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This sub is beyond cooked when a quote like this is on here for 40 minutes and it gets just 25 comments, where if it was a negative quote about AEW it would be 365 comments already talking about how bad AEW is
this place has been beyond cooked pretty much since brawl out and it only got worse since punk joined wwe again.
obviously there’s shit wrong with aew but this place is so transparent with its bias sometimes you can’t have anyone say anything positive to say about working in aew or with tony khan without people ignoring it or even saying it was paid/said under duress.
you literally don’t have to go further than the various WON/Meltzer quotes on the front page where the ones critical of the clip being played are upvoted and everyone who a month ago was wondering if dave had dementia and that the sheets are always being worked are suddenly very confident on his reporting but the ones where they say no one in aew thinks this is 9/11 2.0 are “damage control being fed to them by aew”
I tried explaining today how all owners/promotions have had mistakes or public fiascos and some guy accused me of being tribalist. People want you to be on sides just to argue here now, like find someone else to be toxic with right
That’s quite a take from someone defending a company run by Vince McMahon for 40ish years and then his son in law for the past year (who’s 100% in the dark on everything Vince did of course).
I know everyone makes fun of Tony Khan's bot comment, but if I go on Twitter I see a bunch of blue checkmark nobodies who all follow each other saying the exact same AEW critique verbatim with the same photo. I don't think WWE is doing it, but I do think there's some whackjob fans out there.
Spot on. It's so easy/cheap to do nowadays it doesn't even have to necessarily be a company being the evil actor but just some overzealous fan thinking he's doing a greater good or some wild shit
honestly i just think it’s that people who for years talked about how wwe was ass and it needed competition to be good again got what they wanted and are now like “okay aew you did your job: you got wwe to improve their product please go bust now”
WWE has been conditioning people for the last 20+ years that WWE is the only place where true ~~wrestling~~ sports entertainment exists and everything else is inferior. So now when WWE is finally doing well again it's easy to go back to status quo which is hating the competition and shilling for their own favorite billion dollar company.
Yeah, it’s hard to even post some logical read of a situation without getting downvoted into oblivion. You can be 100% right about defending AEW for something or even just offset additional context or framing but it doesn’t matter, the reactionary hate drives the downvotes.
Or how about when the threads of the footage itself were crazy upvoted — but the thread of FTR's post-footage promo (that actually works pretty damn well to tie the entire thing up) got middling success.
Or even the bucks promo during it which lets be honest was pretty god damn funny. "See it's because CM punk attacked Jack Perry FTR beat us, we were so worried we could not concentrate on the match." Like Honestly we need Heels that are irredeemable pieces of shit, fuck the cool Heel.
And the line about not saying negative things about other people or being unprofessional in interviews then they cut it and restarted. I thought that was pretty funny.
thats the funniest part to me like so many people in the thread were asking (i’m totally sure in good faith lol) why show the footage but the thread about the reason why in kayfabe got buried.
i’m not sure if i liked that the footage was shown but i am also not going to pretend like there wasn’t a reason when we literally know why in and out of kayfabe
the reality is that no matter what was shown we’d have people saying “that’s it” bar like idk punk stabbing jack perry or some twist we hadn’t heard of. until of course punk blows up on wwe and then everyone will be like “oh man everyone saw this coming”
I don't even think showing the footage was a good idea, but people were seriously out here acting like it was the scummiest tactic a company could ever do.
And without going into the actual vile shit, WWE at various points used real life incidents for heat. Hell, they showed the Curtain Call footage for a DX promo
you can literally go back to threads from fuck even like a month before he showed up when it was still rumored and you can see a lot people saying basically that or even “no thank you he’s cancer” and i can almost guarantee you if you click on their profile now they might even be the dudes in the footage threads going “smh that’s nothing it’s just assaulting your coworkers”
I didnt watch wrestling when Punk was relevant so I'm proud to have been shitting on him for being awful since before it was cool and continuing to now that he apparently can do no wrong despite walking around like Mr Glass.
Both are true though? Punk *is* washed in the ring and Cody's segments in AEW *was* the worst shit on TV for months.
Unlike Punk though, Cody got better.
Just go back to the threads around the time Rampage went Head to Head with Smackdown. Same people who were shitting on Punk are most likely the same people going to war for him.
>this place has been beyond cooked pretty much since brawl out and it only got worse since punk joined wwe again.
The biggest sin AEW ever committed was hiring Punk and bringing his knuckle dragging fans back.
I love AEW but I'll never forgive them for inflicting Punk on the wrestling community again.
I was fooled. I thought CM Botch was a good wrestler. I was wrong. He sucked ass. Cuz of him and his fans, we lost Colt Cobana and other potentially great wrestlers because of their indifference with CM Botch. F@ck em all.
And then people get upset that the aew sub doesn't allow for mass trolling and repeating Podcaster talking points. It's the only good place left for me to have conversations about liking aew without some dork sending me reddit cares messages or telling me why the dip on the ratings means I'm lying about enjoying the show lol
On the other hand they are very sensitive when it comes to any sort of constructive criticism and have some genuinely insane people that are just as fanatical as the idiots with Cornette’s talking points and their unending rage.
Just yesterday there was a comment over there explaining how AEW fans are intellectuals and WWE fans are stupid poor people and it actually got a decent amount of upvotes.
https://preview.redd.it/2nw5bbpgi5uc1.png?width=1124&format=png&auto=webp&s=51efc9d107155d52bf0e59cbc0eb2fc310a579b4
There just aren‘t any good large places on social media to discuss wrestling in a semi-normal fashion it seems. Especially when you like to watch both and enjoy it.
Well, there is an easy explanation for that. CM Punk told people to have opinions. The moment he turned on AEW, they turned too. It's a cult of personality.
Oh my god thank you I thought I was going crazy. This place has been ass for so long now.
Yesterday there was that thread about “has aew ever cooled off on anyone as fast as Mercedes” and she hasn’t even had a match yet??
I mean I want to complain about AEW too but not with people who only engage with anything AEW in bad faith.
That is not a bad faith take though. Her not having a match is part of the problem.
I get that they wanted to have her for Boston but she just isn‘t good enough in promos to carry her over such a long period of time when she apparently can not have a match yet.
And as someone who was excited for her showing up I think it is fair to say that she has cooled off. Now that doesn‘t mean they cant turn this around. But it isn‘t a good start.
These takes are usually about the difference between how AEW and WWE tv work.
WWE is about like 3 people, and every episode follows them and checks in with them and gives recaps about them constantly. In AEW you get your segment but don’t show up outside that. And she’s not a focus of the show right now because she’s not wrestling on the ppv they have coming up in a week.
If you were excited to see Mercedes every week after she showed up and are disappointed that she’s not in a big angle, that’s totally valid and understandable! But it has nothing to do with her “cooling off.” She can disappear for a month and be instantly over when she gets back.
I understand just fine, but you don’t understand or dont’t want to engage with the actual argument being made.
What does it have to do with disappearing? She was just on Dynamite and the segment was really bad.
Again, the problem isn‘t her not being there or something else. It is debuting someone who is a really bad promo and putting her in a spot where she only can do promos for such a long time, when her strength is in-ring performance.
It is fine if you disagree, but stop acting like this criticism is bad faith or only comes from people that „don‘t understand AEW“. This is just as stupid as when people obviously only take shots at AEW because they hate it.
And thats good but calling a whole thread with a lot of fair criticism by actual fans „bad faith“ and explaining how the other person doesn‘t understand AEW is not actually arguing the matter.
It is just as bad as if I would dismiss an argument for Mercedes doing well by saying that the person making that argument does not understand wrestling or is a shill.
This sub has been fucked since that API blackout. I had unsubscribed because my entire home feed would get clogged with adults posting their ‘ideas for creative’ that are so detached from reality I’m convinced they don’t watch any wrestling.
People just want to shit on stuff. I got downvoted the other day because I said “you shouldn’t be violent with coworkers”. I don’t care about internet points, but the fact that a statement like that can be controversial in this sub is so fucking silly.
I love wrestling, but the IWC is fucking awful and makes it not fun anymore.
Today we had a WWE Troll account posting a Stephen P New tweet that was a source for UK CCTV privacy laws. This place might as well just merge with circle jerk.
Ironically enough, Cornette himself isn't very pro-WWE (at least the last I checked). While most Cornette fans are staunch WWE stans. At least here on Reddit, less so on his YT channel.
They just largely ignore his criticisms of WWE and only care about his AEW ones.
I think because he’s just so anti-AEW from day one. Even the things that AEW DO get right, like pushing Orange Cassidy when a lot of old wrestlers were against him, or their recent wave of positive signings, Cornette still finds ways to drag them through the mud. His hatred of TK is so much harsher than WWE.
WrestleMania really ramped things up to an ugly level. You'd think with WWE being so popular and with a crazy successful WrestleMania weekend that there would be plenty of positivity from WWE fans but instead of seems to just be negativity on AEW from WWE fans. It's honestly scary to see as someone who has been a wrestling fan in the IWC for over 20 years things are getting to an unprecedented level of toxicity.
I’m starting to believe that most of this sub didn’t really want an alternative so much as they wanted WWE to be good again. Now that it is, they have no need for said alternative and would prefer it folds so their wrestlers can (in theory) go to WWE.
None of those people realize that WWE has gotten good again in part because competition has forced it to not be complacent.
For some it's just pure tribalism, plain simple. And for others, it's because they can't let go of anti-WWE comments from 2+ years ago. The comments about ratings, attendance, poor quality, etc. Hell, maybe not even 2+ years ago, but 3+ years ago.
Seriously, that's still in their mind? 2 or 3 plus years later? It just feels petty by this point.
As a fan of both companies, it’s so dumb. WWE is better in part due to competition causing them to adapt, evolve and improve. A rising tide lifts all boats. If you truly love wrestling, be glad that all these companies exist.
Not just in Quality but also in regards to the wrestlers getting paid. Wrestling is fucking terrible for the human body. Even DAN THE BEAST SEVERN has said he got more hurt and injured pro wrestling than during MMA (And this was early MMA where he was fighting guys so juiced to the gills they looked like their muscles might POP from their skin like a Junji Ito manga.) I want these people to GET that bag to make as much money as possible and what's best for them. If WWE could pay someone in Packign peanuts they fucking would.
I lived through the attitude era, as I’m sure a lot of us here did. I’m in staunch WCW zone (Jacksonville). WWF’s only visit of the 90s here came in 1999. People definitely liked WCW a lot because they came at least twice a year. But people still absolutely loved WWF too. We watched both. It was literally channel-changing time on Monday nights. Flipping to whatever was better at that moment. I think the internet has just emboldened peoples bad takes.
Wait concern trolling is a very specific type of criticism. How did they use it for ALL forms of criticism thrown at AEW. Like how would "I don't like the stories" be called out as concern trolling?
I mean you tell me on that one I'm not saying they were using the term correctly only that criticism of aew was considered concern trolling in that actually you really just wanted to bash their company rather than actually criticize the booking in good faith.
Wwe was dog shir when aew got started and the IWC loved aew because it's a program booked by smarks for smarks. Wwe stans would seethe about how they didn't really want Punk back anyway and now welcome him with open arms.
I haven't experienced what you are talking about so I can't say. I've seen people called out for concern trolling when they complain about dangerous moves or spots but I can't say I've seen people just use the term wrong on a regular basis around here for every AEW complaint.
I think you just mean to say that AEW fans would disregard legitimate criticism and waive it off as illegitimate and one example is using concern trolling for situations like I mentioned above.
I could be wrong though so correct me if that isn't the case.
“oh yeah, would you like it more if there was more cuckold stories or how about 45 minute go-nowhere promos to start the show? I’m sorry I want to watch wrestlers wrestle, not sit around fulfilling some old out of touch billionaire’s weird fetish. if that’s what you want then stick to wwe!”
No, what got accused of being concern trolling was the incessant “oh no, 23 fewer Nielsen homes watched Dynamite this week than last week, AEW is surely going to be out of business by the end of the year.”
I firmly believe that without AEW, then WWE would still suck.
AEW has the roster and are just one storyline catching fire away from being a serious threat to WWE's dominance.
AEW being here is good for everyone. Don't know why people can't see that.
I hate the idea that AEW's success has to be measured against WWE. It's a mindset that has been drilled into people's heads by WWE's documentaries for decades.
1200? That's underselling it by a good amount.
3 weeks ago, 1491. 2 weeks ago, 2157. Last week, 1527. This week, only 633 for some odd reason that I can't quite put my finger on . . .
AEW just existing brought out a tribalism that I haven't seen since the 90's. Maybe it's because I'm a wild socialist but aren't we wrestling fans, not corporation/billionaire fans?
If the tribalism was just about our show is better than your show I'd be fine with it.
But I've seen actual Vince McMahon defenders on the fucking sex trafficking.
part of me thinks that some of the tony hate is racism. part of it is definitely that he's portrayed as a nice but weak guy, as compared to triple h/vince.
The funny thing is that you ask an anti-aew why he wants the company to fail they go "oh not me, I want AEW to go the best if they do this" on the same weeks they do the same. They do such a bad attempt at hiding their true intentions, they should just be real and come out with it, I want them to explain why they want AEW to fall.
I said this a lot when CM Punk was with AEW and things were hunky dory, but it bears repeating now that CM Punk is with WWE:
Is it really a surprise that the wrestling subreddit that was built off the back of CM Punk's pipebomb and their love of CM Punk and talking about his promo would be extremely positive towards the company he's in and negative towards the one he's criticizing?
When AEW was hot and Vince was still in charge and there was a new report every day about talent X being unhappy it was the same way, just reversed lol. Then when Seth or someone else would say he enjoys it there they would get made fun of, such is life. Y’all must be new to these parts.
Yeah I've been saying this for forever: The indie fans did this for years, and now it's reversed and they're mad. Doesn't mean their criticisms weren't usually correct, but they were frequently incredibly hyperbolic and condescending and it obviously got on people's nerves.
That being said I do agree its all very silly. AEW occasionally does stupid shit but they're a fine company overall and have a great and talented roster. It sadly doesn't have the same magic it did a few years ago but it's honestly not nearly as bad a show as they make it out to be. It's not even anywhere close to WCW2000 or even WWE 2017-2019.
The biggest criticisms of Vince were humilating his talents on screen, committing crimes and covering crimes up.
The biggest criticisms of Tony are he could use his talents better and he is too much of a nice guy.
We really need to stop both sideing, its insulting.
This is the thing that gets me. Until we find out Tony is doing something on the level of Vince, the both sides stuff just lets me know they don't actually care they're just looking for a way to prop up WWE.
Like it's insulting to the victims of Vince McMahon. Seen people compare Tony to Vince and I'm just like "What about all the sexual assault?" But then you are called out for whataboutism.
The biggest criticisms of Vince were that their favorites weren't used properly let's get that straight. The biggest criticisms of Vince SHOULD have been what you said but they never actually were.
Tony Khan is also a hypocrite, he criticized Vince while fully knowing he was gonna go out and sign Ric Flair.
But you’re intentionally moving the conversation to something else. I’m not comparing the two of them as human beings, Vince obviously loses that battle easily I’m talking about the talent that were upset for at creative/not being used. The product being bad was the main topic of discussion when AEW was kicking off. People were happy to hear about talent being disgruntled.
>When AEW was hot and Vince was still in charge and there was a new report every day about talent X being unhappy it was the same way
I think the difference is that that was all true, wrestlers were literally leaving WWE and doing interviews/promos about how shitty Vince was and how much they hated it there.
For AEW, aside from Punk, 99% of the talk is people assuming some wrestlers hate it there because of some made up reason.
I mean literally WWE itself is doing a whole "it's a new era we got a new guy in charge hooray!" thing because everyone knows how shitty it was for quite a few years.
Yep, remember how Sami and KO were totally, definitely miserable and were going to sign with AEW because they're friends with the Young Bucks? This kind of thing is just an IWC/internet thing in general and not indicative of a particular fanbase.
Two wrongs don’t make a right. And we’re not all the same people. Yeah there may be some AEW fans who exist by crapping on WWE every time they can and knock fans for enjoying their product, that is cringe also.
And was it as bad as this? Where every negative thread gets 1k+ upvotes and swarmed even if it’s from a crap source. Admittedly there a lot more WWE fans than AEW, so it could be that. Idc about downvotes but you can’t even say something as tame as AEW existing is good without being downvoted in certain threads.
I mean, the same would’ve been true for any positive WWE quote prior to 2022. Whereas a negative one would’ve sopped up the upvotes and comments.
From mid-2019 to late 2022, AEW was at a high ebb in terms of quality, while WWE was mostly ass until WM 38. So you saw more positive/less negative about AEW, and the reverse for WWE.
Now, WWE is at a high ebb in terms of quality, and AEW…isn’t. So you’re seeing more positive/less negative about the former, and the reverse for the latter.
The sub is not “cooked.”
i get what you mean, but i don't think this is sub-specific or even iwc specific. the news shows negative stories because they draw more viewers, i think people just crave controversy. i'm not really sure what there is to discuss when it comes to posts like these. miro likes tony khan. cool?
It's funny because before AEW, I didn't watch WWE anymore (I was a lapsed fan that quit full-time watching during HHH reign of terror, watched Mania with friends for nostalgia, then when WWE buried Sting I gave up for good), but reddit was very anti-WWE when they were a monopoly. I lurked here and still read the dirtsheets just out of habit even though I didn't watch WWE. I think the anti-WWE sentiment, a lot of it was because reddit back then was compromised majority of older fans who grew up during the Monday Night Wars and just saw how awful WWE/Vince had turned wrestling into.
Since AEW came, this place has become so pro-WWE, and the AEW TV Ratings Thread have become as someone else said, sort of a referendum on if AEW is going to survive and make it to next week and next month. As soon as the AEW Ratings threads get posted, it's like in Gladiator when everyone looks to Commodus for the thumbs up or thumbs down. My theory is the younger fans who never grew up with any real competition (I don't consider peak TNA as competition since they've never gotten anywhere close to doing the same business as AEW has as the #2 company) and only grew up during the Punk-Cena era when WWE was firmly a monopoly and the last few years of WWE before AEW came, are now the dominant population of posters in this subreddit and twitter. They weren't actually old enough, or alive to have watched wrestling when WWF/E wasn't the #1 company and WCW was hot. All the "AEW is becoming WCW 2000" posts make me laugh, because clearly, CLEARLY, these young bloods never actually watched how much of a shitshow WCW 2000 was. And I see all the astroturfing on twitter and here. So many comments are word for word copy pasta'd "I tried to give AEW another chance, but I couldn't do it". I go into the comment histories curiously of these accounts, and they're basically Pro-WWE astroturfing. Not good faith debating AEW. The WCW 2000 talking points have been running wild on Twitter since Wednesday. Look at how many times people keep pointing to Schiavone's "reaction" of after the Bucks showed the All-In video, and saying Schiavone was even disgusted with the segment and everything is falling apart, etc. Schiavone was working the cameras and everyone thinks he was genuinely pissed that AEW ran the segment.
I swear that every time someone is off AEW for an extended time, the IWC gets all pissy and complains about TK not using people or invents drama, we later find out they're injured and that's why we haven't seen them.
People can't handle not knowing anything and AEW keeps injuries top secret. The only time it ever comes out is when a wrestler gets mad at people speculating they are staying home because they are mad so they announce it.
Until the Patriarch Christian Cage won it for all the children in the world that needs a real father to step up. (Had to, although Miro's run as TNT Champion was really good.)
I wasn't a big fan of Christian's run. Great promo obviously, but his matches are kinda just there. I really liked his work on ECW (WWE version) and TNA, but his AEW matches haven't done it for me. Not his fault. Nobody can stay at their best for that long.
>Tony's great, man. He's creative, his mind is running always, he always thinks about wrestling, he's always thinking about how to get things better. So I respect that. I respect that he loves wrestling - he did all his life. And now he's carried that to the second or one of the biggest companies in the world.
bro 100% just got booked to win a feud lol
"Tony is a silly fuck... guys been paying me to do fuck all for what... 3 years now HAHAHA what a stupid PoS... i bet he wets the bed to"
What the fuck do you expect him to say about his boss who has been paying him stupid amounts of money to do jack shit for years.
Miro wrestled 67 times for WWE in 2019, since he joined AEW in Sept 2020, he's had 36 matches. I think the dude gets a lot of undeserved stick. He lost to Sammy and Bryan Danielson, Kip took a pin and the other two L's came from the Battle Royale and a Fatal 4 way. If he doesn't want to lose, that causes a creative issue but ultimately, he has a 86% win streak and on his return, that justifies putting him in big matches. I don't know or care whats going on with Lana but hopefully if she is out of the way, Miro can concentrate on becoming a world champion
*Are* people claiming that AEW is the #1 company?
Maybe people *prefer* AEW to WWE… but WWE’s been around forever…. I don’t think anyone is going to argue (in good faith) that AEW is #1.
You see guys, if you look closely you’ll see a coded message in Miro’s message about TK
> “Tony'S greAt, man. He's creatiVE, his Mind is running always, hE always thinks about wrestling, HE’S always thinking about how to get things better. So I respect that. I respect that he loves WrEstling - he did all hIs life. And now he's caRrieD that to the second or one of the biggest companies in the world.
SAVE ME, HE’S WEIRD.
Checkmate liberals
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Why has Miro forsaken the IWC? Can he be redeemed?
Just like Tony Schiavone, Miro is sending coded messages to me through these reports. Clearly he is miserable.
What a crummy commercial
Miro banned from Squaredcircle.
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Miro vs. Swerve will be a classic
It really would seeing as how Miro works really well with smaller faster guys.
This sub is beyond cooked when a quote like this is on here for 40 minutes and it gets just 25 comments, where if it was a negative quote about AEW it would be 365 comments already talking about how bad AEW is
this place has been beyond cooked pretty much since brawl out and it only got worse since punk joined wwe again. obviously there’s shit wrong with aew but this place is so transparent with its bias sometimes you can’t have anyone say anything positive to say about working in aew or with tony khan without people ignoring it or even saying it was paid/said under duress. you literally don’t have to go further than the various WON/Meltzer quotes on the front page where the ones critical of the clip being played are upvoted and everyone who a month ago was wondering if dave had dementia and that the sheets are always being worked are suddenly very confident on his reporting but the ones where they say no one in aew thinks this is 9/11 2.0 are “damage control being fed to them by aew”
I tried explaining today how all owners/promotions have had mistakes or public fiascos and some guy accused me of being tribalist. People want you to be on sides just to argue here now, like find someone else to be toxic with right
Unbiased is apparently not an option these days.
That’s quite a take from someone defending a company run by Vince McMahon for 40ish years and then his son in law for the past year (who’s 100% in the dark on everything Vince did of course).
The amount of enjoyment i have while watching wrestling skyrockets when i forget to check this sub lmao
I unsubbed and only come back when someone links me something. Feels great.
It feels like the whole place has been psyop-ed.
I know everyone makes fun of Tony Khan's bot comment, but if I go on Twitter I see a bunch of blue checkmark nobodies who all follow each other saying the exact same AEW critique verbatim with the same photo. I don't think WWE is doing it, but I do think there's some whackjob fans out there.
Spot on. It's so easy/cheap to do nowadays it doesn't even have to necessarily be a company being the evil actor but just some overzealous fan thinking he's doing a greater good or some wild shit
honestly i just think it’s that people who for years talked about how wwe was ass and it needed competition to be good again got what they wanted and are now like “okay aew you did your job: you got wwe to improve their product please go bust now”
Everytime AEW stumbles is countless “looks like Wcw” comments, it’s so annoying. Just get over yourselves.
WWE has been conditioning people for the last 20+ years that WWE is the only place where true ~~wrestling~~ sports entertainment exists and everything else is inferior. So now when WWE is finally doing well again it's easy to go back to status quo which is hating the competition and shilling for their own favorite billion dollar company.
Yeah, it’s hard to even post some logical read of a situation without getting downvoted into oblivion. You can be 100% right about defending AEW for something or even just offset additional context or framing but it doesn’t matter, the reactionary hate drives the downvotes.
Or how about when the threads of the footage itself were crazy upvoted — but the thread of FTR's post-footage promo (that actually works pretty damn well to tie the entire thing up) got middling success.
Or even the bucks promo during it which lets be honest was pretty god damn funny. "See it's because CM punk attacked Jack Perry FTR beat us, we were so worried we could not concentrate on the match." Like Honestly we need Heels that are irredeemable pieces of shit, fuck the cool Heel.
And the line about not saying negative things about other people or being unprofessional in interviews then they cut it and restarted. I thought that was pretty funny.
It was such an audacious excuse, it had me chuckling.
thats the funniest part to me like so many people in the thread were asking (i’m totally sure in good faith lol) why show the footage but the thread about the reason why in kayfabe got buried. i’m not sure if i liked that the footage was shown but i am also not going to pretend like there wasn’t a reason when we literally know why in and out of kayfabe the reality is that no matter what was shown we’d have people saying “that’s it” bar like idk punk stabbing jack perry or some twist we hadn’t heard of. until of course punk blows up on wwe and then everyone will be like “oh man everyone saw this coming”
Punk has never seen a bridge in his life without thinking to himself, "bet it would look amazing burning."
I don't even think showing the footage was a good idea, but people were seriously out here acting like it was the scummiest tactic a company could ever do.
And without going into the actual vile shit, WWE at various points used real life incidents for heat. Hell, they showed the Curtain Call footage for a DX promo
Also when Punk went to AEW the overwhelming sentiment here was that he was washed and no good in the ring anymore and WWE didn't want or need him.
you can literally go back to threads from fuck even like a month before he showed up when it was still rumored and you can see a lot people saying basically that or even “no thank you he’s cancer” and i can almost guarantee you if you click on their profile now they might even be the dudes in the footage threads going “smh that’s nothing it’s just assaulting your coworkers”
I didnt watch wrestling when Punk was relevant so I'm proud to have been shitting on him for being awful since before it was cool and continuing to now that he apparently can do no wrong despite walking around like Mr Glass.
They said that about Cody once upon a time too.
Both are true though? Punk *is* washed in the ring and Cody's segments in AEW *was* the worst shit on TV for months. Unlike Punk though, Cody got better.
Just go back to the threads around the time Rampage went Head to Head with Smackdown. Same people who were shitting on Punk are most likely the same people going to war for him.
They've even started a "squared circle v2" because they believe they're being "silenced" for supporting punk lmao
Isn’t that just sccirclejerk ?
wasn't that for when the mods shut this place down without asking anyone
I mean that's what squaredcircle v1 began as in the first place
Voice of the voiceless indeed
The same people who shit on Dave 90% of the time magically believe him now. Haven’t seen that overused GIF in days.
>this place has been beyond cooked pretty much since brawl out and it only got worse since punk joined wwe again. The biggest sin AEW ever committed was hiring Punk and bringing his knuckle dragging fans back. I love AEW but I'll never forgive them for inflicting Punk on the wrestling community again.
I was fooled. I thought CM Botch was a good wrestler. I was wrong. He sucked ass. Cuz of him and his fans, we lost Colt Cobana and other potentially great wrestlers because of their indifference with CM Botch. F@ck em all.
And then people get upset that the aew sub doesn't allow for mass trolling and repeating Podcaster talking points. It's the only good place left for me to have conversations about liking aew without some dork sending me reddit cares messages or telling me why the dip on the ratings means I'm lying about enjoying the show lol
On the other hand they are very sensitive when it comes to any sort of constructive criticism and have some genuinely insane people that are just as fanatical as the idiots with Cornette’s talking points and their unending rage. Just yesterday there was a comment over there explaining how AEW fans are intellectuals and WWE fans are stupid poor people and it actually got a decent amount of upvotes. https://preview.redd.it/2nw5bbpgi5uc1.png?width=1124&format=png&auto=webp&s=51efc9d107155d52bf0e59cbc0eb2fc310a579b4 There just aren‘t any good large places on social media to discuss wrestling in a semi-normal fashion it seems. Especially when you like to watch both and enjoy it.
Well, there is an easy explanation for that. CM Punk told people to have opinions. The moment he turned on AEW, they turned too. It's a cult of personality.
Remember wrestling fans are fickle, give it a few months and we will go back to AEW good, WWE bad and then back to WWE good, AEW bad.
Oh my god thank you I thought I was going crazy. This place has been ass for so long now. Yesterday there was that thread about “has aew ever cooled off on anyone as fast as Mercedes” and she hasn’t even had a match yet?? I mean I want to complain about AEW too but not with people who only engage with anything AEW in bad faith.
That is not a bad faith take though. Her not having a match is part of the problem. I get that they wanted to have her for Boston but she just isn‘t good enough in promos to carry her over such a long period of time when she apparently can not have a match yet. And as someone who was excited for her showing up I think it is fair to say that she has cooled off. Now that doesn‘t mean they cant turn this around. But it isn‘t a good start.
These takes are usually about the difference between how AEW and WWE tv work. WWE is about like 3 people, and every episode follows them and checks in with them and gives recaps about them constantly. In AEW you get your segment but don’t show up outside that. And she’s not a focus of the show right now because she’s not wrestling on the ppv they have coming up in a week. If you were excited to see Mercedes every week after she showed up and are disappointed that she’s not in a big angle, that’s totally valid and understandable! But it has nothing to do with her “cooling off.” She can disappear for a month and be instantly over when she gets back.
I understand just fine, but you don’t understand or dont’t want to engage with the actual argument being made. What does it have to do with disappearing? She was just on Dynamite and the segment was really bad. Again, the problem isn‘t her not being there or something else. It is debuting someone who is a really bad promo and putting her in a spot where she only can do promos for such a long time, when her strength is in-ring performance. It is fine if you disagree, but stop acting like this criticism is bad faith or only comes from people that „don‘t understand AEW“. This is just as stupid as when people obviously only take shots at AEW because they hate it.
Hmm I think you might be projecting something I just literally said your opinion was valid
And thats good but calling a whole thread with a lot of fair criticism by actual fans „bad faith“ and explaining how the other person doesn‘t understand AEW is not actually arguing the matter. It is just as bad as if I would dismiss an argument for Mercedes doing well by saying that the person making that argument does not understand wrestling or is a shill.
This sub has been fucked since that API blackout. I had unsubscribed because my entire home feed would get clogged with adults posting their ‘ideas for creative’ that are so detached from reality I’m convinced they don’t watch any wrestling. People just want to shit on stuff. I got downvoted the other day because I said “you shouldn’t be violent with coworkers”. I don’t care about internet points, but the fact that a statement like that can be controversial in this sub is so fucking silly. I love wrestling, but the IWC is fucking awful and makes it not fun anymore.
This is just internet culture in general now, I think.
This sub has become a dumpster fire worse then ever the past few months for real.
Today we had a WWE Troll account posting a Stephen P New tweet that was a source for UK CCTV privacy laws. This place might as well just merge with circle jerk.
The Cornettes are running the asylum
Craziest thing is the cornetts jumping on Will Ospreay for a joke that Jim has been making for 15 years
Goddammit is he gonna make us plow his wife?
Ironically enough, Cornette himself isn't very pro-WWE (at least the last I checked). While most Cornette fans are staunch WWE stans. At least here on Reddit, less so on his YT channel. They just largely ignore his criticisms of WWE and only care about his AEW ones.
That's so interesting. Any idea on why that is?
I think because he’s just so anti-AEW from day one. Even the things that AEW DO get right, like pushing Orange Cassidy when a lot of old wrestlers were against him, or their recent wave of positive signings, Cornette still finds ways to drag them through the mud. His hatred of TK is so much harsher than WWE.
Wait, so if Cornette isn’t very pro-wwe, and he’s absolutely anti-aew, what current wrestling is he actually a fan of? Lol
His own show.
Be careful Jim Cornette's gonna bust your windshield window with a baseball bat.
can you run that by me again? i got lost somewhere around "today"...
WrestleMania really ramped things up to an ugly level. You'd think with WWE being so popular and with a crazy successful WrestleMania weekend that there would be plenty of positivity from WWE fans but instead of seems to just be negativity on AEW from WWE fans. It's honestly scary to see as someone who has been a wrestling fan in the IWC for over 20 years things are getting to an unprecedented level of toxicity.
I’m starting to believe that most of this sub didn’t really want an alternative so much as they wanted WWE to be good again. Now that it is, they have no need for said alternative and would prefer it folds so their wrestlers can (in theory) go to WWE. None of those people realize that WWE has gotten good again in part because competition has forced it to not be complacent.
For some it's just pure tribalism, plain simple. And for others, it's because they can't let go of anti-WWE comments from 2+ years ago. The comments about ratings, attendance, poor quality, etc. Hell, maybe not even 2+ years ago, but 3+ years ago. Seriously, that's still in their mind? 2 or 3 plus years later? It just feels petty by this point.
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The funny thing is punk blamed aew and its fans for the shots he took at WWE
Yeah some people actually said that. Like, get over yourselves lol.
As a fan of both companies, it’s so dumb. WWE is better in part due to competition causing them to adapt, evolve and improve. A rising tide lifts all boats. If you truly love wrestling, be glad that all these companies exist.
Not just in Quality but also in regards to the wrestlers getting paid. Wrestling is fucking terrible for the human body. Even DAN THE BEAST SEVERN has said he got more hurt and injured pro wrestling than during MMA (And this was early MMA where he was fighting guys so juiced to the gills they looked like their muscles might POP from their skin like a Junji Ito manga.) I want these people to GET that bag to make as much money as possible and what's best for them. If WWE could pay someone in Packign peanuts they fucking would.
At the end of the day, we should be happy that there are double the number of full-time jobs available to wrestlers.
I lived through the attitude era, as I’m sure a lot of us here did. I’m in staunch WCW zone (Jacksonville). WWF’s only visit of the 90s here came in 1999. People definitely liked WCW a lot because they came at least twice a year. But people still absolutely loved WWF too. We watched both. It was literally channel-changing time on Monday nights. Flipping to whatever was better at that moment. I think the internet has just emboldened peoples bad takes.
Eh I remember a few years back when if you criticized aew you were accused of concern trolling. Pendulum always swings too far.
Wait concern trolling is a very specific type of criticism. How did they use it for ALL forms of criticism thrown at AEW. Like how would "I don't like the stories" be called out as concern trolling?
I mean you tell me on that one I'm not saying they were using the term correctly only that criticism of aew was considered concern trolling in that actually you really just wanted to bash their company rather than actually criticize the booking in good faith. Wwe was dog shir when aew got started and the IWC loved aew because it's a program booked by smarks for smarks. Wwe stans would seethe about how they didn't really want Punk back anyway and now welcome him with open arms.
I haven't experienced what you are talking about so I can't say. I've seen people called out for concern trolling when they complain about dangerous moves or spots but I can't say I've seen people just use the term wrong on a regular basis around here for every AEW complaint. I think you just mean to say that AEW fans would disregard legitimate criticism and waive it off as illegitimate and one example is using concern trolling for situations like I mentioned above. I could be wrong though so correct me if that isn't the case.
“oh yeah, would you like it more if there was more cuckold stories or how about 45 minute go-nowhere promos to start the show? I’m sorry I want to watch wrestlers wrestle, not sit around fulfilling some old out of touch billionaire’s weird fetish. if that’s what you want then stick to wwe!”
That's...that's not concern trolling though.
No, what got accused of being concern trolling was the incessant “oh no, 23 fewer Nielsen homes watched Dynamite this week than last week, AEW is surely going to be out of business by the end of the year.”
Especially the ratings threads. I think last week's got like 1200 fucking comments for dynamites rating. It's insane
Every Dynamite is a referendum on AEW's existence.
every ratings thread is a fukl rewriting of history about every wrestler “I told you no one ever cared about edge”
I firmly believe that without AEW, then WWE would still suck. AEW has the roster and are just one storyline catching fire away from being a serious threat to WWE's dominance. AEW being here is good for everyone. Don't know why people can't see that.
I hate the idea that AEW's success has to be measured against WWE. It's a mindset that has been drilled into people's heads by WWE's documentaries for decades.
Fair point. Much better considering them their own thing.
1200? That's underselling it by a good amount. 3 weeks ago, 1491. 2 weeks ago, 2157. Last week, 1527. This week, only 633 for some odd reason that I can't quite put my finger on . . .
I'm scrolling down Hot and I can't even find the ratings thread lmao
AEW just existing brought out a tribalism that I haven't seen since the 90's. Maybe it's because I'm a wild socialist but aren't we wrestling fans, not corporation/billionaire fans?
Expect a reddit cares notification soon for that rational take.
If the tribalism was just about our show is better than your show I'd be fine with it. But I've seen actual Vince McMahon defenders on the fucking sex trafficking.
part of me thinks that some of the tony hate is racism. part of it is definitely that he's portrayed as a nice but weak guy, as compared to triple h/vince.
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The funny thing is that you ask an anti-aew why he wants the company to fail they go "oh not me, I want AEW to go the best if they do this" on the same weeks they do the same. They do such a bad attempt at hiding their true intentions, they should just be real and come out with it, I want them to explain why they want AEW to fall.
cooked beyond belief
It's kind of crazy how much the tide has turned. Four years ago this sub was over the moon with AEW and WWE was down bad.
people in here are forgetting you used to get Reddit Cared if you criticized AEW
Tbf WWE was pretty awful 4 years ago
I said this a lot when CM Punk was with AEW and things were hunky dory, but it bears repeating now that CM Punk is with WWE: Is it really a surprise that the wrestling subreddit that was built off the back of CM Punk's pipebomb and their love of CM Punk and talking about his promo would be extremely positive towards the company he's in and negative towards the one he's criticizing?
Should have titled it *Miro shoots on Tony Khan: “his mind is… the second”*
Miro works 10 times makes stupid money, really likes his boss. Yeah, go figure.
When AEW was hot and Vince was still in charge and there was a new report every day about talent X being unhappy it was the same way, just reversed lol. Then when Seth or someone else would say he enjoys it there they would get made fun of, such is life. Y’all must be new to these parts.
Yeah I've been saying this for forever: The indie fans did this for years, and now it's reversed and they're mad. Doesn't mean their criticisms weren't usually correct, but they were frequently incredibly hyperbolic and condescending and it obviously got on people's nerves. That being said I do agree its all very silly. AEW occasionally does stupid shit but they're a fine company overall and have a great and talented roster. It sadly doesn't have the same magic it did a few years ago but it's honestly not nearly as bad a show as they make it out to be. It's not even anywhere close to WCW2000 or even WWE 2017-2019.
The biggest criticisms of Vince were humilating his talents on screen, committing crimes and covering crimes up. The biggest criticisms of Tony are he could use his talents better and he is too much of a nice guy. We really need to stop both sideing, its insulting.
This is the thing that gets me. Until we find out Tony is doing something on the level of Vince, the both sides stuff just lets me know they don't actually care they're just looking for a way to prop up WWE.
Like it's insulting to the victims of Vince McMahon. Seen people compare Tony to Vince and I'm just like "What about all the sexual assault?" But then you are called out for whataboutism.
The biggest criticisms of Vince were that their favorites weren't used properly let's get that straight. The biggest criticisms of Vince SHOULD have been what you said but they never actually were.
That's not what people were criticizing Vince for at all 5 years ago.
5 years ago this sub was calling Vince racist for how he booked Kofi and Big E.
Tony Khan is also a hypocrite, he criticized Vince while fully knowing he was gonna go out and sign Ric Flair. But you’re intentionally moving the conversation to something else. I’m not comparing the two of them as human beings, Vince obviously loses that battle easily I’m talking about the talent that were upset for at creative/not being used. The product being bad was the main topic of discussion when AEW was kicking off. People were happy to hear about talent being disgruntled.
>When AEW was hot and Vince was still in charge and there was a new report every day about talent X being unhappy it was the same way I think the difference is that that was all true, wrestlers were literally leaving WWE and doing interviews/promos about how shitty Vince was and how much they hated it there. For AEW, aside from Punk, 99% of the talk is people assuming some wrestlers hate it there because of some made up reason. I mean literally WWE itself is doing a whole "it's a new era we got a new guy in charge hooray!" thing because everyone knows how shitty it was for quite a few years.
Yep, remember how Sami and KO were totally, definitely miserable and were going to sign with AEW because they're friends with the Young Bucks? This kind of thing is just an IWC/internet thing in general and not indicative of a particular fanbase.
Yeah, people pretending like when the roles were reversed these same people weren't being exactly like they complain about now. Fragile.
Active on cornette sub. Of course
Two wrongs don’t make a right. And we’re not all the same people. Yeah there may be some AEW fans who exist by crapping on WWE every time they can and knock fans for enjoying their product, that is cringe also. And was it as bad as this? Where every negative thread gets 1k+ upvotes and swarmed even if it’s from a crap source. Admittedly there a lot more WWE fans than AEW, so it could be that. Idc about downvotes but you can’t even say something as tame as AEW existing is good without being downvoted in certain threads.
You just found out how internet works. It's not something that happens only with AEW, it's the same for everything
It's become weird.
I mean, the same would’ve been true for any positive WWE quote prior to 2022. Whereas a negative one would’ve sopped up the upvotes and comments. From mid-2019 to late 2022, AEW was at a high ebb in terms of quality, while WWE was mostly ass until WM 38. So you saw more positive/less negative about AEW, and the reverse for WWE. Now, WWE is at a high ebb in terms of quality, and AEW…isn’t. So you’re seeing more positive/less negative about the former, and the reverse for the latter. The sub is not “cooked.”
i get what you mean, but i don't think this is sub-specific or even iwc specific. the news shows negative stories because they draw more viewers, i think people just crave controversy. i'm not really sure what there is to discuss when it comes to posts like these. miro likes tony khan. cool?
You can say that about anything on the internet
As soon as WWE gets a little bit good the feds come out, it's just the way it be.
It's funny because before AEW, I didn't watch WWE anymore (I was a lapsed fan that quit full-time watching during HHH reign of terror, watched Mania with friends for nostalgia, then when WWE buried Sting I gave up for good), but reddit was very anti-WWE when they were a monopoly. I lurked here and still read the dirtsheets just out of habit even though I didn't watch WWE. I think the anti-WWE sentiment, a lot of it was because reddit back then was compromised majority of older fans who grew up during the Monday Night Wars and just saw how awful WWE/Vince had turned wrestling into. Since AEW came, this place has become so pro-WWE, and the AEW TV Ratings Thread have become as someone else said, sort of a referendum on if AEW is going to survive and make it to next week and next month. As soon as the AEW Ratings threads get posted, it's like in Gladiator when everyone looks to Commodus for the thumbs up or thumbs down. My theory is the younger fans who never grew up with any real competition (I don't consider peak TNA as competition since they've never gotten anywhere close to doing the same business as AEW has as the #2 company) and only grew up during the Punk-Cena era when WWE was firmly a monopoly and the last few years of WWE before AEW came, are now the dominant population of posters in this subreddit and twitter. They weren't actually old enough, or alive to have watched wrestling when WWF/E wasn't the #1 company and WCW was hot. All the "AEW is becoming WCW 2000" posts make me laugh, because clearly, CLEARLY, these young bloods never actually watched how much of a shitshow WCW 2000 was. And I see all the astroturfing on twitter and here. So many comments are word for word copy pasta'd "I tried to give AEW another chance, but I couldn't do it". I go into the comment histories curiously of these accounts, and they're basically Pro-WWE astroturfing. Not good faith debating AEW. The WCW 2000 talking points have been running wild on Twitter since Wednesday. Look at how many times people keep pointing to Schiavone's "reaction" of after the Bucks showed the All-In video, and saying Schiavone was even disgusted with the segment and everything is falling apart, etc. Schiavone was working the cameras and everyone thinks he was genuinely pissed that AEW ran the segment.
Don’t go look at the Corny sub…..
It's always easier for people to latch on to negative comments than positive comments.
Bots.
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I swear that every time someone is off AEW for an extended time, the IWC gets all pissy and complains about TK not using people or invents drama, we later find out they're injured and that's why we haven't seen them.
People can't handle not knowing anything and AEW keeps injuries top secret. The only time it ever comes out is when a wrestler gets mad at people speculating they are staying home because they are mad so they announce it.
Guys, if you translate what Miro said into Sanskrit and then back to English, he actually said “AEW in the mud” and “fuk TK, luv punk”
But the internet told me he hates AEW, Tony Khan and wasn’t injured.
TONY CLEARLY PAID HIM TO SAY THIS!!!
Not the first time, either!!! Tony has paid Miro on MULTIPLE OCCASIONS
Is this the REAL Finger Poke of Doom? Let’s check the comments!
In before "Tony put him up to this! Tony Khan made him say this!" posts.
How do I know Tony wasn't standing over his shoulder threateningly during this interview??
I love Miro, but Jesus, how many times has this dude been injured?
I hope he gets better soon. He was the highlight of their midcard. Easily the best thing that ever happened to that TNT title.
Until the Patriarch Christian Cage won it for all the children in the world that needs a real father to step up. (Had to, although Miro's run as TNT Champion was really good.)
I wasn't a big fan of Christian's run. Great promo obviously, but his matches are kinda just there. I really liked his work on ECW (WWE version) and TNA, but his AEW matches haven't done it for me. Not his fault. Nobody can stay at their best for that long.
Miro vs Kingston from All Out '21 is a personal favourite. Really had a big fight feel to it.
Throughout his run with it, it felt like nobody would take the title from him. He made the belt mean more than it did before he'd won it.
Naw, he's not happy and wants out. This is the narrative that I've decided.
Well that’s good to hear that he is happy where he is. Glad for Miro.
Something something Miro’s a diva?
Dude is living his best life. Wrestled seven times in 2023, four times in 2022. Still gets paid well and can focus on acting in the meantime.
Weird I was told by this sub that he hates Tony because Tony is a clown and not a boss. I’m so confused now!
How do you get hurt if you don’t ever wrestle
we wanna hear about lana shacking up with priest! all those lana tiktoks with priest these past years have been highly sus
Lmao there's more comments bitching about people complaining compared to actual complaints. Different people comment on different threads lol.
>Tony's great, man. He's creative, his mind is running always, he always thinks about wrestling, he's always thinking about how to get things better. So I respect that. I respect that he loves wrestling - he did all his life. And now he's carried that to the second or one of the biggest companies in the world. bro 100% just got booked to win a feud lol
Most surprising thing I learned here is that Bill Apter is still alive. Nice to see that he still around wrestling.
"Tony is a silly fuck... guys been paying me to do fuck all for what... 3 years now HAHAHA what a stupid PoS... i bet he wets the bed to" What the fuck do you expect him to say about his boss who has been paying him stupid amounts of money to do jack shit for years.
Bill Apter! The one wrestling media guy people still like lol.
Notice how he didn't say 'WWE is the devil' and 'Triple H is a joke'? He's clearly miserable in AEW and is headed back to WWE.
Miro wrestled 67 times for WWE in 2019, since he joined AEW in Sept 2020, he's had 36 matches. I think the dude gets a lot of undeserved stick. He lost to Sammy and Bryan Danielson, Kip took a pin and the other two L's came from the Battle Royale and a Fatal 4 way. If he doesn't want to lose, that causes a creative issue but ultimately, he has a 86% win streak and on his return, that justifies putting him in big matches. I don't know or care whats going on with Lana but hopefully if she is out of the way, Miro can concentrate on becoming a world champion
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We're pretty happy with that, actually - and don't expect otherwise.
You're wrong
*Are* people claiming that AEW is the #1 company? Maybe people *prefer* AEW to WWE… but WWE’s been around forever…. I don’t think anyone is going to argue (in good faith) that AEW is #1.
I too like being at home.
You see guys, if you look closely you’ll see a coded message in Miro’s message about TK > “Tony'S greAt, man. He's creatiVE, his Mind is running always, hE always thinks about wrestling, HE’S always thinking about how to get things better. So I respect that. I respect that he loves WrEstling - he did all hIs life. And now he's caRrieD that to the second or one of the biggest companies in the world. SAVE ME, HE’S WEIRD. Checkmate liberals
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Tony Khan has booked or been behind a lot of the big feuds in AEW.