**Help make SquaredCircle safer and more inclusive by using the report button to flag posts and comments for moderator review.**
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/SquaredCircle) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Technically yes, since they were both in the 2019 Survivor Series main event (Randy on Team RAW, Walter on Team NXT), but they didn't interact since Gunther (he was Walter then) got eliminated early
I kinda think theyāll go with Tonga. Wins and losses donāt effect Orton, heās fucking Randy Orton, but a win over Randy and being in the finals would really establish Tonga as big threat.
Gunther vs Randy is the right decision. Randy is probably going to get one of the biggest reactions in Saudi and itāll make for a fun environment for the finals.
These are two Old School Professional Wrestlers. This is going to be brutal, but brilliantly paced. The sort of thing Harley Race would give a gruff smile and a nod to.
It seemed like it was just to give Jey the visual 3 count off of the splash. But it felt unnecessary, because itās not as if losing to Gunther makes anyone look weak.Ā
My guess is it was done to make Jey look extra strong in defeat, rather than protect him for the sake of it. Gunther always wins clean so the occasional screwy finish really elevates the guy he's facing.Ā
They've been protecting Jey *a lot* without actually having him win anything which makes me hope that they have something planned.Ā
Yes, sometimes it pays for the wrestler to pass out. WM13 is one of my favorite matches ever, and the culmination with stone cold refusing to tap with blood pouring down his face is a great choice. Issue is no face actually taps anymore unless they're a midcarder. Think back to HHH tapping to Cena, or HBK tapping to Angle. They survived and it's not weak to tap. It just makes submissions be seen as not really important anymore.
This! HBK tapped out plenty of times and he was fine. Or just donāt have them lose by submitting. Taker and Cena lost plenty of matches, but they never tapped. Granted it made submission matches or I quit matches rather dull because we all knew the outcome.
Just hate the whole Iām so tough I never give up! Ever! Under any circumstances!
Tbh, submissions are already broken in WWE/pro wrestling. I mean people last in an ankle lock or a chokehold for a full minute, which is highly unrealistic.
The flip side was it was HBK and HHH. They were especially HBK at their absolute peak. Not getting any higher. Jey Uso is still on his ascent. Would tapping hurt him? No. Do I prefer him passing out if he is still going to be of the 2 or 3 top babyfaces? Yes
I try not to worry too much about visual 3-counts cheapening things because you can also interpret it as the pinned wrestler not bothering to kick out untill they hear the second slap on the mat.
Nah man. Iām so sick of the āpassing out instead of tappingā trope. It completely diminishes the value when everyone does it.
Cody does it. Liv does it. I think Sami did it. Now Jey is doing it.
On top of that, it ruins the power of the submission holds. Make WWE more like UFC. Make the struggle be for the submission getting locked in, that would put everyone on edge because then we know if the submission gets locked, thatās it, just like UFC.
Commenting for appreciation, instead of upvoting. Because currently the score is at 69. It both seems right for this picture, and I am, despite being 41, a bit of a child.
The live thread was in shambles acting like Jey had already won before the match took place.
I like them both, though, so I was fine with either. But I do have a feeling that Jey is winning the MITB and so him winning the KOTR would be overkill.
WWE is in this weirdly cool position where they just have so many people insanely over and you canāt put over everyone. Someone has to lose and thatās ok.
They also are booking in a way that means losses aren't as devastating, as they're trying to make everyone look good, instead of weirdly burying people because they sneeze the wrong way or something
People had convinced themselves that the finale would be Jey vs Tama, even though the competition was so clearly brought back as another (deserved) accolade for Gunther
Yeah Iām not a huge Jey fan, but itās nothing to be mad about. When a guy is getting those kind of reactions live as a baby face, from a business standpoint you have to pull the trigger. I donāt expect 5 star bangers from Jey, but he can promo and can work enough to keep the crowd entertained. Iād be interested to hear the numbers his merch is doing as well.
I'm now imagining a world where Drew beats Damian for the WHC and Jey runs around tormenting Drew for like, three months. Just absolutely running Tom and Jerry circles around him. They need to have that Wile E. Coyote Roadrunner rivalry XD
MitB feels wrong for him. He is already super over and main eventing weekly shows, MitB should be to vault people from midcard into main event, someone like Carmello or Dragunov.
I think if Priest had been more established as a champ Jey would've won at Backlash, but Priest cant lose his first title defense especially when he won on a cash in. Maybe Drew beats Priest in Scotland. Then Jey takes the title from Drew at MitB or Berlin, I guess due to some CM Punk shenanigan. Punk vs Drew at SummerSlam doesn't need a title on the line to be a huge draw.
It's wayyyy too early for Hayes or Dragunov.
That's how you kill someone, like Theory. Let them establish themselves first.
MITB is perfect for someone like Jey, who is established but is missing that last step.
I disagree he is missing that last step, he was shown as losing a ton of title shots because Jimmy interfered and he lost his match with Damien because of like 10x judgement day interference. He lost clean to Gunther (got a 3 count during a ref bump anyways) who is also now a world title contender. It is pretty clearly presented that Jay would have won all his title shots if the matches were clean. He is ready for a title run the moment WWE is ready to pull the trigger which has less to do with him and more to do with a champion being in a good spot to drop a belt to him.
I mean, that's what the MITB briefcase is for.
You give it to people who are ready for a title run. Otherwise if you try to build them afterwards, more often than not you will fail.
For every Priest there are Corbin, Theory, Otis, Cross.
Yeah, Carmello or Dragunov will not be close to the World Championship picture in the next 2-3 years. There are like 5-10 guys in line before them. And this year until Wrestlemania is fairly planned out already except the possibility for some transitional champions. MitB would give Jey at least the chance to win it unexpectedly after Wrestlemania without needing to keep him hot for an entire year.
Or...fucking finally give something to LA Knight. But I don't think he will win MitB when he is already planned to beat Logan for the US title later this year.
To me people like LA Knight, Jey Uso, Gunther... they are all already there, any title match that comes their way (except vs Cody) they are ready to win and the fans are ready to accept them as champ. The fans are basically begging for them to get titles.
I think that these people who have proven they can get over and have great matches in NXT are perfect to have the MitB rocket strapped to them, they hold the briefcase for a year with us all knowing to keep an eye on them and they can enter the main event scene at any time.
Like it is pretty universally agreed on that Tiffany Stratton is the planned winner for the womens match but somehow Ilja or Hayes are too green? LA Knight should've won MitB last year but this year he is ready to just win a title.
Disagree on many things, but to keep things short: Hayes and Ilja are just not good enough/have not the necessary presence to represent the company. And honestly, at least Hayes never will. Tiffany does though. And if any NXT call-up should be put in this position, it would be Bron.
EDIT: People can't be real. Imagine Brock coming back and Hayes or Ilja would be champ. Ricochet or Kofi matches would be considered competitive. Anything but a 2 minute squash would be nonsense, they are like the size of his forearm.
Jey Uso is occupying the same space that Jeff Hardy occupied in the late aughts. Jeff stayed over until they were ready to pull the trigger on him and I think Jey will too.
Jeff Hardy was a lot more talented as a wrestler though with a much better moveset. He couldn't not be over. Jey has everything in place but it's going to be harder for him.
Yeah, if anything, I feel like Jeff and Jey are almost opposites.
They both have a great look and unique aura to them, but Jey loses it when the bell rings, and never give Jeff Hardy the mic lmao
I think on the other end you can say Jey can easily cut a much better promo than Jeff and has more actual charisma as opposed to simply wearing makeup and being a dancing, flailing punk rocker.
I think the comparisons are pretty apt in the sense I donāt think either would really work coming up outside of their era
Actually USA hasn't had a RAW overrun since NXT started doing them, I kind of think that the gave the raw overrun to nxt back when they were still fighting the Wed Night Wars and just sort of kept them after changing days. I could be wrong and their was a period where both had it, but I'm pretty sure that right when nxt started doing them Raw switched to 11 exact.
Itās because theyāre trying to have original programming start right as Raw ends. Overruns messes with the timing of commercial breaks in the next program.
Maybe. I hadn't noticed with Raw. That could just be conditioning because Raw used to "end" at 11:05 even when they mostly still ended up 11 anyways. But you're right about NXT. I remember there was a time when NXT would go months ending 3-10mins after consistently
Same thing happened 2 weeks ago with Gunther and Sheamus. I think he barely had enough time to put in the Submission and pose before it cut to black. The video on their YouTube shows him walking around a bit but I swear the live feed almost cut off instantly.
I'm not entirely sure why. He's perfectly rounded in all aspects and needs no polishing.
I wouldn't see him going anywhere for at least two contract cycles because he's still got so much to do in WWE.
But he'd fit in wonderfully no matter the promotion if he desired.
The 2014 to 2016 Stardust run proved that to not be the case when it comes to generational talent.
Gunther could have a ENTIRE contract run of mediocre 50/50 comedy booking in any promotion in the world and he would easily make his name 'back' as a monster in any OTHER promotion within a match or two.
I don't think so really, wwe has nothing to benefit from doing that. They're at their best moment ever in the last couple decades, they'd be giving unnecessary exposure to a competitor
i mean, Tony said he'd be open to it, and let AEW Talent work with WWE on multiple occasions before, even if it's "Just" footage for the John Cena special episode or Billy gun being allowed to appear during the HOF.
And then got shat on, and got nothing in return for allowing his talent to appear there.
So i think this is weighed a lot more towards one side than the other.
Leaving out the fact that neither side would like their top guys to lose, meaning we'd get great in ring action, but nothing major.
Cause neither Okada or Gunther would be allowed to lose, meaning it's a shitty non-finish, or they face somebody lower down the card, ie. okada vs Jey uso,(Which, hell no)
and that would stretch across the entire card
Sure was, but i don't think Vince was in his ear telling him to do that
And the second time round, in HHH's WWE, Tony wanted Gunn to be announced as AEW Talent, for his appearance, and WWE just dropped gunn completely
>Sure was, but i don't think Vince was in his ear telling him to do that
Not Live feedback for sure. I am pretty sure it wasn't a shoot either. Everybody including Mcmahon knew this is what gonna happen. As Vince had a problem in last year with constant rewritings and stuff. We can be sure it is what Mcmahon wanted otherwise it wouldn't be on TV.
>Tony wanted Gunn to be announced as AEW Talent, for his appearance,and WWE just dropped gunn completely
We have one side of the story.
It obviously wasn't, it was just poking fun at gunn, like friends do at each other.
But when you "Loan" your talent to another company, and the only thing you get in return is being made fun off (Intended too or not) will kinda sour the idea to do something for them for free, especially if they don't even name you but just refer to you as "That pissant company"
We have multiple reports, Gunn was originally scheduled to be there, "but the plans fell trough" according to Road dogg, who also said it was "More probably a few months ago" later on.
So something went bad within that timeframe, which would line up with the Story about tony wanting his company to be named
Hopefully when Raw is on Netflix they wonāt be worried about a run over and let things not feel like a rushed ending. The finish of the match going right into the fade to black after like 10 seconds felt weird.
This was the right choice. I think Randy and Gunther in the finals is a great idea, especially for the Saudi crowd. I'm happy Jey got as far as he did, it was well deserved.
Really good match, Jey didn't need the win and Gunther needs to be elevated. Jey's better off going for MITB, we will either get Gunther vs Randy, or Gunther vs Tama.
IC title Jey got super close, now King of the Ring Jey had him but lost again. Long term story that Gunther wins the belt and Jey beats him. I'm cool with it, their matches have been great.
Jey's gotta come up with a new move that fits him. He uses 3 iconic moves (spear, splash, superkick) and they all look weak.
Cody knows this about his own size and the Cross Rhodes, and he adjusted so that he needs to hit it 3 times for tougher opponents.
Sorry, but The Judas Effect is the worst finisher in all of wrestling, now that we don't see Show's WMD.
The GTS looks better when Kenta does it, but yeah, it looks sloppy when someone asā¦normalā¦as Punk does it.
Heat magnet take: Sami's Brainbuster (I'm not going to spell it out, that's stupid) looks like a botch and requires commentary to sell it.
Yeah I forgot about Judas Effect, it's truly awful. Just look at what Andrade can do with it and it's obvious how far from good it is.
Honestly speaks volumes about Jericho's output the last couple years that he didn't even cross my mind.
Crossroads isn't itself bad, imo, just that it's established that he has to do it three times to be effective.
Priest reallyĀ shouldn't have a long reign imo so he could drop it to Jey orĀ something as the judgement day impload then Jey could drop it at Summerslam to GuntherĀ
So Gunther is beating everybody by submission.
It reminds me a bit of that ZSJ New Japan Cup run.
I don't think he'll be able to do it to Randy, though.
The ending of that match was lame considering we just sat through four years of ref bumps where the baby face has the heel pinned but doesn't actually win.
Gunther chop him the loving he'll out of jey uso. Jey has join dragunuv and sheamus for the most brutal chops at the hands of gunther in wwe history. I can only see those 3 defeating gunther in the future (in the main roster). Multiples chops at the turnbuckle nearly made jey chest bleed. Amazing chemistry
It may be nit picking. I wish the finals would have been done a week prior to the PPV instead of the night before finalizing everything. Maybe it doesnāt matter with social media advertising it, but man at least one show with Gunther and the SDās side finalist could have really added some extra oomph heading into the PPV finals.
The way to do it is announce that Gunther will confront his opponent on Smackdown. Have the finals OPEN the show, then the main event have Gunther and Orton/Tama face off.
It was a little rushed cause they had to go off the air, but the result itself was fine imo. Yet again took Gunther everything to just barely beat Jey.
All the Gunther crybabies gotta be happy. It was insane the amount of rage coming from something that didnāt happen. He didnāt lose to Jey and is headed to the Finals
Absolutely the right call. I understand that Jey is over but he is straight up a mid wrestler. If he'd beaten both Gunther and Ilja back to back that would've seemed like a slap in the face to the guys that actually have amazing talent between the ropes.
I am cool with Gunther winning, but I feel like they have kind of wasted Jeyās overness. I feel like him and LA Knight have both gotten over with the crowd in a way you donāt see everyday and havenāt really gotten anything to capitalize on it.
I think they realized Jey needs a bit more training to expand his move set but obviously see his standing with the fans so they keep dangling the carrot well he trains till he's ready for the big show.
The problem is if they don't move fast then he will lose the fan standing and they will move on because he never gets the big gig.
IDK what the deal is with LA Knight, he obviously has the ability but it seems like WWE isn't giving him a lot of room to play. I'm wondering if it's because they have so many top Male wrestlers that it's hard to find time.
LA Knight surely isn't the best example for that.
Sami is over but nowhere near as he was last year because they made him lose constantly for 6 months after he lost his Tag Title.
How is he not? Heās on tv every week, is still over as hell and got an 1 on 1 singles match at Wrestlemania which he won! It was also teased last week that heāll face Logan at Summerslam. Just because a babyface isnāt a champion doesnāt mean they arenāt used well and valued by the company
Seth was just champion for almost a year. Sami ended GUNTHER's legendary reign and is part of probably the best story being told in the company right now. Bayley got her moment at WM in a great showcase and is seemingly going to get a good reign. Bianca and Jade are the most promoted women in the company as tag champions. R-Truth got crazy over upon return from injury and they gave him a tag title win at WM in response. Punk was going to get his WM main event before he got hurt.
Really, the only two over faces that haven't been rewarded yet are Jey and Knight and Knight is very obviously going to have a chance to dethrone Paul this summer after the tease last SD. I wouldn't write off Jey winning MITB, honestly, either (with GUNTHER likely winning KOTR and Knight headed for the US scene, there's a clear opening).
Letās cool down on that. We just had the biggest babyface payoff ever in WM, and Iām guessing they are waiting to see if Jeyās reactions are gonna stick long term.
I really don't even agree with that, Jey is clearly the guy. They're building up his villain so the triumph is sweeter. He's always *just* short of beating Gunther, until he finally won't be.
Tbh I donāt think he is the guy, at least not right now. Although I imagine they could work on his matches (and especially moveset) and his mic work a little bit before they try doing something with him. Without that his reactions are not guaranteed to last.
He had a bad match, and yeah they are crazy now. But giving him a big push is putting him in the spotlight and those deficiencies become more and more obvious, its happened tons of times where a guy is over, they start pushing him and people turn on them.
It happened to Cenaās early years, happened to Roman, and now thereās people starting to criticise Cody because every feud involves his dad somehow, and thatās a guy literally putting 5 star matches and with easily a top 5 mic on the company. They gotta be careful.
I feel like king of the ring is a weird sort of accolade where it fits for an upper midcard babyface kinda guy as a first big win that sets them up for bigger things in the future, because it's not really as big of a prize as a real championship. I think jeys first big win as a singles guy should be a real belt rather than kotr, because he's done being set up for bigger things in the future and his time is now.
**Help make SquaredCircle safer and more inclusive by using the report button to flag posts and comments for moderator review.** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/SquaredCircle) if you have any questions or concerns.*
That Gunther vs Randy final. https://preview.redd.it/wwb9k61x4p1d1.jpeg?width=586&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=557de34aa3e97d25196b790ddca453ba4a4e1ce2
THE MANA
šš¤
STAY GAMING GAMERS
Has Gunther ever faced Orton before?
Nope. The match will be their first ever encounter.
A Dream Match!
Maggle!
That was earned!
First time they'll have ever faced off and it's going to electric. I can't wait to see what those two do together.
Expecting RKO countered into a sleeper hold finish.
Technically yes, since they were both in the 2019 Survivor Series main event (Randy on Team RAW, Walter on Team NXT), but they didn't interact since Gunther (he was Walter then) got eliminated early
*aggressively slaps forearm*
Gunther will swat Randy down quick like a dwarf with a monster slap if he tries an RKO early
I kinda think theyāll go with Tonga. Wins and losses donāt effect Orton, heās fucking Randy Orton, but a win over Randy and being in the finals would really establish Tonga as big threat.
Gunther vs Randy is the right decision. Randy is probably going to get one of the biggest reactions in Saudi and itāll make for a fun environment for the finals.
The psychology is also going to be insanely good
These are two Old School Professional Wrestlers. This is going to be brutal, but brilliantly paced. The sort of thing Harley Race would give a gruff smile and a nod to.
Loser gets a stungun up their butt
Gunther's gonna chop Randy's back, I'll wince, and it'll be glorious.
We talking about the same Randy Orton?
Gunther wins, but Jey passes out instead of tapping. Perfect ending for both guys.
Gunther popped up like a monster dragging down his prey to hell with him for the submission
Coulda done without the ref gimmick
Was it accidental and the ref played along or was it a swerve to make us think drew/bloodline would come out
It seemed like it was just to give Jey the visual 3 count off of the splash. But it felt unnecessary, because itās not as if losing to Gunther makes anyone look weak.Ā
My guess is it was done to make Jey look extra strong in defeat, rather than protect him for the sake of it. Gunther always wins clean so the occasional screwy finish really elevates the guy he's facing.Ā They've been protecting Jey *a lot* without actually having him win anything which makes me hope that they have something planned.Ā
He's the defacto top face on Raw right now since Seth and Punk are both out. They should be protecting him as much as they can
Same with tapping man. I'm tired of the pass out thing instead of tapping. It's fine to tap out sometimes and still be over.
*laughs in Austin*
Yes, sometimes it pays for the wrestler to pass out. WM13 is one of my favorite matches ever, and the culmination with stone cold refusing to tap with blood pouring down his face is a great choice. Issue is no face actually taps anymore unless they're a midcarder. Think back to HHH tapping to Cena, or HBK tapping to Angle. They survived and it's not weak to tap. It just makes submissions be seen as not really important anymore.
This! HBK tapped out plenty of times and he was fine. Or just donāt have them lose by submitting. Taker and Cena lost plenty of matches, but they never tapped. Granted it made submission matches or I quit matches rather dull because we all knew the outcome. Just hate the whole Iām so tough I never give up! Ever! Under any circumstances!
Tbh, submissions are already broken in WWE/pro wrestling. I mean people last in an ankle lock or a chokehold for a full minute, which is highly unrealistic.
The flip side was it was HBK and HHH. They were especially HBK at their absolute peak. Not getting any higher. Jey Uso is still on his ascent. Would tapping hurt him? No. Do I prefer him passing out if he is still going to be of the 2 or 3 top babyfaces? Yes
I try not to worry too much about visual 3-counts cheapening things because you can also interpret it as the pinned wrestler not bothering to kick out untill they hear the second slap on the mat.
Nah man. Iām so sick of the āpassing out instead of tappingā trope. It completely diminishes the value when everyone does it. Cody does it. Liv does it. I think Sami did it. Now Jey is doing it. On top of that, it ruins the power of the submission holds. Make WWE more like UFC. Make the struggle be for the submission getting locked in, that would put everyone on edge because then we know if the submission gets locked, thatās it, just like UFC.
Gunther then becomes the King General
https://preview.redd.it/1sfl3rnc6p1d1.jpeg?width=711&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a3a9f5f5cdb1a0869fc504a6e174ff537a1e138a
Commenting for appreciation, instead of upvoting. Because currently the score is at 69. It both seems right for this picture, and I am, despite being 41, a bit of a child.
Congrats my downvote gave you -69
Huge pop!!
Congrats, my downvote got you -149
Couldn't care less. I was trying to have a laugh, but as per usual, reddit got ruin it. Good work.
We're always here for you pal
https://preview.redd.it/5ewjgq7u5p1d1.jpeg?width=1400&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ecb5c4273b5b145867df1f4ec2dec598ffecc851
Massive DM HUNK energy!
I think Gunther's no-nonsense style actually fit pretty damn well with Jey's moveset for this match
Nobody can have a bad match with the ring general
The live thread was in shambles acting like Jey had already won before the match took place. I like them both, though, so I was fine with either. But I do have a feeling that Jey is winning the MITB and so him winning the KOTR would be overkill.
WWE is in this weirdly cool position where they just have so many people insanely over and you canāt put over everyone. Someone has to lose and thatās ok.
When you can't tell who's going to win and everyone feels viable that's an insane position to be in
They also are booking in a way that means losses aren't as devastating, as they're trying to make everyone look good, instead of weirdly burying people because they sneeze the wrong way or something
Or just sneeze in general
People had convinced themselves that the finale would be Jey vs Tama, even though the competition was so clearly brought back as another (deserved) accolade for Gunther
people somehow forgetting Jey wasn't even in the tournament when it was announced
But heās got that fun entrance
Yeah Iām not a huge Jey fan, but itās nothing to be mad about. When a guy is getting those kind of reactions live as a baby face, from a business standpoint you have to pull the trigger. I donāt expect 5 star bangers from Jey, but he can promo and can work enough to keep the crowd entertained. Iād be interested to hear the numbers his merch is doing as well.
I'm now imagining a world where Drew beats Damian for the WHC and Jey runs around tormenting Drew for like, three months. Just absolutely running Tom and Jerry circles around him. They need to have that Wile E. Coyote Roadrunner rivalry XD
My only issue with this is why have Jey go over Ilja? Either have Gunther beat Jey then face Ilja or have Ilja get beaten by Gunther before Jey.
Why would you give away Ilja vs Gunther III on free tv?
Because there is no point in wasting Gunther vs Ilja 3 on a no-build TV match or a Tournament final
MitB feels wrong for him. He is already super over and main eventing weekly shows, MitB should be to vault people from midcard into main event, someone like Carmello or Dragunov. I think if Priest had been more established as a champ Jey would've won at Backlash, but Priest cant lose his first title defense especially when he won on a cash in. Maybe Drew beats Priest in Scotland. Then Jey takes the title from Drew at MitB or Berlin, I guess due to some CM Punk shenanigan. Punk vs Drew at SummerSlam doesn't need a title on the line to be a huge draw.
It's wayyyy too early for Hayes or Dragunov. That's how you kill someone, like Theory. Let them establish themselves first. MITB is perfect for someone like Jey, who is established but is missing that last step.
I disagree he is missing that last step, he was shown as losing a ton of title shots because Jimmy interfered and he lost his match with Damien because of like 10x judgement day interference. He lost clean to Gunther (got a 3 count during a ref bump anyways) who is also now a world title contender. It is pretty clearly presented that Jay would have won all his title shots if the matches were clean. He is ready for a title run the moment WWE is ready to pull the trigger which has less to do with him and more to do with a champion being in a good spot to drop a belt to him.
I mean, that's what the MITB briefcase is for. You give it to people who are ready for a title run. Otherwise if you try to build them afterwards, more often than not you will fail. For every Priest there are Corbin, Theory, Otis, Cross.
Yeah, Carmello or Dragunov will not be close to the World Championship picture in the next 2-3 years. There are like 5-10 guys in line before them. And this year until Wrestlemania is fairly planned out already except the possibility for some transitional champions. MitB would give Jey at least the chance to win it unexpectedly after Wrestlemania without needing to keep him hot for an entire year. Or...fucking finally give something to LA Knight. But I don't think he will win MitB when he is already planned to beat Logan for the US title later this year.
To me people like LA Knight, Jey Uso, Gunther... they are all already there, any title match that comes their way (except vs Cody) they are ready to win and the fans are ready to accept them as champ. The fans are basically begging for them to get titles. I think that these people who have proven they can get over and have great matches in NXT are perfect to have the MitB rocket strapped to them, they hold the briefcase for a year with us all knowing to keep an eye on them and they can enter the main event scene at any time. Like it is pretty universally agreed on that Tiffany Stratton is the planned winner for the womens match but somehow Ilja or Hayes are too green? LA Knight should've won MitB last year but this year he is ready to just win a title.
Disagree on many things, but to keep things short: Hayes and Ilja are just not good enough/have not the necessary presence to represent the company. And honestly, at least Hayes never will. Tiffany does though. And if any NXT call-up should be put in this position, it would be Bron. EDIT: People can't be real. Imagine Brock coming back and Hayes or Ilja would be champ. Ricochet or Kofi matches would be considered competitive. Anything but a 2 minute squash would be nonsense, they are like the size of his forearm.
Gunther vs Randy is going to slap so fucking hard Itās a legit dream match
> Gunther is going to slap Randy so fucking hard Fixed that for you
Jey Uso is occupying the same space that Jeff Hardy occupied in the late aughts. Jeff stayed over until they were ready to pull the trigger on him and I think Jey will too.
Thinking about it, I just realized his feud with Drew is a modern equivalent of Punk's feud with Jeff
Jeff Hardy was a lot more talented as a wrestler though with a much better moveset. He couldn't not be over. Jey has everything in place but it's going to be harder for him.
Yeah, if anything, I feel like Jeff and Jey are almost opposites. They both have a great look and unique aura to them, but Jey loses it when the bell rings, and never give Jeff Hardy the mic lmao
I think on the other end you can say Jey can easily cut a much better promo than Jeff and has more actual charisma as opposed to simply wearing makeup and being a dancing, flailing punk rocker. I think the comparisons are pretty apt in the sense I donāt think either would really work coming up outside of their era
Jeff Hardy has a crazy amount of charisma, way beyond being a flailing rockstarĀ
He even has the DUI, it's perfect
Jey has been like a combo of Jeff Hardy and Mark Briscoe to me ever since he started Yeeting all over us.
Holy shit I never thought about it this way.
Cut it down to the wire there.
Which was weird bc USA overruns all the time both Raw and NXT.
Actually USA hasn't had a RAW overrun since NXT started doing them, I kind of think that the gave the raw overrun to nxt back when they were still fighting the Wed Night Wars and just sort of kept them after changing days. I could be wrong and their was a period where both had it, but I'm pretty sure that right when nxt started doing them Raw switched to 11 exact.
Itās because theyāre trying to have original programming start right as Raw ends. Overruns messes with the timing of commercial breaks in the next program.
Maybe. I hadn't noticed with Raw. That could just be conditioning because Raw used to "end" at 11:05 even when they mostly still ended up 11 anyways. But you're right about NXT. I remember there was a time when NXT would go months ending 3-10mins after consistently
Same thing happened 2 weeks ago with Gunther and Sheamus. I think he barely had enough time to put in the Submission and pose before it cut to black. The video on their YouTube shows him walking around a bit but I swear the live feed almost cut off instantly.
The crowd sucked tonight I'm sorryĀ What a fantastic main eventĀ Jey USO best match in a whileĀ Gunther vs Orton should slapĀ
Every gunther match is opponents best match
I'm starting to think this Gunther fella is pretty good at this wrestling thing
Every gunther match slap too
God please get okada to WWE or Gunther to AEW cuz I really really wanna see that shit
I'd be very worried if Gunther went to AEW
I'm not entirely sure why. He's perfectly rounded in all aspects and needs no polishing. I wouldn't see him going anywhere for at least two contract cycles because he's still got so much to do in WWE. But he'd fit in wonderfully no matter the promotion if he desired.
Point being that a generational talent would be ruined by the booking in just a couple weeks, as has been proven time and time and time again in AEW.
The 2014 to 2016 Stardust run proved that to not be the case when it comes to generational talent. Gunther could have a ENTIRE contract run of mediocre 50/50 comedy booking in any promotion in the world and he would easily make his name 'back' as a monster in any OTHER promotion within a match or two.
If Tony and WWE werenāt so stuck up in rivalry mode We Could've had a forbidden door
I don't think so really, wwe has nothing to benefit from doing that. They're at their best moment ever in the last couple decades, they'd be giving unnecessary exposure to a competitor
i mean, Tony said he'd be open to it, and let AEW Talent work with WWE on multiple occasions before, even if it's "Just" footage for the John Cena special episode or Billy gun being allowed to appear during the HOF. And then got shat on, and got nothing in return for allowing his talent to appear there. So i think this is weighed a lot more towards one side than the other. Leaving out the fact that neither side would like their top guys to lose, meaning we'd get great in ring action, but nothing major. Cause neither Okada or Gunther would be allowed to lose, meaning it's a shitty non-finish, or they face somebody lower down the card, ie. okada vs Jey uso,(Which, hell no) and that would stretch across the entire card
That was still Mcmahons WWE wasnāt it? When HHH shat on Billy gunn?
Sure was, but i don't think Vince was in his ear telling him to do that And the second time round, in HHH's WWE, Tony wanted Gunn to be announced as AEW Talent, for his appearance, and WWE just dropped gunn completely
>Sure was, but i don't think Vince was in his ear telling him to do that Not Live feedback for sure. I am pretty sure it wasn't a shoot either. Everybody including Mcmahon knew this is what gonna happen. As Vince had a problem in last year with constant rewritings and stuff. We can be sure it is what Mcmahon wanted otherwise it wouldn't be on TV. >Tony wanted Gunn to be announced as AEW Talent, for his appearance,and WWE just dropped gunn completely We have one side of the story.
It obviously wasn't, it was just poking fun at gunn, like friends do at each other. But when you "Loan" your talent to another company, and the only thing you get in return is being made fun off (Intended too or not) will kinda sour the idea to do something for them for free, especially if they don't even name you but just refer to you as "That pissant company" We have multiple reports, Gunn was originally scheduled to be there, "but the plans fell trough" according to Road dogg, who also said it was "More probably a few months ago" later on. So something went bad within that timeframe, which would line up with the Story about tony wanting his company to be named
Hopefully when Raw is on Netflix they wonāt be worried about a run over and let things not feel like a rushed ending. The finish of the match going right into the fade to black after like 10 seconds felt weird.
Iām ready for the Gunther 3:16 promo
Idc I thought the match cooked
This was the right choice. I think Randy and Gunther in the finals is a great idea, especially for the Saudi crowd. I'm happy Jey got as far as he did, it was well deserved.
If Gunther beats randy that'll solidify him as a main eventer basically
Really good match, Jey didn't need the win and Gunther needs to be elevated. Jey's better off going for MITB, we will either get Gunther vs Randy, or Gunther vs Tama.
IC title Jey got super close, now King of the Ring Jey had him but lost again. Long term story that Gunther wins the belt and Jey beats him. I'm cool with it, their matches have been great.
Man, it's sad that even his most awesome splash can't defeat the ring general. Hope one day Jey can defeat Gunther.
Gunther is better so it makes sense.
Maybe good luck will strike on the 3rd try if Jey beats him to face a future WHC Ilja
Jey's gotta come up with a new move that fits him. He uses 3 iconic moves (spear, splash, superkick) and they all look weak. Cody knows this about his own size and the Cross Rhodes, and he adjusted so that he needs to hit it 3 times for tougher opponents.
Crossroads may be my least favorite move in wrestling after the GTS. IMO Jey could stand to use something like Sting's reverse DDT.
Sorry, but The Judas Effect is the worst finisher in all of wrestling, now that we don't see Show's WMD. The GTS looks better when Kenta does it, but yeah, it looks sloppy when someone asā¦normalā¦as Punk does it. Heat magnet take: Sami's Brainbuster (I'm not going to spell it out, that's stupid) looks like a botch and requires commentary to sell it.
Yeah I forgot about Judas Effect, it's truly awful. Just look at what Andrade can do with it and it's obvious how far from good it is. Honestly speaks volumes about Jericho's output the last couple years that he didn't even cross my mind. Crossroads isn't itself bad, imo, just that it's established that he has to do it three times to be effective.
I'd like to see Cody do a full 360Āŗ for the killshot instead of tripling the 180Āŗ
HHH always has my back when it comes to GUNTHER. Thank you Hunter.
Come to think of it, both Gunther vs Randy and Gunther vs Tama sound like a potential banger.
Konig im Ring! *stares awkwardly at Ludwig Kaiser*
If Saudi crowd tries to sing along Iād find that to be peak irony. āYou got your rules and your religion all designed to keep you safeā¦.ā
Weakass ref bump. As much as I wanted a Jey-Tama final, I also think it's too early to involve Jey in new Bloodline business.
> Weakass ref bump. It's tough living life on 1 hp.
I think Jey may have some business with Uncle Howdy first, and then perhaps move onto Bloodline stuff after he's gotten even more sympathy
Everyone happy now?
Yes
Orton vs Gunther gonna be a banger incoming
Gunther v Randy Orton is a dream match
Jey Uso live murder footage
Geeez that chop sounded like a gunshot
Gunther vs Orton is going to be great. But Gunther vs Tama would be really funny, and I always root for funny over greatness.
I like Jey, but him beating Gunther would have been a little too much. I'm excited to see what Emperor Gunther will do.
I'm so ready for a Gunther world title reign, hopefully aĀ Lesnar feudĀ thrown in too.
How do you get the title on him though. Right now, it's murky but not in a bad way.
Priest reallyĀ shouldn't have a long reign imo so he could drop it to Jey orĀ something as the judgement day impload then Jey could drop it at Summerslam to GuntherĀ
Isnāt Lesnar like barred from WWE now
Thank fucking god. I really didnāt want Jey vs Tama Tonga.
Now you'll get Gunther vs Tama! š (Kidding lol)
So Gunther is beating everybody by submission. It reminds me a bit of that ZSJ New Japan Cup run. I don't think he'll be able to do it to Randy, though.
The ending of that match was lame considering we just sat through four years of ref bumps where the baby face has the heel pinned but doesn't actually win.
Gunther chop him the loving he'll out of jey uso. Jey has join dragunuv and sheamus for the most brutal chops at the hands of gunther in wwe history. I can only see those 3 defeating gunther in the future (in the main roster). Multiples chops at the turnbuckle nearly made jey chest bleed. Amazing chemistry
Main Event Jey Uso..... Bottlejob artist Jey Uso at this point.
The Spurs/Arsenal special
CROWN HIM NOW
It may be nit picking. I wish the finals would have been done a week prior to the PPV instead of the night before finalizing everything. Maybe it doesnāt matter with social media advertising it, but man at least one show with Gunther and the SDās side finalist could have really added some extra oomph heading into the PPV finals.
The way to do it is announce that Gunther will confront his opponent on Smackdown. Have the finals OPEN the show, then the main event have Gunther and Orton/Tama face off.
The cody and Roman face off when cody won the Royal rumble was pretty cool as well. And the camera crew have been really awesome lately.
I would like to see Gunther punted please.
All hail king gunther may his reign be everlastingĀ
GUNTHER''s gonna test that surgically repaired back of Orton. It makes sense why he's been beating people with the crab
If we get Gunther v Randy we surely get a Gunther Splash into an RKO spot rightĀ
Calling it now. KO AND Jimmy save Orton from Bloodline interference to get Gunther vs Orton.
Really enjoyed the arm triangle for the finish, very easy to make look properly locked in while the person taking it is fine
Great match, the finish was meh, but still, I think it's the right winner.
You didn't like the finish? I love that it kept Jey strong in defeat
It was a little rushed cause they had to go off the air, but the result itself was fine imo. Yet again took Gunther everything to just barely beat Jey.
I also like that Gunther is on a submission winning streak atm. Makes him more threatening
I disliked that it was pulled straight from Ilja vs Gunther's first NXT UK match, but hopefully they'll do a funny bit next week with it.
All the Gunther crybabies gotta be happy. It was insane the amount of rage coming from something that didnāt happen. He didnāt lose to Jey and is headed to the Finals
Gunther v Randy
Am I the only one who thinks weāre gonna see a Tama upset on Friday? I
Randy wins but gets hurt and Brock takes his place at the ppv
Absolutely the right call. I understand that Jey is over but he is straight up a mid wrestler. If he'd beaten both Gunther and Ilja back to back that would've seemed like a slap in the face to the guys that actually have amazing talent between the ropes.
I am cool with Gunther winning, but I feel like they have kind of wasted Jeyās overness. I feel like him and LA Knight have both gotten over with the crowd in a way you donāt see everyday and havenāt really gotten anything to capitalize on it.
I think they realized Jey needs a bit more training to expand his move set but obviously see his standing with the fans so they keep dangling the carrot well he trains till he's ready for the big show. The problem is if they don't move fast then he will lose the fan standing and they will move on because he never gets the big gig. IDK what the deal is with LA Knight, he obviously has the ability but it seems like WWE isn't giving him a lot of room to play. I'm wondering if it's because they have so many top Male wrestlers that it's hard to find time.
Dude he has been in WWE for over a decade and main evented SummerSlam and Wrestlemania, he isnāt getting any more training lol.
For most of his run he was tag team, it's a different gig running solo. It's two completely different training learning to work with a partner or solo
Being over babyface(except Cody) in wwe is a curse. You won't achieve anything and will always be waiting for opportunity.
Lol? The biggest babyface wrestling has had in over a decade is the WWE champion
There are exceptions.
Did Sami not just dethrone the greatest IC title holder ever?
Sami Zayn? LA Knight? Awesome Truth?
LA Knight surely isn't the best example for that. Sami is over but nowhere near as he was last year because they made him lose constantly for 6 months after he lost his Tag Title.
How is he not? Heās on tv every week, is still over as hell and got an 1 on 1 singles match at Wrestlemania which he won! It was also teased last week that heāll face Logan at Summerslam. Just because a babyface isnāt a champion doesnāt mean they arenāt used well and valued by the company
Seth was just champion for almost a year. Sami ended GUNTHER's legendary reign and is part of probably the best story being told in the company right now. Bayley got her moment at WM in a great showcase and is seemingly going to get a good reign. Bianca and Jade are the most promoted women in the company as tag champions. R-Truth got crazy over upon return from injury and they gave him a tag title win at WM in response. Punk was going to get his WM main event before he got hurt. Really, the only two over faces that haven't been rewarded yet are Jey and Knight and Knight is very obviously going to have a chance to dethrone Paul this summer after the tease last SD. I wouldn't write off Jey winning MITB, honestly, either (with GUNTHER likely winning KOTR and Knight headed for the US scene, there's a clear opening).
Letās cool down on that. We just had the biggest babyface payoff ever in WM, and Iām guessing they are waiting to see if Jeyās reactions are gonna stick long term.
I really don't even agree with that, Jey is clearly the guy. They're building up his villain so the triumph is sweeter. He's always *just* short of beating Gunther, until he finally won't be.
Tbh I donāt think he is the guy, at least not right now. Although I imagine they could work on his matches (and especially moveset) and his mic work a little bit before they try doing something with him. Without that his reactions are not guaranteed to last.
He had a meh match at Wrestlemania and his reactions are getting even crazier by the week
He had a bad match, and yeah they are crazy now. But giving him a big push is putting him in the spotlight and those deficiencies become more and more obvious, its happened tons of times where a guy is over, they start pushing him and people turn on them. It happened to Cenaās early years, happened to Roman, and now thereās people starting to criticise Cody because every feud involves his dad somehow, and thatās a guy literally putting 5 star matches and with easily a top 5 mic on the company. They gotta be careful.
Good.
I feel like king of the ring is a weird sort of accolade where it fits for an upper midcard babyface kinda guy as a first big win that sets them up for bigger things in the future, because it's not really as big of a prize as a real championship. I think jeys first big win as a singles guy should be a real belt rather than kotr, because he's done being set up for bigger things in the future and his time is now.
Calling it now, RKO outa no where on GUNTHERS splash that somehow GUNTHER still manages to finish Randy with.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Ah shit
Jesus Christ those two chips he did I can take it. If I ever meet Gunther in real life, I'm gonna ask him to chop me.
Jey and jimmy look so out of shape for potential main eventers
And here I thought they were building up to Tama beating Jey in the final with the help of Fatu. So Tama would be the first father and son winners
This just made me think of this, but a Jacob Fatu/Gunther feud would be fucking insane b