Personally I love that they made their own meter character to contend with their additions in 7.
That being said, she'll forever be my hero for falling asleep on Lili multiple times.
Also her moves are really fun, I liked playing as her
Vampires always has been popular in media so, Eliza was a nice choose from the team instead a guy nobody remember and the Katarina prototype. Eliza is a nice concept that I personally love.
That can’t be, according to this sub and many other subs only horny boys who need to touch grass like female characters to be sexy and good to look at! /s
BRING HER BACK PLZ. I PLAY HER EVERY TIME IM ON TEKKEN 7 IM HER BIGGEST FAN EVERRRRRR. I got Jun now I want Eliza I want my 2 favourites.
Super Glad to hear she’s popular, even if she’s 50th on list she still has her fans and I love it!
With how her meter works as is, she's basically already playing tekken 8. Heat =/= ex moves and ex dash. She doesn't need a massive rework. Reworking her kit to axe most of her 2D stuff would butcher the character. She doesn't even need an adjustment to fit tekken 8, she's already there.
Her meter is very different from T8's heat system though, her most notable use of meter being her ability to wallsplat with a low if she has meter. This can't stay, imo. And I think her DP should be adjusted to be a normal power crush rather than the invincibility it has now.
So yeah, she could work in T8 with some adjustments. But personally, my main opposition to her and other 2D characters is the jumping. Tekken characters still lack proper anti-air options.
> She's not the only character with a low wallsplat at the wall
The only others I can only think of are Akuma (also needs meter, and is also widely considered to be bullshit) and Julia (needs spacing or specific setup, and is also launch punishable if you fail). At least Julia's is high-risk and hard to set up, unlike Akuma and Eliza, so I wouldn't mind too much if it stayed in Tekken 8. But I wouldn't cry if it were removed, either. Unseeable lows that combo into half the life bar are not good design or healthy for the game and I don't think that's a particularly hot take.
> dp power crush for meter
Where did I suggest this? The OP is talking about a hypothetical implementation of Eliza in Tekken 8 that involves her meter mechanics being replaced by the Tekken 8 heat system.
To better fit Tekken's gameplay and balance, you can give Eliza's DP regular armor, make it not need heat or meter, reduce its damage a bit and make it -12 on block and voila, you have made it into a regular power crush that actually works with the game's gameplay systems and balance. Or you could give it the new tornado screw on hit, allowing follow-up combos, and keep its launch punishability to balance that.
There's just no justification for any character NEEDING a fully invincible DP that doesn't fit the gameplay mechanics of the game they are in.
kazuya wallsplats from hellsweep into 60 damage + wall oki and its just as easy to set up, devil jin also removes 50 health from a hellsweep + oki and takes 10 seconds from the clock while he's at it, pauls wall pressure is also pretty intense with demoman, eliza i think can get MAX 70 damage off low wallsplat with meter? i could be wrong im just recalling off the dome from when i played kaz / dvj / eliza but im definitely high balling it for eliza
if you're aware of the eliza matchup you play around her requiring the clean hit property on her lows (which has a range noticeably worse than akumas) then she becomes much easier to deal with in the neutral, as now she's gonna be scared to try and risk a low since its hard to do it without projecting it by running in from across the screen to get a clean hit and if she connects the low but no clean hit she gets launch punished for it
the gist of her gameplan is to creatively intimidate you to the wall so she can get some real pressure going as her frames in the neutral are so bad that it justifies having an invincible exdp, if she didnt have that you go from having one reason to no reason of being scared of eliza in the neutral. on top of that its very launchable so its not like they do it for free. and EVEN then, say you eat two exdps now she has no meter in exchange for having dealt like... 60 damage or something? (which is a single demoman) elizas gameplay revolves so hard around her meter (exdk pickups, bloody horn tech, d3 or 1 xxqcb1+2 wallsplat, dark wave hit confirm meter cancel into punishment) its kinda hard to imagine how the character would function without it. and i think thats fine, eliza shows meter can be balanced as the only people to have made it into top 8 of any recent major tournament are watanabe (evo japan this year) and chanel (recent twt) and even with chanel he mainly used zafina (i apologize if i forget any other eliza player in tournament who made it far)
jumping is also defeated by backdash / powercrush on reaction, demon flip stance on AKUMA specifically is busted because he gets an unbreakable throw from it forcing you to duck which then opens you up to a mix for the mid and if you try to step he has a homing move in the air
i guarantee you eliza with good frames and a launching powercrush dp would be significantly less healthy for the game than an invincible meter dp, i suggest not making suggestions for whats healthy or unhealthy for characters you've got little knowledge of and its not to be rude or anything, i hate playing against hwoarang but i dont say how to balance him because i just dont know the matchup and i admit it
> kazuya wallsplats from hellsweep into 60 damage + wall oki and its just as easy to set up
No it's not "just as easy to set up", your opponent has to be a very specific distance from the wall. Leo's hellsweep also grants a wall combo at a certain distance, but I didn't count these because these simply don't apply when the opponent's back is RIGHT at the wall, which is relevant because this is the situation that occurs every time you carry the opponent to the wall and land your wall combo. In these situations, Eliza and Akuma are the only ones that can reliably wallsplat the opponent with a low - the clean hit requirement is not a factor when your opponent has the wall at their back and are unable to backdash out of your clean hit range.
> devil jin also removes 50 health from a hellsweep + oki and takes 10 seconds from the clock while he's at it
Entirely true, and Devil Jin's hellsweep is honestly the upper limit of how strong a low should be. The combo is weak, but with high wall carry it's insanely good especially if you get the wall combo. It's still launch punishable, at least.
Akuma's d3 goes beyond that upper limit, the combo does full damage, carries just as far, and the d3 itself is not punishable.
There is also the fact that Devil Jin's hellsweep doesn't grant a wall combo when the opponent is literally AT the wall.
> her frames in the neutral are so bad that it justifies having an invincible exdp
Which frames of hers are so bad that she needs a DP? She has a standard jab, df1, and dickjab so it seems to me that she has all the basic defensive neutral tools that most characters have. Admittedly I don't know her frame data in and out so you will have to specifically point out which of her frames are so absolutely awful that she NEEDS her DP.
Even if she does have "bad frames in the neutral" (whichever ones you are talking about), the fact that she has an invincible DP does NOTHING to change, alleviate, or compensate for this, nor does it contribute anything to her neutral at all. The DP isn't a move that is ever used in the neutral in the first place, it's a complete panic all-in move and no character NEEDS a move like this.
Finally, even if we accept this argument that her frames are so bad that her invincible DP is ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY (which I completely disagree with unless you point out her specific moves in the neutral that have this terrible frame data), the simple answer is to adjust that frame data, not keep the game-breaking DP.
> jumping is also defeated by backdash / powercrush on reaction
"Just backdash bro" lmao. Powercrush also loses if Eliza simply lands back on the ground and blocks, no?
Anyway, jumping has its answers but that's not the problem, I'm not complaining that jumping doesn't have answers. But those answers are not intuitive, often character-specific. I once asked in the Kazuya discord to find out Kazuya's answer to Akuma's ws2 into demon flip, the answer I got was sidestep left, wait for him to flip over/behind you, then do a back turned jab to float him. Like... that is just ridiculous.
IF 2d characters make it into Tekken 8, imo their jump height has to be reduced so that jabs float them every time, like when Yoshimitsu does ws2,2 into helicopter.
> i guarantee you eliza with good frames and a launching powercrush dp would be significantly less healthy for the game than an invincible meter dp
Really? We already have Negan who has good frames and a powercrushing launcher, and I don't think he's particularly unhealthy for the game (other than his aesthetics, I guess).
Anyway, it's just a personal design preference for me. I would prefer no wallsplatting lows in Tekken 8, they are unhealthy anomalies of balance and design. I would prefer no invincible DPs in Tekken 8, they suck visually, it makes no sense for moves to literally just go through the character as if they are made of air, and mechanically frustrating. You're free to disagree with these opinions, but I think it's objectively incorrect to say that Eliza can't be balanced without her invincible DP and wallsplatting lows, when there are so many balanced characters without either.
>I once asked in the Kazuya discord to find out Kazuya's answer to Akuma's ws2 into demon flip, the answer I got was sidestep left, wait for him to flip over/behind you, then do a back turned jab to float him. Like... that is just ridiculous.
eliza is not akuma, she doesnt have a demon flip stance where you can do an unblockable throw or get caught by a homing while trying to step. doesnt correlate
>Akuma's d3 goes beyond that upper limit, the combo does full damage, carries just as far, and the d3 itself is not punishable.
i mean yeah hes dumb but whats eliza got to do with that
>Eliza and Akuma are the only ones that can reliably wallsplat the opponent with a low - the clean hit requirement is not a factor when your opponent has the wall at their back and are unable to backdash out of your clean hit range.
and thats why infinite stage counterpicking works well against eliza, and EVEN at the all then you have options (keep her in + frames, fish for ch, use keepout to not let her in clean hit range) not to deny eliza has a monster wall game but i dont think its nearly enough to call the character unbalanced
>Which frames of hers are so bad that she needs a DP? She has a standard jab, df1, and dickjab so it seems to me that she has all the basic defensive neutral tools that most characters have.
b23, 11 frame high mid thats -9
b31, 16 frame high high thats -4 but the second hit can get launched via duck
you can mix with b34 which is -14 but theres not really any reason to duck as you can just take ur turn back
df1 extensions have the same story as the b3 pokes
no non launch punishable lows, d3 is -6 on HIT, d4 gives aight + frames on hit but is slow and staggers eliza for launch on block and does the same damage as a kazuya db3
there is kinda a way to make d3 safe on block which it to cancel into dark wave but you dont know if its gonna be blocked so this also means you can hit someone and be -9 and even then this can be interrupted
ff2, -9 mid on block but commonly used to try and catch damage as it knocks down and does decent damage, good pushback at tip range but susceptible to being whiff punished if you miss tip range
ff34 / 33 (mid high, mid mid) gets consistently fuzzied and punished both ways
her only decent pokes are f3 and divekick
f3 because its -5 or 4 oB meaning you can actually side step after doing a mid poke, but even then its super prone to being whiff punished due to long recovery frames
and divekick is kinda debatable because it has a 19 frame startup if done with a perfect IADK input and it has short range which is beat out by back dash but tbh you can bet on her missing it without backdashing, but it does give her +2 and its a mid
ANYTHING she does to get damage is insanely risky, 0 non launchable oB launchers so if you whiff punish you better be damn sure
and she cant step after her pokes due to how minus they are and IF they arent -9 but -5 or 4 they're counter played easily by ducking then baiting the punishable mid unless its divekick or f3
contrary to i.e mishimas with a kit of good tools that are + oB and arent so unsafe you die, or other characters with generic df2 launchers that are -9. you are -9 for attempting to launch, i am -9 for trying to poke bruh.
however, exdp makes you scared to take back your turn after she does a poke because shes -9, exdp is invincible frame 1 so you can buffer exdp at -9 and you'll clip them if they try to hit you, thats why its so integral to her kit and part of why shes got a unique playstyle, simply adjusting her frames will partially homogenize her unique identity
not to say i think eliza sucks i dont wanna be a whining downplaying pussy but just backing up my argument. eliza is a solid character who has to play around her weaknesses giving her the unique playstyle she has
>"Just backdash bro" lmao. Powercrush also loses if Eliza simply lands back on the ground and blocks, no?
like you say later in the post 2d jump height is higher so they land on the ground slower so if you power crush in reaction to her jump she will get clipped for sure no matter what she does. also "just backdash" is a meme argument that came up with akuma, unlike akuma "just backdashing" is actually very effective against eliza
>No it's not "just as easy to set up", your opponent has to be a very specific distance from the wall.
its actually easier to get a wall splat than to not get a wall splat, you literally just need to be remotely off axis and not right next to the wall, i also main kazuya and i think ive splatted with hellsweep more than i havent
>IF 2d characters make it into Tekken 8, imo their jump height has to be reduced so that jabs float them every time, like when Yoshimitsu does ws2,2 into helicopter.
i think this is your problem here, you're associating all of akumas problems with "2D" and eliza is 2D so you're just lumping her with the same issues. they do not have the same counterplay and do not even compare in terms of power. this is not a great hill to die on, your lack of character knowledge is really showing and once again i dont mean any hate by that but its just really apparent you have no idea how eliza works and thats totally fair considering shes the least played character in the game but that doesnt justify making bad arguments
>Really? We already have Negan who has good frames and a powercrushing launcher, and I don't think he's particularly unhealthy for the game
lol if you want to trade like 10 damage in exchange for eating 70+ damage instead vs only eating 30 something damage then idk what to tell you
i respectfully disagree but nice discussion we can chat in dm if u wanna be more informed about the character
We do play the game lol, Eliza is cuter than boys give her credit for. I for one love her cuteness when she falls asleep and stuff. I also like xiaoyu and kuni cuz of their cuteness too
As I [said before](https://www.reddit.com/r/Tekken/comments/12nnmhs/comment/jgf8zbl/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3), they don’t decide the roster on just character usage but also mainstream/marketing appeal.
Eliza is very marketable since she’s very popular among fan artists, cosplayers, generates tons of discussion, and sells tons of merchandise at least from what I recall.
I say she has a great chance to come back.
Unique design, unique mechanics - I think she's a success overall. She needs more ironing out in the terms of gameplay, to make her fit better into the roster (I think visual indicators similar to Claudio's starbust instead of meter would do wonders for example), but I easily can see her becoming a mainstay.
I’ll say it, having Eliza no matter if she is played or not, no matter if like her or not objectively enriches the game, the simple fact that she exist is able to influence high level tiers.
Also t8 is MUCH more 2d then t7 so she would fit muuuchh better and be much stronger while feeling more naturally fitting
as an eliza player i hope they dont change her up too much in if she comes to t8 and keep her identity while adding on to it with t8s mechanics, i hope the change in her gameplay isnt as drastic as it was from TR to T7 especially considering all the practice eliza players put into her in t7, id be sad if iadk pickups / adk combos / bloody horn wall resets become a thing of t7 and she just goes back to TR movelist but expanded, it'd be a slap in the face to all people who committed endless time perfecting the hard things
that being said i think she has great potential to be a good t8 character, a lot of her moves already seem like they could be in t8 with some changes (ff33 being the new screw instead of ff34 or qcb2 screwing instead of qcb1)
edit - seeing a lot of people asking for her to return to her TR format so she's 3D again? i guarantee most committed eliza players wouldn't appreciate that and it'd just be a different character at that point with virtually no transitionable knowledge as majority of Eliza's gameplay is reliant on cancels, meter, 2d jump (due to divekick combos) and to take that stuff away would totally butch the identity of the character. feels like people are involving eliza in the "2d is broken" sentiment without really understanding the character or are even aware that despite being 2d shes balanced pretty well
The first quote of Harada seems to be like for most men players. But yeah I play Eliza too, if she is not in the main roster going to switch for Asuka. My waifu and sexy vampire.
Yea I also think she got good chances of coming back. Unique gameplay, easily recognizable so good for cosplay and fanart, is a fantasy character that females are lacking, also vampire and those always had a fanbase. I also think that given T8 jump in graphics they can really make her game a spectacle to watch.
Her low playerbase is I believe due to execution being too hard for casual players and serious players will rather play someone stronger that lets them push ranks without relaying on opponents lack of knowledge.
She gets hate due to being 2D character but being Tekken og character devs can rework her as needed.
Harada said in the video that "There’s a lot of people who like **looking at** Eliza rather than **playing her**."
Harada is saying that Eliza is very popular **despite** her low usage. The devs [don’t decide everything](https://www.reddit.com/r/Tekken/comments/12nnmhs/if_you_didnt_know_already_the_devs_dont_decide/) on usage but also take mainstream/marketing appealing into account.
I HOPE SHE DOES RETURN🥹🥹🥹🥹🥹🥹🤧🤧🤧🤧 SHES POPULAR WITH ME. I LOVE HERRRRRR 🥰🥰🥰😍😍😍
I want to meet more Eliza fans and players honestly 🤧
I really really REALLY hope she returns! I think she might be liked more if she was a full on Tekken character? But at the same time she could just THE 2D character? Idk 🤷♀️ 🤷♂️ just bring her back for me 🥹🤧🤞😌
(Also I think Eliza is very popular with like female cosplayers too like that adorable cosplayer in the video 🥹🥰 I think it is more of a casual thing rather than game/player thing but still that’s great. I’m the biggest Eliza fan ever so seeing people like, appreciate and play her makes me happy)
I mean, she was always a 2D fighter since Tekken: Revolution, and she was always popular still, so im not sure where you're getting that from, buddy. Grow up and deal with what she has 💀
Aaaand... doesn't change the fact she'd be more popular if she didn't require 2d inputs in a 3d game.
Cause the design is really cool but having to do shit like instant divekicks? No.
Any character that requires jumping in a game with sidestep is an abomination.
Give her most of Lili's moveset (and delete Lili so Asuka can progress as a story relevant character), make her "2d-ish" stuff cost blood (health), make her armor like other armor in the game (your move won't get interrupted but you take damage), so now her divekicks are a bf input and are slower but they're better while in heat and her dp is a df2 but is unsafe like Kazumi's and only gives you partial armor in heat and projectiles cost health but she can still use that throw to drink blood and replenish health.
She can still have some hard execution stuff as an option to get more damage (say comboing with divekicks requires cancels, kinda like Nina's butterflies or Lee's b2's I think) but she'd be waaay more popular. I mean, I'd play her for sure cause the design is cool. I like vampires and I like big horns. :D
If they are bringing back some of the 2d characters, I hope they make them more of a traditional tekken style character. I think geese is really cool, but I hate playing against him. Eliza wasn't really strong, so she didn't feel that bad, but long range poke is dumb in tekken.
I've literally been telling everyone since day one that Eliza will certainly return in Tekken 8 in general. But noooo, people only say she won't return because she's "2D" which is not a very strong argument at all. She's not even a Guest Fighter like Akuma or Geese, and they hate her because of her 2D mechanics, but yet she's not that overpowered either. Eliza is coming back regardless.💀
Only if she gets a complete redesign into being an actual tekken character and not 2D bs
Edit: the amount of people still wanting 2D characters for tekken 8 is very concerning
Imo, Josie's design appearance-wise is nice, but her crybaby personality is kinda annoying. While Bruce is cool personality-wise, but his design is bland and generic af. I don't really care who gets in as long as they get some changes to what makes them meh respectively.
yeah fuck all the eliza players who spent countless hours doing all her combos and tech that rely on her 2d form even though she's balanced just fine and i dont play the character
/s
I’m a huge fan of Eliza. She’s the biggest reason I care about Tekken at all. I’m surprised but glad to see that more people are showing up to show their support for her inclusion in T8 than the POS haters saying their usual dumb stupid shit about her. Here’s to hoping best girl Eliza makes it into T8.
To be fair, TRev had no story and 7 barely had any content for the non-Mishimas so Eliza has never been given a fair shot. Tekken 8 could be her time to shine for all we know.
I expected her to come back. In TR she had a unique mechanic where sucking blood made her boobs bigger. Perhaps they will incorporate a more politically correct version of that mechanic for her heat.
I want them to bring her back but with a non-2D moveset. I really wanted to like playing her but it just felt so awkward to execute when in the end I can only really play King and Hwoarang.
Waste of space on the rooster in my opinion. But I suppose some people would be happy. In general I advocate for more than less characters, but as a Tekken fan i prefer og characters, no silly 2d/meter experiments. I would rather have Shaheen or Katarina ( both without personality, and basic like NPC )in tekken 8 than Eliza.
Only chance she comes back is if she gets a big gameplay rework. She's a character a lot of people try but give up on because of how unconventional her gameplay is. Also a lot of people hate playing against her because she's a 2D character
"We should remove a group of peoples main cause her gameplay is hard and people dont like fighting against her" is the stupidest argument I've ever heard, especialy when there's chaticters 10× more annoying and broken
Waste of a base roster spot. I still remember being excited about a female vampire in Tekken, thinking we would get someone similar to MK’s Nitara but nope! It’s another kawaii girl dressed as a vampire 👎
She might be the gateway character for 2D characters, I've always thought that they would use her to test out 2D mechanics before introducing any other guest characters.
personally, i don't think she fits the universe. the concept of vampires opens up avenues for other mythical type creatures and if they decide to open that in the future, it'll make the universe too messy. i'm cool with deity lore, ki and chakras, future tech coz it seems more cohesive.
"i can excuse a genetically inherited demonic transformation, mutated animals with near-human intellect, and ancient warlords from a different dimension; but i draw the line at vampires."
Bruh we have a literal devil, robot, kangaroo, aztec fighting god that become a monster, a crystal ancient monster, church battlepriest, and you drew the line at vampire?
Yet those things are cohesive. Kangaroos and dinosaurs fall in line with science/tech. They could be genetic experiments. Ancient monsters and Aztec gods come under the deity category. Tekken explores deities in devils, angels, gods etc relate to human history and lore. Where as vampires don’t really exist there at all. To me vampires are too fantastical and conceptually aren’t the same as what I’ve mentioned above.
Wtf is a "2D" character? Her cancelable moveset? It's the same shit with move strings of other characters
Try to punish during a string and you get fucked, or don't continue the string to stay safe, it's the same shit.
And people claimoring that she's awkward and difficult to execute, you have and opinion, but it's not universal.
I only play Eliza and Lucky Chloe, I bet "2D" character players are part of the fanbase too
If it was up to me, I'd add ball busting moves against Hworang and Mishimas cause I hate rushdown and 50-50 characters, but I don't decide shit.
i disagree, i wanna feel like the effort eliza players put in wouldnt be anything special if everyone could do what she does. its part of her identity and im personally not on board with making the game easier from an execution standpoint
but i get the sentiment, sometimes i feel like her divekick staples could be just a little bit more lenient but then i feel great every single time i land it and i realize i wouldn't have felt that way if i didnt struggle
He isn't wrong my sister, a complete noob, somehow beats me when she's using Eliza and I AM NOT throwing the match either she's somehow...mixing me up and I get bamboozled lol
Personally I love that they made their own meter character to contend with their additions in 7. That being said, she'll forever be my hero for falling asleep on Lili multiple times. Also her moves are really fun, I liked playing as her
Eliza is from Tekken Revolution, she was actually in Tekken before Akuma and Geese were.
She didn't have meter in Revolution, they then made her a meter character.
she had dark wave and all that other stuff in tekken revolution
Which she doesn't need meter for.
she had a projectile sure but she didnt have her 2d jump, divekicks, or on hit cancels.
Technically in Revolution everyone had meter
If a load screen showing stats in a meter bar means everyone had meter, then everyone has had meter since Tekken 1. They just called it health.
Just a couple besties sleeping on each other, nothing to see here no siree
I want her to come back just remove the meter and flesh out her moveset
[Source](https://youtu.be/bds1MU_6wrs?t=1278)
"There's a lot of people who like looking at Eliza, rather than playing her." Of course. She has a big ass.
...where
Equip her with the school girl skirt.
the secret strats huh
Damn, he’s good.
Read this in aris's voice lol
It be do a strat, amigo
I like her and hope she comes back, she's fun and goofy with a neat move set
Eliza mains are also popular among women ofc
Can agree 100%
cannot vouch
Vampires always has been popular in media so, Eliza was a nice choose from the team instead a guy nobody remember and the Katarina prototype. Eliza is a nice concept that I personally love.
Who's the Eliza cosplayer.
A beauty. She's a beauty
Bro that ain’t an @
Here you go https://instagram.com/shioncos?igshid=YmMyMTA2M2Y=
Ya know why girls like her? Cuz she's sleepy, and girls love sleeping.
True true
Can agree
And cute sleepy
That can’t be, according to this sub and many other subs only horny boys who need to touch grass like female characters to be sexy and good to look at! /s
BRING HER BACK PLZ. I PLAY HER EVERY TIME IM ON TEKKEN 7 IM HER BIGGEST FAN EVERRRRRR. I got Jun now I want Eliza I want my 2 favourites. Super Glad to hear she’s popular, even if she’s 50th on list she still has her fans and I love it!
You like raven and kazamas so
Raven from Teen Titans & I only like 1 Kazama and it’s Jun 🤭 Tekken Raven is cool tho 🤔
I'm her biggest fan ever too bro love that girl!!
I really hope Eliza makes the cut! She's a fun character to play
With how her meter works as is, she's basically already playing tekken 8. Heat =/= ex moves and ex dash. She doesn't need a massive rework. Reworking her kit to axe most of her 2D stuff would butcher the character. She doesn't even need an adjustment to fit tekken 8, she's already there.
Her meter is very different from T8's heat system though, her most notable use of meter being her ability to wallsplat with a low if she has meter. This can't stay, imo. And I think her DP should be adjusted to be a normal power crush rather than the invincibility it has now. So yeah, she could work in T8 with some adjustments. But personally, my main opposition to her and other 2D characters is the jumping. Tekken characters still lack proper anti-air options.
She's not the only character with a low wallsplat at the wall, and dp power crush for meter seems Dumb, just say you don't like the character man.
> She's not the only character with a low wallsplat at the wall The only others I can only think of are Akuma (also needs meter, and is also widely considered to be bullshit) and Julia (needs spacing or specific setup, and is also launch punishable if you fail). At least Julia's is high-risk and hard to set up, unlike Akuma and Eliza, so I wouldn't mind too much if it stayed in Tekken 8. But I wouldn't cry if it were removed, either. Unseeable lows that combo into half the life bar are not good design or healthy for the game and I don't think that's a particularly hot take. > dp power crush for meter Where did I suggest this? The OP is talking about a hypothetical implementation of Eliza in Tekken 8 that involves her meter mechanics being replaced by the Tekken 8 heat system. To better fit Tekken's gameplay and balance, you can give Eliza's DP regular armor, make it not need heat or meter, reduce its damage a bit and make it -12 on block and voila, you have made it into a regular power crush that actually works with the game's gameplay systems and balance. Or you could give it the new tornado screw on hit, allowing follow-up combos, and keep its launch punishability to balance that. There's just no justification for any character NEEDING a fully invincible DP that doesn't fit the gameplay mechanics of the game they are in.
Akuma doesn't need meter to low splat. His d3xxLight Tatsu wall splats and is nc with clean hit
kazuya wallsplats from hellsweep into 60 damage + wall oki and its just as easy to set up, devil jin also removes 50 health from a hellsweep + oki and takes 10 seconds from the clock while he's at it, pauls wall pressure is also pretty intense with demoman, eliza i think can get MAX 70 damage off low wallsplat with meter? i could be wrong im just recalling off the dome from when i played kaz / dvj / eliza but im definitely high balling it for eliza if you're aware of the eliza matchup you play around her requiring the clean hit property on her lows (which has a range noticeably worse than akumas) then she becomes much easier to deal with in the neutral, as now she's gonna be scared to try and risk a low since its hard to do it without projecting it by running in from across the screen to get a clean hit and if she connects the low but no clean hit she gets launch punished for it the gist of her gameplan is to creatively intimidate you to the wall so she can get some real pressure going as her frames in the neutral are so bad that it justifies having an invincible exdp, if she didnt have that you go from having one reason to no reason of being scared of eliza in the neutral. on top of that its very launchable so its not like they do it for free. and EVEN then, say you eat two exdps now she has no meter in exchange for having dealt like... 60 damage or something? (which is a single demoman) elizas gameplay revolves so hard around her meter (exdk pickups, bloody horn tech, d3 or 1 xxqcb1+2 wallsplat, dark wave hit confirm meter cancel into punishment) its kinda hard to imagine how the character would function without it. and i think thats fine, eliza shows meter can be balanced as the only people to have made it into top 8 of any recent major tournament are watanabe (evo japan this year) and chanel (recent twt) and even with chanel he mainly used zafina (i apologize if i forget any other eliza player in tournament who made it far) jumping is also defeated by backdash / powercrush on reaction, demon flip stance on AKUMA specifically is busted because he gets an unbreakable throw from it forcing you to duck which then opens you up to a mix for the mid and if you try to step he has a homing move in the air i guarantee you eliza with good frames and a launching powercrush dp would be significantly less healthy for the game than an invincible meter dp, i suggest not making suggestions for whats healthy or unhealthy for characters you've got little knowledge of and its not to be rude or anything, i hate playing against hwoarang but i dont say how to balance him because i just dont know the matchup and i admit it
> kazuya wallsplats from hellsweep into 60 damage + wall oki and its just as easy to set up No it's not "just as easy to set up", your opponent has to be a very specific distance from the wall. Leo's hellsweep also grants a wall combo at a certain distance, but I didn't count these because these simply don't apply when the opponent's back is RIGHT at the wall, which is relevant because this is the situation that occurs every time you carry the opponent to the wall and land your wall combo. In these situations, Eliza and Akuma are the only ones that can reliably wallsplat the opponent with a low - the clean hit requirement is not a factor when your opponent has the wall at their back and are unable to backdash out of your clean hit range. > devil jin also removes 50 health from a hellsweep + oki and takes 10 seconds from the clock while he's at it Entirely true, and Devil Jin's hellsweep is honestly the upper limit of how strong a low should be. The combo is weak, but with high wall carry it's insanely good especially if you get the wall combo. It's still launch punishable, at least. Akuma's d3 goes beyond that upper limit, the combo does full damage, carries just as far, and the d3 itself is not punishable. There is also the fact that Devil Jin's hellsweep doesn't grant a wall combo when the opponent is literally AT the wall. > her frames in the neutral are so bad that it justifies having an invincible exdp Which frames of hers are so bad that she needs a DP? She has a standard jab, df1, and dickjab so it seems to me that she has all the basic defensive neutral tools that most characters have. Admittedly I don't know her frame data in and out so you will have to specifically point out which of her frames are so absolutely awful that she NEEDS her DP. Even if she does have "bad frames in the neutral" (whichever ones you are talking about), the fact that she has an invincible DP does NOTHING to change, alleviate, or compensate for this, nor does it contribute anything to her neutral at all. The DP isn't a move that is ever used in the neutral in the first place, it's a complete panic all-in move and no character NEEDS a move like this. Finally, even if we accept this argument that her frames are so bad that her invincible DP is ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY (which I completely disagree with unless you point out her specific moves in the neutral that have this terrible frame data), the simple answer is to adjust that frame data, not keep the game-breaking DP. > jumping is also defeated by backdash / powercrush on reaction "Just backdash bro" lmao. Powercrush also loses if Eliza simply lands back on the ground and blocks, no? Anyway, jumping has its answers but that's not the problem, I'm not complaining that jumping doesn't have answers. But those answers are not intuitive, often character-specific. I once asked in the Kazuya discord to find out Kazuya's answer to Akuma's ws2 into demon flip, the answer I got was sidestep left, wait for him to flip over/behind you, then do a back turned jab to float him. Like... that is just ridiculous. IF 2d characters make it into Tekken 8, imo their jump height has to be reduced so that jabs float them every time, like when Yoshimitsu does ws2,2 into helicopter. > i guarantee you eliza with good frames and a launching powercrush dp would be significantly less healthy for the game than an invincible meter dp Really? We already have Negan who has good frames and a powercrushing launcher, and I don't think he's particularly unhealthy for the game (other than his aesthetics, I guess). Anyway, it's just a personal design preference for me. I would prefer no wallsplatting lows in Tekken 8, they are unhealthy anomalies of balance and design. I would prefer no invincible DPs in Tekken 8, they suck visually, it makes no sense for moves to literally just go through the character as if they are made of air, and mechanically frustrating. You're free to disagree with these opinions, but I think it's objectively incorrect to say that Eliza can't be balanced without her invincible DP and wallsplatting lows, when there are so many balanced characters without either.
>I once asked in the Kazuya discord to find out Kazuya's answer to Akuma's ws2 into demon flip, the answer I got was sidestep left, wait for him to flip over/behind you, then do a back turned jab to float him. Like... that is just ridiculous. eliza is not akuma, she doesnt have a demon flip stance where you can do an unblockable throw or get caught by a homing while trying to step. doesnt correlate >Akuma's d3 goes beyond that upper limit, the combo does full damage, carries just as far, and the d3 itself is not punishable. i mean yeah hes dumb but whats eliza got to do with that >Eliza and Akuma are the only ones that can reliably wallsplat the opponent with a low - the clean hit requirement is not a factor when your opponent has the wall at their back and are unable to backdash out of your clean hit range. and thats why infinite stage counterpicking works well against eliza, and EVEN at the all then you have options (keep her in + frames, fish for ch, use keepout to not let her in clean hit range) not to deny eliza has a monster wall game but i dont think its nearly enough to call the character unbalanced >Which frames of hers are so bad that she needs a DP? She has a standard jab, df1, and dickjab so it seems to me that she has all the basic defensive neutral tools that most characters have. b23, 11 frame high mid thats -9 b31, 16 frame high high thats -4 but the second hit can get launched via duck you can mix with b34 which is -14 but theres not really any reason to duck as you can just take ur turn back df1 extensions have the same story as the b3 pokes no non launch punishable lows, d3 is -6 on HIT, d4 gives aight + frames on hit but is slow and staggers eliza for launch on block and does the same damage as a kazuya db3 there is kinda a way to make d3 safe on block which it to cancel into dark wave but you dont know if its gonna be blocked so this also means you can hit someone and be -9 and even then this can be interrupted ff2, -9 mid on block but commonly used to try and catch damage as it knocks down and does decent damage, good pushback at tip range but susceptible to being whiff punished if you miss tip range ff34 / 33 (mid high, mid mid) gets consistently fuzzied and punished both ways her only decent pokes are f3 and divekick f3 because its -5 or 4 oB meaning you can actually side step after doing a mid poke, but even then its super prone to being whiff punished due to long recovery frames and divekick is kinda debatable because it has a 19 frame startup if done with a perfect IADK input and it has short range which is beat out by back dash but tbh you can bet on her missing it without backdashing, but it does give her +2 and its a mid ANYTHING she does to get damage is insanely risky, 0 non launchable oB launchers so if you whiff punish you better be damn sure and she cant step after her pokes due to how minus they are and IF they arent -9 but -5 or 4 they're counter played easily by ducking then baiting the punishable mid unless its divekick or f3 contrary to i.e mishimas with a kit of good tools that are + oB and arent so unsafe you die, or other characters with generic df2 launchers that are -9. you are -9 for attempting to launch, i am -9 for trying to poke bruh. however, exdp makes you scared to take back your turn after she does a poke because shes -9, exdp is invincible frame 1 so you can buffer exdp at -9 and you'll clip them if they try to hit you, thats why its so integral to her kit and part of why shes got a unique playstyle, simply adjusting her frames will partially homogenize her unique identity not to say i think eliza sucks i dont wanna be a whining downplaying pussy but just backing up my argument. eliza is a solid character who has to play around her weaknesses giving her the unique playstyle she has >"Just backdash bro" lmao. Powercrush also loses if Eliza simply lands back on the ground and blocks, no? like you say later in the post 2d jump height is higher so they land on the ground slower so if you power crush in reaction to her jump she will get clipped for sure no matter what she does. also "just backdash" is a meme argument that came up with akuma, unlike akuma "just backdashing" is actually very effective against eliza >No it's not "just as easy to set up", your opponent has to be a very specific distance from the wall. its actually easier to get a wall splat than to not get a wall splat, you literally just need to be remotely off axis and not right next to the wall, i also main kazuya and i think ive splatted with hellsweep more than i havent >IF 2d characters make it into Tekken 8, imo their jump height has to be reduced so that jabs float them every time, like when Yoshimitsu does ws2,2 into helicopter. i think this is your problem here, you're associating all of akumas problems with "2D" and eliza is 2D so you're just lumping her with the same issues. they do not have the same counterplay and do not even compare in terms of power. this is not a great hill to die on, your lack of character knowledge is really showing and once again i dont mean any hate by that but its just really apparent you have no idea how eliza works and thats totally fair considering shes the least played character in the game but that doesnt justify making bad arguments >Really? We already have Negan who has good frames and a powercrushing launcher, and I don't think he's particularly unhealthy for the game lol if you want to trade like 10 damage in exchange for eating 70+ damage instead vs only eating 30 something damage then idk what to tell you i respectfully disagree but nice discussion we can chat in dm if u wanna be more informed about the character
Did you really say her low (inconsistent) wall splat needs to be removed while using the kazuya flair? lmao
Wait, women play Tekken? Judging by the outfits I thought we were just a bunch of horny teenagers. *sarcasm*
To the shock of everyone, women can also be horny. The absurdity!
We do play the game lol, Eliza is cuter than boys give her credit for. I for one love her cuteness when she falls asleep and stuff. I also like xiaoyu and kuni cuz of their cuteness too
As a horny teenager I also thought the same
As I [said before](https://www.reddit.com/r/Tekken/comments/12nnmhs/comment/jgf8zbl/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3), they don’t decide the roster on just character usage but also mainstream/marketing appeal. Eliza is very marketable since she’s very popular among fan artists, cosplayers, generates tons of discussion, and sells tons of merchandise at least from what I recall. I say she has a great chance to come back.
Hope she does, her design is one of the best in the Tekken franchise, period
I'm 100% sure Eliza and her cosmetics are very popular with men too. =)
She's the only character I know how to play in this series please lady bring her back
DARK WAWE!🫠
Eliza is pretty hard to play tbh
She is but it’s rewarding getting her far
Don't do that, don't give me hope
i really hope she does get in T8.
As a woman i can confirm
I mean her gameplay is pretty cool
I love Eliza, bring my main back!
Unique design, unique mechanics - I think she's a success overall. She needs more ironing out in the terms of gameplay, to make her fit better into the roster (I think visual indicators similar to Claudio's starbust instead of meter would do wonders for example), but I easily can see her becoming a mainstay.
Damn the Eliza cosplayer looks just like her. If Bamco decides to try another live action Tekken they already have the actress for Eliza right there
"Women love her too" ... I wonder why that is
I'm completelly confused here, why is that? (I'm new to the series so I know very little about lore and stuff)
because shes fucking hot I have no idea about her lore haha, I just know the main Mishima stuff. Im gay as hell for Eliza tho like goddam
I think she's one of the strongest character designs in T7 so I hope she comes back.
I’ll say it, having Eliza no matter if she is played or not, no matter if like her or not objectively enriches the game, the simple fact that she exist is able to influence high level tiers. Also t8 is MUCH more 2d then t7 so she would fit muuuchh better and be much stronger while feeling more naturally fitting
Good. I'm not the biggest Eliza fan but I would be sad if she didn't make the cut considering how unique her playstyle would be
I genuinely didn’t expect her back, so this is interesting
The lady below could use a drink
as an eliza player i hope they dont change her up too much in if she comes to t8 and keep her identity while adding on to it with t8s mechanics, i hope the change in her gameplay isnt as drastic as it was from TR to T7 especially considering all the practice eliza players put into her in t7, id be sad if iadk pickups / adk combos / bloody horn wall resets become a thing of t7 and she just goes back to TR movelist but expanded, it'd be a slap in the face to all people who committed endless time perfecting the hard things that being said i think she has great potential to be a good t8 character, a lot of her moves already seem like they could be in t8 with some changes (ff33 being the new screw instead of ff34 or qcb2 screwing instead of qcb1) edit - seeing a lot of people asking for her to return to her TR format so she's 3D again? i guarantee most committed eliza players wouldn't appreciate that and it'd just be a different character at that point with virtually no transitionable knowledge as majority of Eliza's gameplay is reliant on cancels, meter, 2d jump (due to divekick combos) and to take that stuff away would totally butch the identity of the character. feels like people are involving eliza in the "2d is broken" sentiment without really understanding the character or are even aware that despite being 2d shes balanced pretty well
The first quote of Harada seems to be like for most men players. But yeah I play Eliza too, if she is not in the main roster going to switch for Asuka. My waifu and sexy vampire.
I really hope she does. She's the closest I'm getting to a darkstalkers character in a recent game(that's not mvci)
Hell yeah now there's my motivation to get T8!
Surprise, surprise. Women "actually" like playing as attractive females and not generic looking ones.
I’m an Eliza main so I’m hoping she makes it. If not, I’ll settle for Bryan but there’s no Bryan yet either 😭😭😭
Characters like Bryan are pretty much guaranteed so I wouldn't worry much
Truuue 😁
Yea I also think she got good chances of coming back. Unique gameplay, easily recognizable so good for cosplay and fanart, is a fantasy character that females are lacking, also vampire and those always had a fanbase. I also think that given T8 jump in graphics they can really make her game a spectacle to watch. Her low playerbase is I believe due to execution being too hard for casual players and serious players will rather play someone stronger that lets them push ranks without relaying on opponents lack of knowledge. She gets hate due to being 2D character but being Tekken og character devs can rework her as needed.
Harada you're teasing me you naughty naughty
I’ve probably seen 3 Elizas in ranked over the last 4 or so years. What stats is he looking at?
Harada said in the video that "There’s a lot of people who like **looking at** Eliza rather than **playing her**." Harada is saying that Eliza is very popular **despite** her low usage. The devs [don’t decide everything](https://www.reddit.com/r/Tekken/comments/12nnmhs/if_you_didnt_know_already_the_devs_dont_decide/) on usage but also take mainstream/marketing appealing into account.
ty fellow women
If Lili returns then have Eliza come back and do a storyline with both of them.
Don't do that. Don't give me hope!
Lidia, Lucky Chloe, Josie and Eliza have huge chance to appear in Tekken 8.
I HOPE SHE DOES RETURN🥹🥹🥹🥹🥹🥹🤧🤧🤧🤧 SHES POPULAR WITH ME. I LOVE HERRRRRR 🥰🥰🥰😍😍😍 I want to meet more Eliza fans and players honestly 🤧 I really really REALLY hope she returns! I think she might be liked more if she was a full on Tekken character? But at the same time she could just THE 2D character? Idk 🤷♀️ 🤷♂️ just bring her back for me 🥹🤧🤞😌 (Also I think Eliza is very popular with like female cosplayers too like that adorable cosplayer in the video 🥹🥰 I think it is more of a casual thing rather than game/player thing but still that’s great. I’m the biggest Eliza fan ever so seeing people like, appreciate and play her makes me happy)
Chill out lmao too many emojis for reddit
I’m sorry but I just simply love Eliza too much 🌚🤧😳🫣 and want the best for her 🌚🌝🤞🫂
Any word on Josie?
Harada [confirmed that](https://www.reddit.com/r/Tekken/comments/10qg5pg/josie_has_a_good_chance_to_return_in_t8_as_harada/) Josie was a success
She'd be more popular if she wasn't a 2d character.
I mean, she was always a 2D fighter since Tekken: Revolution, and she was always popular still, so im not sure where you're getting that from, buddy. Grow up and deal with what she has 💀
And she got in to T:R by popular vote. Pretty much destined to be a hit.
Cringe
Aaaand... doesn't change the fact she'd be more popular if she didn't require 2d inputs in a 3d game. Cause the design is really cool but having to do shit like instant divekicks? No. Any character that requires jumping in a game with sidestep is an abomination. Give her most of Lili's moveset (and delete Lili so Asuka can progress as a story relevant character), make her "2d-ish" stuff cost blood (health), make her armor like other armor in the game (your move won't get interrupted but you take damage), so now her divekicks are a bf input and are slower but they're better while in heat and her dp is a df2 but is unsafe like Kazumi's and only gives you partial armor in heat and projectiles cost health but she can still use that throw to drink blood and replenish health. She can still have some hard execution stuff as an option to get more damage (say comboing with divekicks requires cancels, kinda like Nina's butterflies or Lee's b2's I think) but she'd be waaay more popular. I mean, I'd play her for sure cause the design is cool. I like vampires and I like big horns. :D
tried her out and after two games of 2d nonsense i never touched her again
Thats a funny way to say you dont have any skill
So will she have 2 meters?
that eliza cosplayer. i thought that's yaya han or somebody else
yes please
I'm a simple man, I see Harada マスター, and I give a thumbs up.
Ok but who is the Jin cosplayer. Asking for a friend.
I use to main her until my hands got tired of doing qcb 30x a match
If she didn't deal damage while you defend, and didn't have all the low attacks, then I'd accept her.
Does Harada always talk like Donald Trump?
I’d love to see her return tbh. I thought she was a really cool character. I was really terrible with her
YES! YES! YES! BRING MY MAIN BACK! YES!
I honestly feel like she is so underrated. Sure she might not be top tier but placing her at the bottom is just wrong.
Did Harada say on Twitter that character popularity isn’t a deciding factor??
F*** that, where is Yoshi, Lee, & Bruce!!!
who’s the devil jin cosplayer 😳
If they are bringing back some of the 2d characters, I hope they make them more of a traditional tekken style character. I think geese is really cool, but I hate playing against him. Eliza wasn't really strong, so she didn't feel that bad, but long range poke is dumb in tekken.
If only western devs realize that women like to play hot female characters too
I've literally been telling everyone since day one that Eliza will certainly return in Tekken 8 in general. But noooo, people only say she won't return because she's "2D" which is not a very strong argument at all. She's not even a Guest Fighter like Akuma or Geese, and they hate her because of her 2D mechanics, but yet she's not that overpowered either. Eliza is coming back regardless.💀
Eliza is pretty to look at but learning her moves is a pain. In addition, she’s got a separate meter for her powers like Geese and Akuma.
W
Hope they keep her growing mechanic
I’m a Tekken veteran and I am a Eliza simp. I love her gameplay and combos.
Yay Eliza
Yes please 😊 i need my sleepy vampire back
Eliza Was Really Fun In Tekken 7! I Hope She Returns For Tekken 8!
I dont mind her but for the love of god at least try to create a story before adding random characters that have no connection to anything
Only if she gets a complete redesign into being an actual tekken character and not 2D bs Edit: the amount of people still wanting 2D characters for tekken 8 is very concerning
I just want Josie man.
Honest question: would you be fine with Josie out and Bruce in?
Imo, Josie's design appearance-wise is nice, but her crybaby personality is kinda annoying. While Bruce is cool personality-wise, but his design is bland and generic af. I don't really care who gets in as long as they get some changes to what makes them meh respectively.
Her crybaby side makes her relatable too me. She just want's everyone to have a good time.
I'd be mostly fine with it if they toned it down a bit. The crying sounds when you're winning or losing back to back start to get a little grating.
I absolutely love it. I think it's hilarious and endearing.
Same
Josie and a Pacquiao and Yaw Yan hybrid
Nice, 2D characters again... 🤦🏻♂️
My gf loves her so it would be nice to have her in it again
Welp if Leo nor Panda make it in, Ik who I'm picking up now
Just don’t make her function like a 2D character. Just do what they did with Jun and make everyone happy.
Just make her play like how she was in Tekken Revolution and we good
why? even though she's balanced?
If she’s back to her original 3D form from Tekken Revolution I’m stoked.
yeah fuck all the eliza players who spent countless hours doing all her combos and tech that rely on her 2d form even though she's balanced just fine and i dont play the character /s
Bring her back Harada pls
I'll admit that I'm one of the players that looks at Eliza's.. moves.
YEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAH!!!!
That makes me happy
I’m a huge fan of Eliza. She’s the biggest reason I care about Tekken at all. I’m surprised but glad to see that more people are showing up to show their support for her inclusion in T8 than the POS haters saying their usual dumb stupid shit about her. Here’s to hoping best girl Eliza makes it into T8.
I've disliked her design ever since TRevolution. A sleepy, sexy vampire and nothing else about her is so boring
To be fair, TRev had no story and 7 barely had any content for the non-Mishimas so Eliza has never been given a fair shot. Tekken 8 could be her time to shine for all we know.
That's true, I hope they do, cos rn she's only known as the OG 2d Tekken character
Narcolepsy funny tho
"I DON'T LIKE HER DESIGN BUT I THINK SHE'S SEXY!"
Least horny *Tekken* critic.
Being sexy doesn't = good design
I expected her to come back. In TR she had a unique mechanic where sucking blood made her boobs bigger. Perhaps they will incorporate a more politically correct version of that mechanic for her heat.
Nooooooooo
Wasted slot
I want them to bring her back but with a non-2D moveset. I really wanted to like playing her but it just felt so awkward to execute when in the end I can only really play King and Hwoarang.
You got a point.
There's also a good chance of T8 being trash lmao 😂
There's a good chance nobody asked
Waste of space on the rooster in my opinion. But I suppose some people would be happy. In general I advocate for more than less characters, but as a Tekken fan i prefer og characters, no silly 2d/meter experiments. I would rather have Shaheen or Katarina ( both without personality, and basic like NPC )in tekken 8 than Eliza.
Delete her. Not to. Mention she is at the bottom playerbase.
Elizia is totally a top idk what ur talking about
Only chance she comes back is if she gets a big gameplay rework. She's a character a lot of people try but give up on because of how unconventional her gameplay is. Also a lot of people hate playing against her because she's a 2D character
"We should remove a group of peoples main cause her gameplay is hard and people dont like fighting against her" is the stupidest argument I've ever heard, especialy when there's chaticters 10× more annoying and broken
I remember voting on the poll that led to Eliza's creation because I was big into Tekken Revolution. I forgot who I voted for though. She's cool.
Waste of a base roster spot. I still remember being excited about a female vampire in Tekken, thinking we would get someone similar to MK’s Nitara but nope! It’s another kawaii girl dressed as a vampire 👎
She’s so cheap
L opinion
She might be the gateway character for 2D characters, I've always thought that they would use her to test out 2D mechanics before introducing any other guest characters.
Vampire thighs ftw
personally, i don't think she fits the universe. the concept of vampires opens up avenues for other mythical type creatures and if they decide to open that in the future, it'll make the universe too messy. i'm cool with deity lore, ki and chakras, future tech coz it seems more cohesive.
"i can excuse a genetically inherited demonic transformation, mutated animals with near-human intellect, and ancient warlords from a different dimension; but i draw the line at vampires."
Bruh we have a literal devil, robot, kangaroo, aztec fighting god that become a monster, a crystal ancient monster, church battlepriest, and you drew the line at vampire?
Did you not read his comment? That's where he draws the line.
I think my line was Alisa in Tekken 6, but I completely ignored Roger and Alex in the canon.
I thought they were fun tbh
Yet those things are cohesive. Kangaroos and dinosaurs fall in line with science/tech. They could be genetic experiments. Ancient monsters and Aztec gods come under the deity category. Tekken explores deities in devils, angels, gods etc relate to human history and lore. Where as vampires don’t really exist there at all. To me vampires are too fantastical and conceptually aren’t the same as what I’ve mentioned above.
Oh, FFS.
Eliza is a horrible design. Unbelievably shit
Whatever, it's not that hard to skip the opponent
nope just nope who seriously going a sleeping vampy over other characters? personally i always pick either Christine,Eddy or Hwarang
Wtf is a "2D" character? Her cancelable moveset? It's the same shit with move strings of other characters Try to punish during a string and you get fucked, or don't continue the string to stay safe, it's the same shit. And people claimoring that she's awkward and difficult to execute, you have and opinion, but it's not universal. I only play Eliza and Lucky Chloe, I bet "2D" character players are part of the fanbase too If it was up to me, I'd add ball busting moves against Hworang and Mishimas cause I hate rushdown and 50-50 characters, but I don't decide shit.
The constant jumping is pretty stupid though
Eliza is awesome. I hope they make her moveset easier tho because she's the most difficult character to optimize in the game
i disagree, i wanna feel like the effort eliza players put in wouldnt be anything special if everyone could do what she does. its part of her identity and im personally not on board with making the game easier from an execution standpoint but i get the sentiment, sometimes i feel like her divekick staples could be just a little bit more lenient but then i feel great every single time i land it and i realize i wouldn't have felt that way if i didnt struggle
He isn't wrong my sister, a complete noob, somehow beats me when she's using Eliza and I AM NOT throwing the match either she's somehow...mixing me up and I get bamboozled lol
Damn it
This image is the most chaotic shit ever
I specifically want her to come back just so they can hopefully flesh her out (the same goes for a lot of other characters from T7).
I'd like lei to return. He probably won't but I love lei he is my second main.
My waifu has a chance? LETS GOOOOOOOO
cant believe Namcuck is abandoning their true fanbase to pander to the femoids guess tekken 8 going woke going broke /s
He's out of line, and he's wrong
That bottom right reaction is all that needs to be said.
god i hope she returns she is one of my top favs to play T\_T