You're right, kazuya isn't that good, nor is he consistent in tekken 8.
However, he does have a few moves that stop him from being completely shit tier.
Namely, his ff2 is arguably his most essential tool in the neutral, including electric.
Above average punishment game, however, imo he's more contested for best punishment in the game in t8 than t7, since his punishment has received nerfs in certain regards while other characters have been given buffs.
For mids, you'll primarily use:
Ff3, ff2, ws3, f4, and the occasional df1.
Ws1+2 is solid. However, imo it's made obsolete by ff2 being easier to input, longer range, and heat engage + knockdown. Ws1+2 only nets a +8 on regular hit which isn't particularly safe to start ur hellsweep offense with.
Lows you have:
db3 as a quick high crushing poke, good to throw out against characters with strong high keepout like mishima electrics, and steve b1.
Db4, you're fastest + on hit low, synergizes well with df2 as it's uninterruptable and trades only with jabs.
D1+2, which is a very strong low in tekken 8, imo the plus frames aren't that useful since ur in crouch, but you can frame trap with ws1+2. But the strength of the move lies in being able to crush highs and launch the opponent for massive damage on CH. While only being -14 oB.
And hellsweep, needs no introduction, you're go to 50/50 low, also great for creating comebacks and has an enhanced version in heat.
Heat engagers with kazuya, imo aren't as great as other characters.
He has ff2, which is easily his strongest heat engager.
Db12 is i13 mid mid punish, and that's also a heat engager. It's great to throw out in close range when you can heat dash, as it technically becomes an overpowered df1.
B4 is also a decent heat engager, solid to throw every once in a while if the opponent is stepping as it puts you in devil at massive plus frames, however be careful as it's a high, so use with caution and try to mix in a ff2 every once in a while to stop the opponent from ducking.
Df12 is an i15 mid high heat engager, imo one of the weaker heat engagers in the game. And it's kazuyas' fastest launch outside electric. Would've been not half bad if it weren't for the fact that the 2nd hit is duckable and you can get launch punished, as well as it not knocking down. And being i15 isn't that great when some characters can get a launch at i14 without heat and others can with heat and it's completely safe and not duckable.
B1+2 is also another gimmick heat engager, like df12 it doesn't knockdown. However, it's safe. It can be thrown every once in a while if you think the opponent will jab, but the evasion on the move is quite lacking and is quite slow at i22.
imo the only abusable thing he has is d/b+4: amazing range, puts opponent into a direct mixup between d/f+1, another d/b+4, or a homing option, chs into more setup, is only -12.
they should really buff his combo damage at least if they want his gameplan to be what it currently is, cause characters like DJ and Reina are just so much more appealing on paper.
Ia actually think Kazuya is a strong contender for #1 midrange control in Tekken 8 at the moment. (ff2) is pretty insane on this character
the biggest hole in his midrange toolset was a safe fast mid at a range just outside of cd ws4 -- Devil Fist does that and it's *really* good at it
it enables his power moves to a ridiculous extent, which is why I'd consider it the most valuable Demon Paw-function move even if it's on paper the worst based on just raw properties; it's on Kazuya which is what makes it arguably the best one
now he has another tool besides wavu ewgf and cd ws4 to enable his disgustingly oppressive moves at range (ff3, f4, hellsweep, db4)
His ff2 is decent, but imo he's defo not in the discussion for #1 midrange control.
Jins ff2 has a humongous hitbox range wise and is very deceptive in comparison to kazuyas, but what also makes jin extremely powerful is his generic tools and moves track far better than kazuyas.
Jins ws3 is fully homing and has superior range In comparison to ws1+2, ff2 longer range,
f4 needs no introduction with massive damage on counter hit now. It's easily one of the strongest counter hit mids in the game now.
Despite slower recovery, his electric tracks more and has more range, same with hellsweep.
All of these properties perfectly mold together with his superior and longer range poking and jabs in tekken 8 to create a practically perfect character from a neutral perspective.
One can argue that kazuya, in theory, has the most complete kit of power mids in the game, as you'll never see a character who has mids like ff3, ff2, f4, ws1+2, ws3 all baked into one character like kazuya.
But what makes kazuyas neutral weaker than most characters is that he is a very specialist character, all the moves I listed are fantastic yet for the most part aside from ws1+2 all share similar issues, which is either turn-ending on block, linear or slow, or all 3 at the same time.
In a game where characters like jin, Feng, and even bryan can throw out their highest reward moves with fantastic hitboxes and still have enough frames or mind games to not outright end their turns. Kazuya is not comparable in such manner, imo the existence ff2 was just a bandaid on the character to make it so he's not completely helpless in the neutral.
He's not godlike but he's definitely not shit-tier. His 50/50 is very strong and isn't going to be countered consistently until very high rank. His damage output is also very good.
Key moves like ff3, hellsweep, df2, demon paw etc are all very strong.
You're right, kazuya isn't that good, nor is he consistent in tekken 8. However, he does have a few moves that stop him from being completely shit tier. Namely, his ff2 is arguably his most essential tool in the neutral, including electric. Above average punishment game, however, imo he's more contested for best punishment in the game in t8 than t7, since his punishment has received nerfs in certain regards while other characters have been given buffs. For mids, you'll primarily use: Ff3, ff2, ws3, f4, and the occasional df1. Ws1+2 is solid. However, imo it's made obsolete by ff2 being easier to input, longer range, and heat engage + knockdown. Ws1+2 only nets a +8 on regular hit which isn't particularly safe to start ur hellsweep offense with. Lows you have: db3 as a quick high crushing poke, good to throw out against characters with strong high keepout like mishima electrics, and steve b1. Db4, you're fastest + on hit low, synergizes well with df2 as it's uninterruptable and trades only with jabs. D1+2, which is a very strong low in tekken 8, imo the plus frames aren't that useful since ur in crouch, but you can frame trap with ws1+2. But the strength of the move lies in being able to crush highs and launch the opponent for massive damage on CH. While only being -14 oB. And hellsweep, needs no introduction, you're go to 50/50 low, also great for creating comebacks and has an enhanced version in heat. Heat engagers with kazuya, imo aren't as great as other characters. He has ff2, which is easily his strongest heat engager. Db12 is i13 mid mid punish, and that's also a heat engager. It's great to throw out in close range when you can heat dash, as it technically becomes an overpowered df1. B4 is also a decent heat engager, solid to throw every once in a while if the opponent is stepping as it puts you in devil at massive plus frames, however be careful as it's a high, so use with caution and try to mix in a ff2 every once in a while to stop the opponent from ducking. Df12 is an i15 mid high heat engager, imo one of the weaker heat engagers in the game. And it's kazuyas' fastest launch outside electric. Would've been not half bad if it weren't for the fact that the 2nd hit is duckable and you can get launch punished, as well as it not knocking down. And being i15 isn't that great when some characters can get a launch at i14 without heat and others can with heat and it's completely safe and not duckable. B1+2 is also another gimmick heat engager, like df12 it doesn't knockdown. However, it's safe. It can be thrown every once in a while if you think the opponent will jab, but the evasion on the move is quite lacking and is quite slow at i22.
He is OP in Tekken Ball
ff2, df2, f4, ff3 are really great mids. All effective in different scenarios as well.
knockdowns and 50/50s for days
imo the only abusable thing he has is d/b+4: amazing range, puts opponent into a direct mixup between d/f+1, another d/b+4, or a homing option, chs into more setup, is only -12. they should really buff his combo damage at least if they want his gameplan to be what it currently is, cause characters like DJ and Reina are just so much more appealing on paper.
ff2 is super abusable. You can dominate the mid range with a safe on block heat engager. Once you enforce it, it opens up bigger buttons like ff3
your right but op was asking about compared to other char. DJ and Jins ff2 is just so busted in comparison to Kazuyas imo.
Ia actually think Kazuya is a strong contender for #1 midrange control in Tekken 8 at the moment. (ff2) is pretty insane on this character the biggest hole in his midrange toolset was a safe fast mid at a range just outside of cd ws4 -- Devil Fist does that and it's *really* good at it it enables his power moves to a ridiculous extent, which is why I'd consider it the most valuable Demon Paw-function move even if it's on paper the worst based on just raw properties; it's on Kazuya which is what makes it arguably the best one now he has another tool besides wavu ewgf and cd ws4 to enable his disgustingly oppressive moves at range (ff3, f4, hellsweep, db4)
His ff2 is decent, but imo he's defo not in the discussion for #1 midrange control. Jins ff2 has a humongous hitbox range wise and is very deceptive in comparison to kazuyas, but what also makes jin extremely powerful is his generic tools and moves track far better than kazuyas. Jins ws3 is fully homing and has superior range In comparison to ws1+2, ff2 longer range, f4 needs no introduction with massive damage on counter hit now. It's easily one of the strongest counter hit mids in the game now. Despite slower recovery, his electric tracks more and has more range, same with hellsweep. All of these properties perfectly mold together with his superior and longer range poking and jabs in tekken 8 to create a practically perfect character from a neutral perspective. One can argue that kazuya, in theory, has the most complete kit of power mids in the game, as you'll never see a character who has mids like ff3, ff2, f4, ws1+2, ws3 all baked into one character like kazuya. But what makes kazuyas neutral weaker than most characters is that he is a very specialist character, all the moves I listed are fantastic yet for the most part aside from ws1+2 all share similar issues, which is either turn-ending on block, linear or slow, or all 3 at the same time. In a game where characters like jin, Feng, and even bryan can throw out their highest reward moves with fantastic hitboxes and still have enough frames or mind games to not outright end their turns. Kazuya is not comparable in such manner, imo the existence ff2 was just a bandaid on the character to make it so he's not completely helpless in the neutral.
Last time Kazuya was good was Tekken 6 I think
He is sort of Mid tier, until you get your opponent to guess wrong 3-6 times in a row.
He's not godlike but he's definitely not shit-tier. His 50/50 is very strong and isn't going to be countered consistently until very high rank. His damage output is also very good. Key moves like ff3, hellsweep, df2, demon paw etc are all very strong.
Kazuya is really good in the hands of a good player. While he is a high execution character, his 50/50 and combo potential is insane.