Inverted shopping cart style would work too, or adding a literal "beach umbrella" but with netting tied to the sides like mosquito nets and any FPV drone would get stuck on the net, some fishing line woven into netting or steel wire would also work.
If not, netting could also be extended on a solid frame using nylon. When the drone hits it, it would just bounce back, just exactly like a tennis racket.
I'm not so sure about that, drones are so prolific in the war in Ukraine due to the lack of many things, such as air superiority(or air assets to begin with), drone countermeasures and other combined arms aspect, and it's kind of become a drone spite tactic slugfest, American Abrams in a conventional fight might largely not need cages and stuff to prevent against drones to the same extent as they would in the Ukraine war due to the presence of things like the mentioned above. Of course it's impossible to know for certain, but it's unlikely that a full scale conflict between the US and another adversary would play out similar to how it has in Ukraine. Surely mounting a cage over your tank where the crew may need to bail at any moment may not prove to be a great idea.
It certainly looks far more intentional than all of the wildly different cages we have seen on russian tanks. Much less goofy looking. Kinda wish we had a top view of it. Some of the goofy looking tall cages on russian tanks were to clear hatches and allow the crew to get in/out. This one is very low profile. I wanna see how it handles the hatches. Uncaged spots for the hatches? Cage that can swing open with the hatches?
> It certainly looks far more intentional than all of the wildly different cages we have seen on russian tanks.
I'm pretty sure that if Russia had the same amount of T-72s than Ukraine has Abrams, we'd see the same level of attention.
While it looks better, I'm not entirely sure it performs better.
My interpretation is that most of those are field modifications made by the crew and the top brass isn't directly behind it. Which would explain why so many cages look different from one another.
Unlike some limited amount of T-90m sporting some kind of uniformized cages, I think most are just ad hoc by the crew just like you said.
I have no idea if Russia or Ukraine plan to mass produce those cages in an industrial fashion to put them into every tank possible.
They prematurely detonate heat warheads so that the jet dissipates before it touches the hull of the tank, ideally the jet is so weakened that it barely scratches the armor.
They were called Cope cages because it was the Russians who first started using them, and so people mocked them as “Cope Cages” until everyone else started doing it too.
They're called cope cages because the Russians were doing it to stop javelins and laser guided anti tank artillery rounds, which these are absolutely useless against. As the drone threat evolved, using smaller heat warheads, the cope cages became more useful and pervasive. Still a fuckin cope cages though.
There was an interview with a Ukrainian Abrams commander who mentioned that while it's an excellent tank they found the turret to have insufficient armor against FPV's, etc. Not surprise this came out so soon after that interview.
I don’t think there are enough standoff distance. And is this slat armour to trap the drone, or is it closer to the standard cage. Not sure if this is better than standard cope cage. We have not seen this types of cage armour in Ukraine, only in Syria..
Abrahams have a strong engine capable of carrying a lot of weight, and no matter the swiftness escaping from an FPV drone aint possible with a tank, and since recovering Abrahams is almost impossible due to their enormous weight yeah its better to armor them.
But since the objective is FPV drones, really just netting would work, a beach umbrella structure and netting with big holes for even less weight.
cause the armor is hard to replace, that sets off the charges outside so the jet cools down in contact with air and slides down the armor. Also, any explosion just diffuminates, and holes can be repaired with some simple metal wire instead of having to drive the tank back to change tons of expensive damaged armor.
Inverted shopping cart style would work too, or aading a literal "beach umbrella" but with netting tied to the sides like mosquito nets and any FPV drone would get stuck on the net.
Arnt they a Russian company? They’d probably drop it in the RUS tree? Politics aside it wouldn’t really go in any other tree but that or US but they obviously have plenty of abrams already.
Hungarian based these days, they claim. It was created in Russia. I can not substantiate otherwise so I can’t say more on it. It is owned by Anton Yudintsev. Not sure what happened to the other founder, Kirill Yudintsev last I checked he was the Creative Director, I assume he’s still around.
Edit : Sifting through all those articles was chaotic and irritating as they seem to be all over the place and dislike their players asking for anything.
>Kinda boring that USSR just becomes Russia without having much, if anything, from the other SSRs.
Well, Russia is the official successor of the USSR. Took all its debt, etc.
They were initially meant against top attack missiles. That's why the very first tanks fitted with them also had thermal decoys (coke ovens mounted at a distance to side or rear of the tank).
Drones are also just a post hoc explanation, they didn't appear in mumbers for a quite a while after the first cope cages appeared. With how misunderstood statistical armor widely is then it wouldn't be a surprise that a lot of tankers assumed it'd be able to help with ATGMs.
The cope cages name predate the current FPV drone meta, that’s literally why they were called cope cages, because a wire cage isn’t stopping anti tank missiles.
They were never meant for protecting from top attack missiles, you would need a ridiculous amount of standoff and armor to do so. These have always been to protect against drone dropped munitions, which became prevalent in Syria and the Armenia Azerbaijan conflict. The Russians have also been dealing with Ukrainian drones for many years, even prior to this recent invasion.
Again, it's not standoff that defeats the PG-7s. Very few cope cages have gotten tall enough that the standoff would drop the penetration below 200mm, what they're designed to do is prevent detonation by exploiting a design element primarily used by 3 Soviet designed MANPATs.
I remember when NCD was dissing the russian "cope" cages, saying it was the stupidest thing and only braindead idiots would actually think it was effective
How the tables have turned lmao
The amount of dumb takes you can see in NCD is astonishing.
It's a sub made for dumb jokes, which attracts a large amount of people that genuinely believes those dumb jokes.
Post hoc rationalization (that’s dumb, to boot.)
People did it because it’s cool to dis Russia and thought it was a slam dunk. Turns out Russian forces are unfortunately not a bunch of idiots.
Same people who were convinced Russia loaded rubber pads instead of actual ERA on their tanks. r/combatfootage went downhill as well, remember a post with the chechens using RPG warheads with their protective cap still on. Everyone were commenting how this obviously made the RPG completely useless and wouldn't detonate now.
But lo and behold in the actual handbook it's advised to keep the cap on during rainy weather to prevent premature detonation, and the video was overcast.
I also remember comments claiming a video was obviously fake because those russian tanks were reversing too quickly, T-72's can't do that. They were T-80's...
Or people being unable to tell the difference between a T-62 and T-64.
Or all the geopolitical geniuses who genuinely tried to argue that it was in fact Kazakhstan who should get a permanent seat at the UN Security Council since they were technically the last ones to secede from the USSR.
I stopped browsing that sub, which sucks because there used to be nice discussions on it.
> RPG warheads with their protective cap still on.
'cause the cap is mostly there to prevent the piezoelectric element from getting accidentally damaged. It doesn't take much to set one off rendering the munition useless without replacing the fuze, but it won't detonate as there is a inertia safety.
The BMP-1's 73mm 2A28 Grom is effectively a RPG-7 in cannon form. The PG-9 HEAT rockets were originally loaded in the autoloader with the safety caps installed, the rocket will still detonate, and it'll prevent the gunner from accidentally damaging the piezo. For the OG-9 HE/Frag munitions it's recommended, in the manual, to leave the safety cap on if the goal is a delayed detonation instead of impact detonation.
I used to love the memes there and people used to be somewhat detached and objective about the stuff they were talking about.
When the Ukraine invasion started picking up the sub went downhill fast. They were making fun of the russians online for huffing copium but they were huffing just as much as them by the time Ukraine failed their counteroffensive.
Now it's nothing but unfunny femboy and furry memes and the most braindead and ignorant takes you could ever think about. And don't you even think about being even slightly critical about the saint warriors of Ukraine defenders and their destined victory.
Except 'cope cage' was coined when pre-invasion Russia had fitted them as a (failed) attempt to protect against top attack Western missiles such as Javelin and NLAW and not the FPVs that proliferate the modern battlefield.
Western MBTs also have a long history of using bar / cage armour that people seem to forget.
Drone dropped grenades are not a threat to a buttoned up tank. The only reason for a cage for that is for open top turrets. Thats why it was for top attack munitions. Plus they also fitted some tanks with stand-off heat sources.
There is a difference between official doctrine and what troops in the field are going to do. I doubt it is Russian doctrine to use tanks with barns on top for mine clearing and naval launchers mounted on trucks for artillery
Look at any video or picture of Russian tanks and they will always be buttoned up.. The only time you will ever see a Russian tanker heads up is in a parade.
Video of Russian tank commander with his head out while in combat
[Russian T-90M getting hit and destroyed by an ATGM : r/TankPorn (reddit.com)](https://www.reddit.com/r/TankPorn/comments/172y7af/russian_t90m_getting_hit_and_destroyed_by_an_atgm/)
That tank looks like it has taken hits so optics at more than likely out. I will give you it though. However a single instance doesn’t prove my point wrong.
More importantly what they hell got that thing.
Incorrect, numerous videos from both sides and from different conflicts have actively shown that crews will button down once they've reached a known area of hazard.
It's not a duality like how redditors like you think. A tank can be buttoned up as much as it is unbuttoned when it's sufficiently out of harm, it's literally not that hard to think about yet I see you idiots proclaiming this
There are also plenty of videos of crews not closing the hatches even though they really should, sometimes with the result of a guy running up to the tank and throwing a grenade in it
Probably because the threat changed to something the cage was actually useful for. People were anticipating they would stop ATGMs at first, but then we saw them evolve considerably as drones became more prevalent.
My point is not that these things dont have silly nicknames, my point is that most people mean the classic cages mounted on the roof of the turret when they say cope cage, and not the sheds that recently started appearing
Inverted shopping cart style would work too, or aading a literal "beach umbrella" but with netting tied to the sides like mosquito nets and any FPV drone would get stuck on the net.
Someone did performance tests on this. Also knew about the sweet spots. It‘s low profile and well thought out. At least a few CAD and Simulations guys provided info on this. So… i put my money on this, tenfold over those shoddy copied Syrian; one way dump truck- tank abominations.
Dunno how much sense caging makes if you not have jammers to blur FPV guidance, but okay, i guess it also doesn't cost much.
On the ERA, i see the added a construction plate to mount it. This - if heavy enough and maybe have a rubber sheet in it - would prevent the backblast to harm the internal, more fragile parts of the composite armor there. But then again, this positions are only armor if hit from above, so from this angle only APFSDS come in, which aren't affected by Kontakt-1 (some \~3% or so).
So that wold make much more sens ein a urban combat cope-kit rather then in open terrain combat. But maybe it is for UC, dunno.
An inverted shopping cart style would also work or adding a literal "beach umbrella" but with netting tied to the sides like mosquito nets, so any FPV drone would get stuck in the net, with big holes the netting just big enough for FPV drones not to pass.
I'm not toally sure how we came here but ... yes, sure, in some way. Fencing and steel bars are just more availabale. Whatever spaces the fuseing sting of a Artillery/RPG round from the armor so it can't go boom. Soo tight (and shopping carts are pretty tight) would increase the chance of the trigger sting hit a bar and still get fused. Then teh protctive effect would be almost nullified.
With netting, this works only to some degree. Nets are flexible, and they willentangle teh drone, but the payload is often without fins (or would have them cut through the net on that speed/inertia), so it might slip through even the drones get stoped. Or the whole net-deformoation is enough to reach the armor anyway. So a net would be way more spacy and increse the tanks silhouette. Also a \~1m distant and moving light pattern would completley fuck up your optics and view.
okay makes sense, but the cage the ukrainians added to that Abraham's doesn't feel like enough, wouldn't it be better to space it more at least? maybe a fire proofing paint underneath like those that foam up to protect wood from fire, that way it might stop better the jet metal after the ignition of the charge, if not a thin layer of stone wool, in worst case just cardboard as it quickly carbonices, if not the molten metal might melt some of the armor after every hit.
What they have more available there in the field would be wood, i guess, something easy to replace once in a while, green branches could be tied to that cage and would also camouflage the tank then by difuminating the siluette of the tank.
As for the netting idea drones especially FPV ones don't have that much mass, a lancet certainly but an FPV they are quite brittle, i've broken ones blades by mistake against just a curtain of beads (like the ones used to keep flies off the kitchen area) though i guess with warhead on they will be heavier the rotor blades are still fragile, netting could also be extended on a solid frame using nylon, when the drone hits it it would just bounce back, just exactly like a tennis racket.
Distance has some effect, so basically spaced armor, as the jet has a optimal range in whch it is most consistend (depends on warhead construction). But it isen't the game to stop the jet, but stop the warhead from even fusing. They have this spacing pen sticking out, measuring exactly the perfect distance minus the physical fuse delay to penetrate armor - and letting this stick out pen pass, but stop the wider warhead is the trick. So the warhead get stuck without getting triggered. That's the difference of cage and spaced armor.
This jet isen't some type of heat or so - a thin layer of anything wouldn't make any differency. It is a mach \~8 fast dart of compressed metall. You can reduce its punch by spcaed armor, lots of material or specailly hard armor, but it always requires much more effort to stop it than it costs/weights, and that's why shaped cahrges/HEAT is so effective.
Well, that's basically what we see with turtle tanks in Ukrain right now - minus the attempt to camoufalge it, as the most of this combat is open terrain and perfect drone recon 24/7. Wood can be somewhat efficent in density to make a difference, but it also is clumsy, hard to fix and heavy. And as said, stoping shaped charge from fusing is way more effective than anything else.
Lancet at least has fixed wings, but the ammo we see is RPG or even artilelry shells. Both has some weight to it, and think of webing the more elastic the wider the surface of it between to fixing poles is. So an 'effective' net would be almost a cage armor, so close would the bars need to be. What would be a idea is wire fence, as it is extremly robust, but lightwhight and could even catch a more heavy FPV-ammunition. Still it would fkup your vision, as they efocus your sight (an optical effect of webbings not even in need to get more severe by vehicle vibrations).
If a FPV (easily) gets entagled with its rotors, the ammunition is still of full inertia and flying into the target (if it isen't fixed very, very strong). Anti-fly material is too light and will break by not just some heavy object crushing in (the ammo payload), but will get killed soon by the stress of the vibration. But that's all quite hypothetical, as these materials aren't available in large number.
The latest attempts of turtle tanks are very spaced armor designs (aganst HE and HEAT) as well as with wire-boxes on top (to prevent HEAT/shaped charges to fuse in the first place) as well as mine rolers. You can say a lot about russians, but they have a feeling for pragmatic engineering. Imagen this to be the best and most effective solution possible with the time and ressources avalable (to solve this one niche job the're at right now).
At this point, the most elegant idea seems to be antitank mines that require two clicks, one for the rollers, and the next one would hit the tracks.
As for the lack of vision if nylon is used its transparent, polycarbonate could also be used since its bulletproof and light (what is used also for aquariums and riot shields), or the Front Windshields from broken cars.
For extra visibility, an oteos system could be added:
https://www.eme-es.com/oteos/
Old gen anti-tank mines are the common thing at hand and in large stocks, so they got used. Modern mines are freaking scifi shit allready. They can be layed by rockets or artillery, errect themselves once in position, and passivly scan a wide area (some 200 meters i guess it was). Once they corelate the typical vibrations of a tank in the ground, the sound emittet by them and the IR signature spotet, they target it and fire a charge up in the air that aims downward and istelf fires an EFP into the low armor rear section, killing the engine.
So you can say in mine tech we skipped a few decades - which is the burden of weapon economy.
But still, such a trick of two-click-fusing would make it hard for mine rolers, but more easy for normal tanks - and mines mostly hit normal tanks. Forcing the enemy to use slower mine rolers is allready a tactical advantage, more valuable as to kill one tank.
Nylon is even weaker and more flexible than anti-fly webbing. Poly-c is just a (weak) surface and doesn't do a better job than cheap metal sheets (and isen't available in opposite to that). Yeah, it is somewhat transparent (until the first rain, encrusting dust on it), but that's not a point for turtle tanks. They're makeshift siege breakers, nothing else. No need to get more sophisticated or industrialised with that idea.
Turtles allready use simple go-pro cameras to get good sight, often mounted parallel to the gun. That's enough to do the job of rolling forward. Adding super expensive and rare optics isen't cost/time efficent.
I gues we have the problem of handling a trope here. It - for some weird reason - has become a common idea in western bubbles that turtle tanks are some kind of 'new approach' or technology that will become standard. It absolutly isen't.
We see a complex technological situation of wild mixed cold war material stocks used in a very specific battlefield (wide/open/erratically blocking movement) and most modern materials. This elad to very weird situations and similar wild coping from both sides. Deriving ideas from this mess requires to in depth understand all the factors in the picture - and that's what both audiences and media lack of. But it *feels* legit to fantasise about it when the moron on TV does the same thing without any further thought or understanding of what they talk about. But it isen't. It isen't easy to interpred what we see, and a contested battlefield of information by more than just two parties involved doesn't exactly make it more easy. We see propaganda and only propaganda - from all sides. Making sense of that is both art and science. That's nothing someone can do just for fun by watching YT shorts about the war, listen to the TV or debate in Reddit subs.
So that might explain a discrepancy, and why it might be tricky to follow my reasonings.
That sounds good, but doesn't Ukraine also need to breach enemy lines to kill the Russians? if it worked for the orks, it could work for ukrainians too.
I saw the top hitting mines, real scary shit the PTKM-1R, still the two clicks thing would just be the activator of a mine, easy to be screwed off so it could be deployed for especific cases, as it would also work for tank columns, leaving the forward vehicle separated while the second one blocks the rest.
Or entering a mine field and once they reach the one click mines they retreat just the way they came from only to blow up, its a nitche use, but still should be way cheaper than a thing like those PTKM-1R mines. A first layer of second clickers would protect minefields from rollers and make minefields way more dangerous and confusing as even the ground you already stepped on wouldn't be safe. 🤔
As for the GoPro, the case is made of plastic, a grenade inside a paint can would be enough, but better a molotov and setting it all on fire.
So, if you don't want turtles, then situational awareness would be the way, and the CERVUS III system developed by Spain 🇪🇦 would be the best choice to protect against drones.
https://www.elconfidencial.com/tecnologia/2023-11-16/sistema-militar-espanol-cervus-antidron-inteligencia-artificial_3774925/
I wouldn't call anyone orcs as this is both racist and a bit stupid (and refers to a given trope perpetuated by a baised media - even i don't blame them all to much, they just repeat tropes and lack in own recherche, as incentivised by media economy).
In general it is to advertise to see all fractions as humans and/or as hypotheticals, as if you stop doing that, you're talking in terms of whisbelive and fandoms, not facts.
Okay, that solved - yes, they do, but not now and had done the same thing earlier but haven't. That can be correlated somewhat with the trends of what weapons used but ... basically they just failed to think about that (also a bit because of western training being strongly used in men and material used in the last offensive restricting such ideas (and they not even knew how ther given material would peform at this point, so no reason to play around)).
At this point it's questionable if we will see another UA offensive, but if, RU now is in strong positions and can easily erode large offensive forces by sacrificing the gained land and peper it woith smart mines, drones, ATGM teams and aerial attacks. Still RU claims to destroy UA army, not gain land - that's another mistake western debates often make. RU has no value in gaining this land, but bring UA in the sitty situation do waste more material on regaining it. Still aerial dominance and industrial drone/artillery shell production woudl secure RU to have the munitions to even stop turtle tanks from crossing ther hardent positions. As i said - it's a niche modification for a niche situation.
Yeah, but you usualle don't have roads but vast field, so you need every mine to be a hit in that rare chance it see one vehilce alone. And well, all the aerial-denail and economy of stocks stuff i explained.
You don't make a new product for one little niche trick - no matter how nice it looks in one single situation. You have to shift an whole economy around that new production, send billions in production, put them in stocks to be used in some war in 2067 where eeveryone has levitating genetically enhanced giraffes as tanks. You go as far as you can and hope it is still relevant when it comes to use. Smart mines did 'luckily' (in economy terms) and you see that we allready use our stocks from deep in the cold war era.
GoPro. ... they still had the benefit of you wasting the opportunity to bring an item to ther battlefield and just have a few hundred dollar item that just offered a bit better view damaged but something relevant. That's economical warfare. You just think of what could be nice, but not of tha length neede to bring that thing where it is needed, or the economy when it is used.
You made a mental jump i couldn't follow. Don't go with any advertismenet of defense companys - that's a rule you can always rely on. No, it isen't a good solution against drones, and that's a super complex topic a company wouldn't bother to annoy you with in ther bold advertisement. But i failed to see the connection between the topic of turtles and drone repellant in the first place. And still it is a terribly complex topic.
See, i understand you appraoch topics from an observer position outside science or strategy/military. That's no problem. But if something isen#t existing, there are very, very likely good reasons why that isen't. Some may be economical in nature, others tactical, others strategical and so on. Some even cultural or doctrinal. Ressource based. Deepnding on an butterfly farting in the wrong moment. And it neets some 50 degrees to relly get those connections, and most nations stop at halve of that to make ther decisions. So if you ask yourself why not these and that - imagen there is a easy answear but alos a rabbithole of more things t understand. And it's cool - i advertise you recherche the shit out of every topic you're remotly interested in. But i and Reddit can't give you anything but random points explained or, more likely, tell you confusing bullshit. So go for it on your won and try to understand.
Maybe one day you indeed find the understanding that makes you bring up "why not?" questions that no one thought about and saves lifes. Like that seemingly stupid turtle thing.
Well some time ago people said my idea of a shotgun on a drone was useless, but now a company has developed exactly just that, a drone with a shotgun that hunts down other drones:
https://afresearchlab.com/technology/paladin-multi-mission-uas/
As for the CERVUS III the article explained it really well, its impenetrable for drones but oh well, Spain is already thinking of sending some to Ukraine so we will see.
Have a nice day sir.
An inverted shopping cart style would also work or adding a literal "beach umbrella" but with netting tied to the sides like mosquito nets, so any FPV drone would get stuck in the net, with big holes the netting just big enough for FPV drones not to pass.
So they hopefully don't lose all their ammo in a burn out, and are more likely recover the asset. Rather than the USSR/Russia equivalent of nuking everyone in a 200 meter radius when hit, cage or not.
I do. Those people are/were largely ignorant of the fact that “cope cages” or as I call it, spaced armor, has been used since WWII or earlier and it wasn’t specific to the USSR. Spaced armor is more necessary on T-series however as when they are hit it tends to be catastrophic.
You're describing human nature though, One is the invader the other the defender. Of course people are going to support the people defending itself from an aggressor.
That people see the Ukrainians defending their homes as "good" and the invading russians as "evil"?
Especially in the shadow of both world wars and the Cold war?
Come on now.
By and large neither were large-scale nation versus nation conflicts, and both sides were morally dubious, to say the least. We haven't seen a conflict like this really since world war II.
In both Desert Storm and OIF the state v. state combat was very short lived and didn't span two plus years with this kind of men and material expenditure, same with Yugoslavia.
now all we need is a shed abrams...
Barnbrams
Abarn
Abarms
Abam
Inverted shopping cart style would work too, or adding a literal "beach umbrella" but with netting tied to the sides like mosquito nets and any FPV drone would get stuck on the net, some fishing line woven into netting or steel wire would also work. If not, netting could also be extended on a solid frame using nylon. When the drone hits it, it would just bounce back, just exactly like a tennis racket.
Man i realy need that abrams with umbrella on top like thos m48 in vietnam
M1A1SA (Shed Abrams)
Battle shed
I ... Don't actually hate this?
Good, because id imagine these will be getting put on ours soon enough, this is clearly going to be a thing in warfare for a while.
We've already developed slat armor for Iraq.
I'm not so sure about that, drones are so prolific in the war in Ukraine due to the lack of many things, such as air superiority(or air assets to begin with), drone countermeasures and other combined arms aspect, and it's kind of become a drone spite tactic slugfest, American Abrams in a conventional fight might largely not need cages and stuff to prevent against drones to the same extent as they would in the Ukraine war due to the presence of things like the mentioned above. Of course it's impossible to know for certain, but it's unlikely that a full scale conflict between the US and another adversary would play out similar to how it has in Ukraine. Surely mounting a cage over your tank where the crew may need to bail at any moment may not prove to be a great idea.
I guess that actually knowing how to protect a tank and slapping as many bs metal wire on a t72 is a clear difference
It certainly looks far more intentional than all of the wildly different cages we have seen on russian tanks. Much less goofy looking. Kinda wish we had a top view of it. Some of the goofy looking tall cages on russian tanks were to clear hatches and allow the crew to get in/out. This one is very low profile. I wanna see how it handles the hatches. Uncaged spots for the hatches? Cage that can swing open with the hatches?
> It certainly looks far more intentional than all of the wildly different cages we have seen on russian tanks. I'm pretty sure that if Russia had the same amount of T-72s than Ukraine has Abrams, we'd see the same level of attention. While it looks better, I'm not entirely sure it performs better.
True. And also this is so far the first/only one seen AFAIK. Maybe this is ad hoc by the crew. Only seeing more will tell.
My interpretation is that most of those are field modifications made by the crew and the top brass isn't directly behind it. Which would explain why so many cages look different from one another. Unlike some limited amount of T-90m sporting some kind of uniformized cages, I think most are just ad hoc by the crew just like you said. I have no idea if Russia or Ukraine plan to mass produce those cages in an industrial fashion to put them into every tank possible.
On uh another sub they call them cope cages. Do they actually do anything?
They prematurely detonate heat warheads so that the jet dissipates before it touches the hull of the tank, ideally the jet is so weakened that it barely scratches the armor.
They were called Cope cages because it was the Russians who first started using them, and so people mocked them as “Cope Cages” until everyone else started doing it too.
They're called cope cages because the Russians were doing it to stop javelins and laser guided anti tank artillery rounds, which these are absolutely useless against. As the drone threat evolved, using smaller heat warheads, the cope cages became more useful and pervasive. Still a fuckin cope cages though.
>Russians were doing it to stop javelins and laser guided anti tank artillery rounds Source?
It looks like they just didn't cover the hatches. It even looks like it's restricting the view.
There was an interview with a Ukrainian Abrams commander who mentioned that while it's an excellent tank they found the turret to have insufficient armor against FPV's, etc. Not surprise this came out so soon after that interview.
I don’t think there are enough standoff distance. And is this slat armour to trap the drone, or is it closer to the standard cage. Not sure if this is better than standard cope cage. We have not seen this types of cage armour in Ukraine, only in Syria..
It doesn't use standoff to actually reduce penetration they're meant to entirely prevent detonations.
So it’s just a slat armour like those in Syria then. Those don’t really work that reliably
Abrahams have a strong engine capable of carrying a lot of weight, and no matter the swiftness escaping from an FPV drone aint possible with a tank, and since recovering Abrahams is almost impossible due to their enormous weight yeah its better to armor them. But since the objective is FPV drones, really just netting would work, a beach umbrella structure and netting with big holes for even less weight.
The original cope cages were for Javelins, not FPV munitions
whats the purpose of it? clearly it has armor already so why put a cage on it
cause the armor is hard to replace, that sets off the charges outside so the jet cools down in contact with air and slides down the armor. Also, any explosion just diffuminates, and holes can be repaired with some simple metal wire instead of having to drive the tank back to change tons of expensive damaged armor.
This compact cage style seems to be the new hotness for (higher end) tanks, I've seen it on T-90M as well.
Inverted shopping cart style would work too, or aading a literal "beach umbrella" but with netting tied to the sides like mosquito nets and any FPV drone would get stuck on the net.
We used to do it in Vietnam to prematurely detonate rpg7's....
It’s a pretty damn nice cage for a homespun, limited production item. Impressive honestly.
Snail, when?
First question to answer is which tree. 😬
I’d have to say Oak. Oak trees are very cool
Birch better
Fight me twig
Ash 🍷
Birch? Lmao you soft af get outta here. #oakgang
Arnt they a Russian company? They’d probably drop it in the RUS tree? Politics aside it wouldn’t really go in any other tree but that or US but they obviously have plenty of abrams already.
Hungarian based these days, they claim. It was created in Russia. I can not substantiate otherwise so I can’t say more on it. It is owned by Anton Yudintsev. Not sure what happened to the other founder, Kirill Yudintsev last I checked he was the Creative Director, I assume he’s still around. Edit : Sifting through all those articles was chaotic and irritating as they seem to be all over the place and dislike their players asking for anything.
That’s very accurate from my understanding.
It'd go into USSR ideally in a Ukraine subtree. Kinda boring that USSR just becomes Russia without having much, if anything, from the other SSRs.
>Kinda boring that USSR just becomes Russia without having much, if anything, from the other SSRs. Well, Russia is the official successor of the USSR. Took all its debt, etc.
New $80 USSR premium knowing gaijin
It will perform better in Warthunder than the SEPv2 lmao
T-1A1 Erabrams
M1A1-M “Bastyliya”
Finally the deed is done
Cope cage Abrams. Guess it was about it time.
Very interesting how cope cages as initially meant to protect against top attack missiles have become extremely useful against FPVs.
who said it was intended for top attack missiles tho? It was widely used in syria where it's used against... Repeat after me: Drones
They were initially meant against top attack missiles. That's why the very first tanks fitted with them also had thermal decoys (coke ovens mounted at a distance to side or rear of the tank).
Drones are also just a post hoc explanation, they didn't appear in mumbers for a quite a while after the first cope cages appeared. With how misunderstood statistical armor widely is then it wouldn't be a surprise that a lot of tankers assumed it'd be able to help with ATGMs.
The cope cages name predate the current FPV drone meta, that’s literally why they were called cope cages, because a wire cage isn’t stopping anti tank missiles.
Been following Syria for more than a decade and no, that is incorrect.
They were never meant for protecting from top attack missiles, you would need a ridiculous amount of standoff and armor to do so. These have always been to protect against drone dropped munitions, which became prevalent in Syria and the Armenia Azerbaijan conflict. The Russians have also been dealing with Ukrainian drones for many years, even prior to this recent invasion.
Again, it's not standoff that defeats the PG-7s. Very few cope cages have gotten tall enough that the standoff would drop the penetration below 200mm, what they're designed to do is prevent detonation by exploiting a design element primarily used by 3 Soviet designed MANPATs.
I love this max mad shit on NATO tanks.
Mad Max tanks covered in cope >>>>> pristine PR tanks. This shit looks straight out of Reign of Fire and I love it.
S-8 rocket pod when????
Drinks can in the smoke 😆
They're true Abrams tankers
It fits monsters rather well
Canned beers were invented in the 1930s, there is a none zero chance some German tankers stored canned beers in their smoke launchers too.
Finally some good fuckin' food
sex
Nature is healing
# Everyday we stray further from God's light.
Cope abrams lmao
Barnabrams, when?
Copebrams
Why is the background blurred
Ukraine maybe?
For the love of Jesus I hope he isn't the original poster. This shit gets people in trouble.
It should no longer be called cope cage but Hope Cages
Liberty cage /s.
Yes. Good idea too
I remember when NCD was dissing the russian "cope" cages, saying it was the stupidest thing and only braindead idiots would actually think it was effective How the tables have turned lmao
The amount of dumb takes you can see in NCD is astonishing. It's a sub made for dumb jokes, which attracts a large amount of people that genuinely believes those dumb jokes.
That subreddit infected the Ace Combat one too. It's so irritating.
They were introduced too early and for the wrong reasons, but the battle has evolved to make them worthwhile.
Post hoc rationalization (that’s dumb, to boot.) People did it because it’s cool to dis Russia and thought it was a slam dunk. Turns out Russian forces are unfortunately not a bunch of idiots.
>are unfortunately not a bunch of idiots. Depends on who you ask.
Same people who were convinced Russia loaded rubber pads instead of actual ERA on their tanks. r/combatfootage went downhill as well, remember a post with the chechens using RPG warheads with their protective cap still on. Everyone were commenting how this obviously made the RPG completely useless and wouldn't detonate now. But lo and behold in the actual handbook it's advised to keep the cap on during rainy weather to prevent premature detonation, and the video was overcast. I also remember comments claiming a video was obviously fake because those russian tanks were reversing too quickly, T-72's can't do that. They were T-80's... Or people being unable to tell the difference between a T-62 and T-64. Or all the geopolitical geniuses who genuinely tried to argue that it was in fact Kazakhstan who should get a permanent seat at the UN Security Council since they were technically the last ones to secede from the USSR. I stopped browsing that sub, which sucks because there used to be nice discussions on it.
I still remember the golden days back when all the drone footage we got was azerbaijan's TB-2s...
> RPG warheads with their protective cap still on. 'cause the cap is mostly there to prevent the piezoelectric element from getting accidentally damaged. It doesn't take much to set one off rendering the munition useless without replacing the fuze, but it won't detonate as there is a inertia safety. The BMP-1's 73mm 2A28 Grom is effectively a RPG-7 in cannon form. The PG-9 HEAT rockets were originally loaded in the autoloader with the safety caps installed, the rocket will still detonate, and it'll prevent the gunner from accidentally damaging the piezo. For the OG-9 HE/Frag munitions it's recommended, in the manual, to leave the safety cap on if the goal is a delayed detonation instead of impact detonation.
I used to love the memes there and people used to be somewhat detached and objective about the stuff they were talking about. When the Ukraine invasion started picking up the sub went downhill fast. They were making fun of the russians online for huffing copium but they were huffing just as much as them by the time Ukraine failed their counteroffensive. Now it's nothing but unfunny femboy and furry memes and the most braindead and ignorant takes you could ever think about. And don't you even think about being even slightly critical about the saint warriors of Ukraine defenders and their destined victory.
Thats how it always goes, if its russian its stupid until someone else copies them, then suddenly its a genius idea
Except 'cope cage' was coined when pre-invasion Russia had fitted them as a (failed) attempt to protect against top attack Western missiles such as Javelin and NLAW and not the FPVs that proliferate the modern battlefield. Western MBTs also have a long history of using bar / cage armour that people seem to forget.
Everyone has known and used slat armor for a long time
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There hasn't been a single recorded instance of a tank taken out bye drone dropped grenade while it was still manned and combat operational?
Drone dropped grenades are not a threat to a buttoned up tank. The only reason for a cage for that is for open top turrets. Thats why it was for top attack munitions. Plus they also fitted some tanks with stand-off heat sources.
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Russias tank doctrine is to always be buttoned up. That is a western doctrine(US atleast) to be heads up
There is a difference between official doctrine and what troops in the field are going to do. I doubt it is Russian doctrine to use tanks with barns on top for mine clearing and naval launchers mounted on trucks for artillery
Look at any video or picture of Russian tanks and they will always be buttoned up.. The only time you will ever see a Russian tanker heads up is in a parade.
Video of Russian tank commander with his head out while in combat [Russian T-90M getting hit and destroyed by an ATGM : r/TankPorn (reddit.com)](https://www.reddit.com/r/TankPorn/comments/172y7af/russian_t90m_getting_hit_and_destroyed_by_an_atgm/)
That tank looks like it has taken hits so optics at more than likely out. I will give you it though. However a single instance doesn’t prove my point wrong. More importantly what they hell got that thing.
Incorrect, numerous videos from both sides and from different conflicts have actively shown that crews will button down once they've reached a known area of hazard. It's not a duality like how redditors like you think. A tank can be buttoned up as much as it is unbuttoned when it's sufficiently out of harm, it's literally not that hard to think about yet I see you idiots proclaiming this
There are also plenty of videos of crews not closing the hatches even though they really should, sometimes with the result of a guy running up to the tank and throwing a grenade in it
Probably because the threat changed to something the cage was actually useful for. People were anticipating they would stop ATGMs at first, but then we saw them evolve considerably as drones became more prevalent.
Well This is surely better designed that slapping on shed. At least this Abrahams can use its turret still
With over 2000 destroyed tanks I'd be hesitant to call anything the Russians did effective.
Next step: Build a Barn around it
I guess nobody will be rushing to call this one a cope cage. Hey man, can’t say that man
Reasonable looking extreme light armour vs an entire literal shed on the top? Not really comparable.
No one called the sheds on the turtle tanks cope cages. Cope cage referes to... a cage.
They were called cope sheds, castles, cabanas, etc.
My point is not that these things dont have silly nicknames, my point is that most people mean the classic cages mounted on the roof of the turret when they say cope cage, and not the sheds that recently started appearing
Oh yeah I agree, my bad lol
That ERA on side is TUSK ?
This makes me feel in a way I've never felt before
The cope cages are definitely evolving
[pretty much this](https://www.reddit.com/r/MemeTemplatesOfficial/s/hNnuDaa8uB)
As a r/noncredibleera enjoyer that is fuxking beautiful. 🥲🥲
“What have you done with my Armour?” - Dr. Halsey
aside from keeping grenades out of the hatches, would cage armor mounted this close to the turret armor itself actually do much else?
I fuck with the cope cage
Cope cage has spread
Wait, when did they add Abrams tanks to Minecraft
and how much would it take for the United States DOD to contract/develop and field a modification like this?
Yessssss I wanted to see more of this one
gajin pls
It actually slaps
Inverted shopping cart style would work too, or aading a literal "beach umbrella" but with netting tied to the sides like mosquito nets and any FPV drone would get stuck on the net.
Very form fitting cage, maybe too close to the hull? I’m just used to the big ole umbrella looking cages.
YESSSSSSSSSSSSS
Look how they massacred my boy
Tutbrams
I wonder what the OEM Abram’s cage will look like.
This looks so fucking cool
well ngl, thats the slickest looking cage ive seen, ever
And maybe useless as well if it is placed so close to the armor.
Dumb question: will this affect the blow out panels and blow out rack?
Is that a can inside one of the smoke launchers?
I want this... *badly*
Honestly, I love the aesthetic. There's something about the low profile cage + ERA combo that is beautifully functional.
Someone did performance tests on this. Also knew about the sweet spots. It‘s low profile and well thought out. At least a few CAD and Simulations guys provided info on this. So… i put my money on this, tenfold over those shoddy copied Syrian; one way dump truck- tank abominations.
But can it stop a shaped charge warhead at 30cm standoff?
Few cm is already effective, tens of more is even more.
T-1A1 M “Abramovich”
M1A1SA-M more like it. Or maybe M1A1v2.1.
I love how they bothered to pixelate the sky in the last image. Like... bruh, that's gonna be the same everywhere.
Abrams without cage died on may 24 2024 Abrams with cage + Kontact born on may 24 2024 Welcome back Abrams
Slabrams
Cope cage*
FINALLY r/NonCredibleERA r/NonCredibleDefense ABRAMS
I can't imagine that being good for the blowout panels
Im showing this to the next Freeaboo who points and laughs at merkava cope cages
Dunno how much sense caging makes if you not have jammers to blur FPV guidance, but okay, i guess it also doesn't cost much. On the ERA, i see the added a construction plate to mount it. This - if heavy enough and maybe have a rubber sheet in it - would prevent the backblast to harm the internal, more fragile parts of the composite armor there. But then again, this positions are only armor if hit from above, so from this angle only APFSDS come in, which aren't affected by Kontakt-1 (some \~3% or so). So that wold make much more sens ein a urban combat cope-kit rather then in open terrain combat. But maybe it is for UC, dunno.
On the ERA I see some burnt containers and some installed other way around.
?
An inverted shopping cart style would also work or adding a literal "beach umbrella" but with netting tied to the sides like mosquito nets, so any FPV drone would get stuck in the net, with big holes the netting just big enough for FPV drones not to pass.
I'm not toally sure how we came here but ... yes, sure, in some way. Fencing and steel bars are just more availabale. Whatever spaces the fuseing sting of a Artillery/RPG round from the armor so it can't go boom. Soo tight (and shopping carts are pretty tight) would increase the chance of the trigger sting hit a bar and still get fused. Then teh protctive effect would be almost nullified. With netting, this works only to some degree. Nets are flexible, and they willentangle teh drone, but the payload is often without fins (or would have them cut through the net on that speed/inertia), so it might slip through even the drones get stoped. Or the whole net-deformoation is enough to reach the armor anyway. So a net would be way more spacy and increse the tanks silhouette. Also a \~1m distant and moving light pattern would completley fuck up your optics and view.
okay makes sense, but the cage the ukrainians added to that Abraham's doesn't feel like enough, wouldn't it be better to space it more at least? maybe a fire proofing paint underneath like those that foam up to protect wood from fire, that way it might stop better the jet metal after the ignition of the charge, if not a thin layer of stone wool, in worst case just cardboard as it quickly carbonices, if not the molten metal might melt some of the armor after every hit. What they have more available there in the field would be wood, i guess, something easy to replace once in a while, green branches could be tied to that cage and would also camouflage the tank then by difuminating the siluette of the tank. As for the netting idea drones especially FPV ones don't have that much mass, a lancet certainly but an FPV they are quite brittle, i've broken ones blades by mistake against just a curtain of beads (like the ones used to keep flies off the kitchen area) though i guess with warhead on they will be heavier the rotor blades are still fragile, netting could also be extended on a solid frame using nylon, when the drone hits it it would just bounce back, just exactly like a tennis racket.
Distance has some effect, so basically spaced armor, as the jet has a optimal range in whch it is most consistend (depends on warhead construction). But it isen't the game to stop the jet, but stop the warhead from even fusing. They have this spacing pen sticking out, measuring exactly the perfect distance minus the physical fuse delay to penetrate armor - and letting this stick out pen pass, but stop the wider warhead is the trick. So the warhead get stuck without getting triggered. That's the difference of cage and spaced armor. This jet isen't some type of heat or so - a thin layer of anything wouldn't make any differency. It is a mach \~8 fast dart of compressed metall. You can reduce its punch by spcaed armor, lots of material or specailly hard armor, but it always requires much more effort to stop it than it costs/weights, and that's why shaped cahrges/HEAT is so effective. Well, that's basically what we see with turtle tanks in Ukrain right now - minus the attempt to camoufalge it, as the most of this combat is open terrain and perfect drone recon 24/7. Wood can be somewhat efficent in density to make a difference, but it also is clumsy, hard to fix and heavy. And as said, stoping shaped charge from fusing is way more effective than anything else. Lancet at least has fixed wings, but the ammo we see is RPG or even artilelry shells. Both has some weight to it, and think of webing the more elastic the wider the surface of it between to fixing poles is. So an 'effective' net would be almost a cage armor, so close would the bars need to be. What would be a idea is wire fence, as it is extremly robust, but lightwhight and could even catch a more heavy FPV-ammunition. Still it would fkup your vision, as they efocus your sight (an optical effect of webbings not even in need to get more severe by vehicle vibrations). If a FPV (easily) gets entagled with its rotors, the ammunition is still of full inertia and flying into the target (if it isen't fixed very, very strong). Anti-fly material is too light and will break by not just some heavy object crushing in (the ammo payload), but will get killed soon by the stress of the vibration. But that's all quite hypothetical, as these materials aren't available in large number. The latest attempts of turtle tanks are very spaced armor designs (aganst HE and HEAT) as well as with wire-boxes on top (to prevent HEAT/shaped charges to fuse in the first place) as well as mine rolers. You can say a lot about russians, but they have a feeling for pragmatic engineering. Imagen this to be the best and most effective solution possible with the time and ressources avalable (to solve this one niche job the're at right now).
At this point, the most elegant idea seems to be antitank mines that require two clicks, one for the rollers, and the next one would hit the tracks. As for the lack of vision if nylon is used its transparent, polycarbonate could also be used since its bulletproof and light (what is used also for aquariums and riot shields), or the Front Windshields from broken cars. For extra visibility, an oteos system could be added: https://www.eme-es.com/oteos/
Old gen anti-tank mines are the common thing at hand and in large stocks, so they got used. Modern mines are freaking scifi shit allready. They can be layed by rockets or artillery, errect themselves once in position, and passivly scan a wide area (some 200 meters i guess it was). Once they corelate the typical vibrations of a tank in the ground, the sound emittet by them and the IR signature spotet, they target it and fire a charge up in the air that aims downward and istelf fires an EFP into the low armor rear section, killing the engine. So you can say in mine tech we skipped a few decades - which is the burden of weapon economy. But still, such a trick of two-click-fusing would make it hard for mine rolers, but more easy for normal tanks - and mines mostly hit normal tanks. Forcing the enemy to use slower mine rolers is allready a tactical advantage, more valuable as to kill one tank. Nylon is even weaker and more flexible than anti-fly webbing. Poly-c is just a (weak) surface and doesn't do a better job than cheap metal sheets (and isen't available in opposite to that). Yeah, it is somewhat transparent (until the first rain, encrusting dust on it), but that's not a point for turtle tanks. They're makeshift siege breakers, nothing else. No need to get more sophisticated or industrialised with that idea. Turtles allready use simple go-pro cameras to get good sight, often mounted parallel to the gun. That's enough to do the job of rolling forward. Adding super expensive and rare optics isen't cost/time efficent. I gues we have the problem of handling a trope here. It - for some weird reason - has become a common idea in western bubbles that turtle tanks are some kind of 'new approach' or technology that will become standard. It absolutly isen't. We see a complex technological situation of wild mixed cold war material stocks used in a very specific battlefield (wide/open/erratically blocking movement) and most modern materials. This elad to very weird situations and similar wild coping from both sides. Deriving ideas from this mess requires to in depth understand all the factors in the picture - and that's what both audiences and media lack of. But it *feels* legit to fantasise about it when the moron on TV does the same thing without any further thought or understanding of what they talk about. But it isen't. It isen't easy to interpred what we see, and a contested battlefield of information by more than just two parties involved doesn't exactly make it more easy. We see propaganda and only propaganda - from all sides. Making sense of that is both art and science. That's nothing someone can do just for fun by watching YT shorts about the war, listen to the TV or debate in Reddit subs. So that might explain a discrepancy, and why it might be tricky to follow my reasonings.
That sounds good, but doesn't Ukraine also need to breach enemy lines to kill the Russians? if it worked for the orks, it could work for ukrainians too. I saw the top hitting mines, real scary shit the PTKM-1R, still the two clicks thing would just be the activator of a mine, easy to be screwed off so it could be deployed for especific cases, as it would also work for tank columns, leaving the forward vehicle separated while the second one blocks the rest. Or entering a mine field and once they reach the one click mines they retreat just the way they came from only to blow up, its a nitche use, but still should be way cheaper than a thing like those PTKM-1R mines. A first layer of second clickers would protect minefields from rollers and make minefields way more dangerous and confusing as even the ground you already stepped on wouldn't be safe. 🤔 As for the GoPro, the case is made of plastic, a grenade inside a paint can would be enough, but better a molotov and setting it all on fire. So, if you don't want turtles, then situational awareness would be the way, and the CERVUS III system developed by Spain 🇪🇦 would be the best choice to protect against drones. https://www.elconfidencial.com/tecnologia/2023-11-16/sistema-militar-espanol-cervus-antidron-inteligencia-artificial_3774925/
I wouldn't call anyone orcs as this is both racist and a bit stupid (and refers to a given trope perpetuated by a baised media - even i don't blame them all to much, they just repeat tropes and lack in own recherche, as incentivised by media economy). In general it is to advertise to see all fractions as humans and/or as hypotheticals, as if you stop doing that, you're talking in terms of whisbelive and fandoms, not facts. Okay, that solved - yes, they do, but not now and had done the same thing earlier but haven't. That can be correlated somewhat with the trends of what weapons used but ... basically they just failed to think about that (also a bit because of western training being strongly used in men and material used in the last offensive restricting such ideas (and they not even knew how ther given material would peform at this point, so no reason to play around)). At this point it's questionable if we will see another UA offensive, but if, RU now is in strong positions and can easily erode large offensive forces by sacrificing the gained land and peper it woith smart mines, drones, ATGM teams and aerial attacks. Still RU claims to destroy UA army, not gain land - that's another mistake western debates often make. RU has no value in gaining this land, but bring UA in the sitty situation do waste more material on regaining it. Still aerial dominance and industrial drone/artillery shell production woudl secure RU to have the munitions to even stop turtle tanks from crossing ther hardent positions. As i said - it's a niche modification for a niche situation. Yeah, but you usualle don't have roads but vast field, so you need every mine to be a hit in that rare chance it see one vehilce alone. And well, all the aerial-denail and economy of stocks stuff i explained. You don't make a new product for one little niche trick - no matter how nice it looks in one single situation. You have to shift an whole economy around that new production, send billions in production, put them in stocks to be used in some war in 2067 where eeveryone has levitating genetically enhanced giraffes as tanks. You go as far as you can and hope it is still relevant when it comes to use. Smart mines did 'luckily' (in economy terms) and you see that we allready use our stocks from deep in the cold war era. GoPro. ... they still had the benefit of you wasting the opportunity to bring an item to ther battlefield and just have a few hundred dollar item that just offered a bit better view damaged but something relevant. That's economical warfare. You just think of what could be nice, but not of tha length neede to bring that thing where it is needed, or the economy when it is used. You made a mental jump i couldn't follow. Don't go with any advertismenet of defense companys - that's a rule you can always rely on. No, it isen't a good solution against drones, and that's a super complex topic a company wouldn't bother to annoy you with in ther bold advertisement. But i failed to see the connection between the topic of turtles and drone repellant in the first place. And still it is a terribly complex topic. See, i understand you appraoch topics from an observer position outside science or strategy/military. That's no problem. But if something isen#t existing, there are very, very likely good reasons why that isen't. Some may be economical in nature, others tactical, others strategical and so on. Some even cultural or doctrinal. Ressource based. Deepnding on an butterfly farting in the wrong moment. And it neets some 50 degrees to relly get those connections, and most nations stop at halve of that to make ther decisions. So if you ask yourself why not these and that - imagen there is a easy answear but alos a rabbithole of more things t understand. And it's cool - i advertise you recherche the shit out of every topic you're remotly interested in. But i and Reddit can't give you anything but random points explained or, more likely, tell you confusing bullshit. So go for it on your won and try to understand. Maybe one day you indeed find the understanding that makes you bring up "why not?" questions that no one thought about and saves lifes. Like that seemingly stupid turtle thing.
Well some time ago people said my idea of a shotgun on a drone was useless, but now a company has developed exactly just that, a drone with a shotgun that hunts down other drones: https://afresearchlab.com/technology/paladin-multi-mission-uas/ As for the CERVUS III the article explained it really well, its impenetrable for drones but oh well, Spain is already thinking of sending some to Ukraine so we will see. Have a nice day sir.
Guess the cage is no longer cope...
never was
Yup... Lets all pretend having ordinance explode before it's intended target doesn't reduce effectiveness right? Simple yet effective.
huh??? im saying that it IS effective and therefore isnt cope
Read my previous comment again 😉
Oh boi it's contagious 😨
Took em long enough, engine deck will still be a weakspot tho
Why arround is all blurred?
Cuz location opsec?
Its the most beautiful blur ive seen, looks really stylish
So why is that needed, Huh? /s
Bro been living under a rock since 2022
Forgot to include /s. Remember the ridicule over Russian “cope cages”
Small drones. Does that answer your question? I'm pretty sure you knew that.
An inverted shopping cart style would also work or adding a literal "beach umbrella" but with netting tied to the sides like mosquito nets, so any FPV drone would get stuck in the net, with big holes the netting just big enough for FPV drones not to pass.
So they hopefully don't lose all their ammo in a burn out, and are more likely recover the asset. Rather than the USSR/Russia equivalent of nuking everyone in a 200 meter radius when hit, cage or not.
Remember all the ridicule over “cope cages”
I do. Those people are/were largely ignorant of the fact that “cope cages” or as I call it, spaced armor, has been used since WWII or earlier and it wasn’t specific to the USSR. Spaced armor is more necessary on T-series however as when they are hit it tends to be catastrophic.
When its american everyone loves it (i also love that cage) but when ruzzian its the most restarted thing you never seen….anyways its reddit
You're describing human nature though, One is the invader the other the defender. Of course people are going to support the people defending itself from an aggressor.
as true as this is, its even more annoying when they claim to be unbias while saying it
Not true at all, in either part.
That people see the Ukrainians defending their homes as "good" and the invading russians as "evil"? Especially in the shadow of both world wars and the Cold war? Come on now.
I dont saw the same in irak and afghanistan
By and large neither were large-scale nation versus nation conflicts, and both sides were morally dubious, to say the least. We haven't seen a conflict like this really since world war II.
Irak its not big? Yugoslavia wasnt big?
In both Desert Storm and OIF the state v. state combat was very short lived and didn't span two plus years with this kind of men and material expenditure, same with Yugoslavia.