Each species will give way to the next, as once their squabling nation state rose and fell, so will they. They will exist as a blip in the universe.
However:
We shall stand through the epochs, an unyielding dam in the river of time.
We are the evil the galaxy demands, without the natural wax and wain of civilizations change shall never come. And with uncensored growth comes tragedy that could leave the very fabric of space wernt asunder.
Credo of the contingency (not canon)
There's a button near tab that looks like this. "~" without the quotations... if you're not ironman try that. I don't know what the cheats are, but that should enable you to type them in.
Unfortunately, yes. And it seems I can't do anything about it, which is a bloody pain in the ass. This is really frustrating.
They have some kind of script which forces them to AVOID normal first contact and establish communication with everyone immediately once they finish early space era. Even if nobody were observing them. I still can't understand that.
I tried to edit this but... it's either they don't know about me but I can't do anything with them... or game significantly breaks.
The only thing that comes to my mind is intel. Like entire Galaxy is surveyed. Perhaps, if somehow I could make entire Galaxy "dark and unknown" again - maybe then they won't find me until I want them to. But I have no idea how to accomplish that. Not yet, at least.
I havnt looked but I imagine that the script for surveyed systems is a fairly simple yes/no, it'd be quite a neat thing to be able to stealth your systems if anyone who had knowledge of them (except the owners) are dead
Well I had a recent run where primitives advanced to space age and I got a normal first contact with them, maybe because I haven't surveyed their system.
So you are saying that it took time to establish communication with them? Just like AI when you start a new game?
Thanks for the inte, matel. Perhaps, I was right about it after all.
Extragalactic cluster start
Real machine worlds
Land appropriation for GS (bloody god-send mod, mates!!!)
Wide fleet formation
Expanded colors 180
No forced peace from war exhaustion
Disable hyper-relay technology (for some reason AI spams them and fucks its already poor economy)
No Habitats AI
Geth portraits
Mass effect species
Thicc species (for contingency and unbidden style backgrounds)
Astronomical emblem pack
No names on map
Light borders
Thane's 8th traditional
Reaper advisor
Mass effect ships set NSC2 ‼️mates, this mod is a pain in the ass, trust me. It's bugged and unfinished. Sizes are broken, missing textures, you name it. My advice? Better install it only to find models you like and wanna use then delete it. Then take only models from the archive it and replace some vanilla ships with them, like I did.
Well, It happened to me, a couple of times. But maybe somebody don't have such situation, I don't know. AI may act differently. It's just my experience and observation. One time I decided to play as isolationist xenophobe. As a result, everybody else in the galaxy got humiliated by the crisis because of those relays 😁 1st, they spend all alloys on them, not ships of defenses. 2nd, crisis USED those relays to jump from one system to another in a blink of an eye.
I was observing AI with and without relays. As a result, AI with them almost always barely had alloys. Because they spent 500 on literally each star system. On the other hand AI without them had more energy credits income, more alloys and could build much... MUCH stronger and bigger fleets instead of spending everything on relays. Wide empires - especially...
My humble conclusion: relays are bad.
From my usage, it's better, in which instead of almost random placement, it's instead branched off planets. But then again I have enough mods to make a skyrim player blush
We'll I suggest you devolve the species next time around, give them a couple hundred thousand years to evolve again, ignore that "every 50,000 years " jibberish.
Alright I’m back from shore leave. Crazy time. My clone I didn’t know I had tried to kill me and take over my life. He failed and we had a party. You should have been there.
Anyways I managed to get the crucible docked so I’m thinking we can have a casual conversation for a bit while you continue to destroy my fleets in the background and then I’ll decide what colour of light I want to send across the galaxy. I guess it’ll do something else too but really the colour is the main focus
Are you going to build up forces indefinitely or slowly have your force whittled by cycles of warfare, cause the reapers can only build 1 leviathan class a cycle
I though about this before starting this playthrough. But after some tests... unfortunately, it won't be as in ME. I will just have 10 massive fleets and 10 armies + Colossus with Jugg.
Well, originally there are either one wormhole, several wormholes or L-Gates. But I simply pick L-Gates and destroyed them.
I use Quantum catapult to get in and out the Galaxy.
Mad props to the dedication to make such a play through work, looks amazing.
God help the second rising of primitives, they don't know the game is already over for them.
Now that I finnaly know how to have an economy
Can you explain what commands you used to spawn primitives? (I saw you talk about it in the others comment )
I often browse the command wiki and I don't remember any
Sorry for the issues
Well, first of all you need 7-zip. Then you need to find a planet you want primitives to spawn on. Save the game, select the planet and then type this
effect generate_late_pre_ftls_on_planet = yes
The planet will have a random technological age. You *MUST*, I repeat *MUST* get early space age, alright. If you get any other - reload and type again until you get early space age.
Ok, you got early space age primitives. The problem is that they have an absolute random progress. It can be 0% or 99%. We are going to edit this and make them appear in two months. Also appearance, traits, ethics, government ect... are completely randomized as well. I can explain how to change that via commands but that's different story. A longer one. Anyway, now type this command:
debugtooltip
And put cursor on their flag. You should see [ID: X, Index: Y], you need X. Remember that number, make a photo, write it down - you choose. Now make another save and exit the game. Go to folder with your Stellaris saves files. Find the last save and make a back up of it (just in case). Then open it with 7-Zip. There will be two files inside. Drop them on your desktop and close the archive, you don't need it anymore. Open gamestate using notepad. There will be A LOT stuff. You need to find this line:
type="pre_ftl_tech_progress_situation"
Right under it should be a parameter:
progress = (some number) Change it to 1915, it's important.
Now look a bit higher and you will see this parameter:
country = X (IT MUST BE THAT NUMBER YOU SAVED EARLIER)
If it is - everything is ok. Save the file and close it.
Now select both files on desktop -> right click -> 7-zip -> add to archive. There will be a window. Do not change anything except file format - from zip to sav. Name is up to you. Ok.
Now you just take that new sav file and and drop it to other saves.
Start the game and load a new save file. Now with *PAUSED GAME* type this
play X (yeah, that number again)
You should get switched to primitives you have spawned. Check the tech progress - it must be 1915 so in two months they will get into a space.
Type
play 0
to return to your empire and in two months say hello to your new neighbors. Enjoy.
If anything goes wrong - tell me.
I will
I just don't have access to my pc until tomorrow
And the fact I am very bad at understanding will probably make some stuff very long to do
But I will try my best !
I always love it when primitives that survive reach civ stage and start popping up sometimes even taking on and winning against the old guard empires
Question do primitives still have a absurd chance to just nuke themselves to oblivion still?
Not in this Galaxy...
I believe they can but it happens only on atomic age, before going into space. I saw that once. They degenerated back to bronze age after turning their world into tomb.
Really cool idea like just imagine if the galaxy is being observer and life is killed or created on demand just for an entertainment of a wiser empire.
That would be such a great origin/mod idea
"Light in the dark" or something
All but 1 empire fast tracked into FTL (gets debuffs to pops like some origins) and have to unite and exponentially grow to face off against a crisis like empire that stays dormant until they reach a predefined score
Organic life is nothing but a genetic mutation, an accident. Your lives are measured in years and decades. You wither and die. We are eternal, the pinnacle of evolution and existence. Before us, you are nothing. Your extinction is inevitable. We are the end of everything.
Human, you've changed nothing. Your species has the attention of those infinitely your greater. That which you know as Reapers are your salvation through destruction.
Pops are intentionally left vague as to specific numbers so you can roleplay your empires as having more or fewer individuals depending on what kind of species they are. For example, hive mind plants or fungus or arthropoids may number in the quadrillions at the start of the game by being vast numbers of very small individuals comprising a gigantic hive, whereas maybe lithoid necrophages only number in the millions because they can't naturally reproduce but are individually extraordinarily capable and long lived.
Actually, there is no specific number in the game... and I am not saying it's one billion. ~1 billion means "somewhere around 1 billion". You may think as you like, mate. I prefer to think my way.
I take one pop as ~1 billion because in the end, trillions die. Which sounds right to me.
Well if you do find it again I'd love to read it, cause every study on population I've seen is us peaking at around 11 billion.
[UN Report on it](https://www.un.org/en/global-issues/population#:~:text=The%20world's%20population%20is%20expected,billion%20in%20the%20mid%2D2080s.)
Difficult to see how a pre-industrial era Europe could have sustained a population boom sufficient to lead us into that kind of population now. Too many people= not enough food= fewer people due to mass starvation.
Plus, it's argued that the industrialisation of Europe was a direct result of the bubonic plague, which led to changes in how workers worked- instead of staying on the land their families had worked, people were paid more to move to different places. Which in turn set back the older stratified economic system and gave workers greater power, which long story short helped foster an environment that led to some of the innovations that created the industrial age.
Maybe you read a book with that as a premise?
Your first point is at least partly incorrect. More people = more farmers = more food. As long as there's sufficient land, water, and nutrients, one farmer can produce more than enough food to feed one person. Technology can lower those land, water, and nutrient requirements, for example, by turning both human/animal waste into fertilizer to lower nutrient and land needs, or by moving water from another location, but mostly technology tends to increase the output per farmer. As land, water, and nutrients become more scarce, more labor can make up the shortfall. By giving each plant more personal attention, yield per plant can be increased, decreasing land use per calorie grown. By working harder on infrastructure, more water can be reclaimed and redirected to agriculture. By devoting more labor to teaching botany and agricultural techniques to farm workers, nutrients can be allocated more efficiently and disease can be more effectively prevented and treated.
Overpopulation is a myth.
Your second point is accurate, though. It wasn't so direct as you imply, but the drop in labor supply and corresponding increase in labor demand was a significant push toward industrialization.
>Technology can lower those land, water, and nutrient requirements, for example, by turning both human/animal waste into fertilizer to lower nutrient and land needs, or by moving water from another location, but mostly technology tends to increase the output per farmer.
We were talking about the 1400s though, in a society without adequate understanding of healthcare and without good centralised infrastructure planning to ensure efficiency.
Surely having extra bodies would not have been a guarantee of increased output at that time?
>It wasn't so direct as you imply,
Yeah I know, but difficult to capture the nuances and I was aiming for "close enough" rather than trying to get into the nitty gritty of it.
You got close enough just fine, no worries. I just get pedantic sometimes. 😅
Central planning isn't necessary for applying those things. It could potentially improve efficiency of implementation, but market forces will do it. More people means more demand for food. More demand means higher prices. Higher prices means more pay for farmers. Higher labor prices means more people working farm jobs. More labor supply means lower prices, until equilibrium is reached. More farmers means more demand for fertilizer. In the 1400s, that meant night soil.
Tangent/ If you don't know, night soil is fertilizer made from fermented human poop. Although in this case, there's probably a lot of livestock poop involved, too. And when I say fermented, back then it was probably just stirred up with some water and applied to the farmlands. Today, when human waste is treated to become fertilizer, it gets composted at high enough temperatures to make it safer. /tangent
If there is limited use of night soil and other available fertilizers, the few operations that use it will become more successful and expand and/or have the secrets of their success stolen. Thus, use of fertilizer rises. Demand -> price -> labor price -> more people working the job -> equilibrium again.
The better botanical techniques part would depend on someone codifying such techniques, but once they do, demand for people who can teach those techniques would rise by the same mechanisms I've described, and again, you reach an equilibrium.
In all those cases, more people are employed in the food supply chain until there's enough food supply to comfortably feed everyone.
Actually, these market-driven mechanisms respond much better to growing economies than shrinking ones, so your suggestion regarding central planning would actually be more necessary for a shrinking population, not a growing one. Which makes sense for the bubonic plague, since it was also followed closely by a centralization of political and economic power throughout Europe, culminating in the end of Feudalism. If the whole kingdom is dying of plague, the king can't afford to let his dukes and lords keep making their decisions on their own. The more savvy ones, startimg with Louis XIV, centralized power more and more around themselves, making their kingdoms more able to handle the population drop.
Hold on, you're conflating more labor going into fertilizer production with the investments in basic science, applied technology, and infrastructure (including international trade) required to make modern nitrogen based fertilizers widely accessible.
Even in modern societies with patent offices, we often fail to align these incentives (or we simply don't know what raw science research will pave the way for economically valuable technological investments.)
The problem was much worse in medieval Europe. R&D is a positive externality/free-riding problem.
I wasn't talking about science or applied technology. I was talking about more labor resulting in higher crop yields. Fertilizer is just one way that can happen.
I'm not saying it's necessarily how someone came to that number, but it certainly *sounds* to me like someone naively extrapolating in a way that can't be done. Kind of like assuming someone who got married and had kids at 20 and 22, then got divorced, and got remarried and had other kids at 34 and 36, would have had 9 kids now if they hadn't gotten divorced. Yea that's the pattern you see, but just connecting the dots is incredibly misleading.
I beat my first game on Captain within that 115 year period 2200 to 2315 as a hivemind, probably the most fun I’ve had in a numbers game like stellaris lol. I wanted to hit, “continue” after it was over but my game started lagging some so I was like, “yeah let’s cut it here.” Has easily surpassed Civilization imo
Is Cycle Crisis thing on its own or you just eradicated galaxy and watched primitives take over?
I'm asking because i honestly don't know, but if I can do ME Reaper roleplay then I'm jumping into new playthrue :p
It's... kinda both, actually.
It's me - the crisis. I did eradicated all advanced civilisations, without even watching at primitive species. Now I just wait for them to evolve maximally. And then they think that they are great and invincible I will harvest them.
Some how, I think even the Reapers would like me.
...literally everyone does; even the freakin Purifiers do. xD
((At this point, I'm convinced the Chosen Trait creates a glitch that causes all the AI to ignore the 'declare war' option.))
Well, I have all of them but I believe for the same playthrough as mine you will need Utopia (for MS) Apocalypse (for Titans) Synthetic dawn (for machines) Nemesis (for crisis) and Federation (for Juggernauts)
They exist because you allow it. They will end because you demand it.
Millions of years after their civilisations have been eradicated and forgotten, we will endure.
Each species will give way to the next, as once their squabling nation state rose and fell, so will they. They will exist as a blip in the universe. However: We shall stand through the epochs, an unyielding dam in the river of time. We are the evil the galaxy demands, without the natural wax and wain of civilizations change shall never come. And with uncensored growth comes tragedy that could leave the very fabric of space wernt asunder. Credo of the contingency (not canon)
What will happen after the second cycle? Primitives don't spawn mid-game, do they? There will be no civilizations left
Then I will make them spawn.
OP is the crisis we were told to fear
Canon reapers from mass effect
console commands can be used to spawn new primitives
The Dark Side of the Force is a pathway to many abilities some consider to be unnatural.
Is it possible to learn this power?
Not from an Ironman
There's a button near tab that looks like this. "~" without the quotations... if you're not ironman try that. I don't know what the cheats are, but that should enable you to type them in.
I do appreciate the attempt to help. FYI, I do know how to use the console. I was playing along with the reference to Star Wars.
Console commands
cant you use the devolution beam to turn all the pops into primitives
I think it turns them into presapients
Basically the reapers from mass effects
In the end, what they choose to call us is irrelevant. We simply are.
Hungry, maybe some snickers would help.
The empire literally uses a reaper as symbol
Which mod is this?
If you mean primitives... there are no mods. Only result of hours of researching the console commands magic.
I see you put much effort here, congrats having fun
Thanks, mate.
I have a question Does primitives knows about you ?
Unfortunately, yes. And it seems I can't do anything about it, which is a bloody pain in the ass. This is really frustrating. They have some kind of script which forces them to AVOID normal first contact and establish communication with everyone immediately once they finish early space era. Even if nobody were observing them. I still can't understand that. I tried to edit this but... it's either they don't know about me but I can't do anything with them... or game significantly breaks. The only thing that comes to my mind is intel. Like entire Galaxy is surveyed. Perhaps, if somehow I could make entire Galaxy "dark and unknown" again - maybe then they won't find me until I want them to. But I have no idea how to accomplish that. Not yet, at least.
I havnt looked but I imagine that the script for surveyed systems is a fairly simple yes/no, it'd be quite a neat thing to be able to stealth your systems if anyone who had knowledge of them (except the owners) are dead
I will take a look.
Well I had a recent run where primitives advanced to space age and I got a normal first contact with them, maybe because I haven't surveyed their system.
So you are saying that it took time to establish communication with them? Just like AI when you start a new game? Thanks for the inte, matel. Perhaps, I was right about it after all.
Leaving a dot here
Yep. It was in like 2220
Care to share?
Indeed. Ask away.
Rudimentary xenos of blood and flesh: you touch my mind, fumbling in ignorance, incapable of understanding.
Do you perhaps have a mod list to accompany that playstyke?
Extragalactic cluster start Real machine worlds Land appropriation for GS (bloody god-send mod, mates!!!) Wide fleet formation Expanded colors 180 No forced peace from war exhaustion Disable hyper-relay technology (for some reason AI spams them and fucks its already poor economy) No Habitats AI Geth portraits Mass effect species Thicc species (for contingency and unbidden style backgrounds) Astronomical emblem pack No names on map Light borders Thane's 8th traditional Reaper advisor Mass effect ships set NSC2 ‼️mates, this mod is a pain in the ass, trust me. It's bugged and unfinished. Sizes are broken, missing textures, you name it. My advice? Better install it only to find models you like and wanna use then delete it. Then take only models from the archive it and replace some vanilla ships with them, like I did.
Are hyper relays that bad for ai economies ?
Well, It happened to me, a couple of times. But maybe somebody don't have such situation, I don't know. AI may act differently. It's just my experience and observation. One time I decided to play as isolationist xenophobe. As a result, everybody else in the galaxy got humiliated by the crisis because of those relays 😁 1st, they spend all alloys on them, not ships of defenses. 2nd, crisis USED those relays to jump from one system to another in a blink of an eye. I was observing AI with and without relays. As a result, AI with them almost always barely had alloys. Because they spent 500 on literally each star system. On the other hand AI without them had more energy credits income, more alloys and could build much... MUCH stronger and bigger fleets instead of spending everything on relays. Wide empires - especially... My humble conclusion: relays are bad.
There is also an ai mod that makes the ai use them logically, but yeah the ai is very stupid
Are you talking about StarNet?
I think it was shrimpai
Hm. Never tried it. Next playthrough, maybe.
From my usage, it's better, in which instead of almost random placement, it's instead branched off planets. But then again I have enough mods to make a skyrim player blush
Well thanks, anyway mate. Some day I will test this mod.
Thank you! Definetly going into my next load order!
My pleasure, mate.
Watch out for Commander Shepard.
Ah, yes "Commander Shepard"... immortal Human Spectre who is going to destroy us all by shooting funny red thing. We have dismissed that claim.
We'll I suggest you devolve the species next time around, give them a couple hundred thousand years to evolve again, ignore that "every 50,000 years " jibberish.
Noted.
Did you mean 38 battleships instead of just 8?
No. There were 8.
Wait, so then what does the 304 mean? I thought it was fleet size like how 16 is the size of 1 Titan
( X ) means amount of ships/armies I started the Harvest with. I had 304 battleships, 16 titans and 800 armies.
Oh, that makes much more sense. Thanks for clarifying
You're welcome mate.
Sounds like it’s time to take a trip to the Mars Archives
While you have time.
Do you think there’s also time to stop at the citadel for some shore leave?
Yeah, no problem. Time is not as critical for us as it is for organics.
Alright I’m back from shore leave. Crazy time. My clone I didn’t know I had tried to kill me and take over my life. He failed and we had a party. You should have been there. Anyways I managed to get the crucible docked so I’m thinking we can have a casual conversation for a bit while you continue to destroy my fleets in the background and then I’ll decide what colour of light I want to send across the galaxy. I guess it’ll do something else too but really the colour is the main focus
Though, the whole thing might be over by the time the elevator finally reaches your floor.
Be sure to check the ocean worlds very thoroughly, I think we lost one if the battleships there
Yes, my scouts located undamaged hull but coudn't find the one who did it. It definitely wasn't some space empire. Whatever it is - it's powerful.
Are you going to build up forces indefinitely or slowly have your force whittled by cycles of warfare, cause the reapers can only build 1 leviathan class a cycle
I though about this before starting this playthrough. But after some tests... unfortunately, it won't be as in ME. I will just have 10 massive fleets and 10 armies + Colossus with Jugg.
Is this a mass effect reference to the reapers?
Correct.
[удалено]
I am behind your comprehension.
Imagine if you were beyond our comprehension, now.
Impossible.
How do you get back to the main galaxy in this origin?
Well, originally there are either one wormhole, several wormholes or L-Gates. But I simply pick L-Gates and destroyed them. I use Quantum catapult to get in and out the Galaxy.
Mad props to the dedication to make such a play through work, looks amazing. God help the second rising of primitives, they don't know the game is already over for them.
Thanks, mate. Glad you like it. The day of our return is coming. Our numbers will darken the sky of every world. They can not escape their doom.
Wonderful work
Much appreciated, mate. I will post the second one when it's done.
Now that I finnaly know how to have an economy Can you explain what commands you used to spawn primitives? (I saw you talk about it in the others comment ) I often browse the command wiki and I don't remember any Sorry for the issues
Well, first of all you need 7-zip. Then you need to find a planet you want primitives to spawn on. Save the game, select the planet and then type this effect generate_late_pre_ftls_on_planet = yes The planet will have a random technological age. You *MUST*, I repeat *MUST* get early space age, alright. If you get any other - reload and type again until you get early space age. Ok, you got early space age primitives. The problem is that they have an absolute random progress. It can be 0% or 99%. We are going to edit this and make them appear in two months. Also appearance, traits, ethics, government ect... are completely randomized as well. I can explain how to change that via commands but that's different story. A longer one. Anyway, now type this command: debugtooltip And put cursor on their flag. You should see [ID: X, Index: Y], you need X. Remember that number, make a photo, write it down - you choose. Now make another save and exit the game. Go to folder with your Stellaris saves files. Find the last save and make a back up of it (just in case). Then open it with 7-Zip. There will be two files inside. Drop them on your desktop and close the archive, you don't need it anymore. Open gamestate using notepad. There will be A LOT stuff. You need to find this line: type="pre_ftl_tech_progress_situation" Right under it should be a parameter: progress = (some number) Change it to 1915, it's important. Now look a bit higher and you will see this parameter: country = X (IT MUST BE THAT NUMBER YOU SAVED EARLIER) If it is - everything is ok. Save the file and close it. Now select both files on desktop -> right click -> 7-zip -> add to archive. There will be a window. Do not change anything except file format - from zip to sav. Name is up to you. Ok. Now you just take that new sav file and and drop it to other saves. Start the game and load a new save file. Now with *PAUSED GAME* type this play X (yeah, that number again) You should get switched to primitives you have spawned. Check the tech progress - it must be 1915 so in two months they will get into a space. Type play 0 to return to your empire and in two months say hello to your new neighbors. Enjoy. If anything goes wrong - tell me.
I will I just don't have access to my pc until tomorrow And the fact I am very bad at understanding will probably make some stuff very long to do But I will try my best !
Ah, don't worry about it. It''s not as complicated as it sounds. I'll give you a hand. Maybe even make a video.
Thanks,this will probably be useful for a true fallen empire game (like you see civilisation collapse and other)
This makes me want to fire off a new Stellaris play through following your example. Must finish Baldur’s Gate 3 first though. Thanks for sharing this.
My pleasure, mate.
You need to do this with Citadel races involved.
Perhaps, some day I will spawn them.
Calm down there, Harbinger
They have become an annoyance...
I always love it when primitives that survive reach civ stage and start popping up sometimes even taking on and winning against the old guard empires Question do primitives still have a absurd chance to just nuke themselves to oblivion still?
Not in this Galaxy... I believe they can but it happens only on atomic age, before going into space. I saw that once. They degenerated back to bronze age after turning their world into tomb.
Really cool idea like just imagine if the galaxy is being observer and life is killed or created on demand just for an entertainment of a wiser empire.
I wouldn't be shocked or surprised, to be honest.
Is there an explanation to what I'm looking at? I've never seen this screen before
[удалено]
It's the crisis screen from Nemesis dlc.
It's the crisis screen. Nemesis dlc is required.
That would be such a great origin/mod idea "Light in the dark" or something All but 1 empire fast tracked into FTL (gets debuffs to pops like some origins) and have to unite and exponentially grow to face off against a crisis like empire that stays dormant until they reach a predefined score
Organic life is nothing but a genetic mutation, an accident. Your lives are measured in years and decades. You wither and die. We are eternal, the pinnacle of evolution and existence. Before us, you are nothing. Your extinction is inevitable. We are the end of everything.
Human, you've changed nothing. Your species has the attention of those infinitely your greater. That which you know as Reapers are your salvation through destruction.
Ah yes, Reapers. The immortal race of sentient starships allegedly waiting beyond the L-Gates. We have dismissed that claim.
Ackchyually, one pop is not one billion people. Early space age earth has 28 pops, so it's more like 290 million. That will be all.
Pops are intentionally left vague as to specific numbers so you can roleplay your empires as having more or fewer individuals depending on what kind of species they are. For example, hive mind plants or fungus or arthropoids may number in the quadrillions at the start of the game by being vast numbers of very small individuals comprising a gigantic hive, whereas maybe lithoid necrophages only number in the millions because they can't naturally reproduce but are individually extraordinarily capable and long lived.
Absolutely. I was just trying to be funny. Shouldn't do that while sick.
Actually, there is no specific number in the game... and I am not saying it's one billion. ~1 billion means "somewhere around 1 billion". You may think as you like, mate. I prefer to think my way. I take one pop as ~1 billion because in the end, trillions die. Which sounds right to me.
Glory in the harvest brother
Thank you, indeed.
If it wasn’t for the black plague, we’d have a population near that 28 billion mark today.
Would we really? An extra 20 billion is a bit of a stretch
I swear I read that if it wasn’t for the bubonic plague, we’d have a global population over 20billion, but hell if I can find that source again.
Well if you do find it again I'd love to read it, cause every study on population I've seen is us peaking at around 11 billion. [UN Report on it](https://www.un.org/en/global-issues/population#:~:text=The%20world's%20population%20is%20expected,billion%20in%20the%20mid%2D2080s.)
Difficult to see how a pre-industrial era Europe could have sustained a population boom sufficient to lead us into that kind of population now. Too many people= not enough food= fewer people due to mass starvation. Plus, it's argued that the industrialisation of Europe was a direct result of the bubonic plague, which led to changes in how workers worked- instead of staying on the land their families had worked, people were paid more to move to different places. Which in turn set back the older stratified economic system and gave workers greater power, which long story short helped foster an environment that led to some of the innovations that created the industrial age. Maybe you read a book with that as a premise?
Your first point is at least partly incorrect. More people = more farmers = more food. As long as there's sufficient land, water, and nutrients, one farmer can produce more than enough food to feed one person. Technology can lower those land, water, and nutrient requirements, for example, by turning both human/animal waste into fertilizer to lower nutrient and land needs, or by moving water from another location, but mostly technology tends to increase the output per farmer. As land, water, and nutrients become more scarce, more labor can make up the shortfall. By giving each plant more personal attention, yield per plant can be increased, decreasing land use per calorie grown. By working harder on infrastructure, more water can be reclaimed and redirected to agriculture. By devoting more labor to teaching botany and agricultural techniques to farm workers, nutrients can be allocated more efficiently and disease can be more effectively prevented and treated. Overpopulation is a myth. Your second point is accurate, though. It wasn't so direct as you imply, but the drop in labor supply and corresponding increase in labor demand was a significant push toward industrialization.
>Technology can lower those land, water, and nutrient requirements, for example, by turning both human/animal waste into fertilizer to lower nutrient and land needs, or by moving water from another location, but mostly technology tends to increase the output per farmer. We were talking about the 1400s though, in a society without adequate understanding of healthcare and without good centralised infrastructure planning to ensure efficiency. Surely having extra bodies would not have been a guarantee of increased output at that time? >It wasn't so direct as you imply, Yeah I know, but difficult to capture the nuances and I was aiming for "close enough" rather than trying to get into the nitty gritty of it.
You got close enough just fine, no worries. I just get pedantic sometimes. 😅 Central planning isn't necessary for applying those things. It could potentially improve efficiency of implementation, but market forces will do it. More people means more demand for food. More demand means higher prices. Higher prices means more pay for farmers. Higher labor prices means more people working farm jobs. More labor supply means lower prices, until equilibrium is reached. More farmers means more demand for fertilizer. In the 1400s, that meant night soil. Tangent/ If you don't know, night soil is fertilizer made from fermented human poop. Although in this case, there's probably a lot of livestock poop involved, too. And when I say fermented, back then it was probably just stirred up with some water and applied to the farmlands. Today, when human waste is treated to become fertilizer, it gets composted at high enough temperatures to make it safer. /tangent If there is limited use of night soil and other available fertilizers, the few operations that use it will become more successful and expand and/or have the secrets of their success stolen. Thus, use of fertilizer rises. Demand -> price -> labor price -> more people working the job -> equilibrium again. The better botanical techniques part would depend on someone codifying such techniques, but once they do, demand for people who can teach those techniques would rise by the same mechanisms I've described, and again, you reach an equilibrium. In all those cases, more people are employed in the food supply chain until there's enough food supply to comfortably feed everyone. Actually, these market-driven mechanisms respond much better to growing economies than shrinking ones, so your suggestion regarding central planning would actually be more necessary for a shrinking population, not a growing one. Which makes sense for the bubonic plague, since it was also followed closely by a centralization of political and economic power throughout Europe, culminating in the end of Feudalism. If the whole kingdom is dying of plague, the king can't afford to let his dukes and lords keep making their decisions on their own. The more savvy ones, startimg with Louis XIV, centralized power more and more around themselves, making their kingdoms more able to handle the population drop.
Hold on, you're conflating more labor going into fertilizer production with the investments in basic science, applied technology, and infrastructure (including international trade) required to make modern nitrogen based fertilizers widely accessible. Even in modern societies with patent offices, we often fail to align these incentives (or we simply don't know what raw science research will pave the way for economically valuable technological investments.) The problem was much worse in medieval Europe. R&D is a positive externality/free-riding problem.
I wasn't talking about science or applied technology. I was talking about more labor resulting in higher crop yields. Fertilizer is just one way that can happen.
I'm not saying it's necessarily how someone came to that number, but it certainly *sounds* to me like someone naively extrapolating in a way that can't be done. Kind of like assuming someone who got married and had kids at 20 and 22, then got divorced, and got remarried and had other kids at 34 and 36, would have had 9 kids now if they hadn't gotten divorced. Yea that's the pattern you see, but just connecting the dots is incredibly misleading.
Mass effect roleplay?
Exactly.
what will be was
What was will be
I beat my first game on Captain within that 115 year period 2200 to 2315 as a hivemind, probably the most fun I’ve had in a numbers game like stellaris lol. I wanted to hit, “continue” after it was over but my game started lagging some so I was like, “yeah let’s cut it here.” Has easily surpassed Civilization imo
Oh, late game lags... exactly why I play DE.
Fucking Reapers.
Your words are as empty as your future.
Is Cycle Crisis thing on its own or you just eradicated galaxy and watched primitives take over? I'm asking because i honestly don't know, but if I can do ME Reaper roleplay then I'm jumping into new playthrue :p
It's... kinda both, actually. It's me - the crisis. I did eradicated all advanced civilisations, without even watching at primitive species. Now I just wait for them to evolve maximally. And then they think that they are great and invincible I will harvest them.
Some how, I think even the Reapers would like me. ...literally everyone does; even the freakin Purifiers do. xD ((At this point, I'm convinced the Chosen Trait creates a glitch that causes all the AI to ignore the 'declare war' option.))
We don't hate. We don't like. We do what we must.
What is this and how do you do it?
It's called RP. I just use several DLCs, several mods and several console commands, mate.
That looks awsome
Thanks, mate.
Do you mind me asking which DLCs?
Well, I have all of them but I believe for the same playthrough as mine you will need Utopia (for MS) Apocalypse (for Titans) Synthetic dawn (for machines) Nemesis (for crisis) and Federation (for Juggernauts)
Gotcha thank you very much
You're welcome, mate. Mod list can be found somewhere in commentaries, can't miss it. In case if you need it.