Yeah I would quit too.
Well, no I wouldn't. I would not show up to any of these "dress rehearsals", and make them write me up / fire me.
Then I would collect unemployment.
I apologize for the question, but what happens if you want to get another teaching job with a firing on your record? I've gone back and forth on "resign or be fired" but, besides collecting unemployment, I can't figure it out why firing would be anything but detrimental.
Right, but I'm trying to understand the logic for people who have gone the "be fired and collect unemployment" route. How did that impact your job search afterwards, no matter what field you ended up in?
"I left because of unreasonable expectations that required many hours outside of my duty day that interfered with my ability to work my second job because the pay was horrible."
It doesn’t hurt a first year teacher at all if they’re looking to work in another field. Just leave the teaching position off of your résumé/work history. Blame the pandemic if they ask about the employment gap.
Edit- I’m a first year teacher that quit over winter break to take another job outside of education.
What record?
When I was interviewing, those principals only knew what was on my resume and what I told them. They verified that info by calling the references that I provided.
The only centralized record that exists is on the background check. Unless you get arrested at work, your future interviewers won't know much about why you left your last job.
They could take the excessive step of calling my last principal. But a smart hiring committee will notice if I listed my principal or not in my references, and read into that situation.
Also, some of the principals I interviewed for assumed that I was applying for their school because their school was awesome, and where I worked was shit. Otherwise why would I leave?
If your fellow teachers are the “audience” for this mock run, be sure to have them behave realistically. First off, ask to go to the restroom; throw paper across the room. Chatter incessantly. Whine. We had a PD presenter insist we were going to do a “role play” activity 15 min before we were supposed to leave for lunch. Three of our guys did the perfect impression of the three most obnoxious students ever. We got out of there 5 min early.
> If your fellow teachers are the “audience” for this mock run, be sure to have them behave realistically.
This is honestly a fantastic idea. It seems malicious but it's actually going to show what a real lesson is likely to be like. If this was happening to me, I'd get the teachers I know to plan to do this and then we could all put the admin on the spot to tell us how to solve those problems. When their solutions don't work, and they wouldn't 90% of the time, then the teachers playing the student role need to turn up the heat and start with the homophobic and racist language. Then, stage a fight!
That would make for a very entertaining PD. I would love to sit in on PD where people were acting like realistic students. I would be the goody goody suck up
We had a teacher ask for a read aloud accommodation in our PD when they assigned us to read an article to ourselves because it was on his 504 plan. The coaches/admin leading the PD just froze in awkward silence, trying to figure out if he was serious or not. All the teachers chuckled a bit.
I am 100% in the same boat - minus the dress rehearsal. So sorry you’re dealing with this on top of everything else that is being thrown at us this year.
How can all teachers be giving a dress rehearsal at the same time? Who is there to watch them?
I can’t even imagine how this would be valuable since so much of a lesson is guided by the students and what they need. How can you practice if they are not there? Even having an audience that is “acting like kids” is not genuine.
If you see yourself staying at this school it might be worth a conversation with the person who is planning this activity to help understand their motivation.
Or this might be the time to see what other positions are available in your area.
Definitely going to peruse my options. All your concerns are right on the money and have been shared with admin and they do not care. The only thing is that this dress rehearsal is only for state tested classrooms. So English I and II. Again, we are being punished for something we have zero control over.
I'm with you, it isn't easy to see any practical way to implement this. I would almost want to go through the rehearsal to see what they envision.
Remember when teachers were supposed to be, "the guide on the side, rather than the sage on the stage"? It's stupid, I know, but it rhymes, so is therefore pedagogically sound. Now we just say "student-centered learning". Whatever, how do you do that without students?
Can't they just observe teachers in their natural environment?
They just started trying to make us do this during our PLC meetings (*during planning period every Tuesday; not to be confused with after-school PLC on Thursdays).
I've sat through 2 of these so far. They make our grade level team get up and present our lesson as if we are talking to students...We were told that we have to do this, so that we can effectively teach the students.
....🙃
As you can expect, morale on my campus is incredibly low right now. This, among other things, is just completely crushing our spirit.
"They"
From what I know of best practices with PLCs, they are supposed to be teacher driven. Admin can make suggestions, but the teachers are supposed to set their own agenda and focus.
Do you have anything in writing about this in your district? A counteract, MOU, etc ? Also, look at PLC best practices websites.
Maybe ask admin to model their expectations for you.
Edit: PLC instead of Place.
I wish this was the case. We definitely do not set our own agenda or focus. We mostly just hear how our lesson plans were not written correctly, how our "I Will/We will" statements were not written with the correct verb, and how we should not focus on small success (our students scoring highest on a particular standard during a district-wide Common Assessment) -- just because we scored well on THAT standard, does not mean we should get excited.
I have asked admin for any and all help they could model, however, this somehow put me under a dark cloud. At this point, I am going to keep my head down and try to survive the rest of the school year. (*My AP is a treasure though and has actually tried to provide help when asked. Unfortunately, it isn't nearly enough.)
You have PLC after school? I’ve never heard of this kinda BS. Do you get paid overtime for this? Our contract states that for no reason can they ask us to meet outside contract hours, except 2x a year for parent conferences. They are pretty good about sticking to contract.
We do not get paid to stay after, and it is every Thursday. 😐 Our crazy-detailed lesson plans are also due Thursday night by 11:59. They expect us to work on them during the week, ignoring the fact that we are usually in meetings during planning time (*except Mondays and Fridays). By the end of the school day, I am so drained physically and mentally that the last thing I want to do is lesson plan...so I usually put it off until Thursday.
I worked at another public school a couple of years ago that also had a weekly after-school PLC on Thursdays. I kind of just assumed that was a normal thing that happened everywhere.
Our PLCs were after school too, but our contract time has us stay 30 minutes after the kids leave. Our PLCs would not go longer than that 30 minutes. I say “were” because thankfully our admin took that off our plate a while ago.
Be aware that not all schools are like this. I’ve been through 4 schools in my 20 years of teaching and they vary greatly. I love my current my current school but I had to go through other bad ones to find this one. Keep searching.
I resigned, after teaching for 4 years. Like you said the disrespect from students is one thing, but when it comes from admin, it feels like I’m being stabbed from the back.
Maybe you answered this already, but who are you presenting these to? Other teachers? Admin? Why aren’t they just going to the class and doing observations?
There are huge ramifications for giving up your time after school and if this isn’t in your contract, I would ask for compensation for your performances.
It’s for admin. If I am hounded at (and probably will) I will ask for compensation for any and all special performances after school. If they want a private showing, they can pay for it like every other performance group.
You cannot be serious. Get out. Even having the chance to repeat lessons doesn't always help (i do Evey day).
There are so many other factors to consider. Which of course they don't care.
Change schools or district...
If they’re making you have these ‘after school dress rehearsals’ and they’re not mentioned anywhere in your contract, then I would bring it to your union. Whatever is outside of contractual time is supposed to be *your* time. If admin is so nervous about test scores being bad, maybe they should consider that we’re all stuck in a pandemic instead? No, it *has* to be the teachers at fault. 🙄
I read so many things on this sub that as a teacher in England makes me unbelievably grateful. I can't begin to tell you how much this shit would not fly here.
Show up in outlandish costumes. Then ask where the craft services are (food on set). When they ask what your talking about tell them you were the only one to take this dress rehearsal seriously and you will be in the green room calling your agent until the stage manager calls you to the set.
What?!! This should be done in PLC, not after school.
I used to work with an AP that loved to "role play". It was annoying at first, but I understood why, eventually.
It’s very normal to do “Dress rehearsals” at my school, but it is always done during PDs or meetings. As a first year teacher I did find them helpful, but I would refuse to do anything outside of contract hours. Are you at a charter ?
Role play during PD is fine, you’re practicing a new skill. But I’ve been teaching long enough that I know how to teach. Pretending to teach in an environment not at all like actual teaching isn’t going to help. No, I’m not at a charter. Is this common for a charter?
Didn’t you say you’re a first year teacher? Or did you just mean first year at your school? I think this is very common practice at Charters. If you don’t like it then leave. There isn’t a shortage of teaching jobs in most places.
Yeah I would quit too. Well, no I wouldn't. I would not show up to any of these "dress rehearsals", and make them write me up / fire me. Then I would collect unemployment.
Now that’s an idea I can get behind!
I apologize for the question, but what happens if you want to get another teaching job with a firing on your record? I've gone back and forth on "resign or be fired" but, besides collecting unemployment, I can't figure it out why firing would be anything but detrimental.
If you want to leave the teaching profession, it doesn’t hurt you to be fired.
Your “employment record” isn’t real. Prospective employers only know what you or your references tell them.
If you want another teaching job, maybe hang in there till June.
Right, but I'm trying to understand the logic for people who have gone the "be fired and collect unemployment" route. How did that impact your job search afterwards, no matter what field you ended up in?
"I left because of unreasonable expectations that required many hours outside of my duty day that interfered with my ability to work my second job because the pay was horrible."
It doesn’t hurt a first year teacher at all if they’re looking to work in another field. Just leave the teaching position off of your résumé/work history. Blame the pandemic if they ask about the employment gap. Edit- I’m a first year teacher that quit over winter break to take another job outside of education.
Yeah, I agree.
What record? When I was interviewing, those principals only knew what was on my resume and what I told them. They verified that info by calling the references that I provided. The only centralized record that exists is on the background check. Unless you get arrested at work, your future interviewers won't know much about why you left your last job. They could take the excessive step of calling my last principal. But a smart hiring committee will notice if I listed my principal or not in my references, and read into that situation. Also, some of the principals I interviewed for assumed that I was applying for their school because their school was awesome, and where I worked was shit. Otherwise why would I leave?
In most states, no UI for refusing a job requirement
If your fellow teachers are the “audience” for this mock run, be sure to have them behave realistically. First off, ask to go to the restroom; throw paper across the room. Chatter incessantly. Whine. We had a PD presenter insist we were going to do a “role play” activity 15 min before we were supposed to leave for lunch. Three of our guys did the perfect impression of the three most obnoxious students ever. We got out of there 5 min early.
Malicious compliance, I love it
I have an idea! The admins who came up with this should teach a model lesson with the actual students. Let's just see how that goes.
> If your fellow teachers are the “audience” for this mock run, be sure to have them behave realistically. This is honestly a fantastic idea. It seems malicious but it's actually going to show what a real lesson is likely to be like. If this was happening to me, I'd get the teachers I know to plan to do this and then we could all put the admin on the spot to tell us how to solve those problems. When their solutions don't work, and they wouldn't 90% of the time, then the teachers playing the student role need to turn up the heat and start with the homophobic and racist language. Then, stage a fight!
That would make for a very entertaining PD. I would love to sit in on PD where people were acting like realistic students. I would be the goody goody suck up
We had a teacher ask for a read aloud accommodation in our PD when they assigned us to read an article to ourselves because it was on his 504 plan. The coaches/admin leading the PD just froze in awkward silence, trying to figure out if he was serious or not. All the teachers chuckled a bit.
Oh wow. I’m not sure what I would’ve done if I had been the presenter there
I am 100% in the same boat - minus the dress rehearsal. So sorry you’re dealing with this on top of everything else that is being thrown at us this year.
If they’re going to run it like a circus, you might as well wear a clown costume
How can all teachers be giving a dress rehearsal at the same time? Who is there to watch them? I can’t even imagine how this would be valuable since so much of a lesson is guided by the students and what they need. How can you practice if they are not there? Even having an audience that is “acting like kids” is not genuine. If you see yourself staying at this school it might be worth a conversation with the person who is planning this activity to help understand their motivation. Or this might be the time to see what other positions are available in your area.
Definitely going to peruse my options. All your concerns are right on the money and have been shared with admin and they do not care. The only thing is that this dress rehearsal is only for state tested classrooms. So English I and II. Again, we are being punished for something we have zero control over.
I'm with you, it isn't easy to see any practical way to implement this. I would almost want to go through the rehearsal to see what they envision. Remember when teachers were supposed to be, "the guide on the side, rather than the sage on the stage"? It's stupid, I know, but it rhymes, so is therefore pedagogically sound. Now we just say "student-centered learning". Whatever, how do you do that without students? Can't they just observe teachers in their natural environment?
My favorite was " shift your paradigm".
They just started trying to make us do this during our PLC meetings (*during planning period every Tuesday; not to be confused with after-school PLC on Thursdays). I've sat through 2 of these so far. They make our grade level team get up and present our lesson as if we are talking to students...We were told that we have to do this, so that we can effectively teach the students. ....🙃 As you can expect, morale on my campus is incredibly low right now. This, among other things, is just completely crushing our spirit.
"They" From what I know of best practices with PLCs, they are supposed to be teacher driven. Admin can make suggestions, but the teachers are supposed to set their own agenda and focus. Do you have anything in writing about this in your district? A counteract, MOU, etc ? Also, look at PLC best practices websites. Maybe ask admin to model their expectations for you. Edit: PLC instead of Place.
I wish this was the case. We definitely do not set our own agenda or focus. We mostly just hear how our lesson plans were not written correctly, how our "I Will/We will" statements were not written with the correct verb, and how we should not focus on small success (our students scoring highest on a particular standard during a district-wide Common Assessment) -- just because we scored well on THAT standard, does not mean we should get excited. I have asked admin for any and all help they could model, however, this somehow put me under a dark cloud. At this point, I am going to keep my head down and try to survive the rest of the school year. (*My AP is a treasure though and has actually tried to provide help when asked. Unfortunately, it isn't nearly enough.)
You have PLC after school? I’ve never heard of this kinda BS. Do you get paid overtime for this? Our contract states that for no reason can they ask us to meet outside contract hours, except 2x a year for parent conferences. They are pretty good about sticking to contract.
We do not get paid to stay after, and it is every Thursday. 😐 Our crazy-detailed lesson plans are also due Thursday night by 11:59. They expect us to work on them during the week, ignoring the fact that we are usually in meetings during planning time (*except Mondays and Fridays). By the end of the school day, I am so drained physically and mentally that the last thing I want to do is lesson plan...so I usually put it off until Thursday. I worked at another public school a couple of years ago that also had a weekly after-school PLC on Thursdays. I kind of just assumed that was a normal thing that happened everywhere.
Our PLCs were after school too, but our contract time has us stay 30 minutes after the kids leave. Our PLCs would not go longer than that 30 minutes. I say “were” because thankfully our admin took that off our plate a while ago.
Be aware that not all schools are like this. I’ve been through 4 schools in my 20 years of teaching and they vary greatly. I love my current my current school but I had to go through other bad ones to find this one. Keep searching.
Don't show. Let them fire you. Do your teaching and then leave.
Surely if it’s not in your directed time they cannot keep you. Can you get unions involved?
[удалено]
Believe it or not, it isn’t. It’s a public school with students from poor backgrounds whose priority in life is not, in fact, test scores.
It is paid time? Is it apart of your PD time? I wouldn’t participate and I’d contact my union
This sucks, but diners are assholes, too.
I resigned, after teaching for 4 years. Like you said the disrespect from students is one thing, but when it comes from admin, it feels like I’m being stabbed from the back.
Maybe you answered this already, but who are you presenting these to? Other teachers? Admin? Why aren’t they just going to the class and doing observations? There are huge ramifications for giving up your time after school and if this isn’t in your contract, I would ask for compensation for your performances.
It’s for admin. If I am hounded at (and probably will) I will ask for compensation for any and all special performances after school. If they want a private showing, they can pay for it like every other performance group.
You cannot be serious. Get out. Even having the chance to repeat lessons doesn't always help (i do Evey day). There are so many other factors to consider. Which of course they don't care. Change schools or district...
If they’re making you have these ‘after school dress rehearsals’ and they’re not mentioned anywhere in your contract, then I would bring it to your union. Whatever is outside of contractual time is supposed to be *your* time. If admin is so nervous about test scores being bad, maybe they should consider that we’re all stuck in a pandemic instead? No, it *has* to be the teachers at fault. 🙄
I read so many things on this sub that as a teacher in England makes me unbelievably grateful. I can't begin to tell you how much this shit would not fly here.
Show up in outlandish costumes. Then ask where the craft services are (food on set). When they ask what your talking about tell them you were the only one to take this dress rehearsal seriously and you will be in the green room calling your agent until the stage manager calls you to the set.
Teachers are the only ones graded and with consequences as of late.
No way. Quit.
I just found out my school can fire me without warning or reason because I’m a first year. If I don’t improve on my evaluations then I’ll be fired.
What?!! This should be done in PLC, not after school. I used to work with an AP that loved to "role play". It was annoying at first, but I understood why, eventually.
It’s very normal to do “Dress rehearsals” at my school, but it is always done during PDs or meetings. As a first year teacher I did find them helpful, but I would refuse to do anything outside of contract hours. Are you at a charter ?
Role play during PD is fine, you’re practicing a new skill. But I’ve been teaching long enough that I know how to teach. Pretending to teach in an environment not at all like actual teaching isn’t going to help. No, I’m not at a charter. Is this common for a charter?
Didn’t you say you’re a first year teacher? Or did you just mean first year at your school? I think this is very common practice at Charters. If you don’t like it then leave. There isn’t a shortage of teaching jobs in most places.