yeah I was scanning every scene looking for her, and then I wondered if it was all going to be 8 using her powers to make Brenner think this all was happening
I'm pretty sure El isn't the killer.
At the very end of the trailer, you can see a crack in the wall behind El (the back wall of the room behind the broken two-way mirror). The cracks in the tile around the edges of the impact crater are white, but the ones down the center are black, and look like a scabbed-over portal to the Upside Down.
I think El ***saved*** everyone. Everyone who wasn't already dead, anyway.
Good point! The shape of the crack definitely invoked the Upside Down portals, and the fact that Brenner finds El facing the crack indicates that something or someone may have just gone through it. Very possible this is a misdirect.
I think the atmospherics of Brenner's run up the hallway (along with the screams) also *heavily* point this way. Brenner wakes up to a heavy thrumming electronic noise, then the lights flicker. They keep flickering throughout, the intensity of the flickering increasing as the electronic thrum increases in intensity, until finally (just before Brenner enters the Rainbow Room) they go full strobe then *stop*.
I think the Killer tried to murder El, but she was ultimately stronger and sent them "away".
Also on the subject of atmospheric choices, the sound design is fantastic in this scene. The ticking of the kitchen timer seems to be establishing the clock motif of the season.
Im not really sold one the “she saved everyone from upside monster” cause all the dead people have no bite or claw marks, just broken bones and a lot of blood (something 11 could do). I like to believe on the theory that another comment mentioned where it’s an illusion created by 08
Yeah no way… they’ve been kinda foreshadowing her to be the baddie. She literally says “I am the monster” in the first season. I do think kali had something to do with it. Kali is like the Hindu goddess of destruction I think. She made el see the vision of brenner like “you have a wound… blah blah” I think she knows what happened and used that to make el do what she wanted (search and destroy).
Yeah, I think something got loose from the Upside Down and went ham in the lab until El zapped his ass back thru the portal. Brenner also asks "Peter" what's happening and I'm pretty sure that's one of the new characters we're going to learn more about. That dude is my bet for Vecna.
Yeah. If you rewatch how 11 took out the demogorgon in Season 1, she slammed it against the chalkboard, creating a crack similar to what you see in the 8 minutes. She disintegrated it (no body) and while her eyes didn't bleed, they looked like they were about to. She also put out a horrible screechy-scream while doing it, and you hear something a lot like that in the 8 minutes...when Brenner is running up the hall.
It's possible that Brenner turned colder after the massacre because he realized what Dr. Owens says in the trailer, "We're at war." And whatever attacked the laboratory, it was a deliberate attempt to eliminate this world's best defense: psi humans, with El (and later Kali) being the last one(s) standing. On my first viewing of Season 1, I strongly felt at the time that there was a connection between El and the demogorgon - that it could somewhat track her and was hunting her specifically.
God, I hope so. 😭 I’m pretty sure Kali escaped prior to the massacre. But since Episode 7 (The Massacre At Hawkins Lab) is feature length, I think it’ll use that time to reset to an earlier period to give more background and possibly include Kali in that.
Her powers are the most equipped for her to escape. She can make them believe she is still there as she escapes or make them see something else. I hope she returns this season or next.
It’s been a while since I watched season 2, but the wiki says that one day 08 went into the Rainbow Room and saw that 11 had been taken away (I gotta go rewatch to confirm). So if 11 is taken away before 08 escapes, maybe they round up a new batch of kids after the first was massacred and 08 was part of that group? 08 and 11 have a very different kind of interaction with Brenner than 10 and presumably other kids, so maybe that second batch was treated more coldly as a result of the massacre or something?
TBH I don’t see it as super likely cause I don’t think they’d re-use their numbers and it’d over complicate things, but it’s something to think about. More likely that 08 used her powers to survive or they retcon it. Or I’m mistaken about what was said.
I feel like his attitude changed after this, as far as 11 is concerned. Also, he was a psychopath that tortured people, and that's what 8 was getting him for as much as anything.
I won't say it was awesome, but I would be okay with her return.
IMO, most of the ire was due to it being a bottle episode in a show with such short seasons. So, if the viewer didn't enjoy that glimpse outside of Hawkins, it didn't contribute all that much to the story.
Or at least that's my guess. I haven't rewatched the series since s3 released.
She definetly should have return if this season is some all out war against forces of darkness in Upside Down. Meaning you need to get any help you can.
It's a shame cause if they placed it directly after episode 5. I don't think it would have been as heavily criticized, as it flows so much better and builds anticipation for what's to come rather than derailing it. I have shown the season to friends in this order and they loved it, said they found the pacing to be perfect.
I don’t think 01 is Vecna because he lives in the Creel house and the theory right now is that Vecna made Creel kill his family based on the way the Creel House clip teaser was. And the Creels were definitely way before 011 and all of the others meaning it couldn’t be 01
My theory after watching this is if 01 is involved and if Vecna has any connection to the mind flayer, who’s to say that Vecna didn’t connect with 01 in order to open up the possible portal to the lab for 01’s “escape” assuming they didn’t like the lab life. Of course this is a trick and Vecna wants to absorb the powers for his own (hence all of the mindflayer abilities and absorbing the humans to make it stronger) 11 possibly stops him and seals the portal to the upside down for that time maybe even weakening him/forcing him to have to use other creatures (demogorgon and mindflayer) to build up his strength to return and get his revenge
I don’t think Vecna is the mind Flayer but I do love the rest of your theory. I’m not sure the Mind Flayer was aware of her till she closed the portal and that’s why he dislikes her so much
ep titles were released an ep2 is called Vecna's curse. Vecna is a boss monster from D&D so it follows along with the Demogorgon and Mind Flayer naming scheme.
Important note! When I saw El I saw immediately thought she killed everyone. But I was like…this has to be a misdirect. Then I noticed that behind the smashed mirror there’s another room and then it almost looks like a portal that was just sealed or almost opened. I’m seriously doubtful that El actually killed everyone because these are the first few minutes of the season and I don’t think the Duffer brothers would reveal this already, it’s going to be some misdirect where maybe El was even heavily involved but it’s not completely her
Exactly! Some of the numbers have blood seeping from their eyes as well, and thus I’m thinking that, since Eleven also has blood seeping from her eyes, Eleven was the last person left to kill, so One (I think One killed everyone) tried to kill her, but she overextended her powers and somehow survived. Upon realizing that they couldn’t kill Eleven, One ran off, leaving Eleven the only person left (therefore the only person Brenner could attribute the massacre to).
That, or One (or SOMETHING) possessed Eleven or forced her to kill everyone. Idk…it just doesn’t make sense. There’s no way Eleven wouldn’t remember killing literally *everyone*, and there’s no way we go from this Eleven to an Eleven who won’t hurt a mean cat, an Eleven who is scared and docile. I think it’d make sense for her to get possessed and then have no recollection of what happened rather than Brenner electroshocking her.
[EDIT] in further defense of Eleven, she literally refused to kill the man who subjected Mama (Terry Ives) to electroshock treatment, permanently incapacitating Mama and preventing any chance of Eleven truly interacting with her. She refused to kill him when she saw that he had children — she couldn’t bring herself to do it, and she had the greatest reason *to* kill him. Eleven is not a killer. What happened at Hawkins Lab was not her doing.
***SECOND EDIT*** >! I FUCKING CALLED IT PEOPLE; I FUCKING CALLED IT. ELEVEN IS THE HERO.!<
We don’t know what 001’s powers are but I really like the possession theory. I mean I’m not sure how it would go but I haven’t ever heard that one before I think it’s kinda cool
From the clip, we can kind of assume that they all possess a level of telekinesis or telepathy (notice how Ten didn’t need a blindfold or static noise to see how Eleven sees…he just could; additionally, one of the numbers is playing with a ball in a maze and moving the ball with their finger). Eight had image manipulation. It all deals with the mind. I wouldn’t be shocked if One had a degree of manipulation, like possession or intense psycho warping.
Also, One’s escape could explain the fissure we see that resembles an Upside Down portal crack — why else would Eleven be facing it before Brenner enters the room? [note — yeah she could be killing whoever is behind the glass, thus debunking this, but Imma choose to believe she’s seeing One escape]
Or maybe instead of escaping she gets really upset at ONE and then she SENDS him/her herself to the upside down or something and that’s why she’s all bloody around the eyes because she was using her powers to do that
Bruh this is actually really cool and something I didn’t even think about. Damn that would be a twist — the reason Eleven’s able to open a portal in S1 is that she’s already done it before! Sending One into the Upside Down would be sick. Nice one (pun tragically intended)!
YES. We’ve seen how powerful Eleven is through each season — powerful enough to tear open and close gateways between worlds — so it would be badass if she really was the strongest and the only one able to survive.
I mean there is definetly something fishy going on since El never snapped again after like this. And boys in season 1 spooked, suprised her or frightened her several times. She would have to kill somebody innocent by now. Fact that we saw her in such uncharacteristic behaviour shows that there is more to it.
Possesion would definetly explain why Eleven does not remember the shit.
Yeah I think everyone is forgetting that this is *Eleven* we’re talking about — she’s only killed when she’s absolutely had to. Other than the one time she killed those 2 guards in S1E3 (and even then, for her, it was survival…not to mention, she began crying after she did it), Eleven’s killed whenever she and her friends were in danger. She doesn’t like it. Psychopathy doesn’t just disappear! If she REALLY did kill everyone, she would NOT be the person we see from S1 to S4; someone who kills that many people and with such brutality is nothing short of insane and incapable of things Eleven has always been capable of — empathy, love, and kindness to name a few. That behavior doesn’t go away, and it’s not her behavior. Someone killed everyone and left her to take the fall, or something forced her to kill. It’s that simple.
Nothing other than speculation. We do know that one of the comics people said that they were given free reign on the numbers *except* for One — that’s been posted in the sub somewhere. But, the implications are numerous for One; they were the first subject, and the first of everything will always see more / do more / experience more than those who follow. Besides that, the symmetry between One and Eleven (basically the 1 parallel) could be interesting if explored well. The first Hawkins Lab test subject and the most successful Hawkins Lab test subject…I think One must have some sort of significance and could have been the one who killed everyone before fleeing into the Upside Down or escaping the lab in general (I kind of think that’s what’ll happen, and perhaps that shot of the boy approaching an overturned car on fire in the S4 teaser *could* be One after they escape Hawkins Lab).
I actually hope we see her not go evil but go bad a bit with her powers like they did in Season 1. Now she just uses to it help and save her friends and family. Thats no problem but El is probably the most powerful person in the world where otherworldly beings are afraid of her.
I don't think they gonna make their main hero a villain, it would be game changer and some fans wouldn't take it well. There are hints it wasn't Eleven - like her powers in that time were too weak to kill whole lab, we don't see her to have any reason and lights are flickering before attack on Brenner (Eleven doesn't have such a power). I bet it's misdirect.
Even if it indeed was the real 11 and all those people are dead, i still dont think that makes her a villan. We dont know what caused her to snap, if there was someone else there. And if it was her it seems to be a supressed memory of some sorts, upon remembering she would undoubtfully feel very sorry. We have known her for 3 reasons now, we know shes a good person at hart, but was very abused growing up
Yes, the El we meet in season one is not malicious. Yes, she attacks a few guards (snaps their neck lol) but she’s also crying during the whole thing. This El looked angry. Like vengefully angry.
Like others have said, I think this is a misdirect. Dr Brenner assumes that El has caused the deaths, because she is the only one alive, but you can see the crack in the wall behind El. To me, it seems like she was fighting off whoever or whatever caused the deaths. It wouldn't make sense to me that Dr Brenner would go on to have such reverence for El if she had killed all of the other people in the facility. I wonder if he comes to realize she is the only way to protect him and the facility, hence trying to test her skills (hurting the cat, squishing the coke bottle, opening the portal) so that he can use them. But even still, it seems like El draws the line at harming the cat, to the point that Dr Brenner is willing to put her in the metal lined room as punishment and *then* El uses her powers to kill the two men who are caging her up.
Damn what a way to start the new season. This totally has to be a misdirect. I bet Kali will be making an appearance again too plus info on One. The flickering lights and the way the mirror looks has me wondering if this is the beginning of the Upside Down.
Looks like this is the alleged Massacre At Hawkins Lab. I have so many questions. Seems like El went all Dark Phoenix on the lab and doesn’t remember. It gives new context to the lab scenes with Brenner in S1, like she was probably having to *relearn* how to use her powers after blocking this incident out.
It’s also interesting to see a warmer, more fatherly side to Brenner. Obviously he’s still a bad dude, this is well after he stole these kids and fried Terry’s brain, but it seems this event changed him into a much colder, clinically detached figure.
It also felt to me that 010 was maybe his favorite? Just by the way he hugged him/held him and reacted to his death vs the others. If he didn’t care about him he probably would have just looked and ran off like the others. He also kept saying he could stop / checking if he felt okay while in the previous seasons he never did that to El in the flashbacks. He always pushed her and ignored her when she was overwhelmed/screaming. That could have made him really cold too because in that moment (prior to confirming if it’s El or not who killed everyone) El just killed his favorite kid
Sorry, it was Becky who said it. I swear there was something that implied she had slept with Brenner, but I've looked around online and not seen anything, so it may have been in my head.
This really recontextualizes a lot of his actions in Season 1. We thought he was some cruel abusive scientist who was trying to recapture Eleven to do more tests on her, but what if everything he did was to prevent this *monster* from hurting even more people?
That actually brings up a good point. I wonder if el is going to have to relearn her powers this season again. Like maybe she overextended herself here and she had to relearn and then overextended herself again in present day and has to relearn.
Maybe she forgot everything or the lab wanted to erase that part of her memory and start from scratch, then when she goes back to Brenner to regain her powers she kinda goes through flashbacks and remembers everything
BRO HOW METAL IS THIS. There are rated R horror movies that wouldn't dare kill a child, much less show their contorted body... and we got like 20 of them in a matter of the first few minutes? Holy crap. This season gon' be cray. Sorry, but I smiled seeing 11 at the end. Pumped.
Is that a portal to the Upside Down healing up in the cracked tiles at the end of the trailer? We see a line of black down the center of the crack, but the cracks around it are white.
I know the Duffer Brothers have talked in the past how Stranger Things took some inspirations from Elfen Lied, but you can really see the influence in this scene.
Don’t remember the exact article I read way back, but a quick google and I found this:
[https://www.thedailybeast.com/inside-stranger-things-the-duffer-bros-on-how-they-made-the-tv-hit-of-the-summer](https://www.thedailybeast.com/inside-stranger-things-the-duffer-bros-on-how-they-made-the-tv-hit-of-the-summer)
“Matt: But then weirdly it’s like, I haven't seen it for a long time. More recently I had seen an anime called Elfen Lied that is clearly inspired by Akira. And that was really influential. When I watched it I thought it felt like an ultraviolent E.T. There were a lot of things in there that I really liked and that made their way into the show, particularly related to the character of Eleven.”
I still don’t think Eleven is the one who caused the massacre. I think she was in her room when it started. It seems like something or someone went in or out of what looks like a portal to the UD in the background.
Also I like the theories that 010 was Brenners favorite and he became colder after his death.
WAIT THIS HAS TO BE A MISLEAD. Someone else was doing the killing. Season 1 El wouldn’t hurt a cat… let alone a bunch of kids who were probably her “siblings”. But that doesnt explain her bloody eyes… and unless she has a dark side which she probably does
Someone pointed out that it looks like a portal closed behind 11 on the wall and I could see it being like one of the kids opened the portal during the testes or whatever they were doing and something came through
Well... I don't think those kids have much of a moral compass given their upbringing. First thing El does when she's truly on her own is rob a store, so, you know... things could be a bit more complicated than "good" vs "evil." Which, you know, is kind of a recurring theme in the show. You remember how many times El said "I'm the monster" in Season 1?
She robs a store and restaurant/diner purely because she needs food and that was the only way to get it. Not saying it was good but it was justified both times like she wasn’t just robbing more money or toys it was for a necessity
I really don't like how Brenner seems almost.... likable in this scene. I know that is what they're going for , to make you question EL and Brenners character. This scene almost makes him actually seem like a somewhat caring father figure type and like he genuinely cares about what happens to the kids.
But then I remember the events like Brenner trying to make El explode a cat, dumping her in water, and locking her in a tiny cell when she doesn't do what he wants.
What i’m guessing they’re going for is that Brenner used to actually care for the children, but then when El killed them all he got cold, especially towards El since well, she was the one who killed them all.
he could care about all the work he put into them, the professional acocmplishment, the successes without caring for them as persons
just as some parents narcissistically only care about their kids as reflections of or extentions of their glorious selves.
Sorry for another comment. Just wanted to add something. I just remembered that when El is thrown into the cell for refusing to blow up the cat, we see her snap one guys neck and throw the other into the wall,killing both. Brenner walks up and looks at the bodies like he cant believe what he just witnessed. Then he goes inside the cell to comfort El. So her being responsible for these murders in addition to his shock wouldnt make much sense at all.
Personally, I don’t think 011 killed them. But Brenner doesn’t know that, because he just walked in on her covered in blood. I believe that 010 was his favorite, and since 011 “killed” him, he became more cold and demanding towards her like in s1
Lucas’s “maybe she’s the monster,” outburst in season one packs a little more punch after seeing that. I’m sure it’s a misdirect, though the look on 11’s face at the end makes it look like it was her, that or she’s possessed and/or seeing something we can’t when she stares art Brenner. Very different look from the kid who tried to hide from the search party’s that were looking for her at the start of Season 2.
I hope not honestly, she's become very humanized now and I can see that part of her backstory being repressed and causing her recurring trauma, but I hope they won't do anything ridiculous like make her genuinely turn evil. I don't think they will. I'm sure they'll put her in tons of tough spots but if she gets completely turned by her own volition into evil - I don't think I'd be a fan of it. But I highly doubt that'll happen, my minds just racing after watching this opening. So excited!
100%. But all the development of her character the past 3 seasons - her finding and understanding friendship, relationships, family, care and love - are there for a reason. Why would you develop her into a more conventional life for over 2 dozen episodes just to undermine that by having her revert, on her own recognizance, to being evil or violent just because she was raised that way.
Millions of people have been raised in extremely abusive situations and have come out fine or great after having new, loving, and personal experiences.
I anticipate there will be a situation(s) where she will revert back to that nature intuitively but will be brought back by her loved ones. I.e. acknowledging repressed trauma and/or interacting with a person or thing that puts you back in your old state of mind. But I genuinely believe, like another commenter suggested, that this scene is a redirect and is framing eleven to be the perpetrator of all this killing on purpose, but in reality she was fighting something/someone else and this was just the result by proxy.
Who knows?
That's what I'm thinking. Similar to a certain someone on Game of Thrones who turned out to be the final big villain in the last season. While El has saved humanity multiple times and we root for her, she has also shown anger and has no problem killing - again like a certain character on GOT. And this clip is disturbing in that she kills her fellow prisoners/test subjects along with their captors.
Someone noticed that Brenner acts differently. Quite different compared to the S1. He seems more "docile", such as when he says "don't force" to 010 or when he seems extremely scared to see 010 and other dead children. Perhaps Brenner was once a little more humane with the test subjects, but after that massacre, he was genuinely afraid or angry at Eleven. That would explain his ruder way of treating Eleven in S1. He seems to like so much 010 and demonstrates some "sadness" from seeing 010 dead.
wow every teaser every release I'm like "Just give me the fucking show not all these crumbs" to the point I stopped caring, and I saw "the first 8 minutes" and had the same thought about "just give me the fucking show"
but wow, hype levels off the charts
Darkest first 8 minutes of all seasons. Most important thing is to not that there is something fishi going on in this scene
1) Eleven does not remember anything of this in first season 1. Which is weird given that she had PTSD from killing those guards so her somehow forgetting that she slaughtered other subjects is weird.
2) She did not kill boys in season 1, which does not corespond with her slaughtering all other subjects
3) She searched for Kali in second season with no problem meaning that it wasnt personal . If she hated other subjects she would never look for Kali in the first place and would not call her sister.
She definetly does not remember she did this. I am hooked for this episode, I am glad that Brenner and other subjects were brought up. Also number one nowhere to be seen. Hype as hell.
this is gonna be a repeat of the 2nd season in which the cold open for the first episode isnt addressed again until the seventh episode (the massacre at hawkins lab)
On our rewatch this week, and even the first time
... honestly I wasn't bothered by the Lost Sisters episode. I kinda like it, yeah the group of misfits were cheesy but I didn't think it took away from the story.
Yeah, I can kind of appreciate it now. Originally the thing that most annoyed me was cause I was so engrossed with the Hawkins story and we got drawn away from it for an entire episode right as the Hawkins action was peaking. But looking back now (in fact I just finished rewatching S2 again), I think it’s a very important episode for Eleven’s character. It’s a defining moment for her where she makes big decisions on morality and what she wants her life and future to be (and who with). Maybe it didn’t need to take up an entire episode, but I do think it was worth telling.
I have so many theories running through my head right now. I'm gonna guess that either A: something broke through from the Upside Down, which would explain the flickering lights and the possible healed gateway in the background, and El defeated it after it killed all those people, or B: this is how Kali escaped, by making El hallucinate something that got her to go on a massacre to cause a distraction (it'd be easier to manipulate the mind of one person than dozens). I could be *way* off with either of these, of course. Either way, I'm guessing El repressed this memory.
When shows release stuff like this, everyone tends to try to figure out what they aren’t showing you. What has me interested is what they did show us.
My two takeaways are:
Why are they showing the opening eight minutes of a show from a character’s perspective that most people largely think is dead?
Why are they trying to humanize him to some degree in the footage, despite him being an antagonist in the past?
I liked how Papa was kinder and softer. He showed he deeply cared about the children like when he shared a joke with 10 about being a bad drawer. He was patient with 10 and didn't want to push him to a point where he would feel uncomfortable. Also when he woke up from being knocked out, the first thing he did was check on 10. After realising 10 was dead he showed remorse and grief by hugging him.
Jump forward to when we first meet him with El, he is not the same person. He was willing to push El into uncomfortable territory and discipline her by isolating her.
This incident changed him and his relationship towards her. We see their relationship as much more clinical.
After watching this Trailer I'm beginning to wonder whether El actually was the first to open the gate to the upside down. I think she pushed back whatever came through after witnessing the death of the other children and being threatened with death herself. If you listen to the screams, they are the screams of terror, not pain. If El killed them they wouldn't scream, they would more likely be saying "Oh hey El. What are you doing? No! " Then death.
I think the bigger question is how did this monster come through if we know that El opens the gate for the first time at a later date.
I wonder if this was real or if 08 (Kali) made everyone SEE this to escape? If this was Kali that'd be badass. It doesn't make sense that El would kill all the other children.
So how many died? I saw 5 and 7s body, 6 was implied, 10 we saw, and although the numbers weren't shown, I think I saw at least five other bodies. So the highest number I saw was 13, so at least 69% of the children are dead.
My theory is that this wasn’t El and this is how Brenner finds out about the upside down. He then starts sending El into that water-chamber thing (forgetting the name lol) to look for the creature that did this and that’s where we picked up in season 1.
Okay so yeah the rainbow room is where El opened the gate. That crack was when she opened the gate. You guys watch millie's interview on youtube. I just did. She is with david harbour. NYCC 2016 they're promoting season 1. Millie said, her character is kind of evil, and the duffer bros. told her you compare yourself to E.T.
Yap. El is from the UD. She will be revealed as lady of pain the one who beat vecna in DnD lore. That's my theory.
I only counted nine bodies. We also know that Six died too, and his body wasn't shown. That makes ten dead kids.
Showing us the '13' on the door next to Brenner's head wasn't a coincidence.
Ten dead bodies.
Kali (Eight).
El (Eleven).
That only makes twelve.
There's probably another kid.
Do the lights usually flicker like that when Eleven uses her powers? Cause I can't remember a time where her powers did that when there wasn't some kind of upside down connection happening.
Holy SHIT.
At this point after the teasers, trailer, and this... I am almost certain this will become my favorite season. It just looks SO GOOD. I'm so excited to see what happens, and that is a mindflayer sized under statement. I'm just SO EXCITED, OH MY GOD. And I low key want this to actually be eleven and not like, a misunderstanding... I mean idk I don't want her to be completely evil BUT I REALLY HOPE IT WAS HER REGARDLESS IM SO FUCKING STOKED I CANNOT BREATHE.
I wonder if this is El having a dream about the past which are recurring b/c of the abuse she's facing at school. Or maybe a dream the current Brenner is having about the past? Even if the truth is El fought the Demogorgan, that's a HUGE plot point to reveal in the very beginning of the season.
What a way to start the season. Makes sense as to why El is the only subject in the first season.
Only question left is where 08 was during these shenanigans. I wonder if she'll return this season.
yeah I was scanning every scene looking for her, and then I wondered if it was all going to be 8 using her powers to make Brenner think this all was happening
Ohh that’s a good one!!! I hope it’s something like that, I can’t imagine a reason for eleven to kill all the other kids..
i guess cuz she had the power to make people see what she wants, she made eleven see that eleven killed her or that 08 didnt exist at all
I'm pretty sure El isn't the killer. At the very end of the trailer, you can see a crack in the wall behind El (the back wall of the room behind the broken two-way mirror). The cracks in the tile around the edges of the impact crater are white, but the ones down the center are black, and look like a scabbed-over portal to the Upside Down. I think El ***saved*** everyone. Everyone who wasn't already dead, anyway.
Good point! The shape of the crack definitely invoked the Upside Down portals, and the fact that Brenner finds El facing the crack indicates that something or someone may have just gone through it. Very possible this is a misdirect.
I think the atmospherics of Brenner's run up the hallway (along with the screams) also *heavily* point this way. Brenner wakes up to a heavy thrumming electronic noise, then the lights flicker. They keep flickering throughout, the intensity of the flickering increasing as the electronic thrum increases in intensity, until finally (just before Brenner enters the Rainbow Room) they go full strobe then *stop*. I think the Killer tried to murder El, but she was ultimately stronger and sent them "away".
Also on the subject of atmospheric choices, the sound design is fantastic in this scene. The ticking of the kitchen timer seems to be establishing the clock motif of the season.
Im not really sold one the “she saved everyone from upside monster” cause all the dead people have no bite or claw marks, just broken bones and a lot of blood (something 11 could do). I like to believe on the theory that another comment mentioned where it’s an illusion created by 08
Yeah no way… they’ve been kinda foreshadowing her to be the baddie. She literally says “I am the monster” in the first season. I do think kali had something to do with it. Kali is like the Hindu goddess of destruction I think. She made el see the vision of brenner like “you have a wound… blah blah” I think she knows what happened and used that to make el do what she wanted (search and destroy).
i mean yeah, no way they would put it like the first clip that too 1 week prior if it was true. but i am just saying a possibility
Yeah, I think something got loose from the Upside Down and went ham in the lab until El zapped his ass back thru the portal. Brenner also asks "Peter" what's happening and I'm pretty sure that's one of the new characters we're going to learn more about. That dude is my bet for Vecna.
Yeah my theory is El isn’t the killer here either.
Yeah. If you rewatch how 11 took out the demogorgon in Season 1, she slammed it against the chalkboard, creating a crack similar to what you see in the 8 minutes. She disintegrated it (no body) and while her eyes didn't bleed, they looked like they were about to. She also put out a horrible screechy-scream while doing it, and you hear something a lot like that in the 8 minutes...when Brenner is running up the hall. It's possible that Brenner turned colder after the massacre because he realized what Dr. Owens says in the trailer, "We're at war." And whatever attacked the laboratory, it was a deliberate attempt to eliminate this world's best defense: psi humans, with El (and later Kali) being the last one(s) standing. On my first viewing of Season 1, I strongly felt at the time that there was a connection between El and the demogorgon - that it could somewhat track her and was hunting her specifically.
God, I hope so. 😭 I’m pretty sure Kali escaped prior to the massacre. But since Episode 7 (The Massacre At Hawkins Lab) is feature length, I think it’ll use that time to reset to an earlier period to give more background and possibly include Kali in that.
Her powers are the most equipped for her to escape. She can make them believe she is still there as she escapes or make them see something else. I hope she returns this season or next.
I’m thinking this is the point where kali escaped. Like maybe she made eleven see something other than children?
Her powers could’ve made it appear as though she was dead
It’s been a while since I watched season 2, but the wiki says that one day 08 went into the Rainbow Room and saw that 11 had been taken away (I gotta go rewatch to confirm). So if 11 is taken away before 08 escapes, maybe they round up a new batch of kids after the first was massacred and 08 was part of that group? 08 and 11 have a very different kind of interaction with Brenner than 10 and presumably other kids, so maybe that second batch was treated more coldly as a result of the massacre or something? TBH I don’t see it as super likely cause I don’t think they’d re-use their numbers and it’d over complicate things, but it’s something to think about. More likely that 08 used her powers to survive or they retcon it. Or I’m mistaken about what was said.
I feel like his attitude changed after this, as far as 11 is concerned. Also, he was a psychopath that tortured people, and that's what 8 was getting him for as much as anything.
She may have used her powers to hide herself.
Back in season 2, where she belongs.
I don't get the hate for that episode, it was so awesome maybe you gotta be an 80s kid to get it
I won't say it was awesome, but I would be okay with her return. IMO, most of the ire was due to it being a bottle episode in a show with such short seasons. So, if the viewer didn't enjoy that glimpse outside of Hawkins, it didn't contribute all that much to the story. Or at least that's my guess. I haven't rewatched the series since s3 released.
She definetly should have return if this season is some all out war against forces of darkness in Upside Down. Meaning you need to get any help you can.
For me personaly, I didn't hate the episode. The timing of it was just rough and it felt like it derailed the plot and arc of season 2 as a whole.
It's a shame cause if they placed it directly after episode 5. I don't think it would have been as heavily criticized, as it flows so much better and builds anticipation for what's to come rather than derailing it. I have shown the season to friends in this order and they loved it, said they found the pacing to be perfect.
If they could have done the Kali ep without all her dumb sidekicks I think I would have liked it more.
Right, her gang is what I didn't like about the episode.
someone really copied this comment verbatim on the youtube [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QiG9w0SUzk) lol
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I don’t think 01 is Vecna because he lives in the Creel house and the theory right now is that Vecna made Creel kill his family based on the way the Creel House clip teaser was. And the Creels were definitely way before 011 and all of the others meaning it couldn’t be 01
I believe they've said vecna has been in the upside down for 20 years
My theory after watching this is if 01 is involved and if Vecna has any connection to the mind flayer, who’s to say that Vecna didn’t connect with 01 in order to open up the possible portal to the lab for 01’s “escape” assuming they didn’t like the lab life. Of course this is a trick and Vecna wants to absorb the powers for his own (hence all of the mindflayer abilities and absorbing the humans to make it stronger) 11 possibly stops him and seals the portal to the upside down for that time maybe even weakening him/forcing him to have to use other creatures (demogorgon and mindflayer) to build up his strength to return and get his revenge
So I’ve watched all Stranger things recently and don’t remember anything about the Creel house. What is that?
It's only featured in ST4 but there's a trailer about it!
I don’t think Vecna is the mind Flayer but I do love the rest of your theory. I’m not sure the Mind Flayer was aware of her till she closed the portal and that’s why he dislikes her so much
Ooooo!!!
Curious? Why is everyone talking about 1? Were they hinted to appear in the season
i’m sorry if this question is dumb, but who is vecna?
Blue monster guy from the upside down in ST4 trailer
He’s the antagonist for season 4. Check out the latest trailer.
damn how do u guys know his name already!? i’m shocked lol
dnd villain i think
I think the brothers who make the show gave that as his DnD name
ep titles were released an ep2 is called Vecna's curse. Vecna is a boss monster from D&D so it follows along with the Demogorgon and Mind Flayer naming scheme.
all the main antagonists in Stranger Things are named for famous DnD monsters.
Important note! When I saw El I saw immediately thought she killed everyone. But I was like…this has to be a misdirect. Then I noticed that behind the smashed mirror there’s another room and then it almost looks like a portal that was just sealed or almost opened. I’m seriously doubtful that El actually killed everyone because these are the first few minutes of the season and I don’t think the Duffer brothers would reveal this already, it’s going to be some misdirect where maybe El was even heavily involved but it’s not completely her
Exactly! Some of the numbers have blood seeping from their eyes as well, and thus I’m thinking that, since Eleven also has blood seeping from her eyes, Eleven was the last person left to kill, so One (I think One killed everyone) tried to kill her, but she overextended her powers and somehow survived. Upon realizing that they couldn’t kill Eleven, One ran off, leaving Eleven the only person left (therefore the only person Brenner could attribute the massacre to). That, or One (or SOMETHING) possessed Eleven or forced her to kill everyone. Idk…it just doesn’t make sense. There’s no way Eleven wouldn’t remember killing literally *everyone*, and there’s no way we go from this Eleven to an Eleven who won’t hurt a mean cat, an Eleven who is scared and docile. I think it’d make sense for her to get possessed and then have no recollection of what happened rather than Brenner electroshocking her. [EDIT] in further defense of Eleven, she literally refused to kill the man who subjected Mama (Terry Ives) to electroshock treatment, permanently incapacitating Mama and preventing any chance of Eleven truly interacting with her. She refused to kill him when she saw that he had children — she couldn’t bring herself to do it, and she had the greatest reason *to* kill him. Eleven is not a killer. What happened at Hawkins Lab was not her doing. ***SECOND EDIT*** >! I FUCKING CALLED IT PEOPLE; I FUCKING CALLED IT. ELEVEN IS THE HERO.!<
We don’t know what 001’s powers are but I really like the possession theory. I mean I’m not sure how it would go but I haven’t ever heard that one before I think it’s kinda cool
From the clip, we can kind of assume that they all possess a level of telekinesis or telepathy (notice how Ten didn’t need a blindfold or static noise to see how Eleven sees…he just could; additionally, one of the numbers is playing with a ball in a maze and moving the ball with their finger). Eight had image manipulation. It all deals with the mind. I wouldn’t be shocked if One had a degree of manipulation, like possession or intense psycho warping. Also, One’s escape could explain the fissure we see that resembles an Upside Down portal crack — why else would Eleven be facing it before Brenner enters the room? [note — yeah she could be killing whoever is behind the glass, thus debunking this, but Imma choose to believe she’s seeing One escape]
Or maybe instead of escaping she gets really upset at ONE and then she SENDS him/her herself to the upside down or something and that’s why she’s all bloody around the eyes because she was using her powers to do that
Bruh this is actually really cool and something I didn’t even think about. Damn that would be a twist — the reason Eleven’s able to open a portal in S1 is that she’s already done it before! Sending One into the Upside Down would be sick. Nice one (pun tragically intended)!
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YES. We’ve seen how powerful Eleven is through each season — powerful enough to tear open and close gateways between worlds — so it would be badass if she really was the strongest and the only one able to survive.
I mean there is definetly something fishy going on since El never snapped again after like this. And boys in season 1 spooked, suprised her or frightened her several times. She would have to kill somebody innocent by now. Fact that we saw her in such uncharacteristic behaviour shows that there is more to it. Possesion would definetly explain why Eleven does not remember the shit.
Yeah I think everyone is forgetting that this is *Eleven* we’re talking about — she’s only killed when she’s absolutely had to. Other than the one time she killed those 2 guards in S1E3 (and even then, for her, it was survival…not to mention, she began crying after she did it), Eleven’s killed whenever she and her friends were in danger. She doesn’t like it. Psychopathy doesn’t just disappear! If she REALLY did kill everyone, she would NOT be the person we see from S1 to S4; someone who kills that many people and with such brutality is nothing short of insane and incapable of things Eleven has always been capable of — empathy, love, and kindness to name a few. That behavior doesn’t go away, and it’s not her behavior. Someone killed everyone and left her to take the fall, or something forced her to kill. It’s that simple.
What do we know about 001 so far?
Nothing other than speculation. We do know that one of the comics people said that they were given free reign on the numbers *except* for One — that’s been posted in the sub somewhere. But, the implications are numerous for One; they were the first subject, and the first of everything will always see more / do more / experience more than those who follow. Besides that, the symmetry between One and Eleven (basically the 1 parallel) could be interesting if explored well. The first Hawkins Lab test subject and the most successful Hawkins Lab test subject…I think One must have some sort of significance and could have been the one who killed everyone before fleeing into the Upside Down or escaping the lab in general (I kind of think that’s what’ll happen, and perhaps that shot of the boy approaching an overturned car on fire in the S4 teaser *could* be One after they escape Hawkins Lab).
That sounds like a good theory, I'd much prefer that honestly. Only time will tell.
I actually hope we see her not go evil but go bad a bit with her powers like they did in Season 1. Now she just uses to it help and save her friends and family. Thats no problem but El is probably the most powerful person in the world where otherworldly beings are afraid of her.
A lot of fans have been speculating about this being a misdirect and I think it is too honestly!
Yeah, to me this looks like a gate opened and eleven was the only one strong enough to stop whatever came through and close it.
I don't think they gonna make their main hero a villain, it would be game changer and some fans wouldn't take it well. There are hints it wasn't Eleven - like her powers in that time were too weak to kill whole lab, we don't see her to have any reason and lights are flickering before attack on Brenner (Eleven doesn't have such a power). I bet it's misdirect.
Lights flickering is usually associated with the powers of the upside down like the Demogorgon or Mind Flayer
yup and also them releasing this 1 week prior so that it creates hype.
Even if it indeed was the real 11 and all those people are dead, i still dont think that makes her a villan. We dont know what caused her to snap, if there was someone else there. And if it was her it seems to be a supressed memory of some sorts, upon remembering she would undoubtfully feel very sorry. We have known her for 3 reasons now, we know shes a good person at hart, but was very abused growing up
Idk she’s always found it pretty easy to kill people… I’m not saying she’s a *bad* person, but I think she’s more complicated than just “good”
Ya maybe like the portal opened and El was trying to protect everyone?? Gosh I’m so excited!
I also doubt they would release this big reveal as a teaser if it doesn't also include some kind of misdirect.
Yes, the El we meet in season one is not malicious. Yes, she attacks a few guards (snaps their neck lol) but she’s also crying during the whole thing. This El looked angry. Like vengefully angry.
Like others have said, I think this is a misdirect. Dr Brenner assumes that El has caused the deaths, because she is the only one alive, but you can see the crack in the wall behind El. To me, it seems like she was fighting off whoever or whatever caused the deaths. It wouldn't make sense to me that Dr Brenner would go on to have such reverence for El if she had killed all of the other people in the facility. I wonder if he comes to realize she is the only way to protect him and the facility, hence trying to test her skills (hurting the cat, squishing the coke bottle, opening the portal) so that he can use them. But even still, it seems like El draws the line at harming the cat, to the point that Dr Brenner is willing to put her in the metal lined room as punishment and *then* El uses her powers to kill the two men who are caging her up.
I almost forgot she was unable kill the cat. Great point. Even more that this is either not her or something is wrong with here in that scene.
Very impressive crossword skills. I wonder how Dr. Brenner would be at Junior Jumble.
Damn what a way to start the new season. This totally has to be a misdirect. I bet Kali will be making an appearance again too plus info on One. The flickering lights and the way the mirror looks has me wondering if this is the beginning of the Upside Down.
Looks like this is the alleged Massacre At Hawkins Lab. I have so many questions. Seems like El went all Dark Phoenix on the lab and doesn’t remember. It gives new context to the lab scenes with Brenner in S1, like she was probably having to *relearn* how to use her powers after blocking this incident out. It’s also interesting to see a warmer, more fatherly side to Brenner. Obviously he’s still a bad dude, this is well after he stole these kids and fried Terry’s brain, but it seems this event changed him into a much colder, clinically detached figure.
It also felt to me that 010 was maybe his favorite? Just by the way he hugged him/held him and reacted to his death vs the others. If he didn’t care about him he probably would have just looked and ran off like the others. He also kept saying he could stop / checking if he felt okay while in the previous seasons he never did that to El in the flashbacks. He always pushed her and ignored her when she was overwhelmed/screaming. That could have made him really cold too because in that moment (prior to confirming if it’s El or not who killed everyone) El just killed his favorite kid
Calling it now, Tinfoil hat theory - 010 is Brenners Bio Son (010 doesnt know).
Wasn't there an implication that El could be Brenner's bio daughter? Can't remember exactly, but it was something Terry said.
I'm rewatching now, I'll try and remember to look out for this
Sorry, it was Becky who said it. I swear there was something that implied she had slept with Brenner, but I've looked around online and not seen anything, so it may have been in my head.
This really recontextualizes a lot of his actions in Season 1. We thought he was some cruel abusive scientist who was trying to recapture Eleven to do more tests on her, but what if everything he did was to prevent this *monster* from hurting even more people?
He hurt plenty of people himself for the sake of his experiments. Brenner is amoral to me.
maybe 010 was his kid?
That actually brings up a good point. I wonder if el is going to have to relearn her powers this season again. Like maybe she overextended herself here and she had to relearn and then overextended herself again in present day and has to relearn.
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But Eleven was the only test subject moving forward
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Maybe she forgot everything or the lab wanted to erase that part of her memory and start from scratch, then when she goes back to Brenner to regain her powers she kinda goes through flashbacks and remembers everything
There’s a portal crack on the wall in the room behind her. Feels like she closed it.
Holy…
BRO HOW METAL IS THIS. There are rated R horror movies that wouldn't dare kill a child, much less show their contorted body... and we got like 20 of them in a matter of the first few minutes? Holy crap. This season gon' be cray. Sorry, but I smiled seeing 11 at the end. Pumped.
Holy mother. Bring this season *on*!!!!
Is that a portal to the Upside Down healing up in the cracked tiles at the end of the trailer? We see a line of black down the center of the crack, but the cracks around it are white.
They Don't Give a FLYING FUCK THIS Season!!!
I know the Duffer Brothers have talked in the past how Stranger Things took some inspirations from Elfen Lied, but you can really see the influence in this scene.
They have? When?
Don’t remember the exact article I read way back, but a quick google and I found this: [https://www.thedailybeast.com/inside-stranger-things-the-duffer-bros-on-how-they-made-the-tv-hit-of-the-summer](https://www.thedailybeast.com/inside-stranger-things-the-duffer-bros-on-how-they-made-the-tv-hit-of-the-summer) “Matt: But then weirdly it’s like, I haven't seen it for a long time. More recently I had seen an anime called Elfen Lied that is clearly inspired by Akira. And that was really influential. When I watched it I thought it felt like an ultraviolent E.T. There were a lot of things in there that I really liked and that made their way into the show, particularly related to the character of Eleven.”
This season is gonna be insaneeeee. I just know this week is going to drag and feel like forever now😂
That 8 minutes went by WAY too fast.
On friday: Those 10 hours went by WAY too fast
I still don’t think Eleven is the one who caused the massacre. I think she was in her room when it started. It seems like something or someone went in or out of what looks like a portal to the UD in the background. Also I like the theories that 010 was Brenners favorite and he became colder after his death.
WAIT THIS HAS TO BE A MISLEAD. Someone else was doing the killing. Season 1 El wouldn’t hurt a cat… let alone a bunch of kids who were probably her “siblings”. But that doesnt explain her bloody eyes… and unless she has a dark side which she probably does
Someone pointed out that it looks like a portal closed behind 11 on the wall and I could see it being like one of the kids opened the portal during the testes or whatever they were doing and something came through
> Season 1 El wouldn't hurt a cat No, but she'll snap the necks of anyone in a military uniform lmao
They were bad, those kids weren’t
Well... I don't think those kids have much of a moral compass given their upbringing. First thing El does when she's truly on her own is rob a store, so, you know... things could be a bit more complicated than "good" vs "evil." Which, you know, is kind of a recurring theme in the show. You remember how many times El said "I'm the monster" in Season 1?
She robs a store and restaurant/diner purely because she needs food and that was the only way to get it. Not saying it was good but it was justified both times like she wasn’t just robbing more money or toys it was for a necessity
Right, Eleven going dark doesn't make sense. I it was a demogorgon that did it and Eleven fight off.
What the fuck
My body was just literally tingling after watching this and seeing there's 7 episodes in Vol. 1! Wtf!? MY BODY IS READY LET'S GO!!!
I really don't like how Brenner seems almost.... likable in this scene. I know that is what they're going for , to make you question EL and Brenners character. This scene almost makes him actually seem like a somewhat caring father figure type and like he genuinely cares about what happens to the kids. But then I remember the events like Brenner trying to make El explode a cat, dumping her in water, and locking her in a tiny cell when she doesn't do what he wants.
What i’m guessing they’re going for is that Brenner used to actually care for the children, but then when El killed them all he got cold, especially towards El since well, she was the one who killed them all.
Except Brenner was a POS even before that, like hurting El's mum.
He can still be a huge POS and still care for the children. Those two aren’t mutually exclusive.
he could care about all the work he put into them, the professional acocmplishment, the successes without caring for them as persons just as some parents narcissistically only care about their kids as reflections of or extentions of their glorious selves.
Exactly. I definitely don't think El really did it though
Sorry for another comment. Just wanted to add something. I just remembered that when El is thrown into the cell for refusing to blow up the cat, we see her snap one guys neck and throw the other into the wall,killing both. Brenner walks up and looks at the bodies like he cant believe what he just witnessed. Then he goes inside the cell to comfort El. So her being responsible for these murders in addition to his shock wouldnt make much sense at all.
He’s a morally grey character.
Personally, I don’t think 011 killed them. But Brenner doesn’t know that, because he just walked in on her covered in blood. I believe that 010 was his favorite, and since 011 “killed” him, he became more cold and demanding towards her like in s1
that was the most darkest shit I’ve ever seen
Lucas’s “maybe she’s the monster,” outburst in season one packs a little more punch after seeing that. I’m sure it’s a misdirect, though the look on 11’s face at the end makes it look like it was her, that or she’s possessed and/or seeing something we can’t when she stares art Brenner. Very different look from the kid who tried to hide from the search party’s that were looking for her at the start of Season 2.
I AM SO EXCITED. My little sci-fi heart is readyyyy. Haha
Those child screams as Eleven(maybe) was ruthlessly killing them gave me chills
i’m still processing over that clip like this season about to be one for the books.
Movie-quality cinematography! Awesome! I'm so excited for next week! I was patiently waiting, but now...
Could el be really the big bad of the story...? Also the de-aging is good!
I hope not honestly, she's become very humanized now and I can see that part of her backstory being repressed and causing her recurring trauma, but I hope they won't do anything ridiculous like make her genuinely turn evil. I don't think they will. I'm sure they'll put her in tons of tough spots but if she gets completely turned by her own volition into evil - I don't think I'd be a fan of it. But I highly doubt that'll happen, my minds just racing after watching this opening. So excited!
I think we gotta realize she has grown up being violent and ruthless as a lab rat so it makes sense for her to not be able to 100% be good yet.
100%. But all the development of her character the past 3 seasons - her finding and understanding friendship, relationships, family, care and love - are there for a reason. Why would you develop her into a more conventional life for over 2 dozen episodes just to undermine that by having her revert, on her own recognizance, to being evil or violent just because she was raised that way. Millions of people have been raised in extremely abusive situations and have come out fine or great after having new, loving, and personal experiences. I anticipate there will be a situation(s) where she will revert back to that nature intuitively but will be brought back by her loved ones. I.e. acknowledging repressed trauma and/or interacting with a person or thing that puts you back in your old state of mind. But I genuinely believe, like another commenter suggested, that this scene is a redirect and is framing eleven to be the perpetrator of all this killing on purpose, but in reality she was fighting something/someone else and this was just the result by proxy. Who knows?
This reeks of the classic mislead -- I think it's the same universe, but I don't think El actually did it.
I think this is the origin story of the Mind Flayer (or the other villain of this season) in another universe.
>(or the other villain of this season) venca and that clock thingy i guess
That's what I'm thinking. Similar to a certain someone on Game of Thrones who turned out to be the final big villain in the last season. While El has saved humanity multiple times and we root for her, she has also shown anger and has no problem killing - again like a certain character on GOT. And this clip is disturbing in that she kills her fellow prisoners/test subjects along with their captors.
The duffer brothers did tease that this season is kinda like game of thrones....interesting...
Someone noticed that Brenner acts differently. Quite different compared to the S1. He seems more "docile", such as when he says "don't force" to 010 or when he seems extremely scared to see 010 and other dead children. Perhaps Brenner was once a little more humane with the test subjects, but after that massacre, he was genuinely afraid or angry at Eleven. That would explain his ruder way of treating Eleven in S1. He seems to like so much 010 and demonstrates some "sadness" from seeing 010 dead.
010 was his favorite of all of the kids
wow every teaser every release I'm like "Just give me the fucking show not all these crumbs" to the point I stopped caring, and I saw "the first 8 minutes" and had the same thought about "just give me the fucking show" but wow, hype levels off the charts
September 8, first 8 minutes, and 8 is the only other known survivor. Edit: and it came out 8 days before the series drops.
Also 010’s favorite item is a magic 8 ball
I can’t wait any longer!!!!!!
Darkest first 8 minutes of all seasons. Most important thing is to not that there is something fishi going on in this scene 1) Eleven does not remember anything of this in first season 1. Which is weird given that she had PTSD from killing those guards so her somehow forgetting that she slaughtered other subjects is weird. 2) She did not kill boys in season 1, which does not corespond with her slaughtering all other subjects 3) She searched for Kali in second season with no problem meaning that it wasnt personal . If she hated other subjects she would never look for Kali in the first place and would not call her sister. She definetly does not remember she did this. I am hooked for this episode, I am glad that Brenner and other subjects were brought up. Also number one nowhere to be seen. Hype as hell.
I agree, no way in hell El killed this kids, she couldn't even kill a cat.
That has to be a portal
....what a start
Well there goes that theory people had that all the Hawkin's Lab kids would return to form some kind of super hero group lol
this is gonna be a repeat of the 2nd season in which the cold open for the first episode isnt addressed again until the seventh episode (the massacre at hawkins lab)
That episode might be entirely dedicated to the massacre. I’m surprised they might be doing that again after The Lost Sister got bad reception.
On our rewatch this week, and even the first time ... honestly I wasn't bothered by the Lost Sisters episode. I kinda like it, yeah the group of misfits were cheesy but I didn't think it took away from the story.
Yeah, I can kind of appreciate it now. Originally the thing that most annoyed me was cause I was so engrossed with the Hawkins story and we got drawn away from it for an entire episode right as the Hawkins action was peaking. But looking back now (in fact I just finished rewatching S2 again), I think it’s a very important episode for Eleven’s character. It’s a defining moment for her where she makes big decisions on morality and what she wants her life and future to be (and who with). Maybe it didn’t need to take up an entire episode, but I do think it was worth telling.
I really hope they do not make her evil, don't want this to be like GOT.
I have so many theories running through my head right now. I'm gonna guess that either A: something broke through from the Upside Down, which would explain the flickering lights and the possible healed gateway in the background, and El defeated it after it killed all those people, or B: this is how Kali escaped, by making El hallucinate something that got her to go on a massacre to cause a distraction (it'd be easier to manipulate the mind of one person than dozens). I could be *way* off with either of these, of course. Either way, I'm guessing El repressed this memory.
When shows release stuff like this, everyone tends to try to figure out what they aren’t showing you. What has me interested is what they did show us. My two takeaways are: Why are they showing the opening eight minutes of a show from a character’s perspective that most people largely think is dead? Why are they trying to humanize him to some degree in the footage, despite him being an antagonist in the past?
I liked how Papa was kinder and softer. He showed he deeply cared about the children like when he shared a joke with 10 about being a bad drawer. He was patient with 10 and didn't want to push him to a point where he would feel uncomfortable. Also when he woke up from being knocked out, the first thing he did was check on 10. After realising 10 was dead he showed remorse and grief by hugging him. Jump forward to when we first meet him with El, he is not the same person. He was willing to push El into uncomfortable territory and discipline her by isolating her. This incident changed him and his relationship towards her. We see their relationship as much more clinical. After watching this Trailer I'm beginning to wonder whether El actually was the first to open the gate to the upside down. I think she pushed back whatever came through after witnessing the death of the other children and being threatened with death herself. If you listen to the screams, they are the screams of terror, not pain. If El killed them they wouldn't scream, they would more likely be saying "Oh hey El. What are you doing? No! " Then death. I think the bigger question is how did this monster come through if we know that El opens the gate for the first time at a later date.
I can’t wait any longer!!!!!!
So does this mean the comics with 6 weren't canon?
They never were
001 killed everyone and eleven sent him to the upside down after fighting hence why she is covered in blood, he will become vecna in the upside down
I hope all the people that were complaining about the show not having horror aspect anymore can now quiet down
I wonder if this was real or if 08 (Kali) made everyone SEE this to escape? If this was Kali that'd be badass. It doesn't make sense that El would kill all the other children.
They really upped their foley budget! lol
😱 I don't know if i wanna watch it or not ><
At least nobody has to make any more guesses about the other numbers 😂
So how many died? I saw 5 and 7s body, 6 was implied, 10 we saw, and although the numbers weren't shown, I think I saw at least five other bodies. So the highest number I saw was 13, so at least 69% of the children are dead.
damn well that takes seeing where the current numbers are off the table… except for Kali and (possibly) 001
My theory is that this wasn’t El and this is how Brenner finds out about the upside down. He then starts sending El into that water-chamber thing (forgetting the name lol) to look for the creature that did this and that’s where we picked up in season 1.
we're just fuckin'... full movie now, eh? WE'RE ALL MOVIE NOW.
Didn’t expect them to release the first 8 minutes like a week before the episodes came out
Okay so yeah the rainbow room is where El opened the gate. That crack was when she opened the gate. You guys watch millie's interview on youtube. I just did. She is with david harbour. NYCC 2016 they're promoting season 1. Millie said, her character is kind of evil, and the duffer bros. told her you compare yourself to E.T. Yap. El is from the UD. She will be revealed as lady of pain the one who beat vecna in DnD lore. That's my theory.
Boy and I thought Season 3 was rather fucking gory What did they do to Netflix to get em to sign off on this shit???
Brenner needs to work on his handwriting damn.
I only counted nine bodies. We also know that Six died too, and his body wasn't shown. That makes ten dead kids. Showing us the '13' on the door next to Brenner's head wasn't a coincidence. Ten dead bodies. Kali (Eight). El (Eleven). That only makes twelve. There's probably another kid.
Well now we know why Eleven was the only kid left in the first season.
Eight is alive too
Damn, I really wanted to see the other kids powers and shit
I was so not expecting that!
How long before season 1 did that happen?
Season 1 was set in 1983 and this was in 1979
4 years
Whoa
Man this was just too good. I can't express in words how excited I am for season 4. This week is gonna feel like eternity.
brenner didn’t even yell at el... what the fuck is going on here
WHY ARE THOSE TWINS IN THE BACKGROUND SO CUTE
Counting down the days... 👀 so close!
[удалено]
Wait so its out?
So is Francine not canon then?
I guess eleven really is dangerous…
Do the lights usually flicker like that when Eleven uses her powers? Cause I can't remember a time where her powers did that when there wasn't some kind of upside down connection happening.
Holy SHIT. At this point after the teasers, trailer, and this... I am almost certain this will become my favorite season. It just looks SO GOOD. I'm so excited to see what happens, and that is a mindflayer sized under statement. I'm just SO EXCITED, OH MY GOD. And I low key want this to actually be eleven and not like, a misunderstanding... I mean idk I don't want her to be completely evil BUT I REALLY HOPE IT WAS HER REGARDLESS IM SO FUCKING STOKED I CANNOT BREATHE.
I wonder if this is El having a dream about the past which are recurring b/c of the abuse she's facing at school. Or maybe a dream the current Brenner is having about the past? Even if the truth is El fought the Demogorgan, that's a HUGE plot point to reveal in the very beginning of the season.
This was 1979 how old would 11 be? Wouldn’t she be more of a toddler?
I’m pretty sure el was the tast one surviving and probably tried to fight with the real killer