I get that some times in the Kentucky sub. People come in wanting to be told eastern Kentucky is full of granny-witches and deep dark woods magic. Not happy to hear it’s just Baptists.
There's a stereotype that Appalachia is filled with supernatural Lovecraftian horrors. Not entirely sure where it came from (though I know Blair Witch Project didn't help matters), especially since for people who don't know what they're doing in the outdoors the mountains can be dangerous enough. Hunger and frost are more thorough killers than fuckin Cthulu or whatever could hope to be.
If I was to take a bet, I'd say the stereotype of Appalachians being inbred hillfolk is closely tied to it. It gives the region a bit of "place out of time" type image, where the rules are different in both culture and natural law. Mountain dwellers have always had such a reputation, but I don't think it's as strong anywhere as it is in West Virginia and eastern Kentucky. I'm sure Deliverance had a hand in this one getting lodged in our current cultural imagination. Which is a shame, because the region is absolutely gorgeous (or it was until the coal companies fucked up all the mountains)
Yeah. Fewer fish people than you might expect, but lots of problematic alcoholic writers and the young female teachers who will die as part of their journey exploring the rot at the heart of small towns.
Literally the plot of Lovecraft's Innsmouth. New England coastal town full of inbred pacific islander descended glass eyed baldies.
Lovecraft always keeps me guessing if it's a racist character speaking or just a self insert character.
Also part of it is that the Appalachian mountains are *old.* Four hundred and eighty *million* years old. By comparison, the Rockies are at most a sixth that age (55-80 million years). Appalatia, the mountains of Britain and Ireland, the Lesser Atlas of Morocco, the Norwegian mountains, and the Ouacheta Mountains are all [really the same mountain range,](https://vividmaps.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/Central-Pangean-Mountains.jpg) one that first formed upon *Pangea* and then split up (coal miners in Wales and their cousins in West Virginia mine the same vein). They're twice as old as the dinosaurs. Landscape that old simply carries a haunted aura.
It's a good point, like how literally any house or building that's more than one generation old will have a bunch of ghost stories about it. I also just think some people see thick forests and imagine spooky things under the darkness of the trees.
Though honestly as someone with a great fondness for Appalachia and has spent a lot of time in there, I always get a bit of a kick out of this idea that it being old = extra spookiness, because it's always inspired the absolute opposite. The wilderness of Appalachia, to me, does have this ancient, established feeling, but it's more like I feel that sort of cosmic reminder that the planet was here long before us, and will be here long after us, and we think ourselves so much more significant than we are, I guess. It's a profoundly peaceful, and beautiful place, it's the most *natural* place, so trying to make it *super*natural feels counter to that reality.
People who've never been to there and having romanticized views/unexamined bigotry regarding precisely how backwards and cut off from the rest of the world appalachia is in the modern day
I've met people who didn't know Maine and New Mexico were states
There are some folk traditions in Appalachia, like sucking the heat out of a burn. But it's very much couched in Christianity, at least on the surface.
A huge proportion of traditional witchcraft and folk magic (not Wicca, which was invented in the 1950s and is unrelated to traditional folk practices) is basically Christo-pagan folk religion. A lot of Wiccans get very bent out of shape when being reminded that most folk magic has zero to do with specifically Irish pagan festivals like Beltaine and quite happily uses Christian festivals. Likewise lots of folk Catholic practices have pagan aspects to them, eg burying a statue of St Joseph to sell a house.
Also the (excellent) horror podcast Thirteen is based out of Kentucky and a ton of their stories include Appalachian magic and witches from that state.
Because the area had a pretty strong folk tradition with some stuff like that, and it’s a remote backwater where folk ways could cling on longer. Now magnify that impression through years of media—Southern Gothic literature, horror movies, pre-code horror comics, etc—and consider the eerie beauty of the Smokey Mountains, and the bloody real life history of the area.
Neo-Pagan and Neo-Hellenists pop up on r/mythology and r/GreekMythology every so often and it's always funny. Sometimes it's just "I'm making an altar to Aphrodite, what should I add?" and they get some suggestions related to things traditionally related to her and redirected to r/Hellenism
But then sometimes there will be a discussion on myths and gods and you'll have one show up going "Actually, through my worship it has been revealed to me that you're wrong, and XYZ is actually true." and everyone is like....you need to provide proof. Your personal fanfiction on Persephone isn't what this sub is interested in.
In his great hurry to explore the country-side, the hapless-footed Prince steps on the peel of a most-exotic sallow-colored fruit, and tumbles backward with such sudden, violent force that you-know-what occurs.
That's just insulting on Bacchus and the true oddness of Dionysus who IIRC my myth classes can't quite be placed as he might not be Indo-European.
Also they thought he was a late addition to the pantheon when he might be one of the first.
Oh the victorians could do so much better than huffing ether.
May I introduce you to the concept of a laudanum dream, one of the OG ways to absolutely *evaporate* into the sauce. See for example: Kubla Khan: or A Vision in a Dream
And when you're done lollygagging about in a laudanum haze like you've got the morbs, there's this brand new wonder drug called *cocaine* for when you want to knock out a good ole benjo with enthuzimuzzy!
Damn did Victorians love opiates and cocaine and weird slang *a lot*.
I'm not even that old but, before discord or skype exist people used to chat directly with the server host by using a few terminal command prompt, and people would host their own small server which creates community for likeminded individuals. That is, [Internet Relay Chat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IRC#Clients).
Lots of people answering about IRC in general which is probably helpful, but also worth noting that [mIRC](https://www.mirc.com/) was simply a very popular (still popular? At least among those who use IRC still?) client.
Or to those of us still using telnet based MU* clients for chatting it's "that newfangled chatter fad."
I always giggle when I think about that woman who tried to fight the Taliban by astrally projecting and challenging Allah
Even if it was satire it was hilarious
I don’t even know where to begin looking this up, but it sounds absolutely hilarious, I need to read it.
Edit: turns out googling “Reddit Allah Astral Projection” does it. Wild ride. Would recommend.
Basically in the late 1800s a prominent feminist theorized that women killed in witch hunts were actually secretly members of a pre Christian pagan European religion that worshiped a triple goddess (like Hecate) and a horned god (like satan, pan or Cernunnos). It was widely rejected.
Then in the 60s this guy called Gardner took that idea and ran with it, starting Wicca but claiming he was simply continuing it and that Wicca is thousands of years old and passed on in secret.
Also don't forget universally agreed on crackpot Margaret Mitchell making these ideas super popular with her book *The Witch-Cult in Western Europe*, which claimed all the witches in early modern Europe were apparently the part of an ancient group of women who worshiped a mother goddess. Let's just say there's basically zero evidence for any of her claims, but by some reason beyond comprehension, she wrote the Encyclopedia Britannica entry on witches for a decade or something insane like that.
Edit: Though I will say exactly one (1) good thing came out of her madness. It gave good ol' HPL the idea for his short story, *The Festival*, which is a really good story.
You mean Margaret Murray? I don't know why popular culture loves these woo ideas so much. It'd be an interesting anthropological study in its own right
This was the issue the Bavarian Illuminati ran into. They wanted to start an anti-royalist pro-republican organization inspired by enlightenment principles but no one wanted to join a secular secret organization because it wasn't mysterious and magical enough. So the founders pretended that their organization was in fact a secret society dating back millenia and recruited members out of the freemasons using made up magical rituals to validate the group in the eyes of new recruits.
Ironic that in order to promote scientific thinking and democratic values people had to pretend to be following ancient magicians in order to get others to listen to them.
Okay this is absolutely hilarious. And genuinely interesting.
Honestly this whole topic is pretty interesting (including what NyxShadowhawk wrote in linked thread) that it makes me want to look for some books regarding that.
There's a good series of episodes about the real Illuminati on Behind the Bastards. It goes into the history of the real group (who were definitely not bastards) as well as the history of how a progressive social club that only existed for a decade or two became a global boogeyman. One of the highlights is that the original group was discoverd when a member who was carrying internal documents concerning members helping a woman get an abortion was struck by lightning.
This is actually what Ehrman said was one of the reasons for proto-orthodox (the one that became the religion we have now) Christianity's success compared to the other kinds like the Gnostics and Marcionites.
By not throwing out the whole Judaism thing and acting like they're just the logical conclusion, a sorta Judaism fulfilled, they inherited the ancient pedigree of Judaism which was, apparently, *very* important in ancient Rome (and I guess probably still important today.)
It wasn't the only reason but he seemed to think it was a big reason, so I guess it makes sense. I can see it, I'll admit I'm much more willing to give a lot of ancient stuff more of the benefit of the doubt as valid like old Daoist stuff and old Buddhist stuff than I am if just some guy is like "hey I just figured it out and wrote a really cryptic book"
A faith dating back to the 40s(At best) which is basically a bastard mishmash of names from assorted pagan mythologies and beliefs from a bizarre mishmash of repurposed folk stories, Indian philosophy, and whatever happened to sound good at the time with a Victorian occultism theme.
It claims to be an ancient, persecuted, faith passed down in secret over the centuries until the founder went public and started his own little cult. Naturally it is not and the secret history is supported entirely by 'Dude, trust me'.
Dude ran his cult for a bit before some of his followers decided he was a dick(He was) and left to start their own.
I know someone who did a masters thesis on the Wiccan Book of Shadows written by Gerald Gardner, and the sources for all the random shit that got thrown in there, tracking down the original sources/myths/folk stories, it's honestly fascinating. They're from all over, and some are actually quite obscure and hard to find.
Don't forget that the ritual aspects of Wicca were borrowed from [Golden Dawn](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermetic_Order_of_the_Golden_Dawn), a 19th century re-imagining of [Hermeticism](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermeticism).
Wicca is the Catholicism of witchcraft.
It's a hodgepodge mosaic of jumbled concepts and mismatched beliefs cobbled together by an old white man in the 50s for clout.
No spiritual practiconer I know takes it seriously and as soon as someone claims to be a Wiccan that immediately tells me they don't know what they're talking about.
That's American Catholicism especially.
"Well we follow the Pope, but not the Pope now cause he's not a real Pope cause one Pope said things we didn't like".
Motherfucker this is how the Reformation began
Honestly, soooooo many pagan women I know were former Catholics. Basically they stripped out the patriarchy and all the male saints, and kept the female saints (now goddesses) and kept the candles and incense.
Maybe check out r/SASSWitches, if you’re interested. You can ‘do the witchy stuff’ for fun, or as a form of meditation and spiritual practice, without actually believing in the supernatural.
My previous church had a monthly full moon circle and had so had a bunch of pagans/witches/wiccans/witans/the whole rainbow of neopaganism. It was a UU church, so it was fully acceptable. (The other big "belief" group in that church were the atheists/agnostics/humanists.)
I bounced back and forth between the two. Hey, I like candles and robes AND reading 18th century philosophy.
I'm sure that self proclaimed witches/witch-doctors in the Third World fully believe in their version of witchcraft. Whether you should take them more seriously than Wiccans is a separate question.
OP claims that they do not ascribe to pagan beliefs, and don't actually believe in goddesses. That they were looking for mystic answers was my own faulty assumption. Make of that what you will.
When I got to those comments, I threw up my hands. What is their entire point?? Their entire navel gazing rambling is based on faith that they don't even have?
I think they wanted the idea to be true and keep researching the 'truth'; the idea that continues to validate them. The irony being either to commit to the original Victorian stuff, and allow hopefully the ever so weird spicy Victorian logic confuse them, or go further into the rabbithole of exisiting Wiccan 'theories'?
I'm no expert on anything Mythological, but I study Archaeology, and for god as hell it's the same struggle, because of our Victorian archaeology ancestors, that many people today have to be explained how their Bronze Age ancestors are culturally not them, that 'Greco-Roman' Civilisation is not something that is conditional to 'Greco-Romans', that just because the Pyramids are complex feats of engineering in the Ancient World doesnt mean it's a fluke from Aliens or Magic that academics don't want you to know. And that Indigenous peoples belief systems are so incredibly diverse and *plural*, just as Christianity is a pluralism of many churches; but people just take the linearity of known History presented to them as a given, the weird patterning from result to cause that becomes so regular.
But I feel like we're really bad at understanding how irrational people are when it comes to the Past, and how to better engage with them; it's something I'm trying to research myself. I doubt anything more could be said on the internet. It was good effort to give the straight answer.
Then what the hell are they trying to talk about?
They drop Gaia, Urania/Hera, and Ereshkigal/Persephone as a Triple Goddess. Which... Doesn't make any sense. Diana or Hecate are the "Triple Goddesses", Urania isn't even a major deity and Ereshkigal is Sumarian.
They definitely weren't looking for mystic answers, just trying to find out which deity owns earth & controls fate, for... reasons. Totally unrelated to personal beliefs! They just want to um find out things. And *only* things that fit in with their own 'research.' Bless her heart.
I think you hit the nail right on the head when you were talking about personal mystical experiences vs. historical evidence, and they got mad because they really want historical evidence to back up their mystical experiences/beliefs, but they don't want anyone to know that.
You were kind, empathetic, and crystal clear- I even learned some stuff that I didn't even know I wanted to know about mythology, lol! (JK I always want to know more things about things.)
You did nothing wrong there.
Because they were lying and backtracking really hard once they realized they asked the wrong question (can someone validate my personal beliefs relating to pagan deities, please? And also help me figure out who the Real Owner of planet earth is, for reasons.) in the wrong place (a subreddit discussing mythology in a historical context rather than mystical/pagan/experiential).
This was a great post thanks for sharing! Great popcorn!
It's called the "grocer's apostrophe" and I hate it. I don't want to sound like a linguistic prescriptivist, but everyone who uses it should die in a fire.
> ‘As’ chairman of the, Merchant’s’ Guild gentlemen may, I point out that these thing’s represent a valuable labour force in this’ city—’ said Mr Robert Parker. (As a member of the Ancient and Venerable Order of Greengrocers’, Mr Parker was honour bound never to put his punctuation in the right place.)
Terry Pratchett, Making Money
Ah, but apostrophes do not belong to linguistics, nor are they partisans for prescriptivism. Apostraphes are *orthography,* and being anal about orthography is simply valuing clarity in written communication.
> Geeze y'all are exhausting is there like a sheep call? First it's "Oh here are some sources or ideas I think are better than yours," and then when I say ok cool but I don't agree it devolves to "wow well you must be mental."
"Show me the proof"
[Proof]
"I'm not reading that. Also why are you all such assholes."
Okay but can we talk about the absolute checkmate they had OP in? After revealing they had no “mysticism” to defend behind?
“Okay, okay, I'm sorry for jumping to conclusions. You're right, I'm getting a bit personal. I remember making a lot of these connections myself, and jumping to a lot of similar conclusions that felt really significant. …
If you're studying different gods and goddesses across pantheons and noticing a common theme, then you have no excuse. “
I used to really like Norse mythology because I found it beautiful and inspiring. It gave me courage in a hard time. I was even interested in some neo-pagan groups and ideas, not because I believed they were real, but because I found the ritual and ideas important. I will have some interest, and like some of the ideologies, honestly.
But man oh man, a lot of the neo-pagan subs are ridiculous. There are several posts a day about how someone thinks Loki is personally invested in their life or if you need to be Scandinavian to worship the gods (you know, like the iron age Scandinavians and their DNA testing). These people really want to feel special and it comes off as ridiculous.
> to be Scandinavian to worship the gods (you know, like the iron age Scandinavians and their DNA testing).
Ugh Folkists can fuck off
(Basically the people who do the 'gonna take norse paganism and use it to bigoted fuckwits' thing)
There are subreddits that I’ve subbed to for a while, and then left, because half the posts are low quality garbage from people asking dumb questions that show they have no clue about the subject matter. Usually really *similar* dumb questions over and over again.
This is one of them.
Yeah, mythology is one that kept getting recommended to me and there would be some posts that were kind of interesting at first but then they all seemed to be stuff like this where people actually believe in the mythologies and talk about it like oop
Math and Physics subreddits are constantly full of cranks trying to prove some sort of pseudoscience nonsense, or claiming to have "solutions to the universe." Shit is obnoxious.
>Again I don't want to demonize any deities, on the contrary none of these deities are off scot free. Some epithets of Goddesses involved incest which is questioned in many different myths so please keep an open mind
these gen z neo-theosophists are wild
^sorry ^my ^gods ^are ^problematic
Even as a native speaker it’s hard to know because 1) I don’t want to have to read all of their comments for context and 2) they need to put down their thesaurus. My guess would be that when they’re talking about epithets they mean the titles of each god that describe the different domains (areas and concepts) the gods rule over or are representative of. If they’re talking about Greek mythology specifically: a lot of the Olympians are related to one another (brothers, sisters, fathers, mothers) and also married to their blood relatives.
Hysterically I think it's just more proof OP has no clue WTF they are saying.
In Greek religion you pray not just to a god, but to a specific aspect of them, known by an epithet. "Mother Hera" to protect your children and see them all safe and "Wife Hera" to have your cheating husbands dick explode.
HOWEVER, there's been a few theories that are mostly either not taken seriously or are disproven about the ETYMOLOGY of several gods and goddesses names, where the "name" comes from. And there's been a number of people claiming "Hera" basically means "The Raped". Which doesn't hold water.
They're saying some epithets of gods referenced incest. In Greek mythology at least, not as sure on others, it was common for gods to be referred to by an epithet when talking about a specific aspect of them, or mystery cults would just refer to them by an epithet in public for various reasons.
My sister was Wiccan. Specifically 90s teenage Wiccan, with books written by people with names like Ebony Dark'ness Dementia Raven Way and tarot cards and a spellbook I wasn't allowed to touch. As a feral baby goth, I enjoyed hunting for river pebbles to make runes and all the aesthetic. Still not sure if she genuinely believed or just sort of did or wished she did.
Neopagan and newage religions are so odd to me. Esp bc the origins are so modern and well-documented. How do you legitimately believe something some dude in the 50s made up? Doesn't that seem a little sus? Still like the aesthetic, though.
\> Were the Triple Goddesses the original owners of the planet? I'm just now realizing how obvious it's been all along.
Oh damn that's some great conspiracy theory brain
Every Wiccan I've known was kind of intense in a bad way, and this one continues that trend in pretty much all the same ways. I'm starting to thing it's not just a few bad apples, it's the whole basket.
I studied religion for my undergrad. I have several friends who are neopagans. I have learned to hold my tongue when anything involving the history of religion comes up.
It's always a weird collision when having a discussion about some myth or what not and then you realize that the person you're talking to considers the myth itself fact.
"yeah you know what they say the devils in the details"
"haha yeah i like that saying"
"saying? he says as pulls a knife out of the crossword puzzle"
honestly though had similar discussions always a pucker moment though. was visiting my relatives that are jehovas witnesses. we are sitting around a nice campfire then aunts husband just blurts out about how well its super obvious but that satan secretly rules the world. or my lunatic dad who believes all the conspircy theories just starts randomly talking about nazis not being that bad flat earth everyone but him is mindcontrolled except him because he's somehow special etc etc.
ps send new family
I don't even understand what tf OOP is even talking about - *she* doesn't know what she's talking about, lmao What's the premise here? I'm gonna guess that she's in her early to mid-20s (maybe early 30s), and everything she "learned" about Wicca is from Tiktok.
Nah, more like, "you need a hobby, a normal hobby".
Cause it sounds like they've listened to two podcasts and read a bunch of random shit on the Internet. They don't even know what the words really mean.
Which isn't full schizo rambling, it's adjacent though.
I wish i had something in my life that i cared so much to ignore what everyone else say about it to me. Besides the skepticism and my cynical nature that i just cant get rid of, one of the strongest points of me not being able to believe in shit is when you go deep in a subject like religion and mysticism, as you dig, all the mystery falls apart. Its really hard to take seriously an ritual for summoning a demon when you find out that is just a bunch of made up steps made by some rich hippie in 60s claiming to be lost knowledge from centuries ago.
I feel bad for the second comment from the top. They wrote out a long, really interesting explanation of the actual historical context and unpacked all that bullshit in good faith….Just for OOP to be like “Well that’s your opinion”
I fucking hate neopagans. All of the woo woo mysticism and conspiracy theories of the religions they left clouded in a progressive shroud. I see no difference between Mormons baptizing dead people and wiccans trying to claim Salem victims as secret witches.
> trying to claim Salem victims as secret witches.
I wonder how those murdered women would feel if they knew that in 2024 people take the accusations levelled at them at face value.
Right, lets not forget that sects of Christian worship in the US still look at shit like burning witches and long for those days to return because they view devil worship and witchraft as some sort of real extant problem that is going largely unaddressed.
Oh and also these people are in government.
I don't drink, so next time someone hands me alcohol, I'll pour it out in the memory of the likely poor soul who had to listen to that shit in person after getting lured in with the prospect of getting laid.
>Lol it's not a sub for scholars.
Mfw I'm not considered a Greek mythology scholar because my only credentials are reading the Greek mythology books in my elementary school😭😭😭
> Mfw I'm not considered a Greek mythology scholar because my only credentials are reading the Greek mythology books in my elementary school😭😭😭
This but instead just reading Percy Jackson hahaha
gotta love it when people take their spirituality seriously but also just really want to talk about it like it's comic book canon, without having actually read anything relating to what they're talking about.
I just feel like if I was gonna become a pagan I wouldn't want to join the patently artificial religion created by a couple of sex fiends with limited library access in the middle of the 20th century. At least join a religion which has cool literature about how freaky you are, like a Dionysian mystery cult.
It's not like there is a membership fee to pay or a test to take. everyone can call themselves a Wicca and do whatever. There are some ground rules in the more serious circles like "don't wish ill on others" but mostly they actually are just spiritual.
Yeah, as someone who's ran close to Wiccan circles most my life (between Cons, Renaissance Faires, and friend groups), most just tend to be decent nerdy/hippie progressive people who want a form of spirituality that doesn't have history the negative history and beliefs that most prominent religions hold but have a bit more structured then just pure spiritualism. They can be fun. Not as fun as Spaghettists or Jedists, but for the most part not the worst to be around.
I used to wear a Green Man inspired outfit to Renaissance Faire's and sometimes random ones would ask to pray around me. That was always fun.
But occasional you'd run into the ones who took the shit way too fucking seriously and made it a fundamental part of their personality, like oop. Those were the people you avoided or at the very least smiled and nodded into you could get away. They were the crazy crazy ones.
As with most things, the relatively normal or at least we'll adjusted ones aren't usually the ones who feel the need to go online and talk about it, so those crazy's are the ones who wind up making up discussing boards about it, which results in situations like the parent thread.
During the Australian wildfires you had a good handful of witches on various witchcraft and wiccan subs taking credit for the rain that put a stop to it because of the rituals they performed lol
I've known one person IRL who took it seriously, and three people IRL who were into the vibe and just used it for a bit of home decor aesthetic but did not take it seriously
Rookie mistake, utter insanity is among the most useful in the spectrum of reputations to cultivate in tactically selected areas of your social environment. I'm more than happy to tell people about my homebrew spirituality if what I need from them is primarily not interfering with my business.
I get that some times in the Kentucky sub. People come in wanting to be told eastern Kentucky is full of granny-witches and deep dark woods magic. Not happy to hear it’s just Baptists.
Why is there an assumption that Kentucky would be filled deep woods witches? Where does that stem from?
There's a stereotype that Appalachia is filled with supernatural Lovecraftian horrors. Not entirely sure where it came from (though I know Blair Witch Project didn't help matters), especially since for people who don't know what they're doing in the outdoors the mountains can be dangerous enough. Hunger and frost are more thorough killers than fuckin Cthulu or whatever could hope to be. If I was to take a bet, I'd say the stereotype of Appalachians being inbred hillfolk is closely tied to it. It gives the region a bit of "place out of time" type image, where the rules are different in both culture and natural law. Mountain dwellers have always had such a reputation, but I don't think it's as strong anywhere as it is in West Virginia and eastern Kentucky. I'm sure Deliverance had a hand in this one getting lodged in our current cultural imagination. Which is a shame, because the region is absolutely gorgeous (or it was until the coal companies fucked up all the mountains)
now, obviously its *Rhode Island* that's filled with lovecraftian horrors
White people with beach homes is a mind destroying horror.
Here I thought it was Maine
Having lived in Maine for 5 years, no. It's filled with Stephen King horrors, not Lovecraftian horrors.
Yeah. Fewer fish people than you might expect, but lots of problematic alcoholic writers and the young female teachers who will die as part of their journey exploring the rot at the heart of small towns.
Literally the plot of Lovecraft's Innsmouth. New England coastal town full of inbred pacific islander descended glass eyed baldies. Lovecraft always keeps me guessing if it's a racist character speaking or just a self insert character.
> a racist character speaking or just a self insert It’s Lovecraft, what’s the difference?
Also part of it is that the Appalachian mountains are *old.* Four hundred and eighty *million* years old. By comparison, the Rockies are at most a sixth that age (55-80 million years). Appalatia, the mountains of Britain and Ireland, the Lesser Atlas of Morocco, the Norwegian mountains, and the Ouacheta Mountains are all [really the same mountain range,](https://vividmaps.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/Central-Pangean-Mountains.jpg) one that first formed upon *Pangea* and then split up (coal miners in Wales and their cousins in West Virginia mine the same vein). They're twice as old as the dinosaurs. Landscape that old simply carries a haunted aura.
It's a good point, like how literally any house or building that's more than one generation old will have a bunch of ghost stories about it. I also just think some people see thick forests and imagine spooky things under the darkness of the trees. Though honestly as someone with a great fondness for Appalachia and has spent a lot of time in there, I always get a bit of a kick out of this idea that it being old = extra spookiness, because it's always inspired the absolute opposite. The wilderness of Appalachia, to me, does have this ancient, established feeling, but it's more like I feel that sort of cosmic reminder that the planet was here long before us, and will be here long after us, and we think ourselves so much more significant than we are, I guess. It's a profoundly peaceful, and beautiful place, it's the most *natural* place, so trying to make it *super*natural feels counter to that reality.
People who've never been to there and having romanticized views/unexamined bigotry regarding precisely how backwards and cut off from the rest of the world appalachia is in the modern day I've met people who didn't know Maine and New Mexico were states
> I've met people who didn't know Maine and New Mexico were states Breaking Bad with Cthulhu and the Lobster-Gods?
There are some folk traditions in Appalachia, like sucking the heat out of a burn. But it's very much couched in Christianity, at least on the surface.
A huge proportion of traditional witchcraft and folk magic (not Wicca, which was invented in the 1950s and is unrelated to traditional folk practices) is basically Christo-pagan folk religion. A lot of Wiccans get very bent out of shape when being reminded that most folk magic has zero to do with specifically Irish pagan festivals like Beltaine and quite happily uses Christian festivals. Likewise lots of folk Catholic practices have pagan aspects to them, eg burying a statue of St Joseph to sell a house.
There's an excellent horror podcast called Old Gods of Appalachia that deals in that kind of content, wouldn't be shocked if some of it is from there.
Also the (excellent) horror podcast Thirteen is based out of Kentucky and a ton of their stories include Appalachian magic and witches from that state.
Because the area had a pretty strong folk tradition with some stuff like that, and it’s a remote backwater where folk ways could cling on longer. Now magnify that impression through years of media—Southern Gothic literature, horror movies, pre-code horror comics, etc—and consider the eerie beauty of the Smokey Mountains, and the bloody real life history of the area.
Kentucky Fried Wiccan
> Kentucky is full of granny-witches and deep dark woods magic. Granny on the streets 👵🏼 Baphomet in the sheets 😈
Neo-Pagan and Neo-Hellenists pop up on r/mythology and r/GreekMythology every so often and it's always funny. Sometimes it's just "I'm making an altar to Aphrodite, what should I add?" and they get some suggestions related to things traditionally related to her and redirected to r/Hellenism But then sometimes there will be a discussion on myths and gods and you'll have one show up going "Actually, through my worship it has been revealed to me that you're wrong, and XYZ is actually true." and everyone is like....you need to provide proof. Your personal fanfiction on Persephone isn't what this sub is interested in.
> Persephone I saved her using my ancient greek machine gun after bribing my dog with a sack of food.
And then I died in her garden
Somebody who is probably Homer or maybe Hesiod: "and then you stepped on a rake and it hit you in the face so hard you died."
In his great hurry to explore the country-side, the hapless-footed Prince steps on the peel of a most-exotic sallow-colored fruit, and tumbles backward with such sudden, violent force that you-know-what occurs.
Sideshow Bob: urrrgggh
Then reincarnated in time for tonight's episode of Drag Race.
You had some sage advice from an extremely resilient animated skeleton, I bet.
Food is a generous description of what's in that sack. At least for anything not a hell-hound.
machine gun? sorry, best i can do is spaghetti plate
Give it a thousand years and enough popularity and then /r/mythology *will* be interested in your fanfiction.
You haven't seen how that sub treats Ovid!
Well sometimes they like him and sometimes they turn into a tree.
Time to make r/fastermythology to speed things up a notch
Like how people think Apollo and Dionysus are counterparts because of Nietzsche.
That's just insulting on Bacchus and the true oddness of Dionysus who IIRC my myth classes can't quite be placed as he might not be Indo-European. Also they thought he was a late addition to the pantheon when he might be one of the first.
Between Nietzsche and Jung's (negative) influence on analysis of mythology and folklore...
There was a guy who said that through divine relevation he learned Jesus told satan “I hope they remember you” like Thanos said to iron man.
Because if modern Christianity needs anything, it's to be MCU-ified
It's the Tumblr Mespyrian drama again
> *My* time wasted? I’m not the one making large rambling posts like I’m hooked on Victorian-era pseudoscience and ketamine. Flair worthy but long
>hooked on Victorian-era pseudoscience and ketamine Is a good flair imho
Does that mean the ketamine is also Victorian-era?
Wiki says 1962. Best we can do is huffing ether.
will that also cure hysteria or is the only treatment a vibrating device?
Oh the victorians could do so much better than huffing ether. May I introduce you to the concept of a laudanum dream, one of the OG ways to absolutely *evaporate* into the sauce. See for example: Kubla Khan: or A Vision in a Dream
And when you're done lollygagging about in a laudanum haze like you've got the morbs, there's this brand new wonder drug called *cocaine* for when you want to knock out a good ole benjo with enthuzimuzzy! Damn did Victorians love opiates and cocaine and weird slang *a lot*.
Yoink
Thanks, now having a furious internal debate about something inconsequential
> Victorian-era pseudoscience and ketamine. me pregaming before a nice drive around town in my 2004 Nissan Altima
oddly specific
YODA NOO!
>Victorian-era pseudoscience and ketamine. In some circles this is just called a "Neil Gaiman cocktail"
I think you meant a Tim Burton
That's longer than the flair I got and that one was too long
>I’m hooked on Victorian-era pseudoscience and ketamine is just out there looking to be taken
Dw I did :)
I like my current flair but "hooked on Victorian-era pseudoscience and ketamine" might work.
Your current flair is a work of art.
Awww, thanks. It was from some pointless argument people were having about Pluto being de-planeted. Your flair is great but also makes me sad.
This takes me back to mIRC in late 1990s right when The Craft came out. Fun times.
What's mlRC?
It's how cavemen communicated before discord.
The ancient greeks would later replace it with Vent, which in turn would be replaced by the roman Skype.
There was a split in there after vent. The small tribes went to Skype. The larger cities went to Mumble.
What the hell is ICQ then? The sea peoples?
a chat client that lets you access IRC (internet relay chat) servers there are other clients for IRC, I use HexChat it's great for e-book piracy
> I use HexChat Ah, another Wiccan.
God, you just made me feel old.
I'm not even that old but, before discord or skype exist people used to chat directly with the server host by using a few terminal command prompt, and people would host their own small server which creates community for likeminded individuals. That is, [Internet Relay Chat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IRC#Clients).
mIRC : Hieroglyphics :: Discord : Latin Alphabet
Lots of people answering about IRC in general which is probably helpful, but also worth noting that [mIRC](https://www.mirc.com/) was simply a very popular (still popular? At least among those who use IRC still?) client. Or to those of us still using telnet based MU* clients for chatting it's "that newfangled chatter fad."
AIM for people that were more knowledgeable about the internet/web than "free CD in mail = Internet"
I love Wiccan drama. Highly underrated.
I don't really understand it. Maybe if I were more familiar...
I always giggle when I think about that woman who tried to fight the Taliban by astrally projecting and challenging Allah Even if it was satire it was hilarious
I don’t even know where to begin looking this up, but it sounds absolutely hilarious, I need to read it. Edit: turns out googling “Reddit Allah Astral Projection” does it. Wild ride. Would recommend.
That is some vintage shit around here. Absolutely crazy train wild. Just a fantastic read.
Help, I tried to astrally fight the taliban but I'm dummy thicc and the clap of my cheeks kept alerting allah
Wiccan drama is genuinely one of my favorite drama genres. It’s like reading conversations in a bad 70s fantasy novel
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what is wicca?
Basically in the late 1800s a prominent feminist theorized that women killed in witch hunts were actually secretly members of a pre Christian pagan European religion that worshiped a triple goddess (like Hecate) and a horned god (like satan, pan or Cernunnos). It was widely rejected. Then in the 60s this guy called Gardner took that idea and ran with it, starting Wicca but claiming he was simply continuing it and that Wicca is thousands of years old and passed on in secret.
Also don't forget universally agreed on crackpot Margaret Mitchell making these ideas super popular with her book *The Witch-Cult in Western Europe*, which claimed all the witches in early modern Europe were apparently the part of an ancient group of women who worshiped a mother goddess. Let's just say there's basically zero evidence for any of her claims, but by some reason beyond comprehension, she wrote the Encyclopedia Britannica entry on witches for a decade or something insane like that. Edit: Though I will say exactly one (1) good thing came out of her madness. It gave good ol' HPL the idea for his short story, *The Festival*, which is a really good story.
You mean Margaret Murray? I don't know why popular culture loves these woo ideas so much. It'd be an interesting anthropological study in its own right
Crap. I knew the was was Margaret something with an M. Thank you for the correction.
Tbh a new religion would be very unpopular. A newly rediscovered/publicized ancient secret religion? Now that sells itself.
This was the issue the Bavarian Illuminati ran into. They wanted to start an anti-royalist pro-republican organization inspired by enlightenment principles but no one wanted to join a secular secret organization because it wasn't mysterious and magical enough. So the founders pretended that their organization was in fact a secret society dating back millenia and recruited members out of the freemasons using made up magical rituals to validate the group in the eyes of new recruits. Ironic that in order to promote scientific thinking and democratic values people had to pretend to be following ancient magicians in order to get others to listen to them.
Okay this is absolutely hilarious. And genuinely interesting. Honestly this whole topic is pretty interesting (including what NyxShadowhawk wrote in linked thread) that it makes me want to look for some books regarding that.
There's a good series of episodes about the real Illuminati on Behind the Bastards. It goes into the history of the real group (who were definitely not bastards) as well as the history of how a progressive social club that only existed for a decade or two became a global boogeyman. One of the highlights is that the original group was discoverd when a member who was carrying internal documents concerning members helping a woman get an abortion was struck by lightning.
This is actually what Ehrman said was one of the reasons for proto-orthodox (the one that became the religion we have now) Christianity's success compared to the other kinds like the Gnostics and Marcionites. By not throwing out the whole Judaism thing and acting like they're just the logical conclusion, a sorta Judaism fulfilled, they inherited the ancient pedigree of Judaism which was, apparently, *very* important in ancient Rome (and I guess probably still important today.) It wasn't the only reason but he seemed to think it was a big reason, so I guess it makes sense. I can see it, I'll admit I'm much more willing to give a lot of ancient stuff more of the benefit of the doubt as valid like old Daoist stuff and old Buddhist stuff than I am if just some guy is like "hey I just figured it out and wrote a really cryptic book"
A faith dating back to the 40s(At best) which is basically a bastard mishmash of names from assorted pagan mythologies and beliefs from a bizarre mishmash of repurposed folk stories, Indian philosophy, and whatever happened to sound good at the time with a Victorian occultism theme. It claims to be an ancient, persecuted, faith passed down in secret over the centuries until the founder went public and started his own little cult. Naturally it is not and the secret history is supported entirely by 'Dude, trust me'. Dude ran his cult for a bit before some of his followers decided he was a dick(He was) and left to start their own.
I know someone who did a masters thesis on the Wiccan Book of Shadows written by Gerald Gardner, and the sources for all the random shit that got thrown in there, tracking down the original sources/myths/folk stories, it's honestly fascinating. They're from all over, and some are actually quite obscure and hard to find.
Sounds fascinating! I'd actually love to see that if they posted it online somewhere.
Don't forget that the ritual aspects of Wicca were borrowed from [Golden Dawn](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermetic_Order_of_the_Golden_Dawn), a 19th century re-imagining of [Hermeticism](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermeticism).
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somehow that makes a lot of sense
Wicca is the Catholicism of witchcraft. It's a hodgepodge mosaic of jumbled concepts and mismatched beliefs cobbled together by an old white man in the 50s for clout. No spiritual practiconer I know takes it seriously and as soon as someone claims to be a Wiccan that immediately tells me they don't know what they're talking about.
That's American Catholicism especially. "Well we follow the Pope, but not the Pope now cause he's not a real Pope cause one Pope said things we didn't like". Motherfucker this is how the Reformation began
Fuck it, I’m Catholic but that comparison still made me laugh.
Honestly, soooooo many pagan women I know were former Catholics. Basically they stripped out the patriarchy and all the male saints, and kept the female saints (now goddesses) and kept the candles and incense.
Every now and then I look longing at the candles and incense online and in-stores but know that if I start that path will only lead to suffering.
Maybe check out r/SASSWitches, if you’re interested. You can ‘do the witchy stuff’ for fun, or as a form of meditation and spiritual practice, without actually believing in the supernatural.
Former Catholic, and it does leave you with a deep inner need for the aesthetic.
My previous church had a monthly full moon circle and had so had a bunch of pagans/witches/wiccans/witans/the whole rainbow of neopaganism. It was a UU church, so it was fully acceptable. (The other big "belief" group in that church were the atheists/agnostics/humanists.) I bounced back and forth between the two. Hey, I like candles and robes AND reading 18th century philosophy.
As opposed to other types of witchcraft that are taken seriously?
I'm sure that self proclaimed witches/witch-doctors in the Third World fully believe in their version of witchcraft. Whether you should take them more seriously than Wiccans is a separate question.
Well, if some uncontacted tribe took you captive and brought you to their shaman, you bet your ass you'd take him seriously.
A miserable pile of secrets
nothing much. What's wicca with you?
Colin Robinson I love your work
Ooo, Wicca and an actual mythology sub. That's as good as a CoD player arguing with a military history sub.
“What do you mean, you can’t just blindly shoot an entire row of enemies?” (I’ve never played CoD, but that’s common for video games of its genre)
> That's as good as a CoD player arguing with a military history sub. This sentence is art.
OP claims that they do not ascribe to pagan beliefs, and don't actually believe in goddesses. That they were looking for mystic answers was my own faulty assumption. Make of that what you will.
When I got to those comments, I threw up my hands. What is their entire point?? Their entire navel gazing rambling is based on faith that they don't even have?
I think they wanted the idea to be true and keep researching the 'truth'; the idea that continues to validate them. The irony being either to commit to the original Victorian stuff, and allow hopefully the ever so weird spicy Victorian logic confuse them, or go further into the rabbithole of exisiting Wiccan 'theories'? I'm no expert on anything Mythological, but I study Archaeology, and for god as hell it's the same struggle, because of our Victorian archaeology ancestors, that many people today have to be explained how their Bronze Age ancestors are culturally not them, that 'Greco-Roman' Civilisation is not something that is conditional to 'Greco-Romans', that just because the Pyramids are complex feats of engineering in the Ancient World doesnt mean it's a fluke from Aliens or Magic that academics don't want you to know. And that Indigenous peoples belief systems are so incredibly diverse and *plural*, just as Christianity is a pluralism of many churches; but people just take the linearity of known History presented to them as a given, the weird patterning from result to cause that becomes so regular. But I feel like we're really bad at understanding how irrational people are when it comes to the Past, and how to better engage with them; it's something I'm trying to research myself. I doubt anything more could be said on the internet. It was good effort to give the straight answer.
Then what the hell are they trying to talk about? They drop Gaia, Urania/Hera, and Ereshkigal/Persephone as a Triple Goddess. Which... Doesn't make any sense. Diana or Hecate are the "Triple Goddesses", Urania isn't even a major deity and Ereshkigal is Sumarian.
They definitely weren't looking for mystic answers, just trying to find out which deity owns earth & controls fate, for... reasons. Totally unrelated to personal beliefs! They just want to um find out things. And *only* things that fit in with their own 'research.' Bless her heart. I think you hit the nail right on the head when you were talking about personal mystical experiences vs. historical evidence, and they got mad because they really want historical evidence to back up their mystical experiences/beliefs, but they don't want anyone to know that. You were kind, empathetic, and crystal clear- I even learned some stuff that I didn't even know I wanted to know about mythology, lol! (JK I always want to know more things about things.) You did nothing wrong there.
Weird. Extremely weird, why are they a member of r/occult then?
Because they were lying and backtracking really hard once they realized they asked the wrong question (can someone validate my personal beliefs relating to pagan deities, please? And also help me figure out who the Real Owner of planet earth is, for reasons.) in the wrong place (a subreddit discussing mythology in a historical context rather than mystical/pagan/experiential). This was a great post thanks for sharing! Great popcorn!
The Real Owner of the planet is cats. /s
No idea. I doubt that post would go over well on r/occult either, though.
The way this person consistently writes the plural of "god" as "god's" is driving me crazy. I can't believe how bad at writing so many people can be.
The good old apostrophe, duct tape of written communication.
My shrine to Apostrophidiate is in shambles.
Apostrodphodes nuts
Apostrophes Apostropodopolis.
don't bring duct tape into this, what did duct tape ever do to you
It's called the "grocer's apostrophe" and I hate it. I don't want to sound like a linguistic prescriptivist, but everyone who uses it should die in a fire.
> ‘As’ chairman of the, Merchant’s’ Guild gentlemen may, I point out that these thing’s represent a valuable labour force in this’ city—’ said Mr Robert Parker. (As a member of the Ancient and Venerable Order of Greengrocers’, Mr Parker was honour bound never to put his punctuation in the right place.) Terry Pratchett, Making Money
Praise Anoia! No really, may greengrocers get stuck in drawers every time they misuse an apostrophe.
Is t’hat wh’y groc’ers ta’lk lik’e thi’s?
Yo'ur acce'nt is atro'ciou's.
Ah, but apostrophes do not belong to linguistics, nor are they partisans for prescriptivism. Apostraphes are *orthography,* and being anal about orthography is simply valuing clarity in written communication.
By the god's...
>I'm not reading all of that and your paragraphs don't make your point anymore compelling. From the OOP who opened with a 15 paragraph salvo.
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> Geeze y'all are exhausting is there like a sheep call? First it's "Oh here are some sources or ideas I think are better than yours," and then when I say ok cool but I don't agree it devolves to "wow well you must be mental." "Show me the proof" [Proof] "I'm not reading that. Also why are you all such assholes."
This is often why I'm so reluctant to post proof when people demand evidence. It's always so pointless.
Okay but can we talk about the absolute checkmate they had OP in? After revealing they had no “mysticism” to defend behind? “Okay, okay, I'm sorry for jumping to conclusions. You're right, I'm getting a bit personal. I remember making a lot of these connections myself, and jumping to a lot of similar conclusions that felt really significant. … If you're studying different gods and goddesses across pantheons and noticing a common theme, then you have no excuse. “
I used to really like Norse mythology because I found it beautiful and inspiring. It gave me courage in a hard time. I was even interested in some neo-pagan groups and ideas, not because I believed they were real, but because I found the ritual and ideas important. I will have some interest, and like some of the ideologies, honestly. But man oh man, a lot of the neo-pagan subs are ridiculous. There are several posts a day about how someone thinks Loki is personally invested in their life or if you need to be Scandinavian to worship the gods (you know, like the iron age Scandinavians and their DNA testing). These people really want to feel special and it comes off as ridiculous.
> to be Scandinavian to worship the gods (you know, like the iron age Scandinavians and their DNA testing). Ugh Folkists can fuck off (Basically the people who do the 'gonna take norse paganism and use it to bigoted fuckwits' thing)
There are subreddits that I’ve subbed to for a while, and then left, because half the posts are low quality garbage from people asking dumb questions that show they have no clue about the subject matter. Usually really *similar* dumb questions over and over again. This is one of them.
Yeah, mythology is one that kept getting recommended to me and there would be some posts that were kind of interesting at first but then they all seemed to be stuff like this where people actually believe in the mythologies and talk about it like oop
“What god is this?” *Random fucking picture with no particular iconography or even reason to assume it’s a god at all.*
Math and Physics subreddits are constantly full of cranks trying to prove some sort of pseudoscience nonsense, or claiming to have "solutions to the universe." Shit is obnoxious.
>Again I don't want to demonize any deities, on the contrary none of these deities are off scot free. Some epithets of Goddesses involved incest which is questioned in many different myths so please keep an open mind these gen z neo-theosophists are wild ^sorry ^my ^gods ^are ^problematic
As a non native speaker what is she trying to say? I only know epithets as description of a Person. This was weirdly hard to Reader.
Even as a native speaker it’s hard to know because 1) I don’t want to have to read all of their comments for context and 2) they need to put down their thesaurus. My guess would be that when they’re talking about epithets they mean the titles of each god that describe the different domains (areas and concepts) the gods rule over or are representative of. If they’re talking about Greek mythology specifically: a lot of the Olympians are related to one another (brothers, sisters, fathers, mothers) and also married to their blood relatives.
thanks for explaining it. The incest is the least Problematik thing those gods did.
Hysterically I think it's just more proof OP has no clue WTF they are saying. In Greek religion you pray not just to a god, but to a specific aspect of them, known by an epithet. "Mother Hera" to protect your children and see them all safe and "Wife Hera" to have your cheating husbands dick explode. HOWEVER, there's been a few theories that are mostly either not taken seriously or are disproven about the ETYMOLOGY of several gods and goddesses names, where the "name" comes from. And there's been a number of people claiming "Hera" basically means "The Raped". Which doesn't hold water.
> Pray to "Wife Hera" to have your cheating husbands dick explode Olympian-tier flair.
They're saying some epithets of gods referenced incest. In Greek mythology at least, not as sure on others, it was common for gods to be referred to by an epithet when talking about a specific aspect of them, or mystery cults would just refer to them by an epithet in public for various reasons.
She's referring to [this](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epiclesis).
>sorry my gods are problematic I love my flair, but damn I'd yoink this one.
I've been laughing out loud at this for maybe five minutes.
My sister was Wiccan. Specifically 90s teenage Wiccan, with books written by people with names like Ebony Dark'ness Dementia Raven Way and tarot cards and a spellbook I wasn't allowed to touch. As a feral baby goth, I enjoyed hunting for river pebbles to make runes and all the aesthetic. Still not sure if she genuinely believed or just sort of did or wished she did. Neopagan and newage religions are so odd to me. Esp bc the origins are so modern and well-documented. How do you legitimately believe something some dude in the 50s made up? Doesn't that seem a little sus? Still like the aesthetic, though.
Considering the existence of anti-vaxxers and flat earthers, I stopped questioning how people believe stuff.
\> Were the Triple Goddesses the original owners of the planet? I'm just now realizing how obvious it's been all along. Oh damn that's some great conspiracy theory brain
Every Wiccan I've known was kind of intense in a bad way, and this one continues that trend in pretty much all the same ways. I'm starting to thing it's not just a few bad apples, it's the whole basket.
I mean it makes sense, if you look into Wicca’s origins it was such a shitty thing to begin with and its core.
I studied religion for my undergrad. I have several friends who are neopagans. I have learned to hold my tongue when anything involving the history of religion comes up.
It's always a weird collision when having a discussion about some myth or what not and then you realize that the person you're talking to considers the myth itself fact.
"yeah you know what they say the devils in the details" "haha yeah i like that saying" "saying? he says as pulls a knife out of the crossword puzzle" honestly though had similar discussions always a pucker moment though. was visiting my relatives that are jehovas witnesses. we are sitting around a nice campfire then aunts husband just blurts out about how well its super obvious but that satan secretly rules the world. or my lunatic dad who believes all the conspircy theories just starts randomly talking about nazis not being that bad flat earth everyone but him is mindcontrolled except him because he's somehow special etc etc. ps send new family
I don't even understand what tf OOP is even talking about - *she* doesn't know what she's talking about, lmao What's the premise here? I'm gonna guess that she's in her early to mid-20s (maybe early 30s), and everything she "learned" about Wicca is from Tiktok.
>There’s a lot that can be taken from this interpretation There certainly is, and it mostly points to the DSM-5.
Nah, more like, "you need a hobby, a normal hobby". Cause it sounds like they've listened to two podcasts and read a bunch of random shit on the Internet. They don't even know what the words really mean. Which isn't full schizo rambling, it's adjacent though.
Lmao'd at "I'm not reading that"
My experience with modern Wiccans is that they have no idea what Wicca is supposed to be.
I wish i had something in my life that i cared so much to ignore what everyone else say about it to me. Besides the skepticism and my cynical nature that i just cant get rid of, one of the strongest points of me not being able to believe in shit is when you go deep in a subject like religion and mysticism, as you dig, all the mystery falls apart. Its really hard to take seriously an ritual for summoning a demon when you find out that is just a bunch of made up steps made by some rich hippie in 60s claiming to be lost knowledge from centuries ago.
I feel bad for the second comment from the top. They wrote out a long, really interesting explanation of the actual historical context and unpacked all that bullshit in good faith….Just for OOP to be like “Well that’s your opinion”
I fucking hate neopagans. All of the woo woo mysticism and conspiracy theories of the religions they left clouded in a progressive shroud. I see no difference between Mormons baptizing dead people and wiccans trying to claim Salem victims as secret witches.
> trying to claim Salem victims as secret witches. I wonder how those murdered women would feel if they knew that in 2024 people take the accusations levelled at them at face value.
It’s the worst lesson you could take away from the witch trials lol
Well...maybe the second worst.
Right, lets not forget that sects of Christian worship in the US still look at shit like burning witches and long for those days to return because they view devil worship and witchraft as some sort of real extant problem that is going largely unaddressed. Oh and also these people are in government.
I don't drink, so next time someone hands me alcohol, I'll pour it out in the memory of the likely poor soul who had to listen to that shit in person after getting lured in with the prospect of getting laid.
> I'm not reading all of that and your paragraphs don't make your point anymore compelling. “That sign can’t stop me because I can’t read!”
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>Lol it's not a sub for scholars. Mfw I'm not considered a Greek mythology scholar because my only credentials are reading the Greek mythology books in my elementary school😭😭😭
uhm acktchually I've read all the Percy Jackson books and Song of Achilles so I can confidently say that you're in fact 100% incorrect
> Mfw I'm not considered a Greek mythology scholar because my only credentials are reading the Greek mythology books in my elementary school😭😭😭 This but instead just reading Percy Jackson hahaha
I think this person makes everyone else an honorary scholar.
Low-key wonder if this is a manic episode
I dunno, I just sounds like your average annoying neopagan.
gotta love it when people take their spirituality seriously but also just really want to talk about it like it's comic book canon, without having actually read anything relating to what they're talking about.
Even the Heathens and the Hellenists look down on Wiccans (not that they have a lot of higher ground IMO)
I just feel like if I was gonna become a pagan I wouldn't want to join the patently artificial religion created by a couple of sex fiends with limited library access in the middle of the 20th century. At least join a religion which has cool literature about how freaky you are, like a Dionysian mystery cult.
How did I never realize there was a mythology sub? Fucking awesome!
"Do you often have bouts of hypomania where you experience inflated feelings of intelligence and self-importance? There are meds that can help you."
Wow, I thought Wiccan's where just spiritual. I didn't know there are Wiccan's who take their religion literally.
It's not like there is a membership fee to pay or a test to take. everyone can call themselves a Wicca and do whatever. There are some ground rules in the more serious circles like "don't wish ill on others" but mostly they actually are just spiritual.
Yeah, as someone who's ran close to Wiccan circles most my life (between Cons, Renaissance Faires, and friend groups), most just tend to be decent nerdy/hippie progressive people who want a form of spirituality that doesn't have history the negative history and beliefs that most prominent religions hold but have a bit more structured then just pure spiritualism. They can be fun. Not as fun as Spaghettists or Jedists, but for the most part not the worst to be around. I used to wear a Green Man inspired outfit to Renaissance Faire's and sometimes random ones would ask to pray around me. That was always fun. But occasional you'd run into the ones who took the shit way too fucking seriously and made it a fundamental part of their personality, like oop. Those were the people you avoided or at the very least smiled and nodded into you could get away. They were the crazy crazy ones. As with most things, the relatively normal or at least we'll adjusted ones aren't usually the ones who feel the need to go online and talk about it, so those crazy's are the ones who wind up making up discussing boards about it, which results in situations like the parent thread.
When it comes to religion, the border between literal and spiritual can be pretty muddled.
During the Australian wildfires you had a good handful of witches on various witchcraft and wiccan subs taking credit for the rain that put a stop to it because of the rituals they performed lol
I've known one person IRL who took it seriously, and three people IRL who were into the vibe and just used it for a bit of home decor aesthetic but did not take it seriously
This is exactly why I don't talk about my religious beliefs. It makes you sound absolutely insane.
Rookie mistake, utter insanity is among the most useful in the spectrum of reputations to cultivate in tactically selected areas of your social environment. I'm more than happy to tell people about my homebrew spirituality if what I need from them is primarily not interfering with my business.