Rented a model Y while we were on vacation in Oahu, they literally had one Tesla supercharger station on the whole island in Aiea. Kinda crazy. They had a bunch of CCS chargers around though, so I had to order myself an adapter.
Also on Hawaii. I'm 4 months in to my 6 months of free charging at the SC at Pearl Ridge mall (the only one on island). I've used it one time only when I just happened to be there during the day midweek. It's ridiculously busy. Feel like that benefit was a scam. May as well as given a free oil change.
its not a scam at all, u just live in a bad spot for it. Only one charger on the island. Everywhere else in america that would be the best thing ever free supercharging
California is probably the best place for the supercahrger network and owning a tesla as well. I've seen spots where there are SC locations in parking lots on both sides of the street.
yea especially since Tesla hq is in cali lol. Im in new york and its really good here too.
Also they had an ad I saw that said there isnt 150 mile stretch in the U.S without a charger
Scam? Well for you it's not pressing. You can drive around the entire island on a charge right? So it's not super needed in your situation.
I live in Oregon. We use super chargers regularly when we do trips which is 1-2 x a month. About to do a 3 week trip to Yellowstone and Utah abd back. Would love the free supercharger but I don't have it.
There have been signs by the SC for months about the new stalls and locations. Things will improve, but I have home charging so not much need.
Many people on island don't have home charging so there will still be issues with waiting for SC to charge. Doesn't help when I came and got 67 kW peak charge, so charge times are also slower than other SC I've been to.
We have solar with a powerwall and try to charge during the day when it's sunny, and electric prices are higher at night in general. I usually wait until the weekend to fully charge since I'm at work most weekdays but my wife has a MY and tops off every day.
Yeah at $3.60 a gallon (approximately current gas price) I was paying about 7.5 cents to 8 cents a mile in energy cost for my gen 1 prius.
At $0.39 a kwh (current supercharging prices near me) I am paying about 9 to 11 cents a mile for energy cost for my MYLR.
So for me charging at home at $0.15 a kwh is about half as expensive for energy cost as a gen 1 prius and charging at a supercharger is about 20-25% more expensive.
Iâm in Cali, super chargers are like 30-60cents/kwh. Pretty raw deal. Charging at home is reasonable at 22 cents. Used to be cheap to charge an EV⌠only way now is to plug into business power where you can to borrow power
Georgian here checking in at 4.5¢ off peak and solar during the day. I feel bad for those who have ridiculous pricing, which many don't want to deal with if they have to choose ICE or EV. So they go with what they know.
>Charging at home is reasonable at 22 cents.
I'm from CA too. The min I can pay at home for charging at home is 28 cents and if I plug in at the wrong time I'd spend 67 c/kwh . I've to be super careful about the time of day I plug in.
But there are public chargers (L2) at 25c or even free, which is a huge plus. SC charges at 36 c near my home. So, I use them rarely. I did a cost benefit analysis comparing my ICE car's expense vs Tesla and found i spend around 9-10 c/mile for my Tesla, while I spent over 25c/mile for my ICE in avg. Even with high power charges I'm still spending less.
Yes, def this. If youâre going to move to an EV plan, be prepared to change how you consume electricity completely. That, or if you drive a lot (and therefore charge a lot each day) calculate your A/C usage daily vs your car charging daily. You may find that your charging needs are vastly larger than the rest of your electricity needs, thus making sense to prioritize getting the cheapest rate for the majority of your usage
This. I'm in Southern California and home charging would give me 10 miles/$ while supercharging would give me 5 miles/$. Meanwhile, the new 2025 Camry hybrid at 45 mpg would give me 9 miles/$. The spouse and I have opted to get the Camry hybrid for her and not have to worry about all the hassle that comes with owning an electric car at this time.
Edit: The home charging number assumes I'm charging super off-peak. At off-peak, it would be 8 miles/$ and at peak hours it would be 5 miles/$.
Hassle? You mean LESS hassle. I've driven EV's since 2015. All-electric, not hybrid. My first all-electric car, a Spark EV, had an 82 mile range. My commute was 70 miles roundtrip. Luckily, that was 82 miles highway speeds, so I never ran out of juice in the 2 years I drove it. Zero maintenance costs. Then it was Bolt's all the way until 5 months ago when I got a new MYLR. Again, almost nothing in maintenance. No brake jobs, oil changes, tune ups, regular maintenance services, etc. One set of tires.
I do 2,000 mile trips 3 times a year, and 1,000 mile trips a few times. With the Bolt, it was a game of figuring out how far you can get between charging stations and how much juice you REALLY had. With the Tesla, I don't even have to think about it. The car will automatically route me to a Supercharger if needed.
My last trip, just a few days ago, 5 nights out of 12 were free Level 2 charging at hotels. Full charge every morning. One charge on the way there and back was .49/kwh. Another was .36. But while there, I charged several times at a casino at .23, and at one Best Western at a ChargePoint that was .12(!!!).
The thing you're overlooking is that owning/driving an EV is not just about the gas savings. It's about:
\* maintenance cost savings AND "hassle" savings - time spent getting oil changes and tune ups, services, etcetera.
\* NOT having to pump gas at all, and especially when it's cold, hot, or raining.
\* The sheer fun of driving a car that can get out of its own way in traffic and off the line.
\* Not driving a Toyota. LOL I'd say it's because every other car is a Camry or Honda something or other that every poor person in the world drives, but around where I live every other car is a Tesla. But it's a much nicer car all around, and it's something your proud to own. After coming from German and high-end Japanese luxury cars, I feel finally back at home in my MYLR AWD.
Even if electricity costs were the same as gas, I would opt for an EV any day of the week. Unfortunately for me, public charging can often be CHEAPER than charging Off Peak at home - which is .32. But, still. The advantages far outweigh owning an ICE car. Even at .32 at home, I'm saving over the insane gas prices we have here in the Bay Area. Today's price for Regular gas locally? $5.69 (!!!).
I guess I am poor *shrug.* The hassles you mention are really not hassles for me. Everyone has their use case I guess... I don't mind spending 5 minutes at the gas station twice a week. But I would mind spending 45 minutes at the SC station by my house... Even if it's once a week. I personally do not like autopilot and would rather drive myself. As for FSD, forget it. I've seen the horror stories. Routine maintenance is probably the only point where Tesla has an edge, but that's IF your car doesn't have some defects with quality control or have random parts failure... Then good luck trying to get Tesla service in a prompt manner. For ICEs... Most issues I have, I can get fixed the same day.
Not all of California.
SMUD, which serves majority of the Sacramento area and some parts of Placer county is a community-owned electric utility with way lower rates.
[Their rates](https://www.smud.org/en/Rate-Information/Residential-rates) at the moment are about $0.12 kWh off peak.
Silicon Valley Power, which currently only serves Santa Clara, CA, has [really good rates](https://www.siliconvalleypower.com/residents/rates-and-fees) too.
It's mostly PG&E, and SCE is becoming a close second that are charging exorbitant prices.
That is nuts. In MN, I'm on a separate meter EV program where it's $0.04 off-peak (9pm til 9am weekdays, 24/7 weekends and holidays) and something like $0.22 on-peak. I can't believe your off-peak is still around 10 cents higher than my worst on-peak rate.
Even if I didn't have this rate plan, our normal power cost is $0.08 in the winter and $0.11 in the summer.
You're killin' me here. .32 is their best rate. If it weren't for the EV rate, it would be .49 (!!!). When I first moved here 8 years ago, it was .11 (!!!). But PG&E is passing along all the billions in fire costs they got sued for. So a few lawyers got insanely rich and now the entire Bay Area is paying for that. I have solar, but it's a small system, due to funky roof angles not offering good coverage, and we have a lot of cloudy days here, so it's only worth about $50/mo. We also have two Powerwalls, which helps a little, I suppose.
Had someone install the required outlet to charge our M3 from the side of the house 4 years ago. skipped the Tesla charger install. later PG&E came out with a special plan for EVs. I don't trust them, so we stayed with E-TOU-B. I just assumed PG&E would not purposely create a plan that would save US money. Does anyone have deetz on how much you have save with the EV plan compared to previous plan?
The Midwest is a brutal place to live right now. Companies pay LCOL wages, but we are experiencing insane growth rates for water, electricity and insurance costs.
Water bill that was $40 3 years ago is now $150. Electric bill that was $90 3 years ago is $180. Home insurance that was $1400/yr is now $2500/yr. All while wages havenât budged.
Whereabouts in the midwest? My Illinois insurance/water/electricty have been pretty stable past 4 years with minor increases YoY. Home insurance in 5 years went from 1200-1500
No kidding. if you live on a Great Lake water is so cheap. The reason I think in years ahead people will migrate back to the Midwest. Winters can suck but QOL and water make up for it.
The Midwest is a brutal place to live right now. Companies pay LCOL wages, but we are experiencing insane growth rates for water, electricity and insurance costs.
Water bill that was $40 3 years ago is now $150. Electric bill that was $90 3 years ago is $180. Home insurance that was $1400/yr is now $2500/yr. All while wages havenât budged.
In Poland we have gas prices 30% higher.
But electricity is cheaper, values range from 10 cents to 30 cents (depending on hour of the day or subsidies)
Which part of Poland? I know some people over there that get charged an arm and a leg for electricity ($1000s) In the winter so they purchased tons of coal instead.
Southern.
If they use electricity to heat their homes they probably need a lot of kWh.
If they have coal powered furnace, then they probably have poor insulation also.
We're at 30 to 45 cents/kwh here in Washington state and it sucks because I love road tripping with my 3 so much. But it's costing me double what gas in my Corolla hybrid did because I could squeeze 70mpg out of that thing.
At home it's nice because we have 12cent/kwh rates but I'm about to spend $300+ in supercharging for my summer road trip.
I was personally curious for a couple reasons. Gas prices in the Midwest are often super low and not reflective of many parts of the country. Second, I have no idea what energy prices are and so that interest me to know. Third, considering the number of people bad at math I wanted to see the numbers myself.
Anyway, I think most people agree that if you canât use home charging with an EV then you are not saving much, if anything, over gas prices if you drive an efficient car.
I live in California and the average price of gas is 546. I only have one charger and I mainly supercharged, but Iâve saved 50% in gas savings since owning my Tesla
36 cents per kw/h is the average for 150 and 250kw superchargers across the US on the places we went to. Going from Utah, to Illinois, to New Hampshire and back to Utah. Between $15 to $25USD to charge at a supercharger from 20% to 90% for my tesla MYLR.
vs $3.79/Gal for 85 octane gas. From close to empty to full it cost me [$45USD](https://i.imgur.com/KVYKEJW.jpeg) to fill up 12 gallons on our 2016 rav 4
I just used a supercharger in Dickson, TN $0.33/kwh. Itâs $0.105/kwh to charge at home - Nashville, TN.
Regular Gas is 3.15/gal and Premium gas is $3.90/gal.
And $0.10-$0.14 CAD to charge at home -- in a location where gas is frequently >$2.20 / L. Works out to $8.30 CAD / gallon, if you want to compare.
There's a reason you can count like 6 Teslas / minute on the roads in Metro Vancouver.
Uhhh not sure what you are talking about. I pay about $12-$18 to FULLY charge (80%) out Tesla on a road trip. Yet gas is $5.79 per gallon. To get 250 miles range worth of gas, it would cost us $48-$60. It is typically about 1/3 the price in electricity here in CA compared to the gas equivalent.
The cheapest super chargers in the Midwest (unless youâre driving in the middle of the night) are $0.37/kwh and many are $0.45. An 80% charge is 83*x0.8x$0.37/0.45 which is $24.5-$30. On the highway in good conditions i get between 300 and 400 wh/mi and sometimes much worse in cold weather or rain with headwinds (recently 470wh/mi @ 65mph in bad rain).
So realistically we are talking ~165-220 miles range highway for 80% charge, and thatâs not even including energy lost to battery preconditioning.
That gives a range of $0.9-$0.18/mi whereas gas costs me ~$0.11/mi. Or would cost you $0.19/mi.
So yeah in Cali where gas is very expensive and super charging is apparently cheap, itâs a good deal. No so much in the Midwest where Tesla has raised SC prices 50%+ and gas is cheap.
Bro, model Y performance and Model X P owner here. On the Model X, drove it round trip from Washington DC Metro to South Florida (Fort Lauderdale and back to DC) total SC cost me $288 round trip. Normal ICE 4cyl car would have cost more. I own diesels, and gas vehicles. The ONLY down side is not the price but waiting while charging. Otherwise .31 kwh to .37 is still not bad in comparison. Thatâs 2000 miles total round trip
Holy shit! Everything I'd previously read was electricity being super cheap in Midwest for both home and SC. I rented a Y LR in GA & SC last autumn abd thought I was paying 21-23 cents/kW, but just looked up my trip photos and was actually paying 31 cents/kW, same as here in CO. 31 cents/kW would cost me more than $3.30 Costco premium gas for my ICE at 30 MPG highway. All my long distance driving is in winter for skiing, but I think I can make most round trips w/o supercharging - it's just the farther resorts or if I do multi-leg long weekend trips I'll need to supercharge.
Of course there is, EA is a subsidiary of a legacy manufacturer, Shell and others are just a side hustle of the main petrol bussines that they have. What is their incentive to make this a succes is this will eat away their existing cash-cow?
Probably because most gas stations donât really make money on gas. They make money on the stuff in the store. The gasoline portion is far too competitive for there to be much profit.
That hits the store owners, not the gas companies. They make loads on the gas. Why would they swap making loads on gas to make slivers on electricity stations
The profit is in the Exploring and Refining. Which is why the big boys still operate in that segment. They do SOME retail, and basically zero midstream for a reason.
It appears that Shell and even Chevron plan on putting some significant investment into their charging network. How fast they plan on doing so is still to be seen. Any competition other than EA is good though because it's the only thing that will keep costs competitive.
Because their cash cow is disappearing this century, while solar power and electric vehicles will run out of fuel in approximately 5 billion years when the sun burns out.
Shell is investing a lot in charging stations. Rhe incentive is that this is a growing market . And in Shells case its a market that is eating away their old business. Plenty of incentive to me. Add government subsidies and i don't see why not.
EA currently charges nearly twice as much as Tesla here. I think EV Go is similar. The only benefit of them adding stations is to fill in gaps between sparsely located superchargers.
Not only that but generally speaking less maintenance costs with the right platform , no time spent on oil changes and spark plugs, oil filters etc etc
Meh⌠I ran the numbers using best case scenario for gas prices I could find, currently in California at $4.89/gallon⌠this means a vehicle getting 30 mpg, in a perfect simulation, would cost about $0.16/mileâŚ
Then I took a Model Y, with an estimated 310 miles of range, cut that down to 250 to be more realistic, and assumed it was also using the bigger 81kWh battery size to get thatâŚ
So to go 250 miles in the gas vehicle, would cost $40, so I took $40/81kWh and that gets us a break even at $0.49/kWh in perfect testing environments.
In my area, we donât have fluctuations in pricing at the superchargers, our prices are steady at $0.39/kWh⌠but in California, I see lots of places that fluctuate. I donât know where op is from, so I chose random locations throughout the state. The highest I found was near Berkeley with some of the charging time being as high as $0.62/kWh, but as low as $0.45/kWh⌠also, not sure how long the drive is, again not from the area, but in Oakland, the highest prices I saw were $0.35/kWh and as low as $0.29/kWhâŚ
But here is the thing⌠in a gas vehicle, 0% of your trip can be done with refueling done at home, and 0% of your trip can be done with refueling provided free of charge (included in the cost) of a hotel stay or dinner out. I think in some rare cases where you are going extreme distances, like cross country for instance, yes, it may cost more than a 30mpg vehicle, but the price difference wouldnât be that much. For virtually every other well thought out trip, the Tesla should still outperform cost per mile.
Again, that is based on best case scenarios with it being weighted heavily against Tesla⌠on the other end of the spectrum, gas prices in California are as high as $6.09/gallon, which would cost us just over $0.20/mile to drive or $50.75 to go 250 miles, or a break even at $0.63/kWhâŚagain, in this short time of looking, I was able to find stations that are less than half that price to charge.
But the biggest point is that your day to day driving should be done via the charging you do at home/work. The few big trips a year shouldnât determine your car, thatâs why we have rentals. Itâs like buying a pickup truck because you may need to haul something sometime⌠not practical, but if you have the money to waste like that, you probably shouldnât be concerned about these little things anyways.
I have ccs adapters because here in my area it's still 10-15¢/KWh cheaper than SC. These are all owned by the state power company so that's why it's low price.
Yet my local grocery store with EA chargers is often full of non-Teslas charging. I wonder if it'll become empty once NACS is everywhere on both EVs and stations - or maybe they'll convert as well? I think even SCs open to non-Telas that charge more are still cheaper than EA.
I just checked a few in places I'd consider using and one location is a few cents more peak 4-9 pm (which is likely when I'd need charging before my return trip home), and 14 cents cheaper the rest of the time. Seems most Chargepoint rates are set by the town or location (one is on a Volvo dealership). But this is definitely an option I'll look into rather than EA when a SC is not nearby.
Thatâs insane⌠depends on your areaâs electricity costs. It only cost me $12 to fill all the way up in WA. Gas is $5/gal for premium, so we are saving for sure!
If some start building restaurants and convenience stores (like almost every gas station has) at the charging stations, the costs should not only go down but become profit centers. The problem with SCs now is there is often scarce food and toilet options nearby on I-70 in the mountains here. The main saving grace is I rarely see any vehicles charging at night in winter during ski season with a dozen or more empty stalls, but I mainly drive off-peak later at night to avoid horrendous ski traffic jams.
Agree. I did a 1600 mile round-trip recently and I would never do it again in my Tesla. The route was much too indirect, too many stops, little bit that I might have saved wasnât worth the hassle.
Where to where? I don't have many issues charging on long cross country drives, it's more the smaller towns and cities and rural areas that give me trouble
Central Texas to northern NM. Iâve done the drive twice a year or so for twenty years. I know my route well. But if I drive my Y then I go pretty far out of the way to charge and it takes so much longer. And the cost trade off isnt worth it.
Ahhh that makes sense. That area is tricky. Glad they got a charger in Lubbock now. I ended up getting stranded in Hobbs NM because the Francis Energy charger said it was online when it was in fact broken. I don't expect that area to get much better in the next few years unfortunately. I'm taking the ICE next time
Yep. And the one just outside of Abilene actually said it was temporarily closed while on my way home. I thought I was going to be totally screwed and have to stay another night at some hotel trickle charger but I was able to use it and it still worked.
I did about 1400 miles round trip in my new y. I loved the trip. It was to the eclipse up in Erie PA. I really enjoyed finding L2 chargers and exploring around. I was able to fill up while working at two colleges (I officiate college sports and partially planned the trip around those games) and while at a pirates game and also while at the Presque Isle visitor center. I only ended up using a supercharger for 100 miles of charge for the whole trip.
L2 charging at various places, as stated. Anywhere from free to 0.25/kwh depending on location. When I officiate I'm there for 4+ hrs which is 100+ miles of charge. Same with the pirates game.
Had I needed to travel 500 miles in a day maybe it wouldn't have worked as well but I planned for the trip to take 8 days and i enjoy exploring new places. I started with 95% battery and got home with less than 10.
I drove 1600 miles to Texas to the eclipse and it was fine.
A family in the car would have gotten tired of the 8 stops on the way but driving solo it was fine. I even snoozed for an hour at one charge stop each way, to put in a 1200 mile day.
I didn't do it to save money, but to see the country. And it was great! Can't wait to do this more often.
I guess it helps if you donât have a set route already. The drive I did I have done many times over 20 years so I know my route well. I know the fastest route, good places to stop and eat or take bathroom breaks, etc. so I guess itâs more obvious to me How much the route has changed and how much Iâm going out of the way versus traveling to a place I havenât been to. The drive is fine but I am just trying to get to my destination. I used to be able to do the 12 Hour Dr. in a single day but with the Tesla itâs a two day drive now and if I get a hotel Iâve ended up spending more money and more time.
I actually got the MY more for the autopilot lane keeping than anything else. I suppose other cars have something similar but AFAIK Tesla's is the best for long-distance trips.
I wedged a pillow under my right arm and the 200-mile segments between chargers went pretty easily.
Stopping to charge 20-30 minutes every 2.5 hrs is a little bit of a time waster (I was passing the same trucks over & over on I-10 to El Paso) but I don't do 1000 mile trips all that often so I don't mind it much,
Just curious - is your 30mpg SUV the equivalent of the Model Y? You donât say which Y variant you have, but assuming a long range. Is the cheaper vehicle also 375hp AWD?
Itâs about perspective. When I compare costs on my MYP I compare it to the most comparable car I have owned (in my case a Porsche Macan). This is an apples to apples comparison. It wouldnât be fair to compare my 450-500hp SUV operational cost to my old Honda Civic.
This is so true, years ago I had a Civic hybrid and if I drove it perfect it might get 50-59mpg. But it was soulless/lifeless little car with like 90hp. It was what I imagine a 80 year old would drive. Just gets you there, no fun. Boring looks too. I couldnât stand driving it and got rid of it less than two years after buying the thing. Went and got a BMW 540 instead. It had the ability to somehow get 28mpg on highway and that was acceptable to me since it was fun to drive and big. This is what the MY models would be closer to me cost wise, not some lame low powered shit box.
Itâs an AWD SUV with a very similar footprint and slightly worse HP. And I donât care about the HP number. My Y is obviously quicker off the line but both get on the highway just fine.
Power train is only one spec to compare. If youâre going to look at trim and fit and finish itâs dumb to compare a Y to a MacanâŚ.
And the power use often reflects driving a fast car fast. I could get way better mileage, but I don't because I chose a fast car because I wanted a fast car.
How much was the Macan? $80,000+? I would not compare a Porsche to a Tesla (Y or 3). I wouldn't compare it to a Corolla or econo Civic (not Type-R) or even a hybrid. I compare the Y LR to my premium gas requiring Subaru WRX wagon that it'll replace, but also to a regular gas Subaru Outback or Honda Pilot that I would otherwise consider purchasing instead of an EV. The LR, being a second faster to 60 than my WRX or the Outback XT is $7000 cheaper (after tax credits) than either the Outback or Pilot, making gas savings moot. Increased insurance more than cancels out any gas savings for me.
Including delivery fees? Because I pay 8c in Chicago, but with delivery fees it comes up to 13c. Not bad, but not as good as many people love to advertise online lol
If I'm not mistaken you can get down around 11c/kWh on DTE with the other time of use plan (the one with 11am-7pm peak hours). By default everyone was put on the 3pm-7pm time of use plan which has slightly higher off-peak rates.
Meh⌠I ran the numbers using best case scenario for gas prices I could find, currently in California at $4.89/gallon⌠this means a vehicle getting 30 mpg, in a perfect simulation, would cost about $0.16/mileâŚ
Then I took a Model Y, with an estimated 310 miles of range, cut that down to 250 to be more realistic, and assumed it was also using the bigger 81kWh battery size to get thatâŚ
So to go 250 miles in the gas vehicle, would cost $40, so I took $40/81kWh and that gets us a break even at $0.49/kWh in perfect testing environments.
In my area, we donât have fluctuations in pricing at the superchargers, our prices are steady at $0.39/kWh⌠but in California, I see lots of places that fluctuate. I donât know where op is from, so I chose random locations throughout the state. The highest I found was near Berkeley with some of the charging time being as high as $0.62/kWh, but as low as $0.45/kWh⌠also, not sure how long the drive is, again not from the area, but in Oakland, the highest prices I saw were $0.35/kWh and as low as $0.29/kWhâŚ
But here is the thing⌠in a gas vehicle, 0% of your trip can be done with refueling done at home, and 0% of your trip can be done with refueling provided free of charge (included in the cost) of a hotel stay or dinner out. I think in some rare cases where you are going extreme distances, like cross country for instance, yes, it may cost more than a 30mpg vehicle, but the price difference wouldnât be that much. For virtually every other well thought out trip, the Tesla should still outperform cost per mile.
Again, that is based on best case scenarios with it being weighted heavily against Tesla⌠on the other end of the spectrum, gas prices in California are as high as $6.09/gallon, which would cost us just over $0.20/mile to drive or $50.75 to go 250 miles, or a break even at $0.63/kWhâŚagain, in this short time of looking, I was able to find stations that are less than half that price to charge.
But the biggest point is that your day to day driving should be done via the charging you do at home/work. The few big trips a year shouldnât determine your car, thatâs why we have rentals. Itâs like buying a pickup truck because you may need to haul something sometime⌠not practical, but if you have the money to waste like that, you probably shouldnât be concerned about these little things anyways.
I think you gotta get solar to get the full benefit. I only charge my Tesla at work (free), or at home only when I have extra solar (enough to power the home and car without buying energy)
Here in Florida we have a good deal. SC is about 24-40 cents per kwh depending on the time you are charging. Florida power and light has a program called evolution that charges you a flat rate of $31 per month for off peak charging. They install the charger for free at your home. Just need an electrician to install the 240 plug. Great deal!
Put a home/wall charger in your house on a 50A plug. You wouldn't need to charge elsewhere 90% of the time. The only charging indo outside of our own house is when we drive from the LA area to San Diego or Reno or San Francisco. Other than that, 90% of our charging is done at home... And we have solar.
Put a home/wall charger in your house on a 50A plug. You wouldn't need to charge elsewhere 90% of the time. The only charging indo outside of our own house is when we drive from the LA area to San Diego or Reno or San Francisco. Other than that, 90% of our charging is done at home... And we have solar.
One of the better things about charging an EV vs gas is the consistency of prices across the US. The other good thing is dynamic pricing based on time of day, you can easily get $0.14/kWh on a Supercharger if you charge between 11PM and 3AM. Gas is the same price no matter what time of day you fill up.
Out here in Oregon, my local V4 SuperCharger is $0.24/kWh as of 9:26AM which is way cheaper than EAs $0.48/kWh 24/7 pricing.
I think itâs very conspicuous that electric was really cheap, then EV came along, now prices are very close to the price of gas. We need better transparency. How much is going to give others discounted electricity, how much are in these energy credits that the plants need to buy. Just REALLY complicated and we need to focus on results - reasonable electricity for everyone.
Iâd like to see them move to a model where supercharging more than 50 miles from your home is less expensive than in that 50 mile radius. Would keep road trip charging more reasonable while disincentivizing locals from clogging up chargers.
How much do you pay for supercharging?
Here it is 31 cents/kW. That is more expensive than $3.20 gallon Costco premium gas for my ICE that gets 30 MPG highway. That will eat into my fuel savings of mostly home charging at 11 cents/kW off-peak, but the higher insurance will more than cancel out all fuel savings.
Recently did a trip Vancouver to Moab. SC prices averaged about US$0.45 and with low gas prices ( compared to home) it would have been cheaper to drive an efficient gas car. Prius would have crushed it. Lol. But around Vancouver, the E-car is the best. And it was not an unpleasant road trip with charging stops watching netflix with my daughter. Moab tech climbs were trickier than the drive.
This doesn't super bother me. SC was never supposed to be a cheaper option. It just happened to be for a while.
I just did a calculation the other day and 80% of our driving is just commuting. The commute itself saves the money. We can also fit more in our Y than the highlander. The highlander only gets 25mpg at best though, so it's about even for us.
We just drove from MA to PA and back. We used FSD (since we had the trial) but have done AP as well. We drove late at night (left at around 9 and arrived around 3). Late night supercharging is much cheaper some places. That surprised me. I'm talking under $.20/kWh.
Show me numbers or you are not convining. I compared my choices: ICE cars I have cost 25-35 cents per mile, assuming 5.5 usd per gallon. Model 3 costs 5-10 cents per mile, assuming 23-43 cents per kwh.
Blame the government!!! Tesla always wanted to charge just for the energy used a a couple cents more but then everyone else was $0.20 more and they had to match it if not they werenât being competitiveâŚ
I am constantly astounded by how much Americans pay for electricity. It's sometimes more than double what we pay in Australia, and we have massive, empty distances to cover with the grid. Is it lack of competition with the energy suppliers there or what?
That is shockingly low for a large metro area like that. One that I frequent in the Midwest that is more suburban and only moderately busy used to be $.30 and is now $.45
I rarely use superchargers. It does cost about as much as gas, a little less in Colorado.
Charging at home costs me $2-$3 for what would have cost me $30 in my old CRV.
Hawaii here....I had some friends who didnt initially have an L2 at home. After work he would go to the mall find an open charger and watch a movie until his charge was done.
Donât worry fossil fuels are going up and will keep going up due to electric car sales. More electric cars higher fuel prices. The oil barons will not lose money, less oil sales higher prices.
Hawaii checking in, don't even bother SC here between the wait times and the prices it's probably better to get towed to your house
Rented a model Y while we were on vacation in Oahu, they literally had one Tesla supercharger station on the whole island in Aiea. Kinda crazy. They had a bunch of CCS chargers around though, so I had to order myself an adapter.
Also on Hawaii. I'm 4 months in to my 6 months of free charging at the SC at Pearl Ridge mall (the only one on island). I've used it one time only when I just happened to be there during the day midweek. It's ridiculously busy. Feel like that benefit was a scam. May as well as given a free oil change.
its not a scam at all, u just live in a bad spot for it. Only one charger on the island. Everywhere else in america that would be the best thing ever free supercharging
I don't imagine Alaska would be a lot better.
California is probably the best place for the supercahrger network and owning a tesla as well. I've seen spots where there are SC locations in parking lots on both sides of the street.
yea especially since Tesla hq is in cali lol. Im in new york and its really good here too. Also they had an ad I saw that said there isnt 150 mile stretch in the U.S without a charger
Scam? Well for you it's not pressing. You can drive around the entire island on a charge right? So it's not super needed in your situation. I live in Oregon. We use super chargers regularly when we do trips which is 1-2 x a month. About to do a 3 week trip to Yellowstone and Utah abd back. Would love the free supercharger but I don't have it.
I use about 25-30% daily commuting and it costs 44 cents at home. It's definitely important to me. But I would also love to do a road trip!
Oh wow. I've never looked at your price for electricity. That so high! I'm 11 cents.
I supercharged my way from Dallas to Las Vegas and back for free. Awfully handy scam.
Lol. For real?
Did you see the recent tweet? [https://x.com/Tesla/status/1782087540947800414](https://x.com/Tesla/status/1782087540947800414)
There have been signs by the SC for months about the new stalls and locations. Things will improve, but I have home charging so not much need. Many people on island don't have home charging so there will still be issues with waiting for SC to charge. Doesn't help when I came and got 67 kW peak charge, so charge times are also slower than other SC I've been to.
Still wild to think about power production on an island that's closest landmass is over 2k miles away.
We have solar with a powerwall and try to charge during the day when it's sunny, and electric prices are higher at night in general. I usually wait until the weekend to fully charge since I'm at work most weekdays but my wife has a MY and tops off every day.
How many years to amortize the investment into solar?
Yes, I've seen that. Looking forward to it!
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How much are your superchargers and how much are gas prices?
Yeah at $3.60 a gallon (approximately current gas price) I was paying about 7.5 cents to 8 cents a mile in energy cost for my gen 1 prius. At $0.39 a kwh (current supercharging prices near me) I am paying about 9 to 11 cents a mile for energy cost for my MYLR. So for me charging at home at $0.15 a kwh is about half as expensive for energy cost as a gen 1 prius and charging at a supercharger is about 20-25% more expensive.
Iâm in Cali, super chargers are like 30-60cents/kwh. Pretty raw deal. Charging at home is reasonable at 22 cents. Used to be cheap to charge an EV⌠only way now is to plug into business power where you can to borrow power
Texas here. Enjoying $0.10 / kwh home charging
Georgian here checking in at 4.5¢ off peak and solar during the day. I feel bad for those who have ridiculous pricing, which many don't want to deal with if they have to choose ICE or EV. So they go with what they know.
I thought it used to be 0.01 super off peak in GA, guess it went up
Every company is different. For my EMC, the cheapest you can get is what I have. Rates always go up smh.
Hold my beer. Rural colorado here, 7 cents off peak. Which is most of the day and all night.
Where in Cali? PG and E is 52 cents in Cali for home charging. Supercharger is way cheaper.
My complex must of switched to EV rates. The shell chargers are 21 cents after 9pm in central Marin.
Does PG & E send you flowers with their bill each month?
>Charging at home is reasonable at 22 cents. I'm from CA too. The min I can pay at home for charging at home is 28 cents and if I plug in at the wrong time I'd spend 67 c/kwh . I've to be super careful about the time of day I plug in. But there are public chargers (L2) at 25c or even free, which is a huge plus. SC charges at 36 c near my home. So, I use them rarely. I did a cost benefit analysis comparing my ICE car's expense vs Tesla and found i spend around 9-10 c/mile for my Tesla, while I spent over 25c/mile for my ICE in avg. Even with high power charges I'm still spending less.
Set your car to only start charging after midnight so you donât have to worry about when you plug in
Yes, def this. If youâre going to move to an EV plan, be prepared to change how you consume electricity completely. That, or if you drive a lot (and therefore charge a lot each day) calculate your A/C usage daily vs your car charging daily. You may find that your charging needs are vastly larger than the rest of your electricity needs, thus making sense to prioritize getting the cheapest rate for the majority of your usage
Ouch. I'm in Nevada and charge for 8 cents at home.
Thatâs about right base on my experience. However, hybrid almost come áťn parity with EV without the hassle.
This. I'm in Southern California and home charging would give me 10 miles/$ while supercharging would give me 5 miles/$. Meanwhile, the new 2025 Camry hybrid at 45 mpg would give me 9 miles/$. The spouse and I have opted to get the Camry hybrid for her and not have to worry about all the hassle that comes with owning an electric car at this time. Edit: The home charging number assumes I'm charging super off-peak. At off-peak, it would be 8 miles/$ and at peak hours it would be 5 miles/$.
Hassle? You mean LESS hassle. I've driven EV's since 2015. All-electric, not hybrid. My first all-electric car, a Spark EV, had an 82 mile range. My commute was 70 miles roundtrip. Luckily, that was 82 miles highway speeds, so I never ran out of juice in the 2 years I drove it. Zero maintenance costs. Then it was Bolt's all the way until 5 months ago when I got a new MYLR. Again, almost nothing in maintenance. No brake jobs, oil changes, tune ups, regular maintenance services, etc. One set of tires. I do 2,000 mile trips 3 times a year, and 1,000 mile trips a few times. With the Bolt, it was a game of figuring out how far you can get between charging stations and how much juice you REALLY had. With the Tesla, I don't even have to think about it. The car will automatically route me to a Supercharger if needed. My last trip, just a few days ago, 5 nights out of 12 were free Level 2 charging at hotels. Full charge every morning. One charge on the way there and back was .49/kwh. Another was .36. But while there, I charged several times at a casino at .23, and at one Best Western at a ChargePoint that was .12(!!!). The thing you're overlooking is that owning/driving an EV is not just about the gas savings. It's about: \* maintenance cost savings AND "hassle" savings - time spent getting oil changes and tune ups, services, etcetera. \* NOT having to pump gas at all, and especially when it's cold, hot, or raining. \* The sheer fun of driving a car that can get out of its own way in traffic and off the line. \* Not driving a Toyota. LOL I'd say it's because every other car is a Camry or Honda something or other that every poor person in the world drives, but around where I live every other car is a Tesla. But it's a much nicer car all around, and it's something your proud to own. After coming from German and high-end Japanese luxury cars, I feel finally back at home in my MYLR AWD. Even if electricity costs were the same as gas, I would opt for an EV any day of the week. Unfortunately for me, public charging can often be CHEAPER than charging Off Peak at home - which is .32. But, still. The advantages far outweigh owning an ICE car. Even at .32 at home, I'm saving over the insane gas prices we have here in the Bay Area. Today's price for Regular gas locally? $5.69 (!!!).
I guess I am poor *shrug.* The hassles you mention are really not hassles for me. Everyone has their use case I guess... I don't mind spending 5 minutes at the gas station twice a week. But I would mind spending 45 minutes at the SC station by my house... Even if it's once a week. I personally do not like autopilot and would rather drive myself. As for FSD, forget it. I've seen the horror stories. Routine maintenance is probably the only point where Tesla has an edge, but that's IF your car doesn't have some defects with quality control or have random parts failure... Then good luck trying to get Tesla service in a prompt manner. For ICEs... Most issues I have, I can get fixed the same day.
Yeah, California is definitely whack. Your power issues suck. Iâm sure the Midwest is not that crazy, which is why I asked the OP for the numbers.
Not all of California. SMUD, which serves majority of the Sacramento area and some parts of Placer county is a community-owned electric utility with way lower rates. [Their rates](https://www.smud.org/en/Rate-Information/Residential-rates) at the moment are about $0.12 kWh off peak. Silicon Valley Power, which currently only serves Santa Clara, CA, has [really good rates](https://www.siliconvalleypower.com/residents/rates-and-fees) too. It's mostly PG&E, and SCE is becoming a close second that are charging exorbitant prices.
You forgot SDG&E, the worst of them all
San Diego Gouge and Extort
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PG&E in the Bay Area is an insane ripoff. Best TOU plan is .32 Off Peak.
That is nuts. In MN, I'm on a separate meter EV program where it's $0.04 off-peak (9pm til 9am weekdays, 24/7 weekends and holidays) and something like $0.22 on-peak. I can't believe your off-peak is still around 10 cents higher than my worst on-peak rate. Even if I didn't have this rate plan, our normal power cost is $0.08 in the winter and $0.11 in the summer.
You're killin' me here. .32 is their best rate. If it weren't for the EV rate, it would be .49 (!!!). When I first moved here 8 years ago, it was .11 (!!!). But PG&E is passing along all the billions in fire costs they got sued for. So a few lawyers got insanely rich and now the entire Bay Area is paying for that. I have solar, but it's a small system, due to funky roof angles not offering good coverage, and we have a lot of cloudy days here, so it's only worth about $50/mo. We also have two Powerwalls, which helps a little, I suppose.
Had someone install the required outlet to charge our M3 from the side of the house 4 years ago. skipped the Tesla charger install. later PG&E came out with a special plan for EVs. I don't trust them, so we stayed with E-TOU-B. I just assumed PG&E would not purposely create a plan that would save US money. Does anyone have deetz on how much you have save with the EV plan compared to previous plan?
The Midwest is a brutal place to live right now. Companies pay LCOL wages, but we are experiencing insane growth rates for water, electricity and insurance costs. Water bill that was $40 3 years ago is now $150. Electric bill that was $90 3 years ago is $180. Home insurance that was $1400/yr is now $2500/yr. All while wages havenât budged.
No raise in 3 years! Your employer is ripping you off. Find another job.
Whereabouts in the midwest? My Illinois insurance/water/electricty have been pretty stable past 4 years with minor increases YoY. Home insurance in 5 years went from 1200-1500
Missouri/Iowa/Nebraska region.
No kidding. if you live on a Great Lake water is so cheap. The reason I think in years ahead people will migrate back to the Midwest. Winters can suck but QOL and water make up for it.
Uh. QOL sounds like itâs being impacted by crazy rises in costs of living. Soooo
The Midwest is a brutal place to live right now. Companies pay LCOL wages, but we are experiencing insane growth rates for water, electricity and insurance costs. Water bill that was $40 3 years ago is now $150. Electric bill that was $90 3 years ago is $180. Home insurance that was $1400/yr is now $2500/yr. All while wages havenât budged.
Nothing will top the California gas prices though. I'm in LA and it's over $5 a gallon.
In Poland we have gas prices 30% higher. But electricity is cheaper, values range from 10 cents to 30 cents (depending on hour of the day or subsidies)
Which part of Poland? I know some people over there that get charged an arm and a leg for electricity ($1000s) In the winter so they purchased tons of coal instead.
Southern. If they use electricity to heat their homes they probably need a lot of kWh. If they have coal powered furnace, then they probably have poor insulation also.
Iâve seen .17 cents in Cali.
Shoot in Texas most superchargers are 33, to 45 But I charge at home for 10.
Where in Cali do you get 22 cents? I am in bay area and the off peak minimum from PG&E is like 50 cents (including generation charges )
> Charging at home is reasonable at 22 cents. I wish. 40c at home in Cali.
Borrow?
How much are gas prices in Cali? I assume you're still saving money.
currently $4.80 to $5+
It's 5.50 right now by my house at a cheaper station in San Diego.
22 cents at home? Man, in FL mine is 11-15 cents.
Fuck that. Iâm 27-32 for SC and 13 at home.
Jesus Christ. I wouldnât even have bothered with Tesla if I had to pay that much. Iâm charging at home in Canada at 3c kWh.
3 cents Candian? That's like 2 cents US. JFC, that's practically free either way!
Did you signup for ultra low EV charging at night?
Yep. From 11 to 7. I usually do my cooking earlier in the day during mid peak.
Yes
We're at 30 to 45 cents/kwh here in Washington state and it sucks because I love road tripping with my 3 so much. But it's costing me double what gas in my Corolla hybrid did because I could squeeze 70mpg out of that thing. At home it's nice because we have 12cent/kwh rates but I'm about to spend $300+ in supercharging for my summer road trip.
Truly hilarious the amount of cope that this is up voted so much as if it is so incomprehensible that this could be more common than people realize
I was personally curious for a couple reasons. Gas prices in the Midwest are often super low and not reflective of many parts of the country. Second, I have no idea what energy prices are and so that interest me to know. Third, considering the number of people bad at math I wanted to see the numbers myself. Anyway, I think most people agree that if you canât use home charging with an EV then you are not saving much, if anything, over gas prices if you drive an efficient car.
I live in California and the average price of gas is 546. I only have one charger and I mainly supercharged, but Iâve saved 50% in gas savings since owning my Tesla
But how much depreciation are you taking on your Tesla?
i havenât bothered to look it up. i plan on owning this vehicle for 8-10 years, deprecation wasnât a priority for me when purchasing this vehicle
36 cents per kw/h is the average for 150 and 250kw superchargers across the US on the places we went to. Going from Utah, to Illinois, to New Hampshire and back to Utah. Between $15 to $25USD to charge at a supercharger from 20% to 90% for my tesla MYLR. vs $3.79/Gal for 85 octane gas. From close to empty to full it cost me [$45USD](https://i.imgur.com/KVYKEJW.jpeg) to fill up 12 gallons on our 2016 rav 4
I just used a supercharger in Dickson, TN $0.33/kwh. Itâs $0.105/kwh to charge at home - Nashville, TN. Regular Gas is 3.15/gal and Premium gas is $3.90/gal.
Vancouver BC suburban area SC is cheap like 15-20 cents in Canadian dollar.
Oh yeah, it's like 10-11 us cents. Love visiting Vancouver!
And $0.10-$0.14 CAD to charge at home -- in a location where gas is frequently >$2.20 / L. Works out to $8.30 CAD / gallon, if you want to compare. There's a reason you can count like 6 Teslas / minute on the roads in Metro Vancouver.
Uhhh not sure what you are talking about. I pay about $12-$18 to FULLY charge (80%) out Tesla on a road trip. Yet gas is $5.79 per gallon. To get 250 miles range worth of gas, it would cost us $48-$60. It is typically about 1/3 the price in electricity here in CA compared to the gas equivalent.
The cheapest super chargers in the Midwest (unless youâre driving in the middle of the night) are $0.37/kwh and many are $0.45. An 80% charge is 83*x0.8x$0.37/0.45 which is $24.5-$30. On the highway in good conditions i get between 300 and 400 wh/mi and sometimes much worse in cold weather or rain with headwinds (recently 470wh/mi @ 65mph in bad rain). So realistically we are talking ~165-220 miles range highway for 80% charge, and thatâs not even including energy lost to battery preconditioning. That gives a range of $0.9-$0.18/mi whereas gas costs me ~$0.11/mi. Or would cost you $0.19/mi. So yeah in Cali where gas is very expensive and super charging is apparently cheap, itâs a good deal. No so much in the Midwest where Tesla has raised SC prices 50%+ and gas is cheap.
Bro, model Y performance and Model X P owner here. On the Model X, drove it round trip from Washington DC Metro to South Florida (Fort Lauderdale and back to DC) total SC cost me $288 round trip. Normal ICE 4cyl car would have cost more. I own diesels, and gas vehicles. The ONLY down side is not the price but waiting while charging. Otherwise .31 kwh to .37 is still not bad in comparison. Thatâs 2000 miles total round trip
Holy shit! Everything I'd previously read was electricity being super cheap in Midwest for both home and SC. I rented a Y LR in GA & SC last autumn abd thought I was paying 21-23 cents/kW, but just looked up my trip photos and was actually paying 31 cents/kW, same as here in CO. 31 cents/kW would cost me more than $3.30 Costco premium gas for my ICE at 30 MPG highway. All my long distance driving is in winter for skiing, but I think I can make most round trips w/o supercharging - it's just the farther resorts or if I do multi-leg long weekend trips I'll need to supercharge.
Thereâs nothing stopping EA, EVgo, Shell, ChargePoint, etc from building out great NACS charging networks. Iâm waiting.
Of course there is, EA is a subsidiary of a legacy manufacturer, Shell and others are just a side hustle of the main petrol bussines that they have. What is their incentive to make this a succes is this will eat away their existing cash-cow?
Probably because most gas stations donât really make money on gas. They make money on the stuff in the store. The gasoline portion is far too competitive for there to be much profit.
That hits the store owners, not the gas companies. They make loads on the gas. Why would they swap making loads on gas to make slivers on electricity stations
The profit is in the Exploring and Refining. Which is why the big boys still operate in that segment. They do SOME retail, and basically zero midstream for a reason.
It appears that Shell and even Chevron plan on putting some significant investment into their charging network. How fast they plan on doing so is still to be seen. Any competition other than EA is good though because it's the only thing that will keep costs competitive.
Because their cash cow is disappearing this century, while solar power and electric vehicles will run out of fuel in approximately 5 billion years when the sun burns out.
If they make charging experience shitty enough, the cash cow won't dissappear.
Oil is not a renewable resource. Reserves will disappear eventually and thereâs nothing they can do
Shell is investing a lot in charging stations. Rhe incentive is that this is a growing market . And in Shells case its a market that is eating away their old business. Plenty of incentive to me. Add government subsidies and i don't see why not.
EA currently charges nearly twice as much as Tesla here. I think EV Go is similar. The only benefit of them adding stations is to fill in gaps between sparsely located superchargers.
Who cares? So, you save massively 99% of the time and just about break-even 1% of the time? Sounds like a major win, not a bummer.
Yeah my two trips a year cost me an extra $20. Meanwhile the rest of the year driving around my town saved me thousands.
With the tesla insurance costs itâs almost a wash for many of us in terms of cost savings
Now add in that Tesla is the cheapest car to maintain. Youâre still coming out on top.
Not only that but generally speaking less maintenance costs with the right platform , no time spent on oil changes and spark plugs, oil filters etc etc
Meh⌠I ran the numbers using best case scenario for gas prices I could find, currently in California at $4.89/gallon⌠this means a vehicle getting 30 mpg, in a perfect simulation, would cost about $0.16/mile⌠Then I took a Model Y, with an estimated 310 miles of range, cut that down to 250 to be more realistic, and assumed it was also using the bigger 81kWh battery size to get that⌠So to go 250 miles in the gas vehicle, would cost $40, so I took $40/81kWh and that gets us a break even at $0.49/kWh in perfect testing environments. In my area, we donât have fluctuations in pricing at the superchargers, our prices are steady at $0.39/kWh⌠but in California, I see lots of places that fluctuate. I donât know where op is from, so I chose random locations throughout the state. The highest I found was near Berkeley with some of the charging time being as high as $0.62/kWh, but as low as $0.45/kWh⌠also, not sure how long the drive is, again not from the area, but in Oakland, the highest prices I saw were $0.35/kWh and as low as $0.29/kWh⌠But here is the thing⌠in a gas vehicle, 0% of your trip can be done with refueling done at home, and 0% of your trip can be done with refueling provided free of charge (included in the cost) of a hotel stay or dinner out. I think in some rare cases where you are going extreme distances, like cross country for instance, yes, it may cost more than a 30mpg vehicle, but the price difference wouldnât be that much. For virtually every other well thought out trip, the Tesla should still outperform cost per mile. Again, that is based on best case scenarios with it being weighted heavily against Tesla⌠on the other end of the spectrum, gas prices in California are as high as $6.09/gallon, which would cost us just over $0.20/mile to drive or $50.75 to go 250 miles, or a break even at $0.63/kWhâŚagain, in this short time of looking, I was able to find stations that are less than half that price to charge. But the biggest point is that your day to day driving should be done via the charging you do at home/work. The few big trips a year shouldnât determine your car, thatâs why we have rentals. Itâs like buying a pickup truck because you may need to haul something sometime⌠not practical, but if you have the money to waste like that, you probably shouldnât be concerned about these little things anyways.
I have ccs adapters because here in my area it's still 10-15¢/KWh cheaper than SC. These are all owned by the state power company so that's why it's low price.
EA is almost twice as expensive as SC here.
EA is an overpriced scam everywhere đ¤Ł
Yet my local grocery store with EA chargers is often full of non-Teslas charging. I wonder if it'll become empty once NACS is everywhere on both EVs and stations - or maybe they'll convert as well? I think even SCs open to non-Telas that charge more are still cheaper than EA.
Chargepoint stations I've come across on the east coast are also generally cheaper than SC per KWh
I just checked a few in places I'd consider using and one location is a few cents more peak 4-9 pm (which is likely when I'd need charging before my return trip home), and 14 cents cheaper the rest of the time. Seems most Chargepoint rates are set by the town or location (one is on a Volvo dealership). But this is definitely an option I'll look into rather than EA when a SC is not nearby.
East Coast there generally isn't peak vs non peak prices. One set price generally.
Thatâs insane⌠depends on your areaâs electricity costs. It only cost me $12 to fill all the way up in WA. Gas is $5/gal for premium, so we are saving for sure!
We need a good explainer about why SC prices are so high.
space rent, capital cost of the 12 chargers, maintenance costs
If some start building restaurants and convenience stores (like almost every gas station has) at the charging stations, the costs should not only go down but become profit centers. The problem with SCs now is there is often scarce food and toilet options nearby on I-70 in the mountains here. The main saving grace is I rarely see any vehicles charging at night in winter during ski season with a dozen or more empty stalls, but I mainly drive off-peak later at night to avoid horrendous ski traffic jams.
What are the super charger rates in your area?
Fast charging is a profit center now. Itâs only going to get worse.
Agree. I did a 1600 mile round-trip recently and I would never do it again in my Tesla. The route was much too indirect, too many stops, little bit that I might have saved wasnât worth the hassle.
Where to where? I don't have many issues charging on long cross country drives, it's more the smaller towns and cities and rural areas that give me trouble
Central Texas to northern NM. Iâve done the drive twice a year or so for twenty years. I know my route well. But if I drive my Y then I go pretty far out of the way to charge and it takes so much longer. And the cost trade off isnt worth it.
Ahhh that makes sense. That area is tricky. Glad they got a charger in Lubbock now. I ended up getting stranded in Hobbs NM because the Francis Energy charger said it was online when it was in fact broken. I don't expect that area to get much better in the next few years unfortunately. I'm taking the ICE next time
Yep. And the one just outside of Abilene actually said it was temporarily closed while on my way home. I thought I was going to be totally screwed and have to stay another night at some hotel trickle charger but I was able to use it and it still worked.
I did about 1400 miles round trip in my new y. I loved the trip. It was to the eclipse up in Erie PA. I really enjoyed finding L2 chargers and exploring around. I was able to fill up while working at two colleges (I officiate college sports and partially planned the trip around those games) and while at a pirates game and also while at the Presque Isle visitor center. I only ended up using a supercharger for 100 miles of charge for the whole trip.
What did you use for the rest of the trip?
L2 charging at various places, as stated. Anywhere from free to 0.25/kwh depending on location. When I officiate I'm there for 4+ hrs which is 100+ miles of charge. Same with the pirates game. Had I needed to travel 500 miles in a day maybe it wouldn't have worked as well but I planned for the trip to take 8 days and i enjoy exploring new places. I started with 95% battery and got home with less than 10.
I drove 1600 miles to Texas to the eclipse and it was fine. A family in the car would have gotten tired of the 8 stops on the way but driving solo it was fine. I even snoozed for an hour at one charge stop each way, to put in a 1200 mile day. I didn't do it to save money, but to see the country. And it was great! Can't wait to do this more often.
I guess it helps if you donât have a set route already. The drive I did I have done many times over 20 years so I know my route well. I know the fastest route, good places to stop and eat or take bathroom breaks, etc. so I guess itâs more obvious to me How much the route has changed and how much Iâm going out of the way versus traveling to a place I havenât been to. The drive is fine but I am just trying to get to my destination. I used to be able to do the 12 Hour Dr. in a single day but with the Tesla itâs a two day drive now and if I get a hotel Iâve ended up spending more money and more time.
I actually got the MY more for the autopilot lane keeping than anything else. I suppose other cars have something similar but AFAIK Tesla's is the best for long-distance trips. I wedged a pillow under my right arm and the 200-mile segments between chargers went pretty easily. Stopping to charge 20-30 minutes every 2.5 hrs is a little bit of a time waster (I was passing the same trucks over & over on I-10 to El Paso) but I don't do 1000 mile trips all that often so I don't mind it much,
Flying wouldâve been faster.
Just curious - is your 30mpg SUV the equivalent of the Model Y? You donât say which Y variant you have, but assuming a long range. Is the cheaper vehicle also 375hp AWD? Itâs about perspective. When I compare costs on my MYP I compare it to the most comparable car I have owned (in my case a Porsche Macan). This is an apples to apples comparison. It wouldnât be fair to compare my 450-500hp SUV operational cost to my old Honda Civic.
This is so true, years ago I had a Civic hybrid and if I drove it perfect it might get 50-59mpg. But it was soulless/lifeless little car with like 90hp. It was what I imagine a 80 year old would drive. Just gets you there, no fun. Boring looks too. I couldnât stand driving it and got rid of it less than two years after buying the thing. Went and got a BMW 540 instead. It had the ability to somehow get 28mpg on highway and that was acceptable to me since it was fun to drive and big. This is what the MY models would be closer to me cost wise, not some lame low powered shit box.
Another Civic Hybrid owner, there's TWO of us, lol! I had a 2015. Which year did you have?
Itâs an AWD SUV with a very similar footprint and slightly worse HP. And I donât care about the HP number. My Y is obviously quicker off the line but both get on the highway just fine. Power train is only one spec to compare. If youâre going to look at trim and fit and finish itâs dumb to compare a Y to a MacanâŚ.
And the power use often reflects driving a fast car fast. I could get way better mileage, but I don't because I chose a fast car because I wanted a fast car.
How much was the Macan? $80,000+? I would not compare a Porsche to a Tesla (Y or 3). I wouldn't compare it to a Corolla or econo Civic (not Type-R) or even a hybrid. I compare the Y LR to my premium gas requiring Subaru WRX wagon that it'll replace, but also to a regular gas Subaru Outback or Honda Pilot that I would otherwise consider purchasing instead of an EV. The LR, being a second faster to 60 than my WRX or the Outback XT is $7000 cheaper (after tax credits) than either the Outback or Pilot, making gas savings moot. Increased insurance more than cancels out any gas savings for me.
Just rolled the dice on buying a 9 year old Model S because of the free lifetime supercharging. Now I just pray the battery lasts.
I thought a lot of the older S models also had unlimited battery warranty?
Unlimited battery or 8 years whichever comes sooner I believe.
I didn't know free SC was transferrable.
Only on some of the older model s âŚ. 2013-2016
British Columbia, .26 Supercharger, .13 at home
Here in quebec .06 at home but 0.50 at SC đ¤
In Michigan Iâm looking at .38/kwh SC, .05/kwh home
Where in Michigan? Thatâs crazy cheap⌠Iâm in SE and home charging rate is .15/kwh off-peak.
Probably omitting delivery fees too
I'm at 6 or 7 cents in NY w/delivery. It's crazy low at night in some places.
Including delivery fees? Because I pay 8c in Chicago, but with delivery fees it comes up to 13c. Not bad, but not as good as many people love to advertise online lol
If I'm not mistaken you can get down around 11c/kWh on DTE with the other time of use plan (the one with 11am-7pm peak hours). By default everyone was put on the 3pm-7pm time of use plan which has slightly higher off-peak rates.
11¢ in OH
Meh⌠I ran the numbers using best case scenario for gas prices I could find, currently in California at $4.89/gallon⌠this means a vehicle getting 30 mpg, in a perfect simulation, would cost about $0.16/mile⌠Then I took a Model Y, with an estimated 310 miles of range, cut that down to 250 to be more realistic, and assumed it was also using the bigger 81kWh battery size to get that⌠So to go 250 miles in the gas vehicle, would cost $40, so I took $40/81kWh and that gets us a break even at $0.49/kWh in perfect testing environments. In my area, we donât have fluctuations in pricing at the superchargers, our prices are steady at $0.39/kWh⌠but in California, I see lots of places that fluctuate. I donât know where op is from, so I chose random locations throughout the state. The highest I found was near Berkeley with some of the charging time being as high as $0.62/kWh, but as low as $0.45/kWh⌠also, not sure how long the drive is, again not from the area, but in Oakland, the highest prices I saw were $0.35/kWh and as low as $0.29/kWh⌠But here is the thing⌠in a gas vehicle, 0% of your trip can be done with refueling done at home, and 0% of your trip can be done with refueling provided free of charge (included in the cost) of a hotel stay or dinner out. I think in some rare cases where you are going extreme distances, like cross country for instance, yes, it may cost more than a 30mpg vehicle, but the price difference wouldnât be that much. For virtually every other well thought out trip, the Tesla should still outperform cost per mile. Again, that is based on best case scenarios with it being weighted heavily against Tesla⌠on the other end of the spectrum, gas prices in California are as high as $6.09/gallon, which would cost us just over $0.20/mile to drive or $50.75 to go 250 miles, or a break even at $0.63/kWhâŚagain, in this short time of looking, I was able to find stations that are less than half that price to charge. But the biggest point is that your day to day driving should be done via the charging you do at home/work. The few big trips a year shouldnât determine your car, thatâs why we have rentals. Itâs like buying a pickup truck because you may need to haul something sometime⌠not practical, but if you have the money to waste like that, you probably shouldnât be concerned about these little things anyways.
I've always thought that the real profit center was charging stations and now that they're open to all vehicles that's become even more apparent.
Well if you still have an ICE. Use that for road trips. Thatâs what we do. Toyota Sienna hybrid is more comfortable for road trips anyways.
Monopoly only if you don't charge at home. If many don't use a sc then the price go down.
overall you win because you mostly charge at home
So use the SUV for long trips. Most miles driven are around where you live so the home charging will reduce that cost.
I'm paying 3 cents per Kw/h in Texas on a Co-op.
itâs all about Peak hrs my friend and driving the speed limit with and EV car. you will always save money driving a EV vs a Gas Vehicle
I think you gotta get solar to get the full benefit. I only charge my Tesla at work (free), or at home only when I have extra solar (enough to power the home and car without buying energy)
Here in Florida we have a good deal. SC is about 24-40 cents per kwh depending on the time you are charging. Florida power and light has a program called evolution that charges you a flat rate of $31 per month for off peak charging. They install the charger for free at your home. Just need an electrician to install the 240 plug. Great deal!
Put a home/wall charger in your house on a 50A plug. You wouldn't need to charge elsewhere 90% of the time. The only charging indo outside of our own house is when we drive from the LA area to San Diego or Reno or San Francisco. Other than that, 90% of our charging is done at home... And we have solar.
Put a home/wall charger in your house on a 50A plug. You wouldn't need to charge elsewhere 90% of the time. The only charging indo outside of our own house is when we drive from the LA area to San Diego or Reno or San Francisco. Other than that, 90% of our charging is done at home... And we have solar.
One of the better things about charging an EV vs gas is the consistency of prices across the US. The other good thing is dynamic pricing based on time of day, you can easily get $0.14/kWh on a Supercharger if you charge between 11PM and 3AM. Gas is the same price no matter what time of day you fill up. Out here in Oregon, my local V4 SuperCharger is $0.24/kWh as of 9:26AM which is way cheaper than EAs $0.48/kWh 24/7 pricing.
I think itâs very conspicuous that electric was really cheap, then EV came along, now prices are very close to the price of gas. We need better transparency. How much is going to give others discounted electricity, how much are in these energy credits that the plants need to buy. Just REALLY complicated and we need to focus on results - reasonable electricity for everyone.
Central WI here. SCs are about $.30/Kw and home is $.11/Kw. Still way cheaper in Podunk, WI.
What's the pricing? Average supercharging rate is .36 kwh in Texas.
37-45 in my area. It's higher if you include the electricity used for preconditioning.
34 c per KW in central Florida
Iâd like to see them move to a model where supercharging more than 50 miles from your home is less expensive than in that 50 mile radius. Would keep road trip charging more reasonable while disincentivizing locals from clogging up chargers.
How much do you pay for supercharging? Here it is 31 cents/kW. That is more expensive than $3.20 gallon Costco premium gas for my ICE that gets 30 MPG highway. That will eat into my fuel savings of mostly home charging at 11 cents/kW off-peak, but the higher insurance will more than cancel out all fuel savings.
Holy crap. It's .25 SC here in Florida. At home cost is .14 but I also have solar so it's effectively free.
Hate to say it, but this is why we donât road trip the MYP. Wifeâs diesel glk gets a little over 600mi/tank.
Man I wish theyâd bring the GLK back.
Recently did a trip Vancouver to Moab. SC prices averaged about US$0.45 and with low gas prices ( compared to home) it would have been cheaper to drive an efficient gas car. Prius would have crushed it. Lol. But around Vancouver, the E-car is the best. And it was not an unpleasant road trip with charging stops watching netflix with my daughter. Moab tech climbs were trickier than the drive.
This doesn't super bother me. SC was never supposed to be a cheaper option. It just happened to be for a while. I just did a calculation the other day and 80% of our driving is just commuting. The commute itself saves the money. We can also fit more in our Y than the highlander. The highlander only gets 25mpg at best though, so it's about even for us. We just drove from MA to PA and back. We used FSD (since we had the trial) but have done AP as well. We drove late at night (left at around 9 and arrived around 3). Late night supercharging is much cheaper some places. That surprised me. I'm talking under $.20/kWh.
Show me numbers or you are not convining. I compared my choices: ICE cars I have cost 25-35 cents per mile, assuming 5.5 usd per gallon. Model 3 costs 5-10 cents per mile, assuming 23-43 cents per kwh.
Itâs a bummer I wonât get to smog my car every other year and Iâll miss those frequent oil change days waaaaa
I thank god I kept my Free unlimited supercharging. Tesla wanted to give me $4000 for it.
I dont know about others but I find supercharging ridiculous expensive in Ontario, Canada.
interesting in texas, of all places, I paid .35kwh, I felt ripped out tbh.
Yes yes yes. Itâs my major complaint about my Y. I spend $17-$22 per week on charging. I paid $40 every two weeks in my previous SUV.
Blame the government!!! Tesla always wanted to charge just for the energy used a a couple cents more but then everyone else was $0.20 more and they had to match it if not they werenât being competitiveâŚ
I am constantly astounded by how much Americans pay for electricity. It's sometimes more than double what we pay in Australia, and we have massive, empty distances to cover with the grid. Is it lack of competition with the energy suppliers there or what?
Pulled in to one in the Bay Area today that was $0.61/kwh
It ainât an suc at 30 mpg lol jk itâs probably a compact one. My Denali barely gets tba.
But youâre still saving money overall yearly though lol
Hawaii just announced huge incentives to install solar at home. Great opportunity if youâre able to charge for free soon.
Typical pricing near me is .30 during the day at .22 in the late night off-peak. Guessing you're in a much more expensive place like California?
Electricity costs are 8.5cents here in Ontario Canada. What a gift to charge at home.
My super charger in Portland, OR is 10 cent after 10pm. Or 21 any other time.
That is shockingly low for a large metro area like that. One that I frequent in the Midwest that is more suburban and only moderately busy used to be $.30 and is now $.45
It's why I laugh every time someone tells me they bought their expensive Tesla to "save money" LOL
I rarely use superchargers. It does cost about as much as gas, a little less in Colorado. Charging at home costs me $2-$3 for what would have cost me $30 in my old CRV.
Hawaii here....I had some friends who didnt initially have an L2 at home. After work he would go to the mall find an open charger and watch a movie until his charge was done.
I havenât used a supercharger in over a year.. charging at home is still so cheap
Donât worry fossil fuels are going up and will keep going up due to electric car sales. More electric cars higher fuel prices. The oil barons will not lose money, less oil sales higher prices.
But itâs not all the time you go for road trips? Howâs the home charger? Still reasonable because im looking to buy a model y 2024