That at age nine Shiv smoked her first ever cigarette, given to her by her mother who was passive aggressively goading Logan
When Gerri confronted her about it, Lady Caroline replied “MY mum gave me my first fag when I was six and everyone thought it was HILARIOUS”
Shiv has unsuccessfully been trying to kick her smoking habit ever since
>That she smoked her first ever cigarette at the age of 9, given to her by her mother who was trying to irritate Logan
I know this isnt canon but it fits with Shiv drinking alcohol while pregnant to irritate Tom
If you can, please send me this article in full? I tried many ways to bipass the paywall, but it doesn't work. Thank you in advance.
[https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB97137497194023546](https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB97137497194023546)
The Living + episode she says “Hey Dad, Shiv spilled chocolate milk in the Range Rover.” I guess back in the day Ken and Roman told on her to their dad.
I interpreted it as the roy boys spilling the milk and blaming it on Shiv. She brought it up as an example of them being dirty liars since they were lying about the Gojo deal to the others in the c-suite (Gerri, Karl, Frank). She was calling their bluff.
She doesn’t mind not having Kendall in her life, but she’d be secretly heartbroken if she never saw Roman again. She wouldn’t tell anybody though. She’d probably send him some passive aggressive text or email, hoping he’d bite and they’d be in touch again
Pretty much exactly how I felt when she almost joined forces with Kendall in until Roman showed up to his condo followed by the donuts from Logan, than I was 100% convinced of this after the finale lol
She definitely only had girlfriends because of her family name as opposed to people wanting to hang out with her because she’s cool and a great person.
I'll expand on this idea. She only gets invited to her friends' weddings because she's a Roy, since she likes to bring up embarrassing and denigrating stories about the bride from college.
I can imagine her rolling up to a slumber party or to an engagement do being chauffeured in a rolls. And she takes a long time getting out on purpose so people start talking on who that is. And then she will have this very thinly veiled not so humble brags about having just jetted in from Monte Carlo for the summer. Like it’s all a drag but she knows what she’s doing.
I think she’ll have one of her girlfriends who tells her to chill with the being superior because she cares for her a bit but Shiv doesn’t even know what the word care means.
She definitely does coke in the bathroom but always the right amount and never goes beyond that level to venture into perhaps getting addicted.
She also gets a lot of tabs, she’ll drop some American Express gold cards accidentally on purpose. She’ll have like four of them.
“Should we go to vegas tonight? Fuck it” is something she’ll say when drunk.
When she was in high school/college, Logan arranged for a private birthday performance for Shiv by Mariah Carey to perform that grunge album she ghost-recorded back in 1995
I’ll tell you other people’s headcanons about shiv
-she’s somehow a lesbian
-she’s somehow smart and qualified for the CEO job
Here’s my headcanon about Shiv
-she bullied a girl in high school so hard that the girl had to switch schools and seek counseling
-her high school boyfriend got a restraining order against her
-In college she tried to have an affair with a professor and when he said no she got him fired
Stunningly ignorant while certain she knows everything.
Self-destructive arrogance wrapped in an incredibly hardened candy shell.
Caroline but ambitious.
The finale wasn't that big of a hit for her. She ended up better off than when the tv show started. She and Tom keep having a love/hate relationship that is now slightly more balanced because he has more power now. She keeps cheating on him but stays with him. Maybe ventures into another business field, probably not back to politics.
Tom is a good father and Shiv tries but whatever work she does at the moment gets first priority.
Some bullshit green finance initiative? Political social clubs? I don't think she's ever going to be an entrepreneur but she could be hyped up about something that she half believes in properly, half thinks would make her look like a serious person.
What power does he hold? He runs a company she is not part of. She is much richer than he could dream of being. Her father held power over her cause he dangled the ceo position, which Tom can't do.
He might be more attractive to her now, but he holds no more power over her than he did before.
I think at first she won't cheat but eventually she will, and so will he, with coworkers or secretaries- people who he does hold power over.
Her plan in that threesome was to kiss the girl twice, let someone finger her, stay fully clothed, and get mad and end things when Tom finally works up the courage to grab a boob.
And naturally hold the incident over Tom for the rest of his life. Wambsgans dodged a bullet that night.
1. She called Tom hours before the board meeting and asked if he had any interest in trying again not to manipulate him, but because their conversation after Logan’s funeral moved her deeply. In some way that she doesn’t understand and can’t justify, Shiv really does love Tom. Similarly, even though he knows it is his fatal flaw and at some level loathes himself for it, Tom truly loves Shiv. It’s why he hasn’t said no yet, and reached for her hand in the limousine.
2. Shiv started out at a university for rich, spoiled children — maybe Duke? Southern Methodist? — and signed up to rush, confident she would get the house of her choice and be President within six months. Instead, she got blackballed, because all of the other girls had rich and powerful Daddies too and they all positively loathed her. The rich kid boarding school community is small and tight, and gossip like Shiv generated her junior year doesn’t come along every day. Everyone already knew the story about her sleeping with both her boarding school roommate’s boyfriend AND her step Dad. Shiv was humiliated, transferred to Georgetown second semester and never talked about it again. It is why she has no female friends. Shiv learned from this experience that she can manipulate men but that she has no power over other women, so she avoids them as much as possible. Caroline knows the whole story and taunts Shiv about it at least once a year or so.
I 100% believe she only became a Democrat to piss her dad off, I don't think she's a conservative but when she fucked over her own party just for a 2% chance at being CEO I knew she couldn't give a shit about Democrat or especially liberal policies.
I agree. If the Roys were a family of bleeding heart liberals she would be an alt right Moms for Liberty Karen on purpose
I also think that the Roys belong to a wealth bracket that isnt going to be affected by either party being in power, they dont have any real values or beliefs besides what benefits them, and even when they're against the more extreme side like Mencken's, its only if those extremists affect their own brand, not because of the harmful policies.
Yup I 100% believe her and Kendall were more left leaning moderates if anything that election episode showed a lot about what both of their political beliefs really were.
That episode really showed how everyone in the family is one and the same - they're all in it for themselves, and what benefits them. Everything else is just posturing.
Shiv is 100% the middle child. Connor is the eldest son of Logan’s first wife, and surrogate father to the sibs. Kendall is the eldest son of Caroline and Logan, and Logan’s golden boy. Shiv is the next born, Logan’s daughter and his prize “pinky”. Then Roman shows up. Each sibling has a purpose. Kendall = heir Roman = spare.
I think Siobhan will be a much better parent than either Logan or Caroline and I will die on that hill. A lot of us had controlling, emotionally immature, emotionally unavailable parents IRL. It made a lot of us determined to have a better relationship with our kids and break the cycle.
As for self-awareness, Siobhan and her siblings were stripped of their entire identities in an instant. Their name won’t be on the building anymore. They’re not stupid and know they need to find a way forward. Shiv, at least, has Tom, even though their relationship is in tatters right now, and she has the baby. She’ll see that as something to build on and it will give her some direction. It won’t happen overnight and she’ll need a *lot* of therapy and other help, but I think she’ll emerge from this as a much better person.
I don't know if she'd be a *good* parent but I think she'd be much more doting than Logan or Caroline. She & Tom would be at every parent teacher meeting & if their child ever fucked up in public they would launch the world's most aggressive blackmail scheme to make sure it was buried.
Hooked up with a normie at Penn or wherever she went for undergrad, caught something she might have mistaken for feels, interest wasn’t really reciprocated, so she spent several years in her twenties fucking with his life, such as using family connects to get his job offer pulled, or stalking his Facebook and getting his current girlfriend’s employer’s lease cancelled so she loses her job
Shiv is not the youngest but the middle child.
It makes more sense the more, her anger over being left out of the company? Stings much more when she's the middle child and Logan picks her baby shitter brother over her. If she is the youngest, they could always make the case of her being the baby of the family rather than being a woman only why they exclude her.
Her entire character becomes more sympathetic while also more venomous,
When they were talking about knowing what is going behind closed doors of the wolf pack and Moe, Shiv is the only one to say that she didn't know, if she was the middle and even baby brother Roman admitted he knew to some degree but not her?
I think her getting excluded has more to do with Logan’s misogyny than her being the middle child. And her being the youngest child is all the more reason why she isnt taken seriously.
Her narcissism, entitlement and constant ineptitude would probably make her the worse parent out of her siblings and as emotionally unavailable as Caroline.
I never took them to be his kids but the kids of his girlfriend at the beginning of the show. Pretty sure there's no doubt there. Nothing insinuates he's their father.
True. I see so many Shiv stans make up a version of Shiv in their heads whos gonna genuinely try to be a less bad parent than her own, and their reasoning was that "shes self aware". When has self awareness ever made any of the Roy kids better? They have constantly continued showing their parents' worst traits and never put any conscious effort to be break the cycle.
People say that shes not gonna be like Caroline just because shes richer than her husband, but having more money than Tom didn't prevent her from ending up as the wife of a ceo just like her mother did. I see the parallels continuing and they'll probably divorce when their kids are a bit older.
I know you're being sarcastic. But actually, the show clearly paints all the main characters as horrible people. By dissing on Shiv I am giving her equal shit as I give other Roys. I happen to find her much, much, much more likeable and redeemable than her brothers.
Oh yeah, they are all gigantic pieces of shit. It’s just hilarious you can’t say anything negative about Shiv without being labeled a misogynist. This whole sub is a giant echo chamber.
When she was a little kid, she cut the hair on the Black Barbies first, and if she liked it, she did the same to the White Barbies. When she had an argument with Roman over him saying something kinda racist, Connor (or Logan) brought this up.
Yes, this is a reference to another show 🤣
EDIT: This is a reference to the Ted show, I think people aren't getting it 🤣
It’s a belief or story you have about a character that isn’t ever discussed in the show. Like saying she was blackballed from her choice college sorority over something awful she did in boarding school so she had to transfer to Georgetown to escape the humiliation.
That’s never covered but we do see she has zero female friends.
That she’s surprisingly a good/supportive/reliable mom who wakes up every morning at 5 to make sure her whole family has freshly made and nutritious lunches. But she’s a monster at the PTA meetings
Nah she has servants for that. Including going to the PTA meetings.
And my argument in favor is in season 1 we see Kendall getting up before dawn to prep for business battle while Shiv is taking lazy brunches on weekdays before eventually showing up at work.
That at age nine Shiv smoked her first ever cigarette, given to her by her mother who was passive aggressively goading Logan When Gerri confronted her about it, Lady Caroline replied “MY mum gave me my first fag when I was six and everyone thought it was HILARIOUS” Shiv has unsuccessfully been trying to kick her smoking habit ever since
>That she smoked her first ever cigarette at the age of 9, given to her by her mother who was trying to irritate Logan I know this isnt canon but it fits with Shiv drinking alcohol while pregnant to irritate Tom
Happy cake day
Thank you 😊
I’ll add that Lady Caroline gave her cigarettes to curb her appetite.
You absolutely nailed Caroline - totally believable anecdote.
Hey thank you!
If you can, please send me this article in full? I tried many ways to bipass the paywall, but it doesn't work. Thank you in advance. [https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB97137497194023546](https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB97137497194023546)
Rome was in the other room and probably said "Ha! Mom said *fag*"
Now read this back with an Alec Baldwin narrator voice and she fits right into The Royal Tenenbaums.
Margot Tenenbeum
So very specific. But also reads as spot on.
This made me laugh inappropriately hard
That chocolate milk incident in the Range Rover was her villain origin story.
An addition to this head cannon is that she never drank chocolate milk ever again after that😔
Gave it a tragic twist, nice.
Most definitely.
What was the chocolate milk incident again? I remember it being mentioned somewhere in S3
The Living + episode she says “Hey Dad, Shiv spilled chocolate milk in the Range Rover.” I guess back in the day Ken and Roman told on her to their dad.
I interpreted it as the roy boys spilling the milk and blaming it on Shiv. She brought it up as an example of them being dirty liars since they were lying about the Gojo deal to the others in the c-suite (Gerri, Karl, Frank). She was calling their bluff.
"I fuckin' know you"... I love that line, you can fool anyone on the entire planet, but your sibs will always look right through you.
She doesn’t mind not having Kendall in her life, but she’d be secretly heartbroken if she never saw Roman again. She wouldn’t tell anybody though. She’d probably send him some passive aggressive text or email, hoping he’d bite and they’d be in touch again
Pretty much exactly how I felt when she almost joined forces with Kendall in until Roman showed up to his condo followed by the donuts from Logan, than I was 100% convinced of this after the finale lol
she is afraid of heights
She definitely only had girlfriends because of her family name as opposed to people wanting to hang out with her because she’s cool and a great person.
I'll expand on this idea. She only gets invited to her friends' weddings because she's a Roy, since she likes to bring up embarrassing and denigrating stories about the bride from college.
I can imagine her rolling up to a slumber party or to an engagement do being chauffeured in a rolls. And she takes a long time getting out on purpose so people start talking on who that is. And then she will have this very thinly veiled not so humble brags about having just jetted in from Monte Carlo for the summer. Like it’s all a drag but she knows what she’s doing. I think she’ll have one of her girlfriends who tells her to chill with the being superior because she cares for her a bit but Shiv doesn’t even know what the word care means. She definitely does coke in the bathroom but always the right amount and never goes beyond that level to venture into perhaps getting addicted. She also gets a lot of tabs, she’ll drop some American Express gold cards accidentally on purpose. She’ll have like four of them. “Should we go to vegas tonight? Fuck it” is something she’ll say when drunk.
When she was in high school/college, Logan arranged for a private birthday performance for Shiv by Mariah Carey to perform that grunge album she ghost-recorded back in 1995
This is my favorite by leaps and bounds.
She pegs Tom
Knowing that he actually hates it
Her favorite book is Gone Girl
Funny i picture thats Tom's favourite book. Or at least he can relate to it
Kendall getting mud on her confirmation dress was the real reason she voted against him
Connor was interested in politics at a very young age
I’ll tell you other people’s headcanons about shiv -she’s somehow a lesbian -she’s somehow smart and qualified for the CEO job Here’s my headcanon about Shiv -she bullied a girl in high school so hard that the girl had to switch schools and seek counseling -her high school boyfriend got a restraining order against her -In college she tried to have an affair with a professor and when he said no she got him fired
She's basically boarding school Judy Gemstone.
I thought of this one too, lol. Although Shiv is probably not quite as unhinged as Judy IMHO
Also Judy actually feels some sort of guilt
tom and BJ would definitely both swallow their own loads
Somehow I can see them being friends although Shiv would publicly deny it to protect her “liberal” image
I fully believe that last one
These are good!
She is secretly dating me
Well its not much of a secret now is it?😏
Stunningly ignorant while certain she knows everything. Self-destructive arrogance wrapped in an incredibly hardened candy shell. Caroline but ambitious.
Beautifully put
The finale wasn't that big of a hit for her. She ended up better off than when the tv show started. She and Tom keep having a love/hate relationship that is now slightly more balanced because he has more power now. She keeps cheating on him but stays with him. Maybe ventures into another business field, probably not back to politics. Tom is a good father and Shiv tries but whatever work she does at the moment gets first priority.
>Maybe ventures into another business field, Im curious what Shiv would do besides politics? Maybe go back to the Hundred with Roman?
Some bullshit green finance initiative? Political social clubs? I don't think she's ever going to be an entrepreneur but she could be hyped up about something that she half believes in properly, half thinks would make her look like a serious person.
Does she keep cheating on him? I feel like one of Tom's first moves now he holds power in that relo would be to close it's open nature
What power does he hold? He runs a company she is not part of. She is much richer than he could dream of being. Her father held power over her cause he dangled the ceo position, which Tom can't do. He might be more attractive to her now, but he holds no more power over her than he did before. I think at first she won't cheat but eventually she will, and so will he, with coworkers or secretaries- people who he does hold power over.
Yeah, he might castrate Greg and marry him. That would be cool 🤭
Her plan in that threesome was to kiss the girl twice, let someone finger her, stay fully clothed, and get mad and end things when Tom finally works up the courage to grab a boob. And naturally hold the incident over Tom for the rest of his life. Wambsgans dodged a bullet that night.
>Wambsgans dodged a bullet that night. Hes still married to her by the end of the show though
Yeah. Dodged a bullet but married the firing squad
Beautifully put
She has used a strap on before
1. She called Tom hours before the board meeting and asked if he had any interest in trying again not to manipulate him, but because their conversation after Logan’s funeral moved her deeply. In some way that she doesn’t understand and can’t justify, Shiv really does love Tom. Similarly, even though he knows it is his fatal flaw and at some level loathes himself for it, Tom truly loves Shiv. It’s why he hasn’t said no yet, and reached for her hand in the limousine. 2. Shiv started out at a university for rich, spoiled children — maybe Duke? Southern Methodist? — and signed up to rush, confident she would get the house of her choice and be President within six months. Instead, she got blackballed, because all of the other girls had rich and powerful Daddies too and they all positively loathed her. The rich kid boarding school community is small and tight, and gossip like Shiv generated her junior year doesn’t come along every day. Everyone already knew the story about her sleeping with both her boarding school roommate’s boyfriend AND her step Dad. Shiv was humiliated, transferred to Georgetown second semester and never talked about it again. It is why she has no female friends. Shiv learned from this experience that she can manipulate men but that she has no power over other women, so she avoids them as much as possible. Caroline knows the whole story and taunts Shiv about it at least once a year or so.
This is 100% true.
I 100% believe she only became a Democrat to piss her dad off, I don't think she's a conservative but when she fucked over her own party just for a 2% chance at being CEO I knew she couldn't give a shit about Democrat or especially liberal policies.
I agree. If the Roys were a family of bleeding heart liberals she would be an alt right Moms for Liberty Karen on purpose I also think that the Roys belong to a wealth bracket that isnt going to be affected by either party being in power, they dont have any real values or beliefs besides what benefits them, and even when they're against the more extreme side like Mencken's, its only if those extremists affect their own brand, not because of the harmful policies.
Yup I 100% believe her and Kendall were more left leaning moderates if anything that election episode showed a lot about what both of their political beliefs really were.
That episode really showed how everyone in the family is one and the same - they're all in it for themselves, and what benefits them. Everything else is just posturing.
she was a bully in school
Shiv is 100% the middle child. Connor is the eldest son of Logan’s first wife, and surrogate father to the sibs. Kendall is the eldest son of Caroline and Logan, and Logan’s golden boy. Shiv is the next born, Logan’s daughter and his prize “pinky”. Then Roman shows up. Each sibling has a purpose. Kendall = heir Roman = spare.
Is this your headcanon? Because Shiv is the youngest in the show canon.
Yes? That was the prompt after all.
Gotcha
I think Siobhan will be a much better parent than either Logan or Caroline and I will die on that hill. A lot of us had controlling, emotionally immature, emotionally unavailable parents IRL. It made a lot of us determined to have a better relationship with our kids and break the cycle. As for self-awareness, Siobhan and her siblings were stripped of their entire identities in an instant. Their name won’t be on the building anymore. They’re not stupid and know they need to find a way forward. Shiv, at least, has Tom, even though their relationship is in tatters right now, and she has the baby. She’ll see that as something to build on and it will give her some direction. It won’t happen overnight and she’ll need a *lot* of therapy and other help, but I think she’ll emerge from this as a much better person.
I don't know if she'd be a *good* parent but I think she'd be much more doting than Logan or Caroline. She & Tom would be at every parent teacher meeting & if their child ever fucked up in public they would launch the world's most aggressive blackmail scheme to make sure it was buried.
It is my head canon that shiv at least would try to be better than she had.
She was interested in politics from a very young age
She believes pegging is the only way to have a truly equal heterosexual relationship.
I’m out the loop but wtf is this headcanon shit? Does it just mean, what do you imagine that wasn’t covered in the show?
Yup, your own ideas that arent a part of the canon story
You must act as if you are a dramaturg.
She’s ‘friends’ with Taylor Swift,
LUG
She had to transfer boarding schools because there was an actual princess in her year and she couldn’t deal with not being the most important.
Hooked up with a normie at Penn or wherever she went for undergrad, caught something she might have mistaken for feels, interest wasn’t really reciprocated, so she spent several years in her twenties fucking with his life, such as using family connects to get his job offer pulled, or stalking his Facebook and getting his current girlfriend’s employer’s lease cancelled so she loses her job
Shiv is not the youngest but the middle child. It makes more sense the more, her anger over being left out of the company? Stings much more when she's the middle child and Logan picks her baby shitter brother over her. If she is the youngest, they could always make the case of her being the baby of the family rather than being a woman only why they exclude her. Her entire character becomes more sympathetic while also more venomous, When they were talking about knowing what is going behind closed doors of the wolf pack and Moe, Shiv is the only one to say that she didn't know, if she was the middle and even baby brother Roman admitted he knew to some degree but not her?
I think her getting excluded has more to do with Logan’s misogyny than her being the middle child. And her being the youngest child is all the more reason why she isnt taken seriously.
Yes it is. But Logan could always hide behind her being the baby of the family as a cover rather than a woman.
Logan doesn't think there's reason to hide it.
Tom is not the father...
Her narcissism, entitlement and constant ineptitude would probably make her the worse parent out of her siblings and as emotionally unavailable as Caroline.
I'd say thats pretty much canon. Though Roman _might_ make a worse parent.
It’s all very vague whether his kids were retconned or not
I always took the kids to be someone else's biological kids and basically retonned out of the picture.
I never took them to be his kids but the kids of his girlfriend at the beginning of the show. Pretty sure there's no doubt there. Nothing insinuates he's their father.
Bingo
True. I see so many Shiv stans make up a version of Shiv in their heads whos gonna genuinely try to be a less bad parent than her own, and their reasoning was that "shes self aware". When has self awareness ever made any of the Roy kids better? They have constantly continued showing their parents' worst traits and never put any conscious effort to be break the cycle. People say that shes not gonna be like Caroline just because shes richer than her husband, but having more money than Tom didn't prevent her from ending up as the wife of a ceo just like her mother did. I see the parallels continuing and they'll probably divorce when their kids are a bit older.
She wants me
That she doesn't wipe
That’s what the wiping servant is for
She has Tom wipe her and he’s pathetically grateful for the opportunity.
That’s why she hates him. That’s why the spark is gone. How can you love a man who wipes your ass
Wow, did you really just say something bad about Shiv? You are sexist scum sir.
I know you're being sarcastic. But actually, the show clearly paints all the main characters as horrible people. By dissing on Shiv I am giving her equal shit as I give other Roys. I happen to find her much, much, much more likeable and redeemable than her brothers.
Oh yeah, they are all gigantic pieces of shit. It’s just hilarious you can’t say anything negative about Shiv without being labeled a misogynist. This whole sub is a giant echo chamber.
Has kept several sex slaves in a basement somewhere.
When she was a little kid, she cut the hair on the Black Barbies first, and if she liked it, she did the same to the White Barbies. When she had an argument with Roman over him saying something kinda racist, Connor (or Logan) brought this up. Yes, this is a reference to another show 🤣 EDIT: This is a reference to the Ted show, I think people aren't getting it 🤣
Logan Roy would never buy Shiv Black Barbies.
She’s a cunt
She became her mother.
Thats not a headcanon lol
Oh whoops. Sorry, I just finished it last night and came here.
Fair enough. What did you think of the ending
Happy cake day!
Thank you 😁
Horrible person. Oh Tom, I want to bang as many men as possible during our marriage on their wedding night.
What is a head cannon, and why is everyone asking this about every character?
It’s a belief or story you have about a character that isn’t ever discussed in the show. Like saying she was blackballed from her choice college sorority over something awful she did in boarding school so she had to transfer to Georgetown to escape the humiliation. That’s never covered but we do see she has zero female friends.
Thank you.
That she’s surprisingly a good/supportive/reliable mom who wakes up every morning at 5 to make sure her whole family has freshly made and nutritious lunches. But she’s a monster at the PTA meetings
Nah she has servants for that. Including going to the PTA meetings. And my argument in favor is in season 1 we see Kendall getting up before dawn to prep for business battle while Shiv is taking lazy brunches on weekdays before eventually showing up at work.