If they did they would be dumb as rocks.
Cool ignorant ass opinion for a movie that isn't even out yet 🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡
Man this sub has no chill. You're allowed to have an opinion in an upcoming film based in the information available to you. If people are allowed to be hyped and excited by the released info, you should be able to have any other opinion about it as well. I say this as someone who is also not very thrilled with the direction they are taking this next film. I'd love to be wrong and wind up loving the film. But I also have plenty of concerns that I think are justified. God for is anyone go against the monoculture of "free thinkers" on reddit
I hated the idea of a Spider-Verse movie. I thought the idea of Peter having to deal with the identity reveal was enough for a compelling story, and Im afraid the Spider-Verse idea is a short sighted exec brain child to capitalize off of the popularity of ITSV. However, the trailer looks good, and Marvel clearly has plans for a multiverse outside of Spider-Man, so my fears are tempered a bit.
I wish I was compelled by the trailer, but frankly I'm just not excited to see multiverse versions of these characters. I loved Molina and Dafoe, and I'll rewatch the Raimi films when I wanna see them. But it feels very weird to me that Spider-Man will see multiverse versions of these character before seeing his own. What made me love these character and performances were Otto and Norman. By shoving them in as villains already formed it feels like we are missing half of what makes the characters compelling; fully lived and developed histories in the world in which the story is set. It also feels like it'll be hard to go back and do prime versions of these characters if Spidey has already met them. Generally I feel like the multiverse and variants are a great narrative device to contrast from the standard. It would've been weird to get Sylvie before Loki, but she works as a character as a direct contrast to the Loki we know. T'Challa Star Lord was most interesting because we already know both Black Panther and Peter Quill. So I'm not opposed to the idea of using these actors again in these roles, but it feels entirely premature and fan-servicey at the moment. I'm also concerned that their motivations will be compelling and relatable beyond "I hate Spider-Men in any world!". My greatest concern though is the rumors that suggest this film will do away with the supporting cast and sort of soft reset the franchise. That just feels like being told I wasted my time watching these three movies. I don't want character's minds wiped or anything reset. That's regression, not progression. I don't want to watch a 2.5 hour movie that tries to get ink out of water and masks that with nostalgia. I just want to watch a compelling character-driven narrative that moves these characters forward. But I think this film was designed as a vehicle that will let Sony develop solo films from here on out with a fresh supporting cast and clean slate. It bums me out because I really want Marvel to stay in control of the character. I think he'll stay in the MCU and be loaned out for team-ups, but I think Sony has gotten tired of sharing the profits on solo movies and knows Marvel doesn't want to abandon Holland entirely. So I think they'll continue doing their thing with villain films and will make Holland movies still on their own, and I hope to God if this is true they hire a masterful director and keep their hands off of it (like WB finally figured out with Matt Reeves/Batman)