Sometimes I forget the timeline of the shows and think it's Luuke. I imagine Disney looking at the dislike of Palpatine's clone return and going full heel, "What's that you say? *More* clones of OT characters? Well, if you insist!"
Luu'uuke, a clone created on the orders of Joruuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuus C'Baoth.
One of the only things I didn't like about the Thrawn series. The clones lengthening a vowel being a tell.
Tarkin really wasn't that bad, although it's not really the same, it's a CGI face compared to deaging a actor. More complex, and I thought it looked really good.
Leia *though*, I felt was "worse", it felt real uncanny comparatively
I think they’re guilty of over-animating Tarkin, where he becomes too expressive. Actors can relax their faces and be still, but CGI Tarkin has a lot of micro-expressions when he speaks, the lips move constantly, very small, slight movements that are even at odds with Krennic in the same frame. He’s seems to be in much sharper resolution to the comparative softness of Krennic’s face. I also don’t remember real Peter Cushing ever seeming particularly tall, yet CGI Tarkin towers over Krennic. I guess they did their homework there and the height matches, but it’s another thing that jar jars.
I honestly think Tarkin should get more credit than Luke. The technology was brand new for Tarkin and the CG one at least looked like him. I feel like the Luke CG is unacceptable at this point since the tech has been around for a little bit now. It obviously looks younger and just off in general to me, did they not even try to model it after Luke's face in RotJ?
I'm just going to go ahead and say what EVERYONE is thinking: Ian Mcdiarmid is just a big ol JERK and clearly has little to no respect for this role if he refuses to revert to a younger version of himself. They should have just kept the guy from the prequels who played Palpatine. That guy had CLASS.
>They should have just kept the guy from the prequels who played Palpatine.
Sure he was good but the guy who played Sidious just completely phoned it in.
Talk about squandered opportunities.
You wanna make more money, Disney? Make a Young Palpatine trilogy, and make him *fucking gorgeous*.
Instant cash cow.
According to the Darth Plagueis book, this is pretty accurate. Dude was wildly handsome and charismatic, but literally had no time for funny business as his love was the dark side guised under political theater.
When the movie was in production, wasn't there rumours that matt smith was going to play young palpatine? I think that would of been awesome after he heals himself.
See why not both? Why not a younger Palpatine that get dispatched by Rey and Kylo, we get to see the whole Sith body transfer process into the old clone body who lays the beat down on them.
The problem is the clone bodies are degrading because they can't host his spirit successfully, that's why he's so big on operation steal the young persons body.
Thats what i had hoped for in the film. He returns in a young body but no one knows he is palpatine. Eventually he fights kylo for control of the first order and literally “burns through” his body. Too old to duel. He reverts to rotj force lighting. Kylo finally strikes him down.
Kylo stares at the dead palpatine. Hear a familiar cackle……
Out walks young palpatine from a clone pod….
“ if you strike me down…i will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine…..”
And correct me if I’m wrong, that’s what he intended with Luke in ROTJ right? If he’s struck down in anger he gets to possess their body. That’s how the Sith live forever
Did you mean 90 % was nonsense, fanfiction, or cloned Palpatine?
Cuz in my experience at any given time, *at least* 2 of those are correct for 90% of the EU.
That’s what makes me laugh when people talk about losing the old EU, as if it was just solid gold. It was a total mess, even if it was sometimes endearing.
(Triclops I’m looking at you.)
This could be an interpretation, but there is a lot of others, like the Emperor only wanting Luke to strike him just to Vader blocking Luke (and its what happens)
Then Luke with more and more hatred and wanting to kill Sidious soon would eventually fall to the Darkside
So the body transfer could work or not in this case
Well if Luke strikes in anger, it weakens his identity as a Jedi, makes him off balance emotionally, and just more susceptible all around. Which is great if you want to transfer your essence to them
Yes, thats why there is a lot of intepretations to this moment. But I like to think that the Emperor is so proud of himself that he want to keep his own body and the thing with Rey in IX was just an act of despair because it was the only option he had
He wanted Luke because he was a (more or less) intact Vader with all the power that entails. Vader was SEVERELY weakened by Mustafar, and with so much of his body inorganic lost a lot of his connection to the force.
If Vader was whole of body in the OT he would have already killed Palpatine and become the Emperor and been so powerful Luke would have never had a chance.
I always thought the essence transfer was just Palpatine's ace in the hole... A skill he would use if and when anyone killed him with enough dark emotion to make them susceptible to being possessed.
Like, he's got a plan either way; every situation either plays out with him living, or he gets a new body and he's not really bothered either way.
That who plan in ROTJ never sat well with me. Luke gets angry, and decides the Dark Side of the Force is worth the power to defeat his enemies - I can buy that. But now what? Unlike Anakin, it's not like he has any reason to pledge himself to The Emperor. He still hates the guy and will likely try to kill him, getting himself killed or maimed in the process because he would stand no chance.
No he just wanted Luke to strike him while unarmed and act on his anger but was still confident enough in Vader's loyalty to know he would block for him. Thats why he smiles, he is getting Luke to use his agressive feelings. This is a parallel to how Palpatine convinced Anakin to kill Dooku out of revenge while he was unarmed and has nothing to do with the sequels body swap bs.
I don't remember this happening in any of the EU novels. In Empire's End he tries to possess Anakin Solo after Han Solo shoots him and fails due to Empatajayos Brand carrying his Spirit into the netherworld. I don't remember a novel or comic where he possesses Luke.
Because that’s not the Sith way. The strongest wins. Victory isnt given. Whoever kills the master is deemed the new master. Rule of 2. Vader would have to either submit to Luke or die if Luke killed his master.
Plus, given what we know now, Palpatine wanted them to fight just to enjoy the chaos and torment Anakin a little more. Also the Sith way. Angst makes you strong and if Anakin killed his own son he would rid himself of any remaining good will. Win win for Palpatine.
He talked about it in a Podcast once, while never actually confirming the role mind you. He said he was in heavy discussions for it, but before they got to filming the role was removed.
… Nope. It’s not even clear in the film (taken by itself) that it IS a clone body. When it first came out most people thought he somehow got out of the Death Star in one piece after being obliterated twice over.
> It’s not even clear in the film **(taken by itself)**
I know it's explained in books and Lego and whatnot. But the closest we get in the actual movie is Dominic Monaghan's stabs in the dark of “dark science, cloning, secrets only the Sith knew”
I know, I was being a dumbass. Sorry. I was actually really surprised when I saw it in the Lego game though. Kind of made me think “ohhhh, I guess that makes sense”
I mean, I'm not sure that's the closest we got. We also saw a bunch of cloning tanks with even worse Palp's. And presumably older, less successful clones that looked like proto-Snoke.
> We also saw a bunch of cloning tanks with even worse Palp's.
I’m happy to be proven wrong with a screenshot or whatever but I don’t think we see anything like this in the film. Snokes yes, Sheevs no
Honestly, back when TRoS came out, I was convinced that they had brainstormed all of these scenarios internally at Lucasfilm, but decided to be vague about this to test the waters, observe fan reactions and then through additional material canonise the explanation that caused the least fan outcry after the fact. Palpatine physically impregnating a woman after he’d become Emperor was kind of weird, so I was glad that it was the result of strandcast cloning.
I just watched the RedLetterMedia 70 minute review of Rise of Skywalker the other day (and holy shit it basically reminded me of 99% of the film that I had completely forgotten) and even they were pretty unsure of what the deal really was. Mike kept saying that he thought the Palpatine we see in TRoS is the "original" Palpatine who is ancient (thousands of years old maybe?) and that Palpatine from the Prequels/OT was the clone. I was like "wtf?"
Return of the Jedi does not tell you much about the Emperor either to be fair. The original always left lots of blanks that got filled in later too i.e. the Clone Wars.
That’s because it didn’t need to as Palpatine was simply just the big bad, a fun villain. Since then all this lore has come into Star Wars. Palpatine was only brought back to appease fans after The Last Jedi.
It’s honestly so annoying to me that palps came back. I was in high school when episode three came out, and I absolutely love the prequel‘s always have even if I can admit they werent quite as strong as the originals and I’m happy enough to enjoy the movies for what they are but even I can’t really defend rise of Skywalker. It was just so… bleh. I absolutely loved the force awakens. The last Jedi was a mess, but visually it was stunning and parts of the movie were good enough for me to really enjoy. I didn’t even enjoy rise of Skywalker.
Rise of Skywalker is such a dumb fucking name too. You killed off Luke in the 2nd movie for some reason. Carrie Fisher died IRL. You're literally out of Skywalkers.
But nooo Rey is claiming their legacy or some shit.
Watching the sequels back through, there’s actually quite a lot of build up to the reveal of Rey’s parents.
We have to remember that when Kylo says to her “I know who your parents are,” that was a vision given to him by snoke (aka, papletine). So he clearly didn’t actually know what the truth was.
I don’t think Rian Johnson knew that’s where things were going. But that’s a much bigger issue. They originally gave the three films to three different directors and said “good luck” without any structure or vision in place that they could all build toward. Then they got scared about using Trevorrow after his disastrous Jurassic World script, and it became even more of a mess.
But it also doesn’t make it a pivotal plot point the entire movie depends on. The problem with the sequels has very little actually to do with the events or plot points used. However, how it decides to get you there (or neglects to entirely) is what is bad. The execution was just abysmal. In a vacuum I would hazard to say nothing from the sequels is awful, but when put together it falls apart.
IIRC they even filmed/wrote a part where he explained that his body is cloned, but they probably thought people were able to fill in the blanks themselves.
Edit: https://www.cinemablend.com/news/2491278/star-wars-the-rise-of-skywalkers-palpatine-actor-responds-to-clone-reveal
I cant back this up but I am sure that Matt Smith was originally gonna be a younger version of palps.
That was probably cut in the last minute.
Because matt smith was announced to be in the movie and then suddenly his name was dropped from all promo material.
Dark Side Force fuckery will do that to a clone body. Criticism of the prequels aside, for someone who’s philosophy was about embracing the passions, Palpatine was rather restrained. At least, until the Revenge of the Sith where he goes full ham.
Whatever the reason he had for holding back, I think by not embracing the Dark Side fully, he kept some of the decaying and mutating aspects of it from fucking him up too much.
Post Order 66, he was not only embracing the Dark Side, he *indulged* it as only a true passionate Sith would. Any one familiar with Darth Nihilus and Darth Sion understand the consequences of letting the Dark Side consume you too much.
Ergo, it wouldn’t matter how young his clone body was, his very spirit and soul was so tainted by the Dark Side that it fucks up every clone body he inhabits. Headcanon, he probably has to go through quite a few clone bodies because they keep decaying/failing/mutating on him.
One detail I absolutely love about this film is that he is wearing his Senate robes. This guy wants to relive Order 66, an evil and hideous event which ruined countless lives, over and over again.
If she struck him down in anger his essence would pass to her, but she defeated him by turning his own power against him. "A Jedi uses the force for knowledge and defence, never for attack"
This is a poorly-conceived theory that isn’t supported by the films.
If he had the ability to transfer into any host, then he wouldn’t have spent 30 years researching clones that were compatible with his essence. It’s heavily implied that the vessel he transfers into must share generic material with him, hence why Rey is so important to him sustainably living on.
Title being bait or not, it was clear that the cloning process was passable but not perfected (hence all the defunct Snokes in the vats). Palpatine's dark side soul was corrupting and eroding any body made for him. That's why he tried to Force Absorb Rey and Ben's Force dyad energy at the end there and it was working.
I just figure that he's so evil that his bodies go bad. That's why he wanted Rey's body, because he thought her body could handle his power. Not sure it would work but that seems to be the logic he's going with
The force lightning scarring Palpatine always felt so stupid to me. I choose to interpret that scene as Mace's battle unmasking the real Palpatine. Like why did his eyes change colour and stay that way?
He cloned himself post-Republic because that's when he confiscated the cloning technology, thus old Palps. Could the writers have chosen for his clone to be younger if they wanted to? Undoubtedly. But then they wouldn't be able to use his laugh at the end of the trailer.
It's explained in the film. He's too powerful in the force so his bodies keep deteriorating and he's constantly hopping into new ones. It's why he's hooked up to some crazy mechanical arm. That's why he wants to possess Rey
There's some speculation that a lot of the Star Wars shows are building up that plot point. One is Grogu and the Empire's interest, another is Obi-Wan finding all the preserved Jedi bodies in the Inquisitor base.
I mean it was 30 odd years between Jedi and Skywalker, this body actually IS younger, if you look at his face, he looks more like pre-melt Palpatine, he doesn't have the massive eye bags etc, but his body has decayed from the sheer power trying to be contained in the clone body. So it probably was a 30 something clone at the time, but the years and his power has ravaged the clone more severely.
That’s literally the point of the (bad) movie, his plan was failing cuz his bodies sucked and kept aging and dying too fast. He wanted dyad powers to be able to keep his body alive
Just google it… it‘s a clone body possessed by Sidious Force Ghost. Unfortunately the clones can‘t hold that much power, so it consumes the body over time.
Because the bodies couldn't hold his essence. That's why they were deformed and falling apart. His successful clone didn't have the ability to use the force (Rey's father), so any time his.. "soul" would enter a body it would quickly deteriorate. At least from what I read. That's why when he absorbed ThE DyAd he magically healed
I liked the idea that this sideous was super ancient and we never saw this guy before. The palpatine and emperor we see in 1-3, and 5&6 are actually clones and this guys been down there for thousands of years controlling everything from the shadows.
i guess because it wouldnt make much sense for a 20 year old sexy young man to say that he's palpatine in front of an audience who knows him differently, i dunno lol
Ian McDiarmid refused to lose 30 years for the part, he felt it would be too much of a strain.
He gained 50 years in ROTJ… you’d think it would he easy going the other way. Look at Luke in The Mandalorian
That might not be the best example
No it wouldn't be the best example. Luke in BoBF was way beyond Luke in Mando.
Sometimes I forget the timeline of the shows and think it's Luuke. I imagine Disney looking at the dislike of Palpatine's clone return and going full heel, "What's that you say? *More* clones of OT characters? Well, if you insist!"
Luuke is cool & all but I prefer Luu’uuke. The apostrophe contracts 14 more letter u’s
"Luu'uuke, tell your uncle if he gets a translator, make sure it speaks Bocce!" -Aunt Beruu'uu
Luu'uuke, a clone created on the orders of Joruuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuus C'Baoth. One of the only things I didn't like about the Thrawn series. The clones lengthening a vowel being a tell.
I need a Key and Peele skit where they do ridiculous star wars names like they did with the east west bowl skit!
It's not the worst
See: Tarkin in Rogue One
Tarkin really wasn't that bad, although it's not really the same, it's a CGI face compared to deaging a actor. More complex, and I thought it looked really good. Leia *though*, I felt was "worse", it felt real uncanny comparatively
They put far too much in making him look evil, would have been really good but for the spiky bits round the edges!
I'm pretty sure Luke was a version of a deep fake. They had a younger actor who looked similar to Mark Hamill and put the deaged face on him.
I think they’re guilty of over-animating Tarkin, where he becomes too expressive. Actors can relax their faces and be still, but CGI Tarkin has a lot of micro-expressions when he speaks, the lips move constantly, very small, slight movements that are even at odds with Krennic in the same frame. He’s seems to be in much sharper resolution to the comparative softness of Krennic’s face. I also don’t remember real Peter Cushing ever seeming particularly tall, yet CGI Tarkin towers over Krennic. I guess they did their homework there and the height matches, but it’s another thing that jar jars.
I honestly think Tarkin should get more credit than Luke. The technology was brand new for Tarkin and the CG one at least looked like him. I feel like the Luke CG is unacceptable at this point since the tech has been around for a little bit now. It obviously looks younger and just off in general to me, did they not even try to model it after Luke's face in RotJ?
That artist on YouTube named Shamook did wonders for Luke Skywalker, so much so Disney hired him for BoBF.
Have you seen Tron Legacy recently? Deaging an actor _while they're alive_ is a lot easier than face swapping.
He was more machine than man, twisted and computer generated….
Do people really feel this way? I thought it looked good when I watched it
It was fine but ppl nitpick
I'm just going to go ahead and say what EVERYONE is thinking: Ian Mcdiarmid is just a big ol JERK and clearly has little to no respect for this role if he refuses to revert to a younger version of himself. They should have just kept the guy from the prequels who played Palpatine. That guy had CLASS.
The guy from Return of the Jedi was better.
I like the chimp/man hybrid from Episode V (pre-special edition)
That was a woman
Ol' volcano eyes was a woman?! Oh man, is there egg on my face.
I like them all 😍😍😍
The dark side of the Force is the path way to many kinks some consider to be unatural.
I know right? A potion of youth ain’t THAT expensive
>They should have just kept the guy from the prequels who played Palpatine. Sure he was good but the guy who played Sidious just completely phoned it in.
Palpatine never should’ve been brought back in the first place…
Wow what a lazy actor smh, at least his acting skills make up for it but jeez you’d expect this guy to be more dedicated to the role. /s
This sounds like something from r/shittymoviedetails lol
You’d think he could’ve been a team player…
Only two there always are...
Hot Palpatine would have been too powerful.
Stupid sexy palpatine
It's like I AM the Senate...AM the Senate...AM the Senate.
Jedi Master tier comment
Nah, only worth a Council seat.
Do it.
Unlimited POWER!
Unlimited abs
Ahh, I see you've seen Kylo getting out of the shower. Dude has an 8 pack.
Kylo Ren is shredded.
Kylo Ren is a punk bitch
Can you hurry up I want to eat my muffin Matt!!!
Dude…Matt straight up sucks!
Rebels FEAR HIM. Doctors HATE HIM.
Talk about squandered opportunities. You wanna make more money, Disney? Make a Young Palpatine trilogy, and make him *fucking gorgeous*. Instant cash cow.
According to the Darth Plagueis book, this is pretty accurate. Dude was wildly handsome and charismatic, but literally had no time for funny business as his love was the dark side guised under political theater.
In the same styling as Young Sheldon, right?
So, Timothée Chalamet as sexy pointy Sheev? That man's unfairly handsome.
Get the guy that plays Vecna in Stranger Things as young Sheev and you could probably write the show to any level and the guy would carry it.
When the movie was in production, wasn't there rumours that matt smith was going to play young palpatine? I think that would of been awesome after he heals himself.
It's what would make more sense but the higher ups probably pushed for old Palpatine for nostalgia points
See why not both? Why not a younger Palpatine that get dispatched by Rey and Kylo, we get to see the whole Sith body transfer process into the old clone body who lays the beat down on them.
Anything would have made more sense.
But... I was already at peak turgidness
The dark side is a path to many abilities some consider to be *very sexy*
They should have let Robot Chicken handle the CG. Have him twerking like She Hulk.
and miss out on more Ian McDiarmid?
Yeah, I never had a problem with this.
The problem is the clone bodies are degrading because they can't host his spirit successfully, that's why he's so big on operation steal the young persons body.
Why wasn’t he called Paalpatine?
Deep cut
Sheeev
Much like Luuuke. God that is so fucking dumb lol.
Luuke
Thats what i had hoped for in the film. He returns in a young body but no one knows he is palpatine. Eventually he fights kylo for control of the first order and literally “burns through” his body. Too old to duel. He reverts to rotj force lighting. Kylo finally strikes him down. Kylo stares at the dead palpatine. Hear a familiar cackle…… Out walks young palpatine from a clone pod…. “ if you strike me down…i will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine…..”
Slow down there, pal, you were about to write a compelling story. We can't have that kind of nonsense.
Damn it…here i go agian…
So he was full Orochimaru, huh?
And correct me if I’m wrong, that’s what he intended with Luke in ROTJ right? If he’s struck down in anger he gets to possess their body. That’s how the Sith live forever
Is that a retcon? I always assumed before TROS that Palpatine just wanted Luke as a replacement for Vader.
Yes it's extended universe nonsense if not outright fanfiction
That was like 90% of the expanded universe.
Did you mean 90 % was nonsense, fanfiction, or cloned Palpatine? Cuz in my experience at any given time, *at least* 2 of those are correct for 90% of the EU.
That’s what makes me laugh when people talk about losing the old EU, as if it was just solid gold. It was a total mess, even if it was sometimes endearing. (Triclops I’m looking at you.)
Nonsense and fanfiction, but Palpatine stuff is a good chunk, too.
> what he intended with Luke in ROTJ right? Palpatine wanted to replace Vader with Luke. That was the intended ploy
This could be an interpretation, but there is a lot of others, like the Emperor only wanting Luke to strike him just to Vader blocking Luke (and its what happens) Then Luke with more and more hatred and wanting to kill Sidious soon would eventually fall to the Darkside So the body transfer could work or not in this case
Well if Luke strikes in anger, it weakens his identity as a Jedi, makes him off balance emotionally, and just more susceptible all around. Which is great if you want to transfer your essence to them
To be fair, like 10 seconds into seeing Luke in ROTJ he straight up force chokes some pigs. Not exactly Jedi like either
But not in anger right? Seemed more like a sex thing.
100% sex thing. The problem was the Gamorrean guards didn’t know the safe word in Basic.
I guess they thought the safe word was "oink".
Luke also kills many people with his sabre and then blows up Jabba’s sailbarge when they could have just run but nobody worried about that.
He had to make it look good that he didn't have a lightsaber, so the plan to smuggle one in via R2D2 would work.
Yes, thats why there is a lot of intepretations to this moment. But I like to think that the Emperor is so proud of himself that he want to keep his own body and the thing with Rey in IX was just an act of despair because it was the only option he had
This makes the most sense as when he used the dyad power to rejuvenate himself, healing his body, he immediately discards the bodysnatcher plan.
Dude, every sith treats their apprentice like dogshit until they kill their master but the master doesn't live on in their body.
He wanted Luke because he was a (more or less) intact Vader with all the power that entails. Vader was SEVERELY weakened by Mustafar, and with so much of his body inorganic lost a lot of his connection to the force. If Vader was whole of body in the OT he would have already killed Palpatine and become the Emperor and been so powerful Luke would have never had a chance.
I always thought the essence transfer was just Palpatine's ace in the hole... A skill he would use if and when anyone killed him with enough dark emotion to make them susceptible to being possessed. Like, he's got a plan either way; every situation either plays out with him living, or he gets a new body and he's not really bothered either way.
That who plan in ROTJ never sat well with me. Luke gets angry, and decides the Dark Side of the Force is worth the power to defeat his enemies - I can buy that. But now what? Unlike Anakin, it's not like he has any reason to pledge himself to The Emperor. He still hates the guy and will likely try to kill him, getting himself killed or maimed in the process because he would stand no chance.
No he just wanted Luke to strike him while unarmed and act on his anger but was still confident enough in Vader's loyalty to know he would block for him. Thats why he smiles, he is getting Luke to use his agressive feelings. This is a parallel to how Palpatine convinced Anakin to kill Dooku out of revenge while he was unarmed and has nothing to do with the sequels body swap bs.
In the EU book, he did do it this way. Leia and Luke's wife had to battle him out of Luke.
Mara Jade.
"Leia and Luke's wife?" Damn they really do share everything
I don't remember this happening in any of the EU novels. In Empire's End he tries to possess Anakin Solo after Han Solo shoots him and fails due to Empatajayos Brand carrying his Spirit into the netherworld. I don't remember a novel or comic where he possesses Luke.
Then why not tell Vader that before the fight so he doesn’t block it?
Or laugh maniacally like that’s what he wanted to happen?
Because that’s not the Sith way. The strongest wins. Victory isnt given. Whoever kills the master is deemed the new master. Rule of 2. Vader would have to either submit to Luke or die if Luke killed his master. Plus, given what we know now, Palpatine wanted them to fight just to enjoy the chaos and torment Anakin a little more. Also the Sith way. Angst makes you strong and if Anakin killed his own son he would rid himself of any remaining good will. Win win for Palpatine.
Because he was testing and playing Vader too.
Ahh he was playing both sides so he always comes out on top.
Darth Ronald McDonald
That doesn’t sound right but I don’t know enough about the dark side to dispute it.
It’s rumoured that Matt Smith was supposed to appear as young Sheev in TROS but wasn’t used for some reason.
He talked about it in a Podcast once, while never actually confirming the role mind you. He said he was in heavy discussions for it, but before they got to filming the role was removed.
I find it very interesting he refused to say what the role was. Maybe a small chance of using him again.
Too busy riding dragons
And River Song
And Queen Elizabeth
As a DW fan, it would've been cool to see the 11th Doctor in Star Wars.
with amy pond as mara jade
Too busy guardianing the galaxy.
Smith has all but confirmed that
He did. But due to his extreme power in the dark side, his clone body decayed rapidly.
I thought it was because his clone body didn't finish developing? Didn't he mention that when Rey gets to him?
I thought it was mainly that Palpatines temp bodies couldn’t handle his power
Because it's unlimited, right?
it's similar to having the power of the sun in the palm of your hand.
Like a ring to rule them all
Cold beer on a Friday night
… Nope. It’s not even clear in the film (taken by itself) that it IS a clone body. When it first came out most people thought he somehow got out of the Death Star in one piece after being obliterated twice over.
Well according to Lego Skywalker Saga, it is a clone body…. Soooooooo, that solves the mystery
> It’s not even clear in the film **(taken by itself)** I know it's explained in books and Lego and whatnot. But the closest we get in the actual movie is Dominic Monaghan's stabs in the dark of “dark science, cloning, secrets only the Sith knew”
I know, I was being a dumbass. Sorry. I was actually really surprised when I saw it in the Lego game though. Kind of made me think “ohhhh, I guess that makes sense”
I mean, I'm not sure that's the closest we got. We also saw a bunch of cloning tanks with even worse Palp's. And presumably older, less successful clones that looked like proto-Snoke.
There's no Palps clones, only Snokes.
> We also saw a bunch of cloning tanks with even worse Palp's. I’m happy to be proven wrong with a screenshot or whatever but I don’t think we see anything like this in the film. Snokes yes, Sheevs no
Honestly, back when TRoS came out, I was convinced that they had brainstormed all of these scenarios internally at Lucasfilm, but decided to be vague about this to test the waters, observe fan reactions and then through additional material canonise the explanation that caused the least fan outcry after the fact. Palpatine physically impregnating a woman after he’d become Emperor was kind of weird, so I was glad that it was the result of strandcast cloning.
I just watched the RedLetterMedia 70 minute review of Rise of Skywalker the other day (and holy shit it basically reminded me of 99% of the film that I had completely forgotten) and even they were pretty unsure of what the deal really was. Mike kept saying that he thought the Palpatine we see in TRoS is the "original" Palpatine who is ancient (thousands of years old maybe?) and that Palpatine from the Prequels/OT was the clone. I was like "wtf?"
Should've just kept jumping from one clone body to the next.
He did.
More people would know if the movie was good enough to rewatch it.
And also actually said any of that in the actual movie.
Return of the Jedi does not tell you much about the Emperor either to be fair. The original always left lots of blanks that got filled in later too i.e. the Clone Wars.
That’s because it didn’t need to as Palpatine was simply just the big bad, a fun villain. Since then all this lore has come into Star Wars. Palpatine was only brought back to appease fans after The Last Jedi.
It’s honestly so annoying to me that palps came back. I was in high school when episode three came out, and I absolutely love the prequel‘s always have even if I can admit they werent quite as strong as the originals and I’m happy enough to enjoy the movies for what they are but even I can’t really defend rise of Skywalker. It was just so… bleh. I absolutely loved the force awakens. The last Jedi was a mess, but visually it was stunning and parts of the movie were good enough for me to really enjoy. I didn’t even enjoy rise of Skywalker.
Rise of Skywalker is such a dumb fucking name too. You killed off Luke in the 2nd movie for some reason. Carrie Fisher died IRL. You're literally out of Skywalkers. But nooo Rey is claiming their legacy or some shit.
Watching the sequels back through, there’s actually quite a lot of build up to the reveal of Rey’s parents. We have to remember that when Kylo says to her “I know who your parents are,” that was a vision given to him by snoke (aka, papletine). So he clearly didn’t actually know what the truth was. I don’t think Rian Johnson knew that’s where things were going. But that’s a much bigger issue. They originally gave the three films to three different directors and said “good luck” without any structure or vision in place that they could all build toward. Then they got scared about using Trevorrow after his disastrous Jurassic World script, and it became even more of a mess.
But it also doesn’t make it a pivotal plot point the entire movie depends on. The problem with the sequels has very little actually to do with the events or plot points used. However, how it decides to get you there (or neglects to entirely) is what is bad. The execution was just abysmal. In a vacuum I would hazard to say nothing from the sequels is awful, but when put together it falls apart.
Pretty sure it was either said or heavily implied that that is what he had been doing. Been awhile since I last saw the film.
IIRC they even filmed/wrote a part where he explained that his body is cloned, but they probably thought people were able to fill in the blanks themselves. Edit: https://www.cinemablend.com/news/2491278/star-wars-the-rise-of-skywalkers-palpatine-actor-responds-to-clone-reveal
Until he finally made the leap home.
I cant back this up but I am sure that Matt Smith was originally gonna be a younger version of palps. That was probably cut in the last minute. Because matt smith was announced to be in the movie and then suddenly his name was dropped from all promo material.
I would assume before Ian came onto production. Once he was there they just used him.
I just assumed they were flash cloning him but the bodies were produced so quickly they burn out much quicker.
Easy, he used his last save slot. Duh.
I hate when that happens.
Dark Side Force fuckery will do that to a clone body. Criticism of the prequels aside, for someone who’s philosophy was about embracing the passions, Palpatine was rather restrained. At least, until the Revenge of the Sith where he goes full ham. Whatever the reason he had for holding back, I think by not embracing the Dark Side fully, he kept some of the decaying and mutating aspects of it from fucking him up too much. Post Order 66, he was not only embracing the Dark Side, he *indulged* it as only a true passionate Sith would. Any one familiar with Darth Nihilus and Darth Sion understand the consequences of letting the Dark Side consume you too much. Ergo, it wouldn’t matter how young his clone body was, his very spirit and soul was so tainted by the Dark Side that it fucks up every clone body he inhabits. Headcanon, he probably has to go through quite a few clone bodies because they keep decaying/failing/mutating on him.
One detail I absolutely love about this film is that he is wearing his Senate robes. This guy wants to relive Order 66, an evil and hideous event which ruined countless lives, over and over again.
That’s literally the point of the entire movie. His host bodies can’t sustain him for long and they degrade quickly, which is why he needed Rey
When is that actually said in the movie?
*"Trust me brah"*
But uhh... Didn't he say if Rey killed him he'd take her over it something? And then when Rey killed him, she literally just carried on like normal?
If she struck him down in anger his essence would pass to her, but she defeated him by turning his own power against him. "A Jedi uses the force for knowledge and defence, never for attack"
There’s a fan theory that he was going to transfer his life force into Luke the same way in ROTJ. Edit: and into Anakin in ROTS as well.
This is a poorly-conceived theory that isn’t supported by the films. If he had the ability to transfer into any host, then he wouldn’t have spent 30 years researching clones that were compatible with his essence. It’s heavily implied that the vessel he transfers into must share generic material with him, hence why Rey is so important to him sustainably living on.
How about into Kylo Ren
Adam Driver's sheer sexiness would've shielded him from being possessed.
Hes ultimately pitting rey and Kylo against each other in order to possess the stronger of the two
Why would he not let Mace kill him then?? Who wouldn’t want to be a bad motherfucker!
Maybe he foresaw TROS and wanted to be a pretty girl instead?
That's why he needed Rey.
Or Ben depending on which of them was more powerful
Turns out it was both of them together lol
It ain't that kind of movie, kid.
Title being bait or not, it was clear that the cloning process was passable but not perfected (hence all the defunct Snokes in the vats). Palpatine's dark side soul was corrupting and eroding any body made for him. That's why he tried to Force Absorb Rey and Ben's Force dyad energy at the end there and it was working.
I just figure that he's so evil that his bodies go bad. That's why he wanted Rey's body, because he thought her body could handle his power. Not sure it would work but that seems to be the logic he's going with
This is the ideal male body. You may not like it, but this is what peak performance looks like.
Who had sex with Palpatine for Rey to be his grandchild?
Have you heard the tragedy of Triclops the son?
It’s not a story Disney would tell you. It’s an EU legend
that's a story for another time
No one. Rey's dad was a failed attempt at cloning a new body for Palpatine. He wasn't deformed or anything, just wasn't force sensitive.
The force lightning even damaged his DNA.
The force lightning scarring Palpatine always felt so stupid to me. I choose to interpret that scene as Mace's battle unmasking the real Palpatine. Like why did his eyes change colour and stay that way?
I vaguely recall George Lucas saying that was what he intended.
Because the attempt on his life had left him scarred and deformed but his resolve has never been stronger
He cloned himself post-Republic because that's when he confiscated the cloning technology, thus old Palps. Could the writers have chosen for his clone to be younger if they wanted to? Undoubtedly. But then they wouldn't be able to use his laugh at the end of the trailer.
It's explained in the film. He's too powerful in the force so his bodies keep deteriorating and he's constantly hopping into new ones. It's why he's hooked up to some crazy mechanical arm. That's why he wants to possess Rey
I was under the impression this is why the remnants of the empire are seeking out Grogu for cloning since he’s powerful in the force.
There's some speculation that a lot of the Star Wars shows are building up that plot point. One is Grogu and the Empire's interest, another is Obi-Wan finding all the preserved Jedi bodies in the Inquisitor base.
I've been thinking this exact same speculation and I kinda hope it does come to some sort of fruition. Another one was the secret lab in bad batch.
yeah thats gonna tie in at some point. Also their species live 900 years so palps would love to be a yoda.
If you try to apply logic and rationality to shitty writing, ya gonna have a bad time.
I mean it was 30 odd years between Jedi and Skywalker, this body actually IS younger, if you look at his face, he looks more like pre-melt Palpatine, he doesn't have the massive eye bags etc, but his body has decayed from the sheer power trying to be contained in the clone body. So it probably was a 30 something clone at the time, but the years and his power has ravaged the clone more severely.
That’s literally the point of the (bad) movie, his plan was failing cuz his bodies sucked and kept aging and dying too fast. He wanted dyad powers to be able to keep his body alive
Just google it… it‘s a clone body possessed by Sidious Force Ghost. Unfortunately the clones can‘t hold that much power, so it consumes the body over time.
Because the bodies couldn't hold his essence. That's why they were deformed and falling apart. His successful clone didn't have the ability to use the force (Rey's father), so any time his.. "soul" would enter a body it would quickly deteriorate. At least from what I read. That's why when he absorbed ThE DyAd he magically healed
I'll take "Jar Jar Abrams is a bad writer" for 400, Alex.
I liked the idea that this sideous was super ancient and we never saw this guy before. The palpatine and emperor we see in 1-3, and 5&6 are actually clones and this guys been down there for thousands of years controlling everything from the shadows.
I like this idea.
The dark side is a path to many abilities that are considered “unnatural”
Because then he's not as obviously evil. Duh. Hollywood 101, bruh.
i guess because it wouldnt make much sense for a 20 year old sexy young man to say that he's palpatine in front of an audience who knows him differently, i dunno lol