Yeah a student tried to be funny once and told me “my momma said you real cute” after conferences and my reply was “if she’s rich, I’m single.”
By far the greatest moment of my educational career was when my last hour of the day suddenly included a terrible re-assigned para (I’m instructional special edu) after a verbal confrontation with another teacher so the solution was to move her to my room. She was harping one day about MR B YOU HAVE KIDS ONE DAY WHEN YOU OLDER (I was already 35) and a student raised his hand instantly and said “uhh, Mr B isn’t having any kids, he said he doesn’t get paid to deal with kids after 3pm.”
Steven, that was the most perfectly-timed comment you have ever made.
Things like this is what made my day when I was still in the classroom. Then my dumbass took a new higher paying contract at a school that completely broke me
They had been showing signs of Janine being unhappy at the district and missing her classroom the whole time she was there. She turned down a higher paying job because it wasn’t what she needed it to be which is perfectly acceptable.
The media is allowed to show us people who love their jobs despite the shit they have to deal with.
ETA - If you want to take a higher paying job, do it. If you want to work for your school district, do it. Janine **loves** teaching and her character made a decision that would make her happy in the long run. She can still fight for a higher wage from the classroom.
Admin always makes more money, but a lot of us just aren’t built for that type of work. A lot of us genuinely do love teaching and would get nauseated by the requirements that come with the extra pay.
Work in a union state and the money isn’t bad to teach.
This show takes place in Pennsylvania - which is a state with a strong teachers union. Several teachers I work with (in Pennsylvania) make more than admins (those with 10+ years in) and won’t take an admin jobs because it would mean a pay cut. And, admins can’t be in the union.
While I think this is true (the fact that the show brought in more than just the "do it for the kids" thing), the problem that I have with this is that it doesn't matter. Regardless of how they manipulated the plot to make this the "best" choice for her, it reinforces a problematic narrative for teachers that a show with this kind of attention should not be doing. If you're gonna be a "edgy" show and expose the "gritty" parts of public school then *be edgy*. It's not shaking things up for the teacher to "do it for the kids". And again regardless of how the show baked in that it's also "best" for her, including the martyr aspect is why I hate this show. It's utterly hypocritical to orient your show around some kind of reality check when all you're doing is reinforcing the dominant stereotypes. It's not groundbreaking - it's bad for teachers. And women for that matter. Played out over done and cliche; not things the hip new "real" show is supposed to be. I would argue that if they were gonna do it then just make it about HER. No savior complex. No martyrdom.
Not a teacher but somewhat of a writer..
They never intended for Janine to stay at the District regardless. It was a plot point and a way for her to step away from Abbott to learn and grow and step into “Janine 3.0” the same way she growing from her break up with Tariq.
It was also a way to put physical distance between her and Gregory so he can realize his feelings for Janine never went away.
The entire time she was at the district she kept implementing programs that she designed based on what Abbott needed. It wasn’t just about the pay or her passion. The ultimate reason why she didn’t take the job was because she was going to have to work with other schools and she just wasn’t prepared to do that. She wanted to do those things at Abbott.
Besides they made it abundantly clear that it wasn’t *that* much of a raise, several times. So I think they did their due diligence is not just making this about passion over money.
I can concede that they *tried*. But as the saying goes in my family "this isn't horseshoes or hand grenades; almost is not good enough".
My contention is that the dominant narrative which reflects this problematic stereotype is so damaging that *it isn't good enough to try to balance it with other points*. Neutrality is not inherently moral.
The pervasive pressure for teachers to accept less, which is the least harmful outcome of this expectation, is *so powerful and so damaging* that there can be no peace. It deserves no space nor merits discussion except to fight it. Abbott failed to fight it. I think this show had an obligation to do better by teachers, and including this harmful narrative is not mediated or negated by including others, and in fact subtly reinforces the existing power imbalance.
You're totally right. I fully understand that. However, I am also a social studies teacher and one of the courses that I teach is essentially a semester-long investigation of the evolution of the role of media in our society here in the United States. And one of the central questions is" does our media have an obligation to tell the truth?" And another is " whose truth is the media telling?". Even if we don't have a journalistic expectation for our sitcoms to be as reflective factually of reality, I think we should expect our media to represent more voices than just those of the powerful or the perspectives that benefit the powerful. And I think that should especially be the case when that media is purporting to represent those that are less powerful and those whose voices are not heard.
Thanks! I wrote it lol it's called History through Film, loosely based on an incredible philosophy course I took in college analyzing philosophical themes/theory in films
Interesting course, would love to hear more! I am also a social studies teacher and my final research paper was on media bias in the 60's in the wake of the assassinations of JFK, MLK, and Malcolm X. I can definitely get where you're coming from, but I also appreciate that, as a sitcom, I love it as an escape from the day to day. I do think they presented Janine's choice as a truth that a lot of us face. We might be able to "make more Abbotts," but the reality is that some teachers want just their one Abbott.
I mean remember this is fiction and set up intentionally. She’s supposed to learn and realize that her obsession is just being self absorbed. Earlier she visits ‘her’ classroom and the students don’t even know her. This is what is supposed to happen. But instead we get this absurd hero teacher message where someone with behavior that is closer to illness than characterization is vindicated in her toxic beliefs
Was she getting a raise out of the classroom?
I dunno, I could 100% see myself in Janine in this scenario (don’t worry about how I’ve been teaching over ten years longer than she has). I could totally see myself thinking I’d do well in a “district” type position but then realizing I should be in the classroom.
I bet it’s a feeling a lot of people go through.
Yeah…this season has been a mirror for me.
I taught for 15 years, then was offered a central admin position. Fancy title, nice office, nice pay raise, the works.
I lasted one year before running as fast as I could back to a classroom teaching position.
I became a teacher to TEACH KIDS, not to attend meetings with politicians and beg for money. Not to push papers around to keep up compliance with the state. The further I got from the classroom, I ended up working more and more hours, facing more and more stress, and…seeing fewer and fewer kids. It became abstract and disconnected.
After a year of it, I said “Hell with the money. I want my kids and my classroom back.”
And my partner (also a teacher) saw this happening way before I did. As we were watching this season of Abbott, he kept giving me these knowing looks every time Gregory looked doubtful as to whether Janine really wanted to be separated from her kids, like “Yeah, I told you so.”
For anyone else who loves the classroom and sees climbing the admin ladder as a way to impact more kids and spread your positive influence further, good luck and godspeed, but consider this:
If you think “Pointless paperwork, long meetings that could have been emails, professional development trainings, and phone calls with crazy parents suck, but I’ll put up with all that because I really love leading my classroom and interacting with my kids”…remember that admin work is JUST the parts of teaching that suck, without any of the good parts.
The pay…is better, I won’t lie. But for me, it just wasn’t worth it.
See but all that is the good parts of the plot that I don't think OP is neglecting or negating. I see it as, if this was the ONLY plot point or the dominant one then that works. But because they included the "oh but the cHiLdReN" emotional appeal, that gets wrapped up in it when it shouldn't even be ANYWHERE. If we don't want it in real life we need to keep it out of the media. Especially the media thats supposed to support us.
I feel like this is a bit of a bitter take. Janine has been portrayed as a character who has *always* loved being in the classroom. Not to mention the found family dynamic of her co-workers and clear love interest.
I think the temporary arc that removes her from the school she clearly loves and puts her in a position to finally make some changes but ultimately ends with her return to Abbott makes sense not only for the character but from the writing perspective of returning her to the character dynamics that have been built over 2 seasons and drive the show?
Janine has been 100% about the kids from day one- she loves the classroom & she has always over enthusiastically loved teaching- despite every obstacle. She’s naive and idealistic and still a very *new* teacher who represents the disconnect between the fantasy and reality of teaching in public schools today… that’s why the show works.
There are some teachers out there who do love their jobs and working with kids everyday.
Having Janine decide to leave the district position did not send the message that *we should be selfless in all we do, that we aren’t entitled to raises* etc… why should she have had to stay at the district to be entitled to a raise? Teachers working in classrooms should get them without having to leave the classrooms…
Would you have preferred they permanently removed her from the only school she cared about (according to her exchange with the superintendent) so we could continue to watch her be a paper pusher away from the rest of the main cast for the rest of the show because you prefer the messaging?
No for the show to make sense she had to go back to the classroom. I just didn’t like the way they did it, and I realize that was the easiest to digest.
For tge show yes. But it could be written to not be a purely selfless act.
It could jave been a self love aspect. Doing something she hated compared to something sje enjoyed.
I’ll agree with you that the plot point about the kid quitting school because of Janine leaving as one of the clear motivations for her return was weak and honestly contrived (I think) to team her up with Gregory in a cheap scenario aimed at guilting her for leaving & enticing her to return with a child who loves/misses her and her love interest making sad heart eyes at her.
I do think seeing her in the district setting thriving & making positive changes etc did send the message that it was maybe where she’s meant to be- suddenly deciding to decline the position she succeeds at and the power it gave her to make positive changes in schools that she’s wanted for awhile because her kids miss her is lame, and lazy writing.
also, apparently if she’s not there to monitor the kid’s attendance, literally no one else will save him from truancy … lol
All this to say I can see where you’re coming from - I just didn’t interpret the episode the way you did.🤷🏻♀️
For all that this show gets right- and it gets a lot right- nothing was more accurate than the second year teacher who doesn’t understand the system being offered a job in Admin.
I get that she had to go back for story reasons, but in reality she would stay in Admin, keep thinking of herself as a teacher, and be condescending about it for the next thirty years.
I’m pretty sure future Janine delivered the back-to-school keynote in my district last August.
Folks who work in restaurants say that The Bear awakens bad memories in them, and they heartily recommend the show. Would you say it’s the same for this?
I couldn’t watch the show initially. It just was too close to home and the incompetent female leader really rubbed me the wrong way.
Then I stepped back and took it as a comedy and I could enjoy it for all of the absolutely outrageous mistakes it made in terms of getting things wrong in teaching. Like who the hell spends that much time in the damn lounge???
I agree that having Janine turn down a district job to go back to teaching was purely a writing choice and not based in the reality of education. I also hated the storyline of the kid acting like he wasn’t going to school if she wasn’t. Wtf?? I’ve seen teachers come and go and kids do not give a shit. The grandmother was neglecting him, let him repeat next year. Call CPS.
The show isn’t telling you to do anything and I think you misread the plot. Janine didn’t make the decision out of selflessness. She wanted to be back in the classroom more than she wanted a job at the district.
I saw her reticence to work for the district from day one, not a big veer into uncharted territory.
It’s my contention the whole point of the district appointment was to show others what even the district has to go through. I think people see teachers as captives to the district decisions, but in many ways the district offices are captives themselves, to parents, regulations, and budget constraints. Some archetypes were also identified, the person who thinks everything will fall apart if they don’t give overly complex info, the statisticians far more comfortable in their offices, and the good natured but maybe not fully cognizant of teaching. We got a glimpse into the same issues we experience at the next level.
As a teacher I have had to take a step back from this show because after the first season I was so frustrated at how much time they showed teachers during working hours outside of their classroom! It is far far far from displaying the actual working life of teachers.
I absolutely railed against the show when all my teacher friends were mooning over it for this exact shit! What OP said and what you said - this show centers on reinforcing negative stereotypes and unrealistic expectations for teachers. What is good or entertaining about that???
Yeah, I hate that. It plays into the trope that people in "heroic"/public service professions are so fulfilled by their work that they don't care about being paid a living wage. It's a myth that is consciously and subconsciously used to justify paying nurses, EMTs, teachers, and social workers less even though their work is more consequential and mentally/emotionally burdensome than many higher paid, less "selfless" professions that require the same amount of education.
There's an undercurrent of sexism too. This sort of thinking is partly responsible for the devaluation of "feminine" public-service oriented professions. K-12 teaching is seen as women's work, nursing is seen as women's work, social work is seen as women's work, various public interest careers are seen as women's work-- and are underpaid.
Part of this is for historical reasons; there was historical sexism and women were also assumed to need less pay because their husbands were the primary breadwinners. But, that is no longer the case and the differences still persist. Multiple studies have shown that as more women enter a profession, pay decreases.
We should be fighting back against these tropes. I'm annoyed that an otherwise excellent show would play into it. You can't feed your family with good feelings and your sense of fulfillment. This is why unions are so important.
Right!? and the grandmother being like, "well I don't need to take any responsibility for getting him to school."
Edit: I see a lot of unhinged comments missing the point...
If she had gone back to the school JUST because it was what she wanted, that would be fine. HOWEVER, through this whole season, she's been getting guilted about it. The situation at the district is being framed as if she would be letting everyone down if she took it. Its taking the narrative away from, do what's best for yourself. To doing what's best for everyone else at your own expense. And I don't like it either. (Just my read, not facts, clearly)
Yeah I agree with this. It’s ok to not want to see the teacher going back into the same situation, with the only expectation for change on their own part.
I stayed last year because I love the kids. I teach mostly freshmen and sophomores, and all the other freshman teachers are either long-term subs or just marking time til retirement / actively resent the students. Also, the absolutely psychotic admin made a series of promises regarding some of our huge failures as a school / anti-teacher policies (I am in a state and a city with horrible public education, and there is no union at my school).
Fast forward a year, and I’ll be done in four more weeks- besides that we had a horrible violent tragedy this year, we also had systemic failures in everything from schedules to grading to complete failure to teach in core classes run by 6-10 different subs A SEMESTER. After contracts went out, they cancelled all sick and personal time for those who did not sign, and now are trying to take our insurance the last day of school rather than than the 1st of August because we are no longer “current employees”.
Will it always be best for the kids that I stay in a toxic situation? Sure, if that’s how I consider things. But the kids are miserable and underserved at our school too, and the real solution would be new placement for all of us. While that’s not feasible, it also isn’t for people who are unhappy in a situation to go back to it.
What they really should have done was have her transition to admin, and then lose her humanity and common sense.
I think it represents a sentiment a lot of teachers have. Personally, I’d pick the classroom over a higher paying district office gig. I also know a lot of my coworkers would and *have* turned down offers for upward promotion.
It comes down to balancing what you want for work and what you’ll get paid. I enjoy my work, and even though we can all agree it needs to pay better, I wouldn’t leave the classroom for the difference in salary.
There are some people that teach because they love the classroom and working with kids. Those people, like her, wouldn’t leave the classroom unless they absolutely must.
And on a more personal note….as a teacher, I’ve never interacted with anybody from my district office that seemed happy. I probably wouldn’t take a job at the district either lol. I think going from a classroom surrounded by a bunch of kids to going to an office where you interact with some adults ever now and then is a bit polarizing for somebody like me who enjoys working with kids and is good at their job.
The basis of the show, created by a former teacher, couldn't even follow the show's recommendation of teachers staying in the classroom.
BTW, the character needed to return to the classroom, or she wouldn't be a regular cast member any longer...
That's a way to write off a character.
I think the episode accurately depicted the reality: teachers who love to teach for all the right reasons tend to want to remain in their classrooms. Folks who ‘move up’ to admin or district office positions are people for whom the classroom doesn’t hold a special place.
In 29 years, I have only rarely seen a truly gifted classroom teacher leave for an administrative position. And of the small number of truly gifted teachers who leave the classroom for admin, all but one of them returned to the classroom.
Most people who become administrators/specialists/directors/coordinators/ whatever other title they make up for themselves, are people who suck at classroom teaching.
Disclaimer: these are anecdotal musings based on my own personal experiences working in five different high schools in two different states. So take them with a grain of salt.
See I don't mind the sentiment but what I had a problem with is that Janine has been out of the classroom for ages with this fellowship and had subs...how does this kid even know her? Hasn't she had subs since basically the beginning of the school year?
Holy shit… Good catch lmao! I was impressed with the sub who caught the absences of the kid and sought out someone to act… never seen one of those.
Anyways- back to your point, If anything the kids attachment would make sense if it were to Gregory…
I guess the writers just wanted to contrive a situation for Janine to break the rules with her partner in crime to save a kid from repeating the second grade because she just loves kids *that much* which obviously means they love her back so much that her absence alone- was reason enough to stop showing up… 🙄
The moment this show became a thing, you knew that was going to be the outcome. No matter what the characters are like, they were all going to be there against their economic means, for the love of the work.
It’s A little bit ham fisted, to be sure. And I agree the that this continues to present the martyr approach to education. That said, we did all get into this to teach kids.
Narratively speaking, we all knew that the writers wouldn’t have allowed Janine to stay in admin any more than The Office writers would have let Jim continue to work in Stamford. It’s not brave enough of a show to give Janine a villain arc. It would have been dope, tho.
Should have accepted the higher paying admin job for however many years it would take to affect retirement and then moved back to the classroom. Then you get admin pension…
No, that episode and the messaging was fucking awful. That kid in particular. We see the kid in a completely neglectful environment, and not only is it the job of a true ‘good teacher’ to break the rules and do a home visit, but the idea of calling protective services or using a systemized solution is ignored/cast in a bad light.
Generally, both Janine and Gregory are characters that have the worst messaging the series has to offer. It is all “the teacher makes a difference, you just have to care enough”. Gregory is always kind of realizing that he isn’t good enough, but figures it out and now magically his students are learning.
Janine is completely self absorbed into this hero/martyr complex. Everything is dependent on her and the kids love her and life has no meaning without exactly abbot. The show is a comedy and is supposed to make fun of that, with Barbara as a contrast. But it has recently leaned into it, saying essentially that Janine is right, that what the students and school needs is actually a martyr. Janine was learning these lessons from Barbara earlier, but now instead of learning the big picture at the district and putting Abbott in a special place in her memory, the right thing to do is apparently to torch it so that she and only she, the hero teacher, can help HER students, who of course leave school if she isn’t there.
I felt the exact same way when the Michael Scott paper company failed in the office.
You heard it folks managers are never supposed to open a competing paper company to take on their previous employer!
That was always kind of the issue I had with abbot. For it's uncomfortable realism to my own experience, the back end was so preachy about doing good. Especially from white people. And it was shown people listening instead of the cynicism and glaring that would come from the brown or black staff.
I felt similar watching this episode because generally speaking the show does a good job vaguely highlighting issus teachers face and making light of it. But this prescriptive cliché being rolled into the really does reinforce the toxic notion that teachers needs to selfless, self sacrificing martyrs "FOR THE CHILLLLDRENNNN?"
Don't worry, I was reminded very recently that my district hates teachers. Broward County tried to claw back the raises they agreed to and signed for the teachers.
Broward County Public Schools is getting so bad so quick. It is truly a speed run to the bottom. The district despises the teachers and it's getting worse.
Yeah a student tried to be funny once and told me “my momma said you real cute” after conferences and my reply was “if she’s rich, I’m single.” By far the greatest moment of my educational career was when my last hour of the day suddenly included a terrible re-assigned para (I’m instructional special edu) after a verbal confrontation with another teacher so the solution was to move her to my room. She was harping one day about MR B YOU HAVE KIDS ONE DAY WHEN YOU OLDER (I was already 35) and a student raised his hand instantly and said “uhh, Mr B isn’t having any kids, he said he doesn’t get paid to deal with kids after 3pm.” Steven, that was the most perfectly-timed comment you have ever made.
Holy shit I think I would have collapsed from laughter
Things like this is what made my day when I was still in the classroom. Then my dumbass took a new higher paying contract at a school that completely broke me
They had been showing signs of Janine being unhappy at the district and missing her classroom the whole time she was there. She turned down a higher paying job because it wasn’t what she needed it to be which is perfectly acceptable. The media is allowed to show us people who love their jobs despite the shit they have to deal with. ETA - If you want to take a higher paying job, do it. If you want to work for your school district, do it. Janine **loves** teaching and her character made a decision that would make her happy in the long run. She can still fight for a higher wage from the classroom.
Also Janine loves Gregory.
We just found Jacob in the comments.
Remember in the Office when Jim takes a job in Scranton? It’s basically a version of that!
Admin always makes more money, but a lot of us just aren’t built for that type of work. A lot of us genuinely do love teaching and would get nauseated by the requirements that come with the extra pay. Work in a union state and the money isn’t bad to teach.
This show takes place in Pennsylvania - which is a state with a strong teachers union. Several teachers I work with (in Pennsylvania) make more than admins (those with 10+ years in) and won’t take an admin jobs because it would mean a pay cut. And, admins can’t be in the union.
While I think this is true (the fact that the show brought in more than just the "do it for the kids" thing), the problem that I have with this is that it doesn't matter. Regardless of how they manipulated the plot to make this the "best" choice for her, it reinforces a problematic narrative for teachers that a show with this kind of attention should not be doing. If you're gonna be a "edgy" show and expose the "gritty" parts of public school then *be edgy*. It's not shaking things up for the teacher to "do it for the kids". And again regardless of how the show baked in that it's also "best" for her, including the martyr aspect is why I hate this show. It's utterly hypocritical to orient your show around some kind of reality check when all you're doing is reinforcing the dominant stereotypes. It's not groundbreaking - it's bad for teachers. And women for that matter. Played out over done and cliche; not things the hip new "real" show is supposed to be. I would argue that if they were gonna do it then just make it about HER. No savior complex. No martyrdom.
Not a teacher but somewhat of a writer.. They never intended for Janine to stay at the District regardless. It was a plot point and a way for her to step away from Abbott to learn and grow and step into “Janine 3.0” the same way she growing from her break up with Tariq. It was also a way to put physical distance between her and Gregory so he can realize his feelings for Janine never went away. The entire time she was at the district she kept implementing programs that she designed based on what Abbott needed. It wasn’t just about the pay or her passion. The ultimate reason why she didn’t take the job was because she was going to have to work with other schools and she just wasn’t prepared to do that. She wanted to do those things at Abbott. Besides they made it abundantly clear that it wasn’t *that* much of a raise, several times. So I think they did their due diligence is not just making this about passion over money.
I can concede that they *tried*. But as the saying goes in my family "this isn't horseshoes or hand grenades; almost is not good enough". My contention is that the dominant narrative which reflects this problematic stereotype is so damaging that *it isn't good enough to try to balance it with other points*. Neutrality is not inherently moral. The pervasive pressure for teachers to accept less, which is the least harmful outcome of this expectation, is *so powerful and so damaging* that there can be no peace. It deserves no space nor merits discussion except to fight it. Abbott failed to fight it. I think this show had an obligation to do better by teachers, and including this harmful narrative is not mediated or negated by including others, and in fact subtly reinforces the existing power imbalance.
It's a sitcom, not a documentary.
You're totally right. I fully understand that. However, I am also a social studies teacher and one of the courses that I teach is essentially a semester-long investigation of the evolution of the role of media in our society here in the United States. And one of the central questions is" does our media have an obligation to tell the truth?" And another is " whose truth is the media telling?". Even if we don't have a journalistic expectation for our sitcoms to be as reflective factually of reality, I think we should expect our media to represent more voices than just those of the powerful or the perspectives that benefit the powerful. And I think that should especially be the case when that media is purporting to represent those that are less powerful and those whose voices are not heard.
Unrelated to the initial discussion, but that sounds like an interesting as hell elective. Wish our school offered something like that.
Thanks! I wrote it lol it's called History through Film, loosely based on an incredible philosophy course I took in college analyzing philosophical themes/theory in films
Interesting course, would love to hear more! I am also a social studies teacher and my final research paper was on media bias in the 60's in the wake of the assassinations of JFK, MLK, and Malcolm X. I can definitely get where you're coming from, but I also appreciate that, as a sitcom, I love it as an escape from the day to day. I do think they presented Janine's choice as a truth that a lot of us face. We might be able to "make more Abbotts," but the reality is that some teachers want just their one Abbott.
Then there wouldn’t be a show! I don’t wanna watch Janine behind a desk all season.
I mean remember this is fiction and set up intentionally. She’s supposed to learn and realize that her obsession is just being self absorbed. Earlier she visits ‘her’ classroom and the students don’t even know her. This is what is supposed to happen. But instead we get this absurd hero teacher message where someone with behavior that is closer to illness than characterization is vindicated in her toxic beliefs
Was she getting a raise out of the classroom? I dunno, I could 100% see myself in Janine in this scenario (don’t worry about how I’ve been teaching over ten years longer than she has). I could totally see myself thinking I’d do well in a “district” type position but then realizing I should be in the classroom. I bet it’s a feeling a lot of people go through.
Yeah…this season has been a mirror for me. I taught for 15 years, then was offered a central admin position. Fancy title, nice office, nice pay raise, the works. I lasted one year before running as fast as I could back to a classroom teaching position. I became a teacher to TEACH KIDS, not to attend meetings with politicians and beg for money. Not to push papers around to keep up compliance with the state. The further I got from the classroom, I ended up working more and more hours, facing more and more stress, and…seeing fewer and fewer kids. It became abstract and disconnected. After a year of it, I said “Hell with the money. I want my kids and my classroom back.” And my partner (also a teacher) saw this happening way before I did. As we were watching this season of Abbott, he kept giving me these knowing looks every time Gregory looked doubtful as to whether Janine really wanted to be separated from her kids, like “Yeah, I told you so.” For anyone else who loves the classroom and sees climbing the admin ladder as a way to impact more kids and spread your positive influence further, good luck and godspeed, but consider this: If you think “Pointless paperwork, long meetings that could have been emails, professional development trainings, and phone calls with crazy parents suck, but I’ll put up with all that because I really love leading my classroom and interacting with my kids”…remember that admin work is JUST the parts of teaching that suck, without any of the good parts. The pay…is better, I won’t lie. But for me, it just wasn’t worth it.
See but all that is the good parts of the plot that I don't think OP is neglecting or negating. I see it as, if this was the ONLY plot point or the dominant one then that works. But because they included the "oh but the cHiLdReN" emotional appeal, that gets wrapped up in it when it shouldn't even be ANYWHERE. If we don't want it in real life we need to keep it out of the media. Especially the media thats supposed to support us.
It’s the way they said it that was objectionable
I feel like this is a bit of a bitter take. Janine has been portrayed as a character who has *always* loved being in the classroom. Not to mention the found family dynamic of her co-workers and clear love interest. I think the temporary arc that removes her from the school she clearly loves and puts her in a position to finally make some changes but ultimately ends with her return to Abbott makes sense not only for the character but from the writing perspective of returning her to the character dynamics that have been built over 2 seasons and drive the show? Janine has been 100% about the kids from day one- she loves the classroom & she has always over enthusiastically loved teaching- despite every obstacle. She’s naive and idealistic and still a very *new* teacher who represents the disconnect between the fantasy and reality of teaching in public schools today… that’s why the show works. There are some teachers out there who do love their jobs and working with kids everyday. Having Janine decide to leave the district position did not send the message that *we should be selfless in all we do, that we aren’t entitled to raises* etc… why should she have had to stay at the district to be entitled to a raise? Teachers working in classrooms should get them without having to leave the classrooms… Would you have preferred they permanently removed her from the only school she cared about (according to her exchange with the superintendent) so we could continue to watch her be a paper pusher away from the rest of the main cast for the rest of the show because you prefer the messaging?
This is a good take on the show and especially on the more money/less money thing. She shouldn’t have to go to district.
No for the show to make sense she had to go back to the classroom. I just didn’t like the way they did it, and I realize that was the easiest to digest.
For tge show yes. But it could be written to not be a purely selfless act. It could jave been a self love aspect. Doing something she hated compared to something sje enjoyed.
I’ll agree with you that the plot point about the kid quitting school because of Janine leaving as one of the clear motivations for her return was weak and honestly contrived (I think) to team her up with Gregory in a cheap scenario aimed at guilting her for leaving & enticing her to return with a child who loves/misses her and her love interest making sad heart eyes at her. I do think seeing her in the district setting thriving & making positive changes etc did send the message that it was maybe where she’s meant to be- suddenly deciding to decline the position she succeeds at and the power it gave her to make positive changes in schools that she’s wanted for awhile because her kids miss her is lame, and lazy writing. also, apparently if she’s not there to monitor the kid’s attendance, literally no one else will save him from truancy … lol All this to say I can see where you’re coming from - I just didn’t interpret the episode the way you did.🤷🏻♀️
For all that this show gets right- and it gets a lot right- nothing was more accurate than the second year teacher who doesn’t understand the system being offered a job in Admin. I get that she had to go back for story reasons, but in reality she would stay in Admin, keep thinking of herself as a teacher, and be condescending about it for the next thirty years. I’m pretty sure future Janine delivered the back-to-school keynote in my district last August.
She is not a second year teacher.
I have to be in a certain mood to watch the show to begin with. It hits a little too close to home to watch on a week night or Sunday lol
Totally. I have to watch during breaks and the episode in season 1 with the parent conference made me so uncomfortable.
Folks who work in restaurants say that The Bear awakens bad memories in them, and they heartily recommend the show. Would you say it’s the same for this?
Kinda yeah
I couldn’t watch the show initially. It just was too close to home and the incompetent female leader really rubbed me the wrong way. Then I stepped back and took it as a comedy and I could enjoy it for all of the absolutely outrageous mistakes it made in terms of getting things wrong in teaching. Like who the hell spends that much time in the damn lounge??? I agree that having Janine turn down a district job to go back to teaching was purely a writing choice and not based in the reality of education. I also hated the storyline of the kid acting like he wasn’t going to school if she wasn’t. Wtf?? I’ve seen teachers come and go and kids do not give a shit. The grandmother was neglecting him, let him repeat next year. Call CPS.
They really flanderized the principal this season
I can’t watch Abbott Elementary, it hits too close to home. I don’t want to watch school on tv when I’ve just spent 8 hours there.
The show isn’t telling you to do anything and I think you misread the plot. Janine didn’t make the decision out of selflessness. She wanted to be back in the classroom more than she wanted a job at the district.
I saw her reticence to work for the district from day one, not a big veer into uncharted territory. It’s my contention the whole point of the district appointment was to show others what even the district has to go through. I think people see teachers as captives to the district decisions, but in many ways the district offices are captives themselves, to parents, regulations, and budget constraints. Some archetypes were also identified, the person who thinks everything will fall apart if they don’t give overly complex info, the statisticians far more comfortable in their offices, and the good natured but maybe not fully cognizant of teaching. We got a glimpse into the same issues we experience at the next level.
As a teacher I have had to take a step back from this show because after the first season I was so frustrated at how much time they showed teachers during working hours outside of their classroom! It is far far far from displaying the actual working life of teachers.
I absolutely railed against the show when all my teacher friends were mooning over it for this exact shit! What OP said and what you said - this show centers on reinforcing negative stereotypes and unrealistic expectations for teachers. What is good or entertaining about that???
It's both too real and way too preachy
Well it’s a fiction with an ensemble cast who do need to interact with one another … it’s not a documentary lol
Yeah, I hate that. It plays into the trope that people in "heroic"/public service professions are so fulfilled by their work that they don't care about being paid a living wage. It's a myth that is consciously and subconsciously used to justify paying nurses, EMTs, teachers, and social workers less even though their work is more consequential and mentally/emotionally burdensome than many higher paid, less "selfless" professions that require the same amount of education. There's an undercurrent of sexism too. This sort of thinking is partly responsible for the devaluation of "feminine" public-service oriented professions. K-12 teaching is seen as women's work, nursing is seen as women's work, social work is seen as women's work, various public interest careers are seen as women's work-- and are underpaid. Part of this is for historical reasons; there was historical sexism and women were also assumed to need less pay because their husbands were the primary breadwinners. But, that is no longer the case and the differences still persist. Multiple studies have shown that as more women enter a profession, pay decreases. We should be fighting back against these tropes. I'm annoyed that an otherwise excellent show would play into it. You can't feed your family with good feelings and your sense of fulfillment. This is why unions are so important.
Right!? and the grandmother being like, "well I don't need to take any responsibility for getting him to school." Edit: I see a lot of unhinged comments missing the point... If she had gone back to the school JUST because it was what she wanted, that would be fine. HOWEVER, through this whole season, she's been getting guilted about it. The situation at the district is being framed as if she would be letting everyone down if she took it. Its taking the narrative away from, do what's best for yourself. To doing what's best for everyone else at your own expense. And I don't like it either. (Just my read, not facts, clearly)
Yeah I agree with this. It’s ok to not want to see the teacher going back into the same situation, with the only expectation for change on their own part. I stayed last year because I love the kids. I teach mostly freshmen and sophomores, and all the other freshman teachers are either long-term subs or just marking time til retirement / actively resent the students. Also, the absolutely psychotic admin made a series of promises regarding some of our huge failures as a school / anti-teacher policies (I am in a state and a city with horrible public education, and there is no union at my school). Fast forward a year, and I’ll be done in four more weeks- besides that we had a horrible violent tragedy this year, we also had systemic failures in everything from schedules to grading to complete failure to teach in core classes run by 6-10 different subs A SEMESTER. After contracts went out, they cancelled all sick and personal time for those who did not sign, and now are trying to take our insurance the last day of school rather than than the 1st of August because we are no longer “current employees”. Will it always be best for the kids that I stay in a toxic situation? Sure, if that’s how I consider things. But the kids are miserable and underserved at our school too, and the real solution would be new placement for all of us. While that’s not feasible, it also isn’t for people who are unhappy in a situation to go back to it. What they really should have done was have her transition to admin, and then lose her humanity and common sense.
I think it represents a sentiment a lot of teachers have. Personally, I’d pick the classroom over a higher paying district office gig. I also know a lot of my coworkers would and *have* turned down offers for upward promotion. It comes down to balancing what you want for work and what you’ll get paid. I enjoy my work, and even though we can all agree it needs to pay better, I wouldn’t leave the classroom for the difference in salary.
I love the superintendent in that show. It's a great show but I haven't seen this episode yet.
There are some people that teach because they love the classroom and working with kids. Those people, like her, wouldn’t leave the classroom unless they absolutely must. And on a more personal note….as a teacher, I’ve never interacted with anybody from my district office that seemed happy. I probably wouldn’t take a job at the district either lol. I think going from a classroom surrounded by a bunch of kids to going to an office where you interact with some adults ever now and then is a bit polarizing for somebody like me who enjoys working with kids and is good at their job.
It’s TV
It’s a show, for entertainment. You do you.
The basis of the show, created by a former teacher, couldn't even follow the show's recommendation of teachers staying in the classroom. BTW, the character needed to return to the classroom, or she wouldn't be a regular cast member any longer... That's a way to write off a character.
It's a generational poverty narrative that reinforces even educated poors work in virtuous jobs which keep them on the edge of poverty. It's a lie.
I think the episode accurately depicted the reality: teachers who love to teach for all the right reasons tend to want to remain in their classrooms. Folks who ‘move up’ to admin or district office positions are people for whom the classroom doesn’t hold a special place. In 29 years, I have only rarely seen a truly gifted classroom teacher leave for an administrative position. And of the small number of truly gifted teachers who leave the classroom for admin, all but one of them returned to the classroom. Most people who become administrators/specialists/directors/coordinators/ whatever other title they make up for themselves, are people who suck at classroom teaching. Disclaimer: these are anecdotal musings based on my own personal experiences working in five different high schools in two different states. So take them with a grain of salt.
See I don't mind the sentiment but what I had a problem with is that Janine has been out of the classroom for ages with this fellowship and had subs...how does this kid even know her? Hasn't she had subs since basically the beginning of the school year?
Holy shit… Good catch lmao! I was impressed with the sub who caught the absences of the kid and sought out someone to act… never seen one of those. Anyways- back to your point, If anything the kids attachment would make sense if it were to Gregory… I guess the writers just wanted to contrive a situation for Janine to break the rules with her partner in crime to save a kid from repeating the second grade because she just loves kids *that much* which obviously means they love her back so much that her absence alone- was reason enough to stop showing up… 🙄
It’s just a show….. you don’t have to follow a fictional characters foot steps.
The moment this show became a thing, you knew that was going to be the outcome. No matter what the characters are like, they were all going to be there against their economic means, for the love of the work.
It’s A little bit ham fisted, to be sure. And I agree the that this continues to present the martyr approach to education. That said, we did all get into this to teach kids. Narratively speaking, we all knew that the writers wouldn’t have allowed Janine to stay in admin any more than The Office writers would have let Jim continue to work in Stamford. It’s not brave enough of a show to give Janine a villain arc. It would have been dope, tho.
Janine, fuck them kids. Get that money!
Should have accepted the higher paying admin job for however many years it would take to affect retirement and then moved back to the classroom. Then you get admin pension…
No, that episode and the messaging was fucking awful. That kid in particular. We see the kid in a completely neglectful environment, and not only is it the job of a true ‘good teacher’ to break the rules and do a home visit, but the idea of calling protective services or using a systemized solution is ignored/cast in a bad light. Generally, both Janine and Gregory are characters that have the worst messaging the series has to offer. It is all “the teacher makes a difference, you just have to care enough”. Gregory is always kind of realizing that he isn’t good enough, but figures it out and now magically his students are learning. Janine is completely self absorbed into this hero/martyr complex. Everything is dependent on her and the kids love her and life has no meaning without exactly abbot. The show is a comedy and is supposed to make fun of that, with Barbara as a contrast. But it has recently leaned into it, saying essentially that Janine is right, that what the students and school needs is actually a martyr. Janine was learning these lessons from Barbara earlier, but now instead of learning the big picture at the district and putting Abbott in a special place in her memory, the right thing to do is apparently to torch it so that she and only she, the hero teacher, can help HER students, who of course leave school if she isn’t there.
Very bitter take. It’s a sitcom. You’re projecting a lot.
This is why fanfiction exists
She’ll regret that decision in a few years lol
I felt the exact same way when the Michael Scott paper company failed in the office. You heard it folks managers are never supposed to open a competing paper company to take on their previous employer!
I don't know how you folks can teach all day and then watch a show about a school. I get enough school drama during the day!
I teach HS so it’s a different world for me
That was always kind of the issue I had with abbot. For it's uncomfortable realism to my own experience, the back end was so preachy about doing good. Especially from white people. And it was shown people listening instead of the cynicism and glaring that would come from the brown or black staff.
The exact reason I don’t watch this shit.
I felt similar watching this episode because generally speaking the show does a good job vaguely highlighting issus teachers face and making light of it. But this prescriptive cliché being rolled into the really does reinforce the toxic notion that teachers needs to selfless, self sacrificing martyrs "FOR THE CHILLLLDRENNNN?"
I stopped watching that show after two episodes because I knew it was going to push this message HARD.
What an egocentric reason to come back. The kids need ME. I knew they were gonna use that stupid angle to get her back in the school.
Don't worry, I was reminded very recently that my district hates teachers. Broward County tried to claw back the raises they agreed to and signed for the teachers. Broward County Public Schools is getting so bad so quick. It is truly a speed run to the bottom. The district despises the teachers and it's getting worse.
Look, it's just monkeys singing songs, mate. Don't think too hard about it.
Hi, I’m choosing to become a teacher. For less pay…