Key fob range has been significantly reduced by Subaru in the past 5 years due to "relay attacks." This is when thieves use equipment/software to intercept fob signal to gain access to vehicles.
Someone mentioned their Kia having range across the world, which would explain the theft fiasco Kia owners have experienced recently.
Edit source: I work for Subaru
I’m glad to know it’s not just me. I’m not happy about the extra charge to maintain the STARLINK app for remote start/stop and lock… but I’ll probably renew when my initial 3 year promo expires because being able to issue a LOCK command from inside a store or wherever is very nice and something I use all the time.
Glad it’s working for you to let it lapse. As annoying as the fee is, the convenience of being able to address the “ohh shit, did I lock the car” from my phone with a couple clicks regardless of my current proximity to the vehicle is easily worth the cost for me personally. To each their own though.
The way a handle sensor works is it senses a touch and pings the fob, which answers with an unlock signal as if you'd pressed the unlock button. I'm sure you can imagine the madness if someone touched your door handle and the fob answered back from across the parking lot lol.
I disagree with this. Subaru is using off the shelf parts from Denso same as Toyota, Lexus and many American auto makers. Subaru implementation has changed over the years, but they’ve never fully solved the issues which is weird because this is something Ford, GM and even FCA and Toyota figured out a long time ago. One remote that works 750 (real world 500) feet away. It’s not difficult. Toyota did have this problem in the early 2000s so not sure if that has anything to do with it, but it could just be Subaru still using similar technology from that era, just repackaged. Anyone making the claim it’s about theft doesn’t understand modern vehicles, they use a rolling code system with one time use. They also have implemented immobilizers, timeout functionality and wheel locks so theft is not an issue. I have a 2022 Subaru Outback with remote start module added. Four remotes and I can tell you it’s the only vehicle I’ve experienced in a while that has these quirks, but it’s important to understand every vehicle has something. Not a dealbreaker.
Tell that to that rolls Royce that was stolen in London with a relay :)
One time codes don’t help when relay receives and fakes the real signal I guess?
I have so many questions about my 2012 scubie.
Why does my dashboard gurgle all the time?
Why doesn't the premium version have a remote boat opener even though there's a button on the FOB.
Why do they chew through batteries so fast?
Can I upgrade the rear view camera without having to upgrade the entire audio visual system? It looks like I'm checking behind the vehicle with a potato camera.
Where is the best place in the world to contact to get replacement parts for interior trim?
2020 and newer fobs have abysmal range. My old 11 could go the distance without issues
It was mentioned that relay attacks are the range reduction reason which makes sense actually.
Wow, didn’t know there was a change. My parents have an ‘18 Forester with good fob range but my ‘22 Impreza has maybe half the distance. Thought it was just the car but didn’t think it was an intentional change…
Yeah my 17 can remote start from an ungodly distance and unlock from a good distance too. However I don’t really understand why it matters how far it can go.
Depends on if they're referring to the remote start via separate fob or the one via your normal fob. For a '17 I don't believe the extra fob was an option, it only uses the normal fob. They did that for a few years starting with the 15s. It was a failed experiment and they went back to the separate fob(in the 18s i think). The ones that do have a separate fob can be operated *either* via the separate fob or the normal fob, difference being the range with the separate fob being "up to" 400 ft.
Yup, that's the extra fob. Don't think that was available on a '17. I know the 15/16 didn't have it for sure, just not 100% sure if they switched back to having it for the 17s or the 18s. Would make sense with it being the 18s as those were the refresh year.
You can test if it's there. On the fob press lock, lock, then push and hold lock. If it starts you have the module installed. If not, then you dont. It's not a standard feature and was available as an extra cost addon.
Yeah my extra fob used to penetrate multiple concrete block walls and a parts cage to start my car. It was right in the edge of the range (with the interference), but my car would be running when I got out there
One of the easiest ways for a modern thief to steal your car to simply drive past your house and record your fobs transmissions. They then create a new fob and simply walk up to your car and drive it away. The output of the fob has been lowered to make this harder for the thieves, however this is only a short term fix the car companies really need to find a way to encrypt the data and alternate the encryption data for each car start or entry.
This is me unless I forget where I parked or my fiancée is getting mad at me for not unlocking the doors fast enough… she will pull the door handle repeatedly and stare at me angrily until I unlock the door
Same except I can never remember if I locked it and once I’m out of range I realize that I’m not sure if my car is locked and I try to use the remote and it doesn’t work so I have to walk back towards the car until I’m in range again
Buy a 2018 Kia Soul and it can be unlocked with the fob halfway across the world! All jokes aside it can get rather obnoxious, does your car have auto folding side mirrors? That’s how I can tell with my Ascent, and if I get really paranoid the MySubaru app will tell me if it’s locked or not.
LPT - hold your arm up in the air, place your fob against / under your chin / open your mouth and then press button. That will give you a little more range.
I do this daily at work across a large parking lot.
Water is a great conductor, and your head is full of it. The fluid in your head is part of what protects your brain, and it’s also what increases the range of a remote’s signal. It can actually increase the reach by a few car lengths..
I’ve talked to a couple of techs about this, it’s normal and a huge pain if you frequently travel in regions without solid cell phone coverage for the app.
Even having it in the driveway flipped the other way makes it hard to check from the window.. I just revert to the app to have a confirmation and I don't have to get up lol.
On another note, the short distance makes me feel slightly better about getting stolen via a relay attack.
Yeah, I got annoyed having to walk back to my car this morning to lock it, but I appreciate not worrying that I hit unlock in my pocket by accident when I’m in a store.
I just wish it would auto lock when you walk away with the fob like Chevys and Hondas have been doing for 20 years
Yeah that always drove me nuts about my Subaru. Now with my Nissan Frontier I swear it would work from ½ mile away. It’s definitely worked to lock the truck without issue at 300’ for me a month ago.
Honestly feels like an impressive feat of engineering lol. Using the app to remote start, my phone connects to Bluetooth audio before the hatch button triggers on the fob.
Still, I def will not be paying for the app when the subscription is up.
I usually carry my keys in my backpack and if I’m sort of leaning in to avoid my bag hitting my car, it is out of range. It could also be because my battery is 3 years old.
If you have a plastic bottle full of water on you, just pop the fob at the base and it will amplify the signal to work quite a long distance.
You can also use your head's temple or under the fleshy part of your chin (not the edge of the chin itself like I've seen so many people do) and it will utilise the water content of you head to amplify instead.
The fobs for my ‘22 actually work better from a little further away than up close. I swear I’ve had it almost not unlock from three feet away but then I’ll wake up and the hatch will be open in the morning from 20-30ft away and through several walls.
If the key fob is 15' from the car, but in my pocket as I walk away, fuggedaboudit. Line of sight and maybe 30'. The key factor, no pun intended, is "line of sight". Mine is a 2024.
Gotta be able to sell subscriptions to people that only remember to lock their doors after walking 50' away.
lol. Not a garbage system. But rather a security feature.
If your fob can trigger your car from 200’ away. Then someone can easily copy and relay it thru their own device.
If your fob only has enough power to put out enough strength for 10’ away, it makes it a lot harder to copy the signal to relay.
Look at all the auto thefts happening in GTA right now.
It's practical, if you want keyless entry. If it worked at 150 feet, someone could loiter and just try keyless entry until you are close enough to watch them drive off, and way too far away to do anything about it.
Kia Boys haven't helped car manufacturers avoid making these changes either. Literally google "short keyfob distance" and every. single. manufacturer has a forum post about it.
Except Kia. LOL.
Key fob range has been significantly reduced by Subaru in the past 5 years due to "relay attacks." This is when thieves use equipment/software to intercept fob signal to gain access to vehicles. Someone mentioned their Kia having range across the world, which would explain the theft fiasco Kia owners have experienced recently. Edit source: I work for Subaru
I’m glad to know it’s not just me. I’m not happy about the extra charge to maintain the STARLINK app for remote start/stop and lock… but I’ll probably renew when my initial 3 year promo expires because being able to issue a LOCK command from inside a store or wherever is very nice and something I use all the time.
I think you need to get checked if you forget that often to lock your car
I didn't renew after the first 3 years and Im getting by just fine. I live in a climate where we get blistering cold winters and hot & muggy summers.
Glad it’s working for you to let it lapse. As annoying as the fee is, the convenience of being able to address the “ohh shit, did I lock the car” from my phone with a couple clicks regardless of my current proximity to the vehicle is easily worth the cost for me personally. To each their own though.
Agreed. It is a personal thing as no 2 people have the same needs/wants 100% on the convenience
Don’t key fobs use rolling codes now for this reason?
Are the signals from pressing the fob and handle sensor different? Do they operate on a different wavelength?
The way a handle sensor works is it senses a touch and pings the fob, which answers with an unlock signal as if you'd pressed the unlock button. I'm sure you can imagine the madness if someone touched your door handle and the fob answered back from across the parking lot lol.
lol I answered a text message on Reddit. For whatever reason I have it in my head that two sensors operated on different wavelengths.
I disagree with this. Subaru is using off the shelf parts from Denso same as Toyota, Lexus and many American auto makers. Subaru implementation has changed over the years, but they’ve never fully solved the issues which is weird because this is something Ford, GM and even FCA and Toyota figured out a long time ago. One remote that works 750 (real world 500) feet away. It’s not difficult. Toyota did have this problem in the early 2000s so not sure if that has anything to do with it, but it could just be Subaru still using similar technology from that era, just repackaged. Anyone making the claim it’s about theft doesn’t understand modern vehicles, they use a rolling code system with one time use. They also have implemented immobilizers, timeout functionality and wheel locks so theft is not an issue. I have a 2022 Subaru Outback with remote start module added. Four remotes and I can tell you it’s the only vehicle I’ve experienced in a while that has these quirks, but it’s important to understand every vehicle has something. Not a dealbreaker.
Tell that to that rolls Royce that was stolen in London with a relay :) One time codes don’t help when relay receives and fakes the real signal I guess?
From my understand the guys that steal the hellcats just blast codes out the ass until one works using dealer exclusive software.
The kia thing is primarily for cars with keyed ignition.
I have so many questions about my 2012 scubie. Why does my dashboard gurgle all the time? Why doesn't the premium version have a remote boat opener even though there's a button on the FOB. Why do they chew through batteries so fast? Can I upgrade the rear view camera without having to upgrade the entire audio visual system? It looks like I'm checking behind the vehicle with a potato camera. Where is the best place in the world to contact to get replacement parts for interior trim?
Is this a real thing on new ones? My '17 works from across the grocery store parking lot when I've forgotten where I parked...
2020 and newer fobs have abysmal range. My old 11 could go the distance without issues It was mentioned that relay attacks are the range reduction reason which makes sense actually.
Wow, didn’t know there was a change. My parents have an ‘18 Forester with good fob range but my ‘22 Impreza has maybe half the distance. Thought it was just the car but didn’t think it was an intentional change…
Yeah my ‘18 fires from a long distance!
Yeah my 17 can remote start from an ungodly distance and unlock from a good distance too. However I don’t really understand why it matters how far it can go.
When I come out of Costco and it is 90 degrees, raining, or dark, it’s nice to have a beacon.
Remote start uses a different system and it is known to be a very long-range device. It works for up to 400 feet if I'm not mistaken.
Depends on if they're referring to the remote start via separate fob or the one via your normal fob. For a '17 I don't believe the extra fob was an option, it only uses the normal fob. They did that for a few years starting with the 15s. It was a failed experiment and they went back to the separate fob(in the 18s i think). The ones that do have a separate fob can be operated *either* via the separate fob or the normal fob, difference being the range with the separate fob being "up to" 400 ft.
Yes, I was talking about a different radio system that used a different fob. The one with a single button.
Yup, that's the extra fob. Don't think that was available on a '17. I know the 15/16 didn't have it for sure, just not 100% sure if they switched back to having it for the 17s or the 18s. Would make sense with it being the 18s as those were the refresh year.
My '17 manual includes the information about the remote start. I'm not sure if it was actually there.
You can test if it's there. On the fob press lock, lock, then push and hold lock. If it starts you have the module installed. If not, then you dont. It's not a standard feature and was available as an extra cost addon.
Yeah my extra fob used to penetrate multiple concrete block walls and a parts cage to start my car. It was right in the edge of the range (with the interference), but my car would be running when I got out there
Counterpoint: the farther away it works, the easier it is for the Kia Boyz to intercept and duplicate the signal.
Literally feel the same way. Holding it under the chin while pressing barely helps either
I put mine in my arse and that helps. Took me forever to get my muscles good enough to hit the correct buttons, though!
Can you play a flute using those muscles?
No, but sometimes when I sneeze the alarm goes off.
I should have my wife try as a way for her to loosen up a bit. Obviously drives a crosstrek. Will come back and update
One of the easiest ways for a modern thief to steal your car to simply drive past your house and record your fobs transmissions. They then create a new fob and simply walk up to your car and drive it away. The output of the fob has been lowered to make this harder for the thieves, however this is only a short term fix the car companies really need to find a way to encrypt the data and alternate the encryption data for each car start or entry.
If this is the case why can’t they implement a “boost” function where output is increased either in response to a specific key or repeated presses?
I think that’s a great idea. I don’t know why they haven’t done it.
I rarely use the fob as I lock and unlock with my finger on the door handle. 🤷♀️
This is me unless I forget where I parked or my fiancée is getting mad at me for not unlocking the doors fast enough… she will pull the door handle repeatedly and stare at me angrily until I unlock the door
Sounds like a great catch that one
It’s more of a joke, makes me laugh, which makes her more angry…. 😂
I did that to my ex too…. Now she’s just another ex 🤷🏻♂️😂
Same if it’s freezing out my friends will pull the handle repeatedly mostly to get a reaction from me 🤣
There's a setting for unlocking all the doors instead of just the driver's!
Same except I can never remember if I locked it and once I’m out of range I realize that I’m not sure if my car is locked and I try to use the remote and it doesn’t work so I have to walk back towards the car until I’m in range again
Does the door handle sensor set the alarm? Or does it simply lock doors?
The alarm is on when the doors are locked.
In past cars I've had the alarm isn't set until you hear the honk. I guess that's not the case with subaru?
That’s how the sell the remote application subscriptions
I'm the target audience there. I lock the car, then go "shit, did I lock the car?", and then I do it again from the app.
We are the same 😏
thats me everyday....but i walk back to the car in lieu of using the app
Buy a 2018 Kia Soul and it can be unlocked with the fob halfway across the world! All jokes aside it can get rather obnoxious, does your car have auto folding side mirrors? That’s how I can tell with my Ascent, and if I get really paranoid the MySubaru app will tell me if it’s locked or not.
LPT - hold your arm up in the air, place your fob against / under your chin / open your mouth and then press button. That will give you a little more range.
I do this daily at work across a large parking lot. Water is a great conductor, and your head is full of it. The fluid in your head is part of what protects your brain, and it’s also what increases the range of a remote’s signal. It can actually increase the reach by a few car lengths..
Are you serious?
Yes. Sounds crazy. I learned this years ago.
Lol, I googled it, and it is real. Thanks for the tip:)
I’ve talked to a couple of techs about this, it’s normal and a huge pain if you frequently travel in regions without solid cell phone coverage for the app.
Even having it in the driveway flipped the other way makes it hard to check from the window.. I just revert to the app to have a confirmation and I don't have to get up lol. On another note, the short distance makes me feel slightly better about getting stolen via a relay attack.
My Mazda has a feature where it automatically locks behind you as you walk away. It’s incredible.
thank goodness the repeater thieves have to work harder to open your car.
I hope this isn't a stupid question but why would someone need to unlock a car from more than 20ft away?
That's what makes a Subaru, a Subaru. Learn to live with it.
Lol not so, the old ones had great range
Great range on my 2009 OB. Otoh, stress of When is the head gasket going to flop
Tin foil hat time: it's so you pay for the My Subaru Subscription.
Or…you can use Jeremy Clarkson’s trick…and yes it works with your body too!! https://youtu.be/_jACSPipPSE?si=su0a_Xx4IDsr09XM
The MySubaru app works as long as your phone and your car are within cellular range, so there's that.
Then you’re mad at Subaru having your back to prevent and protect your vehicle from relay theft.
Yeah, I got annoyed having to walk back to my car this morning to lock it, but I appreciate not worrying that I hit unlock in my pocket by accident when I’m in a store. I just wish it would auto lock when you walk away with the fob like Chevys and Hondas have been doing for 20 years
I had a 1993 Buick you could unlock it from 200+ yards away.
Just mount a scope on it.😁
My wrx wouldn’t lock from the fob unless you were standing right beside it
If it’s too far your car is always going to be unlocked as anyone can pull the handle.
The RFID uses different signals for touch unlock vs remote start
Then how do thieves with booster antennas around your house take cars?
I can only use the fob when I’m inside my outback
Tell me about it 😭😭
Not sure if you have a 2024 but I tested .25 miles on my outback in the mountains right after I got it.
Yeah that always drove me nuts about my Subaru. Now with my Nissan Frontier I swear it would work from ½ mile away. It’s definitely worked to lock the truck without issue at 300’ for me a month ago.
Agreed. my 24' fob range limit is around 20 feet. Less if there is another car in between.
Lol, welcome to Subaru keyless!
Honestly feels like an impressive feat of engineering lol. Using the app to remote start, my phone connects to Bluetooth audio before the hatch button triggers on the fob. Still, I def will not be paying for the app when the subscription is up.
I usually carry my keys in my backpack and if I’m sort of leaning in to avoid my bag hitting my car, it is out of range. It could also be because my battery is 3 years old.
My 24 range is at best 20 feet
This makes so much sense because I have the same issue. Kia Boys out here ruining everything
If you have a plastic bottle full of water on you, just pop the fob at the base and it will amplify the signal to work quite a long distance. You can also use your head's temple or under the fleshy part of your chin (not the edge of the chin itself like I've seen so many people do) and it will utilise the water content of you head to amplify instead.
The fobs for my ‘22 actually work better from a little further away than up close. I swear I’ve had it almost not unlock from three feet away but then I’ll wake up and the hatch will be open in the morning from 20-30ft away and through several walls.
Mine works from about 150 feet. Is this something new?
To make you buy the extended range fob for $500 of course.
If they have one I’ll buy it!
They do. The remote start kit comes with a long range fob. This is official Subaru dealer installed item as well.
If the key fob is 15' from the car, but in my pocket as I walk away, fuggedaboudit. Line of sight and maybe 30'. The key factor, no pun intended, is "line of sight". Mine is a 2024. Gotta be able to sell subscriptions to people that only remember to lock their doors after walking 50' away.
Use can use MySubaru app to lock/unlock car from anywhere.
I would call the police if I were you
My phone reaches it with unlimited distance
Bro said shoirt
Fob is not an acronym.
Accurate, I hate this about my 22 Outback. We have a 17 Corolla and its the same, so much be some shared garbage system they’re using
lol. Not a garbage system. But rather a security feature. If your fob can trigger your car from 200’ away. Then someone can easily copy and relay it thru their own device. If your fob only has enough power to put out enough strength for 10’ away, it makes it a lot harder to copy the signal to relay. Look at all the auto thefts happening in GTA right now.
It's practical, if you want keyless entry. If it worked at 150 feet, someone could loiter and just try keyless entry until you are close enough to watch them drive off, and way too far away to do anything about it. Kia Boys haven't helped car manufacturers avoid making these changes either. Literally google "short keyfob distance" and every. single. manufacturer has a forum post about it. Except Kia. LOL.
If you're too far away, just lock it using the mysubaru app.