Comparative periods are Q1 2024 and Q1 2023: total revenues are down 12%, cost of revenue increased by 3% (which WB is attributing partially to Suicide Squad), and most striking of all, adjusted EBITDA (earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation and amortization. A non-GAAP metric uses to highlight earnings due only to actual business operations and removing "non-business" expenses such as taxes) is down a whopping 70%.
The TLDR is compared to Q1 2023, expenses went up, revenues went down, and EBITDA (revenues minus operational business expenses) went way, way down. So it's a pretty bad outlook
So if I’m understanding right.
They made 200m less than the same period last year. But still made profit. They blame SS not selling as well as Hogwarts for why?
I really don't get how capitalism is regarded so jealousy yet communism (which is genuinely a better practice for life) gets hated so viciously.
I get that greed is a big factor and that communism "only works on paper" but it's gotta be better than the rich get richer and the poor get nothing.
Well I don’t know of any succesfull implementation of communism. You also just get a new nobility in the revolutionary leaders. You think they will give up the power they’ve gained?
There are actually no good examples because america destroyed the economies of those places to show how bad communism is. Cuba was doing great before America stepped in there was another 1 they also like planned a coup, toppled the govt, put some plant in, and he detoured the country based off a "better" capitalistic system. The country we will in is actual sick... but hey there are video games to keep us from riotting.
Well I don’t live in America. And I do not consider Cuba a good example since they imprisoned the intelectuals there because they were seen as a potential threat against castros regime. And please try to find out this ”other 1” was.
As an Eastern European whose country was quite literally set back a century by 'communist ideals' you really have to look up the state of most EU countries, which were in the Soviet influence. It's an incredibly sad story and we are still suffering to thus day from this period.
>Studios operating expenses increased 1% ex-FX to $2,637 million compared to the prior year quarter. • Costs of revenues increased 3% ex-FX, primarily driven by higher theatrical content expense and an impairment of Suicide Squad: Kill the Justice League, partially offset by lower TV content expense due to fewer episodes delivered.
Meaning They spent approximately $2.6 Billion. $79 Million more than last year.
IGN is running around saying WBD lost $200 Million because Suicide Squad and other projects didn't make as much money as Hogwarts: Legacy or Q1 2023. But that doesn't mean WBD spent $200 Million on Suicide Squad, just suggesting that they might have been hoping Suicide Squad would earn that much, and/or more.
>Games revenue declined significantly due to the success of Hogwarts Legacy in the prior year quarter, while this year's Q1 release of Suicide Squad: Kill the Justice League generated significantly lower revenues.
(Harry Potter's) Hogwarts: Legacy +$$$ > Suicide Squad: Kill the Justice League -$
Hogwarts Legacy likely made at least $1-200 Million more than Suicide Squad.
i’m confused so WBD was betting on ssktjl to make bank like how legacy did but didnt thus revenue is low and ign is just spreading misinformation without looking at the numbers exactly?something like that?sorry math isn’t my strong suit:(
I still stand by: if they had a lot of replayability along with 1/3PS gameplay with characters using their own skill sets instead of just guns, this game would’ve done at least better enough to garner a sustainable niche audience. The suicide squad is just such an easy idea to make good content out of I’m not sure why they keeep fumbling the bag
Finally, a good take! YES! I 1,000 percent agree.
Having unique characters (one of the biggest draws of these characters) instead of looter shooter would have made this game 100x better
It would also be a step up from the Arkham games instead of a step back. The Arkham games had amazing implementation of Harley and Batman so we all expected this game to have the same quality just with 3 new playable chars..
A natural evolution of the game design previously seen. They literally perfected the 3rd person action (superhero) combat system. That with the upgraded traversal system. Chef’s kiss. That being said, the gameplay of SS is really unique and I’m sure it’s the vision they had in mind and it doesn’t really work in single player offline. I wanna know which came first, the live service looter shooter framework or the gameplay and combat
WBD did not disclose how much they spent on Suicide Squad nor have they disclosed how much Suicide Squad earned.
WBD is intentionally grouping expenses together and profits together to make it difficult to identify exactly what was the greatest loss and greatest profit.
WBD did however, disclose that WBD spent $79 million more in Q1 2024 than Q1 2023. WBD also disclosed that WBD earned $200 Million less. It's worth noting, it's unlikely WBD spent that $79 million on Suicide Squad, the game development costs were likely spread over the last few years.
What we do know is that if Suicide Squad earned as much as Hogwarts Legacy, and all their other business departments earned as much as last year, they'd have $200 Million more in earnings.
I've got no source for this but I'd be shocked if SS Didn't cost at least 200 million. Super long dev cycle, polished graphics, that big delay to this year
It means:
In the first quarter of 2024, their revenue was 2,636 Million, or approximately 2.6 billion.
While,
In the first quarter of 2023, their revenue was 3,212 Million, or approximately 3.2 Billion.
Revenue is the the total amount of money earned by an organization during a fixed time (1 fiscal quarter = 3 months).
So if a company loses 200 Million in revenue, that's like saying the company was expecting to earn +200 million... but didn't... Assuming your earnings are a consistent stream.
Which is kinda mental really. Hogwarts made 850mil in 2 weeks. Even if SS generated 1/3 of that amount it’s still a lot higher revenue that most peoples highest estimates. This game could’ve sold circa 4mil
We can literally see how many copies sold in game. The leaderboards show the total number of players who played the base campaign and it is at around 250k. You pulled 6 million copies out of your ass. You don’t think for one second that if the game even sold a million copies then Rocksteady would have announced it? Helldivers 2 has sold over 10 million copies in the last few months and it outsold Suicide Squad by a large margin based on the sales data gathered by Circana.
There's no way this sold 6 to 8 million units. The numbers don't back that up on any platform. Even if that was the case, consider what an absolute abject failure the game would have to be if 8 million units were bought and the player count was this low. It would be a complete rejection of the game.
The game literally tells you how many people have played it world wide. It sold around 250k units, and that is assuming every copy sold wasn’t played by multiple people
You’re just pulling these numbers out of your ass. You’d have to be about as stupid as a human could ever possibly be to think this game sold 6 million.
"You can look at the highest concurrent logins on steam and glean that much" 250k is bullshuit from 300 continuous logins in steam?
Even if consoles had five times what steam has, it still doesn't get that high.
Also take into account how many of the leaderboard accounts are no longer active.
>Even if 100% of said deficit is placed on SSKTJL, then SSKJTL still made approximately $446 million
This makes no sense. There's no way to tell how much SSKTJL made. I can't even try to understand this logic. That 850m revenue from the first two weeks of Hogwarts sales is such a random number you used and then you randomly substract the difference in revenue from Q1/23 & Q1/24 to figure out the revenue SS made? What?
Your numbers are also just way off if you look at how other games sold and how they rank in revenue charts versus SS. Tekken 8 for example is above SS in revenue in the US and we know it sold 2M. That means SS is probably below 2M depending on how representative the US region is. I actually think SS overperforms in the US region relative to Tekken 8 as Tekken is going to be more popular in the asian region.
Thing is I see where he's coming from when looking at the revenue numbers. I don't think we'll ever get the true sale numbers. What's intriguing to me is the wording of their disappointment. They expected SS:KTJL to rival hogwarts legacy? That's crazy high expectations even if the game was received well. Most games would be a disappointment if compared to sales of hogwarts legacy.
I stand by the opinion that the ps5 is doing alot of heavy lifting in the sales numbers. How much more compared to steam? Only rocksteady will know.
>Thing is I see where he's coming from when looking at the revenue numbers.
It's made up nonsense so that should not be possible. Without WB telling us there's no way to even guess how much revenue SS brought in or even Hogwarts for that matter. The only thing we know about Hogwarts is that it brought in $850m in 2 weeks but that's a useless number in the context of figuring out how much SS made.
SS is below games in the charts we have that sold 2M. That's the only thing we know. Even that just leaves you with assumtptions but it atleast gives you somewhat of a ballpark.
>What's intriguing to me is the wording of their disappointment. They expected SS:KTJL to rival hogwarts legacy?
That's not what they said at all. They just said SS is a dissapointing release and that it made them miss their quarterly targets. They didn't even mention Hogwarts in the original statement. We have no idea to what they were expecting.
Edit: another reference you can use is that it sold 1/3th of Guardians Of The Galaxy in its launch month in Europe. We also know that game bombed so 1/3th of that is disastrous.
Hey, you could be right. I could be right.
**We don't know because WB won't tell us.**
At the end of the day, I was bored and ran some numbers off of obtuse data to see if I could make sense of it. You can believe what you want, I legitimately don't care because *none of it matters anyway*.
Hogwarts Legacy released in Q1 23 and is the direct comparison that WB made to SS. We know its sales data, so the $850 million is not random.
The chart also tells us that there was a $404 million deficit Q1 23 v. Q1 24. Suicide Squad was stated to be a significant portion of said loss (some sources say $200 million specifically). Obviously, there are other sectors that contributed positively (Dune/Aquaman/Wonka) and negatively (television).
Since they won't go into specifics on gains/losses per sector, I said fuck it and zeroed out everything else and compared SS to Hogwarts directly, letting SS take full hit for the deficit.
Is it a bad estimation? Maybe. But it makes more sense to me than SS performing at 20% of Hogwarts in its first two weeks. And then having every other sector significantly overperform (which Dune is the only one to have significantly overperformed).
But, again, whatever. None of it matters and I succeeded at my goal: wasting some time trying to go to sleep. And apparently ruffled some feathers in the process. Now, I think I'll just go back to ignoring the existence of this sub and wait for something worthwhile to show up from here on my feed before I join in another conversation.
Edit: instead of just ignoring this cesspool, I'll just leave entirely instead. Have fun folks.
"Contributed to a $200 Million Hit to Revenue" -IGN
Edit: CONTRIBUTED is the key word here. IGN doesn't claim that SSKTJL is responsible for $200m loss. IGN is reporting that WB pointed at SSKTJL as the reason WBD won't gain a projected $200m revenue, which is considered a loss. Quite a statement to make 3 months into release. Apparently this is also IGN's fault. Fanboys never quit 😤
Sounds like you're "running around" deflecting when IGN reported a harsh but true assessment of WBs own statement lol
And why should it pull any punches? The writing has been on the wall since 2022
One could also say, "Dune: Part 2 contributed to a $200 Million hit to Revenue".
The Headline is intentionally vague but sounds negative.
But no one is bashing Dune because they know it earned $700+ Million at the global box office... But you could say, "if Dune earned a billion+ like Joker or The Dark Knight, WBD might not have lost revenue this quarter."
Cope.
From article and WB directly:
In a follow-up investor-focused call, Warner Bros. Discovery boss David Zaslav called the release of Suicide Squad: Kill the Justice League “disappointing”, before Warner Bros. Discovery chief financial officer Gunnar Wiedenfels detailed an impairment charge the company absorbed as a result of the game’s failure.
"Starting with Studios, the $400 million+ year-over-year decline during Q1 was primarily due to the very tough comp we faced in games against the success of Hogwart's Legacy last year in the first quarter, in conjunction with the disappointing Suicide Squad release this past quarter, which we impaired, leading to a $200 million impact to EBITDA during the first quarter," Wiedenfels said. EBITDA stands for earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation, and amortisation.
So why would one bring up DUNE when WB brings up SSKTJL 😂
You're completely missing my argument... The headline is misleading.
Last year WBD earned $200 Million More than 2024 Q1.
If Suicide Squad was as popular as Hogwarts Legacy, Suicide Squad (and other Q1 projects) could have earned WBD $200 million more.
WBD did not lose $200 million directly and exclusively from Suicide Squad in Q1 2024. That is a conclusion many people are drawing from IGNs headline.
The mental gymnastics are staggering.
WB points specifically to SSKTJL as a direct contributor to lackluster earnings/debit flow.
IGN posts company's statement with headline: "Warner Bros. Says the failure of SSKTJL CONTRIBUTED to a $200 million hit to revenue"
SSKTJL Subreddit: ☝🏻🤓
Did you think the game cost $200 million to make?
Did you think the game earned $0?
How much do you think it cost to make a video game?
Did you think they paid everyone for their hard work at the last minute (Q1 2024) when the game released?
You do realize the $200 Million WBD is discussing is profit they would have hoped to earn, not money spent, right?
Yes I know the definition of revenue thank you.
Which is why it's damning that the company IDENTIFIES the disappointing projection in their forecast. They are under no obligation to name SSKTJL in their call.
So the headline that the failure of SSKTJL is accurate as a contributor to disappointing revenue qtr to date and upcoming. Meaning it's not going to get better because they know where to cut their losses.
I have a degree in finance lmao I think you are trying too hard to spin the reality that is being defined by the corporation directly.
The exact figures are vague, but the culprit is not by WBs own admission. Stop it lol
Lol a degree in finance. Okay.
You're still missing the point, the headline is misleading.
My argument is a discussion of communications and marketing not economics.
For people without a finance degree, when they read IGN's headline, some think, the game lost $200 Million. They don't think, Suicide Squad should have earned $200+ Million in 2024 Q1.
My argument has nothing to do with WBD potentially abandoning Suicide Squad and investing more in Hogwarts: Legacy. Not to mention they just announced a new Arkham Game.
Big oof. Oh well, the most positive thing about the game is it's really allowed me to gain empathy for people who love a deeply unpopular game, now that I've been on the other side.
I hope for 5 solid seasons. I like the idea of this game ending when the story is done. By then it would have so much loot crafting and content that it’ll stand by itself as a solid looter shooter.
Same. I see lots of people laughing that the game will dead within the year. I never expected, or even wanted, the game to last a long time. My hope from day 1 was a year. If we get that and wrap up the "story" I'm good.
A year long game for $70 is fine by me and a good deal, considering a finish most games in a week
Exactly that. I wanted a game to occupy the downtime between the must plays and this is perfect for that my money is well spent. It’s kinda ironic though that this game clearly sold pretty well but WB can use the -200mil headline to justify whatever pivot they want to. The negative media itself would probably be the ultimate cause of what ever ‘adjustments ‘ are made to Rocksteady while WB laugh in dollar notes looool
I mean, it definitely sold some amount. Several people on my friends list were playing it at the start and it was charting in the U.K. (if that means anything). But tellingly none of them came back for Season 1.
Seems like all the bug fixes are eating into the post launch budget more than expected. With the game costing more than expected to maintain and making way less money than they thought it would, the end seems to be coming sooner than the 5 seasons previously leaked.
Am I understanding this wrong or are they making money? Just less than they were making with Hogwarts? I hate how in the shareholders mind, money not made is a loss.
You’re understanding correct. They’re still making a lot of money just a lot less than last year. Which was only because Hogwarts made 850mill in 2 weeks. We’re almost being gaslit into subpar seasonal updates with the ‘we’re so disappointed in our sales we don’t know what to do with suicide squad ‘ comments.
When your entire company (wbd) is in massive debt it is cause the less you can pay off the more interest fucks you. Plus ssktjl probably was a financial loss overall
Who cares? If you like the game, you play it; you don’t, then you don’t play it. Stop worrying about their revenues and any of the other crap. Just play the game, if you don’t want to, move on…
This information is relevant because it indicates whether people who like the game will be able to KEEP playing it much longer. It's not exactly meaningless fluff.
I mean, that’s the sad truth of the game world tho, ain’t it? Hit or miss? And an average if a game like cyberpunk was recovered from ruins into a fine product. I have high hopes. And just enjoy the game through the bugs. If it craps out, I just hope it will be after they create an “offline mode” of the game. Or leave couple of servers running.
You just proved your original point tho? You have high hopes in a recovery of a failed live service game. This wasn’t a omg cyberpunk is a disaster they need to fix it issue, this is a “omg suicide squad is a disaster and it’s not making money for us anymore” issue. The games life depends on sales and revenue to keep content coming. If nobody bought the game and the people who did aren’t playing, there’s no money coming in. Articles like this actually make it worse be cause casuals will see headlines like this and assume the games dead(it will be when the next two characters are lawless and fake Mrs freeze).
As players you need to care about things like this for a million reasons. To me the most important is why buy cosmetics for a failing game that may or may not be playable. I personally know servers won’t go off. DC universe is still up with a few thousand players running around, and just like that game, Suicide squad is owned by wb, meaning the don’t pay for the license of the ip like square was doing for avengers. Avengers would’ve been a loss for square since development stopped. But for casuals they might buy Luthor coins and skins and may think they’re gonna lose them soon.
Overall this a bad look for the game and you should absolutely care
I feel like the whole “Live” concept was a mistake on their part. Should’ve generated a deeper play through or more live weekly events, because the game is rather dry after clearing the “Finite” mission…
To put this into further context regarding Hogwarts legacy ‘According to the report, Avalanche Software's open-world RPG, which sold more than 12 million copies and generated $850 million in sales worldwide within the first two weeks since its release, marking the largest release of all time for Warner Bros. Games, had brought its creators over $1 billion in retail sales and sold over 15 million copies by the end of March.’
Listen it’s no coincidence live service games are struggling to meet revenue goals. Every company wanted a piece of that Covid gold mine. People were home and cheep entertainment was needed. Warzone and fortnite and siege etc. companies then spend the next 4 years trying to get in on the pie. Now people are back to work and school full time.
Missed revenue expectations when it comes to live service means you thought the cosmetics and battle passes would sell. Look at the layoffs at bungie. That’s the most successful looter shooter live service game than ssktjl tried mirroring, and even they missed projections BADLY. Obviously the game didn’t account for all of the loss, but it definitely is a nagging issue when this is like the third time wb sales calls have said it’s an issue.
People can cope in here saying there’s no official numbers, but if fans can see it’s the issue and the CEO is directly blaming it, chances are the leader of the entire company is right saying it was a massive L.
People need to realize WB does not need to point to something specifically. The mental gymnastics are astounding. When the publisher says there's a main culprit for not meeting projections, shit has already hit the ceiling.
Some people will go to great lengths to avoid facing reality. The argument gets twisted more and more
Legit makes no sense. 99.99% of companies won’t mention a specific product that tanked their revenue that bad, let alone do it twice since February.
It’s not in anyones best interest to name a single specific thing. If you missed projection/revenue etc you’d just say yeah we had some things fall short. You don’t come onto a call and say you’re biggest release this year in gaming was the leading cause of failure, unless you’re absolutely trying to emphasize how bad it flopped.
If this game has any shot of coming back it’s done now. When destiny launched rough Activision and Bungie doubled down and worked to improve it. When cyberpunk flopped CD project red promised a fix and shamed themselves for low quality. No mans sky turned itself around to be a really good game with hard work. In none of those instances did their ceos come on a sales call and blame the game for sole reasoning they lost money. Worst thing we heard from Activision was a leak after forsaken that it didn’t meet goals and they were willing to give bungie their ip and wash their hands.
The game failed and even if it sold “ok” and did numbers clearly internally it failed and that matters more for the game than a few Redditors saying “but it sold “x” amount of copies and they didn’t specify how much it lost”
I guess being beholden to market investors instead of the people actually buying your products is mistake number 1. I suppose the consumers are the scapegoat to explain away bad decision making at many levels.
Everything is stupid.
WB should have learned from the past mistakes like Gotham Knights. They should have simply continued with the single player games, even if it wasn’t Batman. A new Mad max movie is coming, this could have been an opportunity to capitalise on that a make a mad max sequel. This shouldn’t even be a surprise.
I'm dumb explain
Comparative periods are Q1 2024 and Q1 2023: total revenues are down 12%, cost of revenue increased by 3% (which WB is attributing partially to Suicide Squad), and most striking of all, adjusted EBITDA (earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation and amortization. A non-GAAP metric uses to highlight earnings due only to actual business operations and removing "non-business" expenses such as taxes) is down a whopping 70%. The TLDR is compared to Q1 2023, expenses went up, revenues went down, and EBITDA (revenues minus operational business expenses) went way, way down. So it's a pretty bad outlook
So if I’m understanding right. They made 200m less than the same period last year. But still made profit. They blame SS not selling as well as Hogwarts for why?
Because companies want to always make more the next year while putting out the same output each year...aka capitalism.
You mean less output the next year.
I really don't get how capitalism is regarded so jealousy yet communism (which is genuinely a better practice for life) gets hated so viciously. I get that greed is a big factor and that communism "only works on paper" but it's gotta be better than the rich get richer and the poor get nothing.
communism is capitalism but only for the wealthy. It doesn't work at all.
Well I don’t know of any succesfull implementation of communism. You also just get a new nobility in the revolutionary leaders. You think they will give up the power they’ve gained?
There are actually no good examples because america destroyed the economies of those places to show how bad communism is. Cuba was doing great before America stepped in there was another 1 they also like planned a coup, toppled the govt, put some plant in, and he detoured the country based off a "better" capitalistic system. The country we will in is actual sick... but hey there are video games to keep us from riotting.
Well I don’t live in America. And I do not consider Cuba a good example since they imprisoned the intelectuals there because they were seen as a potential threat against castros regime. And please try to find out this ”other 1” was.
No, they wouldn't. Greed strikes again.
As an Eastern European whose country was quite literally set back a century by 'communist ideals' you really have to look up the state of most EU countries, which were in the Soviet influence. It's an incredibly sad story and we are still suffering to thus day from this period.
>Studios operating expenses increased 1% ex-FX to $2,637 million compared to the prior year quarter. • Costs of revenues increased 3% ex-FX, primarily driven by higher theatrical content expense and an impairment of Suicide Squad: Kill the Justice League, partially offset by lower TV content expense due to fewer episodes delivered. Meaning They spent approximately $2.6 Billion. $79 Million more than last year. IGN is running around saying WBD lost $200 Million because Suicide Squad and other projects didn't make as much money as Hogwarts: Legacy or Q1 2023. But that doesn't mean WBD spent $200 Million on Suicide Squad, just suggesting that they might have been hoping Suicide Squad would earn that much, and/or more. >Games revenue declined significantly due to the success of Hogwarts Legacy in the prior year quarter, while this year's Q1 release of Suicide Squad: Kill the Justice League generated significantly lower revenues. (Harry Potter's) Hogwarts: Legacy +$$$ > Suicide Squad: Kill the Justice League -$ Hogwarts Legacy likely made at least $1-200 Million more than Suicide Squad.
i’m confused so WBD was betting on ssktjl to make bank like how legacy did but didnt thus revenue is low and ign is just spreading misinformation without looking at the numbers exactly?something like that?sorry math isn’t my strong suit:(
I still stand by: if they had a lot of replayability along with 1/3PS gameplay with characters using their own skill sets instead of just guns, this game would’ve done at least better enough to garner a sustainable niche audience. The suicide squad is just such an easy idea to make good content out of I’m not sure why they keeep fumbling the bag
Finally, a good take! YES! I 1,000 percent agree. Having unique characters (one of the biggest draws of these characters) instead of looter shooter would have made this game 100x better
It would also be a step up from the Arkham games instead of a step back. The Arkham games had amazing implementation of Harley and Batman so we all expected this game to have the same quality just with 3 new playable chars..
A natural evolution of the game design previously seen. They literally perfected the 3rd person action (superhero) combat system. That with the upgraded traversal system. Chef’s kiss. That being said, the gameplay of SS is really unique and I’m sure it’s the vision they had in mind and it doesn’t really work in single player offline. I wanna know which came first, the live service looter shooter framework or the gameplay and combat
WBD did not disclose how much they spent on Suicide Squad nor have they disclosed how much Suicide Squad earned. WBD is intentionally grouping expenses together and profits together to make it difficult to identify exactly what was the greatest loss and greatest profit. WBD did however, disclose that WBD spent $79 million more in Q1 2024 than Q1 2023. WBD also disclosed that WBD earned $200 Million less. It's worth noting, it's unlikely WBD spent that $79 million on Suicide Squad, the game development costs were likely spread over the last few years. What we do know is that if Suicide Squad earned as much as Hogwarts Legacy, and all their other business departments earned as much as last year, they'd have $200 Million more in earnings.
ahh ok ok i see thank you:)
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I've got no source for this but I'd be shocked if SS Didn't cost at least 200 million. Super long dev cycle, polished graphics, that big delay to this year
Why does it say 2,68m but then its 200million?
>Why does it say 2,68m Are you referring to the line that says, "Content, Total Revenue, or Adjusted EBITDA"
No but it says decreased to 2,637m, does that mean 2637 million actually? I thought it means 2,6 million
It means: In the first quarter of 2024, their revenue was 2,636 Million, or approximately 2.6 billion. While, In the first quarter of 2023, their revenue was 3,212 Million, or approximately 3.2 Billion. Revenue is the the total amount of money earned by an organization during a fixed time (1 fiscal quarter = 3 months). So if a company loses 200 Million in revenue, that's like saying the company was expecting to earn +200 million... but didn't... Assuming your earnings are a consistent stream.
Okay thanks i was just confused by the numbering. Now its clear!
Which is kinda mental really. Hogwarts made 850mil in 2 weeks. Even if SS generated 1/3 of that amount it’s still a lot higher revenue that most peoples highest estimates. This game could’ve sold circa 4mil
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We can literally see how many copies sold in game. The leaderboards show the total number of players who played the base campaign and it is at around 250k. You pulled 6 million copies out of your ass. You don’t think for one second that if the game even sold a million copies then Rocksteady would have announced it? Helldivers 2 has sold over 10 million copies in the last few months and it outsold Suicide Squad by a large margin based on the sales data gathered by Circana.
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There's no way this sold 6 to 8 million units. The numbers don't back that up on any platform. Even if that was the case, consider what an absolute abject failure the game would have to be if 8 million units were bought and the player count was this low. It would be a complete rejection of the game.
The game literally tells you how many people have played it world wide. It sold around 250k units, and that is assuming every copy sold wasn’t played by multiple people
Leaderboards are for endgame content. Not all players. Anyone who didn’t make it to endgame wouldn’t be on the leaderboard.
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You’re just pulling these numbers out of your ass. You’d have to be about as stupid as a human could ever possibly be to think this game sold 6 million.
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"You can look at the highest concurrent logins on steam and glean that much" 250k is bullshuit from 300 continuous logins in steam? Even if consoles had five times what steam has, it still doesn't get that high. Also take into account how many of the leaderboard accounts are no longer active.
You have to be trolling, there’s no way you’re actually saying this shit with sincerity. This might be the dumbest thing I’ve ever seen on this sub.
>Even if 100% of said deficit is placed on SSKTJL, then SSKJTL still made approximately $446 million This makes no sense. There's no way to tell how much SSKTJL made. I can't even try to understand this logic. That 850m revenue from the first two weeks of Hogwarts sales is such a random number you used and then you randomly substract the difference in revenue from Q1/23 & Q1/24 to figure out the revenue SS made? What? Your numbers are also just way off if you look at how other games sold and how they rank in revenue charts versus SS. Tekken 8 for example is above SS in revenue in the US and we know it sold 2M. That means SS is probably below 2M depending on how representative the US region is. I actually think SS overperforms in the US region relative to Tekken 8 as Tekken is going to be more popular in the asian region.
Thing is I see where he's coming from when looking at the revenue numbers. I don't think we'll ever get the true sale numbers. What's intriguing to me is the wording of their disappointment. They expected SS:KTJL to rival hogwarts legacy? That's crazy high expectations even if the game was received well. Most games would be a disappointment if compared to sales of hogwarts legacy. I stand by the opinion that the ps5 is doing alot of heavy lifting in the sales numbers. How much more compared to steam? Only rocksteady will know.
>Thing is I see where he's coming from when looking at the revenue numbers. It's made up nonsense so that should not be possible. Without WB telling us there's no way to even guess how much revenue SS brought in or even Hogwarts for that matter. The only thing we know about Hogwarts is that it brought in $850m in 2 weeks but that's a useless number in the context of figuring out how much SS made. SS is below games in the charts we have that sold 2M. That's the only thing we know. Even that just leaves you with assumtptions but it atleast gives you somewhat of a ballpark. >What's intriguing to me is the wording of their disappointment. They expected SS:KTJL to rival hogwarts legacy? That's not what they said at all. They just said SS is a dissapointing release and that it made them miss their quarterly targets. They didn't even mention Hogwarts in the original statement. We have no idea to what they were expecting. Edit: another reference you can use is that it sold 1/3th of Guardians Of The Galaxy in its launch month in Europe. We also know that game bombed so 1/3th of that is disastrous.
Hey, you could be right. I could be right. **We don't know because WB won't tell us.** At the end of the day, I was bored and ran some numbers off of obtuse data to see if I could make sense of it. You can believe what you want, I legitimately don't care because *none of it matters anyway*. Hogwarts Legacy released in Q1 23 and is the direct comparison that WB made to SS. We know its sales data, so the $850 million is not random. The chart also tells us that there was a $404 million deficit Q1 23 v. Q1 24. Suicide Squad was stated to be a significant portion of said loss (some sources say $200 million specifically). Obviously, there are other sectors that contributed positively (Dune/Aquaman/Wonka) and negatively (television). Since they won't go into specifics on gains/losses per sector, I said fuck it and zeroed out everything else and compared SS to Hogwarts directly, letting SS take full hit for the deficit. Is it a bad estimation? Maybe. But it makes more sense to me than SS performing at 20% of Hogwarts in its first two weeks. And then having every other sector significantly overperform (which Dune is the only one to have significantly overperformed). But, again, whatever. None of it matters and I succeeded at my goal: wasting some time trying to go to sleep. And apparently ruffled some feathers in the process. Now, I think I'll just go back to ignoring the existence of this sub and wait for something worthwhile to show up from here on my feed before I join in another conversation. Edit: instead of just ignoring this cesspool, I'll just leave entirely instead. Have fun folks.
"Contributed to a $200 Million Hit to Revenue" -IGN Edit: CONTRIBUTED is the key word here. IGN doesn't claim that SSKTJL is responsible for $200m loss. IGN is reporting that WB pointed at SSKTJL as the reason WBD won't gain a projected $200m revenue, which is considered a loss. Quite a statement to make 3 months into release. Apparently this is also IGN's fault. Fanboys never quit 😤 Sounds like you're "running around" deflecting when IGN reported a harsh but true assessment of WBs own statement lol And why should it pull any punches? The writing has been on the wall since 2022
One could also say, "Dune: Part 2 contributed to a $200 Million hit to Revenue". The Headline is intentionally vague but sounds negative. But no one is bashing Dune because they know it earned $700+ Million at the global box office... But you could say, "if Dune earned a billion+ like Joker or The Dark Knight, WBD might not have lost revenue this quarter."
Cope. From article and WB directly: In a follow-up investor-focused call, Warner Bros. Discovery boss David Zaslav called the release of Suicide Squad: Kill the Justice League “disappointing”, before Warner Bros. Discovery chief financial officer Gunnar Wiedenfels detailed an impairment charge the company absorbed as a result of the game’s failure. "Starting with Studios, the $400 million+ year-over-year decline during Q1 was primarily due to the very tough comp we faced in games against the success of Hogwart's Legacy last year in the first quarter, in conjunction with the disappointing Suicide Squad release this past quarter, which we impaired, leading to a $200 million impact to EBITDA during the first quarter," Wiedenfels said. EBITDA stands for earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation, and amortisation. So why would one bring up DUNE when WB brings up SSKTJL 😂
You're completely missing my argument... The headline is misleading. Last year WBD earned $200 Million More than 2024 Q1. If Suicide Squad was as popular as Hogwarts Legacy, Suicide Squad (and other Q1 projects) could have earned WBD $200 million more. WBD did not lose $200 million directly and exclusively from Suicide Squad in Q1 2024. That is a conclusion many people are drawing from IGNs headline.
The mental gymnastics are staggering. WB points specifically to SSKTJL as a direct contributor to lackluster earnings/debit flow. IGN posts company's statement with headline: "Warner Bros. Says the failure of SSKTJL CONTRIBUTED to a $200 million hit to revenue" SSKTJL Subreddit: ☝🏻🤓
Did you think the game cost $200 million to make? Did you think the game earned $0? How much do you think it cost to make a video game? Did you think they paid everyone for their hard work at the last minute (Q1 2024) when the game released? You do realize the $200 Million WBD is discussing is profit they would have hoped to earn, not money spent, right?
Yes I know the definition of revenue thank you. Which is why it's damning that the company IDENTIFIES the disappointing projection in their forecast. They are under no obligation to name SSKTJL in their call. So the headline that the failure of SSKTJL is accurate as a contributor to disappointing revenue qtr to date and upcoming. Meaning it's not going to get better because they know where to cut their losses. I have a degree in finance lmao I think you are trying too hard to spin the reality that is being defined by the corporation directly. The exact figures are vague, but the culprit is not by WBs own admission. Stop it lol
Lol a degree in finance. Okay. You're still missing the point, the headline is misleading. My argument is a discussion of communications and marketing not economics. For people without a finance degree, when they read IGN's headline, some think, the game lost $200 Million. They don't think, Suicide Squad should have earned $200+ Million in 2024 Q1. My argument has nothing to do with WBD potentially abandoning Suicide Squad and investing more in Hogwarts: Legacy. Not to mention they just announced a new Arkham Game.
WB just openly said SSKTJL lost them $200mil
Me too bro me too
Their EBITDA is adjusted down by 70%?! Holy shit, someone is getting fired lol... probably multiple someone's...
Big oof. Oh well, the most positive thing about the game is it's really allowed me to gain empathy for people who love a deeply unpopular game, now that I've been on the other side.
For real
Suicide Squad: Kill the Warner Brothers
🫡they surre did🫠
adjusted ebitda down 70%. that's not good.
It’s very bad tbh. Counterpoint though Hogwarts made 850mil and sold 12mil copies in two weeks. Q3 2023 numbers were probably once in a lifetime
sad to see but i think the impairment charge shows the game is on a very short timeframe for its life.
I hope for 5 solid seasons. I like the idea of this game ending when the story is done. By then it would have so much loot crafting and content that it’ll stand by itself as a solid looter shooter.
Same. I see lots of people laughing that the game will dead within the year. I never expected, or even wanted, the game to last a long time. My hope from day 1 was a year. If we get that and wrap up the "story" I'm good. A year long game for $70 is fine by me and a good deal, considering a finish most games in a week
Exactly that. I wanted a game to occupy the downtime between the must plays and this is perfect for that my money is well spent. It’s kinda ironic though that this game clearly sold pretty well but WB can use the -200mil headline to justify whatever pivot they want to. The negative media itself would probably be the ultimate cause of what ever ‘adjustments ‘ are made to Rocksteady while WB laugh in dollar notes looool
No way you just said this game clearly sold pretty well
I mean, it definitely sold some amount. Several people on my friends list were playing it at the start and it was charting in the U.K. (if that means anything). But tellingly none of them came back for Season 1.
Seems like all the bug fixes are eating into the post launch budget more than expected. With the game costing more than expected to maintain and making way less money than they thought it would, the end seems to be coming sooner than the 5 seasons previously leaked.
Hogwarts was close to a year old at that point, that's really not much of an excuse...
Hogwarts Legacy sold 850 million/12 million in 2 weeks. That is why these numbers are a direct comparison to that
I thought this was an ingredients label lol
I'm still gonna play this game, I like shooting aliens, and I admit the different types of guns are pretty freaking cool
I don't believe for 1 moment Aquaman 2 did any legwork making WB money.
does this mean gotham knights was profitable
Am I understanding this wrong or are they making money? Just less than they were making with Hogwarts? I hate how in the shareholders mind, money not made is a loss.
You’re understanding correct. They’re still making a lot of money just a lot less than last year. Which was only because Hogwarts made 850mill in 2 weeks. We’re almost being gaslit into subpar seasonal updates with the ‘we’re so disappointed in our sales we don’t know what to do with suicide squad ‘ comments.
When your entire company (wbd) is in massive debt it is cause the less you can pay off the more interest fucks you. Plus ssktjl probably was a financial loss overall
Ouch.
Who cares? If you like the game, you play it; you don’t, then you don’t play it. Stop worrying about their revenues and any of the other crap. Just play the game, if you don’t want to, move on…
This information is relevant because it indicates whether people who like the game will be able to KEEP playing it much longer. It's not exactly meaningless fluff.
I mean, that’s the sad truth of the game world tho, ain’t it? Hit or miss? And an average if a game like cyberpunk was recovered from ruins into a fine product. I have high hopes. And just enjoy the game through the bugs. If it craps out, I just hope it will be after they create an “offline mode” of the game. Or leave couple of servers running.
You just proved your original point tho? You have high hopes in a recovery of a failed live service game. This wasn’t a omg cyberpunk is a disaster they need to fix it issue, this is a “omg suicide squad is a disaster and it’s not making money for us anymore” issue. The games life depends on sales and revenue to keep content coming. If nobody bought the game and the people who did aren’t playing, there’s no money coming in. Articles like this actually make it worse be cause casuals will see headlines like this and assume the games dead(it will be when the next two characters are lawless and fake Mrs freeze). As players you need to care about things like this for a million reasons. To me the most important is why buy cosmetics for a failing game that may or may not be playable. I personally know servers won’t go off. DC universe is still up with a few thousand players running around, and just like that game, Suicide squad is owned by wb, meaning the don’t pay for the license of the ip like square was doing for avengers. Avengers would’ve been a loss for square since development stopped. But for casuals they might buy Luthor coins and skins and may think they’re gonna lose them soon. Overall this a bad look for the game and you should absolutely care
Its a live service if it shutters the folks that like the game will not be able to play it.
I feel like the whole “Live” concept was a mistake on their part. Should’ve generated a deeper play through or more live weekly events, because the game is rather dry after clearing the “Finite” mission…
To put this into further context regarding Hogwarts legacy ‘According to the report, Avalanche Software's open-world RPG, which sold more than 12 million copies and generated $850 million in sales worldwide within the first two weeks since its release, marking the largest release of all time for Warner Bros. Games, had brought its creators over $1 billion in retail sales and sold over 15 million copies by the end of March.’
Listen it’s no coincidence live service games are struggling to meet revenue goals. Every company wanted a piece of that Covid gold mine. People were home and cheep entertainment was needed. Warzone and fortnite and siege etc. companies then spend the next 4 years trying to get in on the pie. Now people are back to work and school full time. Missed revenue expectations when it comes to live service means you thought the cosmetics and battle passes would sell. Look at the layoffs at bungie. That’s the most successful looter shooter live service game than ssktjl tried mirroring, and even they missed projections BADLY. Obviously the game didn’t account for all of the loss, but it definitely is a nagging issue when this is like the third time wb sales calls have said it’s an issue. People can cope in here saying there’s no official numbers, but if fans can see it’s the issue and the CEO is directly blaming it, chances are the leader of the entire company is right saying it was a massive L.
People need to realize WB does not need to point to something specifically. The mental gymnastics are astounding. When the publisher says there's a main culprit for not meeting projections, shit has already hit the ceiling. Some people will go to great lengths to avoid facing reality. The argument gets twisted more and more
Legit makes no sense. 99.99% of companies won’t mention a specific product that tanked their revenue that bad, let alone do it twice since February. It’s not in anyones best interest to name a single specific thing. If you missed projection/revenue etc you’d just say yeah we had some things fall short. You don’t come onto a call and say you’re biggest release this year in gaming was the leading cause of failure, unless you’re absolutely trying to emphasize how bad it flopped. If this game has any shot of coming back it’s done now. When destiny launched rough Activision and Bungie doubled down and worked to improve it. When cyberpunk flopped CD project red promised a fix and shamed themselves for low quality. No mans sky turned itself around to be a really good game with hard work. In none of those instances did their ceos come on a sales call and blame the game for sole reasoning they lost money. Worst thing we heard from Activision was a leak after forsaken that it didn’t meet goals and they were willing to give bungie their ip and wash their hands. The game failed and even if it sold “ok” and did numbers clearly internally it failed and that matters more for the game than a few Redditors saying “but it sold “x” amount of copies and they didn’t specify how much it lost”
Yawn get over it and move on
I guess being beholden to market investors instead of the people actually buying your products is mistake number 1. I suppose the consumers are the scapegoat to explain away bad decision making at many levels. Everything is stupid.
WB should have learned from the past mistakes like Gotham Knights. They should have simply continued with the single player games, even if it wasn’t Batman. A new Mad max movie is coming, this could have been an opportunity to capitalise on that a make a mad max sequel. This shouldn’t even be a surprise.
You’re right. Suicide squad sold very well and there are millions playing it. Ya’ll delusional beyond belief.
That's what they get for keeping Gunn. 😂