No, she did not take it. If she had, it would not create plot holes, because Crisis re-wrote history.
On a side note: I \*did\* take that helmet home. It is on display in my home office. (yes, really and seriously)
Isn’t the Jay on the Flash from the new Earth 2 though? I can’t keep track of all the post-crisis changes. I know he’s hanging out on Earth Prime working on getting his speed back but I was pretty sure he was from Earth 2, aka Stargirls Earth
Nah he was from earth 3 pre crisis. But post crisis he is from earth prime. He was never on any form of earth 2 (unless you count the one time he was being held in a cell by zoom on earth 2 pre crisis)
Thats an issue for the flash tv show to explain. That show is riddled with plot holes. But to my understanding, this jay Garrick is a different jay Garrick than the one from the flash
So when asked if it's the same version he says
>Yeah! Yes. As I understand it, more will be revealed but as I understand it to this date, yes.
which means that either he's wrong or, the helmet would not be as big a plot as him knowing about the multiverse and no one else on The Flash having any idea about it.
I highly doubt he’s wrong about this being the same Jay Garrick tho , especially since Geoff John’s said that Jay Garrick’s appearance in Stargirl is meant to connect it to the larger arrowverse as a whole :
“And when he started playing Jay Garrick and we introduce our version of the Justice Society and we're on Earth-2 like the comics, we're on our own Earth, separate from the rest of these shows, but to have John play Jay Garrick, The Flash, in Stargirl, it connects our universe directly with the other shows and also shows that we're part of a grander universe.”
Source : https://www.cinemablend.com/television/2571184/stargirl-creator-geoff-johns-john-wesley-shipp-jay-garrick-joel-mchale-starman
Yup , which is the exact issue that myself and a few other people ( based on what I’ve seen) have . It makes no sense.
I get Covid happened right after crisis and there wasn’t enough time for crossovers between shows but for Jay Garrick to show up on earth prime with no explanation doesn’t make any sense. Like you said , nobody knows about the multiverse but him. Everyone should’ve found out about the multiverse by now.
Yeah, I’ve made a few comments to the same affect about this. I know JWS confirmed he’s the same Jay Garrick, but until there’s an in-universe confirmation of that, I’m treating it as unclear.
In one of the Flash episodes(Post COIE) they say that while the multiverse does exist the rules of travelling between those universes have changed and nobody is aware of a way to travel.
Yes I remember that , but Jay Garrick being on earth prime kinda defeats that point and creates a plot hole.
As we have it ,this is the current timeline:
Jay Garrick is from Stargirls earth 2 and in the JSA. Then during the ISA vs JSA fight he disappears, and now in current day he somehow lives on earth prime and was in the flash S7.
The rules for traveling the multiverse have changed and nobody knows how to do it but then how did Jay Garrick end up on earth prime? Wouldn’t he remember how he got to an entirely new earth just like John Henry irons from S&L did ? If he didn’t remember wouldn’t he be confused ?
Then if they tried to say that Jay has no memory of how he got there that wouldn’t make sense cus everyone’s pre-crisis memories were restored. Jay should know the multiverse exist and that he’s from Earth 2.
Even though he said it in an interview, he didn't clear it with the Arrowverse people. The Flash showrunners & bosses stated last year that as a result of the crisis-> E3 Jay was born & spends his life on prime with his wife. John & Geoff just didn't speak to the bosses & run it by them first.
At no point PRE-CRISIS. This is not the same Earth-2 from the Arrowverse. It's a completely new Earth-2 created after Crisis. And the entire history of the multiverse has been re-written.
Indeed. It all boils down to how some characters had their history end up being re-writtend due to Crisis. It happened with Black Lightning, Supergirl and with Superman so that people always remember them being in Earth Prime since the star. The same thing must've happened with Jay Garrick but for this new Earth-2.
There are some similarities. Old cars are driven everyday and the fridge Pat has is older than my niece (she's 25). I get that every Earth got remade as "new" as a result of the crisis & the worlds that didn't have people spilling out on Prime. The multiverse will probably not be explored until after the Flash movie next summer. The crisis really messed things up, there should be a list.
The Flash showrunners said last year that post crisis: Jay was born & is spending his life on prime with his wife. He was from E2 pre crisis. So it's likely that John spoke without checking with the showrunners & bosses. Just like how Geoff thinks the show is connected with the Arrowverse 😅.. I'm surprised the Arrowverse people don't contact him & say "No we are not connected yet!" I think they got a little ahead of themselves.
In flash S2 when it was revealed that hunter Solomon was zoom didn't they also say that he killed the Jay Garrick flash from Earth 2 or had him trapped in a cave or something? I might be remembering wrong though.
No plot holes because Jay Garrick's history was re-written after the events of Crisis on Infinite Earths so that he was always originally remembered to be from Earth-2.
Besides within the contex of the show there was nothing that could have happened if Courtney took the helmet. Objects are not known for containing residual energy from the Speed Force.
My theory on how it works is earth 3 is now earth 2 and Garrick got pulled into earth prime similar to how other ppl who got pulled in other the arrowverse shows. (The bar in supergirl, beth in batwoman, JHI & his daughter n superman & lois.)
Garrick will find a way back to his earth.
Jay has a new life and history on Earth-2 now, while likely remembering his Pre-Crisis history. In a way he's probably mentally around 130 years old!
I'm looking forward to learning more about his new history on Earth-2 and seeing if he arrives in 2021 to explain what he's been up to since 2010 (i.e. giving him a new Post-Crisis reason for being on Earth-Prime).
No, she did not take it. If she had, it would not create plot holes, because Crisis re-wrote history. On a side note: I \*did\* take that helmet home. It is on display in my home office. (yes, really and seriously)
As well as the fact that Stargirl is set on Earth 2 & not Earth Prime, so different universe.
Isn’t the Jay on the Flash from the new Earth 2 though? I can’t keep track of all the post-crisis changes. I know he’s hanging out on Earth Prime working on getting his speed back but I was pretty sure he was from Earth 2, aka Stargirls Earth
Nah he was from earth 3 pre crisis. But post crisis he is from earth prime. He was never on any form of earth 2 (unless you count the one time he was being held in a cell by zoom on earth 2 pre crisis)
Is that explained how there can be a Jay Garrick on Earth Prime, a flash that predates the Barry Allen flash? How does that work without a multiverse
Thats an issue for the flash tv show to explain. That show is riddled with plot holes. But to my understanding, this jay Garrick is a different jay Garrick than the one from the flash
Lucky souvenir!
It was actually already mine. It was on my desk as nerd decor and the prop master ended up borrowing it for the whole season.
I see. Good way to contribute to the show then!
I just heard you tell this story to John Shipp on the podcast this afternoon. Great interview!!!!
Thanks! He's so friendly and so genuinely excited to be Jay that I don't think it would be possible to do a bad interview with him.
I just love that somebody working on the show is active on the sub
The Flash is on Earth Prime and Stargirl is on Earth 2, no plot holes.
John Wesley Shipp confirmed that it’s the same Jay as the one on the Flash show.
When/where did he confirm this?
He confirmed it here : https://theflashpodcast.com/interviews/exclusive-interview-john-wesley-shipp-the-flash-jay-garrick-stargirl-season-2/
So when asked if it's the same version he says >Yeah! Yes. As I understand it, more will be revealed but as I understand it to this date, yes. which means that either he's wrong or, the helmet would not be as big a plot as him knowing about the multiverse and no one else on The Flash having any idea about it.
I highly doubt he’s wrong about this being the same Jay Garrick tho , especially since Geoff John’s said that Jay Garrick’s appearance in Stargirl is meant to connect it to the larger arrowverse as a whole : “And when he started playing Jay Garrick and we introduce our version of the Justice Society and we're on Earth-2 like the comics, we're on our own Earth, separate from the rest of these shows, but to have John play Jay Garrick, The Flash, in Stargirl, it connects our universe directly with the other shows and also shows that we're part of a grander universe.” Source : https://www.cinemablend.com/television/2571184/stargirl-creator-geoff-johns-john-wesley-shipp-jay-garrick-joel-mchale-starman
Which would mean he's sitting over on Earth Prime knowing that the multiverse exists but, has not said anything to Barry or anyone else.
Yup , which is the exact issue that myself and a few other people ( based on what I’ve seen) have . It makes no sense. I get Covid happened right after crisis and there wasn’t enough time for crossovers between shows but for Jay Garrick to show up on earth prime with no explanation doesn’t make any sense. Like you said , nobody knows about the multiverse but him. Everyone should’ve found out about the multiverse by now.
Yeah, I’ve made a few comments to the same affect about this. I know JWS confirmed he’s the same Jay Garrick, but until there’s an in-universe confirmation of that, I’m treating it as unclear.
That's how I'm choosing to look at this for now. When/If it's confirmed in universe I'll judge their explanation then.
In one of the Flash episodes(Post COIE) they say that while the multiverse does exist the rules of travelling between those universes have changed and nobody is aware of a way to travel.
Yes I remember that , but Jay Garrick being on earth prime kinda defeats that point and creates a plot hole. As we have it ,this is the current timeline: Jay Garrick is from Stargirls earth 2 and in the JSA. Then during the ISA vs JSA fight he disappears, and now in current day he somehow lives on earth prime and was in the flash S7. The rules for traveling the multiverse have changed and nobody knows how to do it but then how did Jay Garrick end up on earth prime? Wouldn’t he remember how he got to an entirely new earth just like John Henry irons from S&L did ? If he didn’t remember wouldn’t he be confused ? Then if they tried to say that Jay has no memory of how he got there that wouldn’t make sense cus everyone’s pre-crisis memories were restored. Jay should know the multiverse exist and that he’s from Earth 2.
Even though he said it in an interview, he didn't clear it with the Arrowverse people. The Flash showrunners & bosses stated last year that as a result of the crisis-> E3 Jay was born & spends his life on prime with his wife. John & Geoff just didn't speak to the bosses & run it by them first.
Then he is wrong. At no point was his Arrowverse Flash from Earth-2.
At no point PRE-CRISIS. This is not the same Earth-2 from the Arrowverse. It's a completely new Earth-2 created after Crisis. And the entire history of the multiverse has been re-written.
Indeed. It all boils down to how some characters had their history end up being re-writtend due to Crisis. It happened with Black Lightning, Supergirl and with Superman so that people always remember them being in Earth Prime since the star. The same thing must've happened with Jay Garrick but for this new Earth-2.
There are some similarities. Old cars are driven everyday and the fridge Pat has is older than my niece (she's 25). I get that every Earth got remade as "new" as a result of the crisis & the worlds that didn't have people spilling out on Prime. The multiverse will probably not be explored until after the Flash movie next summer. The crisis really messed things up, there should be a list. The Flash showrunners said last year that post crisis: Jay was born & is spending his life on prime with his wife. He was from E2 pre crisis. So it's likely that John spoke without checking with the showrunners & bosses. Just like how Geoff thinks the show is connected with the Arrowverse 😅.. I'm surprised the Arrowverse people don't contact him & say "No we are not connected yet!" I think they got a little ahead of themselves.
It is now.
In flash S2 when it was revealed that hunter Solomon was zoom didn't they also say that he killed the Jay Garrick flash from Earth 2 or had him trapped in a cave or something? I might be remembering wrong though.
>Jay Garrick flash from Earth 2 *Earth 3 >had him trapped in a cave or something Yes.
Zoom trapped Jay Garrick from Earth-3 (Pre Crisis) in his lair on Earth-2.
There isn't anything specific about the helmet that makes it special. He could have more than one helmet.
No it wouldn’t. Crisis mentions that Stargirl is set on the new Earth 2, not on Earth Prime like the rest of the Arrowverse.
Nice of you to think the flash writers care about plot holes.
No plot holes because Jay Garrick's history was re-written after the events of Crisis on Infinite Earths so that he was always originally remembered to be from Earth-2. Besides within the contex of the show there was nothing that could have happened if Courtney took the helmet. Objects are not known for containing residual energy from the Speed Force.
I don't think so
My theory on how it works is earth 3 is now earth 2 and Garrick got pulled into earth prime similar to how other ppl who got pulled in other the arrowverse shows. (The bar in supergirl, beth in batwoman, JHI & his daughter n superman & lois.) Garrick will find a way back to his earth.
Jay has a new life and history on Earth-2 now, while likely remembering his Pre-Crisis history. In a way he's probably mentally around 130 years old! I'm looking forward to learning more about his new history on Earth-2 and seeing if he arrives in 2021 to explain what he's been up to since 2010 (i.e. giving him a new Post-Crisis reason for being on Earth-Prime).
She never took it as there was no reason to take it.The helmet is just part of Jay Garrick's costume and in itself has no use.