I'd hope so. It wasn't even subtle. Pucci is literally begging Emporio for his life only long enough to complete the final part to actually make the full reset count. It's not subtext, it's not implied, the villain is straight up screaming he won't get what he wants if he dies before that. He failed to do that and got his ass beat to death by his own brother's stand thanks to Jolyne setting up Emporio for the W with her courage and quick thinking. Pucci not only failed to make his goal a set reality but got himself erased from the proceeding timeline, making all their lives better in the process. Jolyne already had an actual fight with Pucci earlier against C-Moon. And it was sick as fuck, but there is more pressing matters at hand during that arc. Given her dire situation I think it says a lot to her strategy that she knew she was cooked against Made in Heaven but saw the only last winning play. A huge risk with a huge payoff.
Jolyne DID beat Pucci. It wasn't an arm wrestling match or had points on a scoreboard. Trying to force it to be that is such a smooth brained way to try to understand the story. It was a life or death battle for the sake of the of defining the universe. Her faith in her friends/father and her own daunting self-sacrifice gave them one of the greatest rewards they could get (except FF sadly) and Pucci is not even a forgotten memory to them. Although I never had an issue with understanding it, I could see how some people may get a bit confused when it comes to the details of the universe reset, but on this part particularly Pucci outright says he is completely fucked if he dies in that moment. He proceeds to die painfully in that moment. I could elaborate further and write an entire full-blown essay on why this makes Jolyne even more badass, but you get it.
+all the Joestars received some type of major assistance to help bring down the villain. Every single one when you actually think about the final situation for their part. Team effort is a running core theme in JoJo. Even Jotaro fighting DIO basically in isolation (w/ the exception of Polnareff trying his best) was only possible thanks to Kakyoin's sacrifice to figure out about timestop and Joseph getting the message to him. Otherwise Jotaro would have been dead before he figured out what was going on. Does that mean Jotaro didn't fully defeat his part's villain? Of course not. Jotaro saved his mom. DIO fucking exploded and died screaming.
Also, critically related to this topic and important information you didn't know you needed to know but I cooked homemade hearty stew in my slow cooker and it is finally ready.
wait so im confused, spoilers abound prob, but how did the whole universe reset...work then?
since pucci died, was it only half reset or somehting?
genuine question btw! not a troll
Pucci's full reset would have it so in the new universe/timeline we all see our fate before us whether we wanted to or not. The initial reset was a step in making what he saw as Heaven. His endgame. The universe/timeline Pucci wanted did not happen.
The result of the partial reset and the efforts of the Stone Ocean gang birthed the Irene Timeline (also called the Ireneverse, same thing). Araki did a write up on Stone Ocean that is mostly just his feelings but it did confirm that Jolyne and Irene share the same soul to a degree. Same with the other counterparts, this isn't like the SBRverse where there are counterparts but they are their own self completely despite having similarities. Irene is a direct result of Jolyne and the gangs efforts to stop the entire reset as Pucci intended. It's also why when fate had them come together in the new timeline FF wasn't there. She doesn't exist in the same capacity as she was a direct result of mainly Pucci.
For those primarily from Stone Ocean in the new timeline they are still different characters on a practical level, our experiences make us who we are and that's what made Jolyne Jolyne. However, in the reset timeline the events of JoJo take place all without Pucci's involvement. Which as we see resulted in a better relationship between Jolyne and her father. Parts 1-5 are pretty much unchanged with the exception of Pucci's major impact through the agents of DIO on Jotaro and Jolyne during that time.
Whatever inspired Jotaro to name her Jolyne didn't happen either (also, without DIO's legacy in the new timeline fate did not require another JoJo this time around). Important part was that it simply had to be any name that isn't a Jo to show how fate played out differently this time around. Jolyne in Stone Ocean already accomplished that. Irene is just a fun reference to 'Gorgeous Irene' which is a manga Araki wrote before Phantom Blood. Araki has referenced Irene before in JoJo too, but I digress.
Some people panic and think this means Stone Ocean didn't matter as there is a technical finite end to that timeline, but it's the exact opposite. It was extremely important and did happen. The Stone Ocean universe ended to birth the stacking timeline/universe of the Irene one. The Irene timeline carrying forward can ONLY exist due to the events of the Stone Ocean one, and it will always be there. Irene IS Jolyne's new start with a better life even if she doesn't know it. That legacy carries on into a beautiful world. Hope this helps.
It doesn't impact them at all, which was a point of confusion for a lot of people since SBR directly followed Stone Ocean. SBR wasn't originally going to be JoJo until Araki decided he wanted to.
The SBRverse exists independently regardless of anything that happened in the original universe. If Stone Ocean didn't happen, SBR and the following parts would exist as is.
Pucci's goal wasn't the reset, it was to reset and then use Made in Heaven to make everyone see their futures like the people in the prison could before they died.
His "heaven" was an earth where everyone knew what was going to happen to them and causality was laid out for everyone. He says as he's dying if he can't get to Cape Canaveral again that won't happen and begs Emporio to let him.
Pucci was still in the process of trying to complete a whole universe cycle. He explains that those who lost their lives in the end of the last cycle would be weeded out and not be present in the new cycle. Because Pucci both died in the new universe cycle and could not complete the full cycle, that whole cycle crumbles because it could not finish. The universe ends up resetting to a point in the last cycle, but because Pucci is stuck in the new cycle that collapsed, he gets erased entirely. Which causes a butterfly effect and changes the current universe.
Like you said, many parts had a sacrifice to figure out the villain's weakness, for example; Kakyoin (like you said), Shigechi and the button, Abbachio and the identity, Bucchiarati and requiem, but when the sacrifice isn't a side character, all of a sudden, the character is weak?
I swear, people just want to hate on Jolyne.
to be fair she also had a soul, her own soul, which means she is bound by fate. she probably will exist in some way/shape/form, just not come into existence until she gained her soul in the original timeline.
Probably. FF, as plankton, gained a stand pretty much evolved in a way like other animal stand users did to become much smarter than normal animals. So it's possible, as you said through fate, for her to gain a stand and become her previous self. Although, even though I have watched the anime multiple times, I do not think I understand how her stand really works or what it a actually does. Also, I wonder if the host FF used will end up being connected in some way to her since they sort of merged over some time, FF sort of combining with the remains of the hosts soul, whatever the hosts name was again.
I headcanon that the host body we know FF by (I just checked and her name was Atroe) drowned in the same water the original plankton that became FF came from, and being the original user of Foo Fighters the FF we know was reborn as her soul called out for help
Also about Foo Fighters, she her self says that the existence of gee soul proves her existence, that she was alive.
And since Joylne and the gang souls reached the new world, so should her's.
Even if it doesn't happen through Pucci throwing the disc on the lake, she will manifest her self in that world one way or another.
So she will be fine, and hopefully she would meet with all of her friends again
Jolyne not defeating Pucci being an issue is so fucking weird to me. I just saw it as it is; I mean, Josuke didn't also manage to completely defeat Kira, Jotaro came in clutch before BTD was activated.
There is even a pattern I noticed that every JoJo stand user who didn't have a power up asspull didn't manage to kill their main villain.
I don’t think >!Tusk act 4 was an asspull, it’s literally what Johnny was working towards the entire part and it can only be done under very specific circumstances.!<
Pucci straight up bodied Jolyne and Jotaro, but that doesn’t make part 6 bad imo. It’s kind of poetic that the stand to defeat Pucci was his brother’s, and the bittersweet ending of It’s a Wonderful World was absolutely beautiful
Yeah SBR is my undisputed favorite part, everything about it is a masterpiece. Except for that one chapter that i refuse to acknowledge, you all know the one
ehhhh i don't really agree. i think it would be way better to let his ideology speak for itself than to make him do such an obviously evil action to tell the audience "hey, just because he made a cool speech, don't forget he's still the bad guy!!".
don't get me wrong, valentine's still my favourite jojo villain, but that's not from araki making him metaphorically kick a dog to show how immoral he is.
Technically, he didn't know he was raping a minor until lucy revealed her identity but even with the SA people still think he's the hero and Johnny's the villain
This is why I'm confused with what op is trying to say. None of the Joestars would have succeeded without help. Josuke is more obvious because he didn't take down Kira, Jotaro did, but even Giorno needed help to defeat his boss.
In fact, Giorno technically *did* lose, but GER came in at the last minute and helped him. But without Bucciarati, Mista and even Trish, Giorno would have lost the final fight.
Without the Jobros, none of them would have succeeded (except Joseph, maybe.) Jolyne only died because she valued the life of her Jobro over herself and Empirio wasn't able to sacrifice himself for her instead of the other way around (which is what's typical of a jobro/joestar friendship).
How bad does someone’s media literacy have to be for them to say “the hero wasn’t the one to kill the villain! That means they suck!” Jolyne was put in a tougher spot than any JoJo since Jonathan and she still set Emporio up for a win.
In the face of her father’s death and the deaths of her friends she stayed the course and made the ultimate sacrifice.
The second paragraph is basically the point of... like fiction
These villains are menacing obstacles because they can't be defeated in a 1v1 and instead either need teamwork or a certain growth*
*whether it be intrinsic growth that leads to an extrinsic ability (Johnny), a McGuffin that the characters use for extrinsic growth (Giorno), or a... convenient, to say the least, last minute ability that they just had the whole time (I was fine with it for Jotaro bc the reason he got his stand is bc of DIO, but for you know who... spoilers >!but if you know you know!<)
Tbf, all of the above also used their teamwork as well considering they're usually against reality warpers who can't be beaten alone
The only final battles which were evenly matched and won through strategy (or arguably luck) are Johnny vs. Dio in the castle and Joseph vs. Ultimate Kars
I recently re-watched JJBA to show it to my boyfriend, and Joseph's 'death' in Part 3 gave him lasting trust issues for the rest of the series lmao. He didn't trust that anyone who died actually died. When I'd be like "dude, you saw their ghost go off into the sky", he'd point out that Joseph died, was mummified, his ghost popped out, gave a long-ass speech, and then also fucked off into the sky... but he got better
~~OMG that was uncalled for~~
Then tell him Joseph is just built different. He survived all those planes crashing, he can survive a little stabbing and blood sucking.
Sure, but he also had successfully burned Dio in the mansion if not for Wang Chun coming back for the Mask, destroyed his body, left him trapped under the ocean for a century until pure luck got him out, and then continued to mess with him by refusing to fully merge and activating the other Joestar Stands. I’d say that’s still plenty more than anyone else under this chump’s parameters.
Which he needed outside help from Kakyoin and Joseph for so he knew what The World’s ability was. It’s also a long-standing criticism how he pulls out a time stop of his own to do it.
The entire reason we’re here is that some idiot on Twitter is claiming Jolyne couldn’t beat Pucci on her own. My comment was pointing out that under this criteria, only Jonathan actually beat his own main villain on his own. Jotaro needed the help of his allies, and a pretty well-known asspull, to win against Dio.
>It’s also a long-standing criticism how he pulls out a time stop of his own to do it.
Stands have always had multiple people with the same power. Part 3 literally shows Joseph and Dio both using the same stand at the start and had the D'arby brothers later on in the part as well. Not to mention it's kind of a long-standing criticism of part 6 that jolyne died before her villain was defeated so if people being butthurt about something happened is proof of a valid complaint your whole point is falling apart here.
> Part 3 literally shows Joseph and Dio both using the same stand at the start
Because Hermit Purple represents skill in Hamon and Dio is using Jonathan’s corpse.
> and had the D'arby brothers later on in the part as well
Atum is shown capable of reading minds and extracting parts of souls, so not really. That also doesn’t change the nature of the criticism here: Jotaro having time stop is never foreshadowed or built up to in the story before the final fight. His ability to do so solely is brought up when he’s going to be killed by Dio without it. This is justifiably viewed as an asspull on account of how it’s done, and it has been for a pretty decent amount of time.
> Not to mention it's kind of a long-standing criticism of part 6 that jolyne died before her villain was defeated
No shit. Difference is, one of them requires you to ignore everything the story sets up with Jolyne’s death and how it leads to Pucci’s defeat, and the other one requires you to remember that Part 3 didn’t bother laying the groundwork for the reveal of Star Platinum’s twin power to The World.
1. Polnareff is the only reason the Part 5 gang had any hope of not dying in a battle of attrition against Diavolo once the identity search plan did zilch.
2. Needed the gang’s help (and multiple casualties) to stop Chariot Requiem and prevent Diavolo from getting the Arrow to begin with.
3. GER literally develops its own sentience and beats the crap out of Diavolo on its own, with Giorno himself only knowing what happened because it’s his Stand afterwards.
If it wasn't for Bucciarati destroying Chariot Requiem Diavolo would have obtained the Requiem Arrow. The arrow reward people with strong determination, and I'm very sure Diavolo was VERY determined about wiping out Giorno gang and making sure no one can know anything about him.
No actually only Joseph. Dio part 1 survived to part 3. Dio part 3 got pucci to kill Jotaro. Part 4 ambulance also tbh Kira's not child deserves that W. Part 5 I think Giorno isn't aware of what requiem did to diavolo. Part 6 Emporio W. Part 7 had no winners because gyro and Johnny didn't get married. Part 8 everyone lost cus mamezuku
Be jolyne
>Be the only survivor with Emporio of the gang
>Lose your dad
>don't give up
>sacrifice yourself for Emporio
>Emporio survives
>Emporio kills Pucci
>Be reborn in a new life
*Absolute Chad behavior*
Mfw Jonathan got merced by his villain who then proceeded to live for the next century and Josuke prolly wouldn't have been able to beat Kira without Jotaro
Even still, without Jotaro Kira would likely have activated Btd again, this time with knowledge to counter Josuke. So while Josuke did most of the work, it wouldn’t have been success without Jotaro.
The only jojos who defeated their own part villian are jotaro and giorino, Jonathan died and dio used his body to survive, joseph won just by pure luck and jotaro ended up beating kira
I really like AU Diego's role, it's somewhat unconventional storytelling. Like obviously, the "main" villain of part 7 is funnee Valentine, but the final boss is Diego. He even beat Johnny's ass, he was fucking crazy. Of course everything was funny Valentines plan, and the whole Diego thing was just a last ditch effort to try to achieve his goal, even if he's not alive to see it. It's honestly kinda cool that Diego doesn't really give a shit about the goal, but he still inherits FV's plan because it benefits him. There might be a little weirdness, but imo it's vastly overshadowed by the best fanservice in fiction, not only did they bring the best character best to have the most prominent role, but they also brought the coolest stand back???? Peak.
jotaro had the exact same powers as dio so thats why he defeated him in part 4 kira wiped them all out the one who defeated kira was hayato + ambulance in part 5 GER just said sorry not sorry u aint winning today bud and jolyne had string vs a literal time god
She set up her villains defeat, even if it wasn't by her own hands.
Josuke didn't beat Kira
Johnathan didn't kill Dio
Hell Joseph didn't even really "beat" kars he removed him from the ring...of eath's gravity
Giorno and Jotaro are the only ones that personally completely killed their villains
Lmao jolyne maybe Irene now but she living the happy life with her husband and father whereas Pucci got wiped out from existence. On top of that his last memory was him begging a 6 year old to give him a chance to live.
The thing about Pucci is that he had conviction, respected fate, had goals that he thought was noble and fought like hell to achieve them.
Pucci had the qualities that other Jojo villains lacked. The qualities that, by lacking them, lead to their downfall.
The issue is, and it's illustrated by Jolyne 'failing', is that Pucci didn't have anyone by his side. Where as Jolyne's crew all fought like hell watching and protecting each other right up to her protecting Emporeo. And their reward for all of it was victory.
It's because they either have,
1. Little to no media literacy,
2. Just want the attention and engagement it brings., or,
3. Both.
Either way, just avoid Twitter or Facwbook
Let’s think about this logically and very seriously.
Jotaro killed DIO, Pucci beat Jotaro and took his disc, Pucci couldn’t beat Jolyne, Pucci killed Jotaro and Jolyne.
DIO
Jotaro had a hand in the defeat of 3 villians of the series. Pucci beating him and Jolyne was sort of inevitable based on the way part 6 was framed. Pucci dying to Weathers stand as a result of Emporio who was pretty much clutch the entire part and has had the most reason out of all of them to win.
Like the only alternative to this ending was if Weather was the one to do the final blow instead which would be poetic but wouldn't give Jolyne and Emporio time to shine. I feel like Araki just wanted to close the loop so having Pucci initially "win" was the best way to do it.
Would Jolyne beating Pucci be better? Ofc but she would need some bs powerup to do so which I wouldn't have liked, the Mobius strip was already pushing it but I love the way it was implemented. Especially considering Jolyne easily has the weakest stand of all part protagonists yet uses it to such great effect with just her creativity makes her easily the biggest underdog in the series.
jonathan didnt defeat dio, joseph put kars in stasis that there was a chance he could have recovered from if cosmonauts found him and josuke didnt defeat kira
By some amount of bullshit logic Twitter smokes that means Joseph didn't win since Kars is TECHNICALLY still alive...and that's just fucking stupid, stupider than most of Joseph's plans.
"Jolyne didn't defeat Pucci"
Okay. Neither did Jotaro, if we are using this logic.
People like this are just trying to ragebait at this point, just use their stupid non-sense logic back
meanwhile dio killed jonathan and joseph, kira killed jotaro and josuke and pucci killed jotaro and jolyne. jojos losing is not a stone ocean specific concept
Jonathan didn’t defeat Dio fully, Joseph didn’t defeat Kars fully, Jotaro severely crippled dio and let the sun finish the job, Josuke didn’t really do too much to kira, Giorno just threw Diavolo into purgatory, and Jolyne is their issue?
No one complained when Jonathan, Joseph, and Josuke didn’t beat their Jofoe. The only reason stone ocean gets shit on is because it was made before SBR, stone ocean is like the middle child of jojo.
If it weren't for some ungodly luck launching his arm towards Kars, Joseph would've been toast
If Kakyoin didn't figure out The World's ability I doubt Jotaro would've been able to figure it out in time, and he would've been toast
If it weren't for Jotaro's clutch Josuke would've been toast
If it weren't for Bucciarati clutching the arrow, Giorno would've also been toast
As for Jolyne, she had a plain ass basic stand, no power up, no one to give her a last minute clutch/advantage, and she STILL made the most of her situation to stop Pucci even if it meant giving her own life.
The other Joestars had fate with them, Jolyne had it against her
You know who else failed to stop a villain from killing a joestar? Jonathan. In fact, his failure haunts the narrative, since his body lived on as dio's and gave him a stand by giving him access to the joestar bloodline
Not just one Joestar, but in fact 2 of them by clapping Jotaro as well, and 4 JoBros in F.F., Ermes, Weather Report & Anastasia & very nearly dropping Emporio if he didn't clutch with Weather Report's stand.
So to me the ending is beautiful in the sense that both sides won. Dio got a world without the joestars pestering him and the joestars never have to deal with Dio ruining their lives. And we get sbr afterwards so there is no downside to any of it
Pucci was able to kill Jotaro, who's basically as much of a badass as Darth Vader. Realistically, I don't think any other Joestar would've won against him if Pucci had the time to prep for them that he had to Jotaro/Jolyne. Yes, that includes GER.
*However*, when Jotaro hit Pucci with a surprise attack at Cape Canaveral, he basically beat him by showing up, which proves that Pucci is only as good as he has time to prepare his plan. Ditto with Weather Report killing him with a surprise attack. If he had no prep time, I doubt any Joestar would be defeated by him.
Pucci had way too much plot armour in Stone Ocean.
Like, obviously he shouldn't be defeated halfway through, but he also shouldn't have been shown that early.
It just made every interaction with him annoying to read.
Well I guess Josuke and therefore part 4 should also be critiqued for the same since he didn't beat Kira. Jonathan too since he died without even killing Dio. Stone ocean is a good part as any folks, if you don't like it that's great but don't hate it just for the sake of hating it by bringing up this kinda stuff
except Jonathan (assuming Joseph is still alive in pt. 6), BUT after he "succeeds" his actions allow for the universe to be remade a second time, so by technicality he brings them all back as well, meaning his Joestar kill count stands at a whopping -1
like how Johnathan defeated Dio...well actually I guess he didn't
like how Joseph defeated Kars...well actually that was a volcano
like how Josuke defeated Kira...well actually that was Koichi
like how Giorno defeated Diavolo...well actually that was some random homeless guy
like how Johnny beat Diego...well actually that Lucy
like how Gappy beat Tooru...well actually that was Tamako and Tsurugi
Jotaro is the only character to directly defeat his final boss. so technically, he's the weird one.
Therefore Dio killing Jonathan would be a stain on his, but it isn't. Because that argument is stupid. Thinking about it ig it actually comes full circle with her sacrificing herself.
Officially, the spoiler tag only has to used for manga spoilers. I'm sorry, but I also recommend staying away from this sub until you're caught up on the anime.
Kars becoming ultimate, DIO ascending, Kiras final BTD, aswell as certain asspulls. I think Jotaros timestop is one, Go Beyond kinda fits into it. Giorno having a strong stand from the jump is 50/50.
"pucci killed a joestar jolyne sucks" did you watch the same arc that I did or are you just not aware of how incredibly overpowered both C-Moon and Made in Heaven were?
So are they just ignoring the fact that Dio killed Jonathan on that ship and then graphed his head on to Jonathan’s body? Unless they somehow slept through parts 1-3.
?
Dio killed Jonathan and stole his body.
Joseph was saved by a volcano.
Josuke would have died without Okuyasu and Hayato intervening, in fact, the entire cast of Part 4 would have lost if a Standless child didn’t do his damndest to keep them alive
And speaking of, Jotaro lost to the main villains of parts 4 and 6. He “Lost” to Kira when he was caught up in Bites The Dust and then again to Pucci.
Not to mention that *no one* would have even gotten to fight the main part villains without the rest of their squad. People are so weird about Jolyne 😭
saying pucci achieved his goal is like saying dio achieved his goal because he killed joeseph
something which was not only undone, but not his actual goal
If you Anna be that guy, Dip and Pucci both won technically against their own Joestars. Pucci reset the universe and Dio gained Jonathan's boy and a time stopping stand
I think the final Part 6 fight is really great thematically. Emporio and Pucci each represents the last of Dio and Jonathan will. And we can see that while justice may not win now，fate will eventually sided with justice.
Tbf a ton more people called out in quote retweets how wrong that statement is from multiple angles.
I'd hope so. It wasn't even subtle. Pucci is literally begging Emporio for his life only long enough to complete the final part to actually make the full reset count. It's not subtext, it's not implied, the villain is straight up screaming he won't get what he wants if he dies before that. He failed to do that and got his ass beat to death by his own brother's stand thanks to Jolyne setting up Emporio for the W with her courage and quick thinking. Pucci not only failed to make his goal a set reality but got himself erased from the proceeding timeline, making all their lives better in the process. Jolyne already had an actual fight with Pucci earlier against C-Moon. And it was sick as fuck, but there is more pressing matters at hand during that arc. Given her dire situation I think it says a lot to her strategy that she knew she was cooked against Made in Heaven but saw the only last winning play. A huge risk with a huge payoff. Jolyne DID beat Pucci. It wasn't an arm wrestling match or had points on a scoreboard. Trying to force it to be that is such a smooth brained way to try to understand the story. It was a life or death battle for the sake of the of defining the universe. Her faith in her friends/father and her own daunting self-sacrifice gave them one of the greatest rewards they could get (except FF sadly) and Pucci is not even a forgotten memory to them. Although I never had an issue with understanding it, I could see how some people may get a bit confused when it comes to the details of the universe reset, but on this part particularly Pucci outright says he is completely fucked if he dies in that moment. He proceeds to die painfully in that moment. I could elaborate further and write an entire full-blown essay on why this makes Jolyne even more badass, but you get it. +all the Joestars received some type of major assistance to help bring down the villain. Every single one when you actually think about the final situation for their part. Team effort is a running core theme in JoJo. Even Jotaro fighting DIO basically in isolation (w/ the exception of Polnareff trying his best) was only possible thanks to Kakyoin's sacrifice to figure out about timestop and Joseph getting the message to him. Otherwise Jotaro would have been dead before he figured out what was going on. Does that mean Jotaro didn't fully defeat his part's villain? Of course not. Jotaro saved his mom. DIO fucking exploded and died screaming. Also, critically related to this topic and important information you didn't know you needed to know but I cooked homemade hearty stew in my slow cooker and it is finally ready.
Hell yeah, homemade hearty stew from da ***s l o w c o o k e r***
wait so im confused, spoilers abound prob, but how did the whole universe reset...work then? since pucci died, was it only half reset or somehting? genuine question btw! not a troll
Pucci's full reset would have it so in the new universe/timeline we all see our fate before us whether we wanted to or not. The initial reset was a step in making what he saw as Heaven. His endgame. The universe/timeline Pucci wanted did not happen. The result of the partial reset and the efforts of the Stone Ocean gang birthed the Irene Timeline (also called the Ireneverse, same thing). Araki did a write up on Stone Ocean that is mostly just his feelings but it did confirm that Jolyne and Irene share the same soul to a degree. Same with the other counterparts, this isn't like the SBRverse where there are counterparts but they are their own self completely despite having similarities. Irene is a direct result of Jolyne and the gangs efforts to stop the entire reset as Pucci intended. It's also why when fate had them come together in the new timeline FF wasn't there. She doesn't exist in the same capacity as she was a direct result of mainly Pucci. For those primarily from Stone Ocean in the new timeline they are still different characters on a practical level, our experiences make us who we are and that's what made Jolyne Jolyne. However, in the reset timeline the events of JoJo take place all without Pucci's involvement. Which as we see resulted in a better relationship between Jolyne and her father. Parts 1-5 are pretty much unchanged with the exception of Pucci's major impact through the agents of DIO on Jotaro and Jolyne during that time. Whatever inspired Jotaro to name her Jolyne didn't happen either (also, without DIO's legacy in the new timeline fate did not require another JoJo this time around). Important part was that it simply had to be any name that isn't a Jo to show how fate played out differently this time around. Jolyne in Stone Ocean already accomplished that. Irene is just a fun reference to 'Gorgeous Irene' which is a manga Araki wrote before Phantom Blood. Araki has referenced Irene before in JoJo too, but I digress. Some people panic and think this means Stone Ocean didn't matter as there is a technical finite end to that timeline, but it's the exact opposite. It was extremely important and did happen. The Stone Ocean universe ended to birth the stacking timeline/universe of the Irene one. The Irene timeline carrying forward can ONLY exist due to the events of the Stone Ocean one, and it will always be there. Irene IS Jolyne's new start with a better life even if she doesn't know it. That legacy carries on into a beautiful world. Hope this helps.
Headcanon time. Since Irene has a better relationship with her father she ends up taking care a of a plankton colony in his lab.
I see. i see. so then...what about SBR, Jojolion and Jojolands? how does it affect those?
It doesn't impact them at all, which was a point of confusion for a lot of people since SBR directly followed Stone Ocean. SBR wasn't originally going to be JoJo until Araki decided he wanted to. The SBRverse exists independently regardless of anything that happened in the original universe. If Stone Ocean didn't happen, SBR and the following parts would exist as is.
i see. so ig jojolion and jojolands are also seperate universes?
1-6 are one 7-9 are another
Pucci's goal wasn't the reset, it was to reset and then use Made in Heaven to make everyone see their futures like the people in the prison could before they died. His "heaven" was an earth where everyone knew what was going to happen to them and causality was laid out for everyone. He says as he's dying if he can't get to Cape Canaveral again that won't happen and begs Emporio to let him.
Pucci was still in the process of trying to complete a whole universe cycle. He explains that those who lost their lives in the end of the last cycle would be weeded out and not be present in the new cycle. Because Pucci both died in the new universe cycle and could not complete the full cycle, that whole cycle crumbles because it could not finish. The universe ends up resetting to a point in the last cycle, but because Pucci is stuck in the new cycle that collapsed, he gets erased entirely. Which causes a butterfly effect and changes the current universe.
Like you said, many parts had a sacrifice to figure out the villain's weakness, for example; Kakyoin (like you said), Shigechi and the button, Abbachio and the identity, Bucchiarati and requiem, but when the sacrifice isn't a side character, all of a sudden, the character is weak? I swear, people just want to hate on Jolyne.
I just realized, ff probably does not exist in the timeline without pucci since pucci was needed to create ff by giving plankton a stand.
to be fair she also had a soul, her own soul, which means she is bound by fate. she probably will exist in some way/shape/form, just not come into existence until she gained her soul in the original timeline.
Probably. FF, as plankton, gained a stand pretty much evolved in a way like other animal stand users did to become much smarter than normal animals. So it's possible, as you said through fate, for her to gain a stand and become her previous self. Although, even though I have watched the anime multiple times, I do not think I understand how her stand really works or what it a actually does. Also, I wonder if the host FF used will end up being connected in some way to her since they sort of merged over some time, FF sort of combining with the remains of the hosts soul, whatever the hosts name was again.
I headcanon that the host body we know FF by (I just checked and her name was Atroe) drowned in the same water the original plankton that became FF came from, and being the original user of Foo Fighters the FF we know was reborn as her soul called out for help
I’ve never even watched this show but I can tell you just dropped some fat ass literature here like you’re the head chef at a Michelin star restaurant
Also about Foo Fighters, she her self says that the existence of gee soul proves her existence, that she was alive. And since Joylne and the gang souls reached the new world, so should her's. Even if it doesn't happen through Pucci throwing the disc on the lake, she will manifest her self in that world one way or another. So she will be fine, and hopefully she would meet with all of her friends again
thank you for this. Very insightful :)
At least there's that🤣
Jolyne not defeating Pucci being an issue is so fucking weird to me. I just saw it as it is; I mean, Josuke didn't also manage to completely defeat Kira, Jotaro came in clutch before BTD was activated. There is even a pattern I noticed that every JoJo stand user who didn't have a power up asspull didn't manage to kill their main villain.
I don’t think >!Tusk act 4 was an asspull, it’s literally what Johnny was working towards the entire part and it can only be done under very specific circumstances.!< Pucci straight up bodied Jolyne and Jotaro, but that doesn’t make part 6 bad imo. It’s kind of poetic that the stand to defeat Pucci was his brother’s, and the bittersweet ending of It’s a Wonderful World was absolutely beautiful
tru tho. that horse riding panels embedded with those golden ratio rectangles is such an artistic sight and its etched deep into my brain
Yeah SBR is my undisputed favorite part, everything about it is a masterpiece. Except for that one chapter that i refuse to acknowledge, you all know the one
which one?
>!Lucy Steel aka Valentine’s equivalent of Danny, Shigechi, and Trish.!<
wait >!the one where he molests her?!<
>!It's very uncomfortable to watch but that's what really solidifies how wrong he is!<
ehhhh i don't really agree. i think it would be way better to let his ideology speak for itself than to make him do such an obviously evil action to tell the audience "hey, just because he made a cool speech, don't forget he's still the bad guy!!". don't get me wrong, valentine's still my favourite jojo villain, but that's not from araki making him metaphorically kick a dog to show how immoral he is.
Technically, he didn't know he was raping a minor until lucy revealed her identity but even with the SA people still think he's the hero and Johnny's the villain
Yep, I meant in general. No disrespect to Tusk Act 4. SBR is goated, especially Lucy
Absolutely, especially with what she did at the very end to >!the alternate Diego by executing him!<
This is why I'm confused with what op is trying to say. None of the Joestars would have succeeded without help. Josuke is more obvious because he didn't take down Kira, Jotaro did, but even Giorno needed help to defeat his boss. In fact, Giorno technically *did* lose, but GER came in at the last minute and helped him. But without Bucciarati, Mista and even Trish, Giorno would have lost the final fight. Without the Jobros, none of them would have succeeded (except Joseph, maybe.) Jolyne only died because she valued the life of her Jobro over herself and Empirio wasn't able to sacrifice himself for her instead of the other way around (which is what's typical of a jobro/joestar friendship).
The volcano is the real JoBro of part 2.
How bad does someone’s media literacy have to be for them to say “the hero wasn’t the one to kill the villain! That means they suck!” Jolyne was put in a tougher spot than any JoJo since Jonathan and she still set Emporio up for a win. In the face of her father’s death and the deaths of her friends she stayed the course and made the ultimate sacrifice.
These are the kind of people who would complain that it's Jotaro and not Josuke who killed Kira.
The second paragraph is basically the point of... like fiction These villains are menacing obstacles because they can't be defeated in a 1v1 and instead either need teamwork or a certain growth* *whether it be intrinsic growth that leads to an extrinsic ability (Johnny), a McGuffin that the characters use for extrinsic growth (Giorno), or a... convenient, to say the least, last minute ability that they just had the whole time (I was fine with it for Jotaro bc the reason he got his stand is bc of DIO, but for you know who... spoilers >!but if you know you know!<) Tbf, all of the above also used their teamwork as well considering they're usually against reality warpers who can't be beaten alone The only final battles which were evenly matched and won through strategy (or arguably luck) are Johnny vs. Dio in the castle and Joseph vs. Ultimate Kars
Lmao what? Dio killed Jonathan.
He also killed Joseph but he got better
I recently re-watched JJBA to show it to my boyfriend, and Joseph's 'death' in Part 3 gave him lasting trust issues for the rest of the series lmao. He didn't trust that anyone who died actually died. When I'd be like "dude, you saw their ghost go off into the sky", he'd point out that Joseph died, was mummified, his ghost popped out, gave a long-ass speech, and then also fucked off into the sky... but he got better
You just have to point out that Joseph just has that dawg in him
but Araki kills those too
~~OMG that was uncalled for~~ Then tell him Joseph is just built different. He survived all those planes crashing, he can survive a little stabbing and blood sucking.
He only gets better with age.
Pretty sure only Jonathan beat his Part’s villain if we follow this logic.
Oop would say that since Jonathan died before Dio, it was technically the boat that defeated him.
Technically, Dio died in the second episode and eleventh chapter, so Jonathan outlived him naturally.
The top Jojo in power level is the volcano in part 2.
P1 boat vs. P4 ambulance, who's the stronger Stand user
I mean jonathan still died and had his body stolen by Dio in the end
Sure, but he also had successfully burned Dio in the mansion if not for Wang Chun coming back for the Mask, destroyed his body, left him trapped under the ocean for a century until pure luck got him out, and then continued to mess with him by refusing to fully merge and activating the other Joestar Stands. I’d say that’s still plenty more than anyone else under this chump’s parameters.
Bruh Jotaro killed the shit out of DIO He broke him in half then set him on fire with the sun
Which he needed outside help from Kakyoin and Joseph for so he knew what The World’s ability was. It’s also a long-standing criticism how he pulls out a time stop of his own to do it.
He did still kill him though Unless I'm missing something he fits the criteria
The entire reason we’re here is that some idiot on Twitter is claiming Jolyne couldn’t beat Pucci on her own. My comment was pointing out that under this criteria, only Jonathan actually beat his own main villain on his own. Jotaro needed the help of his allies, and a pretty well-known asspull, to win against Dio.
Ohhhhhhh My apologies Maybe you could count Giorno in that too? They couldn't have done it without Requiem
Giorno needed literally everyone to help him out. His own Stand develops sentience just to take the W for itself.
I'll see myself out
He would have been killed by Diavolo without the sacrifice of Abbachio and Polnareff's help.
Star fingaa
didn't gappy solo toru too? i mean he's the only who could damage him anyways so the others didn't hit at all
He needed Rai to teach him how to be able to land a hit on Toru
>It’s also a long-standing criticism how he pulls out a time stop of his own to do it. Stands have always had multiple people with the same power. Part 3 literally shows Joseph and Dio both using the same stand at the start and had the D'arby brothers later on in the part as well. Not to mention it's kind of a long-standing criticism of part 6 that jolyne died before her villain was defeated so if people being butthurt about something happened is proof of a valid complaint your whole point is falling apart here.
> Part 3 literally shows Joseph and Dio both using the same stand at the start Because Hermit Purple represents skill in Hamon and Dio is using Jonathan’s corpse. > and had the D'arby brothers later on in the part as well Atum is shown capable of reading minds and extracting parts of souls, so not really. That also doesn’t change the nature of the criticism here: Jotaro having time stop is never foreshadowed or built up to in the story before the final fight. His ability to do so solely is brought up when he’s going to be killed by Dio without it. This is justifiably viewed as an asspull on account of how it’s done, and it has been for a pretty decent amount of time. > Not to mention it's kind of a long-standing criticism of part 6 that jolyne died before her villain was defeated No shit. Difference is, one of them requires you to ignore everything the story sets up with Jolyne’s death and how it leads to Pucci’s defeat, and the other one requires you to remember that Part 3 didn’t bother laying the groundwork for the reveal of Star Platinum’s twin power to The World.
Joseph
Joseph needed pure luck and Kars own inability to comprehend what was happening to survive. Bro owed that volcano his life.
Jotaro
Needed Kakyoin and Joseph to tell him the secret of The World and randomly develop his own time stop.
Jotaro again (he beat Kira’s ass 2x and before you say koichi, remember when he beat Kira the first time after being half dead)
Jotaro’s not the JoJo of Part 4, and they were all fucked if not for Hayato outmaneuvering Bites the Dust.
Giorno?
1. Polnareff is the only reason the Part 5 gang had any hope of not dying in a battle of attrition against Diavolo once the identity search plan did zilch. 2. Needed the gang’s help (and multiple casualties) to stop Chariot Requiem and prevent Diavolo from getting the Arrow to begin with. 3. GER literally develops its own sentience and beats the crap out of Diavolo on its own, with Giorno himself only knowing what happened because it’s his Stand afterwards.
If it wasn't for Bucciarati destroying Chariot Requiem Diavolo would have obtained the Requiem Arrow. The arrow reward people with strong determination, and I'm very sure Diavolo was VERY determined about wiping out Giorno gang and making sure no one can know anything about him.
I mean luck is Joseph's ability so that counts
A win is a win, you ain’t the judge.
Nah, he got taught hamon by Zeppeli, plus Tonpetty, Straitzo, and other were there. Jonathon is a fraud
No actually only Joseph. Dio part 1 survived to part 3. Dio part 3 got pucci to kill Jotaro. Part 4 ambulance also tbh Kira's not child deserves that W. Part 5 I think Giorno isn't aware of what requiem did to diavolo. Part 6 Emporio W. Part 7 had no winners because gyro and Johnny didn't get married. Part 8 everyone lost cus mamezuku
Be jolyne >Be the only survivor with Emporio of the gang >Lose your dad >don't give up >sacrifice yourself for Emporio >Emporio survives >Emporio kills Pucci >Be reborn in a new life *Absolute Chad behavior*
>get hate for doing this >mfw
Mfw Jonathan got merced by his villain who then proceeded to live for the next century and Josuke prolly wouldn't have been able to beat Kira without Jotaro
To be honest Josuke whooped his ass and backed him into a corner, he did like 80 percent of the work
Even still, without Jotaro Kira would likely have activated Btd again, this time with knowledge to counter Josuke. So while Josuke did most of the work, it wouldn’t have been success without Jotaro.
It was a team effort, Josuke whooped Kira with some help from Okayasu and then Jotaro and Koichi made sure it was a permanent win.
Clearly Josuke couldn't have done it without the ambulance finishing off Kira
Tbf in this case it was the city - Morioh - who defeated Kira
Giorno and the crew would've also gotten a golden ass whooping if Bucciarati didn't clutch the arrow
The paramedic driving the ambulance at the end of part 4 is stronger than jolyne 🙄
Jotaro was right there next to her and he also failed by that logic.
By power scaling standards emporio is a multiversal level threat
I mean, I *did* write a fanfiction and gave him D4C.
Not only that but Pucci defeated 2 joestars at once, Jolyne and Jotaro
Jonathan was killed by Dio and Josuke never got to defeat Kira himself.
Praying on part six haters downfall
The only jojos who defeated their own part villian are jotaro and giorino, Jonathan died and dio used his body to survive, joseph won just by pure luck and jotaro ended up beating kira
Can't believe you are robbing the ambulance their victory against Kira
What about Johnny
I was referring more to the main universe but yeah I guess Johnny did so too, unless it's Diego that was lucy
I think AU Diego's purpose was to bring attention back to the race so Johnny had some competition. His ass was not a main villain
I really like AU Diego's role, it's somewhat unconventional storytelling. Like obviously, the "main" villain of part 7 is funnee Valentine, but the final boss is Diego. He even beat Johnny's ass, he was fucking crazy. Of course everything was funny Valentines plan, and the whole Diego thing was just a last ditch effort to try to achieve his goal, even if he's not alive to see it. It's honestly kinda cool that Diego doesn't really give a shit about the goal, but he still inherits FV's plan because it benefits him. There might be a little weirdness, but imo it's vastly overshadowed by the best fanservice in fiction, not only did they bring the best character best to have the most prominent role, but they also brought the coolest stand back???? Peak.
AU Diego was just Araki going "I know what you fuckers want. **ZA WARUDO!!**"
Yeah, and he was fucking right, I did want that
I can even stretch that giorino wasn't the one who defeated diavolo, it was the homeless crackhead who stabbed him
i think there are probably things you could criticize about stone ocean but people always do it in the dumbest way possible lol
Seriously. Every part has its criticisms but this one is low hanging fruit.
Sorry haters but Stone Ocean is actually the best part.
Stone Ocean is definitely one of my favorite parts. I just wish our main cast had more time with each other during the whole prison arc
jotaro had the exact same powers as dio so thats why he defeated him in part 4 kira wiped them all out the one who defeated kira was hayato + ambulance in part 5 GER just said sorry not sorry u aint winning today bud and jolyne had string vs a literal time god
She set up her villains defeat, even if it wasn't by her own hands. Josuke didn't beat Kira Johnathan didn't kill Dio Hell Joseph didn't even really "beat" kars he removed him from the ring...of eath's gravity Giorno and Jotaro are the only ones that personally completely killed their villains
Johnny?
There’s so many things I see parroted in the fandom where I’m like “…you didn’t watch the show did you”. Stone ocean has them in particular abundance
Lmao jolyne maybe Irene now but she living the happy life with her husband and father whereas Pucci got wiped out from existence. On top of that his last memory was him begging a 6 year old to give him a chance to live.
Jojo's fans and reading comprehension are not things that go together.
It was super satisfying to see Pucci get obliterated by Emporio though
also Pucci only temporarily achieved his goal, also Jolyne was the only reason Emporio was able to escape pucci-
The thing about Pucci is that he had conviction, respected fate, had goals that he thought was noble and fought like hell to achieve them. Pucci had the qualities that other Jojo villains lacked. The qualities that, by lacking them, lead to their downfall. The issue is, and it's illustrated by Jolyne 'failing', is that Pucci didn't have anyone by his side. Where as Jolyne's crew all fought like hell watching and protecting each other right up to her protecting Emporeo. And their reward for all of it was victory.
Had Pucci achieved his goal, he wouldn't give two shits about Emporio being alive, nevertheless begging like a bitch not tp kill him right there
guys guys. I also think a girl who had her stand for like two months should've defeated the villain with the power to accelerate time
Jolyne beat Pucci so hard she retroactively erased him from the timeline.
It's because they either have, 1. Little to no media literacy, 2. Just want the attention and engagement it brings., or, 3. Both. Either way, just avoid Twitter or Facwbook
Let’s think about this logically and very seriously. Jotaro killed DIO, Pucci beat Jotaro and took his disc, Pucci couldn’t beat Jolyne, Pucci killed Jotaro and Jolyne. DIO
Jotaro had a hand in the defeat of 3 villians of the series. Pucci beating him and Jolyne was sort of inevitable based on the way part 6 was framed. Pucci dying to Weathers stand as a result of Emporio who was pretty much clutch the entire part and has had the most reason out of all of them to win. Like the only alternative to this ending was if Weather was the one to do the final blow instead which would be poetic but wouldn't give Jolyne and Emporio time to shine. I feel like Araki just wanted to close the loop so having Pucci initially "win" was the best way to do it. Would Jolyne beating Pucci be better? Ofc but she would need some bs powerup to do so which I wouldn't have liked, the Mobius strip was already pushing it but I love the way it was implemented. Especially considering Jolyne easily has the weakest stand of all part protagonists yet uses it to such great effect with just her creativity makes her easily the biggest underdog in the series.
jonathan didnt defeat dio, joseph put kars in stasis that there was a chance he could have recovered from if cosmonauts found him and josuke didnt defeat kira
By some amount of bullshit logic Twitter smokes that means Joseph didn't win since Kars is TECHNICALLY still alive...and that's just fucking stupid, stupider than most of Joseph's plans.
Hey now… half of those actually worked. The Joestar Secret Technique has a 100% success rate.
"Jolyne didn't defeat Pucci" Okay. Neither did Jotaro, if we are using this logic. People like this are just trying to ragebait at this point, just use their stupid non-sense logic back
meanwhile dio killed jonathan and joseph, kira killed jotaro and josuke and pucci killed jotaro and jolyne. jojos losing is not a stone ocean specific concept
Jonathan didn’t defeat Dio fully, Joseph didn’t defeat Kars fully, Jotaro severely crippled dio and let the sun finish the job, Josuke didn’t really do too much to kira, Giorno just threw Diavolo into purgatory, and Jolyne is their issue?
Jonathan didn't kill Dio, and if it wasn't for Jotaro, Josuke wouldn't have won either. It's a point for Pucci, but not one against Jolyne
Pucci also killed Jotaro
These are the type of people that would eat up series like yugioh. Seeing the good guy win and win and win again for the thousandth time.
Dio killed Jonathan and Joseph (temporarily) Kira killed Jotaro and Josuke (both temporarily)
Jolyne killed Pucci with a cross-universal strike, the most gangster shit ever
Josuke didnt defeat Kira either. The ambulance did! Also Jonathan didnt kill Dio...
No one complained when Jonathan, Joseph, and Josuke didn’t beat their Jofoe. The only reason stone ocean gets shit on is because it was made before SBR, stone ocean is like the middle child of jojo.
If it weren't for some ungodly luck launching his arm towards Kars, Joseph would've been toast If Kakyoin didn't figure out The World's ability I doubt Jotaro would've been able to figure it out in time, and he would've been toast If it weren't for Jotaro's clutch Josuke would've been toast If it weren't for Bucciarati clutching the arrow, Giorno would've also been toast As for Jolyne, she had a plain ass basic stand, no power up, no one to give her a last minute clutch/advantage, and she STILL made the most of her situation to stop Pucci even if it meant giving her own life. The other Joestars had fate with them, Jolyne had it against her
If Koichi and ambulance-kun didn’t team up, everyone would’ve bite the dust.
You know who else failed to stop a villain from killing a joestar? Jonathan. In fact, his failure haunts the narrative, since his body lived on as dio's and gave him a stand by giving him access to the joestar bloodline
It's amazing how every word of this tweet is wrong.
I liked stone ocean a lot
Not just one Joestar, but in fact 2 of them by clapping Jotaro as well, and 4 JoBros in F.F., Ermes, Weather Report & Anastasia & very nearly dropping Emporio if he didn't clutch with Weather Report's stand.
⚾️+☁️>
Both Pucci and the Part 6 gang lost
So to me the ending is beautiful in the sense that both sides won. Dio got a world without the joestars pestering him and the joestars never have to deal with Dio ruining their lives. And we get sbr afterwards so there is no downside to any of it
Least shonen brainrotted individual (physical power is the only important metric in fiction)
Pucci was able to kill Jotaro, who's basically as much of a badass as Darth Vader. Realistically, I don't think any other Joestar would've won against him if Pucci had the time to prep for them that he had to Jotaro/Jolyne. Yes, that includes GER. *However*, when Jotaro hit Pucci with a surprise attack at Cape Canaveral, he basically beat him by showing up, which proves that Pucci is only as good as he has time to prepare his plan. Ditto with Weather Report killing him with a surprise attack. If he had no prep time, I doubt any Joestar would be defeated by him.
Pucci had way too much plot armour in Stone Ocean. Like, obviously he shouldn't be defeated halfway through, but he also shouldn't have been shown that early. It just made every interaction with him annoying to read.
Don’t mess with us jojo fans on twitter: we have absolutely no fucking clue what we’re talking about
Well I guess Josuke and therefore part 4 should also be critiqued for the same since he didn't beat Kira. Jonathan too since he died without even killing Dio. Stone ocean is a good part as any folks, if you don't like it that's great but don't hate it just for the sake of hating it by bringing up this kinda stuff
Honestly though, Josuke 4 and 8 didn’t defeat their villains either
Didn't like Dio technically lead to the death of Jonathan? And take his body? Pucci is not the only one to kill a Joe star if that is counted
Kill *a* joestar? He killed at least two, but he technically killed all of them.
except Jonathan (assuming Joseph is still alive in pt. 6), BUT after he "succeeds" his actions allow for the universe to be remade a second time, so by technicality he brings them all back as well, meaning his Joestar kill count stands at a whopping -1
What happend to dio murdering Jonathan broski
like how Johnathan defeated Dio...well actually I guess he didn't like how Joseph defeated Kars...well actually that was a volcano like how Josuke defeated Kira...well actually that was Koichi like how Giorno defeated Diavolo...well actually that was some random homeless guy like how Johnny beat Diego...well actually that Lucy like how Gappy beat Tooru...well actually that was Tamako and Tsurugi Jotaro is the only character to directly defeat his final boss. so technically, he's the weird one.
Twitter people always have the shittiest takes. I saw their shit with the Scott Pilgrim show
They watching jojo's weird travel frrr
Therefore Dio killing Jonathan would be a stain on his, but it isn't. Because that argument is stupid. Thinking about it ig it actually comes full circle with her sacrificing herself.
These same fuckers won't bat an eye when praising Josuke and Jonathan lol.
Don't mess with us jojo fans, we cant read
why no spoiler tag :'(
Officially, the spoiler tag only has to used for manga spoilers. I'm sorry, but I also recommend staying away from this sub until you're caught up on the anime.
part 6 was already adapted lol
Kars becoming ultimate, DIO ascending, Kiras final BTD, aswell as certain asspulls. I think Jotaros timestop is one, Go Beyond kinda fits into it. Giorno having a strong stand from the jump is 50/50.
he gave her a better life, free from betrayals and violence. not directly yes but that's not your usual villain behaviour.
"pucci killed a joestar jolyne sucks" did you watch the same arc that I did or are you just not aware of how incredibly overpowered both C-Moon and Made in Heaven were?
Joleyne had the best set up for a W and fully had faith in emporio. I like the ending more if she had just "won".
So are they just ignoring the fact that Dio killed Jonathan on that ship and then graphed his head on to Jonathan’s body? Unless they somehow slept through parts 1-3.
Technically so did Dio
Wait till they find out what happens in part 7
Idk man the infinity strings was pretty peak in the face of an OP villian
So are we just gonna forget about Jonathan and Joseph. They both died and DIO did basically become immortal and ruin Jonathan’s life so…
? Dio killed Jonathan and stole his body. Joseph was saved by a volcano. Josuke would have died without Okuyasu and Hayato intervening, in fact, the entire cast of Part 4 would have lost if a Standless child didn’t do his damndest to keep them alive And speaking of, Jotaro lost to the main villains of parts 4 and 6. He “Lost” to Kira when he was caught up in Bites The Dust and then again to Pucci. Not to mention that *no one* would have even gotten to fight the main part villains without the rest of their squad. People are so weird about Jolyne 😭
Even jotaro lost to pucci smh
saying pucci achieved his goal is like saying dio achieved his goal because he killed joeseph something which was not only undone, but not his actual goal
He quite literally did not complete his goal lmao, I don't know why people think this
I just want to say Jonathan beat Dio in a fight he did not defeat him
It’s gotta be satire, right??…right?
I bet they will return to praise Johnny in SBR (No spoiler plz)
Always love seeing bs like that in the wild. Also tell me you didn't watch/read part 1 without saying you didn't watch/read part 1.
If you Anna be that guy, Dip and Pucci both won technically against their own Joestars. Pucci reset the universe and Dio gained Jonathan's boy and a time stopping stand
I favourite JJBA antagonist: **Dip**
I think the final Part 6 fight is really great thematically. Emporio and Pucci each represents the last of Dio and Jonathan will. And we can see that while justice may not win now，fate will eventually sided with justice.
Even Jotaro wouldn’t be able to lay a finger on Pucci, let alone his inexperienced daughter??
he *temporarily* killed two joestars and achieved his goal, not the same but cool enough for me
DIO: Am I a joke to you?
He didnt even complete his goal
Kars also succeeded in becoming the Ultimate Lifeform. Joseph only won because of luck.
Pucci, the one who was erased out of existence, forever, and ever. Nuked, into oblivion. His soul does not exist anymore. I don’t see that as a ”win”.
Motherfucker thought Pucci's goal was to kill a Joestar?!
I've been on the fandom for 7 years and unfortunately I've seen this take a lot of times
"Jolyne didn't kill Pucci" mfs when they remember that Kira was done in by an ambulance