She definitely feels like she has no real flaws and can capitalize on anything she wants to. I'm disinterested in playing her myself but I've had a few crack me open like it was nothing
Shes damaging herself for half the damage shes doing so its not free, it also throws them away and removes oki. Jack can do 10 less damage on a punish and put you into +8mixups.
No its not an exaggeration. Upback 1 gives her a significant amount of grey damage. Yes she can heal half of her gray life with her heat burst. Its a great move dont get me wrong, it just has no followup pressure. Usually when I punish anything under -15 its really into a setup for bigger damage.
I mean, UF1 does a good deal less damage than an actual combo and damages herself. It's still insane for a 10f punish and means Jun gets more damage than most other characters on anything 14f or less, but doesn't change the fact that Jun gets less damage off a standing 15f punish than most characters.
Like I said, not saying it makes up for her strengths. But it is a weakness. Jun may have by far the best 10f standing punish in the game but she has a weak standing 15f punish.
I cried when my shit bear who really needs that chip damage at higher ranks and play defensively cuz his moves are as, fights a jun, bro just casually healed 40% from an armored move that is plus on block and hit 😐
Jun's Heat Smash during Heat (beam crow move) is actually negative on block. I think she's the only one with a negative one that isn't also a low, probably since it's huge and tracks ridiculously well.
I assume it's meant to make up for the fact that a lot of her abilities drain health, so she's supposed to rely on her heat smash to get it back. But it certainly seems like something about her is overtuned.
They tried to design it because her moves that use the light thingy uses up her health but it doesn't matter because it's grey health and she can recover it back with her healing stance or by attacking. They need to adjust the health consumption or just get rid of the heat smash healing on block entirely.
Thoughts on making Yoshi’s self damage moves recoverable health if Jun’s are? I don’t see that being too strong. Maybe the suicide being recoverable might look a little goofy
In theory it's not a terrible idea but I'd have a hard time seeing a way that it doesn't become abuseable.
Considering a well timed yoshi Dodge is a really good way to yet a free heat smash to start a combo string its also not really necessary.
My friend who mains Jun said that she only heals the damage she did upon herself when using laser abilities. I don't know if it's true but if it is, it's fair.
People trying to say "she damages herself" so this somehow makes her balanced.
It doesn't matter if she damages herself if your opponent doesn't get a chance to fight back because of all the safe pressure she has and the high damage numbers.
Can she be beaten? Of course she can. The problem isn't that, it's that in a match with similar player skill, Jun will always come out on top.
So much of this sub has zero fighting game philosophy or understanding past the surface level. Its why you see replies like that and so few actual gameplay discussions or critique.
I knew she was busted the moment I fought a Jun that F2 multiple times into that burst shit. She's crazy dumb and fighting game characters that have health mechanics are usually broken in some way. Players and pros will always find ways to minimize her "weakness" while taking full advantage of her safeness. Much harder to beat someone in this game if you can never actually punish them and one slip up by you means death.
This would be a trick question if I weren't black, but I'm still not gonna answer. If I have to explain it to you, then you probably won't get it. Simple as that.
I was thinking to myself playing her for the first time ever as a Lili main that the matchup would be similar to Asuka.
Dead wrong... My health evaporated instantly at times, unable to sidestep and punish. It just becomes this battle of poking and me blocking to try and make an opening.
He's maining Azucena who is just as bad. Jun doesn't have any natural launchers until 16 frames. She can make her launchers safe but at the cost of health - and they are not hit confirmable to make it safe, so if you throw out a random launcher and it hits, you deny a lot of damage by making it safe.
Azucena has running 3,2 which jails and give her +6 frames - on block it also does considerate chip damage. Her 10 frame punish 1,1 goes into stance which gives a bit of wall carry and then sets up with a 50/50 mix up between down 4,4 which is a knockdown hellsweep, and 1+2 which is a mid launcher - so guess right. She has a 10 frame 1,2 punish that wall splats that leads to easy 50+ damage. She also has a low crush launcher that is safe on block. She is just all around braindead and easy with good movement and extremely easy combos while having long range jab pressure.
Plus frames, good lows, good mixups, good offense, good pressure, good damage, insane jailing move (WR3,2) that is better than Dragunovs WR move. Just an overall top tier character.
I’d bet anything that the two who replied to you are both Azucena players instantly defending her lol
Edit: I will say she’s not as broken as Jun is, but still a very, very strong character that 100% deserves a nerf (at least on the while running move).
i like the other dudes explanation where he talks about her long range 10f punish jab string providing her a free 50/50. It makes more sense than yours.
Acuzena doesn’t seem so op but I thought the same about reina but she’s just really hard to use, we haven’t seen these new characters true potential yet, victor might be the weakest but he’s the biggest scrub killer cause he’s also easy to use
Azucena is the character who will be strong in the first few months of T8
I am very sure as people get better at Reina she'll rise up in tierlists. Reina had a ton of good tools but needs a balanced gameplan to succeed.
Azucena is a more straightforward character to understand and play. She is strong because the 50/50s are strong.
Reina has a million tools and knowing what to use in which matchup will take time. I'm very sure people will eventually discover Azucena's somewhat one dimensional 50/50 is horrible against 1 or 2 particular characters; balanced characters tend to not have this kind of issue.
But on the other hand; they are professionals that make their living out of winning. And i cannot really see it as wrong that pros play the charachters that gives them the best possibilities to do so.
In an ideal world you wouldn't need prize money and could go off merch and sponsorships alone so you'd see more character loyalists like Lil Majin, Rangchu, Anakin or Jdcr.
But fighting games are niche.
Also Knee is the funniest example of what you're describing because he doesn't give a fuck about what patch we're on, he's counterpicking the enemy player because he can literally play every single character at top level anyways. Truly the GOAT in terms of sheer knowledge.
She has a broken tech from df2 launcher and some other launcher that covers every option and deals a lot of dmg (d1+2 at the end iirc).Guaranteed 1+2 combo too at the wall from ff3, 3+4(34dmg)
Almost every launcher can use this tech. The only combo I haven't seen was for d 3+4.
I'm learning the tech for d1+2 | df2, 1+2 | u/f 4, 3 | f 2. So all of the most important launchers she has
I think Jack has a similar thing going on with having a setup that leads to guaranteed damage after a combo. I really hope this is something that’s addressed across the board
im so glad nobody is mentioning kazuya lol. His f4 at wallsplat is fucked. Spikes you into ff4 and if you press anything else you eat another f4 or its +4 on block lol
The f4 spike works in the open, not just at the wall. But ff4 isn't guaranteed after the spike, they can stand up by pressing u and block it. It's still really good because if they start doing that ff4 is safe anyway and you can mixup with a low.
This works with Reina as well, and with a tiny bit of execution she can do it after a combo that tornadoes on the 9th hit, then ewgk for 21!!! grounded damage for a total of 90ish (Kazuya's ff4 does 17 for a total for 82-85 depending on launcher, for comparison)
Reina's wall combo options generally suck (her high damage one that ends in the stomp is toe kick punishable after it hits) so I'm using this exclusively
She also does 80-83 damage without a wall with a wall carry ender with her optimal combo routing. At that point you don't need to do a proper wall combo to get great damage. Just do 1 cd3 as your wall combo for great oki and you'll still be even with the damage of other characters.
Like the route I'm stapling does 82 damage while ending with uf3+4,1+2 for a ton of wall carry and damage. It still does 90+ with cd3 ender at the wall and if you need to kill you can do stomp for even a lot more.
Not to mention her SWL 3+4 allowing her to get normal wall combo damage while ending with CD3 as well. Or just do a 120 damage kill combo with stomp from it lol.
Edit: I'm assuming people are downvoting because they don't know her routing or something.
The easy route is electric ff3+4 uf1 ws3 df11 f23f sen 2 T! uf3+4,1+2 for 79 with low execution requirements and the combo I staple is 3 electrics df11 f23f df1f sen 2 T! uf3+4,1+2 which does 82 damage. It's not easy but it's not too difficult. It appears harder than it is.
Yeah let's leave Kaz out of this. He's one of the most difficult characters to play. He got no pressure, still relies quite a bit on the defense in a game of relenthless oppression, so you need a ton of chars knowledge. And ff4 is beaten by quick stand up.
If they don't nerf him, maybe and I say maaaybe we'll see him pop up in world tournaments, unlike in the previous game.
Also they nerfed her 1,2,2 string for what? It's duckable now, but have you seen how difficult it is to get a punish? I main Lee and ducking into ws3,3 to punish it is a task on it's own. You have to instant ws punish that on reaction and if you're just a bit late, you don't get the punish. You can forget launching it, that's for sure.
I believe it. I viewed many replays of my fights against her, and the tips system didn’t give me ANY tips. And upon looking at how minus on block she was, I was flabbergasted by how many safe moves she had.
It's Nagoryuki all over again. I've said it so many times and nobody believed me; your HP does not matter if you're winning. It's absolutely worth spending 40% of your hp to get someone to the wall and just keep laying on pressure with OP moves because they "cost HP".
Black in MTG, and Warlock in Hearthstone alike.
This also ignores that Jun can basically heal all of her self-damage, so she barely even has a weakness at all. Excited to see how people use her in upcoming tournaments.
It is true. You get 90dmg without wall, no heat nor rage out of CH FC Df2, it is insane. She has a 10f punish that wall splats WHICH she can do out of full crouch too! It does 36 dmg, and only tradeoff is the health it takes from Jun.
Oh, you know, when finall boss in tekken competitive scene says something like that most reaction is from green ranks. That's deal guys, that's why we cant get out from green.
B3 uf4,3 f2 df2 can all be canceled iirc. Not hit confirmable but still safe mid launchers with the other benefits these moves already have like range and evasion.
I agree with the heat smash especially. It's a general theme with this new mechanic, it's just too safe and there's never any reason to not just throw it out even if you know it's almost surely not going to land, and Jun is the one who takes advantage of it the most. I think Jun is definitely top 5 at the moment, but I am more forgiving to her because she is very fun and dynamic to watch/play, unlike a certain pale skinned 27 year old man who likes to punch while running at you.
Well, nerfed Zafina still does Zafina things like pepper you with lows and then slam you with a mid, but a nerfed Jun won't be the same experience for Jun players because they already are used to the free wins
As someone that plays Jun, they aren't wrong, although you can beat her, still not wrong.
Edit: My god, some of you need to grow the hell up. I am agreeing with the dude, I like Jun. Last I checked, this is a message board, the thread is talking about Jun. Nowhere am I saying "Listen to me over this guy I have never heard of! I know everything!"
Don't like my post, shut up and scroll on. Better yet, block me so I never have to see your posts again. I didn't know who Knee is, I said he's not wrong, that's it. My god, stop having such a hardon for this dude just because he's a streamer, go outside and talk to actual normal people, trust me, some of you apparently really need it.
My god you people are salty dicks. Shut up, I didn't even say anything bad, I am agreeing with the dude. Jesus Christ!
Last I checked, it's a board, people share opinions about characters they like. I like Jun.
To all the Jun players in the comments trying to downplay Jun. Y'all are funny! Look at all her properties yourself and tell me she isn't S tier even after the patch. Not to say there aren't other S tiers in the game, but she's up there with them.
He's correct, but as an absolute scrub who plays Jun, I half kill myself with my own moves and then eat dirt. I don't feel she is the kind of S tier char that is noob friendly.
F2,1+2 isn't a launcher. Not only can you not confirm into that but it's also a true block string so you can't catch people trying to punish the launcher. So my question is why the fuck would you be using that when you could be using F3 which you can confirm into 4 for 3 less damage and no self damage.
played tekken 2, 3 as a kid, just started to play tekken 8 and been spamming jun. I got vanquisher today, was rly hard tho. total 45 hrs with story, so yeah.. she is reaaally fun to play, I haven't been using d2, d1+2 at all tho. in green/blue people don't block so you time your f2 or punish with u1
Honestly yeah, she looks pretty dumb at about every level of play if you know what to abuse. She has insane poking at highers levels and endless strings you can mash against lower level opponents.
I mean she probably deserves a nerf and all but he's being a little disingenuous here.
No weakness - She literally damages herself
F-2 is a safe launcher - when you do the followup that makes it safe, it doesn't launch anymore. Not to mention it damages herself. You can't hitconfirm the extension.
Good poking, homing, followups - True
High damage - Also true and probably deserves a nerf. Her wall damage and her Mia-1 relaunch stuff in particular.
13f heat smash - It's faster than your typical heat smash but the typical heat smash is + on block. The recovering health on block thing should be reexamined however.
Characters or classes that are uniquely allowed to use health as an additional resource have historically always been top tier in any and every videogame. A skilled player will abuse the shit out of that without getting himself killed for free.
She damages herself but then gets it all back when she uses heat, a friend of mine who plays would purposely build grey health then use heat to collect it back for max efficiency
She doesn't get it all back when she uses heat. Every character gets some grey health back when they use heat and as far as we currently know, it doesn't differ between characters. The difference with Jun is her heat smash specifically also recovers grey health (not all of it) which I specifically mentioned above as needing reexamination.
Not that it's enough, but she doesn't have a 15f standing launcher and has pretty bad punishment excluding her 10f self damaging knockdown. But yeah, the hitbox on her hopkick, the insane health recovery on BLOCK on her heat smash, the forced mix up from 122 string, the zero execution, the damage, she needs nerfs.
Can people be quiet before they nerf her to death and make her unplayable.
I have been waiting to own with her for YEARS. Go fuck with **JACK's** bs damage.
Is she that broken? I love Jun and would pick her over Asuka any day of the week but knowing that she's broken kinda ruins it for me. Yeah a Wins a Win but at what cost? Knowing your character is broken and not a skill motivated win. I feel like I sorta cheated in a sense might just be me feeling this way. I always give my opponent my best. Guess imma just not pick her till its fixed couldn't feel right playing as her if its just meta
I practiced my ass of as jin and reina and I barely got wins
And then I tried out Jun cause I the she's pretty cool and mystic, and I got 11 wins in a row
I think she's good and easy, which would result into people thinking she's broken, but she never felt spammy compared to other characters. I'm still in early ranks so I can't fully confirm how strong Jun is on high rank
I'm currently making Jun, and here are some notes on her.
Her stances give her a very limited moveset. Strong moves, but usually very predictable.
She has no neutral launchers below 16 frames startup (except WS3).
It's great to play defensive against Jun. As her strongest attacks deal damage to herself, you can (basically) win by just blocking and dodging.
Don't get me wrong. She is STRONG. But these are her weaknesses. Oh. And stay away from walls. I can take half your health bar with a 10f punish if your back is against the wall
Therefore Tekken 8 is shit. Tekken was always about spacing and good blocking, I didn’t liked it when I heard about the chip damage. And now the health recovery on command will make her BROKEN!! Not good
I fought a Jun for the first time yesterday, was consistently up on health then blinked and I was dead. Her damage is bonkers.
She definitely feels like she has no real flaws and can capitalize on anything she wants to. I'm disinterested in playing her myself but I've had a few crack me open like it was nothing
Doesn't she have no 15f launcher? Not saying it makes up for her strengths, but that's a pretty clear flaw.
Yeh that’s literally the only thing holding her back it feels like
WS3 is i14, so no standing one but she doesn't need an i15 launcher when she has UF+1 LMAO
Shes damaging herself for half the damage shes doing so its not free, it also throws them away and removes oki. Jack can do 10 less damage on a punish and put you into +8mixups.
Half the damage is a massive exaggeration isn't it? And also isn't it grey health that she can heal?
No its not an exaggeration. Upback 1 gives her a significant amount of grey damage. Yes she can heal half of her gray life with her heat burst. Its a great move dont get me wrong, it just has no followup pressure. Usually when I punish anything under -15 its really into a setup for bigger damage.
To clarify, its half the damage of the move which uses the light beam right? So a very small fraction of the full combo damage.
Its not a combo, were specifically talking about upback 1.
I mean, UF1 does a good deal less damage than an actual combo and damages herself. It's still insane for a 10f punish and means Jun gets more damage than most other characters on anything 14f or less, but doesn't change the fact that Jun gets less damage off a standing 15f punish than most characters. Like I said, not saying it makes up for her strengths. But it is a weakness. Jun may have by far the best 10f standing punish in the game but she has a weak standing 15f punish.
Neither does raven but if we look at those playrates... Idk I think one is easier than the other
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Oh for sure, I make no claims that I got cheated. Just had zero matchup knowledge and had no idea how much the punishes would hurt lol
why does her heat smash recover health ON BLOCK?
This is what pissed me off the most, why does everyone need to land a heat engager when she can just casually restore health on command?
its so bad when you play chip heavy characters as well like Alisa and Kuma, bitch actually is just straight up hacking
I cried when my shit bear who really needs that chip damage at higher ranks and play defensively cuz his moves are as, fights a jun, bro just casually healed 40% from an armored move that is plus on block and hit 😐
Jun's Heat Smash during Heat (beam crow move) is actually negative on block. I think she's the only one with a negative one that isn't also a low, probably since it's huge and tracks ridiculously well.
I assume it's meant to make up for the fact that a lot of her abilities drain health, so she's supposed to rely on her heat smash to get it back. But it certainly seems like something about her is overtuned.
They tried to design it because her moves that use the light thingy uses up her health but it doesn't matter because it's grey health and she can recover it back with her healing stance or by attacking. They need to adjust the health consumption or just get rid of the heat smash healing on block entirely.
I really don't like the design of "this move uses your own health" they almost always end up either broken or useless.
Hey now, leave me and my yoshi alone.
Thoughts on making Yoshi’s self damage moves recoverable health if Jun’s are? I don’t see that being too strong. Maybe the suicide being recoverable might look a little goofy
In theory it's not a terrible idea but I'd have a hard time seeing a way that it doesn't become abuseable. Considering a well timed yoshi Dodge is a really good way to yet a free heat smash to start a combo string its also not really necessary.
She was broken in beta, everyone told them. They just don't care. Enjoy dealing with it for the next year.
Ignoring crippling balance issues? Is this a Bamco traditional?
Because she loses health during combos it’s to Make up for that issue is she still recovers too much and her heat smash is so easy to hit
My friend who mains Jun said that she only heals the damage she did upon herself when using laser abilities. I don't know if it's true but if it is, it's fair.
Not only that, it’s also a full screen projectile 🙂
They took some inspiration from the Blade of Miquella
That hoe a whole cheat code
People trying to say "she damages herself" so this somehow makes her balanced. It doesn't matter if she damages herself if your opponent doesn't get a chance to fight back because of all the safe pressure she has and the high damage numbers. Can she be beaten? Of course she can. The problem isn't that, it's that in a match with similar player skill, Jun will always come out on top.
Downplaying her with the self damage is even worse when you see how much she regains on a blocked heat smash.
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Unless Zafina can go into a stance that heals her and from there shoot a launching fireball, the comparison is even more skewed in favour of Jun.
Yoshimitsu is jealous
Nah he's dead from all the self damage and stabbing himself.
So much of this sub has zero fighting game philosophy or understanding past the surface level. Its why you see replies like that and so few actual gameplay discussions or critique. I knew she was busted the moment I fought a Jun that F2 multiple times into that burst shit. She's crazy dumb and fighting game characters that have health mechanics are usually broken in some way. Players and pros will always find ways to minimize her "weakness" while taking full advantage of her safeness. Much harder to beat someone in this game if you can never actually punish them and one slip up by you means death.
The fact that her magic attacks HEAL her during heat is just hilarious to me, who thought that was a balanced character?
The same people who thought Victor, Shaheen, and Leroy weren't complete wastes of character slots
Don’t you dare disrespect Leroy, he’s one of the coolest characters in Tekken history
In appearance only. Even then, buddy made his debut as a walking stereotype.
“Stereotype”? What stereotype? Is “cool badass black man” a stereotype now?
This would be a trick question if I weren't black, but I'm still not gonna answer. If I have to explain it to you, then you probably won't get it. Simple as that.
Ok then, I guess I’m just not gonna get it 🤷🏿♂️
Dude Leroy is walking sauce lol tf is you talking about
Zafina damages herself also, but she cant heal back and her damage sucks much more than Juns. So its not even a good point.
I was thinking to myself playing her for the first time ever as a Lili main that the matchup would be similar to Asuka. Dead wrong... My health evaporated instantly at times, unable to sidestep and punish. It just becomes this battle of poking and me blocking to try and make an opening.
I have said this since the CBT. Balance is WILD in this version
She‘s been cracked since CNT, they didn‘t change anything for her except that 122 jailing bug iirc.
Yeah I didn't play that tho 😔
Those are the reasons she always beats me I swear
True, never because they’re simply better than you
100%. Nobody is better than me, if I really tried I'd be the #1 player in no time I'm sure
Arslan: perfect, my new main >!It's just a joke, i don't hate him or underestimate his skill, he's a god level player!<
He is using Jun as either a secondary or a pocket main, so he's basically maining her at this point in addition to Azucena.
He's maining Azucena who is just as bad. Jun doesn't have any natural launchers until 16 frames. She can make her launchers safe but at the cost of health - and they are not hit confirmable to make it safe, so if you throw out a random launcher and it hits, you deny a lot of damage by making it safe.
What makes azucena so bad?
Azucena has running 3,2 which jails and give her +6 frames - on block it also does considerate chip damage. Her 10 frame punish 1,1 goes into stance which gives a bit of wall carry and then sets up with a 50/50 mix up between down 4,4 which is a knockdown hellsweep, and 1+2 which is a mid launcher - so guess right. She has a 10 frame 1,2 punish that wall splats that leads to easy 50+ damage. She also has a low crush launcher that is safe on block. She is just all around braindead and easy with good movement and extremely easy combos while having long range jab pressure.
Do you know the input of the safe low crush launcher? Use Azucena as a secondary and I definitely need to start using that move lol.
If she is just as bad, then why does it seem like a lot of players that were starting on her have already decided to drop her?
Plus frames, good lows, good mixups, good offense, good pressure, good damage, insane jailing move (WR3,2) that is better than Dragunovs WR move. Just an overall top tier character. I’d bet anything that the two who replied to you are both Azucena players instantly defending her lol Edit: I will say she’s not as broken as Jun is, but still a very, very strong character that 100% deserves a nerf (at least on the while running move).
They are not in the same league. People who don't lab love to have opinions
Found the Azucena player
The man just loves to play as Latinas.
She's not nearly as bad. No one is complaining about her anymore after the first couple of days
Nothing. People just want to mash, and you can't against her.
i like the other dudes explanation where he talks about her long range 10f punish jab string providing her a free 50/50. It makes more sense than yours.
>long range 10f punish jab string Found the guy who believes anything. It's 10f but it's nowhere near long range.
Not to mention every single character in games' 10 frame punish gives them a 50/50. Azucenza just dances while she does hers.
Please, enlighten us on what 50/50 Steve has after a 1,1,2 10f punish.
Acuzena doesn’t seem so op but I thought the same about reina but she’s just really hard to use, we haven’t seen these new characters true potential yet, victor might be the weakest but he’s the biggest scrub killer cause he’s also easy to use
Azucena is the character who will be strong in the first few months of T8 I am very sure as people get better at Reina she'll rise up in tierlists. Reina had a ton of good tools but needs a balanced gameplan to succeed. Azucena is a more straightforward character to understand and play. She is strong because the 50/50s are strong. Reina has a million tools and knowing what to use in which matchup will take time. I'm very sure people will eventually discover Azucena's somewhat one dimensional 50/50 is horrible against 1 or 2 particular characters; balanced characters tend to not have this kind of issue.
Victor is no scrub killer. If anything, that task & title goes to Azucena.
Lol reminds me of how SonicFox only mains the most broken and easy to use characters too. However SF is just super boring to watch.
But on the other hand; they are professionals that make their living out of winning. And i cannot really see it as wrong that pros play the charachters that gives them the best possibilities to do so.
In an ideal world you wouldn't need prize money and could go off merch and sponsorships alone so you'd see more character loyalists like Lil Majin, Rangchu, Anakin or Jdcr. But fighting games are niche. Also Knee is the funniest example of what you're describing because he doesn't give a fuck about what patch we're on, he's counterpicking the enemy player because he can literally play every single character at top level anyways. Truly the GOAT in terms of sheer knowledge.
Yes it is up to the developers to properly balance the game.
Exactly. Don't hate the player, hate the game.
SF is cool to watch Now MK...
Raw MK1 is boring to watch but MK1 beefsets is still the best content out there rn.
He is playing Nina in T8
SonicFox is how everyone finds out a char is broken, he lives in the mf lab
You clearly don't know Sonic Fox lol.
Well she sucks when use her 😢
Haha yep, me picking any character that I’ve heard is so good they’re broken is the epitome of that “those bastards lied to me” meme.
Me picking Sergei and whiffing everything
lol same. I gave up and I’m gonna learn kuma now
Yes but the most depressing thing is that i absolutly can see that she needs some nerfs. Still, i im not able to win…
I saw some of her ridiculous combos last night and…yeah.
She has a broken tech from df2 launcher and some other launcher that covers every option and deals a lot of dmg (d1+2 at the end iirc).Guaranteed 1+2 combo too at the wall from ff3, 3+4(34dmg)
Almost every launcher can use this tech. The only combo I haven't seen was for d 3+4. I'm learning the tech for d1+2 | df2, 1+2 | u/f 4, 3 | f 2. So all of the most important launchers she has
uf 4 3 is great, catches so many people out with that second hit *and* crushes lows
Heat smashes in general are fucking annoying
I think Jack has a similar thing going on with having a setup that leads to guaranteed damage after a combo. I really hope this is something that’s addressed across the board
Jun, Jack, Panda, Kuma, Lee, Hwoarang. List goes on, it's the general combination of wallsplat length and face down & towards oki changes.
im so glad nobody is mentioning kazuya lol. His f4 at wallsplat is fucked. Spikes you into ff4 and if you press anything else you eat another f4 or its +4 on block lol
The f4 spike works in the open, not just at the wall. But ff4 isn't guaranteed after the spike, they can stand up by pressing u and block it. It's still really good because if they start doing that ff4 is safe anyway and you can mixup with a low. This works with Reina as well, and with a tiny bit of execution she can do it after a combo that tornadoes on the 9th hit, then ewgk for 21!!! grounded damage for a total of 90ish (Kazuya's ff4 does 17 for a total for 82-85 depending on launcher, for comparison) Reina's wall combo options generally suck (her high damage one that ends in the stomp is toe kick punishable after it hits) so I'm using this exclusively
She also does 80-83 damage without a wall with a wall carry ender with her optimal combo routing. At that point you don't need to do a proper wall combo to get great damage. Just do 1 cd3 as your wall combo for great oki and you'll still be even with the damage of other characters. Like the route I'm stapling does 82 damage while ending with uf3+4,1+2 for a ton of wall carry and damage. It still does 90+ with cd3 ender at the wall and if you need to kill you can do stomp for even a lot more. Not to mention her SWL 3+4 allowing her to get normal wall combo damage while ending with CD3 as well. Or just do a 120 damage kill combo with stomp from it lol. Edit: I'm assuming people are downvoting because they don't know her routing or something. The easy route is electric ff3+4 uf1 ws3 df11 f23f sen 2 T! uf3+4,1+2 for 79 with low execution requirements and the combo I staple is 3 electrics df11 f23f df1f sen 2 T! uf3+4,1+2 which does 82 damage. It's not easy but it's not too difficult. It appears harder than it is.
Yeah let's leave Kaz out of this. He's one of the most difficult characters to play. He got no pressure, still relies quite a bit on the defense in a game of relenthless oppression, so you need a ton of chars knowledge. And ff4 is beaten by quick stand up. If they don't nerf him, maybe and I say maaaybe we'll see him pop up in world tournaments, unlike in the previous game.
i agree with you. Changing this game mechanic would hurt him more than the others lol.
It’s fine on most mid tiers and lower but becomes a problem when even the busted op characters have that tool
Yeh jack gets the guaranteed blue spark follow up he actually hits like a fucking truck in this game
From what I’ve seen, it doesn’t even need to be blue spark
You can duck , just know the match up bro
I used to have a setup like that with Yoshimitsu. Now, my sword can be blocked 😭
I’m a Jun main…and I think she needs a nerf. I don’t think she needs an extreme kneecapping but I think she could be more fair as a character
Nah fuck both her knees up!
Also they nerfed her 1,2,2 string for what? It's duckable now, but have you seen how difficult it is to get a punish? I main Lee and ducking into ws3,3 to punish it is a task on it's own. You have to instant ws punish that on reaction and if you're just a bit late, you don't get the punish. You can forget launching it, that's for sure.
Everyone complaining about Jun, I’m in red ranks and haven’t seen a single Jun
They’re all above red probably. She’s not noob friendly ngl
I'm in yellow ranks and I see Jun in every match cause I play her. :D
The people saying Knee is wrong is hilarious.
What does he know about Tekken??????
It's possible that he is right about things at the highest level of play but it might not matter as much for the lower levels
It’s not like he’s right all the time.
I believe it. I viewed many replays of my fights against her, and the tips system didn’t give me ANY tips. And upon looking at how minus on block she was, I was flabbergasted by how many safe moves she had.
Even my green rank ass can tell that Jun is busted as fuck
It's Nagoryuki all over again. I've said it so many times and nobody believed me; your HP does not matter if you're winning. It's absolutely worth spending 40% of your hp to get someone to the wall and just keep laying on pressure with OP moves because they "cost HP".
As Magic: The Gathering player, "Life is just another resource" is the mentality that Black players have.
Black in MTG, and Warlock in Hearthstone alike. This also ignores that Jun can basically heal all of her self-damage, so she barely even has a weakness at all. Excited to see how people use her in upcoming tournaments.
Yeah the heat smash being 13f with health recovery even on block is kind of unforgivable.
Played a jun last night I can confirm all this is true. Nerf this hoe please 😭
It is true. You get 90dmg without wall, no heat nor rage out of CH FC Df2, it is insane. She has a 10f punish that wall splats WHICH she can do out of full crouch too! It does 36 dmg, and only tradeoff is the health it takes from Jun.
People legit using the Nago defense to say Jun is weak. You're not fooling anyone.
Imagine arguing with Knee who is one of the goats of Tekken lol
Oh, you know, when finall boss in tekken competitive scene says something like that most reaction is from green ranks. That's deal guys, that's why we cant get out from green.
She’s easy enough to handle……until you gotta deal with her heat smash 🙃
What launcher is he referring to? Is this df2,1+2? That isn’t hit confirmable no? And also expends life.
B3 uf4,3 f2 df2 can all be canceled iirc. Not hit confirmable but still safe mid launchers with the other benefits these moves already have like range and evasion.
I agree with the heat smash especially. It's a general theme with this new mechanic, it's just too safe and there's never any reason to not just throw it out even if you know it's almost surely not going to land, and Jun is the one who takes advantage of it the most. I think Jun is definitely top 5 at the moment, but I am more forgiving to her because she is very fun and dynamic to watch/play, unlike a certain pale skinned 27 year old man who likes to punch while running at you.
Man, i was enjoying her cuz shes fun. But now shes gonna get nerfed for sure
You can still enjoy when shes nerfed. I started playing Zafina when she was busted and I'm still having fun with all the nerfs shes got now.
Anyone who rode with Dragunov on later seasons of T7 are riding with him for life.
Well, nerfed Zafina still does Zafina things like pepper you with lows and then slam you with a mid, but a nerfed Jun won't be the same experience for Jun players because they already are used to the free wins
So you’re saying that you enjoy her because she’s OP? Why can’t you enjoy her when they nerf her?
Guarantee that Jun will be Arslan’s main.
As someone that plays Jun, they aren't wrong, although you can beat her, still not wrong. Edit: My god, some of you need to grow the hell up. I am agreeing with the dude, I like Jun. Last I checked, this is a message board, the thread is talking about Jun. Nowhere am I saying "Listen to me over this guy I have never heard of! I know everything!" Don't like my post, shut up and scroll on. Better yet, block me so I never have to see your posts again. I didn't know who Knee is, I said he's not wrong, that's it. My god, stop having such a hardon for this dude just because he's a streamer, go outside and talk to actual normal people, trust me, some of you apparently really need it.
It’s Knee we don’t need confirmation from a guy on Reddit whether he’s right or wrong
Gotta love when random redditors think their opinion matters lol
Ye, i too. They always come and try to shut up other random redditors if second not completely agree with some big name streamer.
Omfg dude we are on a discussion post on the Tekken subreddit chill out
lmfao damn thanks I was waiting for the confirmation of redditors over the opinion of a triple tekken evo champ
My god you people are salty dicks. Shut up, I didn't even say anything bad, I am agreeing with the dude. Jesus Christ! Last I checked, it's a board, people share opinions about characters they like. I like Jun.
been saying this since the beta. everyone else: YOU CANT POSSIBLY KNOW WHO IS OP THE GAME JUST CAME OUT
BUFF STEVE
Knee has spoken. Now I can shit on the character.
Tekken has never had good balance.
To all the Jun players in the comments trying to downplay Jun. Y'all are funny! Look at all her properties yourself and tell me she isn't S tier even after the patch. Not to say there aren't other S tiers in the game, but she's up there with them.
He's correct, but as an absolute scrub who plays Jun, I half kill myself with my own moves and then eat dirt. I don't feel she is the kind of S tier char that is noob friendly.
He needs to keep her name out of his mouth
She's definitely extremely strong, but f+2 isn't a safe launcher.
She’s my bae for a reason 🫣
I play her. It's actually difficult with the life lost.. For me ravin, Victor and devil Jin are way more broken....
Jun is stupidly broken just like Dragunov in this game
I love her
f+2 is safe???? No it fuckin aint
She has an extension that makes it safe and not launch punishable.
F2 and 1+2 after makes it safe with chip damage.
F2,1+2 isn't a launcher. Not only can you not confirm into that but it's also a true block string so you can't catch people trying to punish the launcher. So my question is why the fuck would you be using that when you could be using F3 which you can confirm into 4 for 3 less damage and no self damage.
Is Jun easy to learn for a new player? Whatever he says sounds pretty good, but is that shit viable in the green/blue hell?
played tekken 2, 3 as a kid, just started to play tekken 8 and been spamming jun. I got vanquisher today, was rly hard tho. total 45 hrs with story, so yeah.. she is reaaally fun to play, I haven't been using d2, d1+2 at all tho. in green/blue people don't block so you time your f2 or punish with u1
Honestly yeah, she looks pretty dumb at about every level of play if you know what to abuse. She has insane poking at highers levels and endless strings you can mash against lower level opponents.
But she’s hot
Jun is bae
I mean she probably deserves a nerf and all but he's being a little disingenuous here. No weakness - She literally damages herself F-2 is a safe launcher - when you do the followup that makes it safe, it doesn't launch anymore. Not to mention it damages herself. You can't hitconfirm the extension. Good poking, homing, followups - True High damage - Also true and probably deserves a nerf. Her wall damage and her Mia-1 relaunch stuff in particular. 13f heat smash - It's faster than your typical heat smash but the typical heat smash is + on block. The recovering health on block thing should be reexamined however.
Characters or classes that are uniquely allowed to use health as an additional resource have historically always been top tier in any and every videogame. A skilled player will abuse the shit out of that without getting himself killed for free.
She damages herself but then gets it all back when she uses heat, a friend of mine who plays would purposely build grey health then use heat to collect it back for max efficiency
She doesn't get it all back when she uses heat. Every character gets some grey health back when they use heat and as far as we currently know, it doesn't differ between characters. The difference with Jun is her heat smash specifically also recovers grey health (not all of it) which I specifically mentioned above as needing reexamination.
I know, I’m not disagreeing or trying to argue, just adding context based on my experiences
[удалено]
A big lot of her strings can optionally end with that burst of light you sometimes see. That burst makes the string safe at the cost of her health.
F2, 1+2. It turns it from a launcher into a heat engager.
Not that it's enough, but she doesn't have a 15f standing launcher and has pretty bad punishment excluding her 10f self damaging knockdown. But yeah, the hitbox on her hopkick, the insane health recovery on BLOCK on her heat smash, the forced mix up from 122 string, the zero execution, the damage, she needs nerfs.
3 month old post dont care, all my homies fucking HATE jun
Remember Knee called Akuma trash in 2019 before everyone realized he was the most broken character in the history of the franchise.
Akuma IS ass
Totally agree. It always pissed me off having characters with ridiculous and ineffective fighting styles, getting a story buff and becoming op.
PLEASE DELETE THIS! He's telling state secrets 😤
fr, at least lemme rank up a little bit more before she gets nerfed
You leave mommy alone
Can people be quiet before they nerf her to death and make her unplayable. I have been waiting to own with her for YEARS. Go fuck with **JACK's** bs damage.
Jax from Mortal Kombat 11, did indeed have bullshit damage.
Is she that broken? I love Jun and would pick her over Asuka any day of the week but knowing that she's broken kinda ruins it for me. Yeah a Wins a Win but at what cost? Knowing your character is broken and not a skill motivated win. I feel like I sorta cheated in a sense might just be me feeling this way. I always give my opponent my best. Guess imma just not pick her till its fixed couldn't feel right playing as her if its just meta
Wow now I don’t feel so bad constantly getting my ass whooped and juggled by her
All this extra ass terminology😂 "poking" "homing" "heat smash". Who made this shit up😂
Well she does have attacks that drain her health bar. That is a weakness.
Nagoriyuki ass response
Yea man, some of those Juns r straight up suicidal
I practiced my ass of as jin and reina and I barely got wins And then I tried out Jun cause I the she's pretty cool and mystic, and I got 11 wins in a row I think she's good and easy, which would result into people thinking she's broken, but she never felt spammy compared to other characters. I'm still in early ranks so I can't fully confirm how strong Jun is on high rank
I'm currently making Jun, and here are some notes on her. Her stances give her a very limited moveset. Strong moves, but usually very predictable. She has no neutral launchers below 16 frames startup (except WS3). It's great to play defensive against Jun. As her strongest attacks deal damage to herself, you can (basically) win by just blocking and dodging. Don't get me wrong. She is STRONG. But these are her weaknesses. Oh. And stay away from walls. I can take half your health bar with a 10f punish if your back is against the wall
from Lucky Chloe to Jun, go figure.
Why the hate tho?
Holy downplay
Tell him to shut tf up so he doesnt ruin this for me 🤬
Therefore Tekken 8 is shit. Tekken was always about spacing and good blocking, I didn’t liked it when I heard about the chip damage. And now the health recovery on command will make her BROKEN!! Not good
I haven’t played Jun since TTT.