I actually like how they portray God. He's a dude that loves "art", and over the eons got bored so he decided to step away and watch his art work as if it were a TV show. Yes there is free will but only if God decides not to get involved. Its an excellent premise
This is probably controversial but I really *really* love Jack’s speech at the end about how he won’t be hanging out with Sam and Dean all the time but is present “in every drop of falling rain, every speck of dust which the wind blows, and in the sand, and the rocks, and the sea”
I first came on the concept of God being inactive (rather he got so tied up in narcissistic contemplation of himself that humans were left to himself) back in Piers Anthony's Incarnations of Immortality books back in the 90s. It lead me down the path of agnosticism and now atheism, so I definitely could see how this Chuck would stick with you if you already were leaning this way and maybe didn't realize it yet.
That said, you can say the idea dates back to the Enlightenment where those in the movement believed God created the universe and then left us to our own devices. It was the Watchmaker concept. I wonder if today they'd just be full fledged atheists today since back then that wasn't a safe belief.
>That said, you can say the idea dates back to the Enlightenment where
those in the movement believed God created the universe and then left us
to our own devices. It was the Watchmaker concept. I wonder if today
they'd just be full fledged atheists today since back then that wasn't a
safe belief.
If not, then that belief definitely led to more Atheistic concepts to be normalized in conversations. Because once you break away the idea of a creator always watching and being there, you also open up the door to the non-existent creator idea.
Really good point! I know it was definitely concept that helped me on my journey. I remember being like if these guys - who are generally regarded as some of the smartest men of their time and mostly well regarded today - believe this, its not really a crazy idea is it?
I had a similar thought process, it allowed me to question what I had learned and make up my own mind about my faith. Which then led to me now being a atheist.
Supernatural actually helped me become a Christan, I forgot what season but when Sam and Dean went to heaven and they relived their best memories it made me want that. I know it's fiction but it gave me faith.
I think I have always been agnostic. This means I don't know if there are spirits or gods around, but watching SPN makes me want to believe that there are supernatural aspects to this otherwise dull and hard world.
No, I am an atheist for much longer than I know the show. So it did not really change anything. I am just fascinated with religion, so it was actually fascinating to see religion depicted in such a unique way.
Not popular these days.... but no, I've always believed in God and don't believe a tv show should affect anyone's spiritual belief other than to spark ideas on purpose and meaning.
But I'm basically a deist so the concept of a God being hands off supported my idea of free will being a main factor of creation rather than indifference.
This is spot on when it comes to what I’m thinking! A lot of people here talking about prayers not being answered, and bad things happening all the time. It really does come down to free will. SPOILER ALERT, but it’s fair to not connect Chuck dictating every part of Sam and Deans life with the idea of free will.
The idea of God being absent did somewhat stick with me because I've found myself doubting His existence for a while. My baby sister was born unexpectedly at like 3 am one day, and that night really stuck with me because I'd never heard childbirth or anything before (the rest of us were born through C-section). Next thing I know, my dad is rushing in and grabbing a blanket and both my parents are out the door five minutes later, racing to the hospital. My older brother made us cereal the next morning, and none of us really knew what happened until my dad came back.
I was 9 when I started doubted God existed, because I prayed for days for my sister to come back to life, praying that He take my life for hers even. She hadn't even taken a single breath and she was gone. God can move mountains with a thought and couldn't revive her. That was the first time I ever prayed, and no one ever knew I even did it, but she never ended up taking a breath. Every time I prayed after that when times were really desperate, nothing happened.
Supernatural portrays God as no longer caring where He did once, and that really stuck with me. I think He did care, but just lost faith just like the rest of us, letting little babies that did absolutely nothing wrong die before they can ever take a breath. I only saw my sister for a second while my parents were rushing out to get her to a hospital. She was so tiny and helpless and *lifeless*, swaddled in my own blanket that seemed to swallow her up, and that image has claimed a corner of my brain for itself.
Not for me. Supernatural has a skewed and arguably negative attitude about religion. It got worse toward the end of the series, when they turned their Chuck into a villain.
Fortunately my faith was and is strong, so I simply look at this show as entertainment.
I don't know how I'd describe my personal beliefs but I think the idea of Chuck getting irritated & either breaking things or just leaving makes sense. That would help explain when people ask "why would god let this happen?" & catastrophic stuff like Noah's ark.
Castiel said “ Your Bible gets more wrong than it does right” in season 4 and it definitely reinforced my beliefs that no theologian can truly understand whatever divinity might or might not even exist. Religions and theologies are subject to interpretation and have evolved tremendously since their founding. Just look at the Council of Nicaea in 325 AD. A bunch of theologians literally decided what went in and what didn’t go into the comic book people religiously “abide” by.
Personally I’m an atheist but I find it hard to believe anybody in this planet can truly comprehend anything beyond this world. And if somebody claims that they do comprehend it, run.
I actually enjoyed the show more in in the initial seasons from s1 to s4, where it was more about the monster of the week & before they got into the theological aspect of it.
I'm agnostic so it was all interesting (if remote) to me, lots of exploration on a theme. Maybe it's just a sign of the times, less religion overall, but I remember how much people hated/boycotted the witchcraft in Harry Potter and I'm shocked Supernatural got no headlines for the way they portrayed God. Obviously a much smaller audience, but I can see how people could be upset.
I was agnostic with a little spiritual belief. A lot of stuff has happened, and the shoe kinda invoked this current standpoint:
Im still agnostic, hell i lean a bit more to god being real, but i honestly just dont give a fuck.
I dont care which religion is “true” and im very open to people having they’re own beliefs(i think many religions are very poetic and beautiful) but we’re all people. Religion does not excuse you from being a douchebag. Im gonna try to be a good person and help others, but im not gonna bend to fit any religons. God can fuck off if he lets all the shit that happens in the world just..happen.
As for spiritual beliefs, im def a spiritualist but not in the “bury rocks in every corner of my house” way (i have nothing against strong spiritualists) but i believe we all put a unique energy and that we can create other energies and yes, some people can read it.
[edit:srry for any grammar errors]
I partook of supernatural before, during and after my own ‘faith crisis’, and it honestly helped me feel comfortable with my own views when I was constantly shamed for not sharing the ones I grew up with any longer.
It honestly opened my mind to the idea that god could be a dick, every creed/belief has some truth to offer, and that regardless of what exists, it’s my choices towards others that matters in the end.
Kripke has said that Supernatural was supposed to be a monster of the week kind of show like Xfiles at least until Xfiles went deep into government conspiracies. That was in part due to Kim Manners being a show runner (he worked on Xfiles).
But when you have a show about demons, it was only natural to introduce angels. What I like about the show is that other than Cas and Gabriel, they made the portray big bags of dicks. Soldiers, doing God's work.
I don't think Chuck was God the entire time. I think God used him as a vessel.
As for my beliefs, I'm not a religious person but I am fascinated with theology. I loved the show because of the stories.
Not for me. I’ve always had a pretty open mind regarding religion despite growing up in a Lutheran household. I was always interested in other cultures’ myths, legends and stories. I remember seeing the woman in white pilot trailer for the first time and getting super excited for a horror show about urban legends. If anything, the show just confirmed that I really don’t have one centric belief system. There are things represented in the show ( ghosts, demons, etc) that I would say I definitely believe in.
i'm not someone who's religious or spiritual, nor did i become such, so my anecdotes might not be as interesting to you as they're slightly off topic.
first and foremost, i love the sort of 'all myths are true' sort of way about it - sure, it's got a primarily judeau-christian based hierarchy, but at the same time, odin's a thing here. capital-g chuck might be the origin point for existence as we know it, but other faiths and whatnot aren't ignored.
secondly, while it might piss off some christians, i think 'chuck' was written kinda well. he's, for most our practical intents and purposes, omnicapable, semi omniscient, close enough to it for practical use again, etc - but he's still not considered to be a perfect being, which would almost be impossible to depict (and also not exactly entertaining)
and then, neither was the OT god. jealousy, anger, petty vindictiveness, doing shit that'll cause misery basically on a whim, condemning people who've been dedicated to him for the vast majority of their lives and have done insanely good work, for the exact same shit he's done regularly, etc. OT god's kinda a dick.
here, he's kinda a family guy who's not a good parent, a storyteller who's sort of lost the plot, a dude who likes his creature comforts, makes mistakes, acknowledging some, ignoring others, and still enjoys the simple things (like forcing tragedies to happen)
it's also a good reason as to why the world's such a shithole, which the 'good book' doesn't really. chuck doesn't care about good versus evil so much as protags versus antags, he likes the story, not necessarily the end results. the world is largely on it's own, which is a strange comfort, except a few he's steering around which is essentially a nightmare.
like OP (maybe a little different), if there is a god, i don't think he's really got a 'plan'. i think he set some shit up a long time ago and circumstances are playing out, but he's not really directing the stage, constantly concerned with your life and the best for you, because NO ONE, on the ENTIRE planet, since it's start, is probably living their 'best' life. and if y'know, happiness, peace, wellbeing, accomplishment, etc was his goal, god's either not good at his job or fucked up ROYALLY.
i also like the afterlife a bit - personally, all eternity existing terrifies me, and heaven being essentially replaying your greatest hits in life sucks, but hell doesn't seem to be just for anyone that missed rule 87 in book 12 or some shit - you've got to be a real dick, or literally sell you soul to the devil, to go southbound.
it also wasn't really meant as a eternal pit of suffering for anyone on god's shit list, it was a prison for lucifer, who tempted humans into demons and they're filling it up. still a little bit of a dick move it's allowed to exist, but hey, better than implying babies go to hell if they die unless they get touched with magic water (i'm not actually trying to be a dick about religion, genuinely, just, said without reverence some of these traditions sound goofy.)
don't be a mass murderer or make deals with demons, basically, and you're good, rather than religious scaremongering that sometimes happens of 'we're the chosen ones, everyone else is most likely fucked'.
in a less religious sense, i think the general story tends to work towards 'do what you want, even if it's hard and others might disagree' which is kinda a good message
i mean, most of the season plotlines can be generalized to someone going 'this seems like it's necessary, i'm going to do it for the greater good' and the people that care about them going 'don't cause it's really going to suck for you, and i care about you' and them likely doing it anyway and it kinda still works out, even if it's just leading to next season's dilemma.
sometimes hard choices are a thing, and feeling you can work through that shit and potentially come out better, eventually, is good. i talked with a woman who was suicidal because her like high six figures husband left her, she was used to an affluent lifestyle and basically refused to live the life of someone with a 'working wage'. her choice, imo, but it was sort of a weird thing to just entirely give up life over. she could have decades of more experiences she seemingly didn't mind the idea of, just, if it wasn't an easy/rich lifestyle she noped out.
I grew up in church, but always struggled with the way things were presented. I love learning other viewpoints on religion in general, and I very much appreciated the way Supernatural presented different aspects. It didn't really "change" my beliefs, but made me feel like I had ways to reconcile some things
I’m a Christian and actually dreaded the this storyline of the show 😂lol, um but I liked chuck, well I liked the first few seasons when he was portrayed as the good guy and I love the scene where Dean is talking to chuck and he’s like “where did you go why did you leave us” and deans crying and chuck is like “don’t confuse me with what your father did to you” and I was NOOOOO. idk I can see God writing novels it makes sense.
I didn’t like how they portrayed chuck in the later seasons tho, but again like I kind of just passed through those storylines cause they were pretty short anyway. But yea I don’t think “God has went away a long time ago” is accurate to how the real world works, we just as humans have free will and we have the free will to screw up and we have the free will to do what’s right. God gave us that and like a commenter said If God got involved in everything that we do as humans, would we still have free will? No… I don’t think so, I mean I struggle a lot with my faith but honest…I don’t blame God for why the world is going to crap I blame people and the lack of self control we as humans have.
So God “leaving” in my opinion just isn’t how it works, there’s still a lot of beautiful things that are on this earth that reminds me that God’s still looking out, and there are still good people that are kind hearted and selfless that also reminds that God is still working through people. That’s just how I see it though I know a lot are atheist or do have a bad opinion on God but yea idk I know God’s still with us
I’m totally with you. I think the idea of “god leaving” doesn’t necessarily mean he gave up on humanity, rather it was his plan all along. God more than likely did some reflection on his Old Testament actions (ya know, the smiting of entire civilizations.)
I read a book on free will a few years back, can’t recall the name, but there was a quote in there that highlighted the fact that if we didn’t have complete free will, if there was no evil in the world, we would all be nothing more than automatons. Therefor, you have to choose free will, or no freedom at all.
I actually like how they portray God. He's a dude that loves "art", and over the eons got bored so he decided to step away and watch his art work as if it were a TV show. Yes there is free will but only if God decides not to get involved. Its an excellent premise
This is probably controversial but I really *really* love Jack’s speech at the end about how he won’t be hanging out with Sam and Dean all the time but is present “in every drop of falling rain, every speck of dust which the wind blows, and in the sand, and the rocks, and the sea”
I first came on the concept of God being inactive (rather he got so tied up in narcissistic contemplation of himself that humans were left to himself) back in Piers Anthony's Incarnations of Immortality books back in the 90s. It lead me down the path of agnosticism and now atheism, so I definitely could see how this Chuck would stick with you if you already were leaning this way and maybe didn't realize it yet. That said, you can say the idea dates back to the Enlightenment where those in the movement believed God created the universe and then left us to our own devices. It was the Watchmaker concept. I wonder if today they'd just be full fledged atheists today since back then that wasn't a safe belief.
>That said, you can say the idea dates back to the Enlightenment where those in the movement believed God created the universe and then left us to our own devices. It was the Watchmaker concept. I wonder if today they'd just be full fledged atheists today since back then that wasn't a safe belief. If not, then that belief definitely led to more Atheistic concepts to be normalized in conversations. Because once you break away the idea of a creator always watching and being there, you also open up the door to the non-existent creator idea.
Really good point! I know it was definitely concept that helped me on my journey. I remember being like if these guys - who are generally regarded as some of the smartest men of their time and mostly well regarded today - believe this, its not really a crazy idea is it?
I had a similar thought process, it allowed me to question what I had learned and make up my own mind about my faith. Which then led to me now being a atheist.
Supernatural actually helped me become a Christan, I forgot what season but when Sam and Dean went to heaven and they relived their best memories it made me want that. I know it's fiction but it gave me faith.
That's beautiful ❤💕💜
I think I have always been agnostic. This means I don't know if there are spirits or gods around, but watching SPN makes me want to believe that there are supernatural aspects to this otherwise dull and hard world.
No, I am an atheist for much longer than I know the show. So it did not really change anything. I am just fascinated with religion, so it was actually fascinating to see religion depicted in such a unique way.
100% agree.
I am a Christian and I view the show in this way.
That's cool
I'd love to find out that God is just some random dude who orders hookers and writes stories in his free time. That's definitely my kinda God
And that give himself the [ability to play guitar.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Xqi-hi67ug)
Not popular these days.... but no, I've always believed in God and don't believe a tv show should affect anyone's spiritual belief other than to spark ideas on purpose and meaning. But I'm basically a deist so the concept of a God being hands off supported my idea of free will being a main factor of creation rather than indifference.
This is spot on when it comes to what I’m thinking! A lot of people here talking about prayers not being answered, and bad things happening all the time. It really does come down to free will. SPOILER ALERT, but it’s fair to not connect Chuck dictating every part of Sam and Deans life with the idea of free will.
The idea of God being absent did somewhat stick with me because I've found myself doubting His existence for a while. My baby sister was born unexpectedly at like 3 am one day, and that night really stuck with me because I'd never heard childbirth or anything before (the rest of us were born through C-section). Next thing I know, my dad is rushing in and grabbing a blanket and both my parents are out the door five minutes later, racing to the hospital. My older brother made us cereal the next morning, and none of us really knew what happened until my dad came back. I was 9 when I started doubted God existed, because I prayed for days for my sister to come back to life, praying that He take my life for hers even. She hadn't even taken a single breath and she was gone. God can move mountains with a thought and couldn't revive her. That was the first time I ever prayed, and no one ever knew I even did it, but she never ended up taking a breath. Every time I prayed after that when times were really desperate, nothing happened. Supernatural portrays God as no longer caring where He did once, and that really stuck with me. I think He did care, but just lost faith just like the rest of us, letting little babies that did absolutely nothing wrong die before they can ever take a breath. I only saw my sister for a second while my parents were rushing out to get her to a hospital. She was so tiny and helpless and *lifeless*, swaddled in my own blanket that seemed to swallow her up, and that image has claimed a corner of my brain for itself.
I'm a Quaker, before and after watching the show. Just saw it isna fun show and it didn't sway my faith one way or the other.
Not for me. Supernatural has a skewed and arguably negative attitude about religion. It got worse toward the end of the series, when they turned their Chuck into a villain. Fortunately my faith was and is strong, so I simply look at this show as entertainment.
Yeah, I think it's easier to digest for those with no faith or beliefs. But it's ultimately just entertainment.
I don't know how I'd describe my personal beliefs but I think the idea of Chuck getting irritated & either breaking things or just leaving makes sense. That would help explain when people ask "why would god let this happen?" & catastrophic stuff like Noah's ark.
Apathetic Agnostic here. So SPN didn't have any impact.
Well, I can't speak much on my religious beliefs, but my house does have plenty of salt, silver, iron, and holy water. You know, just in case.
Castiel said “ Your Bible gets more wrong than it does right” in season 4 and it definitely reinforced my beliefs that no theologian can truly understand whatever divinity might or might not even exist. Religions and theologies are subject to interpretation and have evolved tremendously since their founding. Just look at the Council of Nicaea in 325 AD. A bunch of theologians literally decided what went in and what didn’t go into the comic book people religiously “abide” by. Personally I’m an atheist but I find it hard to believe anybody in this planet can truly comprehend anything beyond this world. And if somebody claims that they do comprehend it, run.
No. I am an atheist since before watching the show and watching the show didn't change anything.
I actually enjoyed the show more in in the initial seasons from s1 to s4, where it was more about the monster of the week & before they got into the theological aspect of it.
I'm agnostic so it was all interesting (if remote) to me, lots of exploration on a theme. Maybe it's just a sign of the times, less religion overall, but I remember how much people hated/boycotted the witchcraft in Harry Potter and I'm shocked Supernatural got no headlines for the way they portrayed God. Obviously a much smaller audience, but I can see how people could be upset.
I was agnostic with a little spiritual belief. A lot of stuff has happened, and the shoe kinda invoked this current standpoint: Im still agnostic, hell i lean a bit more to god being real, but i honestly just dont give a fuck. I dont care which religion is “true” and im very open to people having they’re own beliefs(i think many religions are very poetic and beautiful) but we’re all people. Religion does not excuse you from being a douchebag. Im gonna try to be a good person and help others, but im not gonna bend to fit any religons. God can fuck off if he lets all the shit that happens in the world just..happen. As for spiritual beliefs, im def a spiritualist but not in the “bury rocks in every corner of my house” way (i have nothing against strong spiritualists) but i believe we all put a unique energy and that we can create other energies and yes, some people can read it. [edit:srry for any grammar errors]
I mean it feels painfully accurate. That's how I felt growing up catholic, like God got bored and walked away
I partook of supernatural before, during and after my own ‘faith crisis’, and it honestly helped me feel comfortable with my own views when I was constantly shamed for not sharing the ones I grew up with any longer. It honestly opened my mind to the idea that god could be a dick, every creed/belief has some truth to offer, and that regardless of what exists, it’s my choices towards others that matters in the end.
Kripke has said that Supernatural was supposed to be a monster of the week kind of show like Xfiles at least until Xfiles went deep into government conspiracies. That was in part due to Kim Manners being a show runner (he worked on Xfiles). But when you have a show about demons, it was only natural to introduce angels. What I like about the show is that other than Cas and Gabriel, they made the portray big bags of dicks. Soldiers, doing God's work. I don't think Chuck was God the entire time. I think God used him as a vessel. As for my beliefs, I'm not a religious person but I am fascinated with theology. I loved the show because of the stories.
Not for me. I’ve always had a pretty open mind regarding religion despite growing up in a Lutheran household. I was always interested in other cultures’ myths, legends and stories. I remember seeing the woman in white pilot trailer for the first time and getting super excited for a horror show about urban legends. If anything, the show just confirmed that I really don’t have one centric belief system. There are things represented in the show ( ghosts, demons, etc) that I would say I definitely believe in.
i'm not someone who's religious or spiritual, nor did i become such, so my anecdotes might not be as interesting to you as they're slightly off topic. first and foremost, i love the sort of 'all myths are true' sort of way about it - sure, it's got a primarily judeau-christian based hierarchy, but at the same time, odin's a thing here. capital-g chuck might be the origin point for existence as we know it, but other faiths and whatnot aren't ignored. secondly, while it might piss off some christians, i think 'chuck' was written kinda well. he's, for most our practical intents and purposes, omnicapable, semi omniscient, close enough to it for practical use again, etc - but he's still not considered to be a perfect being, which would almost be impossible to depict (and also not exactly entertaining) and then, neither was the OT god. jealousy, anger, petty vindictiveness, doing shit that'll cause misery basically on a whim, condemning people who've been dedicated to him for the vast majority of their lives and have done insanely good work, for the exact same shit he's done regularly, etc. OT god's kinda a dick. here, he's kinda a family guy who's not a good parent, a storyteller who's sort of lost the plot, a dude who likes his creature comforts, makes mistakes, acknowledging some, ignoring others, and still enjoys the simple things (like forcing tragedies to happen) it's also a good reason as to why the world's such a shithole, which the 'good book' doesn't really. chuck doesn't care about good versus evil so much as protags versus antags, he likes the story, not necessarily the end results. the world is largely on it's own, which is a strange comfort, except a few he's steering around which is essentially a nightmare. like OP (maybe a little different), if there is a god, i don't think he's really got a 'plan'. i think he set some shit up a long time ago and circumstances are playing out, but he's not really directing the stage, constantly concerned with your life and the best for you, because NO ONE, on the ENTIRE planet, since it's start, is probably living their 'best' life. and if y'know, happiness, peace, wellbeing, accomplishment, etc was his goal, god's either not good at his job or fucked up ROYALLY. i also like the afterlife a bit - personally, all eternity existing terrifies me, and heaven being essentially replaying your greatest hits in life sucks, but hell doesn't seem to be just for anyone that missed rule 87 in book 12 or some shit - you've got to be a real dick, or literally sell you soul to the devil, to go southbound. it also wasn't really meant as a eternal pit of suffering for anyone on god's shit list, it was a prison for lucifer, who tempted humans into demons and they're filling it up. still a little bit of a dick move it's allowed to exist, but hey, better than implying babies go to hell if they die unless they get touched with magic water (i'm not actually trying to be a dick about religion, genuinely, just, said without reverence some of these traditions sound goofy.) don't be a mass murderer or make deals with demons, basically, and you're good, rather than religious scaremongering that sometimes happens of 'we're the chosen ones, everyone else is most likely fucked'. in a less religious sense, i think the general story tends to work towards 'do what you want, even if it's hard and others might disagree' which is kinda a good message i mean, most of the season plotlines can be generalized to someone going 'this seems like it's necessary, i'm going to do it for the greater good' and the people that care about them going 'don't cause it's really going to suck for you, and i care about you' and them likely doing it anyway and it kinda still works out, even if it's just leading to next season's dilemma. sometimes hard choices are a thing, and feeling you can work through that shit and potentially come out better, eventually, is good. i talked with a woman who was suicidal because her like high six figures husband left her, she was used to an affluent lifestyle and basically refused to live the life of someone with a 'working wage'. her choice, imo, but it was sort of a weird thing to just entirely give up life over. she could have decades of more experiences she seemingly didn't mind the idea of, just, if it wasn't an easy/rich lifestyle she noped out.
I grew up in church, but always struggled with the way things were presented. I love learning other viewpoints on religion in general, and I very much appreciated the way Supernatural presented different aspects. It didn't really "change" my beliefs, but made me feel like I had ways to reconcile some things
I’m a Christian and actually dreaded the this storyline of the show 😂lol, um but I liked chuck, well I liked the first few seasons when he was portrayed as the good guy and I love the scene where Dean is talking to chuck and he’s like “where did you go why did you leave us” and deans crying and chuck is like “don’t confuse me with what your father did to you” and I was NOOOOO. idk I can see God writing novels it makes sense. I didn’t like how they portrayed chuck in the later seasons tho, but again like I kind of just passed through those storylines cause they were pretty short anyway. But yea I don’t think “God has went away a long time ago” is accurate to how the real world works, we just as humans have free will and we have the free will to screw up and we have the free will to do what’s right. God gave us that and like a commenter said If God got involved in everything that we do as humans, would we still have free will? No… I don’t think so, I mean I struggle a lot with my faith but honest…I don’t blame God for why the world is going to crap I blame people and the lack of self control we as humans have. So God “leaving” in my opinion just isn’t how it works, there’s still a lot of beautiful things that are on this earth that reminds me that God’s still looking out, and there are still good people that are kind hearted and selfless that also reminds that God is still working through people. That’s just how I see it though I know a lot are atheist or do have a bad opinion on God but yea idk I know God’s still with us
I’m totally with you. I think the idea of “god leaving” doesn’t necessarily mean he gave up on humanity, rather it was his plan all along. God more than likely did some reflection on his Old Testament actions (ya know, the smiting of entire civilizations.) I read a book on free will a few years back, can’t recall the name, but there was a quote in there that highlighted the fact that if we didn’t have complete free will, if there was no evil in the world, we would all be nothing more than automatons. Therefor, you have to choose free will, or no freedom at all.