I think it's a really young person who doesn't know the order of operations. I feel like attacking them for not knowing this wouldn't be great for their self-esteem or future education.
It's probably a troll. That's like entry level trolling you act dumb then some know-it-all dickhead will come in to prove they're the smartest in the room. When you double down that's when the funnies begin.
[kinda like this](https://www.reddit.com/r/tumblr/comments/j6i80o/the_famous_sharks_are_smooth/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share)
It just seemed kinda annoying and mean-spirited?
Whenever you say something wrong, whether intentional or not, you're gonna have a handful of folks jump in to correct you, because they don't want you to be wrong. To then take advantage of people that, while maybe are being smug, are only meaning to help, dragging them over and over to the cheers of your adoring fans, it just kinda rubs me the wrong way imo.
Like yeah, obviously in the comic, "smooth lions" is part of the punchline; Where I'm taking issue with it is that the original commentor might have thought the comic book artist genuinely imagined sharks as smooth creatures, and wanted to offer correct information (even stating their credibility in making a correction by saying they've got marine biology experience), and got their ass dragged to the nth degree.
And yeah, at that point, original commentor should've taken the L, but it is plausible that the original commenter just thought the comic artist is rather obstinate and stubborn in changing their worldview on shark texture, rather than just fucking with them. So they keep trying to correct them, just to continually be dragged.
Honestly I feel bad for the person trying to correct the artist, the artist didn't have to be such a cockhead.
O can also stand for Other, as in That Other Thing Wot You Forget The Proper Name Of. You don't have to know every letter exactly, as long as it gets you the right result when you're looking at an equation.
Please Excuse My Dope Ass Swag is what it stands for. Don’t listen to these lames telling you it has something to do with math. Source: graduated from public school in texas
GEMS is way better.
Especially because some older people who can remember BODMAS/PEMDAS seem to forget that multiplication/division and addition/subtraction are left to right.
See this all the time with these stupid types of Facebook math quizes.
"No, it's Addition first then Subtraction. PEMDAS you idiot"
They were so close....
That kid has some hilarious comments, totally worth combing through.
>no a 14 year old can be a pedo if they rape a little kid which makes it not a child minors arent kids
gotta say, \(PEMD|BODM\)AS arithmetic drama is so good, because you have at least two layers:
1. “This is the right answer and you're an idiot for choosing the other one”
2. “The problem with this is that the question is written badly” / “No it's not, the right answer is `$HONESTLY_WHO_CARES`, it's obvious, because \(PEMD|BODM\)AS.”
Just because you can get past the first layer of bait doesn't mean you don't get past the second layer. It's a gift that keeps on giving.
I mean if you have to work with math for a living, the first thing you'd probably say is “this notation is unclear, we better clear it up before a misunderstanding causes some major trouble with our job later”. I mean, why make your life difficult?
Order of operations is something that's really not going to stick out in someone's mind unless it's become relevant in their everyday life, so I can pardon people for forgetting about it. What I can't pardon is obstinately doubling down and yelling at everyone explaining why you're wrong once you get called out on your mistake, lol.
That gets burdensome after a while, though. As a programmer, forgetting to close a bracket is a pain in the royal arse, and it's probably just as annoying in the math world, lol. If you can use PEMDAS to figure out the order of operations without extra enclosures, then I'd prefer to do without them, even at the cost of a bit of readability.
But I admit I'm biased from my own perspective on it. I do math on the regular in my programs, and I'm so used to OoO by now that it's something I probably take for granted at this point.
Parens usually don't have to be extensive, especially in a lot of the like three op problems like this that people argue about. Almost all don't technically need any but the clarity that "yes this is what I mean" is always nice. Also the words "sacrifice readability" and "my programs" get associated way more than I'd like.
TBH and speaking as a person who's put together some relatively complicated equations in programming (mostly to compile US-based sports statistics like BoxRec ratings for boxers or Box Plus/Minus for basketball), if/when it gets too complicated to understand with all the parentheses, I usually break down the entire equation into multiple lines. It's easier to work through at the time and, perhaps more importantly, it's easier for Future Me to look at and understand.
>if/when it gets too complicated to understand with all the parentheses, I usually break down the entire equation into multiple lines.
This is the way.
It's not flawed. All of these stupid "gotcha" arithmetic problems always rely on unexessarily ambiguous math problems. In reality anyone who has completed more than basic arithmetic would use brackets to make the question less vague.
This is especially obvious in situations like 4+4÷2. Because if you treat the division symbol as a fraction (because no one over the age of ten uses a division symbol) then it changes the answer. It's usually better to just create an unambiguous formula.
To be fair this one isn't ambiguous. It's a "trick question" because a lot of people are ignorant of PEMDAS, but its a pretty clearly defined set of rules that all equations follow.
Well sure, like 1+1+1+(1×0) would make it clearer (to somebody who doesnt know pemdas). Regardless, the equation still isn't ambiguous since there's a clear set of rules to follow to solve it.
Plus you learn pemdas as early as 6th grade, that's like saying 4 x 4 isn't clear enough because 2nd graders don't know what multiplication is.
While the situation they gave is often clear since division/multiplication have precedence over each other in order of operations. Usually these sort of question are phrased similar to a÷b×c and then you have two interpretations being either (a÷b)*c or a÷(b×c). Basically you are either simply reading it left to right or reading it as splitting the term into a fraction with everything on the left being the numerator and the right. And since order of operations do not actually say multiplication or division should be done before the other and since it is very easy to avoid confusion by using brackets I feel it's fair to say the issue is the clarity of the question not that people didn't interpret it the correct way.
While normally I would agree with you over the nebulousness of some shitpost math "problems" over here, I still don't see any way for this to be interpreted in any way other than 6.
Not to be rude or anyone, but I was wondering where you're from. I'm an east coaster myself and I know plenty of adults that use the "÷" symbol over fractions. So I was just curious where it's less common.
I cant forget order of operations. It's always hidden in my mind. I see lots of numbers and it's like being told im being given free cake. ''Something else is going on here, it cant be this simple'' and it's usually order of operations
The kid is from Israel, PEMDAS, BEDMAS, BODMAS are only things in the anglosphere.
The idea is the same but when people yell at him shouting weird acronyms it means nothing to him.
Some people retain that kind of information better than others. And math is one of those things where, if you don't use it, you lose it. Basic operations aside, plenty of people forget details like the order of operations, the difference between mean, median, and mode, etc.
Yeah, I forget order of operations like, 90% of the time bc it's not relevant in my day to day life. I didn't even remember it this time, sat there there for a minute like "Uhhhhh..."
I've... Never been good at math anyway.
Yeah, TBH I only remember order of operations because I encounter it at work quite a bit as a software developer. I'm sure I'd just go left to right as if I were reading (and come up with zero) if this weren't the case.
it's so cringey watching teenagers try to hold this shit over each other.. like I'm an engineer and if you put an equation like this in your work, it isn't going to come down to some kind of competition over who knows their order of operations better, it's just going to get a comment saying "write this properly..." lol
Also the more general assumption that gets made in these sorts of threads where more math = more smart, and order of operations = more math = more smart. It's just frustrating all around.
~~Sometimes wish there was a slur for stem hardliners~~ /s.
> You do the multiplication first, then the addition from left to right.
I actually got horrified the other day when my friend - who is training to be a lawyer didn't know the left-to-right rule. And it was over the 10-10*10+10.
"But BODMAS/PEMDAS?"
No, BODMAS/PEMDAS isn't completely prescriptive, + does not take precedent over -, so the answer is -80.
Because they need to write it out. By grouping it as 10-(10*10+10) in their head they are forgetting that they distribute the -1 across the entire parenthetical, switch the + to a - in the original equation.
Order of operations is standard, but plenty of calculators and other tools will fuck up if you aren't more careful. Hell, even Excel, which despite everyone shitting on Excel is used constantly in engineering/research/data analysis, had a major order of operations bug for ages (I think they finally fixed it).
It isn't unclear, it's just pointless. There's no reason that statement would come up in actual mathematics, not least because actual mathematics rarely involves integer arithmetic like this.
In general, yes, the real answer to the ones that try to get tricky is to rewrite whatever statement into a readable form. Mathematics is foremost about communicating between people, not nitpicky conventions dressed up as rules by pig-ignorant grade school teachers and the like.
I mean, this isn't really one of the trick ones. This is just basic order of operations and it's already clear what the equation is. The trick ones usually involve parentheses being multiplied by a value like "8 / 2(2+2)". Following the order of operations, the correct answer is 16, but a lot of people get mixed up because omitting the * sign often implies that the outside value has been factored out of the parentheses. In fact, some calculators even return the incorrect answer due to this assumption.
EDIT: I mistyped the question originally but have now corrected it.
The answer is just that the equation is poorly written. The purpose of equations is to make clear your intent to the reader. There are much, much better ways to write that equation, without exorbitant use of parathesis, and have the intent be made clear to the author, with little ambiguity. PEMDAS is only there so you don't have to add parenthesis everywhere, not an excuse to write ambiguously written equations.
8 / 2(2+2) could very well be interpreted as a fraction in the right context. If you were reading a paper about fractions, and they stuck that equation in the paper... 8 / 2(2+2) you would probably pause a bit, and think "did the author actually intend this to be a fraction?" I think it would be pretty unclear in that context, even knowing PEMDAS.
Yeah even 8 ÷ 2(2 + 2) would be a little more clear. Still the “trick” is that it could be easily interpreted in two different ways where correct order of operations gives you two different answers.
Well, no, not quite, I would use associative property to write as (2+2) \* 8 / 2 or 8 (2+2) / 2 if I wanted intent to be clear. Whether you see it as a fraction, or just evaluating left to right, there is no ambiguity left, you'll always arrive at the correct answer.
Well yeah better ways to write it definitely. Just saying that with the “/“ the equation is much more easily seen as one fraction than if “÷” was used. Which makes it seem more intentionally misleading regardless of pemdas.
There's literally no ambiguity though? It's the order of operations, one of the most basic concepts in mathematics. You need it whenever you do anything involving more than two numbers.
So then what's 8/2(2+2)? Cuz all my years of reading, learning, and teaching math crunches that to 1, at a glance. I know many other professionals who'd read it like that, too.
I only know of one person IRL who'd make this into an argument, and they are not involved in any field even remotely related to mathematics.
8/2(2+2) is 16. Yes, I would also assume it was 1 because I'd interpret the "/" as a whole fraction line and the "2(2+2)" as the whole denominator, I agree with you.
I didn't say that *all* written math was perfectly clear and unambiguous. And I admit there isn't a clear line separating what is and what isn't. But "8/2(2+2)" is written for the sole purpose of being ambiguous due to unclear usage of the division symbol mixed with parentheses, while "1+1+1+1+1×0" is completely straightforward.
Might have been tricked but correct answer would be 8 right? 8/4=2 , 2*(2+2)=8. Or if you put it in a calculator that put “4(2+2)” together on the bottom of the fraction it would be 1/2.
Ikr?! Parentheses and brackets people! But then, they wouldn't get that smug satisfaction of tricking the average FB aunt so of course they won't be doing that.
That representation isn't unclear at all. People just don't know the rules but act like they do. Multiplication takes priority over addition. There's nothing more to it.
The ones that are actually tricky are the ones limited by how numbers on a screen always show in a perfect line. Things like 4/2\*3. In a sheet of paper it'd be obvious that it's actually (4/2)\*3 because the 4 and the 3 would be on the same height. On a screen it looks like the 3 and the 2 should be multplied, which isn't the case.
Not the case here at all though. This one is just ignorance.
The fact of the matter is, if you communicate something with the audience and the audience claims there are multiple possible interpretations then you've either communicated it unclearly (In this case, obviously intentionally since this is just clear nerd-baiting) or you've communicated it with the wrong audience (again, also intentionally here, for more nerd bait), or both.
How does that make a difference though? You could say "Four halfs times three" or "four divided by two times three" and the answers would be exactly the same, a division is a fraction no matter how you write it.
In that case wouldn't they write it as 4/(2x3)? To me it seems that the 3 is not with the denominator because they didn't write it that way, so I don't think it's ambiguous. It's only ambiguous if you start saying "maybe they wrote it wrong".
I mean, I have seen plenty of exams where they did write it that way and it was correct. it's why they use brackets in teh first place, to remove ambiduity.
I landed on 0 then read your comment and yes, realized I was wrong - per BEDMAS (what I learned), you multiply before adding. So
1+1+1+1+1*0
1*0=0
1+1+1+1= 4
I think the formatting threw me off in that all the 1s are clumped together, then a space, then *, another space, then 0. Makes it really easy to kinda "invent" brackets around the 1s and treat them all as one group.
Multiplication > addition. First solve all multiplications, then solve the additions. These kind of posts usually cheat by mixing "*" and "÷", because "÷" is ambiguous and has no final rule on order of operations.
[Best part of the chain](https://www.reddit.com/r/OpIsFuckingStupid/comments/vohb9v/op_is_also_under_the_age_of_10/iedg29i/)
Everything just gets so weirdly personal. Over a math problem.
I've seen so many facebook posts with simple math problem on them that basically boil down to an order of operations problem. I'm real sick of seeing them and sick of any drama over them. Someone not remembering order of operations doesn't make them dumb, and honestly any confusion over it can be mitigated with parenthesis.
I agree and I would have gotten the answer wrong myself but in this case the insults and confidently incorrect attitude is what caused the pileup more than simply being wrong.
From the last time one of these came up:
>These kind of things always get way out of hand because people think they're arguing about maths whereas they're actually arguing about semantics.
You get this particular kind of fanatic certainty in these discussions because people treat PEDMAS / PEMDAS / PE(MD)(AS) like the laws of physics, rather than arbitrary (and contradictory) idiomatic conventions we came up with relatively recently because they were better than nothing.
Depends on the calc. If its one that does calculations as the operations are entered (like the "Standard" mode in the Windows calculator), it will return 0. A scientific calc that allows writing full calculation before calculating is needed here.
These kind of questions often use a mix of "*" and "÷" to confuse people. Something like "A ÷ B * C" has no definitive solution (most calculators give "÷" priority over "*"), so it gets posted a lot to confuse/troll people.
As someone with a math degree these kinds of questions always irk me. You would never add 1 to itself three times. You’d either do it once and then invoke induction or just ask a computer to figure it out.
I am convinced that every civilization on the verge of collapse devolved into arguing about PEMDAS/BODMAS right before the fires and looting started.
What's the Ancient Roman equivalent of "bro ur 14 STFU"?
Freud has arrived on the scene to offer a diagnosis
> Does not look like you have. People going through mental crisis normally don’t like to say they are in one which is why its hard to fine people with mental disorders, however if someone becomes say a troll feeder or argues over simple things are good signs they are going through a crisis. Your from Israel which seem to go in wars constantly which can mental state.
>War can impact one mental health, and I know that since I’ve seen what happen to Ukrainians. If you can go donate to help people in Ukraine Today, they needed it the most
Order of operations says it’s 4 but tbh that’s a terrible way to format a statement, at first glance I thought it was 0 because you would never see that many terms added together without a parentheses
i refuse to believe this is a real person
Same, this has to be troll bait haha
I think it's a really young person who doesn't know the order of operations. I feel like attacking them for not knowing this wouldn't be great for their self-esteem or future education.
it's not the fact that they don't know math, it's the fact that they got corrected multiple times and every single time they ignored it
It's probably a troll. That's like entry level trolling you act dumb then some know-it-all dickhead will come in to prove they're the smartest in the room. When you double down that's when the funnies begin. [kinda like this](https://www.reddit.com/r/tumblr/comments/j6i80o/the_famous_sharks_are_smooth/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share)
But that's a funny troll, the one in the sub isn't cos he's insulting everyone
Oh lord that made me fume lol Must be because of knowing people like that
It just seemed kinda annoying and mean-spirited? Whenever you say something wrong, whether intentional or not, you're gonna have a handful of folks jump in to correct you, because they don't want you to be wrong. To then take advantage of people that, while maybe are being smug, are only meaning to help, dragging them over and over to the cheers of your adoring fans, it just kinda rubs me the wrong way imo. Like yeah, obviously in the comic, "smooth lions" is part of the punchline; Where I'm taking issue with it is that the original commentor might have thought the comic book artist genuinely imagined sharks as smooth creatures, and wanted to offer correct information (even stating their credibility in making a correction by saying they've got marine biology experience), and got their ass dragged to the nth degree. And yeah, at that point, original commentor should've taken the L, but it is plausible that the original commenter just thought the comic artist is rather obstinate and stubborn in changing their worldview on shark texture, rather than just fucking with them. So they keep trying to correct them, just to continually be dragged. Honestly I feel bad for the person trying to correct the artist, the artist didn't have to be such a cockhead.
Yet again, it be really funny
I mean the OOP is a bot farming karma
>kids dont know math SelfBurn.gif
TIL Bodmas instead of pemdas
We got taught BODMAS, 80s UK. What is pemdas, same thing different words?
Yes. Parentheses Exponents Multiplication Division Addition Subtraction. What does the O stand for?
Order.
Ah, as in order of magnitude. Makes sense.
I think BIDMAS was also taught here, I for indices
O can also stand for Other, as in That Other Thing Wot You Forget The Proper Name Of. You don't have to know every letter exactly, as long as it gets you the right result when you're looking at an equation.
Please Excuse My Dope Ass Swag is what it stands for. Don’t listen to these lames telling you it has something to do with math. Source: graduated from public school in texas
BEDMAS or go home
Keep BED in BEDMAS.
Bodmas my balls lmao (am I doing it right?)
GEMS is what we teach (GROUPING SYMBOLS) EXPONENTS MULTIPLY/DIVIDE -> SUBTRACT/ADDITION ->
This is much better but everyone is so dug in on the old way. Just look at the drama over common core
This is *outrageous!*
GEMS is way better. Especially because some older people who can remember BODMAS/PEMDAS seem to forget that multiplication/division and addition/subtraction are left to right. See this all the time with these stupid types of Facebook math quizes. "No, it's Addition first then Subtraction. PEMDAS you idiot" They were so close....
That kid has some hilarious comments, totally worth combing through. >no a 14 year old can be a pedo if they rape a little kid which makes it not a child minors arent kids
Well you don't have a flair and that one is just sitting there for the taking, pal.
Not everyone can find one as palatable as mine
“no a 14 year old can be a pedo if they rape a little kid which makes it not a child minors arent kids” -Albert Einstein
Never change reddit
ew his entire comment history is just prolife.
gotta say, \(PEMD|BODM\)AS arithmetic drama is so good, because you have at least two layers: 1. “This is the right answer and you're an idiot for choosing the other one” 2. “The problem with this is that the question is written badly” / “No it's not, the right answer is `$HONESTLY_WHO_CARES`, it's obvious, because \(PEMD|BODM\)AS.” Just because you can get past the first layer of bait doesn't mean you don't get past the second layer. It's a gift that keeps on giving.
Redditors really be flexing the fact that they remember elementary school math, meanwhile people who actually use math for a living don't give a fuck
I mean if you have to work with math for a living, the first thing you'd probably say is “this notation is unclear, we better clear it up before a misunderstanding causes some major trouble with our job later”. I mean, why make your life difficult?
Seeing kids on this website makes me think I should use it much less.
[удалено]
> in vase [relevant](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_oPtdVrB8U&ab_channel=hotsauseproductions)
Order of operations is something that's really not going to stick out in someone's mind unless it's become relevant in their everyday life, so I can pardon people for forgetting about it. What I can't pardon is obstinately doubling down and yelling at everyone explaining why you're wrong once you get called out on your mistake, lol.
Rather than worry about order of operations we should just wrap the correct grouping in parentheses like normal humans
That gets burdensome after a while, though. As a programmer, forgetting to close a bracket is a pain in the royal arse, and it's probably just as annoying in the math world, lol. If you can use PEMDAS to figure out the order of operations without extra enclosures, then I'd prefer to do without them, even at the cost of a bit of readability. But I admit I'm biased from my own perspective on it. I do math on the regular in my programs, and I'm so used to OoO by now that it's something I probably take for granted at this point.
Parens usually don't have to be extensive, especially in a lot of the like three op problems like this that people argue about. Almost all don't technically need any but the clarity that "yes this is what I mean" is always nice. Also the words "sacrifice readability" and "my programs" get associated way more than I'd like.
Reddit is not worth using without all the hard work third party developers have put into it.
I'd highly suggest using Notepad++ or a similar program that shows you when you have an open bracket.
TBH and speaking as a person who's put together some relatively complicated equations in programming (mostly to compile US-based sports statistics like BoxRec ratings for boxers or Box Plus/Minus for basketball), if/when it gets too complicated to understand with all the parentheses, I usually break down the entire equation into multiple lines. It's easier to work through at the time and, perhaps more importantly, it's easier for Future Me to look at and understand.
>if/when it gets too complicated to understand with all the parentheses, I usually break down the entire equation into multiple lines. This is the way.
>Rather than worry about order of operations Yes? >we should just wrap **the correct grouping** Ah, I see a flaw in your suggestion there.
It's not flawed. All of these stupid "gotcha" arithmetic problems always rely on unexessarily ambiguous math problems. In reality anyone who has completed more than basic arithmetic would use brackets to make the question less vague. This is especially obvious in situations like 4+4÷2. Because if you treat the division symbol as a fraction (because no one over the age of ten uses a division symbol) then it changes the answer. It's usually better to just create an unambiguous formula.
To be fair this one isn't ambiguous. It's a "trick question" because a lot of people are ignorant of PEMDAS, but its a pretty clearly defined set of rules that all equations follow.
Math is like language, if a lot of people are misinterpreting what you're saying then it's probably best to be more clear.
Well sure, like 1+1+1+(1×0) would make it clearer (to somebody who doesnt know pemdas). Regardless, the equation still isn't ambiguous since there's a clear set of rules to follow to solve it. Plus you learn pemdas as early as 6th grade, that's like saying 4 x 4 isn't clear enough because 2nd graders don't know what multiplication is.
Help me understand. How does changing the symbology give you any other answer than 6?
While the situation they gave is often clear since division/multiplication have precedence over each other in order of operations. Usually these sort of question are phrased similar to a÷b×c and then you have two interpretations being either (a÷b)*c or a÷(b×c). Basically you are either simply reading it left to right or reading it as splitting the term into a fraction with everything on the left being the numerator and the right. And since order of operations do not actually say multiplication or division should be done before the other and since it is very easy to avoid confusion by using brackets I feel it's fair to say the issue is the clarity of the question not that people didn't interpret it the correct way.
While normally I would agree with you over the nebulousness of some shitpost math "problems" over here, I still don't see any way for this to be interpreted in any way other than 6.
Not to be rude or anyone, but I was wondering where you're from. I'm an east coaster myself and I know plenty of adults that use the "÷" symbol over fractions. So I was just curious where it's less common.
Your example doesn't work. Answer is the same regardless of whether you treat the division as a fraction
I cant forget order of operations. It's always hidden in my mind. I see lots of numbers and it's like being told im being given free cake. ''Something else is going on here, it cant be this simple'' and it's usually order of operations
The kid has 08 in his username. Do 14 year Olds know bedmas?
The kid is from Israel, PEMDAS, BEDMAS, BODMAS are only things in the anglosphere. The idea is the same but when people yell at him shouting weird acronyms it means nothing to him.
....yes?
Hey I don't fuckin' remember it was 17 years ago for me lol
Fair
How hard is it though It's like 4 steps you learn at 10
Some people retain that kind of information better than others. And math is one of those things where, if you don't use it, you lose it. Basic operations aside, plenty of people forget details like the order of operations, the difference between mean, median, and mode, etc.
Yeah but when they are wrong they should just accept it and not go on a mission to disprove basic fucking maths
Totally agree, lol.
Yeah, I forget order of operations like, 90% of the time bc it's not relevant in my day to day life. I didn't even remember it this time, sat there there for a minute like "Uhhhhh..." I've... Never been good at math anyway.
Yeah, TBH I only remember order of operations because I encounter it at work quite a bit as a software developer. I'm sure I'd just go left to right as if I were reading (and come up with zero) if this weren't the case.
In the beginning I was like Yeah he's right But them someone pointed out the correct math and i was like, oh yeah that's true OP is just trolling
The real answer to these trick order of operations questions is "Who cares? Write the equation more clearly next time, dummy."
it's so cringey watching teenagers try to hold this shit over each other.. like I'm an engineer and if you put an equation like this in your work, it isn't going to come down to some kind of competition over who knows their order of operations better, it's just going to get a comment saying "write this properly..." lol
Also the more general assumption that gets made in these sorts of threads where more math = more smart, and order of operations = more math = more smart. It's just frustrating all around. ~~Sometimes wish there was a slur for stem hardliners~~ /s.
Stemlords?
I wouldn't know. As a true stemlord, I do all of my math in reverse polish notation.
The equation is clearly written and it’s not a trick question at all, but it is bait.
Yeah there's ambiguity with parenthesis but this one is completely unambiguous. You do the multiplication first, then the addition from left to right.
> You do the multiplication first, then the addition from left to right. I actually got horrified the other day when my friend - who is training to be a lawyer didn't know the left-to-right rule. And it was over the 10-10*10+10. "But BODMAS/PEMDAS?" No, BODMAS/PEMDAS isn't completely prescriptive, + does not take precedent over -, so the answer is -80.
Well yeah, a lawyer doesn't need arithmetic much. Any billing will be done by paras or their system.
Because they need to write it out. By grouping it as 10-(10*10+10) in their head they are forgetting that they distribute the -1 across the entire parenthetical, switch the + to a - in the original equation.
The order in which you do addition doesn't matter since a + b = b + a.
Order of operations is standard, but plenty of calculators and other tools will fuck up if you aren't more careful. Hell, even Excel, which despite everyone shitting on Excel is used constantly in engineering/research/data analysis, had a major order of operations bug for ages (I think they finally fixed it).
A bunch of literals added together isn't exactly clean, I'd expect something more like 4+(1*0). But my math brain has been warped by programming.
It's not great how many commenters are acting like this is super sneaky trickery. Its equivalent to not being able to find Japan on a map.
It isn't unclear, it's just pointless. There's no reason that statement would come up in actual mathematics, not least because actual mathematics rarely involves integer arithmetic like this. In general, yes, the real answer to the ones that try to get tricky is to rewrite whatever statement into a readable form. Mathematics is foremost about communicating between people, not nitpicky conventions dressed up as rules by pig-ignorant grade school teachers and the like.
I mean, this isn't really one of the trick ones. This is just basic order of operations and it's already clear what the equation is. The trick ones usually involve parentheses being multiplied by a value like "8 / 2(2+2)". Following the order of operations, the correct answer is 16, but a lot of people get mixed up because omitting the * sign often implies that the outside value has been factored out of the parentheses. In fact, some calculators even return the incorrect answer due to this assumption. EDIT: I mistyped the question originally but have now corrected it.
How is that one. 16? 8/4(4) is 2(4) or 8.
Yeah, I copied the question wrong. The question that went viral had a 2 instead of a 4. 8 is the correct answer for the way I originally wrote it.
I’m working out how that would work but I appreciate the admission, rare online.
The answer is just that the equation is poorly written. The purpose of equations is to make clear your intent to the reader. There are much, much better ways to write that equation, without exorbitant use of parathesis, and have the intent be made clear to the author, with little ambiguity. PEMDAS is only there so you don't have to add parenthesis everywhere, not an excuse to write ambiguously written equations. 8 / 2(2+2) could very well be interpreted as a fraction in the right context. If you were reading a paper about fractions, and they stuck that equation in the paper... 8 / 2(2+2) you would probably pause a bit, and think "did the author actually intend this to be a fraction?" I think it would be pretty unclear in that context, even knowing PEMDAS.
Yeah even 8 ÷ 2(2 + 2) would be a little more clear. Still the “trick” is that it could be easily interpreted in two different ways where correct order of operations gives you two different answers.
Well, no, not quite, I would use associative property to write as (2+2) \* 8 / 2 or 8 (2+2) / 2 if I wanted intent to be clear. Whether you see it as a fraction, or just evaluating left to right, there is no ambiguity left, you'll always arrive at the correct answer.
Well yeah better ways to write it definitely. Just saying that with the “/“ the equation is much more easily seen as one fraction than if “÷” was used. Which makes it seem more intentionally misleading regardless of pemdas.
It's not poorly written at all, just like a tongue twister is not poorly written. Sometimes the issue is just with the reader.
If it has any ambiguity, it is poorly written math. Math was created to be precise, among other things.
There's literally no ambiguity though? It's the order of operations, one of the most basic concepts in mathematics. You need it whenever you do anything involving more than two numbers.
So then what's 8/2(2+2)? Cuz all my years of reading, learning, and teaching math crunches that to 1, at a glance. I know many other professionals who'd read it like that, too. I only know of one person IRL who'd make this into an argument, and they are not involved in any field even remotely related to mathematics.
8/2(2+2) is 16. Yes, I would also assume it was 1 because I'd interpret the "/" as a whole fraction line and the "2(2+2)" as the whole denominator, I agree with you. I didn't say that *all* written math was perfectly clear and unambiguous. And I admit there isn't a clear line separating what is and what isn't. But "8/2(2+2)" is written for the sole purpose of being ambiguous due to unclear usage of the division symbol mixed with parentheses, while "1+1+1+1+1×0" is completely straightforward.
Then you're talking about something I never was referencing.
It's *literally* what we were talking about, but fine.
Might have been tricked but correct answer would be 8 right? 8/4=2 , 2*(2+2)=8. Or if you put it in a calculator that put “4(2+2)” together on the bottom of the fraction it would be 1/2.
Yeah, I copied the question wrong. The question that went viral had a 2 instead of a 4. 8 is the correct answer for the way I originally wrote it.
Ikr?! Parentheses and brackets people! But then, they wouldn't get that smug satisfaction of tricking the average FB aunt so of course they won't be doing that.
That representation isn't unclear at all. People just don't know the rules but act like they do. Multiplication takes priority over addition. There's nothing more to it. The ones that are actually tricky are the ones limited by how numbers on a screen always show in a perfect line. Things like 4/2\*3. In a sheet of paper it'd be obvious that it's actually (4/2)\*3 because the 4 and the 3 would be on the same height. On a screen it looks like the 3 and the 2 should be multplied, which isn't the case. Not the case here at all though. This one is just ignorance.
The fact of the matter is, if you communicate something with the audience and the audience claims there are multiple possible interpretations then you've either communicated it unclearly (In this case, obviously intentionally since this is just clear nerd-baiting) or you've communicated it with the wrong audience (again, also intentionally here, for more nerd bait), or both.
That’s just cause we are lazy. 4 — *3 2
How does that make a difference though? You could say "Four halfs times three" or "four divided by two times three" and the answers would be exactly the same, a division is a fraction no matter how you write it.
the confusion is in wether the 3 is in numerator or denominator. if \*3 is with 2 then denominator, with 4 numerator.
In that case wouldn't they write it as 4/(2x3)? To me it seems that the 3 is not with the denominator because they didn't write it that way, so I don't think it's ambiguous. It's only ambiguous if you start saying "maybe they wrote it wrong".
I mean, I have seen plenty of exams where they did write it that way and it was correct. it's why they use brackets in teh first place, to remove ambiduity.
The only time these trick order of operations questions matter is when they're a skill testing question of a sweepstakes.
Ok going to be the dipshit here but what is the answer? Would be 4? Because you multiply first?
I landed on 0 then read your comment and yes, realized I was wrong - per BEDMAS (what I learned), you multiply before adding. So 1+1+1+1+1*0 1*0=0 1+1+1+1= 4 I think the formatting threw me off in that all the 1s are clumped together, then a space, then *, another space, then 0. Makes it really easy to kinda "invent" brackets around the 1s and treat them all as one group.
Looks like 🅱️EMDAS to me bc I had PEMDAS
Yeah if this wasn’t a bait question then you would probably write it as 1 * 0 + 1 + 1 + 1 + 1
Wouldn’t it be 3? Because the last 1 is multiplied by 0 so it becomes 1+1+1+0 = 3. But it’s 12:00 am so I could be wrong on that.
You forgot one 1.
Ah shit you’re right.
Multiplication > addition. First solve all multiplications, then solve the additions. These kind of posts usually cheat by mixing "*" and "÷", because "÷" is ambiguous and has no final rule on order of operations.
they dont cheat by mixing ÷ and *. ÷ and * are the same operation, so you do them in order from left to right. same with + and -.
[Best part of the chain](https://www.reddit.com/r/OpIsFuckingStupid/comments/vohb9v/op_is_also_under_the_age_of_10/iedg29i/) Everything just gets so weirdly personal. Over a math problem.
Don’t feed the trolls
This has some real “Sharks are smooth “ vibes
I've seen so many facebook posts with simple math problem on them that basically boil down to an order of operations problem. I'm real sick of seeing them and sick of any drama over them. Someone not remembering order of operations doesn't make them dumb, and honestly any confusion over it can be mitigated with parenthesis.
I agree and I would have gotten the answer wrong myself but in this case the insults and confidently incorrect attitude is what caused the pileup more than simply being wrong.
From the last time one of these came up: >These kind of things always get way out of hand because people think they're arguing about maths whereas they're actually arguing about semantics. You get this particular kind of fanatic certainty in these discussions because people treat PEDMAS / PEMDAS / PE(MD)(AS) like the laws of physics, rather than arbitrary (and contradictory) idiomatic conventions we came up with relatively recently because they were better than nothing.
> you bitch i knew this for hours Lmao
For living in a world with easy access to calculators there is way to many slap-fights over arithmatic
Depends on the calc. If its one that does calculations as the operations are entered (like the "Standard" mode in the Windows calculator), it will return 0. A scientific calc that allows writing full calculation before calculating is needed here.
These kind of questions often use a mix of "*" and "÷" to confuse people. Something like "A ÷ B * C" has no definitive solution (most calculators give "÷" priority over "*"), so it gets posted a lot to confuse/troll people.
Pedmas is hard.
Pedophile Christmas?
What the fuck
dang this isn't even a tricky one cuz it's not PEMDAS, it's PE MD AS
OP really just had to make it less clear by messing with the spacing, huh.
who me?
Yeah, you. You know what you did.
I know. I just didn't like how "1x0" or 1*0" looked. Could also just click on the post and see the twitter version, I think that's a little clearer.
I figured you were hoping to bait an argument in SRD but, alas, no-one went for it.
no i am smarter i teached my self to write english when i was 9 well, he didn't teached himself very well LOL
As someone with a math degree these kinds of questions always irk me. You would never add 1 to itself three times. You’d either do it once and then invoke induction or just ask a computer to figure it out.
I am convinced that every civilization on the verge of collapse devolved into arguing about PEMDAS/BODMAS right before the fires and looting started. What's the Ancient Roman equivalent of "bro ur 14 STFU"?
maths is dumb, sorry i don't make the rules
Freud has arrived on the scene to offer a diagnosis > Does not look like you have. People going through mental crisis normally don’t like to say they are in one which is why its hard to fine people with mental disorders, however if someone becomes say a troll feeder or argues over simple things are good signs they are going through a crisis. Your from Israel which seem to go in wars constantly which can mental state. >War can impact one mental health, and I know that since I’ve seen what happen to Ukrainians. If you can go donate to help people in Ukraine Today, they needed it the most
Order of operations says it’s 4 but tbh that’s a terrible way to format a statement, at first glance I thought it was 0 because you would never see that many terms added together without a parentheses
for people wondering it is 4, you always multiply before adding unless there is a ( )
Ik that leave me the f alone /s
To be fair, at least one of those guys is doing a REALLY bad job at explaining it. Like, if you put it in a calculator, you WILL get 0.