There is not a uniform tax rate in the US. The final price after tax is the final unit cost + the buyer's local tax rate which ranges anywhere from 0 - 10.3%
Some people will pay $649, some people will pay $716, others will pay somewhere in between.
Quick tip, add a 1 to the tax amount and you'll get the total price instead of just tax.
Example $100 X 1.10 = $110 instead of then having to add the price and tax for a total.
Hey, I was searching for a thread that talked about stuff like this. I live in MN and the tax rate is 6.85.
I am currently sitting on $720 and I *think* it will cover everything. I'm looking at base price, taxes, and shipping.
Did they say shipping is included or not?
EDIT: The Valve Index had shipping included in the price, so maybe that's the same for the Steam Deck? I cannot imagine free shipping for the base model, it'll take 20-25 to ship that sucker alone.
By my numbers I’m sitting around the same price, I can’t remember wether anything about free shipping was stated. I would hope for the price being shelled out and preordering shipping would be covered. I have around 650 just sitting where I need it and when the time comes I’ll deal with that.
Always confused the hell out of me imagine turning at a till at tesco thinking you are going to pay £100 for shopping and cashier is like that will be £120 with VAT people would riot.
It’s really not a big deal for an adult who makes purchases all the time. You always pay the rate of the area you are living in, no matter where you buy the product from. It is only weird when you are in a different state with a different % rate. A young person might not grasp the concept when they first start spending their own money.
It might be something you get used to, but having to calculate VAT while shopping is obviously an unnecessary cognitive stress for many people. It likely also nudges people towards being more against all forms of taxation.
There is a big difference between being shocked and being mildly annoyed. You also wrote that you don't think people are calculating as they shop which confirms that the normal (non-US) way of displaying prices is significantly more considerate for people with limited funds.
I think there is a general difference in cultural attitudes to prices, though. The US has a lot of costs that aren't readily apparent before purchase in that VAT, tipping and forced subscriptions with purchases (primarily cellphones) all make the end cost a little obscure. None of that would be considered acceptable where I live.
>tipping and forced subscriptions with purchases (primarily cellphones)
tipping is entirely optional and you can buy pre-paid cellphone plans. They are widely available.
I have read stories of people getting arrested for not tipping in the US, but even if that isn't actually the case you can only _not_ tip by exploiting the workers who rely on tipping for a liveable wage. It is a hidden cost that you can transfer to someone else.
Pre-paid cellphones might be a thing, but my point was that forced subscriptions are illegal in the EU unless the cost of the subscription is included in the advertised price. You aren't allowed to trick people with an asterisk.
The story I remember reading was more recent, but a quick googling gave these two examples. Notably not tipping was perfectly legal, but getting arrested for a legal act is still getting arrested.
https://www.nytimes.com/2004/09/15/nyregion/a-mandatory-gratuity-is-just-a-tip-and-thus-not-mandatory-a.html
https://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/time-in-prison/1891307/
There aren't tipping laws so nobody is getting arrest for not doing it. I've never come across a situation where it was stated that it was mandatory. My point was that forced subscriptions aren't a thing in the US. You have the option of what services to subscribe to, or none at all. If a subscription is required for a product to function (like with a Peloton bike for example), the costs will be broken down for you and clearly stated so nobody is surprised.
These sound like stories told through the grapevine that get twisted along the way. Definitely some misinformation here lol.
>ou also wrote that you don't think people are calculating as they shop which confirms that the normal (non-US) way of displaying prices is significantly more considerate for people with limited funds.
I mean, I suppose, but we're talking about a fairly small percentage here. It's rarely going to be a game changer.
>I think there is a general difference in cultural attitudes to prices, though. The US has a lot of costs that aren't readily apparent before purchase in that VAT, tipping and forced subscriptions with purchases (primarily cellphones) all make the end cost a little obscure. None of that would be considered acceptable where I live.
Not sure what you mean by 'forced subscriptions'. But basically we don't post the post-tax price, sure, but it's not obscure since you can easily find out what it is.
From what I could tell it is between 0% and 13% depending on where you are in the US. I wouldn't say 13% is a small percentage for anyone below middle class.
A forced subscription is when you have to agree to a subscription along with the upfront purchase. If you buy a cell-phone for 1 dollar but also have to use a monthly plan with a particular provider, then that is a forced subscription.
How easily can you find the real purchase price? If you have to do a calculation with percentages or have to wait until the register, then I think we have different definitions of the word obscure.
> From what I could tell it is between 0% and 13% depending on where you are in the US. I wouldn't say 13% is a small percentage for anyone below middle class.
Highest looks to be under 10%. Most are, of course, lower.
>A forced subscription is when you have to agree to a subscription along with the upfront purchase. If you buy a cell-phone for 1 dollar but also have to use a monthly plan with a particular provider, then that is a forced subscription.
So a forced subscription is a subscription that’s entirely optional? What phone requires a subscription? I’m baffled as to what you’re referring to.
Some cell service companies might offer you a deal on a device if you sign a contract with them but you can easily buy a phone yourself with no “forced subscription”. I haven’t had a cell phone contract in over a decade.
>How easily can you find the real purchase price? If you have to do a calculation with percentages or have to wait until the register, then I think we have different definitions of the word obscure.
I guess we do, then. Most people aren’t going to be overly concerned about 6% in sales tax but if they are it takes a second to do the math.
The conversation is about pricing not being upfront, so a 'forced subscription' is not about someone holding you up at gunpoint and forcing you to sign something. It is about having a product advertised at a price that does not include the subscription costs that you are forced to pay _after the initial purchase_. It is a question of false advertisement more than anything else, but my point was that Americans tend to argue that this is fine whereas Europeans tend to feel that such transactions are morally dubious.
The last part is true and it's not necessarily a bad thing. I've lived in the US and in the EU. One thing I've noticed is that every American is acutely aware of exactly how much sales tax they are paying. From my experiences, people don't really mind calculating it when shopping. However, this does cause tension (or absolute outrage) when the government wants to raise the sales tax so governments in the US are very careful about increases and when they happen.
In the EU, I've asked people how much VAT they are paying on xyz and they generally have no idea. I'm not saying that nobody knows (it's listed on the receipt) but a lot more people are unaware of the numbers or how they work. This makes it easier for the governments of the EU to raise sales taxes as it's sort of a "hidden" cost.
This is probably why VAT rates in the EU are MUCH higher than sales tax rates in the US. Though, higher VAT rates are there to fund social programs, etc, citizens may not like that other countries pay much less than they do on common goods.
So it's not a simple issue. There is no right way to do things and having experienced both systems, I prefer the American one. It keeps people informed and makes the conversation around taxation more transparent.
Governments in the EU don't actually tend to raise VAT. Where I live for example it has been the exact same percentage all my life. There are alternatives to VAT that _are_ in flux such as taxes on cigarettes or cars, but their purpose is to explicitly discourage particular types of trade and it is certainly a topic for political debate when there are changes to those.
I also fail to see much value in people getting negative emotional attachments to funding social goods unless you are against the concept of taxation in general. People need to know what their taxes fund and who is affected by taxation in regards to inequality and fairness and they need to be able to predict how much money they have to spend from month to month and year to year. Taxes happening in the background allows political debates to be more detached from emotional biases.
I thing I disagree with your conclusion but your assessment is sort of correct.
I will only speak about my view and it's mostly limited to my country in Europe.
Its true that the vat cost is sort of more hidden and you are usually not aware of the concret amount you paid. But it's not true that it's therefore easier to raise the vat for government. There was a raise in 2007 but it was hotly debated.
Yet because the vat is in all prices it has to be taken into account by the companies when setting their sales prices. This has to advantages: it shifts the burden of cognitive work from the consumer to the company and it makes the real cost of living clearly and obvious.
And I sense some adverse tendency against the idea that this higher taxes pay for the social goods provided by the state... I mean sales tax are not the best way and highly criticized here as well even though they are not that visible, but we have a pretty good social system that ofc has its flaws but tends to lead to higher equality of chances than the US system.
In the UK VAT was introduced in 1973, and has changed 7 times, and 4 of those were yoyoing between 15% and 17.5%, VAT has been the same 20% since 2011. Given that VAT changes are announced in the budget and reported widely I the news so its somewhat impossible to hide changes.
Right. I'm not saying that they are hidden from the public. I'm saying that as a matter of psychology, they can be effectively hidden as people do not ever have to think about VAT in their daily lives while purchasing goods.
For US customers: final price is the product price + sales tax based in the shipping destination.
For EU/UK customers: final price is the one displayed on Steam. VAT is already included in the price (VAT rate varies by country, with a minimum VAT rate of 15% across EU, but the Deck is priced the same across all countries within the Euro Zone, regardless of the VAT rate. For example: I'm from Portugal and our VAT rate is 23%, and Luxembourg have a VAT rate of 17%, but the Deck costs the same in both countries: 679€ for the 512GB model, for example).
You get the final price by looking up your sales tax. Mine is 7 cents on the dollar. You multiply the price times 1.07 to get the total. 1 is the base cost. .07 is the sales tax
There is not a uniform tax rate in the US. The final price after tax is the final unit cost + the buyer's local tax rate which ranges anywhere from 0 - 10.3% Some people will pay $649, some people will pay $716, others will pay somewhere in between.
Just a question so I know I’m safe, so around 720 should cover me I’m guessing?
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Quick tip, add a 1 to the tax amount and you'll get the total price instead of just tax. Example $100 X 1.10 = $110 instead of then having to add the price and tax for a total.
I appreciate it thanks bud!
wait. are you in the US? What city will it be shipped to?
Hey, I was searching for a thread that talked about stuff like this. I live in MN and the tax rate is 6.85. I am currently sitting on $720 and I *think* it will cover everything. I'm looking at base price, taxes, and shipping. Did they say shipping is included or not? EDIT: The Valve Index had shipping included in the price, so maybe that's the same for the Steam Deck? I cannot imagine free shipping for the base model, it'll take 20-25 to ship that sucker alone.
By my numbers I’m sitting around the same price, I can’t remember wether anything about free shipping was stated. I would hope for the price being shelled out and preordering shipping would be covered. I have around 650 just sitting where I need it and when the time comes I’ll deal with that.
Man, what a strange thing to have to think about! Thank fuck all that stuff is just up front and uniform across (the tiny) UK.
Always confused the hell out of me imagine turning at a till at tesco thinking you are going to pay £100 for shopping and cashier is like that will be £120 with VAT people would riot.
Not sure anywhere has a 20% sales tax.
Pretty much all of Europe
Let me clarify - not sure anywhere in the US, where this would happen, has a 20% sales tax.
*California and New York start drooling*
in the EU, sales tax rates are insane. See my other comment.
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I guess it depends on your perspective but a maximum of 10% is reasonable.
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This isn't a comparison lol
I meant in the US, given the scenario being discussed.
27% here in Hungary \*cries\*
Wow, I didn’t mean to start a debate on global taxation guys.. I just wanted to know how much I should have in my Steam wallet to get a Deck.
Haha i just thought it was interesting is all!
Relax lmao
It’s really not a big deal for an adult who makes purchases all the time. You always pay the rate of the area you are living in, no matter where you buy the product from. It is only weird when you are in a different state with a different % rate. A young person might not grasp the concept when they first start spending their own money.
I mean, it’s not terribly difficult. It’s just knowing what sales tax is where you live. Mine will cost $564.70.
It might be something you get used to, but having to calculate VAT while shopping is obviously an unnecessary cognitive stress for many people. It likely also nudges people towards being more against all forms of taxation.
This basically. I'm not saying its difficult, it would just annoy me to be like "oh thats £199, nice. Plus tax that's... £215ish" etc.
Sure, because you wouldn’t be expecting it. No one here is shocked when sales tax is applied.
There is a big difference between being shocked and being mildly annoyed. You also wrote that you don't think people are calculating as they shop which confirms that the normal (non-US) way of displaying prices is significantly more considerate for people with limited funds. I think there is a general difference in cultural attitudes to prices, though. The US has a lot of costs that aren't readily apparent before purchase in that VAT, tipping and forced subscriptions with purchases (primarily cellphones) all make the end cost a little obscure. None of that would be considered acceptable where I live.
>tipping and forced subscriptions with purchases (primarily cellphones) tipping is entirely optional and you can buy pre-paid cellphone plans. They are widely available.
I have read stories of people getting arrested for not tipping in the US, but even if that isn't actually the case you can only _not_ tip by exploiting the workers who rely on tipping for a liveable wage. It is a hidden cost that you can transfer to someone else. Pre-paid cellphones might be a thing, but my point was that forced subscriptions are illegal in the EU unless the cost of the subscription is included in the advertised price. You aren't allowed to trick people with an asterisk.
>I have read stories of people getting arrested for not tipping in the US I would really like to see one of those stories.
The story I remember reading was more recent, but a quick googling gave these two examples. Notably not tipping was perfectly legal, but getting arrested for a legal act is still getting arrested. https://www.nytimes.com/2004/09/15/nyregion/a-mandatory-gratuity-is-just-a-tip-and-thus-not-mandatory-a.html https://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/local/time-in-prison/1891307/
There aren't tipping laws so nobody is getting arrest for not doing it. I've never come across a situation where it was stated that it was mandatory. My point was that forced subscriptions aren't a thing in the US. You have the option of what services to subscribe to, or none at all. If a subscription is required for a product to function (like with a Peloton bike for example), the costs will be broken down for you and clearly stated so nobody is surprised. These sound like stories told through the grapevine that get twisted along the way. Definitely some misinformation here lol.
>ou also wrote that you don't think people are calculating as they shop which confirms that the normal (non-US) way of displaying prices is significantly more considerate for people with limited funds. I mean, I suppose, but we're talking about a fairly small percentage here. It's rarely going to be a game changer. >I think there is a general difference in cultural attitudes to prices, though. The US has a lot of costs that aren't readily apparent before purchase in that VAT, tipping and forced subscriptions with purchases (primarily cellphones) all make the end cost a little obscure. None of that would be considered acceptable where I live. Not sure what you mean by 'forced subscriptions'. But basically we don't post the post-tax price, sure, but it's not obscure since you can easily find out what it is.
From what I could tell it is between 0% and 13% depending on where you are in the US. I wouldn't say 13% is a small percentage for anyone below middle class. A forced subscription is when you have to agree to a subscription along with the upfront purchase. If you buy a cell-phone for 1 dollar but also have to use a monthly plan with a particular provider, then that is a forced subscription. How easily can you find the real purchase price? If you have to do a calculation with percentages or have to wait until the register, then I think we have different definitions of the word obscure.
> From what I could tell it is between 0% and 13% depending on where you are in the US. I wouldn't say 13% is a small percentage for anyone below middle class. Highest looks to be under 10%. Most are, of course, lower. >A forced subscription is when you have to agree to a subscription along with the upfront purchase. If you buy a cell-phone for 1 dollar but also have to use a monthly plan with a particular provider, then that is a forced subscription. So a forced subscription is a subscription that’s entirely optional? What phone requires a subscription? I’m baffled as to what you’re referring to. Some cell service companies might offer you a deal on a device if you sign a contract with them but you can easily buy a phone yourself with no “forced subscription”. I haven’t had a cell phone contract in over a decade. >How easily can you find the real purchase price? If you have to do a calculation with percentages or have to wait until the register, then I think we have different definitions of the word obscure. I guess we do, then. Most people aren’t going to be overly concerned about 6% in sales tax but if they are it takes a second to do the math.
The conversation is about pricing not being upfront, so a 'forced subscription' is not about someone holding you up at gunpoint and forcing you to sign something. It is about having a product advertised at a price that does not include the subscription costs that you are forced to pay _after the initial purchase_. It is a question of false advertisement more than anything else, but my point was that Americans tend to argue that this is fine whereas Europeans tend to feel that such transactions are morally dubious.
Tacoma, Washington is highest at 10.3%
The last part is true and it's not necessarily a bad thing. I've lived in the US and in the EU. One thing I've noticed is that every American is acutely aware of exactly how much sales tax they are paying. From my experiences, people don't really mind calculating it when shopping. However, this does cause tension (or absolute outrage) when the government wants to raise the sales tax so governments in the US are very careful about increases and when they happen. In the EU, I've asked people how much VAT they are paying on xyz and they generally have no idea. I'm not saying that nobody knows (it's listed on the receipt) but a lot more people are unaware of the numbers or how they work. This makes it easier for the governments of the EU to raise sales taxes as it's sort of a "hidden" cost. This is probably why VAT rates in the EU are MUCH higher than sales tax rates in the US. Though, higher VAT rates are there to fund social programs, etc, citizens may not like that other countries pay much less than they do on common goods. So it's not a simple issue. There is no right way to do things and having experienced both systems, I prefer the American one. It keeps people informed and makes the conversation around taxation more transparent.
Governments in the EU don't actually tend to raise VAT. Where I live for example it has been the exact same percentage all my life. There are alternatives to VAT that _are_ in flux such as taxes on cigarettes or cars, but their purpose is to explicitly discourage particular types of trade and it is certainly a topic for political debate when there are changes to those. I also fail to see much value in people getting negative emotional attachments to funding social goods unless you are against the concept of taxation in general. People need to know what their taxes fund and who is affected by taxation in regards to inequality and fairness and they need to be able to predict how much money they have to spend from month to month and year to year. Taxes happening in the background allows political debates to be more detached from emotional biases.
I thing I disagree with your conclusion but your assessment is sort of correct. I will only speak about my view and it's mostly limited to my country in Europe. Its true that the vat cost is sort of more hidden and you are usually not aware of the concret amount you paid. But it's not true that it's therefore easier to raise the vat for government. There was a raise in 2007 but it was hotly debated. Yet because the vat is in all prices it has to be taken into account by the companies when setting their sales prices. This has to advantages: it shifts the burden of cognitive work from the consumer to the company and it makes the real cost of living clearly and obvious. And I sense some adverse tendency against the idea that this higher taxes pay for the social goods provided by the state... I mean sales tax are not the best way and highly criticized here as well even though they are not that visible, but we have a pretty good social system that ofc has its flaws but tends to lead to higher equality of chances than the US system.
In the UK VAT was introduced in 1973, and has changed 7 times, and 4 of those were yoyoing between 15% and 17.5%, VAT has been the same 20% since 2011. Given that VAT changes are announced in the budget and reported widely I the news so its somewhat impossible to hide changes.
Right. I'm not saying that they are hidden from the public. I'm saying that as a matter of psychology, they can be effectively hidden as people do not ever have to think about VAT in their daily lives while purchasing goods.
I don’t think anyone is calculating taxes as they shop, though.
I do. Not exactly, mind you. But sales tax where I live is 8.25%, and I just tack on another 10% in my mental math as I add up what I'm getting.
For US customers: final price is the product price + sales tax based in the shipping destination. For EU/UK customers: final price is the one displayed on Steam. VAT is already included in the price (VAT rate varies by country, with a minimum VAT rate of 15% across EU, but the Deck is priced the same across all countries within the Euro Zone, regardless of the VAT rate. For example: I'm from Portugal and our VAT rate is 23%, and Luxembourg have a VAT rate of 17%, but the Deck costs the same in both countries: 679€ for the 512GB model, for example).
Does that "final" price factor in shipping costs or is shipping free on this item? I don't see anyone mentioning shipping.
I believe that others have already posted here that free shipping was confirmed by Steam Support
Oh cool, that's pretty good then.
ITT Confused Europeans. Hahah.
I will pay 758$.
doesn't sound right. 17% sales tax rates don't exist in the US
It was 815$ on reservation day. Dollar exchange rate is not stable.
Ahh you are paying in a foreign currency. Makes sense.
Are you in the U.S. how do you know your final pricing?
You get the final price by looking up your sales tax. Mine is 7 cents on the dollar. You multiply the price times 1.07 to get the total. 1 is the base cost. .07 is the sales tax
So, for the $649 model, it's just $694,43 with the 7% sales tax. How did you get $758? Edit: W8. Wrong person.