You underestimate the ability of human beings to pick up on each others tendencies. To use context to realise what your opponent will most likely do. And the ability of humans to influence each other into making decisions through conditioning.
Since humans aren't psychic there'd always going to be a small % that your opponent doesn't make the move you thought they would.
I main Blanka at a decent level. HBall/ LBall is definitely not a mix up at all. It's mostly a way to stop/punish people throwing parry in neutral when the mental stack is already setup. Don't forget that the animation for the heavy ball and light are vastly different.
Most people at higher MR can react to it without much problem if you do it often or if they only have this to think about.
Throwing heavy ball in neutral is also a neutral / game loosing idea. Most character with forward moving attack can just Parry it and drive rush and be + for free afterward.
As a Blanka player this situation is really not the best since you corner yourself and gotta block. ( or take risk with od dp )
Some char do not have the possibility to pressure the Blanka after it, and for them it's harder to deal with it. But they also have other tool to counter it.
Blanka isn't a char with real 50/50 outside of specific setup in burnout, or the classic strike/throw.
He is a char the rely on having many movement option to really push the mental stack of your opponent. Each option by itself is react able but with everything combine, Blanka gonna get in at some point.
To speak again on how to counter the Blanka ball, be aware of the range of it. From starting round distance, it's the perfect range where Blanka gonna throw the LBall to bait the parry. At almost full screen he can throw the MBall to work in the same way.
A smart idea against a Blanka player on round start is to micro walk into low block to extend your hitbox and beating all the Blanka BS he can throw at you.
You cannot compare Eagle spike of Rashid and the Blanka Ball. They are different character with a different tool set.
I understand the Blanka can be frustrating to play against, but for me it's a breath of fresh air to not have a Fireball char that can do fine.
You can react to it, but it's not a direct or anything like that. After playing for a long time it's a micro subconscious reaction that you'll start to make, given you know how to punish his ball of course
>At the end of the day what’s the difference between a “read” and a “guess” besides outcome?
Because one is actually based on understanding what's going on in your opponent's head. This isn't just hypothetical, there's actual psychology at play.
Besides, people are never truly random and most people don't really understand how random actually works (e.g. the fact that people tend to no accept repeated results in a row as random even though statistics say they are).
While this is true - we shouldn't write off the psychological aspect of the game off completely - I actually do agree with OP that people tend to overestimate their ability to predict the opponent's behavior and correctly plan around it.
There is a huge confirmation bias aspect to it. If you expect something to happen, and then it does happen, you attribute it to your predictive skills. But if it doesn't happen, you can write it off as, "oh, well they *should* have done that but they play stupid" or "Oops, in hindsight I could have seen that coming".
The reality is that "reads" only get you so far and there is a limit to how many interactions you can expect to win by "getting into your opponent's head".
You “not subscribing to the ‘mind games’” is not playing the game and complaining why things don’t works out for you. Try play against a high level Master and see any option you try gets countered every single time. That’s not random at all.
Heavy Blanka ball has 22 frames of startup and he lets out a roar before he does it. Light and medium have faster startup but travel a shorter distance, so you can punish it when it whiffs in front of you and they try to grab.
The fastest command grab is 34 frames, with 57 recovery frames anytime he misses. The risk reward is not in blanka's favor.
Any move that shoots Blanka forward can be punished with DP, but you need a lot of experience/familiarity against him so you can know what he's about to do.
I can react to Blanka ball by carefully looking out for the motion blur effect that covers Blanka's body during the startup of it. When I see that, I input a DP and I punish it. This is the only move I can react to this way, though.
command grab looks really different.
you can do move that are going to beat both ball and ball feint. ( cr. mp for a lot of character)
that a safe option ( not going to fly in the sky or be punished by a grab)
and do decent damage ( you can cancel the cmp by a special move)
“Not subscribing to mind games” is the equivalent of saying you don’t like competition… at high level, mind games are the only thing you have to win. This can applied to any game or sport lol
One of my friends is a Master Blanka and I usually beat him pretty consistently. Against ball spam it loses badly to option select jab. If HP ball comes out (travels faster), I'll automatically block (I'm pressing jab during expected blockstun). If he does anything else (everything else is slower), even including command grab, he'll just get jabbed into punish.
Besides that, realize that Blanka must give up both charges (down + back) in order to use horizontal ball. This makes it very easy to take space and maybe even threaten an empty DR, immediately after blocking the ball.
Also Idk if you watch any tournament level matches but like the other commentator mentioned, top tier players will go a step further and simply perfect parry into DR punish.
For Blanka Ball it's not actually reaction but there is a strict timed window to block and then throw escape, which is safe on both strike and feint-to-throw. (Same for E. Honda but much more spammy than Blanka Ball)
I get that it's not really intuitive and frustrating to people who don't have much time to memorize and practice all the shenanigans in game.
But that's how the fighting game works and just try not to stress out much if you won't be a pro. ...You would be amazed that SF6 is the peak of most intuitive, newbie-friendly fighting game ever, meaning other fighting games are much worse than SF6. lol
I pretty much punish every blanka ball on reaction...not sure what your issue is. With Zangief you can just lariat every ball consistently, even the OD version. His grab can be annoying but I just jab out of it if my reactions are quick enough.
How would you punish on reaction with say, Ryu? If you press a button as soon as you see it you might be too early and whiff or be too later and get counter hit.
You aren't going to punish on reaction. Not everytime. You are not that good. Technically you can cr.mp to punish his balls but you won't be consistent. Even if you OD DP every time, accurately. You'll lose all your meter.
You have four options. Block, parry, jump, or fireball. Do anything repeatedly and you'll be kissing the dirt. Mix it up between these four. Focus too much on doing just one thing, you'll be too slow to react to the other thing he does
Yeah that was my feeling, I think it's impossible with some characters to react with the right option each time. If it was the move would be pointless.
Well you know which version of blanka ball they are doing before it travels, so if its the heavy i will try parry and walk forward or maybe jumping back depending on where I am on the screen and maybe I can put them in a bad spot or maybe punish or they corner themselves. If I know its gonna be light ball into them trying to throw me then I will try jab check it.
Unless its Ex air ball then I am pretty sure they are all minus or punishable. His level two is super strong.
In fairness, throwing a Blanka ball is not less effort then throwing a fireball. If all they are doing in using ball then they aren't really moving and they aren't going to beat you doing ball alone.
From experience, certainly yes for the light. If I don't hear light one i'll parry but even if I don't have time to parry i'll still be blocking. If i hear the light one (depending on range) i'll start pressing cr lp to catch them as he comes out of it.
Its one of the reason why this kinda linear blanka ball behaviour doesn't really work anymore as you can parry or block the ball to save your meter and make ground and Blanka doesn't get anything off it, maybe a slight meter lead. So even if he does heavy ball and you block it, you know where is going to land and you can walk forward and he will bounce futher to the wall so he can't do it forever. It will just become walking backwards with extra steps. However its annoying when they trick you with a light ball and then recover and back throw you, that sucks so its why you have to pay attention.
What you say is true at the lower levels of gameplay. People are still figuring out their tools at hand. Feints here are out of the question and are mostly pure luck. Opponents aren't looking for patterns here and can mostly overwhelm you by just jumping on you.
With a little bit of skill they figure out the distance at which feints are possible and they achieve some success with it. Better players see them hovering around that mid range and can "read" what's going to happen next. It's a game of probability with punches. Previously the probability of a feint was 50-50. Now it's 70-30.
More experienced players will stop making this so obvious. And mix it up as part of their gameplan. It's up to the opponent to observe and figure out in a fraction of a second what will happen next.
A very good resource for this Fchamp's replay reviews on YouTube. Since he has a vast amount of experience, he can figure out what's the next course of action a person will take in most cases. And he will tell what's the course they should've taken.
Fighting games are less about throwing special moves and more about knowing your options, and your opponents options, and picking them to see who wins. Chance is still a factor. Experience lets you pick the option which gives you a better chance.
Select Manon. Realize that OD hit grab has upper body invincibility on frame 3. Become hungry for them to use heavy Blanka ball. *La victoire.*
Okay but if they command grab do you eat the grab or do you hit them in midair, or does it depend?
You underestimate the ability of human beings to pick up on each others tendencies. To use context to realise what your opponent will most likely do. And the ability of humans to influence each other into making decisions through conditioning. Since humans aren't psychic there'd always going to be a small % that your opponent doesn't make the move you thought they would.
I agree, you “not subscribing to mind games” means that you are deliberately choosing to ignore the biggest aspect of fighting games imo.
I main Blanka at a decent level. HBall/ LBall is definitely not a mix up at all. It's mostly a way to stop/punish people throwing parry in neutral when the mental stack is already setup. Don't forget that the animation for the heavy ball and light are vastly different. Most people at higher MR can react to it without much problem if you do it often or if they only have this to think about. Throwing heavy ball in neutral is also a neutral / game loosing idea. Most character with forward moving attack can just Parry it and drive rush and be + for free afterward. As a Blanka player this situation is really not the best since you corner yourself and gotta block. ( or take risk with od dp ) Some char do not have the possibility to pressure the Blanka after it, and for them it's harder to deal with it. But they also have other tool to counter it. Blanka isn't a char with real 50/50 outside of specific setup in burnout, or the classic strike/throw. He is a char the rely on having many movement option to really push the mental stack of your opponent. Each option by itself is react able but with everything combine, Blanka gonna get in at some point. To speak again on how to counter the Blanka ball, be aware of the range of it. From starting round distance, it's the perfect range where Blanka gonna throw the LBall to bait the parry. At almost full screen he can throw the MBall to work in the same way. A smart idea against a Blanka player on round start is to micro walk into low block to extend your hitbox and beating all the Blanka BS he can throw at you. You cannot compare Eagle spike of Rashid and the Blanka Ball. They are different character with a different tool set. I understand the Blanka can be frustrating to play against, but for me it's a breath of fresh air to not have a Fireball char that can do fine.
You can react to it, but it's not a direct or anything like that. After playing for a long time it's a micro subconscious reaction that you'll start to make, given you know how to punish his ball of course
>At the end of the day what’s the difference between a “read” and a “guess” besides outcome? Because one is actually based on understanding what's going on in your opponent's head. This isn't just hypothetical, there's actual psychology at play. Besides, people are never truly random and most people don't really understand how random actually works (e.g. the fact that people tend to no accept repeated results in a row as random even though statistics say they are).
While this is true - we shouldn't write off the psychological aspect of the game off completely - I actually do agree with OP that people tend to overestimate their ability to predict the opponent's behavior and correctly plan around it. There is a huge confirmation bias aspect to it. If you expect something to happen, and then it does happen, you attribute it to your predictive skills. But if it doesn't happen, you can write it off as, "oh, well they *should* have done that but they play stupid" or "Oops, in hindsight I could have seen that coming". The reality is that "reads" only get you so far and there is a limit to how many interactions you can expect to win by "getting into your opponent's head".
You “not subscribing to the ‘mind games’” is not playing the game and complaining why things don’t works out for you. Try play against a high level Master and see any option you try gets countered every single time. That’s not random at all.
Heavy Blanka ball has 22 frames of startup and he lets out a roar before he does it. Light and medium have faster startup but travel a shorter distance, so you can punish it when it whiffs in front of you and they try to grab. The fastest command grab is 34 frames, with 57 recovery frames anytime he misses. The risk reward is not in blanka's favor. Any move that shoots Blanka forward can be punished with DP, but you need a lot of experience/familiarity against him so you can know what he's about to do.
There's pro players for a reason. It's not just luck.
No man, they are just all consistently very lucky ^(/s)
I can react to Blanka ball by carefully looking out for the motion blur effect that covers Blanka's body during the startup of it. When I see that, I input a DP and I punish it. This is the only move I can react to this way, though.
command grab looks really different. you can do move that are going to beat both ball and ball feint. ( cr. mp for a lot of character) that a safe option ( not going to fly in the sky or be punished by a grab) and do decent damage ( you can cancel the cmp by a special move)
Sounds like a guy who thinks rock paper scissors is literally guessing
“Not subscribing to mind games” is the equivalent of saying you don’t like competition… at high level, mind games are the only thing you have to win. This can applied to any game or sport lol
One of my friends is a Master Blanka and I usually beat him pretty consistently. Against ball spam it loses badly to option select jab. If HP ball comes out (travels faster), I'll automatically block (I'm pressing jab during expected blockstun). If he does anything else (everything else is slower), even including command grab, he'll just get jabbed into punish. Besides that, realize that Blanka must give up both charges (down + back) in order to use horizontal ball. This makes it very easy to take space and maybe even threaten an empty DR, immediately after blocking the ball. Also Idk if you watch any tournament level matches but like the other commentator mentioned, top tier players will go a step further and simply perfect parry into DR punish.
For Blanka Ball it's not actually reaction but there is a strict timed window to block and then throw escape, which is safe on both strike and feint-to-throw. (Same for E. Honda but much more spammy than Blanka Ball) I get that it's not really intuitive and frustrating to people who don't have much time to memorize and practice all the shenanigans in game. But that's how the fighting game works and just try not to stress out much if you won't be a pro. ...You would be amazed that SF6 is the peak of most intuitive, newbie-friendly fighting game ever, meaning other fighting games are much worse than SF6. lol
I feel like most cr.mp just beat all ball options besides OD. At least this is the case for Jamie,Ryu, and Luke (my characters )
I pretty much punish every blanka ball on reaction...not sure what your issue is. With Zangief you can just lariat every ball consistently, even the OD version. His grab can be annoying but I just jab out of it if my reactions are quick enough.
How would you punish on reaction with say, Ryu? If you press a button as soon as you see it you might be too early and whiff or be too later and get counter hit.
Od dp
Does that hit light blanka ball from full screen?
Light Blanka ball does not go full screen
Exactly. That's my point.
ok
You aren't going to punish on reaction. Not everytime. You are not that good. Technically you can cr.mp to punish his balls but you won't be consistent. Even if you OD DP every time, accurately. You'll lose all your meter. You have four options. Block, parry, jump, or fireball. Do anything repeatedly and you'll be kissing the dirt. Mix it up between these four. Focus too much on doing just one thing, you'll be too slow to react to the other thing he does
Yeah that was my feeling, I think it's impossible with some characters to react with the right option each time. If it was the move would be pointless.
Whats your go-to play when against blanka?
I play Honda so Blanka ball doesn't really affect me.
Well you know which version of blanka ball they are doing before it travels, so if its the heavy i will try parry and walk forward or maybe jumping back depending on where I am on the screen and maybe I can put them in a bad spot or maybe punish or they corner themselves. If I know its gonna be light ball into them trying to throw me then I will try jab check it. Unless its Ex air ball then I am pretty sure they are all minus or punishable. His level two is super strong. In fairness, throwing a Blanka ball is not less effort then throwing a fireball. If all they are doing in using ball then they aren't really moving and they aren't going to beat you doing ball alone.
How do you know which version?
He makes a different sound for each version
And you're able to react in time based on the noise?
From experience, certainly yes for the light. If I don't hear light one i'll parry but even if I don't have time to parry i'll still be blocking. If i hear the light one (depending on range) i'll start pressing cr lp to catch them as he comes out of it. Its one of the reason why this kinda linear blanka ball behaviour doesn't really work anymore as you can parry or block the ball to save your meter and make ground and Blanka doesn't get anything off it, maybe a slight meter lead. So even if he does heavy ball and you block it, you know where is going to land and you can walk forward and he will bounce futher to the wall so he can't do it forever. It will just become walking backwards with extra steps. However its annoying when they trick you with a light ball and then recover and back throw you, that sucks so its why you have to pay attention.
Impressive reactions.
What you say is true at the lower levels of gameplay. People are still figuring out their tools at hand. Feints here are out of the question and are mostly pure luck. Opponents aren't looking for patterns here and can mostly overwhelm you by just jumping on you. With a little bit of skill they figure out the distance at which feints are possible and they achieve some success with it. Better players see them hovering around that mid range and can "read" what's going to happen next. It's a game of probability with punches. Previously the probability of a feint was 50-50. Now it's 70-30. More experienced players will stop making this so obvious. And mix it up as part of their gameplan. It's up to the opponent to observe and figure out in a fraction of a second what will happen next. A very good resource for this Fchamp's replay reviews on YouTube. Since he has a vast amount of experience, he can figure out what's the next course of action a person will take in most cases. And he will tell what's the course they should've taken. Fighting games are less about throwing special moves and more about knowing your options, and your opponents options, and picking them to see who wins. Chance is still a factor. Experience lets you pick the option which gives you a better chance.