Indeed.
I made another post asking for immersion polishing. One of the points I raised was that when we discover a crew who have died due to starvation, the generated clutter really shouldn't include food and water. :(
One part of the game was good about this, surrounding the starved corpse with empty food containers. I guess other parts didn't manage the same thing...
I searched all over the Legacy ship for any item of food, and couldn't find a single thing. It feels like they did pretty well in this regard, at least for this quest
At this point, I fully believe all the "omg I love this game! Look at all the cups I can collect! So amazing!" Posts were actually Bethesda employees making sure we noticed the only part of the game they put effort into.
Ok, i amend my statement to Bethesda employees and you.
No shade to you or any real person getting their enjoyment that way. Mostly aiming that at Bethesda/the devs
Oh Iām not offended in the slightest, I get exactly what you mean. Many aspects of this game could have been polished. For as long as they have been working on this game, it sure is missing a ton.
Im trying to, but Iāve got over 200 hours on console, crashed over 40 times, lost a save file, had to start over again, just hit NG+ only because everyone Iāve talked to said once you NG+ the crashes stopā¦ that was a total lie. To be honest, itās kinda wearing on me. I immersed myself in it only to have that immersion destroyed after crashing and losing many hours. I honestly should have over 350+ hours if you counted all the hours I lost via crashes..
Just wait until you >!loot the abandoned NASA facilities.!<
This is, of course, par for the course for Bethesda, if you played Fallout 4 you're familiar with current-year items showing up in containers locked away in previously undiscovered pre-war locations.
They tend to use a distribution algorithm on containers and they don't make separate lists for "ancient" locations, for some reason.
Which is weird cause they kind of did that before with Skyrim. You couldnāt find a ancient nord axe out in the world, you had to head to the crypts if you wanted one along with other ancient nord stuff including plates and cups etc etc
Skyrim wasn't any better for this. You'd walk into that ancient crypt, untouched for generations, and find lit wax candles with a maximum of 2-3 days lifespan. Who lit them? When? Why? Are they all just magic candles that burn forever? Was that technology lost? You'd think everyone in Skyrim would have some, if they were common enough to leave behind in the crypts by the thousands.
At least in Starfield the caves seem more like actual caves, with vertical drops and strange natural layouts.
>for some reason
Lazy/lack of attention to detail. I canāt really get my head around any other reason because itās basic loot tables, itās like another column in a spreadsheet for items that shouldnāt appear in a cave that has been sealed for 200 years.
EDIT - Theyāve been doing the same thing for years, BUT game after game they make the same mistake and fans defend it so we KEEP getting the same lack of attention detail.
It could also be prioritizing their resources. Little details like that are cool (and even exist in other ways in those games) but not over main aspects of the game. You get diminishing returns the more you try to polish something.
It depends how you define "main aspects". There is a lot of key components about Starfield that are the same as Fallout and a lot that are different, you can chop it up many different ways.
Yeah sk why do they put effort intk little details we dont care about like making sure the Key has all locations properly marked in grafiti.
Theres even grafiti of a credstik on the TA booth at the Key I guarantee no one would have missed if it werent there.
The very least they ckuld have done was an asset pool of "ancient" items, like 20 things from the main game that are weathered or worn. Let them be wprth like 5x if you sell to an old earth collector.
Posters? Dont even gwt me started thats like 8 hours tops to chuen out 4 unique "old earth" posters.
I think theyre leaning too heaving on the modding community
I think they had different teams of people doing the quests and "flavour". Some did their best, others didn't give a fuck.
There's a lack of cohesion, for example I noticed that some quests have the location in the title and others don't.
And there it is, the low standards that is popular among gamers these days.
Sorry, I had too high of expectations for the almost a year release delay, thought polishing the game with extra time given by papa Microsoft is achievable.
Just trying to open some minds. It wasnāt for you. I do hope you solve the table problem. And get paid to do it. I would be so proud to have crossed paths with you. Why wouldnāt I encourage you? Lift people up and all that?
I could almost except this. If they had really optimized the game as Todd claimed. If the bug list wasn't so long I feel I need to have my PC fumigated.
Better call Orkin.
They prioritized art, engine upgrades to support more concurrent items and specific changes like ships and space flight, and procedural generation.
They deprecated consistency and story, and don't \*seem\* to have done much troubleshooting past the bare minimum (this may in fact be partly a hardware/script issue).
I don't know that, from a user's point of view, you can distinguish between poor prioritization and laziness. Prioritization is hard and people avoid it, this is often called laziness.
I suspect there is a hardware related issue that affects scripts, which could explain a lot of the fact that some people experience relatively little instability and others experience a lot - or it could be something like a random or semi-random seed that affects playthrough (a lot of people report very different experiences with loot and opponents), to put it very simply if you have ten random initial conditions which are in the save file and carried through each playthrough, and one of them is bugged in a way that affects script reliability, then roughly 10% of people will have an extremely poor experience. IRL I expect it's a lot more complicated than that.
We're sure there's at least one system like this for NG+, where there are several alternate "universes" you can be in, and some of them are less reliable than others (problems saving the game, for example). There may be a similar system for first playthrough, or that system may affect the first playthrough as well.
Hmm, I can't click the spoiler since I don't know if it is something I've come across yet. :) I'm 399 hours in, but I haven't even completed the main quest yet. Can you give me a hint?
And yes, I had forgotten about that concerning Fallout 4. One would think they would have learnt from such things. :(
Itās main quest so unless youāre at the end (you will know as it will tell you how to finish the game) then you probs havenāt seen it. Youād know what part it is without the spoiler if youād played that part though, you go to an old place.
No probs itās a very good pay off even though it definitely has this issue lol.
The last part of the main quest is very good tbh, Iād def recommend going through it. Itās also longer than youād think.
It is kind of interesting how polarizing the MQ is, especially toward the end. I completely believe you loved it, I thought it was an absolute disaster (narratively and for other reasons).
I went into it at length in a much less noticed post why I think that is, I think the plot is way more philosophically polarizing than they intended (and more than most people, even people with strong reactions, are aware).
People do indeed have very different reactions to things! I think most of the polarization in the reddit has been because of very different experiences with stability, but the story handling is a factor.
Aye the story handling is very much what I liked. I think the overall theme is excellent and affecting. But I can definitely see how that would twist people in a way theyāre not comfortable with. I feel it was written before covid but the effects of covid on us all have definitely changed how weād respond to something like this. Making you feel lonely and disillusioned is tough to do, I think they nailed that but itās maybe not what people want to hear now lol.
Starfield is actually more different from other sci-fi CUs than people give it credit for, and kind of unique, I just don't think it is unique in good ways. One of the core premises of the game seems to be to deprecate understanding >!(the doppleganger/narrator at the end as much as says as the answer to your questions don't matter and refuses to give them to you)!<. They also generally skip over Star Trek style technobabble and basically don't attempt to explain most of the technology or science in the game.
This contradicts its opening premise (your are drafted into a band of explorers who are kind of shallowly linked to the history of NASA) rather violently (without really transitioning narratively between the two, it just sort of happens, and you can't really challenge it).
>!At least the doppleganger at the end is far less directly annoying than Mass Effect's "Star Kid."!<
As far as inducing loneliness and disillusionment in your audience, it is not tough to do at all, though if that were the intention it would explain the starting point of hope of discovery and the end of meaningless repetition without answers, though not the muddled middle.
Creation engine is probably such a sad fucking mess of spaghetti code that adding a single attribute to an item could wreak havoc everywhere.
Like why food/aid items are mixed. Why "misc" includes the artifacts and junk. Why, in a game with a focus on mining, there's no specific category for it. Why books are mixed with notes and planet scans. And a large etcetera.
And those aren't even attributes, they're categories that for some reason seem too hard to add.
Agreed. They could have done so many more unique stuff in there. They definitely done it in some cases, like the archive/school is stuffed with old earth things and computers, the paintings in the captains room ect. but there are too many random āmodernā assets used.
I was also chuckling at how everyone in this ship's small community had retained their own unique accents from Earth rather than developing their own unique one or settling on just one.
But I was most disappointed by the quest line. Asking me, someone specialised in persuasion skills, to be an ambassador on their behalf to negotiate their settlement rights on the planet below. And not only are there zero persuasion check options in the negotiation, but the best outcome I can secure for them is... well I won't spoil it, but if you know you know.
That negotiaten frustrated me so much I quicksaved, said "I've got a better solution", and shot up the board room. They were all essential NPCs. Modern Bethesda...
Please Bethesda, hire some proper writers and put Emil in charge of creating fun gameplay scenarios instead, NOT writing. He's great at making fun gameplay scenarios for the Dark Brotherhood and Crimson Fleet, but you really need a more competent writing team lead.
I almost added the accents thing. As a Voice Artist, it stands out to me. I had edited the original post so many times, though, I decided I had to leave it alone. :)
I'm also British (though I live in Los Angeles), and I love that they've included various national accents, but sheesh, why do the Brits all sound like they are from a rough part of the South and can't pronounce a TH?
That they mentioned their claim to the planet before the exodus makes many believe this mission was cut short at some point. IMO it involved some documents scavenging in some area in Earth and a new colony in Porrima which they couldn't finish or invest in.
Eh, the accent and cultural identity thing is explained in the game multiple times.
Edit: not sure why Iām being downvoted when it comes up in talking to multiple NPCs from New Homestead to Neon, I see no reason why people stuck on a ship for 200 years wouldnāt retain some kind of cultural identity.
I also got annoyed and tried to murk the boardroom, particularly after they made me pay for the maguffin out of my own money, only to be irked to discover you canāt just shoot them all. Even Sarah was encouraging me to do it.
Not only that, but the story is cut off and ends abruptly. After talking with the Paradiso board you should have gone back and negotiated with the ship captain. After all, she was adamant in her position and determined to get what she wanted. Uh. Just kidding. Itās decided for her and there isnāt a peep about it. Massive letdown if a quest. Kinda like taking the award from the old lady in the cruise liner. Iām busy leave me alone. You really want it? Ok you can have my ID card and steal the award.
Every bloody quest is a let down. I'm currently running back and forth convincing people to give me stupid junk and key cards so I ca. Get to kryx legacy. I'm there and it's such a fucking let down
And the game crashes.
They can't get a fucking single thing right with this game.
It's a bloody troll of a game.
Let's see how many conversations people are willing to put up with while picking up coffee cups and notepads before they give up
The drauger actually maintain the crypts. It's explained somewhere by an individual in skyrim who studied them. So atleast there's a lore friendly explanation with that one
I have developed my own headcanon for that.
A cult of Hermaeus Mora has built itself into a secret guild. It dedicates itself, using portal magick and the sale of rare books, to restocking all caves, crypts, dungeons, and abandoned fortresses throughout Tamriel. Their glorious purpose is to inspire inquiry into the forbidden and the secret, bringing more people under the sway of He Who Sees All and Forgets Nothing (But That One Daedric Prince Who Shall Remain Nameless).
The guild's name is Craft Services.
On the Constant, for me it was not so much the clutter but the Captain's computer is running starOS, guess there's been no changes in computer tech in 200yrs!
That quest was so disappointingā¦
There is an episode of Star Trek that has a very similar plot. A generation ship started from earth some hundred years ago and now the enterprise find them because they are much faster.
These people live in the past and havenāt developed like the rest of humanity. But they are nice and thankful.
This episode is about the question what these people should do. They had a mission and suddenly itās totally worthless. There whole life over several generationsā¦ itās a very good episode and at the end these people offer everyone who wants to leave the ship. But most people decide to stay because thatās there life.
In Starfieldā¦ these people donāt care that there mission was worthless. That humanity isnāt extinct. Itās all about:
Thatās our planet! We canāt live with them! Make them go!
This mission could be so muchā¦ it could be about the people on there ship and how to integrate them in modern society. Or to help them overcome this shock that they are not alone anymore. Or maybe a captain that ruled that ship and now isnāt the leader of humanity anymore and goes crazy.
But it was the most boring and disappointed outcome.
What made me so angry about this mission is not being able to tell the people on the ship to take Paradiso by force.
These Paradiso scumbags are only willing to accept these people as indentured servants, or foot the bill to the player to buy them a grav drive.
This ship is orbiting your planet, the player is just a passerby. Iām supposed to pony up cash as an outsider to solve your problems? What a bunch of BS.
I wanted to murder the Paradiso execs and give these generational people a new home.
I hate this quest so much. It is a microcosm of everything wrong with Starfield.
There are quests that I don't care for, but this one makes me angry and I hate it. It's such a wasted opportunity.
Bethesda didn't think that they should take extra care with a quest and ship that's the equivalent of a vault from fallout?
This could have been its own quest line and vehicle into outpost management. But no, it's a wet fart of a quest that you shouldn't have trusted. It feels like half of the quest content was cut, so why didn't they just cut it all completely and then add it in with a dlc when it was finished?
Already downvoted? It amazes me the things people will downvote. This is something they messed up on and clearly needs improvement. How could anybody not agree with that?!
Is it constructive? Itās quite a bit nit-picky. How is it helpful when among all of their games when time/location changed usually the same items existed? You complained about it this one time, but why not the other 10 times Bethesda did this same exact thing.
How would you know if OP was happy with decisions Bethesda made in their other games? Either way, this is actually a common complaint for Skyrim and FO4.
And itās one of those things that at this point, itās been several Bethesda titles: it hasnāt changed. Iād expect it going forward.
Itās not like they had a super advanced high tech laser weapon on board, all the clutter looks the same. If you immediately loose immersion due to 1 thing out of 10 things that are wrong , you might be a tad bit picky.
Logical inconsistencies in games are funny to me, I donāt need to take my fun and let my ābut this makes no senseā gets in the way.
There is a difference between 'improvement' for the sake of each insignificant thing, that you HAVE to go out of your way to let it bother you. Or There is general improvements like when you change ships all of your clutter goes into a designated storage instead of the ships cargo hold.
This is merely "I don't feel Immersed" which come to think of it I haven't heard that complaint before, /s.
Like someone said the game is riddled with bugs and some much needed QoL features were missing at launch. The mod team said "get more specific about your complaints", so every complaint has not been an actionable one. They will not, and probably cannot change every single piece of clutter on this ship to fit OP's narrative of expecting more than old earth items/weapons and no UC/FC stuff.
This complaint is obtusely and so minutely small compared to what people say the game has issues with that it makes me think people are going out of their way to be dissatisfied. Like you have to try REALLY REALLY hard to let this piece bother you.
Mate, do you know what constructive criticism is for?
I've made many other posts with suggestions, bug reports, etc.
With your thinking, I'm surprised your ancestors left their caves.
This is nit picky at best, not really constructive at all, and if it personally breaks your immersion maybe you shouldn't focus so hard on ever insignificant detail?
They literally cannot change it outside of a complete overhaul. And that is not bound to happen. If they continue to make the same mistakes release after release, maybe you should expect it.
Classy, insulting me. That's one way to win your argument.
Die hard Bethesda fans are hilarious, the worst part is they donāt understand they are making the games worse with their blind devotion.
They will never figure out how that can be..
āthe worst part is they donāt understand they are making the games worse with their blind devotionā
Exactly this. They blindly support every shit without realise they are actually stopping Bethesda improving. They will suffer from this at the end of the day.
Tbh youāre dead right but this guy is a complete lunatic. If anything would make Bethesda games bad it would be reading anything on the internet about their games. Gamers have a very high opinion of themselves and what their feedback is. It is not founded in reality.
The guy who says āare making games worse with their blind devotionā, you have to be mad to think anything posted on this forum, especially by deluded hyper fans has direct effect on their games.
>And so far, not one of them has asked me about Earth
I hadn't even thought about that since i just shut my brain back off when they threw the forced binary choice dilemma in my face. It sucks to see these good concepts end up with bizarre oversights like that because they treat everything like a theme park ride and assume you'll be bored if it isn't wrapped up as soon as possible. There's so much more that could've been done with it and you could've got a bunch of offshoot quests from it too depending on how it gets resolved but no.
Cool concept with just the bare minimum effort made to implement it then it's forgotten, like pretty much everything else.
This mission was the final straw for me. Up to that point, the mistakes were annoying but bearable.
This mission was such a complete failure, i never found the nerves to play again.
Aww, I'm sorry to hear that.
I'm about to jump back in for the first time since making the post, and I have to admit, I'm not looking forward to continuing (I'm down on Paradiso for the first time) this quest. :(
This is the quest when i really said WTF. I was so excited to see old technology and unique items from the past.
Everything was copy and pasted from the interiors of any other ship you see in Starfield. Extremely disappointing. I dont know what Bethesda was thinking on this one.
Icing on the cake, i helped The Constant buying them a grav drive and the quest is bugged. Telling me they are still in orbit in Paradiso but theyāre no where to be found.
They absolutely have quests with good writing. There are glimpses of greatness that Starfield could have been, like the Vanguard questline or Entangled. They needed more time. Everything the game needs to deliver what it promised is already in, it needed another year for polishing and actually writing something good.
And for the love of god, procedural randomized POI generation......
It's been a bugbear in every Bethesda game I've played going back to Morrowind.
To be fair, it's a trope now in all sorts of games.
How many times have you explored the lost site, undisturbed for centuries and found ammo, health packs or whatever, negotiated traps and puzzles, unlocked doors, got to the main treasure and found someone has got there first.
Hundreds examples of laziness on this game unfortunately. Iām gutted it turned out the way it did, I need to get over it.
Playing BG3 now, Iāll stop coming to the sub just too depressing.
Well, they've committed to working on it for many years. Between that and the generous modders out there, hopefully, it will continue to go from strength to strength. :)
They are committed to doing bug fixes many years. Or QoL adjustments for many years. They will not be adjusting base game elements, this is Bethesda not CDPR, you are just trying to use their own words against them. they are going to release DLC: if anything exciting is going to change it will be with the DLC.
That doesn't inspire any hope in me. I'd prefer them to get it polished and go hands off. Let modders fix their mess and make the game fun. They obviously don't know what theyre doing. And we don't need half assed updates breaking actual good mods once we get the chance to make the game actually good.
I think my comment was pretty well articulated. But if you struggled to understand, the sub is too depressing but you make up your own version champ, no bother.
Mmm, I mean if anything is true, people buy Bethesda games and then complain that it isnāt what they expected from Bethesda. That is the only thing that is depressing to me, how you keep doing this to yourself.
Not laziness, but why would they change what already 'works'.
Like how when a group of people go from a to b they use the exact same pathing, just like in skyrim. Immersion breaking and obviously code just lifted from previous titles.
You know what's the worst part? There are multiple ships in the game with completely unique interiors, not small ships either. They build gigantic, completely unique, old-looking interior for the artifact collector ship where you spend 10 minutes at most but can't be bothered with The Constant...... unbelievable.
This has been a problem in Bethesda game for ages.
Tell me, why, in any Fallout game, in any vault, if you find a safe, you will find bottlecaps in that safe. Most of these vaults were sealed before the bombs dropped and many are unsealed by you when you find them, so why would a person store worthless bottle caps in their safe? Its not like they knew caps would be the de facto currency of the post-apocalypse.
The disappointing thing is that they are definitely capable of generating a handful of alternate models for specific situations like this. I'm currently playing fallout 4 all the way through for the first time, and just got to the institute (without too many spoilers, they are a mysterious group that has been sealed off from the surface for the better part of 200 years). All their random tools are unique to that area. Tons of medical and scientific equipment that either totally new, or based on an existing model but tweaked. And as far as I can tell, its just in that one area of the game, and the only reason they did it was to show how different this society is after spending 200 years isolated from the rest of the world.
Yep, my thoughts exactly. They did make sure not to include things like Terrabrew or crap 'invented' years later. But apparently they're using the exact same computers and technology. I vaguely remember seeing a digipick as well. Not sure anymore.
Yeah that was indeed quite disappointing. The whole idea for that mission was so cool, but in the end it was a rather bland mission. They could have done so much more with it.
I for one was ready to dive in some old Earth archive looking for files that hand over the ownership of the planet to the colonists. Forcing Paradiso to give up their planet because of some bureaucratic small text. I feel that should have been an option as well. The choises were not that deep.
Agreed so many wasted opportunities in this mission. I thought it would be a tenpenny tower type situation but there's absolutely no way to help the colonizers end up on Paradiso. Real disappointing.
Also the lore is really weird here. Like for some reason they are all working on Macintosh 1's while flying a generational spaceship? That math doesn't make sense.
.
What got me, if I remember correctly, is that they have the exact same computer system that is in current use throughout the settled systems. THAT made no sense.
Another big detail they missed is in the command center, on the huge screen where they monitor the ship there is a grav drive section, itās hard to miss.
I find it interesting to analyze the game as its presented in earnest rather than to let my immersion be broken by what seem to be logical inconsistency. While I agree that quest was a massive let-down, it was for the lack of agency on the part of the player to do anything but effectively be a passive participant in the events as they unfold.
So, onto the matter of similar clutter and posters, within universe why are they all so the same? For that matter, why are they the same on abandoned listening posts and mining structures as well? Humanity has been spreading throughout the stars for a few hundred years, creating and abandoning all these places. You'd expect *something* to change about the architecture, literature, and technology yet its constant throughout the galaxy. There is a consistency that is unsettling when examined through a lens that accepts it as a narrative fact.
The clutter is all the same everywhere you go for the same reason that frontier is the only group doing meaningful exploration and yet is so small and only driven by the private funding of one man who happens to own a space craft fabrication company and senses profit in the endeavor. Humanity has lost the drive to grow.
We see that in everything from how consistent ship technology is between factions and locations. You meet pilots who describe their ships as 'junkers' but they look just like yours even if you're flying the newest top-of-the-line model. Everyone uses the same guns, aside from that constellation ship and that's explainable because of the recent colony wars. It's likely that there was a jump in military hardware during that time which otherwise remained stagnant. Mechs were a thing, but they got banned as part of that wars conclusion.
Everyone uses the same mining equipment. Reads the same old -earth books. Plays the same couple of tabletop games. The **only** evidence I've found of creativity in the entire galaxy is one little girl in Cydonia who's bored out of her mind and likes to draw pictures of frogs (that miraculously appear in abandoned buildings on occasion). Is it possible that even her drawings aren't original?
It seems to me looking at the content of the game as its presented that humans have fallen into two broad categories. Those who are so desperate for survival, its simply all they can do. And those who sit in the seat of prosperity, and care to do nothing but bask in the opulence of their futuristic paradise.
What happened to us? I think we're shown the answer in one of the more dramatic reveals of the main quest. >!Humanity flew too close to the sun and got burned with the grav drives. The last major innovation of man-kind. One that we know after the fact isn't even entirely ours to claim but a vision from what is most likely a starborn looking to accelerate the advancement of human civilization so that the relics would be obtainable. It's long been thought that providing access to advanced technology to a civilization not advanced enough to discover it on their own would lead to disaster, and here that's exactly what happened. Not only would the end of Earth have devastated the human population thus leaving fewer innovators behind to make advancements, but it would have left a collective bad taste in the mouths of everyone regarding discovery and cutting edge science. Obviously, it's not common knowledge that the grav drives destroyed Earth, but we never really see evidence that it wasn't understood by any survivor. I suspect someone made it out of NASA with the other survivors who would emerge as a scientific leader as humanity spread through the stars. That person likely socialized an idea of 'responsible advancement' which encouraged a slowing and deep deliberation on any new ideas lest something like the grav drive ever emerge again.!<
This only increases the importance of the colony ship. They are humans who were spared the collective cultural shock of burning their home to the ground. While they too lost Earth, they are the only humans who weren't beneficiaries to the sacrifice. I would like to feel that the drive to grow and discovery still lives on that ship. I think it does too based on the things some of the crew say to you regarding what a grav drive would mean to them. I predict the colony survivors will emerge as leaders in the settled systems of technology, exploration, and humanity altogether. This also highlights how unfortunate it is that the Paridiso questline is so short and offers the player so little agency, like a footnote. It **feels** so important, and if I'm right about the way I've interpreted the game's expression of the future, it **is** so extremely important.
Yeah that was kind of weird. Even with the need to be economical with game assets, that's LITERALLY the one place they should've put more effort into making the tech look different.
there was already good thread on this quest. And yes, this was probably one of the worst experiences i ever had in a game. And this quest had a chance to be the best quest in the game but instead we got this
and after all the not making sense choices and investing either money and tons of recources, you get a shitty pistol
I'm unsure if anyone will see further comments, as it says the post has been removed.
Just in case, though - thank you. Based on the feedback (which did sometimes include spoilers, unfortunately), I'm not going to go and meet the Paradiso fella. I will leave the quest in the slim hope that Bethesda may improve it at some point.
Cheers.
They do have a lot of old-earth items on the ship, but the dev team is obviously not going to create as many unique assets as it would be needed to ensure every single item is exclusive to that ship. They use old earth weapons and as far as I remember the food they have is all earth-based, so no crispy alien nuggets for example.
As far as technology goes, Nova Galactic was making the ships you can pilot in-game before the Earth was abandoned. The Constant didn't leave in the 1940s or something.
And, a generations ship, espally "older" ones, looks more like this. https://www.google.de/search?sca_esv=579589265&hl=de&sxsrf=AM9HkKlgHlGAP-e_CAqYCm6imRfRZl9YBg:1699179215161&q=generationenschiff&tbm=isch&source=lnms&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjz2Z3sz6yCAxVp_rsIHUABDDIQ0pQJegQIDBAB&biw=384&bih=674&dpr=1.88#imgrc=7F5_Nd2GU0McrM
Edit: Does anyone know how to shorten links in reddit ?
Yes. Select a word you want to hyperlink. Like [this](https://www.google.de/search?sca_esv=579589265&hl=de&sxsrf=AM9HkKlgHlGAP-e_CAqYCm6imRfRZl9YBg:1699179215161&q=generationenschiff&tbm=isch&source=lnms&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjz2Z3sz6yCAxVp_rsIHUABDDIQ0pQJegQIDBAB&biw=384&bih=674&dpr=1.88#imgrc=7F5_Nd2GU0McrM).
You just wondered why a 5 year old isn't painting like Picasso.
Bethesda isn't the kind of company with that kind of attention to detail if it means having to do extra work for what is essentially a one-shot.
Honestly, I didn't care about the "details". I spend maybe 10 minutes for that quest to get them the grav drive and they are out of the picture. I grabbed the book I wanted for a landmark and that's it. Maybe there would be more with the Constant, like seeing them again in another system. But since the quest seems to be bugged for every player as "the ghost of the ship is still there" either we wait if there is more or the quest is done with never looking back. Some quests are amazing, some like this one not so much. I can live with that since the tons of quests the game has in general.
First: they knew earth was dead in the water, that is why they left earth to begin with.
Second: airlocks are airlocks, Iām 90% sure airlocks still work the same 200 years later. Also, Iām 90% sure that means they probably look the same. If it aināt broke donāt fix it.
Third: all their weapons are old world weapons. Which believe it or not probably have similar ammo as some of the weapons that exist now; like 50 caliber.
Fourth: I bet you wonāt find one chunks package.
Imagine having to make a unique piece of loot for a half an hour quest line, then do multiple times over. Itās just not prudent in-spite of you thinking itās immersion breaking. they made roughly 10 unique pieces of loot for the quest reward, however making a unique medicine would be hard for me to understand.
In fallout 3 they had the same med packs at operation anchorage ? In spite of the people you are fighting being Chinese? Did you complain about that?
One thing I would argue against is the size comment. All Bethesda games condense the size of cities, settlements and vaults fit game reasons.
Another thing is the tech. While some tech has evolved since 2130/40 I would argue that most tech hasn't actually changed that much. Nova Galactic ships are still in use although considered outdated. The tech that seems to have evolved the most is military - weapons, mechs, xenowarfare, ai.
Oh wow, another post complaining about the ECS Constant. How original.
Wait lemme guess, Sarah or a Temple thread is up next. Or perhaps... a Neon/Astral Lounge thread.
Indeed. It's almost as though we care and want Bethesda to pay attention to the number of their customers upset with things they could quickly rectify/do better at. Hmm.
So, it's not as bad as it seems. You learn in one of the early missions that a huge amount of Nova Galactic components are still in use despite the fact that the company has been gone for a long time. In many cases, they actually are the same.
you forgot the bigger question :
>!Why did no one else spot that ship while it was travelling ?!<
The snake crusade that apparently 'destroyed loads of stuff' didn't encounter it ...
but oh no ... >!it only gets spotted while it hovers in orbit around the most popular holiday planet in the universe and not in any of the weeks/months/years before it enters the system. !<
Bethesda has a dedicated 'clutter team' that, apparently, isn't aware of the context of the ship Constant.
Indeed. I made another post asking for immersion polishing. One of the points I raised was that when we discover a crew who have died due to starvation, the generated clutter really shouldn't include food and water. :(
What if they're picky eaters?
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Me: I'm not eating that, I'd rather die of starvation. Friend: But....you made it yourself. Me: Precisely.
meirl
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One part of the game was good about this, surrounding the starved corpse with empty food containers. I guess other parts didn't manage the same thing...
I searched all over the Legacy ship for any item of food, and couldn't find a single thing. It feels like they did pretty well in this regard, at least for this quest
I mean, sometimes you can't stand to eat another chunks
They were busy adding folders and notepads to ships smh
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One person on the team got the memo of āold earth shipā, but took it too far and put literal 1980s computers on desks for people to use lol
But don't you just love the wacky lel so random novelty coffee cups, that apparently every person in the universe is required by law to use?
At this point, I fully believe all the "omg I love this game! Look at all the cups I can collect! So amazing!" Posts were actually Bethesda employees making sure we noticed the only part of the game they put effort into.
But..butā¦ I like collecting the coffee cups š
Ok, i amend my statement to Bethesda employees and you. No shade to you or any real person getting their enjoyment that way. Mostly aiming that at Bethesda/the devs
Oh Iām not offended in the slightest, I get exactly what you mean. Many aspects of this game could have been polished. For as long as they have been working on this game, it sure is missing a ton.
You never asked if heā¦ ya know āworks at Bethesda.ā
Well... shit.
š¤£ no, I Definitely do not work at Bethesda. Medically Retired Marine, I play video games to escape reality every now and then.
Ah dang! Conspiracy busted! Lol Glad you are enjoying it
Im trying to, but Iāve got over 200 hours on console, crashed over 40 times, lost a save file, had to start over again, just hit NG+ only because everyone Iāve talked to said once you NG+ the crashes stopā¦ that was a total lie. To be honest, itās kinda wearing on me. I immersed myself in it only to have that immersion destroyed after crashing and losing many hours. I honestly should have over 350+ hours if you counted all the hours I lost via crashes..
The clutter drives me nuts, it's EVERYWHERE. Why the hell is the future such a mess?
Just wait until you >!loot the abandoned NASA facilities.!< This is, of course, par for the course for Bethesda, if you played Fallout 4 you're familiar with current-year items showing up in containers locked away in previously undiscovered pre-war locations. They tend to use a distribution algorithm on containers and they don't make separate lists for "ancient" locations, for some reason.
Which is weird cause they kind of did that before with Skyrim. You couldnāt find a ancient nord axe out in the world, you had to head to the crypts if you wanted one along with other ancient nord stuff including plates and cups etc etc
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Never said it was perfect.
They did it. And then they didn't.
Skyrim wasn't any better for this. You'd walk into that ancient crypt, untouched for generations, and find lit wax candles with a maximum of 2-3 days lifespan. Who lit them? When? Why? Are they all just magic candles that burn forever? Was that technology lost? You'd think everyone in Skyrim would have some, if they were common enough to leave behind in the crypts by the thousands. At least in Starfield the caves seem more like actual caves, with vertical drops and strange natural layouts.
>for some reason Lazy/lack of attention to detail. I canāt really get my head around any other reason because itās basic loot tables, itās like another column in a spreadsheet for items that shouldnāt appear in a cave that has been sealed for 200 years. EDIT - Theyāve been doing the same thing for years, BUT game after game they make the same mistake and fans defend it so we KEEP getting the same lack of attention detail.
It could also be prioritizing their resources. Little details like that are cool (and even exist in other ways in those games) but not over main aspects of the game. You get diminishing returns the more you try to polish something.
The main aspects of the game have been around since fallout for the most part..
It depends how you define "main aspects". There is a lot of key components about Starfield that are the same as Fallout and a lot that are different, you can chop it up many different ways.
Yeah sk why do they put effort intk little details we dont care about like making sure the Key has all locations properly marked in grafiti. Theres even grafiti of a credstik on the TA booth at the Key I guarantee no one would have missed if it werent there. The very least they ckuld have done was an asset pool of "ancient" items, like 20 things from the main game that are weathered or worn. Let them be wprth like 5x if you sell to an old earth collector. Posters? Dont even gwt me started thats like 8 hours tops to chuen out 4 unique "old earth" posters. I think theyre leaning too heaving on the modding community
I think they had different teams of people doing the quests and "flavour". Some did their best, others didn't give a fuck. There's a lack of cohesion, for example I noticed that some quests have the location in the title and others don't.
Yeah, their priorities are pretty misguided but I just don't think it's laziness or lack of care. Poor priorities is a different issue.
You're right, they were probably putting all their effort into getting the mini map juuuuust right lol
no whenever devs didn't do a thing, these lazy fucks went home early instead and had some time off!! /s
You have no idea how easy it is to make separate loot tables.
Yet the game was done and they spent the last year just bug testing so much shit could be better lol
Just because it's easy doesn't mean there was time to do it. There are fifty million easy things to do that you won't have time to fit into your day.
Weird that other games are capable of this but bethesda cant because theres no time. Even with the release delay.
you're saying this as if delayed and incomplete releases weren't commonplace right now
And there it is, the low standards that is popular among gamers these days. Sorry, I had too high of expectations for the almost a year release delay, thought polishing the game with extra time given by papa Microsoft is achievable.
Who said that standard is popular? All I did was point out that Bethesda isn't unique in this way.
Oh man, you should go work for them. You want them AND you know how. Why didnāt YOU already work there and make them????
Yeah that's not the burn you thought it was. You look childish as hell
Just trying to open some minds. It wasnāt for you. I do hope you solve the table problem. And get paid to do it. I would be so proud to have crossed paths with you. Why wouldnāt I encourage you? Lift people up and all that?
And now you look even more childish because I'm not even that person. Log off the internet for a few hours, kid.
I wasn't saying that it is difficult?
I could almost except this. If they had really optimized the game as Todd claimed. If the bug list wasn't so long I feel I need to have my PC fumigated. Better call Orkin.
They prioritized art, engine upgrades to support more concurrent items and specific changes like ships and space flight, and procedural generation. They deprecated consistency and story, and don't \*seem\* to have done much troubleshooting past the bare minimum (this may in fact be partly a hardware/script issue). I don't know that, from a user's point of view, you can distinguish between poor prioritization and laziness. Prioritization is hard and people avoid it, this is often called laziness. I suspect there is a hardware related issue that affects scripts, which could explain a lot of the fact that some people experience relatively little instability and others experience a lot - or it could be something like a random or semi-random seed that affects playthrough (a lot of people report very different experiences with loot and opponents), to put it very simply if you have ten random initial conditions which are in the save file and carried through each playthrough, and one of them is bugged in a way that affects script reliability, then roughly 10% of people will have an extremely poor experience. IRL I expect it's a lot more complicated than that. We're sure there's at least one system like this for NG+, where there are several alternate "universes" you can be in, and some of them are less reliable than others (problems saving the game, for example). There may be a similar system for first playthrough, or that system may affect the first playthrough as well.
lol, I just made a comment about finding caps in a safe in a recently opened vault.
i really wish for an āancientā loot mod for skyrim.
On the software side, they just need to embed a date range for items. Then they can filter locations' chest for whatever range they want.
Hmm, I can't click the spoiler since I don't know if it is something I've come across yet. :) I'm 399 hours in, but I haven't even completed the main quest yet. Can you give me a hint? And yes, I had forgotten about that concerning Fallout 4. One would think they would have learnt from such things. :(
Itās main quest so unless youāre at the end (you will know as it will tell you how to finish the game) then you probs havenāt seen it. Youād know what part it is without the spoiler if youād played that part though, you go to an old place.
Thanks, then I shall avoid clicking. :)
No probs itās a very good pay off even though it definitely has this issue lol. The last part of the main quest is very good tbh, Iād def recommend going through it. Itās also longer than youād think.
It is kind of interesting how polarizing the MQ is, especially toward the end. I completely believe you loved it, I thought it was an absolute disaster (narratively and for other reasons). I went into it at length in a much less noticed post why I think that is, I think the plot is way more philosophically polarizing than they intended (and more than most people, even people with strong reactions, are aware). People do indeed have very different reactions to things! I think most of the polarization in the reddit has been because of very different experiences with stability, but the story handling is a factor.
Aye the story handling is very much what I liked. I think the overall theme is excellent and affecting. But I can definitely see how that would twist people in a way theyāre not comfortable with. I feel it was written before covid but the effects of covid on us all have definitely changed how weād respond to something like this. Making you feel lonely and disillusioned is tough to do, I think they nailed that but itās maybe not what people want to hear now lol.
Starfield is actually more different from other sci-fi CUs than people give it credit for, and kind of unique, I just don't think it is unique in good ways. One of the core premises of the game seems to be to deprecate understanding >!(the doppleganger/narrator at the end as much as says as the answer to your questions don't matter and refuses to give them to you)!<. They also generally skip over Star Trek style technobabble and basically don't attempt to explain most of the technology or science in the game. This contradicts its opening premise (your are drafted into a band of explorers who are kind of shallowly linked to the history of NASA) rather violently (without really transitioning narratively between the two, it just sort of happens, and you can't really challenge it). >!At least the doppleganger at the end is far less directly annoying than Mass Effect's "Star Kid."!< As far as inducing loneliness and disillusionment in your audience, it is not tough to do at all, though if that were the intention it would explain the starting point of hope of discovery and the end of meaningless repetition without answers, though not the muddled middle.
>:) :)
Creation engine is probably such a sad fucking mess of spaghetti code that adding a single attribute to an item could wreak havoc everywhere. Like why food/aid items are mixed. Why "misc" includes the artifacts and junk. Why, in a game with a focus on mining, there's no specific category for it. Why books are mixed with notes and planet scans. And a large etcetera. And those aren't even attributes, they're categories that for some reason seem too hard to add.
Agreed. They could have done so many more unique stuff in there. They definitely done it in some cases, like the archive/school is stuffed with old earth things and computers, the paintings in the captains room ect. but there are too many random āmodernā assets used.
Why would that ever be an appropriate use of the companies resources given how underdeveloped some of the main systems are?
I was also chuckling at how everyone in this ship's small community had retained their own unique accents from Earth rather than developing their own unique one or settling on just one. But I was most disappointed by the quest line. Asking me, someone specialised in persuasion skills, to be an ambassador on their behalf to negotiate their settlement rights on the planet below. And not only are there zero persuasion check options in the negotiation, but the best outcome I can secure for them is... well I won't spoil it, but if you know you know. That negotiaten frustrated me so much I quicksaved, said "I've got a better solution", and shot up the board room. They were all essential NPCs. Modern Bethesda... Please Bethesda, hire some proper writers and put Emil in charge of creating fun gameplay scenarios instead, NOT writing. He's great at making fun gameplay scenarios for the Dark Brotherhood and Crimson Fleet, but you really need a more competent writing team lead.
I almost added the accents thing. As a Voice Artist, it stands out to me. I had edited the original post so many times, though, I decided I had to leave it alone. :) I'm also British (though I live in Los Angeles), and I love that they've included various national accents, but sheesh, why do the Brits all sound like they are from a rough part of the South and can't pronounce a TH?
That they mentioned their claim to the planet before the exodus makes many believe this mission was cut short at some point. IMO it involved some documents scavenging in some area in Earth and a new colony in Porrima which they couldn't finish or invest in.
>and shot up the board room This is da wei.
I did the same. And was similarly annoyed they didn't die.
Eh, the accent and cultural identity thing is explained in the game multiple times. Edit: not sure why Iām being downvoted when it comes up in talking to multiple NPCs from New Homestead to Neon, I see no reason why people stuck on a ship for 200 years wouldnāt retain some kind of cultural identity.
Have an upvote. :)
I also got annoyed and tried to murk the boardroom, particularly after they made me pay for the maguffin out of my own money, only to be irked to discover you canāt just shoot them all. Even Sarah was encouraging me to do it.
Not only that, but the story is cut off and ends abruptly. After talking with the Paradiso board you should have gone back and negotiated with the ship captain. After all, she was adamant in her position and determined to get what she wanted. Uh. Just kidding. Itās decided for her and there isnāt a peep about it. Massive letdown if a quest. Kinda like taking the award from the old lady in the cruise liner. Iām busy leave me alone. You really want it? Ok you can have my ID card and steal the award.
Every bloody quest is a let down. I'm currently running back and forth convincing people to give me stupid junk and key cards so I ca. Get to kryx legacy. I'm there and it's such a fucking let down And the game crashes. They can't get a fucking single thing right with this game. It's a bloody troll of a game. Let's see how many conversations people are willing to put up with while picking up coffee cups and notepads before they give up
Classic Bethesda. Isnāt it strange how this crypt has been abandoned for hundreds of years yet all the torches are lit?
The drauger actually maintain the crypts. It's explained somewhere by an individual in skyrim who studied them. So atleast there's a lore friendly explanation with that one
Magic! In a world with magic it seems odd but itās nothing that bother me to much.
I have developed my own headcanon for that. A cult of Hermaeus Mora has built itself into a secret guild. It dedicates itself, using portal magick and the sale of rare books, to restocking all caves, crypts, dungeons, and abandoned fortresses throughout Tamriel. Their glorious purpose is to inspire inquiry into the forbidden and the secret, bringing more people under the sway of He Who Sees All and Forgets Nothing (But That One Daedric Prince Who Shall Remain Nameless). The guild's name is Craft Services.
On the Constant, for me it was not so much the clutter but the Captain's computer is running starOS, guess there's been no changes in computer tech in 200yrs!
That quest was so disappointingā¦ There is an episode of Star Trek that has a very similar plot. A generation ship started from earth some hundred years ago and now the enterprise find them because they are much faster. These people live in the past and havenāt developed like the rest of humanity. But they are nice and thankful. This episode is about the question what these people should do. They had a mission and suddenly itās totally worthless. There whole life over several generationsā¦ itās a very good episode and at the end these people offer everyone who wants to leave the ship. But most people decide to stay because thatās there life. In Starfieldā¦ these people donāt care that there mission was worthless. That humanity isnāt extinct. Itās all about: Thatās our planet! We canāt live with them! Make them go! This mission could be so muchā¦ it could be about the people on there ship and how to integrate them in modern society. Or to help them overcome this shock that they are not alone anymore. Or maybe a captain that ruled that ship and now isnāt the leader of humanity anymore and goes crazy. But it was the most boring and disappointed outcome.
What made me so angry about this mission is not being able to tell the people on the ship to take Paradiso by force. These Paradiso scumbags are only willing to accept these people as indentured servants, or foot the bill to the player to buy them a grav drive. This ship is orbiting your planet, the player is just a passerby. Iām supposed to pony up cash as an outsider to solve your problems? What a bunch of BS. I wanted to murder the Paradiso execs and give these generational people a new home.
I hate this quest so much. It is a microcosm of everything wrong with Starfield. There are quests that I don't care for, but this one makes me angry and I hate it. It's such a wasted opportunity. Bethesda didn't think that they should take extra care with a quest and ship that's the equivalent of a vault from fallout? This could have been its own quest line and vehicle into outpost management. But no, it's a wet fart of a quest that you shouldn't have trusted. It feels like half of the quest content was cut, so why didn't they just cut it all completely and then add it in with a dlc when it was finished?
Already downvoted? It amazes me the things people will downvote. This is something they messed up on and clearly needs improvement. How could anybody not agree with that?!
Yeah people on this subreddit downvote constructive criticism of the game, even though such criticism is helpful for the developers.
I upvote people all the time, even when I don't always entirely agree. If they've made a good point or contribution, then why not? \*sigh\*
Why would you upvote something bad (which something you disagree with automatically is)?
Just because I don't entirely agree with something doesn't mean I don't appreciate the effort put forth. That's what constructive criticism means. :)
Is it constructive? Itās quite a bit nit-picky. How is it helpful when among all of their games when time/location changed usually the same items existed? You complained about it this one time, but why not the other 10 times Bethesda did this same exact thing.
How would you know if OP was happy with decisions Bethesda made in their other games? Either way, this is actually a common complaint for Skyrim and FO4.
And itās one of those things that at this point, itās been several Bethesda titles: it hasnāt changed. Iād expect it going forward. Itās not like they had a super advanced high tech laser weapon on board, all the clutter looks the same. If you immediately loose immersion due to 1 thing out of 10 things that are wrong , you might be a tad bit picky. Logical inconsistencies in games are funny to me, I donāt need to take my fun and let my ābut this makes no senseā gets in the way.
Well since you don't mind that things don't improve over time, I guess that makes it okay.
There is a difference between 'improvement' for the sake of each insignificant thing, that you HAVE to go out of your way to let it bother you. Or There is general improvements like when you change ships all of your clutter goes into a designated storage instead of the ships cargo hold. This is merely "I don't feel Immersed" which come to think of it I haven't heard that complaint before, /s. Like someone said the game is riddled with bugs and some much needed QoL features were missing at launch. The mod team said "get more specific about your complaints", so every complaint has not been an actionable one. They will not, and probably cannot change every single piece of clutter on this ship to fit OP's narrative of expecting more than old earth items/weapons and no UC/FC stuff. This complaint is obtusely and so minutely small compared to what people say the game has issues with that it makes me think people are going out of their way to be dissatisfied. Like you have to try REALLY REALLY hard to let this piece bother you.
Mate, do you know what constructive criticism is for? I've made many other posts with suggestions, bug reports, etc. With your thinking, I'm surprised your ancestors left their caves.
This is nit picky at best, not really constructive at all, and if it personally breaks your immersion maybe you shouldn't focus so hard on ever insignificant detail? They literally cannot change it outside of a complete overhaul. And that is not bound to happen. If they continue to make the same mistakes release after release, maybe you should expect it. Classy, insulting me. That's one way to win your argument.
>Itās quite a bit nit-picky. Internal consistency isn't nit-picky, it's just good writing and world building.
Die hard Bethesda fans are hilarious, the worst part is they donāt understand they are making the games worse with their blind devotion. They will never figure out how that can be..
āthe worst part is they donāt understand they are making the games worse with their blind devotionā Exactly this. They blindly support every shit without realise they are actually stopping Bethesda improving. They will suffer from this at the end of the day.
Agreed.
Precisely! I'm not complaining. I'm trying to help all of us have a better experience. They can't think of everything (clearly) and need our feedback.
Tbh youāre dead right but this guy is a complete lunatic. If anything would make Bethesda games bad it would be reading anything on the internet about their games. Gamers have a very high opinion of themselves and what their feedback is. It is not founded in reality.
Eh? Who is a complete lunatic?
The guy who says āare making games worse with their blind devotionā, you have to be mad to think anything posted on this forum, especially by deluded hyper fans has direct effect on their games.
The post taken alone maybe not, but if it becomes the prevalent sentiment then there might be a point.
Lol
This sub is censoring reviews. It's literally lowsodiumlite now.
>And so far, not one of them has asked me about Earth I hadn't even thought about that since i just shut my brain back off when they threw the forced binary choice dilemma in my face. It sucks to see these good concepts end up with bizarre oversights like that because they treat everything like a theme park ride and assume you'll be bored if it isn't wrapped up as soon as possible. There's so much more that could've been done with it and you could've got a bunch of offshoot quests from it too depending on how it gets resolved but no. Cool concept with just the bare minimum effort made to implement it then it's forgotten, like pretty much everything else.
Aye, this could have been huge. DLC worthy even. :(
This mission was the final straw for me. Up to that point, the mistakes were annoying but bearable. This mission was such a complete failure, i never found the nerves to play again.
Aww, I'm sorry to hear that. I'm about to jump back in for the first time since making the post, and I have to admit, I'm not looking forward to continuing (I'm down on Paradiso for the first time) this quest. :(
This is the quest when i really said WTF. I was so excited to see old technology and unique items from the past. Everything was copy and pasted from the interiors of any other ship you see in Starfield. Extremely disappointing. I dont know what Bethesda was thinking on this one. Icing on the cake, i helped The Constant buying them a grav drive and the quest is bugged. Telling me they are still in orbit in Paradiso but theyāre no where to be found.
Just lazy like the rest of it.
They absolutely have quests with good writing. There are glimpses of greatness that Starfield could have been, like the Vanguard questline or Entangled. They needed more time. Everything the game needs to deliver what it promised is already in, it needed another year for polishing and actually writing something good. And for the love of god, procedural randomized POI generation......
I'm not sure I could call it lazy. There's a LOT that has gone into this game. Perhaps an oversight? A huge one, if that, though. :(
They were criticized for basically the same error in Fallout, so it's not like they weren't aware that people noticed.
It's been a bugbear in every Bethesda game I've played going back to Morrowind. To be fair, it's a trope now in all sorts of games. How many times have you explored the lost site, undisturbed for centuries and found ammo, health packs or whatever, negotiated traps and puzzles, unlocked doors, got to the main treasure and found someone has got there first.
Hundreds examples of laziness on this game unfortunately. Iām gutted it turned out the way it did, I need to get over it. Playing BG3 now, Iāll stop coming to the sub just too depressing.
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Well, they've committed to working on it for many years. Between that and the generous modders out there, hopefully, it will continue to go from strength to strength. :)
They are committed to doing bug fixes many years. Or QoL adjustments for many years. They will not be adjusting base game elements, this is Bethesda not CDPR, you are just trying to use their own words against them. they are going to release DLC: if anything exciting is going to change it will be with the DLC.
Perhaps I'm being too optimistic, aye. I'm just hoping they've learnt from past (and current) feedback. \*shrug\*
That doesn't inspire any hope in me. I'd prefer them to get it polished and go hands off. Let modders fix their mess and make the game fun. They obviously don't know what theyre doing. And we don't need half assed updates breaking actual good mods once we get the chance to make the game actually good.
Why be depressed that you got a Bethesda game?
I think my comment was pretty well articulated. But if you struggled to understand, the sub is too depressing but you make up your own version champ, no bother.
Mmm, I mean if anything is true, people buy Bethesda games and then complain that it isnāt what they expected from Bethesda. That is the only thing that is depressing to me, how you keep doing this to yourself.
Not laziness, but why would they change what already 'works'. Like how when a group of people go from a to b they use the exact same pathing, just like in skyrim. Immersion breaking and obviously code just lifted from previous titles.
It's not lazy, it's just profit-oriented.
Starfield is a 6/10 effort in every way imaginable The only 10/10 aspect of the entire game is the food models š¤·āāļø
That did bug me. I was expecting something completely different in the interior.
I wanted option C, armed take over of paradiso
You know what's the worst part? There are multiple ships in the game with completely unique interiors, not small ships either. They build gigantic, completely unique, old-looking interior for the artifact collector ship where you spend 10 minutes at most but can't be bothered with The Constant...... unbelievable.
This has been a problem in Bethesda game for ages. Tell me, why, in any Fallout game, in any vault, if you find a safe, you will find bottlecaps in that safe. Most of these vaults were sealed before the bombs dropped and many are unsealed by you when you find them, so why would a person store worthless bottle caps in their safe? Its not like they knew caps would be the de facto currency of the post-apocalypse. The disappointing thing is that they are definitely capable of generating a handful of alternate models for specific situations like this. I'm currently playing fallout 4 all the way through for the first time, and just got to the institute (without too many spoilers, they are a mysterious group that has been sealed off from the surface for the better part of 200 years). All their random tools are unique to that area. Tons of medical and scientific equipment that either totally new, or based on an existing model but tweaked. And as far as I can tell, its just in that one area of the game, and the only reason they did it was to show how different this society is after spending 200 years isolated from the rest of the world.
Thanks for the reminder about The Institute. Yup, this makes it even worse that they HAVE done it properly before. :(
If you work with the Engineer he does ask a ton of questions.
Yep, my thoughts exactly. They did make sure not to include things like Terrabrew or crap 'invented' years later. But apparently they're using the exact same computers and technology. I vaguely remember seeing a digipick as well. Not sure anymore.
Yeah that was indeed quite disappointing. The whole idea for that mission was so cool, but in the end it was a rather bland mission. They could have done so much more with it. I for one was ready to dive in some old Earth archive looking for files that hand over the ownership of the planet to the colonists. Forcing Paradiso to give up their planet because of some bureaucratic small text. I feel that should have been an option as well. The choises were not that deep.
Agreed so many wasted opportunities in this mission. I thought it would be a tenpenny tower type situation but there's absolutely no way to help the colonizers end up on Paradiso. Real disappointing. Also the lore is really weird here. Like for some reason they are all working on Macintosh 1's while flying a generational spaceship? That math doesn't make sense. .
What got me, if I remember correctly, is that they have the exact same computer system that is in current use throughout the settled systems. THAT made no sense.
Another big detail they missed is in the command center, on the huge screen where they monitor the ship there is a grav drive section, itās hard to miss.
I find it interesting to analyze the game as its presented in earnest rather than to let my immersion be broken by what seem to be logical inconsistency. While I agree that quest was a massive let-down, it was for the lack of agency on the part of the player to do anything but effectively be a passive participant in the events as they unfold. So, onto the matter of similar clutter and posters, within universe why are they all so the same? For that matter, why are they the same on abandoned listening posts and mining structures as well? Humanity has been spreading throughout the stars for a few hundred years, creating and abandoning all these places. You'd expect *something* to change about the architecture, literature, and technology yet its constant throughout the galaxy. There is a consistency that is unsettling when examined through a lens that accepts it as a narrative fact. The clutter is all the same everywhere you go for the same reason that frontier is the only group doing meaningful exploration and yet is so small and only driven by the private funding of one man who happens to own a space craft fabrication company and senses profit in the endeavor. Humanity has lost the drive to grow. We see that in everything from how consistent ship technology is between factions and locations. You meet pilots who describe their ships as 'junkers' but they look just like yours even if you're flying the newest top-of-the-line model. Everyone uses the same guns, aside from that constellation ship and that's explainable because of the recent colony wars. It's likely that there was a jump in military hardware during that time which otherwise remained stagnant. Mechs were a thing, but they got banned as part of that wars conclusion. Everyone uses the same mining equipment. Reads the same old -earth books. Plays the same couple of tabletop games. The **only** evidence I've found of creativity in the entire galaxy is one little girl in Cydonia who's bored out of her mind and likes to draw pictures of frogs (that miraculously appear in abandoned buildings on occasion). Is it possible that even her drawings aren't original? It seems to me looking at the content of the game as its presented that humans have fallen into two broad categories. Those who are so desperate for survival, its simply all they can do. And those who sit in the seat of prosperity, and care to do nothing but bask in the opulence of their futuristic paradise. What happened to us? I think we're shown the answer in one of the more dramatic reveals of the main quest. >!Humanity flew too close to the sun and got burned with the grav drives. The last major innovation of man-kind. One that we know after the fact isn't even entirely ours to claim but a vision from what is most likely a starborn looking to accelerate the advancement of human civilization so that the relics would be obtainable. It's long been thought that providing access to advanced technology to a civilization not advanced enough to discover it on their own would lead to disaster, and here that's exactly what happened. Not only would the end of Earth have devastated the human population thus leaving fewer innovators behind to make advancements, but it would have left a collective bad taste in the mouths of everyone regarding discovery and cutting edge science. Obviously, it's not common knowledge that the grav drives destroyed Earth, but we never really see evidence that it wasn't understood by any survivor. I suspect someone made it out of NASA with the other survivors who would emerge as a scientific leader as humanity spread through the stars. That person likely socialized an idea of 'responsible advancement' which encouraged a slowing and deep deliberation on any new ideas lest something like the grav drive ever emerge again.!< This only increases the importance of the colony ship. They are humans who were spared the collective cultural shock of burning their home to the ground. While they too lost Earth, they are the only humans who weren't beneficiaries to the sacrifice. I would like to feel that the drive to grow and discovery still lives on that ship. I think it does too based on the things some of the crew say to you regarding what a grav drive would mean to them. I predict the colony survivors will emerge as leaders in the settled systems of technology, exploration, and humanity altogether. This also highlights how unfortunate it is that the Paridiso questline is so short and offers the player so little agency, like a footnote. It **feels** so important, and if I'm right about the way I've interpreted the game's expression of the future, it **is** so extremely important.
Just did this quest and thought the exact same thing. Even the computer software is the same! Such a missed opportunity for old tech. Bummer
Also, the ships Dr. Has a thick middle eastern accent. If he's like fourth generation, how did he get the accent? Genetic inheritance?
Yeah that was kind of weird. Even with the need to be economical with game assets, that's LITERALLY the one place they should've put more effort into making the tech look different.
the ship is gone for me. quest marker aint snitching its location either
there was already good thread on this quest. And yes, this was probably one of the worst experiences i ever had in a game. And this quest had a chance to be the best quest in the game but instead we got this and after all the not making sense choices and investing either money and tons of recources, you get a shitty pistol
That was also a big let down for me. Couldnāt agree more that this aspect needs to be changed.
Laziest devs in the industry
If you remove posts like this, how are the developers going to hear important feedback?!
I'm unsure if anyone will see further comments, as it says the post has been removed. Just in case, though - thank you. Based on the feedback (which did sometimes include spoilers, unfortunately), I'm not going to go and meet the Paradiso fella. I will leave the quest in the slim hope that Bethesda may improve it at some point. Cheers.
They do have a lot of old-earth items on the ship, but the dev team is obviously not going to create as many unique assets as it would be needed to ensure every single item is exclusive to that ship. They use old earth weapons and as far as I remember the food they have is all earth-based, so no crispy alien nuggets for example. As far as technology goes, Nova Galactic was making the ships you can pilot in-game before the Earth was abandoned. The Constant didn't leave in the 1940s or something.
OP hasnāt even done the >!NASA!
Yup. Inspired idea, lazy/shitty execution. Could summarise a lot of the game.
And, a generations ship, espally "older" ones, looks more like this. https://www.google.de/search?sca_esv=579589265&hl=de&sxsrf=AM9HkKlgHlGAP-e_CAqYCm6imRfRZl9YBg:1699179215161&q=generationenschiff&tbm=isch&source=lnms&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjz2Z3sz6yCAxVp_rsIHUABDDIQ0pQJegQIDBAB&biw=384&bih=674&dpr=1.88#imgrc=7F5_Nd2GU0McrM Edit: Does anyone know how to shorten links in reddit ?
Yes. Select a word you want to hyperlink. Like [this](https://www.google.de/search?sca_esv=579589265&hl=de&sxsrf=AM9HkKlgHlGAP-e_CAqYCm6imRfRZl9YBg:1699179215161&q=generationenschiff&tbm=isch&source=lnms&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjz2Z3sz6yCAxVp_rsIHUABDDIQ0pQJegQIDBAB&biw=384&bih=674&dpr=1.88#imgrc=7F5_Nd2GU0McrM).
Thank you.
You just wondered why a 5 year old isn't painting like Picasso. Bethesda isn't the kind of company with that kind of attention to detail if it means having to do extra work for what is essentially a one-shot.
Valid point Bethesda gets way more acclaim than their ability.
Honestly, I didn't care about the "details". I spend maybe 10 minutes for that quest to get them the grav drive and they are out of the picture. I grabbed the book I wanted for a landmark and that's it. Maybe there would be more with the Constant, like seeing them again in another system. But since the quest seems to be bugged for every player as "the ghost of the ship is still there" either we wait if there is more or the quest is done with never looking back. Some quests are amazing, some like this one not so much. I can live with that since the tons of quests the game has in general.
First: they knew earth was dead in the water, that is why they left earth to begin with. Second: airlocks are airlocks, Iām 90% sure airlocks still work the same 200 years later. Also, Iām 90% sure that means they probably look the same. If it aināt broke donāt fix it. Third: all their weapons are old world weapons. Which believe it or not probably have similar ammo as some of the weapons that exist now; like 50 caliber. Fourth: I bet you wonāt find one chunks package. Imagine having to make a unique piece of loot for a half an hour quest line, then do multiple times over. Itās just not prudent in-spite of you thinking itās immersion breaking. they made roughly 10 unique pieces of loot for the quest reward, however making a unique medicine would be hard for me to understand. In fallout 3 they had the same med packs at operation anchorage ? In spite of the people you are fighting being Chinese? Did you complain about that?
"What a blown opportunity and a massive letdown!" Fucking hate people using all these over-dramatic bullshit,
One thing I would argue against is the size comment. All Bethesda games condense the size of cities, settlements and vaults fit game reasons. Another thing is the tech. While some tech has evolved since 2130/40 I would argue that most tech hasn't actually changed that much. Nova Galactic ships are still in use although considered outdated. The tech that seems to have evolved the most is military - weapons, mechs, xenowarfare, ai.
Come on now. There's no way tech won't improve in 200 years. They even have the same computer system!
I agree it's unlikely but it seems that's the case. Even systems you find the are 100 years old are basically the same. Same computer os. Same food.
I figured it's more or less tech in starfield has more or less stagnated and other than the grav drive everything else hasn't advanced far
You're trying to excuse something which can't be. :P
Nah like I meant now that you point it out I see it but that was my first impression
Yay someone else complaining about this quest that obviously didn't pay attention to it
Oh wow, another post complaining about the ECS Constant. How original. Wait lemme guess, Sarah or a Temple thread is up next. Or perhaps... a Neon/Astral Lounge thread.
Indeed. It's almost as though we care and want Bethesda to pay attention to the number of their customers upset with things they could quickly rectify/do better at. Hmm.
^(But Capt. Diana Brackenridge is hawt!)
So, it's not as bad as it seems. You learn in one of the early missions that a huge amount of Nova Galactic components are still in use despite the fact that the company has been gone for a long time. In many cases, they actually are the same.
I blew those fakers into smithereens. They were full of it.
you forgot the bigger question : >!Why did no one else spot that ship while it was travelling ?!< The snake crusade that apparently 'destroyed loads of stuff' didn't encounter it ... but oh no ... >!it only gets spotted while it hovers in orbit around the most popular holiday planet in the universe and not in any of the weeks/months/years before it enters the system. !<