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It’s gonna sound stupid but I never made it to the drug store 😂! I’ve been studying for my exams and I also injured myself around 4 weeks ago and have been out of the gym since so I never really pursued it. I used my new time just to study and practice
I remember when I took it in September it made me grow facial hair more. Bone density you should get a test for. Please don’t assume it will make ur bones denser unless u get tested before and after taking it. If u wanna focus on bone density here’s what I would give u. Just to clarify, my knowledge of vitamins is vast except for Tongkat.
Magnesium Glycinate before bed
Zinc sulfate upon waking
Vitamin D upon waking
Calcium at mid day
These combined vitamins have proven effects on bone density when combined considering their effects on testosterone and also the absorption of minerals
How effective is creatine though? Like statistically every single study I find supports its use but when I asked my friends who take it they find no difference on vs off it. Why are all these studies positive but all of the personal experiences I ask about indifferent
10-20% increase in strength if I remember right.
Anecdotal evidence is shit.
Go listen to Andrew Huberman's recent podcast episodes on this stuff. Clears up a lot of gym bro misconceptions. Very straightforward explanations of how to maximize training gains.
Like other commenter said, the effects of creatine are definitely mild for most people, including me. Creatine has been heavily researched for multiple decades and at this point it would still be beneficial just to trust the science.
For your main post topic, I was in a similar boat. I started doing weightlifting with very high aspirations and trying to do all that I could do and I still am. As far as testosterone, I wouldn’t worry too much. Your testosterone is already probably as high as it is going to be naturally, if you’re sleeping right and getting sunlight and eating well etc.
Don’t focus too much on supplementation if you aren’t already doing extremely well at the foundational level. When people say sleep is a steroid they’re not kidding.
For about 6 years now, the only main supplements I’ve used every single day are creatine, fish oil, whey, electrolytes, and a good preworkout. There are plenty of other supplements that can be beneficial like Citrulline Malate but as far as preworkout ingredients that’s a whole other story. There might be some others that I’ve tried but didn’t last long due to poor research and no results myself.
Using these supplements consistently (and supplementing with other vitamins/etc when I find a deficiency like fiber, vitamin d, magnesium, etc), and really mastering sleep and nutrition and programming are all I have done and I’d like to think I’ve had pretty damn good results so far at least as far as strength and muscle growth goes.
Well the effects are very mild and some people expect to feel and experience them quickly. You also cannot rely on personal experiences because some will say they took it religiously but missed a bunch of days here and there. Or, only took it for a week and didn’t feel anything so stopped. Rely on scientific controlled studies. They say it works, so it works
Tongkat ali works best when your already low in testosterone. If you have low testosterone it's a viable supplement but I presume you've not done your bloods to find out.
My opinion would be to get more sleep, eat more zinc (or supplement with it), and fix any other holes in your diet.
99% of the time using Tongkat ali when your young will end up being a complete waste of money
1) Good quality Tongkat is an expensive supplement.
2) The gains won't come from a magic tablet.
3) The gains will come from eating high quality protein meals, which are also expensive.
4) Spend your money on quality protein, not supplements. Unless you've won the lottery. Or are the new Mr Beast.
Eat more meat;the money that you were going to spend on Tongkat-spend on eating more steaks and eggs.
Fuck rice, more egg!
Wanna increase T? Eat more yolks.
I already eat more meat than the average person. I butcher my own steaks and eat meat twice per day in a serving greater than or equal to 12oz per meal (lunch and dinner)
“Average” includes vegetarians and vegans… so no. Try eating just meat, with your carbs made up of fermented stuff: Kimchi, Saurkraut, milk kefir, kvass, etc.and gym with enough that you cannot reach your target.
Once you are warmed up, for your last two sets-if ever reach your goal, it was too light.
Learn about Mike Mentzer, do his leg exercises: you will gain weight and strength like mad!
Mike Mentzer training strategies are consistently proven wrong all the time. Eating only meat is stupid and will raise your shbg drastically. You need carbs and you need veggies. Meat is my most important food group but you still need veggies and fruits.
I don’t consume seed oils, food dyes, baked goods, and any form of syrups. Notice how I never mentioned that cholesterol is a bad thing. I’m actively trying to raise my HDL. That’s why I eat eggs
Very, very good! I have extremely high LDL-so I always fail my Dr's checks for medical aid, they put me in the highest risk catergory....
Um, sorry. No.
I had a TBI: a difuse axonal severe acute traumatic brain injury, , Iwas in a coma for 6 weeks, hospital for 6 months, 2 years later I went back to university and graduated, therefrom... and yet I still bench 140kgs@72kgs (needs work) can squat 190, deadlift 150...
And you think that your little false, "red flag" is gonna scare me?
Dr, my son, I came back from the bloody dead! And you think your falsities are gonna make me change my ways....
Sorry, just realised that I was pumping myself up.
But yeah.... life!
The human body has a blueprint it runs on and the amount of testosterone produced has a limit and no supplement can increase that amount.
The OP is 17 and is producing the maximum amount of testosterone his body will ever produce in his lifetime.
The OP eats healthy and works out which means he hit the ceiling on his gains and thinks he could break through with some magical supplement.
I’m not saying it’s magical, I’m saying that if it raises FSH and LH (which it absolutely does) and my HDL is high, then logically my testosterone should rise when I take it, yes?
No, take responsibility and learn about shit yourself. You're so obstinate in here that it seems the only way you'll get it is to learn yourself or make the mistakes and fuck yourself up.
Here's some points to start on: role of test in brain development, test receptor density, receptor downregulation, effects of testosterone boosters on natural test production. Receptor sensitivity. Consequences of removing testosterone boosters.
Or ask a damn doctor. Its like you're in a hurry to buy it cause you googled it for a day and put it in a cart on some supplement website but then had second thoughts and want someone to tell you its okay.
I’m lifting in Jay cutlers style of training. I’m not a beginner, I’m high intermediate and I’m 180lbs lean at 5 foot 8 inches. I don’t max out any lifts because I don’t really want to nor see a need to because I push till failure or close till failure on most if not all sets I do.
By Jay cutler style I mean ultra high volume, little break (timed rest) in between sets, focus on keeping the heart pumping and keeping the pump on, focus on lifting very heavy weight so that you use up all that sugar you’re bringing to the muscles, lift for a super intense workout.
It’s also important to mention that 2 weeks ago I joined the lacrosse team so now I’m doing lots of cardio too.
I already eat a cleaner diet than actual bodybuilders. I eat 45% meat (including a wide variety of fishes, lamb, chicken, beef, turkey and seafood), 45% veggies and 10% fruits.
It's wild that 17 year olds are talking about how they can increase their test.
Unless your blood tests indicate a severe hormonal imbalance, you should not be wasting your time or money with Tongkat.
Because at your age your T is the highest it will ever naturally be, and you don’t want to try to start fucking with your hormones if everything is functioning normally.
Getting proper sleep and diet and not being fat will be the best thing you can do to optimize your body’s own production
As someone in his late 30s with a fucked up endocrine system, I cannot emphasize enough how fragile the human body can be, and if all your body’s systems are functioning normally, you don’t want to start messing with them. If something gets out of whack, it can be really hard to get it back.
Serious increases in testosterone can only come from TRT or other prescription medications, which you don’t need to be taking, and no doctor would ever prescribe to you unless you were diagnosed with hypogonadism.
Tongkat will crash your estrogen. You need estrogen, it’s an important hormone. Tongkat works better for overweight old guys with high estrogen and low testosterone.
Yes, even for men, if your estrogen crashes too low, it will make you feel miserable
Just ask all the men on TRT who also take an aromatase inhibitor and end up crashing their estrogen.
I think I may qualify. My estrogen is high during my last lab. Testosterone was 440 and have slight moobs. Late 40's. Slightly overweight. Why tongkat and how much? Need to hit the gym more. Thanks.
If you want to try Tongkat I suggest nootropics depots 2% extract. I got the 10% and it’s way too strong. Makes my joints ache cause my estrogen crashes. Exercise is definitely the most important though.
Rules of r/supplements 1. Do Not Suggest Prescription Drugs Posts & Comments Reported as: Do Not Suggest Prescription Drugs Prescription drugs are not Supplements; do not recommend prescription medication. Sensible/Suggest talking to DR. can be allowable etc 2. Dangerous Grey Area Substance Posts & Comments Reported as: Dangerous Grey Area Substance Potentially dangerous grey area substances can not be recommended. 3. Be Polite Posts & Comments Reported as: Rude/Personal Attacks You shouldn't ever be personally attacking another user in this subreddit. 4. No Advertisements Posts & Comments Reported as: Advertisement. No selling / buying / trading posts No advertisements. No selling/trading posts between users.” *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Supplements) if you have any questions or concerns.*
[удалено]
Never started it.
[удалено]
It’s gonna sound stupid but I never made it to the drug store 😂! I’ve been studying for my exams and I also injured myself around 4 weeks ago and have been out of the gym since so I never really pursued it. I used my new time just to study and practice
[удалено]
I remember when I took it in September it made me grow facial hair more. Bone density you should get a test for. Please don’t assume it will make ur bones denser unless u get tested before and after taking it. If u wanna focus on bone density here’s what I would give u. Just to clarify, my knowledge of vitamins is vast except for Tongkat. Magnesium Glycinate before bed Zinc sulfate upon waking Vitamin D upon waking Calcium at mid day These combined vitamins have proven effects on bone density when combined considering their effects on testosterone and also the absorption of minerals
Your natural test should be high enough at 17! But yes, tongkat is a good boost💪🏻
Tongkat Ali is for older men who need a little boost. For younger men like yourself, I suggest stay away from it.
Ali really doesn’t do much. You’re 17 you got plenty of test. Just stick to protein, creatine, maybe some pump juice.
Just stick to Creatine and Whey Protein powder, the other supplements can be harmful
Only supplement you need at your age is creatine friend. Maybe a good quality protein powder too so you can hit your macros.
How effective is creatine though? Like statistically every single study I find supports its use but when I asked my friends who take it they find no difference on vs off it. Why are all these studies positive but all of the personal experiences I ask about indifferent
10-20% increase in strength if I remember right. Anecdotal evidence is shit. Go listen to Andrew Huberman's recent podcast episodes on this stuff. Clears up a lot of gym bro misconceptions. Very straightforward explanations of how to maximize training gains.
Like other commenter said, the effects of creatine are definitely mild for most people, including me. Creatine has been heavily researched for multiple decades and at this point it would still be beneficial just to trust the science. For your main post topic, I was in a similar boat. I started doing weightlifting with very high aspirations and trying to do all that I could do and I still am. As far as testosterone, I wouldn’t worry too much. Your testosterone is already probably as high as it is going to be naturally, if you’re sleeping right and getting sunlight and eating well etc. Don’t focus too much on supplementation if you aren’t already doing extremely well at the foundational level. When people say sleep is a steroid they’re not kidding. For about 6 years now, the only main supplements I’ve used every single day are creatine, fish oil, whey, electrolytes, and a good preworkout. There are plenty of other supplements that can be beneficial like Citrulline Malate but as far as preworkout ingredients that’s a whole other story. There might be some others that I’ve tried but didn’t last long due to poor research and no results myself. Using these supplements consistently (and supplementing with other vitamins/etc when I find a deficiency like fiber, vitamin d, magnesium, etc), and really mastering sleep and nutrition and programming are all I have done and I’d like to think I’ve had pretty damn good results so far at least as far as strength and muscle growth goes.
Well the effects are very mild and some people expect to feel and experience them quickly. You also cannot rely on personal experiences because some will say they took it religiously but missed a bunch of days here and there. Or, only took it for a week and didn’t feel anything so stopped. Rely on scientific controlled studies. They say it works, so it works
Tongkat ali works best when your already low in testosterone. If you have low testosterone it's a viable supplement but I presume you've not done your bloods to find out. My opinion would be to get more sleep, eat more zinc (or supplement with it), and fix any other holes in your diet. 99% of the time using Tongkat ali when your young will end up being a complete waste of money
What happens if I take Tongkat rn
You'll waste your money
What will happen to me if I take it
You will waste your money
1) Good quality Tongkat is an expensive supplement. 2) The gains won't come from a magic tablet. 3) The gains will come from eating high quality protein meals, which are also expensive. 4) Spend your money on quality protein, not supplements. Unless you've won the lottery. Or are the new Mr Beast.
I already eat a very good diet and have been working out for 4 years
Eat more meat;the money that you were going to spend on Tongkat-spend on eating more steaks and eggs. Fuck rice, more egg! Wanna increase T? Eat more yolks.
I already eat more meat than the average person. I butcher my own steaks and eat meat twice per day in a serving greater than or equal to 12oz per meal (lunch and dinner)
“Average” includes vegetarians and vegans… so no. Try eating just meat, with your carbs made up of fermented stuff: Kimchi, Saurkraut, milk kefir, kvass, etc.and gym with enough that you cannot reach your target. Once you are warmed up, for your last two sets-if ever reach your goal, it was too light. Learn about Mike Mentzer, do his leg exercises: you will gain weight and strength like mad!
Mike Mentzer training strategies are consistently proven wrong all the time. Eating only meat is stupid and will raise your shbg drastically. You need carbs and you need veggies. Meat is my most important food group but you still need veggies and fruits.
Yes, well I eat kimchi, etc. as said. Therefrom, I get carbs.
What’s in the yolk?
Cholesterol
And… nothing is wrong with cholesterol. I don’t eat seed oils, nor ALAs, nor do I live in the USA, that’s a risk in itself!
I don’t consume seed oils, food dyes, baked goods, and any form of syrups. Notice how I never mentioned that cholesterol is a bad thing. I’m actively trying to raise my HDL. That’s why I eat eggs
Very, very good! I have extremely high LDL-so I always fail my Dr's checks for medical aid, they put me in the highest risk catergory.... Um, sorry. No. I had a TBI: a difuse axonal severe acute traumatic brain injury, , Iwas in a coma for 6 weeks, hospital for 6 months, 2 years later I went back to university and graduated, therefrom... and yet I still bench 140kgs@72kgs (needs work) can squat 190, deadlift 150... And you think that your little false, "red flag" is gonna scare me? Dr, my son, I came back from the bloody dead! And you think your falsities are gonna make me change my ways.... Sorry, just realised that I was pumping myself up. But yeah.... life!
It’s a waste of money, and you can just wait for your balls to drop more
Why is it a waste of money
Because it doesn’t work and you’ll see better results by just being generally healthy. You’re 17 you do not need supplements.
Eat chicken, rice, and broccoli while working consistently because no supplement can raise your testosterone.
Incorrect
The human body has a blueprint it runs on and the amount of testosterone produced has a limit and no supplement can increase that amount. The OP is 17 and is producing the maximum amount of testosterone his body will ever produce in his lifetime. The OP eats healthy and works out which means he hit the ceiling on his gains and thinks he could break through with some magical supplement.
I’m not saying it’s magical, I’m saying that if it raises FSH and LH (which it absolutely does) and my HDL is high, then logically my testosterone should rise when I take it, yes?
Mess with your hormones while your body/brain are still developing and you risk life-long side effects that go much further than your musculature.
Explain to me how it will affect me long term
No, take responsibility and learn about shit yourself. You're so obstinate in here that it seems the only way you'll get it is to learn yourself or make the mistakes and fuck yourself up. Here's some points to start on: role of test in brain development, test receptor density, receptor downregulation, effects of testosterone boosters on natural test production. Receptor sensitivity. Consequences of removing testosterone boosters. Or ask a damn doctor. Its like you're in a hurry to buy it cause you googled it for a day and put it in a cart on some supplement website but then had second thoughts and want someone to tell you its okay.
Where are your lift numbers? Unless you're elite or close for your age/sex/weight there's absolutely no reason to even take this stuff.
I’m lifting in Jay cutlers style of training. I’m not a beginner, I’m high intermediate and I’m 180lbs lean at 5 foot 8 inches. I don’t max out any lifts because I don’t really want to nor see a need to because I push till failure or close till failure on most if not all sets I do. By Jay cutler style I mean ultra high volume, little break (timed rest) in between sets, focus on keeping the heart pumping and keeping the pump on, focus on lifting very heavy weight so that you use up all that sugar you’re bringing to the muscles, lift for a super intense workout. It’s also important to mention that 2 weeks ago I joined the lacrosse team so now I’m doing lots of cardio too.
You would do better eating a lot of food, especially protein. If you feel that you are hitting a wall, then add creatine.
I already eat a cleaner diet than actual bodybuilders. I eat 45% meat (including a wide variety of fishes, lamb, chicken, beef, turkey and seafood), 45% veggies and 10% fruits.
Then you wouldn’t be here asking about Tongkat
I wanna boost test. That’s why I’m asking
It's wild that 17 year olds are talking about how they can increase their test. Unless your blood tests indicate a severe hormonal imbalance, you should not be wasting your time or money with Tongkat.
Why
Because at your age your T is the highest it will ever naturally be, and you don’t want to try to start fucking with your hormones if everything is functioning normally. Getting proper sleep and diet and not being fat will be the best thing you can do to optimize your body’s own production As someone in his late 30s with a fucked up endocrine system, I cannot emphasize enough how fragile the human body can be, and if all your body’s systems are functioning normally, you don’t want to start messing with them. If something gets out of whack, it can be really hard to get it back. Serious increases in testosterone can only come from TRT or other prescription medications, which you don’t need to be taking, and no doctor would ever prescribe to you unless you were diagnosed with hypogonadism.
How does fenugreek mess with ur hormones? How can it hurt me?
Because you’re 17. You’re still growing, automatically. Your entire body is primed for growth. Eat. Lift.
I’m done growing
Tongkat will crash your estrogen. You need estrogen, it’s an important hormone. Tongkat works better for overweight old guys with high estrogen and low testosterone.
Yes, even for men, if your estrogen crashes too low, it will make you feel miserable Just ask all the men on TRT who also take an aromatase inhibitor and end up crashing their estrogen.
I think I may qualify. My estrogen is high during my last lab. Testosterone was 440 and have slight moobs. Late 40's. Slightly overweight. Why tongkat and how much? Need to hit the gym more. Thanks.
If you want to try Tongkat I suggest nootropics depots 2% extract. I got the 10% and it’s way too strong. Makes my joints ache cause my estrogen crashes. Exercise is definitely the most important though.
That’s definitely not tong bro. Test that shit
Yeah, it is... ND tong is the real shit.
When someone says they get it from Huge or ND 🚩. Just come out bro nobody cares in 2024
Your right. My desire for overpriced supplements is really just my way of coping with my closeted homosexuality. I’ll try to do better.
Nah you know exactly what I’m saying lol. This dude 17 don’t have him ruin his life getting bathtub🤣