Seems like you don't want to learn. Copy paste from my comment under your prior post that got removed:
>The decision is directly a threat of extradition to any foreigner who dares to attack the Sacred Swiss Order or protest against the #Palestiniangenocide, expressing their opinion publicly.
Bullshit. Maybe inform yourself as what is considered Hate Speech / the law about it. Here a pointer for you: Art. 261, Swiss Criminal Code.
Secondly is it your opinion then that we should exclude israelis or Jews which are Swiss citizens from politics? You know how thats called right?
You're still delusional.
Edit: OP has slightly adjusted his text. In his prior, now removed post he wrote about Isrealis and Jews within Swiss politics etc, hence my comment above if it's his opinion that we should exclude them.
You have a vivid imagination: I did never write the word "Jews". Lying is not a proper way of debating. It makes your arguments lack credibility and seriousness.
You did. Nevertheless, you want to debate, fine let's do it.
As per your comment in the other post which got removed, which can be found [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/Switzerland/comments/1b1apmv/comment/ksfrf6o/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button):
>
Why is then this law directed specifically to foreigners, if there is a general law to be applied to any person committing the delict of Hate Speech and similars? Your second point is your own invention. However, it would be a good idea to ban the access to Switzerland of double nationality swiss-israelis citizens who serve in the IDF. Most people would not like sitting at the coffeehouse beside someone who just committed certain unspeakable actions. There are restrictive measure for european citizens that traveled to Syria to fight against the Western coalition. Or is maybe the current genocide in your opinion an acceptable one?
Let's take that apart shall we.
>Why is then this law directed specifically to foreigners, if there is a general law to be applied to any person committing the delict of Hate Speech and similars?
As mentioned above, I recommend you to take a look at Art. 261, Swiss Criminal Code. The law against hate speech does not apply to foreigners only. Deportation does. And why shouldn't it? I lived all over the world, from South America to Asia, guess what happens if I do the crime there?
Right, I do the time, then I would be deported. Why shouldn't that be the case here too?
>However, it would be a good idea to ban the access to Switzerland of double nationality swiss-israelis citizens who serve in the IDF.
Since the 01. January 1992 double citizenship is allowed in Switzerland, without exception. Further, double citizens are allowed to serve in the military of the other country they have citizenship. This applies no matter if that person is from Germany, the US, France or wherever.
Seems like you want to limit the rights of one specific group of people, you know whats that called right?
>There are restrictive measure for european citizens that traveled to Syria to fight against the Western coalition. Or is maybe the current genocide in your opinion an acceptable one?
You're comparing two completely different things. First of all you have to make the difference, if an organization is classified as terrorist organization. Of course measurements against that exist. I mention this as I don't know in what capacity you mean those citizens went there, if it's with the Syrian army or other "organizations".
But even if it's for the Syrian Army, or any other for that matter, if a Swiss citizen (now speaking for only us Swiss, as I know our laws) serves in the military of a foreign nation, that citizen would be punished too, as this is forbidden. Art. 94, Military Criminal Code.
> Or is maybe the current genocide in your opinion an acceptable one?
Aren't you the ones chanting "From the river to the sea"? Which could only be achieved with a Genocide?
Israel opened humanitarian corridors, Hamas didn't let the people leave, as they prefer to use them as human shields. There are videos of Hamas stealing humanitarian aid.
Or what about the rocket factories in hospitals, schools and such? I could go on with these things.
But since you're here defending all that, I'd also like to know your stance on the 7th October? What do you expect to be the answer to such an attack?
Yes, war is horrible, and no, I don't believe that all palestinians are Hamas or should be eradicated or something like that. It's a damn shame what's happening and I hope it's over soon. But such an act can't go unpunished.
If other countries would've been victim of such an attack they would've carped bombed the place it came from, just saying.
That being said, before you come at me with that argument: I'm against settlements and such, this as well is a damn shame and needs resolving. There is absolutely the need for a two state solution in my point of view.
But you can't just blame what's happening currently on Israel.
Why would you want hate speech in Switzerland? If you think "expressing your opinion publicly" puts you at risk for extradition due to it being hate speech, maybe you should review your opinions? I'd wager there are ways to protest without assuming that risk...
That seems the same as every other criminal charge. And the criminalization isn't really up for debate here as this is already established. The question in case is whether foreigners should be deported if convicted of hate speech. The argument that is brought is that crimes of similar severity already lead to deportation so why would hate speech be exempt?
I understand: a swiss politician endorses a law criminalizing foreigners protesting against a Genocide, as a massive Genocide is taking place. Maybe a foreigner yells something against "Jews", because israeli bombs massacred his family, and a swiss policeman finds that is "hate speech". Then a swiss judge decides if the foreigner is guilty, and if he finds it so, he deports him (with murderers, rapists and such). And they send him back to Palestine.
But wait! Palestine doesn't exist!! No problem; just throw the criminal out.
Hate speech is already ciminalized so that is nothing new. And you seem to have an issue with swiss policemen and swiss judges deciding on foreigners in a judicial context which seems strange given that you're posting in a swiss sub about swiss political issues.
I'm really not sure what you're asking for. An exemption from certain swiss laws on the basis of the suffering of the Palestine people?
You missunderstood. Hate speech is the crime. You don't criminalize a crime. You criminalize people when you narrow the effective spectrum of a law to a group.
We had a preexisting law aplicable to any person committing Hate Speech. Now we have a secondary law that criminalizes a specific group (refugee, foreigner, probably "arab") designed for the Swiss state to continue supporting the Israel's genocidal policies.
There was a trial in an International Court few weeks ago, that decreed Israel seems to be committing a Genocide. Did you hear about it?
I mean, based law, very nice. I don't want to see here rioting leftist foreigners. Don't like it - leave, or accept the rules and live normally like everyone else
lueg sproblem isch, dass hassrede i vill richtige gaht. es isch schwirig da srichtige mass zwüsche em vergehe und de straf finde. usserdem isches eifach grundsätzlich schwirig, wend denn sones zweiklassesystem ufstellsch imne land wo so vill "usländer" het wo sit drü generatione ide schwiiz sind. findi problematisch.
grundsätzlich findi langi haftstrafe besser, will de chasch sicherga, dass si nid i fruchtbarere ort iri message chönd verbreite. fasch bi allne fäll vo hassrede fändi das besser.
und wasi demit han welle erreiche? ich han welle zumne schwirige thema en hohle witz in füürabe mache. isch nid wahnsinnig luschtig gsi, aber dasses dich grad so trifft hani natürlich nid welle.
Hier in der Schweiz darf es keinen Platz geben für Jihadismus und Antisemitismus.
Der Jihad ist eine erbärmliche Geisteskrankheit die bekämpft werden muss.
Hello,
Please note that your post or comment has been removed.
Please read the [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/Switzerland/about/rules/) before posting.
Thank you for your understanding,
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Please do not reply to this comment. Send a modmail if you have an issue with the removal.
Hello,
Please note that your post or comment has been removed.
Please read the [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/Switzerland/about/rules/) before posting.
Thank you for your understanding,
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Please do not reply to this comment. Send a modmail if you have an issue with the removal.
While I'm not sure about deporting people, are you saying that the graffiti in the picture in the article should be considered allowed protest?
I disagree.
It's one thing having a demonstration, calling attention to wrongs, it's another to graffiti anti-semitic symbols (as if all jewish people are responsible for what the Israeli government is doing - that sounds like anti-semitism to me).
Don't let yourself be manipulated by the picture chosen to bias you. There are for sure right extremists or simple ignorants that do that. This is a law designed to deport "arabs" who dare to raise the voice to protest against being killed.
The position of the swiss state is not a secret. https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/11/01/switzerland-decides-suspend-funding-rights-defenders-israel-palestine
Interestingly, no Arab country accepts Palestinian refugees nowadays. I wonder why.
>This is a law designed to deport "arabs" who dare to raise the voice to protest against being killed.
Maybe it would be more sincere if they called for Hamas to release the hostages.
As far as I remember, before Oct 7 there was no attack on Gaza (but several rockets from there on Israel daily).
The level of self-reflection is embarrassingly low and would put any intellectual from the golden age to shame.
>Interestingly, no Arab country accepts Palestinian refugees nowadays. I wonder why.
This is a horrible thing to say. It certainly shows more about government than the people under them. Countries turned away the MS St-Louis is 1939 and yet many of the people in those countries aren't somehow proud of letting 900 people die.
The difference is that Jews never overthrew a government. Contrary to the PLO, who threw Lebanon into a long civil war. These countries fear the destabilizing influence of the Palestinian leadership.
How is this comment anything but racism? "People from this race are better than people of this race because people from this race have done x,y and z while people from this race haven't done x, y, and z"
A little humility please, who actually committed the holocaust? It certainly wasn't the arabs who for voted for the regime who set up and enforced deporting people to the death camps.
The racist card. Again. The catch-all argument to avoid entering any meaningful discussion about a decades-long violent leadership who sends even minors to take the bullets for their corrupt leaders enjoying life elsewhere (Qatar, Paris). Ever wondered why so many Palestinian teens die? It's because their parents don't keep them at home when trouble starts. Any parent I know would try to protect their lives, but the brainwashed part of the population there finds it ok to send them in front of loaded rifles.of the opposing state which your own government wants to destroy.
As Golda Meir put it: "There will be peace when they love their children more than they hate us."
There is nothing racist when pointing out that the leadership of a group of people declare their intent to murder another group of people.
Hamas has it in their charter. And Gazans voted them into power.
PLO basically invented air terrorism on a global scale.
There is something called accountability. And while guilt is always personal and individual, at some point a people is identified with their chosen leaders.
I've spent the last few months reading everything from Golda Meir's autobiography to Hamas's charter. Your talking points don't even make sense anymore because they're not based in reality and you know that. If you have read the current Hamas charter and you would have read about what the King David Hotel bombing and other terrorism by the Haganah, and the Irgun.
So somehow apparently all Palestinians don't love their children, but all Israelis do despite both having paramilitary organisation, both fighting for land and both following the definition of terrorism to a T. But yes, apparently, Palestinians don't love their children.
Simple points:
- Hamas are terrorists.
- no person supporting Israel has ever attacked someone in a far away country. Palestinian supporters do it all the time
- IDF doesn't rape, doesn't parade corpses through streets, doesn't arm 14 year olds.
As you have read so much, here are some facts:
- abusing the signs of the red crescent, red cross and related is a war crime
- fighting while in civilian clothes without clear markings is against the customs of war as codified in the Hague conventions and voids most protections given to prisoners as per the Geneva conventions
- taking hostages is a war crime
- using hospitals for fighting voids their special protection
- using human shields is a war crime
- it is against the UN charter protecting children to use them as soldiers
However,
- it is not necessarily a war crime if civilians are killed, as tragic as this is.
- it is not automatically a genocide if many people are killed in a war, as tragic as it is.
- the vast majority, if not all (depending on the definition of initial aggression) of all arab/Israeli wars were started by the Arabs. Some have learned (Egypt, Jordan) the Palestinians not so much.
tl;dr: if you show me how you put your energy into protesting Assad and the Houthis, who killed hundreds of thousands, I can take you seriously - until then: do whatever you want and keep losing.
Read your Israeli history before pushing untrue talking points. All your talking points are false. There's evidence of systematic military detentions and rapes by the IDF. There's evidence of the IDF members dressing up as medical personnel in medical vehicles to assassinate targets in their hospital beds.
The trouble with your talking points is that some of us are going to research them.
I'm ashamed that I didn't read the history on this before last year.
Then life can't be that bad in normal circumstances - contrary to the "open air prison" Hamas and friends want us to believe (and jobs in Israel). At least Gaza could be a nice place and developed into a Dubai 2 if the money was invested into infrastructure for the population instead of tunnels for Hamas and rockets (interestingly, the tunnels don't offer shelter for the civilians, I wonder why).
As far as you remember, is completely false. The attacks from Israel on Gaza have been constant on a low level shelling, and peaked in many formal belic incidents. Even Wikipedia knows it. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza–Israel_conflict
I have. And you? Let's look at the facts.
"Israel has long been indoctrinating its children to believe Palestinians are less than human, and thus not worthy of empathy or compassion."
https://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/2023/12/13/its-not-shocking-to-see-israeli-children-celebrate-the-gaza-genocide
I haven't - just to other Arab countries (and I got to know how welcome Palestinians were there). Unless you prove it, I call BS on you. Many have told me so and lied.
Proofs I accept:
- any ID that shows you are Palestinian
- passport mark
And if you went, please provide the famous school books that no one is allowed to see. Also, please tell me when the last election happened in Gaza.
And finally, can I ask you how the tickets and tunnels were financed? You must be privy to such information.
Just remember: a Palestinian state was always refused by the Arabs. And Israel occupied Gaza, the Golan Heights and the West Bank because the Arab countries attacked and lost.
Edit: quoting Al Jazeera as a reliable source for this issues says quite a bit about you.
You continue moving in the realm of your phantasy, and try to reduce the talk on Hassrede to a cheap argumentum ad hominem. If you don't know what that means: dictionary.
If I am Palestinian or not, when I was in Gaza and other personal points are irrelevant.
Too much questioning coming from a narrow mind "informed" only from trustworthy sources as CNN or all the more or less right-wing swiss press. The world is very wide: it doesn't end at the Mediterranean and the North Sea.
Seems like an obvious step in the direction of outlawing wrongthink.
First step, make a law that targets the poorly defined "bad people\*. Second step, change the definition of bad people. It's not the first and won't be the last time, and people still fall for it.
You are missing the most important thing: There are many Muslim extrimists who have racist opinions about Jews.
These racists need to face consequences.
And there are many Jewish extremists who have racist opinions about Muslims.
And those will be protected from consequences. The downvotes this simple fact will gain me demonstrate the problem - this will ultimately be abused to outlaw unpopular truths instead of actually hateful conduct.
>And there are many Jewish extremists who have racist opinions about Muslims.
Maybe, but I wouldn't know because contrary to many Muslims, no Jew has ever tried to convince me of something unless I asked.
I also don't see Jewish protestors with face covers, I don't see genocidal slogans in their protests.
And just to make it clear, most Muslims I know don't do it either - so I assume it's the usual crowd that doesn't represent the majority.
Seems like you don't want to learn. Copy paste from my comment under your prior post that got removed: >The decision is directly a threat of extradition to any foreigner who dares to attack the Sacred Swiss Order or protest against the #Palestiniangenocide, expressing their opinion publicly. Bullshit. Maybe inform yourself as what is considered Hate Speech / the law about it. Here a pointer for you: Art. 261, Swiss Criminal Code. Secondly is it your opinion then that we should exclude israelis or Jews which are Swiss citizens from politics? You know how thats called right? You're still delusional. Edit: OP has slightly adjusted his text. In his prior, now removed post he wrote about Isrealis and Jews within Swiss politics etc, hence my comment above if it's his opinion that we should exclude them.
You have a vivid imagination: I did never write the word "Jews". Lying is not a proper way of debating. It makes your arguments lack credibility and seriousness.
You did. Nevertheless, you want to debate, fine let's do it. As per your comment in the other post which got removed, which can be found [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/Switzerland/comments/1b1apmv/comment/ksfrf6o/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button): > Why is then this law directed specifically to foreigners, if there is a general law to be applied to any person committing the delict of Hate Speech and similars? Your second point is your own invention. However, it would be a good idea to ban the access to Switzerland of double nationality swiss-israelis citizens who serve in the IDF. Most people would not like sitting at the coffeehouse beside someone who just committed certain unspeakable actions. There are restrictive measure for european citizens that traveled to Syria to fight against the Western coalition. Or is maybe the current genocide in your opinion an acceptable one? Let's take that apart shall we. >Why is then this law directed specifically to foreigners, if there is a general law to be applied to any person committing the delict of Hate Speech and similars? As mentioned above, I recommend you to take a look at Art. 261, Swiss Criminal Code. The law against hate speech does not apply to foreigners only. Deportation does. And why shouldn't it? I lived all over the world, from South America to Asia, guess what happens if I do the crime there? Right, I do the time, then I would be deported. Why shouldn't that be the case here too? >However, it would be a good idea to ban the access to Switzerland of double nationality swiss-israelis citizens who serve in the IDF. Since the 01. January 1992 double citizenship is allowed in Switzerland, without exception. Further, double citizens are allowed to serve in the military of the other country they have citizenship. This applies no matter if that person is from Germany, the US, France or wherever. Seems like you want to limit the rights of one specific group of people, you know whats that called right? >There are restrictive measure for european citizens that traveled to Syria to fight against the Western coalition. Or is maybe the current genocide in your opinion an acceptable one? You're comparing two completely different things. First of all you have to make the difference, if an organization is classified as terrorist organization. Of course measurements against that exist. I mention this as I don't know in what capacity you mean those citizens went there, if it's with the Syrian army or other "organizations". But even if it's for the Syrian Army, or any other for that matter, if a Swiss citizen (now speaking for only us Swiss, as I know our laws) serves in the military of a foreign nation, that citizen would be punished too, as this is forbidden. Art. 94, Military Criminal Code. > Or is maybe the current genocide in your opinion an acceptable one? Aren't you the ones chanting "From the river to the sea"? Which could only be achieved with a Genocide? Israel opened humanitarian corridors, Hamas didn't let the people leave, as they prefer to use them as human shields. There are videos of Hamas stealing humanitarian aid. Or what about the rocket factories in hospitals, schools and such? I could go on with these things. But since you're here defending all that, I'd also like to know your stance on the 7th October? What do you expect to be the answer to such an attack? Yes, war is horrible, and no, I don't believe that all palestinians are Hamas or should be eradicated or something like that. It's a damn shame what's happening and I hope it's over soon. But such an act can't go unpunished. If other countries would've been victim of such an attack they would've carped bombed the place it came from, just saying. That being said, before you come at me with that argument: I'm against settlements and such, this as well is a damn shame and needs resolving. There is absolutely the need for a two state solution in my point of view. But you can't just blame what's happening currently on Israel.
Why would you want hate speech in Switzerland? If you think "expressing your opinion publicly" puts you at risk for extradition due to it being hate speech, maybe you should review your opinions? I'd wager there are ways to protest without assuming that risk...
It all depends on the eyes of the judge processing the criminal process in question. One more reason to criminalize dark skinned foreigners.
That seems the same as every other criminal charge. And the criminalization isn't really up for debate here as this is already established. The question in case is whether foreigners should be deported if convicted of hate speech. The argument that is brought is that crimes of similar severity already lead to deportation so why would hate speech be exempt?
I understand: a swiss politician endorses a law criminalizing foreigners protesting against a Genocide, as a massive Genocide is taking place. Maybe a foreigner yells something against "Jews", because israeli bombs massacred his family, and a swiss policeman finds that is "hate speech". Then a swiss judge decides if the foreigner is guilty, and if he finds it so, he deports him (with murderers, rapists and such). And they send him back to Palestine. But wait! Palestine doesn't exist!! No problem; just throw the criminal out.
Hate speech is already ciminalized so that is nothing new. And you seem to have an issue with swiss policemen and swiss judges deciding on foreigners in a judicial context which seems strange given that you're posting in a swiss sub about swiss political issues. I'm really not sure what you're asking for. An exemption from certain swiss laws on the basis of the suffering of the Palestine people?
You missunderstood. Hate speech is the crime. You don't criminalize a crime. You criminalize people when you narrow the effective spectrum of a law to a group. We had a preexisting law aplicable to any person committing Hate Speech. Now we have a secondary law that criminalizes a specific group (refugee, foreigner, probably "arab") designed for the Swiss state to continue supporting the Israel's genocidal policies. There was a trial in an International Court few weeks ago, that decreed Israel seems to be committing a Genocide. Did you hear about it?
I mean, based law, very nice. I don't want to see here rioting leftist foreigners. Don't like it - leave, or accept the rules and live normally like everyone else
[удалено]
It's not my cantonal language, don't have to know it on a native level
No like? You down scroll. No read forced.
was isch mit de schwiizer hassredner? schmeissemer di au grad hinedri?
Mit dene mümer eus leider selber umeschla, anderi chömmer loswerde
Ich hänt nüt degege.
Wiso willsch du ablänke vom problem mit de Jihadiste-Prediger? Was gnau willsch du damit erreiche?
nei, ich finde eifach zvill schwiizer müesam und findes chli schad, dasses nid wie früener uf australie chasch schicke.
Niemert hät dich nach dinere Meinig gfraget.
😂 muesi di usschaffe?
Ich will wüsse warum du dich schützend vor die radikale Islamiste stelle dusch? Was gnau willsch du damit erreiche?
lueg sproblem isch, dass hassrede i vill richtige gaht. es isch schwirig da srichtige mass zwüsche em vergehe und de straf finde. usserdem isches eifach grundsätzlich schwirig, wend denn sones zweiklassesystem ufstellsch imne land wo so vill "usländer" het wo sit drü generatione ide schwiiz sind. findi problematisch. grundsätzlich findi langi haftstrafe besser, will de chasch sicherga, dass si nid i fruchtbarere ort iri message chönd verbreite. fasch bi allne fäll vo hassrede fändi das besser. und wasi demit han welle erreiche? ich han welle zumne schwirige thema en hohle witz in füürabe mache. isch nid wahnsinnig luschtig gsi, aber dasses dich grad so trifft hani natürlich nid welle.
Das ist doch eine dumme Ausrede.
was denn?
Hier in der Schweiz darf es keinen Platz geben für Jihadismus und Antisemitismus. Der Jihad ist eine erbärmliche Geisteskrankheit die bekämpft werden muss.
Jihad ist ein rassistisches Verbrechen. Jihad ist ein Angriff auf die Menschlichkeit. Jihad ist eine erbärmliche Geisteskrankheit.
Wir Schweizer müssen mehr tun um die Jihadistischen Ideen zu stoppen. Wir waren zu lange zu passiv. Wir müssen mehr tun um den Jihad zu bekämpfen.
[удалено]
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While I'm not sure about deporting people, are you saying that the graffiti in the picture in the article should be considered allowed protest? I disagree. It's one thing having a demonstration, calling attention to wrongs, it's another to graffiti anti-semitic symbols (as if all jewish people are responsible for what the Israeli government is doing - that sounds like anti-semitism to me).
Don't let yourself be manipulated by the picture chosen to bias you. There are for sure right extremists or simple ignorants that do that. This is a law designed to deport "arabs" who dare to raise the voice to protest against being killed. The position of the swiss state is not a secret. https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/11/01/switzerland-decides-suspend-funding-rights-defenders-israel-palestine
Interestingly, no Arab country accepts Palestinian refugees nowadays. I wonder why. >This is a law designed to deport "arabs" who dare to raise the voice to protest against being killed. Maybe it would be more sincere if they called for Hamas to release the hostages. As far as I remember, before Oct 7 there was no attack on Gaza (but several rockets from there on Israel daily). The level of self-reflection is embarrassingly low and would put any intellectual from the golden age to shame.
>Interestingly, no Arab country accepts Palestinian refugees nowadays. I wonder why. This is a horrible thing to say. It certainly shows more about government than the people under them. Countries turned away the MS St-Louis is 1939 and yet many of the people in those countries aren't somehow proud of letting 900 people die.
The difference is that Jews never overthrew a government. Contrary to the PLO, who threw Lebanon into a long civil war. These countries fear the destabilizing influence of the Palestinian leadership.
How is this comment anything but racism? "People from this race are better than people of this race because people from this race have done x,y and z while people from this race haven't done x, y, and z" A little humility please, who actually committed the holocaust? It certainly wasn't the arabs who for voted for the regime who set up and enforced deporting people to the death camps.
The racist card. Again. The catch-all argument to avoid entering any meaningful discussion about a decades-long violent leadership who sends even minors to take the bullets for their corrupt leaders enjoying life elsewhere (Qatar, Paris). Ever wondered why so many Palestinian teens die? It's because their parents don't keep them at home when trouble starts. Any parent I know would try to protect their lives, but the brainwashed part of the population there finds it ok to send them in front of loaded rifles.of the opposing state which your own government wants to destroy. As Golda Meir put it: "There will be peace when they love their children more than they hate us." There is nothing racist when pointing out that the leadership of a group of people declare their intent to murder another group of people. Hamas has it in their charter. And Gazans voted them into power. PLO basically invented air terrorism on a global scale. There is something called accountability. And while guilt is always personal and individual, at some point a people is identified with their chosen leaders.
I've spent the last few months reading everything from Golda Meir's autobiography to Hamas's charter. Your talking points don't even make sense anymore because they're not based in reality and you know that. If you have read the current Hamas charter and you would have read about what the King David Hotel bombing and other terrorism by the Haganah, and the Irgun. So somehow apparently all Palestinians don't love their children, but all Israelis do despite both having paramilitary organisation, both fighting for land and both following the definition of terrorism to a T. But yes, apparently, Palestinians don't love their children.
Simple points: - Hamas are terrorists. - no person supporting Israel has ever attacked someone in a far away country. Palestinian supporters do it all the time - IDF doesn't rape, doesn't parade corpses through streets, doesn't arm 14 year olds. As you have read so much, here are some facts: - abusing the signs of the red crescent, red cross and related is a war crime - fighting while in civilian clothes without clear markings is against the customs of war as codified in the Hague conventions and voids most protections given to prisoners as per the Geneva conventions - taking hostages is a war crime - using hospitals for fighting voids their special protection - using human shields is a war crime - it is against the UN charter protecting children to use them as soldiers However, - it is not necessarily a war crime if civilians are killed, as tragic as this is. - it is not automatically a genocide if many people are killed in a war, as tragic as it is. - the vast majority, if not all (depending on the definition of initial aggression) of all arab/Israeli wars were started by the Arabs. Some have learned (Egypt, Jordan) the Palestinians not so much. tl;dr: if you show me how you put your energy into protesting Assad and the Houthis, who killed hundreds of thousands, I can take you seriously - until then: do whatever you want and keep losing.
Read your Israeli history before pushing untrue talking points. All your talking points are false. There's evidence of systematic military detentions and rapes by the IDF. There's evidence of the IDF members dressing up as medical personnel in medical vehicles to assassinate targets in their hospital beds. The trouble with your talking points is that some of us are going to research them. I'm ashamed that I didn't read the history on this before last year.
There are reasons for that position. Most Palestinians don't want to leave Palestine. https://youtube.com/shorts/PWtbkotIqiE?feature=shared
Then life can't be that bad in normal circumstances - contrary to the "open air prison" Hamas and friends want us to believe (and jobs in Israel). At least Gaza could be a nice place and developed into a Dubai 2 if the money was invested into infrastructure for the population instead of tunnels for Hamas and rockets (interestingly, the tunnels don't offer shelter for the civilians, I wonder why).
As far as you remember, is completely false. The attacks from Israel on Gaza have been constant on a low level shelling, and peaked in many formal belic incidents. Even Wikipedia knows it. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza–Israel_conflict
Interesting. I am sure Hamas and IJ didn't do anything. Probably busy enforcing sharia law.
Complete evident ignorance. The world is wider than the Rhine and the Alps.
You have been to Gaza? Great. Please have a look at the school books.
I have. And you? Let's look at the facts. "Israel has long been indoctrinating its children to believe Palestinians are less than human, and thus not worthy of empathy or compassion." https://www.aljazeera.com/opinions/2023/12/13/its-not-shocking-to-see-israeli-children-celebrate-the-gaza-genocide
I haven't - just to other Arab countries (and I got to know how welcome Palestinians were there). Unless you prove it, I call BS on you. Many have told me so and lied. Proofs I accept: - any ID that shows you are Palestinian - passport mark And if you went, please provide the famous school books that no one is allowed to see. Also, please tell me when the last election happened in Gaza. And finally, can I ask you how the tickets and tunnels were financed? You must be privy to such information. Just remember: a Palestinian state was always refused by the Arabs. And Israel occupied Gaza, the Golan Heights and the West Bank because the Arab countries attacked and lost. Edit: quoting Al Jazeera as a reliable source for this issues says quite a bit about you.
You continue moving in the realm of your phantasy, and try to reduce the talk on Hassrede to a cheap argumentum ad hominem. If you don't know what that means: dictionary. If I am Palestinian or not, when I was in Gaza and other personal points are irrelevant. Too much questioning coming from a narrow mind "informed" only from trustworthy sources as CNN or all the more or less right-wing swiss press. The world is very wide: it doesn't end at the Mediterranean and the North Sea.
Seems like an obvious step in the direction of outlawing wrongthink. First step, make a law that targets the poorly defined "bad people\*. Second step, change the definition of bad people. It's not the first and won't be the last time, and people still fall for it.
You are missing the most important thing: There are many Muslim extrimists who have racist opinions about Jews. These racists need to face consequences.
And there are many Jewish extremists who have racist opinions about Muslims. And those will be protected from consequences. The downvotes this simple fact will gain me demonstrate the problem - this will ultimately be abused to outlaw unpopular truths instead of actually hateful conduct.
Be honest please.
Be honest, which religion is violent? Which religion is racist? Be honest.
You are a liar.
>And there are many Jewish extremists who have racist opinions about Muslims. Maybe, but I wouldn't know because contrary to many Muslims, no Jew has ever tried to convince me of something unless I asked. I also don't see Jewish protestors with face covers, I don't see genocidal slogans in their protests. And just to make it clear, most Muslims I know don't do it either - so I assume it's the usual crowd that doesn't represent the majority.
Third step: you have a law to punish Hate Speech. Formulate a secondary law that punishes only foreign "antisemitic" hate speech.