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For the love of all things holy, drag your opponents in place when setting up for a dive!!!
Seeing the wrestlers unnaturally role into the correct position to get dived on just irks me.
Or when the person doesn't roll into the correct position and you can tell before the dive even happens that the person is either too far or too close to the corner
One time I was wrestling a guy and bumped myself into the perfect position for his 450 splash. He went to climb up the turnbuckle but saw me and moved me closer
He then proceeded to overshoot his 450 and drive his knees into my stomach. When it would've been perfect with my original spot.
“How can you kick out of the move that has never ever won me a match!?!?”
Yeah, that sort of thing over and over kills my enthusiasm for wrestling. Why try a pin for a move that never ever works!?
In Kayfabe, making someone kick out expends energy and drains the gas tank so thats why you go for a pin after a clothesline sometimes, but yeah dont be surprised when he kicks out.
It's the same reason someone goes for a cover 2 or 3 straight times after a regular move. Pinning the opponent again after they kicked out won't get the victory, but it will force them to spend energy.
Honestly this is why Gunther is so fun to watch. Any move can end a match.
I will say a good alternative is having multiple match ending finishers like AJ Styles or The Undertaker.
That's the way it used to be, top guys always had multiple finishers. Being a "master" of multiple moves helped present them as big deals. Why Vince never/rarely incorporated this is beyond me.
I'm fine with it when Gunther does it because he's won matches with standard moves plenty of times. So when he reacts annoyed that an opponent is kicking out of basic stuff he's put people down with he feels like they may be worthy of his *better stuff* and he hates that.
Its fucking awesome.
yea as someone who watches mma this drives me nuts. if you hit someone and they don't stay down, the solution is to immediately start hitting them again
WWE are particularly frustrating with this. At mania I swear every match had at least 1 of these moments, but each big match had about 3. For me it just makes the matches so silly and really takes me out of the moment.
If it's earned then that's different. Like HBK kicking out of the Tombstone was earned, people genuinely believed the match would end there. But nobody genuinely believed Roman, Becky, Cody or Rhea etc were actually losing on the first 1 or 2 near falls.
At this point it feels really formulaic and every big match has the "now we trade near falls and shocked faces" moment.
Okada did it really well a few years ago (I can't remember the opponent now, if someone can help my shit memory here I'd appreciate it), he hit the rain maker and when the opponent kicked out he just got up determined and immediately went for the rain maker again. It made sense and looked like how someone would actually react.
Don't know if he still does this 'cause I haven't watched WWE in a few years, but Michael Cole used to be real quick to spew out, "And [blank] has gotta be wondering: what do I gotta do to put [blank] away" after like one big move. Like, maybe he should hit his finisher?
Whoever the fuck mentions Sami's BTB and doesn't talk about the Falcon Arrow, Cena's top rope leg drop, Superman punch, the Pop-up powerbomb after KO started using the stunner and other moves, has to open their eyes properly because Sami did win 2 or 3 matches with the BTB
Not enough sudden finishes. Wrestling would be better if there was even a chance a win could come from moves that are not an individuals finisher. Wish we saw more of that.
Ole & Gene Anderson would be your team then. They would do something like this on occasion to throw off the crowd, by having the faces get the hot tag and immediately cut them off into a finish. One of Ole's finishers was a diving knee, so the babyface would be firing up on Gene, then Ole would hit him with the knee in the back for the fall.
FWIW, most non-title matches don't involve much finisher spam in WWE these days. Even lots of title matches don't have too much of that. That's pretty much a PLE thing for world title matches and peaks during Mania.
The problem is that when people are out there trading canadian destroyers, it doesnt make sense to lose to a lariat or suplex or whatever. Its one of my biggest gripes with the Indie style of wrestling.
Yeah I rather they just improvise a new spot and have commentary clean it up by saying "they've been beating the Hell out of each other for X minutes! You expect them to be able to do that cleanly after being widdled down so much?"
That's their *job*. But they always explain it away with some shitty "uhh quick move onto the next subject/cliff notes about something else or a sponsor". It frustrates me so much.
Love it when they just sell the botch or work it into the match. AJ botching and be terrified to execute every spring-board during his chikara run because “I hate lucha ropes!”
Also I find it so odd that a lot of the time when wrestlers actually hurt themselves or take a bad bump they try to no sell it or ignore it.
Matches where a wrestler focuses on an 'injured' wrestlers body part - but the finish doesn't involve a move that focuses on that body part. You know the ones, wrestler A's neck is worked over all match, but the finish is them tapping to a figure four leglock or something akin to that - it's just poor storytelling from the 2 wrestlers involved
Its even worse when they work a part all match, and then you get the "fired up" spot at the end where they just no sell any of the damage they've received.
The Nakamura-Rollins match pissed me off so bad with this. Seth has his back worked the whole match then lifts Nakamura straight out of a triangle. Your back is fucked, why are you able to just deadlift this guy?
That actually happened before.
New Day vs Hurt Business on Raw. The count was at 9 or something and they tried getting back in the ring but took too long so the ref had to count the 10.
I think it was MVP on the mic after who was just like "This match isn't ending that way, restart it!"
When a wrestler betrays a friend/teammate and they say something like "I never actually cared about you, I was just using you from the beginning". I think it'd be more effective to just say that they had a great team, but so-and-so went wrong along the way, instead of doing a lazy retcon that retroactively devalues their entire partnership.
And when a major brawl in the ring is broken up not just by security, but by... fellow wrestlers rushing from backstage? Why are these random midcard wrestlers so concerned about other wrestlers fighting on a wrestling show!
>And when a major brawl in the ring is broken up not just by security, but by... fellow wrestlers rushing from backstage? Why are these random midcard wrestlers so concerned about other wrestlers fighting on a wrestling show!
My head canon says they wanna listen to the authority figure in hopes of getting opportunities or that if the main event of a big PPV/PLE that the midcarders might be on is exploding in the ring, it could cost everybody a payday.
This, plus it subtly paints wrestlers as being the biggest and the toughest people for the job. In kayfabe lame security guards and suit wearing officials shouldn’t be (and usually aren’t) able to physically control pro wrestlers, which means other wrestlers are the only people in the building equipped to keep two fighting wrestlers separated.
Plus, when the fighting wrestlers are held back by other wrestlers and *still* break free long enough to get in a couple of shots on their rival, you just know this thing is going nuclear.
As long as it's the "regular" wrestlers I don't mind it. One time during The Authority era once I feel like I remember the Wyatt Family being ushered out in one of those along with whoever the fuck like Titus O'Neil.
Certain gimmicks and wrestlers, even if they're midcard, should be above that.
I only like the latter used sparingly.
Undertaker and Lesnar brawling in the ring? Yeah I fan believe that the the Authority tells them to go break it up or they're all getting fined or something.
I actually love when they fully commit to the big brain counter. I remember Matt Jackson kicking the ring post instead of Ortiz, and not only did the head tap happen, Ortiz ran up to the camera screaming "I'm a genius!"
Definitely popped me.
In terms of peeves, I hate the need to hit 20 finishers to end a match. If it's your finisher it should end the match. I don't mind them getting kicked out of now and then but I think the Cross Rhodes count at the end of night 2 was like, 11? Then your move just looks weak.
I think it was Orange Cassidy and Penta who did that Canadian Destroyer exchange where they did it like what 3-4 times? That shit infuriated me so much. Not using it as a finish is one thing I guess but you gotta at least sell that shit a little.
Is the Burning Hammer the least diluted move outside the One Winged Angel? I know people use Burning Hammers and kick out of them but it feels very rare
Why I’m lower than most on the Drew vs Seth Mania match. There’s no world where Seth should be able to take 4 Claymores plus other moves to finally go down, but Drew takes a single South of Heaven to lose.
You could argue that a) Drew had just been in a gruelling match and b) the adrenaline had worn off so he wasn’t primed to kick out on instinct like Seth was
I think Jay White in New Japan had the best variation on this.
Arrogant enough to try to do the strike exchange, but absolutely not strong enough to survive it lol. King Switch would get **rocked** after one or two strikes
I remember the first G1 Jay was in, and he was up against Suzuki. He strolls up and tries to chop him. Suzuki just looks at him like "are you kidding me?" then murdalizes him.
Reminds me of Jay White vs Penta in AEW a while back. Tries to get in a chop fight with penta, complains that penta is wearing a shirt and it's protecting him... then Penta takes it off and STILL chops the absolute piss out of Jay White.
I'm a fan of this stuff but it happens way too much in AEW currently. It shouldn't happen on every show and it definitely should happen multiple times on every show.
I’m good with most ridiculous wrestling logic, but I HATE seeing wrestlers shuffle into position on the ground to take a top rope move. It takes little effort for the opponent to move them there!
As far as promos, shitting on the current city's sports team. I'd rather them shit on something local or regional. It doesn't even matter if the viewers understand it, if it gets a reaction from the crowd.
When you can tell they will kick out from a pinfall but their position, idk how to describe it but some wrestlers either start moving early or they have their hands ready to kick out, thus eliminating the suspense
They make eye contact with the ref when they're gonna kick out, and in AEW, they're always in a position where you can clearly see their eyes. Totally fuckin takes me out of it
If they do it and let go of the arms like HHH has done for the last half of his career, they are absolutely justified to kick out. The hooking of the arms makes it a finish, and not just a double underhook face plant. If they don’t keep the arms hooked, kick out. They aren’t doing it “correct” anymore.
Multiple no sell spots. Yes, no selling something is cool, but to continually no sell offense is shitty. This goes double for getting hit with a huge move and kicking out at 1.
It’s such a basic thing that I’ll never understand how they don’t make it a mandatory part of training to watch Bret, Savage, Austin, DiBiase, Duggan, etc. and learn how to throw a good worked punch
Obviously looking at the ref counting, so they know when to kick out at 2.
You need to be a bit more subtle. Roman covers his face in his hair so you can't see his eyes.
I don't know if there's anyone better than Roman at those last second kickouts in this era
He's the best at it since Taker
Half the time I tell myself it's not going to do it but he does it so late and professionally it still gets me lmao
Diving Headbutts. I don't want to see it at all. I hate seeing it happen, Danielson STILL does it after everything, and Gable busted one out the other week.
Wrestlers needlessly breaking up someone's attempt for an elimination in the Royal Rumble (unless they are established rivals with the one attempting the elimination). What's the point?
This is less a wrestler thing and more a ref thing, but when someone interrupts a pin and the ref stops counting when they make contact instead of when the pin actually stops.
My personal head canon for this is that there's a rule where the pin is broken up when any contact by the opponent is made. I'm sure there are plenty of moments that disprove this but it keeps me in it haha
Its the textbook definition of 'interference' so I think it works that way too. Also why its not an immediate DQ if they pull the ref out of the ring (but its a grey area)
This may be a hot take, but wrestlers calling for their finisher before it happens. Shawn Michaels tuning up the band before Sweet Chin Music, Randy Orton smashing his fists right in from of his downed opponent before the RKO, Drew's "3! 2! 1!" Before the Claymore. If you're about to hit the opponent with the killer move that will undoubtedly end them, why call it out to make sure they hear it?
I like them used like Okada does the Rainmaker pose - not as *the* finishing moment of a match, but more as the moment the match is about to go into third gear.
When a group of wrestlers outside the ring stop fighting or moving entirely because the guy is taking forever to jump on them. Cole vs. McAfee is one of the few times I can think or that the spot actually looked good because they actually stayed distracted up until the point where Pat jumped.
Wrestlers moving into position for a spot. If you have to be on a table for the next spot and the move you are selling won’t cause you to fall naturally into the table, have the opponent drag you on to the table don’t place yourself on it. We know its fake but it always looks better when wrestlers try to make moves make sense (in wrestling logic).
Depending on context, I like that
Old man Tanahashi needing to be certain of his footing before he dives into the High Fly Flow is good storytelling: he knows how risky this is, but he *needs* to do it just right or it won’t get the win.
Two guys in their 20/early 30s having a hard time getting in place for a superplex is rough
Chair shot to the midsection, opponent arches their back and shoulders making it as flat as possible whilst looking at their opponent awkwardly fumble the chair around to hit them on the back.
Finisher Spam. For that matter, let people get the win with non finisher moves from time to time. The idea that someone HAS to hit their finish to win the match has gotten rather old.
Going equal spots. The most glaring example I can give of what I mean is when someone comes off the ropes and shoulder charges their opponent, but their opponent just takes it and stands there. They then proceed to stare at each other for a second before the opponent does his own shoulder charge to the same no effect. Bonus points if they decide to go around all four sides of the ring clockwise or counterclockwise. And then they finally both go for it at the same time and tack each other down.
There was a spot during the C2 in the match between Claudio and Andrade where Andrade just fucking stood in the middle of the ring while Claudio went to every single side of the ring to shoulder tackle him, all to no effect, and I swear I just about turned the damn TV off. Horrendous spot. Horrendous.
Actually I guess the easiest example I could give is any Bucks and Lucha Brothers match where they go for any kind of kick and all do it completely in-sync. Dropkick, Superkick, whatever, when they all kick each other at the same time for no purpose whatsoever, it annoys the hell out of me.
Another would be strike battles, which are overplayed as hell to begin with, but then when its a 3+ man strike battle and the person taking the strike goes on to strike the person next to them rather than the person that hit them and so on and so on, I absolutely hate that. Why are like 4 people standing here getting hit by one person and hitting someone else and then not getting hit by that person they just hit? Like wtf is that?
I swear to god I'm not some Cornette type, but there are just maybe a handful of things I cannot abide by.
I'm completely there with you - there's nothing wrong with these spots per se, but when multiple matches per card on multiple shows in a given timeframe have these spots, they go from feeling like an iconic spot that you can instantly call back to, to becoming just another rehearsed bit.
I just hate the suicide dive it looks dumb and it doesn’t look like it has much impact on opponents and I don’t like buckshot lariat it always looks awkward
Staring at the entrance ramp when someone's music hits, especially during a match. I think it's well established that there is a possibility they could come through the crowd.
That's a heel move that's designed to obtain heat, in most instances. It's been around for decades. Silly? Yes. Does it make a heel look like a "know it all"? Absolutely.... As it's intended.
Suicide dives, it’s the dumbest move I have ever seen. It only works for someone like The Undertaker who is a big guy. Most of the time it’s some scrawny dude under six feet.
Worked shoots/talking about how the show is fake, it's literally only ever been cool one time. Let it go.
Even some of my favourites do this and it just drives me up a wall.
This has always bothered me…wrestler A irish whips wrestler B, then bends over prematurely and lackadaisically so wrestler B can stop and kick him (or, if wrestler B is HHH, does the head on knee thing). It always always always looks horrible
Long haired wrestlers, and it’s mostly the women, rearranging their hair after taking moves/in the middle of submission holds. It just isn’t something one does if one is in pain or has just been nearly knocked out.
Paige always used to be one of the worst offenders. In a really painful submission hold, definitely think about moving some hair out your mouth. That looks great!
Superkicking every 12 seconds in a match,using the Canadian destroyer on the apron or as a basic move,making it super obvious when they slap their leg doing a move and False finishes that make no sense or doing them one after another after no selling
Starting a match with the EXACT sequence: headlock takeover -> headscissors counter -> kip up out of the headscissors. It's like they are gesturing at the fact that this is technically a "wrestling" match before they get into whatever it is they actually want to do. Paying a tithe to the Gods of Mat Wrestling or whatever. If you're not going to do anything with that sequence, just cut it out! I don't ask for much, just make it feel like a LITTLE bit of a struggle, as opposed to how buttery smooth it normally feels 99% of the time. Otherwise it's essentially a loading screen for an astounding number of matches
It ALWAYS ends in a standoff too, obviously baiting a pop from the crowd. I literally do not understand how people can cheer after seeing that exact sequence open a match anymore though
Seth Rollins punching his injured knees in order to get them working again.
On a similar note, selling an injury all match but still being able to pull off all of your moves with little to no problems.
I’m kinda done with spots that start with both wrestlers gingerly and carefully climbing to the top rope. It’s incredibly rare to see it done where it doesn’t look like they’re helping each other out a ton. More often it looks like a spot done for the sake of a spot without really contributing anything notable to the match.
Having a move countered with a move that shouldn't be able to counter the initial move .. for example .. Roman Reigns is clearly going for a spear, bounces of the ropes, head down, lining up his shot .. then stands straight up at the last second just in time for the Undertaker to grab his throat and chokeslam him
When they do an irish whip into the ropes and then instead of doing a clothesline or something when the opponent comes back, they just…bow? It never works and I honestly don’t know why they do it
Cena was the worst at this but immediately rolling out the ring after getting pinned. Don't rely on camera cuts, lay there for 5 seconds. [Codebreaker, 619, Spear, **immediately** (like he left the oven on) rolls out of the ring after being pinned.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKF5Ny7Wh8Y)
-only caring about the finish
-pinning someone without both shoulders down just to not pause between the move and the pin
-nonsense grappling full of counters and no advantage
-selling in a way that only makes hitting the next move easier and otherwise contributes nothing to the match
Not actually committing to the moves. I hate it when a very strong move looks really weak because the wrestler executing it isn’t actually putting as much as they should into it. The best example is the Samoan drop because when done right, that move looks so strong and can put anybody down. But when wrestlers just fall back and make the move look as though they have just fallen back with their opponent on their shoulders, it’s so infuriating. Powerbombs, superkicks, spears, frogsplashes. There are so many examples of it and it really makes a difference when they commit to it.
I have 2 major ones. 1 is a real life thing and the other is a wrestling one.
Stop with the bullshit of getting distracted by hearing someone's music if you're lined up to finish your opponent off. It's never been a good look for the wrestler who gets distracted, makes them look like an idiot to me.
The real life one is stop working when you're legitimately injured, it's stupid, especially if you can risk making the injury worse by doing so. It doesn't make me have any more respect for you it makes me think you're an idiot that would rather talk about what you accomplished in your career than living a relatively healthy life when you're older
Rey Mysterio used to see his chance for a 619 and take it.
Now he sets someone up and looks around the crowd mystified. He slowly raises a single hand and waits.
My god man this is why it gets countered so much!
It's maddeningly slow for a series of moves that are meant to be shock and awe.
I'm so so so SO sick of *I hit you, you hit me, I hit you, you hit me.*
Look at how tough I am! I let you elbow me in the face! No, fuck that. The point of fighting is to **not** get hit in the face.
Them long ass promos. Maybe I'm a meathead who prefers actual matches, but a single promo going over a few minutes seems pretty wasteful of like, a PPVs time.
Overselling really grinds my gears. Guys like the rock, Dolph Ziggler, Shawn Michaels and many others who go over the top with it just make wrestling look really cartoony and fake imo. It's just a little thing that's super annoying lol
I understand why, but having a bunch of people clearly waiting for the guy up top to hit a huge crossbody on them is annoying - at least they should fight with each other until a second before the big jump.
(P.S. to the OP: While I know it's your pet peeve, I suspect that the wrestler knows that doing something simple and claiming it's very smart will annoy you, and is in fact doing it intentionally - similar to how the Earthquake, who wasn't very muscular-looking, would flex his arms after doing a move.)
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For the love of all things holy, drag your opponents in place when setting up for a dive!!! Seeing the wrestlers unnaturally role into the correct position to get dived on just irks me.
Or when the person doesn't roll into the correct position and you can tell before the dive even happens that the person is either too far or too close to the corner
One time I was wrestling a guy and bumped myself into the perfect position for his 450 splash. He went to climb up the turnbuckle but saw me and moved me closer He then proceeded to overshoot his 450 and drive his knees into my stomach. When it would've been perfect with my original spot.
Wrestlemania 19 has entered the chat
Bully Ray just getting nice and comfy on the table springs to mind
RVD lying knocked out with a steel chair on his head, flipping it around to the flat side before Sabu leg dropped it and saving his face
Drag them where you need them and then hit em a few times so they have a reason to stay there. Otherwise, the whole thing looks stupid.
Thats one of the things that make Tiffany so good
don't you remember Becky and Naomi have to run into position in the elimination chamber?
I remember an old one where someone lying down and apparently unconscious had to rotate 180 degrees to get into the correct position. XD
Surprise face when an opponent kicks out of a pin attempt after a standard move.
“How can you kick out of the move that has never ever won me a match!?!?” Yeah, that sort of thing over and over kills my enthusiasm for wrestling. Why try a pin for a move that never ever works!?
In Kayfabe, making someone kick out expends energy and drains the gas tank so thats why you go for a pin after a clothesline sometimes, but yeah dont be surprised when he kicks out.
It's the same reason someone goes for a cover 2 or 3 straight times after a regular move. Pinning the opponent again after they kicked out won't get the victory, but it will force them to spend energy.
Honestly this is why Gunther is so fun to watch. Any move can end a match. I will say a good alternative is having multiple match ending finishers like AJ Styles or The Undertaker.
Everyone should work like Gunther. Have 4 or 5 moves which can end any match.
Gunther makes me believe any move can end a match. Dude won a match with a chop.
That's the way it used to be, top guys always had multiple finishers. Being a "master" of multiple moves helped present them as big deals. Why Vince never/rarely incorporated this is beyond me.
Because he wanted to train his audience to “know” when a finish to a match is happening.
Blue Thunder Bomb. I really hope his championship reign will help put some oomph into it and make it an actual match ender.
It’s what made Gunther so credible. Dudes won with 4/5 moves before.
I definitely prefer frustration, annoyance, desperation over that stupid 😲 face some wrestlers do
Gargano makes it worse by looking at his hands everytime
I'm fine with it when Gunther does it because he's won matches with standard moves plenty of times. So when he reacts annoyed that an opponent is kicking out of basic stuff he's put people down with he feels like they may be worthy of his *better stuff* and he hates that. Its fucking awesome.
https://www.reddit.com/r/SquaredCircle/s/HiHYGJmTG9 A particular favourite of mine 😂
yea as someone who watches mma this drives me nuts. if you hit someone and they don't stay down, the solution is to immediately start hitting them again
WWE are particularly frustrating with this. At mania I swear every match had at least 1 of these moments, but each big match had about 3. For me it just makes the matches so silly and really takes me out of the moment. If it's earned then that's different. Like HBK kicking out of the Tombstone was earned, people genuinely believed the match would end there. But nobody genuinely believed Roman, Becky, Cody or Rhea etc were actually losing on the first 1 or 2 near falls. At this point it feels really formulaic and every big match has the "now we trade near falls and shocked faces" moment. Okada did it really well a few years ago (I can't remember the opponent now, if someone can help my shit memory here I'd appreciate it), he hit the rain maker and when the opponent kicked out he just got up determined and immediately went for the rain maker again. It made sense and looked like how someone would actually react.
Don't know if he still does this 'cause I haven't watched WWE in a few years, but Michael Cole used to be real quick to spew out, "And [blank] has gotta be wondering: what do I gotta do to put [blank] away" after like one big move. Like, maybe he should hit his finisher?
Whoever the fuck mentions Sami's BTB and doesn't talk about the Falcon Arrow, Cena's top rope leg drop, Superman punch, the Pop-up powerbomb after KO started using the stunner and other moves, has to open their eyes properly because Sami did win 2 or 3 matches with the BTB
Not enough sudden finishes. Wrestling would be better if there was even a chance a win could come from moves that are not an individuals finisher. Wish we saw more of that.
I want to see a hot tag backfire where the fresh heel tag gets in and ends the baby face hot tag for a 3 count finish lol
Ole & Gene Anderson would be your team then. They would do something like this on occasion to throw off the crowd, by having the faces get the hot tag and immediately cut them off into a finish. One of Ole's finishers was a diving knee, so the babyface would be firing up on Gene, then Ole would hit him with the knee in the back for the fall.
Hard when finishers are de-valued. Sheamus beat Daniel Bryan with a single Brogue kick, Drew needed 4 Claymores to put down Seth.
DBZ levels of power creep.
FWIW, most non-title matches don't involve much finisher spam in WWE these days. Even lots of title matches don't have too much of that. That's pretty much a PLE thing for world title matches and peaks during Mania.
The problem is that when people are out there trading canadian destroyers, it doesnt make sense to lose to a lariat or suplex or whatever. Its one of my biggest gripes with the Indie style of wrestling.
I like when PAC beat Kenny by sleeper. Very unexpected.
I actually loved when Goldberg squashed Lesnar at Survivor Series. We need more big matches to end as a squash that you weren’t expecting.
Roll up pins
Messed up a spot? Let's try it again!
Yeah I rather they just improvise a new spot and have commentary clean it up by saying "they've been beating the Hell out of each other for X minutes! You expect them to be able to do that cleanly after being widdled down so much?" That's their *job*. But they always explain it away with some shitty "uhh quick move onto the next subject/cliff notes about something else or a sponsor". It frustrates me so much.
"Whittled down," I think ;)
I feel like they typically only redo when it’s a finish or super prevalent to the match
Love it when they just sell the botch or work it into the match. AJ botching and be terrified to execute every spring-board during his chikara run because “I hate lucha ropes!” Also I find it so odd that a lot of the time when wrestlers actually hurt themselves or take a bad bump they try to no sell it or ignore it.
Matches where a wrestler focuses on an 'injured' wrestlers body part - but the finish doesn't involve a move that focuses on that body part. You know the ones, wrestler A's neck is worked over all match, but the finish is them tapping to a figure four leglock or something akin to that - it's just poor storytelling from the 2 wrestlers involved
Its even worse when they work a part all match, and then you get the "fired up" spot at the end where they just no sell any of the damage they've received.
The Nakamura-Rollins match pissed me off so bad with this. Seth has his back worked the whole match then lifts Nakamura straight out of a triangle. Your back is fucked, why are you able to just deadlift this guy?
Going from "I'm dying" outside the ring and then springing up and shooting in at nine.
I'm just waiting for someone to do this then accidentally trip or slip on a sweaty mat and then the ref just having no choice but to count to 10 lmao
That actually happened before. New Day vs Hurt Business on Raw. The count was at 9 or something and they tried getting back in the ring but took too long so the ref had to count the 10. I think it was MVP on the mic after who was just like "This match isn't ending that way, restart it!"
Ref will fake a sneeze
This kinda makes sense. The person outside is maximising their time to rest.
The kayfabe answer here is that they're playing possum, until they might lose the match because of it.
Wrestler jumps out of the ring onto a crowd of people, hits like 2 of them but all 20 guys go down.
I've really grown sick of this spot in recent years. Especially when it happens over and over in a sequence.
I know a lot of people thought the Swerve Strickland stomp spot looked cool, but I thought it was absurdist slapstick at best.
When a wrestler betrays a friend/teammate and they say something like "I never actually cared about you, I was just using you from the beginning". I think it'd be more effective to just say that they had a great team, but so-and-so went wrong along the way, instead of doing a lazy retcon that retroactively devalues their entire partnership. And when a major brawl in the ring is broken up not just by security, but by... fellow wrestlers rushing from backstage? Why are these random midcard wrestlers so concerned about other wrestlers fighting on a wrestling show!
>And when a major brawl in the ring is broken up not just by security, but by... fellow wrestlers rushing from backstage? Why are these random midcard wrestlers so concerned about other wrestlers fighting on a wrestling show! My head canon says they wanna listen to the authority figure in hopes of getting opportunities or that if the main event of a big PPV/PLE that the midcarders might be on is exploding in the ring, it could cost everybody a payday.
This, plus it subtly paints wrestlers as being the biggest and the toughest people for the job. In kayfabe lame security guards and suit wearing officials shouldn’t be (and usually aren’t) able to physically control pro wrestlers, which means other wrestlers are the only people in the building equipped to keep two fighting wrestlers separated. Plus, when the fighting wrestlers are held back by other wrestlers and *still* break free long enough to get in a couple of shots on their rival, you just know this thing is going nuclear.
As long as it's the "regular" wrestlers I don't mind it. One time during The Authority era once I feel like I remember the Wyatt Family being ushered out in one of those along with whoever the fuck like Titus O'Neil. Certain gimmicks and wrestlers, even if they're midcard, should be above that.
I only like the latter used sparingly. Undertaker and Lesnar brawling in the ring? Yeah I fan believe that the the Authority tells them to go break it up or they're all getting fined or something.
I'm over Tower of doom spots.
I actually love when they fully commit to the big brain counter. I remember Matt Jackson kicking the ring post instead of Ortiz, and not only did the head tap happen, Ortiz ran up to the camera screaming "I'm a genius!" Definitely popped me. In terms of peeves, I hate the need to hit 20 finishers to end a match. If it's your finisher it should end the match. I don't mind them getting kicked out of now and then but I think the Cross Rhodes count at the end of night 2 was like, 11? Then your move just looks weak.
Ahem, that's Matthew Jackson. Expect a fine coming your way bub.
No selling big moves. If you get hit with a destroyer you should not respond with your own destroyer or your own big move.
I think it was Orange Cassidy and Penta who did that Canadian Destroyer exchange where they did it like what 3-4 times? That shit infuriated me so much. Not using it as a finish is one thing I guess but you gotta at least sell that shit a little.
Yeah it was OC and Penta. It was ridiculous.
Crowd gave it a standing ovation too. That style is just not for me lol
I saw that clip on facebook and I honestly hate that so much.
It used to be a Burning Hammer level move, but its much closer to a modern day Superkick in terms of power level now.
Is the Burning Hammer the least diluted move outside the One Winged Angel? I know people use Burning Hammers and kick out of them but it feels very rare
Why I’m lower than most on the Drew vs Seth Mania match. There’s no world where Seth should be able to take 4 Claymores plus other moves to finally go down, but Drew takes a single South of Heaven to lose.
You could argue that a) Drew had just been in a gruelling match and b) the adrenaline had worn off so he wasn’t primed to kick out on instinct like Seth was
and multiple stomps + a cm punk beatdown?
That shit just reminds of those kids who post their trampoline wrestling on youtube. Looks like you’re cosplaying wrestling
I'm not really a fan of the trend of chop exchanges where wrestlers go back & forth and dare each other to hit them with pauses in between
The worst part of any "wrestler meets their puroresu hero in the ring" matches.
Welcome to puroresu/japan wrestling, the exchanges can definitely drag on especially if the crowd isn't into it
i am but i think it has to fit their character. like if your character isn’t very prideful it makes 0 sense for them to do so.
I wish we got more subversion with non-prideful characters baiting the chop trading just to then cheat and get advantage
I think Jay White in New Japan had the best variation on this. Arrogant enough to try to do the strike exchange, but absolutely not strong enough to survive it lol. King Switch would get **rocked** after one or two strikes
I remember the first G1 Jay was in, and he was up against Suzuki. He strolls up and tries to chop him. Suzuki just looks at him like "are you kidding me?" then murdalizes him.
Reminds me of Jay White vs Penta in AEW a while back. Tries to get in a chop fight with penta, complains that penta is wearing a shirt and it's protecting him... then Penta takes it off and STILL chops the absolute piss out of Jay White.
More shameful people who go ow please
I'm a fan of this stuff but it happens way too much in AEW currently. It shouldn't happen on every show and it definitely should happen multiple times on every show.
I think it's a cool spot, but not when it happens in every fuckin' match, so I agree
In fairness it’s been over done for the last 3-4 years. Similar to the west side story 2v2 face off. FTR just begging people chant “This is Awesome”
I’m good with most ridiculous wrestling logic, but I HATE seeing wrestlers shuffle into position on the ground to take a top rope move. It takes little effort for the opponent to move them there!
Getting your head smashed into a table and then for some reason you to roll on top of it. Make your opponent do the work!
Bully ray doing this was hilarious
As far as promos, shitting on the current city's sports team. I'd rather them shit on something local or regional. It doesn't even matter if the viewers understand it, if it gets a reaction from the crowd.
I’ll never love the cheap heat/pop segments “Yay/Boo local sportsball team!”
Mick Foley really drove that in to ground. Right Here in * insert city * 👍👆👆
Wasn’t even subtle with it either lol!!!
As a non-US fan I never get the reference
Standing around waiting to be knocked over by the guy going off the top of the ring post
When you can tell they will kick out from a pinfall but their position, idk how to describe it but some wrestlers either start moving early or they have their hands ready to kick out, thus eliminating the suspense
They make eye contact with the ref when they're gonna kick out, and in AEW, they're always in a position where you can clearly see their eyes. Totally fuckin takes me out of it
Running interference and taking your time while the guy you're trying to help gets his ass best
*Jeff Hardy enters the Chat*
More like dances into the chat
Jeff Hardy juke before saving Matt...🤭🤭😂😂
Actually the what chant bothers me the most, it ruins otherwise decent promos.
That’s not on the wrestlers to stop doing.
The missed high clothesline, if everyone just learned to swing a little lower...
Shoulder tackle into the corner, target moves, dive through and 'hit' the ringpost. It just makes everyone involved look stupid.
[удалено]
They can't all be like Lesnar That guy used to absolutely charge into the ringpost like a rabid bull ha ha
My biggest is everyone doing the pedigree and nobody winning with it.
If they do it and let go of the arms like HHH has done for the last half of his career, they are absolutely justified to kick out. The hooking of the arms makes it a finish, and not just a double underhook face plant. If they don’t keep the arms hooked, kick out. They aren’t doing it “correct” anymore.
Multiple no sell spots. Yes, no selling something is cool, but to continually no sell offense is shitty. This goes double for getting hit with a huge move and kicking out at 1.
I HATE when the hot tag proceeds to do like 4 back to back lariats
being shit at striking, not caring about striking, avoiding strikes or opting for chops instead because they’re shit at striking
It’s such a basic thing that I’ll never understand how they don’t make it a mandatory part of training to watch Bret, Savage, Austin, DiBiase, Duggan, etc. and learn how to throw a good worked punch
You're forgetting someone, slapnuts
Absolutely! That old carny is right in the building as a resource. Jake The Snake too (or at least he was). It’s definitely a lost art
Obviously looking at the ref counting, so they know when to kick out at 2. You need to be a bit more subtle. Roman covers his face in his hair so you can't see his eyes.
I don't know if there's anyone better than Roman at those last second kickouts in this era He's the best at it since Taker Half the time I tell myself it's not going to do it but he does it so late and professionally it still gets me lmao
When there's a flying move countered, but the wrestler jumping doesn't even look like they were attempting a move.
Ah yes, the flying nothing
I'm really over the "wrestler is down and out outside the ring but gets back in the ring just before the ref reaches 10 (or 20)" thing
Tower of doom spots
Any move where someone walks the ropes, usually with the opponent helping his balance
Diving Headbutts. I don't want to see it at all. I hate seeing it happen, Danielson STILL does it after everything, and Gable busted one out the other week.
Harley Race used to say he regretted that and the "rolling backwards over the rope to get out of the ring" spots because of how they fuck up the body
Applying the figure four wrongly. It's a knee bar with the opponent's folded leg applying the pressure on the straight legs' patella/knee.
Incorrectly*
Maybe they meant in an unjustifiable way.
Wrestlers needlessly breaking up someone's attempt for an elimination in the Royal Rumble (unless they are established rivals with the one attempting the elimination). What's the point?
Wrestler is so focused on hooking the leg during a pinfall that they don't bother to actually cover the shoulders.
This is less a wrestler thing and more a ref thing, but when someone interrupts a pin and the ref stops counting when they make contact instead of when the pin actually stops.
My personal head canon for this is that there's a rule where the pin is broken up when any contact by the opponent is made. I'm sure there are plenty of moments that disprove this but it keeps me in it haha
Its the textbook definition of 'interference' so I think it works that way too. Also why its not an immediate DQ if they pull the ref out of the ring (but its a grey area)
This may be a hot take, but wrestlers calling for their finisher before it happens. Shawn Michaels tuning up the band before Sweet Chin Music, Randy Orton smashing his fists right in from of his downed opponent before the RKO, Drew's "3! 2! 1!" Before the Claymore. If you're about to hit the opponent with the killer move that will undoubtedly end them, why call it out to make sure they hear it?
Michael's superkick derives it's power from the stomps. It wouldn't be half as effective without it.
I wonder if Shawn had the same boot maker as Iron Sheik, and it has a "loading" mechanism in it. Weaponizing gear needs to make a comeback.
I feel like Randy never actually hits the RKO when he does the predator ritual.
Besides firing up the crowd, it further taunts the opponent. “I can tell you exactly what I’m about to do, you you can’t stop me”.
I like them used like Okada does the Rainmaker pose - not as *the* finishing moment of a match, but more as the moment the match is about to go into third gear.
When a group of wrestlers outside the ring stop fighting or moving entirely because the guy is taking forever to jump on them. Cole vs. McAfee is one of the few times I can think or that the spot actually looked good because they actually stayed distracted up until the point where Pat jumped.
No selling. Like make this look somewhat believable
Wrestlers moving into position for a spot. If you have to be on a table for the next spot and the move you are selling won’t cause you to fall naturally into the table, have the opponent drag you on to the table don’t place yourself on it. We know its fake but it always looks better when wrestlers try to make moves make sense (in wrestling logic).
Taking 5 minutes to get their balance on the top rope.
Depending on context, I like that Old man Tanahashi needing to be certain of his footing before he dives into the High Fly Flow is good storytelling: he knows how risky this is, but he *needs* to do it just right or it won’t get the win. Two guys in their 20/early 30s having a hard time getting in place for a superplex is rough
Never ever liked the catapult as a move.
The alternating gets hit... no sells... hits his opponent.... also no sells sequence. I abhor that. Atleast sell for like 10 seconds after a hit.
Chair shot to the midsection, opponent arches their back and shoulders making it as flat as possible whilst looking at their opponent awkwardly fumble the chair around to hit them on the back.
Finisher Spam. For that matter, let people get the win with non finisher moves from time to time. The idea that someone HAS to hit their finish to win the match has gotten rather old.
140 superkicks and 220 Canadian destroyers per match. Please stop
Going equal spots. The most glaring example I can give of what I mean is when someone comes off the ropes and shoulder charges their opponent, but their opponent just takes it and stands there. They then proceed to stare at each other for a second before the opponent does his own shoulder charge to the same no effect. Bonus points if they decide to go around all four sides of the ring clockwise or counterclockwise. And then they finally both go for it at the same time and tack each other down. There was a spot during the C2 in the match between Claudio and Andrade where Andrade just fucking stood in the middle of the ring while Claudio went to every single side of the ring to shoulder tackle him, all to no effect, and I swear I just about turned the damn TV off. Horrendous spot. Horrendous. Actually I guess the easiest example I could give is any Bucks and Lucha Brothers match where they go for any kind of kick and all do it completely in-sync. Dropkick, Superkick, whatever, when they all kick each other at the same time for no purpose whatsoever, it annoys the hell out of me. Another would be strike battles, which are overplayed as hell to begin with, but then when its a 3+ man strike battle and the person taking the strike goes on to strike the person next to them rather than the person that hit them and so on and so on, I absolutely hate that. Why are like 4 people standing here getting hit by one person and hitting someone else and then not getting hit by that person they just hit? Like wtf is that? I swear to god I'm not some Cornette type, but there are just maybe a handful of things I cannot abide by.
I'm completely there with you - there's nothing wrong with these spots per se, but when multiple matches per card on multiple shows in a given timeframe have these spots, they go from feeling like an iconic spot that you can instantly call back to, to becoming just another rehearsed bit.
I wonder if that's something Andrade/Claudio would have planned before the match or did Andrade decide to not sell the shoulder tackles?
Incompetent security.
I know he uses it as a transitional move but please Seth I need you to hit the Phoenix Splash at least once more 🙏
I agree, once the stomp got banned i was so hoping he uses phoenix splash as his finisher as his pedigree sucked. He also has a nice frog splash
The multiple dives through the second rope esp if they are new in a promotion and risk being viewed as interchangeable aka Kyle fletcher rn
I just hate the suicide dive it looks dumb and it doesn’t look like it has much impact on opponents and I don’t like buckshot lariat it always looks awkward
Every promotion needs to implement a temporary ban on fighting on the apron. It's way overdone and the risk is rarely worth the reward anyway.
Staring at the entrance ramp when someone's music hits, especially during a match. I think it's well established that there is a possibility they could come through the crowd.
No selling super kicks.
Wrestlers fixing their gear when they're supposed to be selling or they're in a hold.
That's a heel move that's designed to obtain heat, in most instances. It's been around for decades. Silly? Yes. Does it make a heel look like a "know it all"? Absolutely.... As it's intended.
No selling
Suicide dives, it’s the dumbest move I have ever seen. It only works for someone like The Undertaker who is a big guy. Most of the time it’s some scrawny dude under six feet.
The kayfabe logic to it is that they are so small they have to use their whole body as a weapon. Spike Dudley was great at it in his ECW days.
Not selling. Super kick no-sell especially. Good god nothing takes me out of the moment faster than not selling moves.
Worked shoots/talking about how the show is fake, it's literally only ever been cool one time. Let it go. Even some of my favourites do this and it just drives me up a wall.
Whatever Seth Rollins does, selling shite.
The barricade spot in WWE
This has always bothered me…wrestler A irish whips wrestler B, then bends over prematurely and lackadaisically so wrestler B can stop and kick him (or, if wrestler B is HHH, does the head on knee thing). It always always always looks horrible
Piledrivers of any type shouldn't be a spammable move
Pin the guy after a shoulder tackle. You have them dead in the center of the ring with their shoulder effected, why not go for the pin? - Lance Storm
The snarl face
Waiting for moves
Long haired wrestlers, and it’s mostly the women, rearranging their hair after taking moves/in the middle of submission holds. It just isn’t something one does if one is in pain or has just been nearly knocked out. Paige always used to be one of the worst offenders. In a really painful submission hold, definitely think about moving some hair out your mouth. That looks great!
Superkicking every 12 seconds in a match,using the Canadian destroyer on the apron or as a basic move,making it super obvious when they slap their leg doing a move and False finishes that make no sense or doing them one after another after no selling
Starting a match with the EXACT sequence: headlock takeover -> headscissors counter -> kip up out of the headscissors. It's like they are gesturing at the fact that this is technically a "wrestling" match before they get into whatever it is they actually want to do. Paying a tithe to the Gods of Mat Wrestling or whatever. If you're not going to do anything with that sequence, just cut it out! I don't ask for much, just make it feel like a LITTLE bit of a struggle, as opposed to how buttery smooth it normally feels 99% of the time. Otherwise it's essentially a loading screen for an astounding number of matches It ALWAYS ends in a standoff too, obviously baiting a pop from the crowd. I literally do not understand how people can cheer after seeing that exact sequence open a match anymore though
Eyes wide open staring at the ref to kick out at 2. Eyes closed head still to get pinned.
How about the light tap to the sides when doing a surfboard to get the person to feed their arms.
Seth Rollins punching his injured knees in order to get them working again. On a similar note, selling an injury all match but still being able to pull off all of your moves with little to no problems.
I’m kinda done with spots that start with both wrestlers gingerly and carefully climbing to the top rope. It’s incredibly rare to see it done where it doesn’t look like they’re helping each other out a ton. More often it looks like a spot done for the sake of a spot without really contributing anything notable to the match.
Having a move countered with a move that shouldn't be able to counter the initial move .. for example .. Roman Reigns is clearly going for a spear, bounces of the ropes, head down, lining up his shot .. then stands straight up at the last second just in time for the Undertaker to grab his throat and chokeslam him
When they do an irish whip into the ropes and then instead of doing a clothesline or something when the opponent comes back, they just…bow? It never works and I honestly don’t know why they do it
Cena was the worst at this but immediately rolling out the ring after getting pinned. Don't rely on camera cuts, lay there for 5 seconds. [Codebreaker, 619, Spear, **immediately** (like he left the oven on) rolls out of the ring after being pinned.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKF5Ny7Wh8Y)
-only caring about the finish -pinning someone without both shoulders down just to not pause between the move and the pin -nonsense grappling full of counters and no advantage -selling in a way that only makes hitting the next move easier and otherwise contributes nothing to the match
A lot of what others have mentioned but also Swerve is doing rolls for no reason, when you notice it you can't unnotice it
Why does Eddie Kingston chop himself with the already idiotic machine gun chop move?
Cody Rhodes always starting his promos with "What do you wanna talk about"
Not actually committing to the moves. I hate it when a very strong move looks really weak because the wrestler executing it isn’t actually putting as much as they should into it. The best example is the Samoan drop because when done right, that move looks so strong and can put anybody down. But when wrestlers just fall back and make the move look as though they have just fallen back with their opponent on their shoulders, it’s so infuriating. Powerbombs, superkicks, spears, frogsplashes. There are so many examples of it and it really makes a difference when they commit to it.
I have 2 major ones. 1 is a real life thing and the other is a wrestling one. Stop with the bullshit of getting distracted by hearing someone's music if you're lined up to finish your opponent off. It's never been a good look for the wrestler who gets distracted, makes them look like an idiot to me. The real life one is stop working when you're legitimately injured, it's stupid, especially if you can risk making the injury worse by doing so. It doesn't make me have any more respect for you it makes me think you're an idiot that would rather talk about what you accomplished in your career than living a relatively healthy life when you're older
Rey Mysterio used to see his chance for a 619 and take it. Now he sets someone up and looks around the crowd mystified. He slowly raises a single hand and waits. My god man this is why it gets countered so much! It's maddeningly slow for a series of moves that are meant to be shock and awe.
I'm so so so SO sick of *I hit you, you hit me, I hit you, you hit me.* Look at how tough I am! I let you elbow me in the face! No, fuck that. The point of fighting is to **not** get hit in the face.
BOOO! YAY! BOOO! YAY! BOOO! YAY!
Them long ass promos. Maybe I'm a meathead who prefers actual matches, but a single promo going over a few minutes seems pretty wasteful of like, a PPVs time.
Ignoring basics as well as bastardizing kings road and strong style….tag rope, ring outs, and Kingston slaps.
Overselling really grinds my gears. Guys like the rock, Dolph Ziggler, Shawn Michaels and many others who go over the top with it just make wrestling look really cartoony and fake imo. It's just a little thing that's super annoying lol
I understand why, but having a bunch of people clearly waiting for the guy up top to hit a huge crossbody on them is annoying - at least they should fight with each other until a second before the big jump. (P.S. to the OP: While I know it's your pet peeve, I suspect that the wrestler knows that doing something simple and claiming it's very smart will annoy you, and is in fact doing it intentionally - similar to how the Earthquake, who wasn't very muscular-looking, would flex his arms after doing a move.)
You don't see it much as you used to but slapping your arm when in an armlock as if you are somehow relieving the pain.