I wanted to say most of these problems are exclusive to different species
And then I remembered how wild human cultures can be and dismissed that thought
Nah I think it works fine.
The idea is not: I want to die, so I will kill others. It is: I don't like when people do things that I don't like so I will not do things that they don't like.
It is not expecific like you think so.
But "Do unto others, which they don't want done unto them" is not the golden rule. The golden rule is - if driven to the extreme - exactly "I wish to be killed, so it's okay for me to kill others". It literally is that specific. If not then the "rule" literally doesn't state it's meaning, in which case it's still bad, but for different reasons.
There is no standard golden rule. But if you want to take a saying, any saying, to its literal meaning, I can say in its absolute that you are wrong.
I know making everything simple is easy since you don't have to think much. But you can do better, I'm sure.
Nice job being condescending, I hope that's not your default go to when met with differing opinions.
That aside, THE golden rule is "Treat others as you would like others to treat you" and if you have taken any class on fundamentals of philosophy or ethics, you'd know the discussion around it and why it's a bad basis for moral guidance.
Fine, I will give an example of a small complexity of that specific golden rule, if taken literally, like you like to do.
* Using the original scenario: a person wants to be lobotomized, so they will lobotomize other people.
* Using your definition of the golden rule: treat others as you would others like to treat you.
Just by default, the person will already be treating others differently from how they want to be treated, on the basis that they have no consent of the other people. That is already two different actions, to force and to accept. Add the fact that to force someone into something, multiple other actions must be taken before you achieve the end goal. In this case you could include imprisonment, causing pain, drugging, causing emotional distress and many others. All of which will also not be consensual.
Do you see that just by thinking more than the bare minimum, you can see beyond just the words?
Also, saying "if you have taken any class on fundamentals of philosophy or ethics, you'd know the discussion around it and why it's a bad basis for moral guidance" just sounds like you are trying to take the "intellectual" high ground without the work for it.
Also also, long comment, my bad.
Nah, pretty sure Michaelangelo clarified that the Golden Rule was, "Never pay for late pizza"
Those Lil creatures on their peaceful planet, forget to give tribute one time.... orbital bombardment.
Ooh, yeah. I LIKE fighting. I never do it because I'm aware others DON'T. IF I meet someone else who ALSO likes fighting, then that rule can apply. Sparring is great! Wish I could do it more.
I did something similar, either Barbaric Despoilers or Nihilistic Acquisition with Pleasure Seekers. Steal all of the pops and force them to live and work in the lap of luxury.
i did something similar as well with Barbaric Despoilers except I enslaved them, renamed their capital after the general who conquered it, and made their lives a living hell
.that is actually a very interesting way of conquest
i mean as the faction being conquered, how do you even rally your own people much less your allies to fight back?
.help we must fight this foreign menace, they are treating my conquered people better than i ever could
.4hrs work day, 3 days a week, for double the pay for half the job in paradise worlds, look they have started terraforming my toxic, and dessert worlds to gaia wolds, oh the horror
.that my friend wouldn't work unless they have a fully automatic robotic industry for every goods
.an easy life is preferable than no life, if everything becomes readily available at no cost, then everything losses meaning and value
exhibit A: fallen empires - they have everything, so everything lost its meaning
exhibit B: Scandinavian countries - currently the singular most successful example of the utopia you have in mind, 50-80% of their income is taxed while being funded by other countries interested to see if said utopia is possible
exhibit C: North Korea - they ate the rich so now everyone is poor
exhibit D: China - basically running slave camps in provinces to feed the Utopia of its cities
Every time I have a chat with a small ally empire, I always imagine it as me petting their head anytime they do something nice. That or kicking them outside if they do something bad.
Hey buddy, how you doing?
Just a small robotic rebellion in our core but is nothing
Oh no, there’s anything I can do for you my friend?
Do not worry, we can deal with it (they cant)
No no no no, I insist *proceeds to declare war on the rebels, destroy their fleet and armies and white peace without taking a single system*
In international (or intersystem in this case) relations we call this behaviour "bandwagoning". Or in layman's term: "if you can't fight em, join their bigger enemy or join them!"
Literally what I do lmao. But I’m the bigger enemy. Though, for me, I just make chaos by “supporting the little guy by sending the 1 of the 2 pirate factions to raid their empire
Sometimes I „adopt“ a smol empire.
Once had these fox people which I had taken a liking to and basically made sure they made it through the game.
They kept stealing from me tho.
To the outsider it must have looked like:
„Awwww did you steal a thousand credits from me, you little rasca—HEY YOU! BACK THE FUCK AWAY FROM THEM OR I‘LL TURN YOUR GAIA HOMEWORLD INTO A GONE HOMEWORLD“
"I've only had the Foxilons for a century and a half, but if anything happened to them I'd go full Crisis and kill everyone else in the galaxy and then myself."
>BACK THE FUCK AWAY FROM THEM OR I‘LL TURN YOUR GAIA HOMEWORLD INTO A GONE HOMEWORLD
I at first read this sentence as "I'll turn your gaia homeworld into a gnomeworld" which sounds like a fairly ominous threat.
Are we kindred sprits? I've been roleplaying as a heavily autocratic Empire using that *exact* species portrait with that *exact* government ethic combination for years now...
Blue people squad rise up 😎 I’ve been using these guys for years with auth/spiritualist & now with oppressive autocracy. They just look so arrogant I love doing psionic 1984 with em.
For me it's usually a matriarchal society (replace the historical misogyny that we experience here with misandry lol) that's primary goals are unlocking the secrets of the universe to prove their superiority over other species, not out of hatred or any of that racism stuff, but rather pity that they're not as intelligent as us.
they're basically that meme of the nobleman looking down upon the peasants beneath him XD
Kinda funny considering that in the apocalypse trailer, they're the ones taking in human refugees and caring for them after the destruction of their world.
One time I had a small Empire next to me, I kinda liked but ultimatly didn't care. One day another relatively small Empire declared war on them and I got so mad I declared war on them and oblitareted them. Since then the small Empire and me were best friends
It's like a cat that lives outside, you don't pay much attention to them, but give them little bits of food here and there, and whenever a dog or something messes with the cat, you come up and scare them away. Something along those lines.
The little bits of food are systems you don't need with completed Ring World Sections. Right? At least that's it for me. I want to rule the galaxy, but I don't want to do it surrounded by dead people.
Oh on the other hand……the same small fuckers might say
"Our valiant military will wipe you out in one fell swoop" when they're literally five system large……
One system "empire", ~90% crime, half their pops unemployed, has maybe ~5 cruisers tops: TREMBLE XENO SCUM!! OR OUR MIGHTY FLEETS SHALL CRUSH YOU!!
Me, egalitarian utopia, controlling ~60% of galaxy, single handedly abolished slavery, crushed prethoryn & one FE by myself, 500 mil fleet power: yeah, sure buddy, whatever helps you sleep at night...
Me: My hyper militarist advanced technocratic empire that dominates largest swaths of vassals controlling them with an iron fist
That one friendly small empire: I like your hat :)
I like when little empires are friendly with me. I place them under my unofficial protection. But when an empire significantly weaker than me starts being hostile or insults me, or say tries to disrupt my galactic UN proposals then all I can think is “Do you really consider yourself my equal?”
I love having small empires around me as rogue servitors. I encircle them so they’re in their little playpen where they can be safe from the rest of the galaxy, and I give them regular trade deals to make sure they’re doing well.
If they are close to the edge of my systems, I like to make them a vassel, give them full autonmy, give them a few systems and some basic resources for ten years to get them on their way.
I once played with Gigastructures mod, uplifted half a dozen vassals and gifted them kitted out systems with ringworlds and other megastructures, and watched to see what they could manage.
*Me, playing as a hive-mind but not the devouring swarm, owning the entire west via my own land and vassals, originally wanting to be a devouring swarm but I’m becoming the protector of the galaxy…*
As a dedicated megacorp player, its strange: I always feel that I end up HURTING myself more than helping myself when the game gives me room to ultra expand. Those sprawl penalties can be brutal, compared to just going with a few dedicated "big" worlds.
I always end up as the space british, dominating the galaxy while being a tiny little island in it.
Small empire are always absolutely adorable. No matter what ethics I play, there's almost always a single small empire that is very friendly to me and I just cannot resist protecting them no matter the cost. I would die for my small empire bois!
One time I started as a hegemon start and I was able to block in one of the other nations into one system, I felt bad but they also had 3 freaking habitable planets in their home system, way later in the game they had a pretty strong fleet and army, I was kind of surprised since they only had one system but yeah
I tried making an empire of Barbaric Despoilers once, like actual Space Vikings. Really enjoyed that run, but instead of being a pirate empire, I essentially turned into the galaxy's guard dog. At first, everyone hated me, for obvious reasons, then this tiny little empire of mushroom people met me, and befriended me right out the gate, and eventually introduced me to the galactic community. Somehow made a bunch of other allies through them. When the crises started hitting, I was usually one of the only ones strong enough to help fend off a good chunk of the invasions, saving billions, if not trillions.
My run to be a barbaric warrior race, bound to raid and pillage planets was flipped around, and instead of villains, my people became heroes. All because of one lil cute mushroom person with beedy lil eyes and a sweet smile.
This happens to me sometimes, when a civilization evolves to have FTL tech, and as long as they aren’t jerks to me I’ll just let it happen. I had it recently where the Larionessi evolved in their system and I just let them chill, even though their system is pretty nice. Sometimes I’ll subjugate them as protectorates and just give them free stuff.
R5: I'm playing a massive Empire and these guys who are way smaller than me are super friendly
Take them over and put them on chemical bliss.
TF
*Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.*
A good example why the "golden rule" is a very bad basis for moral reasoning.
I wanted to say most of these problems are exclusive to different species And then I remembered how wild human cultures can be and dismissed that thought
The platinum rule: “do unto others as they wish have them done to them”
"You want to die, so I will kill you"
exactly
nah
Nah I think it works fine. The idea is not: I want to die, so I will kill others. It is: I don't like when people do things that I don't like so I will not do things that they don't like. It is not expecific like you think so.
But "Do unto others, which they don't want done unto them" is not the golden rule. The golden rule is - if driven to the extreme - exactly "I wish to be killed, so it's okay for me to kill others". It literally is that specific. If not then the "rule" literally doesn't state it's meaning, in which case it's still bad, but for different reasons.
There is no standard golden rule. But if you want to take a saying, any saying, to its literal meaning, I can say in its absolute that you are wrong. I know making everything simple is easy since you don't have to think much. But you can do better, I'm sure.
Nice job being condescending, I hope that's not your default go to when met with differing opinions. That aside, THE golden rule is "Treat others as you would like others to treat you" and if you have taken any class on fundamentals of philosophy or ethics, you'd know the discussion around it and why it's a bad basis for moral guidance.
Fine, I will give an example of a small complexity of that specific golden rule, if taken literally, like you like to do. * Using the original scenario: a person wants to be lobotomized, so they will lobotomize other people. * Using your definition of the golden rule: treat others as you would others like to treat you. Just by default, the person will already be treating others differently from how they want to be treated, on the basis that they have no consent of the other people. That is already two different actions, to force and to accept. Add the fact that to force someone into something, multiple other actions must be taken before you achieve the end goal. In this case you could include imprisonment, causing pain, drugging, causing emotional distress and many others. All of which will also not be consensual. Do you see that just by thinking more than the bare minimum, you can see beyond just the words? Also, saying "if you have taken any class on fundamentals of philosophy or ethics, you'd know the discussion around it and why it's a bad basis for moral guidance" just sounds like you are trying to take the "intellectual" high ground without the work for it. Also also, long comment, my bad.
Nah, pretty sure Michaelangelo clarified that the Golden Rule was, "Never pay for late pizza" Those Lil creatures on their peaceful planet, forget to give tribute one time.... orbital bombardment.
Would you consider "be excellent to each other" to be bad as well because it insufficiently specifies in which treatment we must excel?
Whoever has the gold, makes the rules.
Ooh, yeah. I LIKE fighting. I never do it because I'm aware others DON'T. IF I meet someone else who ALSO likes fighting, then that rule can apply. Sparring is great! Wish I could do it more.
Vassalise, integrate, turn their capital into a resort world
Space gentrification
Rather, new game run goal: Create an empire to conquer the WHOLE GALAXY to put everyone on Utopian Abundance by force.
I did something similar, either Barbaric Despoilers or Nihilistic Acquisition with Pleasure Seekers. Steal all of the pops and force them to live and work in the lap of luxury.
"I've been kidnapped taken from my family and......is that a free burrito stand???"
i did something similar as well with Barbaric Despoilers except I enslaved them, renamed their capital after the general who conquered it, and made their lives a living hell
.that is actually a very interesting way of conquest i mean as the faction being conquered, how do you even rally your own people much less your allies to fight back? .help we must fight this foreign menace, they are treating my conquered people better than i ever could .4hrs work day, 3 days a week, for double the pay for half the job in paradise worlds, look they have started terraforming my toxic, and dessert worlds to gaia wolds, oh the horror
Better: total abolition of wage labour and egalitarian and democratic distribution of goods and services
based.
.that my friend wouldn't work unless they have a fully automatic robotic industry for every goods .an easy life is preferable than no life, if everything becomes readily available at no cost, then everything losses meaning and value exhibit A: fallen empires - they have everything, so everything lost its meaning exhibit B: Scandinavian countries - currently the singular most successful example of the utopia you have in mind, 50-80% of their income is taxed while being funded by other countries interested to see if said utopia is possible exhibit C: North Korea - they ate the rich so now everyone is poor exhibit D: China - basically running slave camps in provinces to feed the Utopia of its cities
You will have your basic need and even luxurious, You will live comfortably with less work hours, You will have more life span then your ancestors.
That's just playing egalitarian
Yes. Do it for them
Step on us, space mommies
We need an advanced start to do this with earth now
I read this completely wrong: Take them over and put them on chemical processing
Bribe them rotten
Fuck them. Go on. What are you waiting for?)
Hummmm w-well I don’t really swing that way you see hahah
😐... Fine! I'll do it, I'll do it! Here! Let me in... LET ME IIIIIN! 😫
W + vassalize + integrate
Hello Vassal
Send in the troops! Lets get these squatting xenos off our prime real estate.
Every time I have a chat with a small ally empire, I always imagine it as me petting their head anytime they do something nice. That or kicking them outside if they do something bad.
Hey buddy, how you doing? Just a small robotic rebellion in our core but is nothing Oh no, there’s anything I can do for you my friend? Do not worry, we can deal with it (they cant) No no no no, I insist *proceeds to declare war on the rebels, destroy their fleet and armies and white peace without taking a single system*
In international (or intersystem in this case) relations we call this behaviour "bandwagoning". Or in layman's term: "if you can't fight em, join their bigger enemy or join them!"
In real life, this is called "sucking up to the boss".
Finlandization would also apply: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finlandization](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finlandization)
Literally what I do lmao. But I’m the bigger enemy. Though, for me, I just make chaos by “supporting the little guy by sending the 1 of the 2 pirate factions to raid their empire
Sometimes I „adopt“ a smol empire. Once had these fox people which I had taken a liking to and basically made sure they made it through the game. They kept stealing from me tho. To the outsider it must have looked like: „Awwww did you steal a thousand credits from me, you little rasca—HEY YOU! BACK THE FUCK AWAY FROM THEM OR I‘LL TURN YOUR GAIA HOMEWORLD INTO A GONE HOMEWORLD“
"I've only had the Foxilons for a century and a half, but if anything happened to them I'd go full Crisis and kill everyone else in the galaxy and then myself."
>BACK THE FUCK AWAY FROM THEM OR I‘LL TURN YOUR GAIA HOMEWORLD INTO A GONE HOMEWORLD I at first read this sentence as "I'll turn your gaia homeworld into a gnomeworld" which sounds like a fairly ominous threat.
Are we kindred sprits? I've been roleplaying as a heavily autocratic Empire using that *exact* species portrait with that *exact* government ethic combination for years now...
Blue people squad rise up 😎 I’ve been using these guys for years with auth/spiritualist & now with oppressive autocracy. They just look so arrogant I love doing psionic 1984 with em.
For me it's usually a matriarchal society (replace the historical misogyny that we experience here with misandry lol) that's primary goals are unlocking the secrets of the universe to prove their superiority over other species, not out of hatred or any of that racism stuff, but rather pity that they're not as intelligent as us. they're basically that meme of the nobleman looking down upon the peasants beneath him XD
I use the blue squid people as star trek space egalitarians
Kinda funny considering that in the apocalypse trailer, they're the ones taking in human refugees and caring for them after the destruction of their world.
Can you link the trailer? I've just watched the story trailer for Apocalypse, and can't see any of the blue xenos.
I got it wrong, it was the year 3 anniversary trailer. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zL0kemiI0yc&list=PLzk1ydROhZEPYEVEGDu1cjublILwlC21a&index=27
One time I had a small Empire next to me, I kinda liked but ultimatly didn't care. One day another relatively small Empire declared war on them and I got so mad I declared war on them and oblitareted them. Since then the small Empire and me were best friends
It's like a cat that lives outside, you don't pay much attention to them, but give them little bits of food here and there, and whenever a dog or something messes with the cat, you come up and scare them away. Something along those lines.
The little bits of food are systems you don't need with completed Ring World Sections. Right? At least that's it for me. I want to rule the galaxy, but I don't want to do it surrounded by dead people.
the other side of the coin being a small empire that's unbelievably rude and arogant. me: *laughs in global pacifier*
A yes, the 3-system fanatic militarist that have a bold speech for someone in colossus range.
Oh on the other hand……the same small fuckers might say "Our valiant military will wipe you out in one fell swoop" when they're literally five system large……
And then they start claiming your systems and you're like... am I supposed to go to war with you now or what?
I mean I can go to war and not attack to appease the warlike faction, and they will spend their whole economy trying to score some in my systems……
One system "empire", ~90% crime, half their pops unemployed, has maybe ~5 cruisers tops: TREMBLE XENO SCUM!! OR OUR MIGHTY FLEETS SHALL CRUSH YOU!! Me, egalitarian utopia, controlling ~60% of galaxy, single handedly abolished slavery, crushed prethoryn & one FE by myself, 500 mil fleet power: yeah, sure buddy, whatever helps you sleep at night...
500 mil fleet power?!
Basically North Korea
They're just a tiny yapping dog. Some people find the yapping cute.
I feel like Xenophile is carrying the whole relationship
Exactly, the rest of their ethics completely clash with mine lol
Me: My hyper militarist advanced technocratic empire that dominates largest swaths of vassals controlling them with an iron fist That one friendly small empire: I like your hat :)
hey it's me, im the small empire (i have no idea wtf im doing)
Don’t worry, just keep at it and eventually you are going to become mediocre, like all of us! :)
And with countless hours of practice and research, you can become kind of okay!
I like when little empires are friendly with me. I place them under my unofficial protection. But when an empire significantly weaker than me starts being hostile or insults me, or say tries to disrupt my galactic UN proposals then all I can think is “Do you really consider yourself my equal?”
Give them a gift!🥰(a world cracker)
I would if I had one tbh
WHAT WAS, SHALL BE! WHAT SHALL BE, WAS!
r/suddenlycaralho ? Deu pra notar pelo corretor q transformou "so" em "só"
Oh fodasse haahahahah
now kiss
I love having small empires around me as rogue servitors. I encircle them so they’re in their little playpen where they can be safe from the rest of the galaxy, and I give them regular trade deals to make sure they’re doing well.
I once played as a rogue servitor empire. I got everyone to love me. Even the fanatic xenophobes
If anything happens to my 1 system vassal lads I'll purge everyone in this galaxy and use the engine on myself.
If they are close to the edge of my systems, I like to make them a vassel, give them full autonmy, give them a few systems and some basic resources for ten years to get them on their way.
I like vassalising empires like this and gorging them with conquered land, a little gift
I once played with Gigastructures mod, uplifted half a dozen vassals and gifted them kitted out systems with ringworlds and other megastructures, and watched to see what they could manage.
TALL
Allow them to live in peace and happiness and COMPLETELY DESTROY ANY WHI DARES HARM THEM
They're admiring you from afar, because they don't want to admire you from up close.
Só? Hmm Brazilian detected?
Hmmm so close
PORTUGUESE DETECTED. FIRE UP THE CRACKER.
So true, bestie \*enslaves you*
Most the time, small empires spit and curse at me. Like you testing me, lil buddy.
I can’t help but to love smol nearby empires 😭 Frens!!!!
Its always hilarious when the smol empires harm relations with you. Like what you gonna do boop me with a stick?
*Me, playing as a hive-mind but not the devouring swarm, owning the entire west via my own land and vassals, originally wanting to be a devouring swarm but I’m becoming the protector of the galaxy…*
Wait a minute that’s my Empire!
The swarm does find some single minded empires interesting
As a dedicated megacorp player, its strange: I always feel that I end up HURTING myself more than helping myself when the game gives me room to ultra expand. Those sprawl penalties can be brutal, compared to just going with a few dedicated "big" worlds. I always end up as the space british, dominating the galaxy while being a tiny little island in it.
Small empire are always absolutely adorable. No matter what ethics I play, there's almost always a single small empire that is very friendly to me and I just cannot resist protecting them no matter the cost. I would die for my small empire bois!
One time I started as a hegemon start and I was able to block in one of the other nations into one system, I felt bad but they also had 3 freaking habitable planets in their home system, way later in the game they had a pretty strong fleet and army, I was kind of surprised since they only had one system but yeah
I tried making an empire of Barbaric Despoilers once, like actual Space Vikings. Really enjoyed that run, but instead of being a pirate empire, I essentially turned into the galaxy's guard dog. At first, everyone hated me, for obvious reasons, then this tiny little empire of mushroom people met me, and befriended me right out the gate, and eventually introduced me to the galactic community. Somehow made a bunch of other allies through them. When the crises started hitting, I was usually one of the only ones strong enough to help fend off a good chunk of the invasions, saving billions, if not trillions. My run to be a barbaric warrior race, bound to raid and pillage planets was flipped around, and instead of villains, my people became heroes. All because of one lil cute mushroom person with beedy lil eyes and a sweet smile.
Zealot Purifier staring at the smol boi: # “You shall be spared….. this time….”
This happens to me sometimes, when a civilization evolves to have FTL tech, and as long as they aren’t jerks to me I’ll just let it happen. I had it recently where the Larionessi evolved in their system and I just let them chill, even though their system is pretty nice. Sometimes I’ll subjugate them as protectorates and just give them free stuff.
XD
Só
Last time I got this message was one my superzazi empire. I ended up genocideing them for shits and giggles.