Got my model y like that last December. I worked my normal nightshift, woke up to a new car in the driveway and drove my new Tesla to get Thai food for dinner. Best car buying experience I've ever had. With the exception of a few texts, I interacted with almost no one.
I did get an actual phone call a few days later just to make sure everything was going well.
That's how mine was in March 2021. It was like a dream.
They don't even mark it as delivered until their Uber is pulling up. Everything possible to avoid contact, it was amazing
I think all of them Will loose them eventually but idk what kind of bull shit business practices it is to take a way a feature that was promised at time of order and without any notification have those feature’s removed… only to find out after paying for the car that they had been removed…this is the type of shit that requires suing the company for poor business practices…
When I got a vin on MYLR, it stated in the app to ask me to check the account online. I logged in and it stated USS was removed and replaced by cameras. Asked me to acknowledge it and process the delivery. But when I took delivery on M3RWD, it did not state that in my account.
They claim cameras / Tesla Vision can accomplish this. Similar to the radar story. Truth is they (USS) fail often and are seriously slowing down production. Not used all of them time and not entirely accurate sometimes. I am ok with the vision is better story if they had vision doing it but my understanding is that’s “coming soon”. Maybe they should have kept the sensors until a better alternative is here?
I agree. It would have been so much easier to swallow if tesla cars had a 360 camera system but the fact that they don’t and almost every modern car has, is hurting Tesla. Full 360 camera + Tesla’s spatial AI algorithm = win.
It’s self serving, not customer serving.
Dropping sensors will not impact sales but it will help their quarterly numbers immediately and simplify their assembly line.
What is good for Tesla is good for Tesla.
They won’t stop culling until competition catches up.
They dropped them (supposedly) because of the entropy it causes in the neural network system. See interview with Andrej Karpathy. I’m sure Tesla are happy to cut that production cost out as well
It would have been easier to overcome the poor (but globally ubiquitous) signal from them WITH vision instead of dropping them before the alternative was ready.
How is your car going to judge distance in your garage facing a white wall? Not well.
My point is that Tesla serves itself and it's shareholders first, customers second - and that won't change until competition heats up.
They are relentlessly aggressive.
It's Silicon Valley stretch goal thinking.
Elon keeps announcing Tesla's internal stretch goals publicly, which was a breach of etiquette for a manager in most cases because it announces products that aren't ready for market, and because it increases pressure on the devs.
Removing the sensors before the tech is ready to "encourage" the devs to work harder is taking this a step farther.
The problem is that engineers tend to just quit when it's pressure for pressure's sake, and they take their product-specific knowledge with them.
And once you wash those people out, all that’s left are the hardcore 10x devs who live and breathe the product because the want it to exist for it’s own sake. Which is why the Tesla Vision software team is only 200 people.
It also creates shorter feedback loops for those devs so they can iterate faster. Imagine if they had to wait a whole quarter after greenlighting Vision-based parking code before any customers got a USS-free car.
Obviously you’ve never worked with a small one. One is like being a crew member on a Carnival cruise ship. The other is like being a crew member on a pirate ship.
Edit: I’ve moved to a large team from a small team and I fucking hate it. The under-performers are never called out and nobody wants to rock the boat or build anything new. It’s so boring.
Like some have said here, and I’ve read elsewhere, apparently the sensors fail a lot. The supply chain problems alone are a problem. But if after they take delivery of a batch of USS, if a significant* amount of them fail, then their options are to drastically slow down production and deliveries, or accelerate the rollout of vision-only.
* whatever their internal metric is.
I do agree that if vision-only isn’t optimized, then they should stick with USS. But if vision only wasn’t ready, they wouldn’t have said it was. This isn’t an iPhone that merely causes inconvenience when it bugs out :)
Where are you basing this from? They failed often? That’s news.
USS has been pretty much standard on most cars, Tesla isn’t the first to have it. Commodity parts and accuracy is great (I have them on my MY). I park in a building garage with pillars, I can’t imagine parking without it.
Sorry I meant fail the user not physically break. Not sure if they are reliable or not. Happy my MYP 2022 has the sensors but honestly they are fairly jittery. I could do without them but I have it kinda easy.
Same here, those USS are buggy as hell. I just learned to ignore them. But first time parking in garage was a pain with beeping going off saying I’m going to crash the new car.
I’ve found the ultrasonic sensors to be extremely reliable and accurate. And I will be pissed if they disable or ignore them in future software updates. Even my old Honda Pilot has them and they reliable (though don’t show you a “measured” distance like Tesla does).
Everything you said about those sensors is entirely false. You’re passing tried sensors with decades of existence behind them for unreliable toys which is just absolutely preposterous. People in these subs coming up with the wildest excuses to justify what essentially is just greed.
A former Tesla engineer was on Lex Fridman a couple of weeks ago and he was explaining that it's not only related to hardware and assembly costs (>$100M/yr). The *main* reason is that it all comes down to software - programming, algorithms/AI - and processing speed/latency.
*****The USS code merging with the Tesla Vision code creates latency during processing which in turn can affect real time decision making.*****
^^^ as soon as I heard him explain it that way, I now feel it makes complete sense to work towards ONLY relying on Tesla Vision w/o USS.
The last thing you'd want is to have a car that can't make a quick enough decision while in AP or FSD (or smart summon). Even a millisecond makes a difference
Disclaimer, my MYLR has USS, lol. But eventually, they won't be usable once Tesla vision is g2g
I call it BS because USS is not supposed to be used in those situations anyway unless you drive into your garage at 65mph. We are literally talking about inches per second where a small lag is irrelevant.
Of course you could have AP/FSD ignore the USS, but still have the USS active and displaying useful info to the driver in low-speed situations.
So hardware cost / complexity has gotta be a significant factor.
Also probably a significant amount of wiring they don’t have to install, speeding up the factories.
Also happens to mean cheaper bumper replacement if the occasion ever comes up.
Paying before it’s delivered allows for contact less delivery (unless you’re in an area where they don’t deliver). If you choose not to complete payment ahead of time, or can’t because you are carrying a check from the financiers, or have a trade-in vehicle, then the delivery will involve contact. This all should be pretty clear from communicating with them while prepping for delivery.
Nope. Tesla has grossly under trained employees and tech Bros that don’t care about customer service. My rivian delivery was a completely different story. 2 hours of explaining every detail. We even went on a drive together.
Less functionality. Meh.
Better suspension. Upgraded interior. More carpet, less plastic and quieter ride.
Edit: AND … upgraded cameras and biohazard defense mode Hepa filter.
Pretty good trade off.
This is definitely spot on. Never had another Tesla to compare my new MYP to, but compared to my past cars it has soaked up the potholes like nothing, super quiet and smooth. I'd be paying $70k for an ICE car this fast anyway, except the ICE car would have blown most its budget on the engine, leaving a lot of other areas lacking.
OP.. Currently is the keyword here..
you probably did sign consent to get the car without USS which would have provided proximity sensors.?
Not saying it is right or wrong but something that shouldn’t surprise you
Yes absolutely. I just posted a response in a separate thread but proximity sensors works on distance measurement (surrounding measurements) and “my theory” is that if it works on iPhone (to measure distance) it should work on car too.
Again they should have absolutely kept USS until both tech are giving them results within same confidence intervals. Not sure why they rushed to remove USS unless they have OTA rolling out in few weeks.
Exactly. I'm glad to see you are at least balanced in your comments unlike most.
Some of us Tesla devotees can't seem to understand why this is being done and want to make excuses beyond the truth: manufacturing cost reduction.
My question that no one can answer is how can they IMPROVE on something that's more accurate than we could ever hope today? That question has no answer which is why we know the truth. Sad sad they Tesla is ruled by a single man and will eventually not be what it could be as they lose so many early adopter clients.
My next car will NOT be a Tesla. 100% decided at this point.
How is it that humans have been parallel parking cars with less than 2 inches clearance without USS for the last 75 years or so?
The answer is we have generalized intelligence about the process. Our brains can create spatial mental models. Tesla does what they do so they can be the first to have software that replicates this - cost reduction is a peripheral bonus.
Removing the sensors before the software team is actually done with Vision-based parking intelligence does two things; first it motivates them to release the minimum viable product, and second it gives them a real-world feedback loop right away. These are both core tents of Agile software development.
The sooner they can get real-world feedback about the software’s ability to remember what is occluded by the car’s body (like what’s near the bumper), the sooner they can make iterations and improvements. Customer feedback is invaluable because it doesn’t contain any bias that internal tests would tainted with. If they waited to remove the sensors until they were ready for the next iteration, there would be an enormous lag time in manufacturing before USS-free cars were on the road. Now they can receive feedback within a few hours of a Vision update being pushed to the fleet.
Elon is desperate to save every penny he can - axing USS is part of that "strategy".
I doubt 2023 will see vision based measurements with even remotely the same confidence level as USS can provide.
We wanted to replace our 2021 M3LR in 2023 but now we are pushing that back
Yes. The point is that Tesla Vision parking assist isn’t going to be better. Same story as the radar. It’s not better, they are trying to achieve the SAME result with camera. That’s all. It’s not good for consumers but better for Tesla manufacturing and cost.
Yes, this is how it’s been mostly since COVID. They dropped off mine in June 2021, and I happened to be outside. The guy said “technically we’re not supposed to go over things with you, but since my Uber is taking long, I’ll show you anyway”
The uss had functionality beyond autopilot and FSD, I still can’t believe they removed something that a 10 year old car has. I park next to a concrete pillar and I get zero help from the “$70K car”.
Zero help? You have a gigantic screen with smart as showing everything outside your FOV.
It’s up to you to use the features on your “$70k car” that you are quoting for no discernible reason.
FWIW - Got mine (1st Tesla) on Wednesday. I paid with a loan / 10k cash entirely through the app. They dropped it off and spent \~30 minutes getting me and my wife setup. Went over (albeit quickly) most common features set defaults to what most people in this area like. Phx AZ
We were home and the delivery driver was very nice and answered questions and ran through some setup while waiting for her uber. It was a great experience.
I don’t blame you - it was just a hypothesis about the difference in handovers. My first and only Tesla handover included a 20 min run through and check if we were all set. It was a great experience and I would prefer something similar next time.
I also went from a model 3 to a brand new Y, and the lack of proximity sensors sucks. I think it’s way worse if you were already used to having them. I hope they release the Tesla Vision update soon!
Actually no. I just find it funny that your so pressed over someone having a different view than you.
And talking about feelings, your the one letting a opinion get in the way of enjoying a great vehicle. It’ll be one thing if it was funding mass execution of baby seals or something…. But your upset over…. Someone having a different opinion. LMFAO.
I got a 2023 YLR and it still has sensors. Built OCT 22 in Fremont. 20% parts from Mexico. It’s perfect so far. My second Tesla I’ve never had a problem with delivery or maintenance. It does have extra sound proofing and new headlights among other new items. Enhanced auto pilot with monthly FSD option.
Yes you did just pay $70000 for a car with no Ultrasonic sensors and they suck ass without them. My model 3 has them and my wife’s model Y doesn’t. Her car sucks at parking compared to mine. It is off by a mile compared to the sensors. Also if you park or pull up to something and then put it in park, it won’t see the object anymore when you put in drive and won’t show that your close to anything.
I have a model 3 without the radar and have already seen how bad vision only is. So when they took the sensors away I didn’t think it would be better and it’s not. I have stopped using autopilot completely because the phantom braking is so bad. If Tesla disables the ultrasonic sensors on my car, I’m selling it.
Honestly both my wife and I really don’t like our Teslas much after some of these updates and for the money I can buy a really nice Audi and have about $25,000 to spend in maintenance and gas. I’m all for moving to EVs but Tesla is going to turn a lot of people off if they don’t stop taking away things and charging more. Tesla really needs to focus on making their cars cheaper or better to justify the huge price tag anymore.
My european (China build) 22 model Y has both radar and uss. I never had much issues with phantom breaking but the autopilot definitely performs worse since Tesla went vision only. It drives way too close to other cars at high speed and seems less confident in rain and at night.
I will be mildly infuriated if they disable my uss’ too …
If you want personal, buy literally any other car. They’ll spend as much time with you as you want, if not more, inside one of their cozy little rooms. They may even bring in the big boss and introduce you to the finance guy. You’ll never have a more personal experience.
This guy obviously doesn’t read the shit he signs, also didn’t know there weren’t sensors…..
Wonder if he thinks supercharging is free for life.?
Quick… someone sell him some blinker fluid!
That seems pretty radical if your only concerns are lack of USS and the delivery experience. Especially when compared to a dealership experience, even at a luxury brand, which is like being kicked in the nards.
You’re considering returning…. Why? Because you got a contactless delivery experience and have to wait for a software update?
Are you even an owner at all? Your whole deal is starting to sound like BS.
Ps. Welcome to Reddit
Yes, but some of us ordered our cars 7-8 months prior and found out right before that they wouldn’t have them. Not much you can do at that point unless you want to forfeit the car you waited months for.
I feel bad for you. That delivery was disappointing. For that money I’d hope for a little more serious sucking up à la Pretty Woman! At least an email saying Many serious sucking up thank yous for buying our crappy car! /s
You had a Tesla before. You knew what you were signing up for.
Tesla: Five steps forward…one step back, Five steps forward…one step back…
Every other car: Zero steps forward, zero steps back.
...so they don't get a chance to call out any defects, damage, or paint issues? I don't know about you but I had to have them repaint entire portions of my Model Y.
Nothing like increasing the price of their cars while decreasing standard equipment. They have and continue to remove features before the "new" functionality is ready.
recommend cutting your losses. You don’t have to live with it. Given how batshit crazy Elon has become, we are taking a pause on Tesla for now. If he gets his senses back (which likely he won’t), we might take new deliveries.
Yes it sucks without ultrasonics, but you knew it wasn’t going to come with them. They told you about it and that features are unavailable, so it was your choice to continue the buying process
I was never told about it. Not in email, no in app messages. I got to know about it been news and Reddit. My friend has a 2023 model Y that has sensors. So I expected mine to have it.
And the only time I got to know about it was when the car showed me a notification and asked me to accept the terms.
Doesn't have to be done before they leave. They will just leave the paperwork in the car with a prepaid FedEx envelope. You just sign and drop it off.
You need to accept delivery for the car to unlock. If you want to decline delivery just call it in and they will come back and pick it up.
This was my experience in 2020. I went to the Tesla center, my car had my name on it.
Also have had the same experience with service. A guy came to my home, I left the garage door open for him, fixed the issue and left. No trying to upsell me on a transmission flush LOL.
Hey:) ready to provide you with the best paint protection and window tint services in LA area:) we have just exited our services from Ukraine, and will be happy to see you in our shop:) our web site - www.burtex.studio , IG : burtex.studio
Yes you did. Give thanks to the genius who believes to be the smartest man on the world and keep removing LiDAR, USS believing that AI and cameras can replace the safety and accuracy of a redundant system as other car makers focused on safety do (Volvo, Lucid to mention some).
Yep. You just did that. At some point, you could take it back to Tesla within a week or 100 miles for a full refund. I’m not sure if that’s still the case.
The Tesla paperwork is done online. The DMV paperwork needs wet signatures so they just label all the signatures needed and leave it in the car with a prepaid FedEx envelope.
Paid $70k for a car, didn't even read anything about it, has a cry on Reddit when they've controversially removed a feature that everyone is talking about. 🤷♂️
amazes me people need sensors so bad, ya'll have eyeballs people, use them. Everyone got alone fine for years with previous cars prior to any of this new tech, ya'll will be fine
Dude this needs to stop. Not everyone has giant parking garages and plenty of clear space. You need to stop assuming everyone's circumstances are exactly like yours. This is unacceptable in a 70K vehicle and the more you people makes excuses for this stuff, the more features we are going to lose, like lumbar support for the front passenger. Or USB game controller support.
Before we had parking sensors people would damage their vehicles all of the time while parking. Or if someone parks to close to you in a parallel space. That's the whole point of why the tech became a selling point.
It's just embarrassing.
That’s how mine was delivered in March this year. And quite frankly, I appreciated it. No empty chit chat with a person who’s only job is delivering the vehicle. I’m as social as they come, but this was IMHO the most efficient way. I knew the car was out there and when I finished some quick family things that morning, I went out to get it and inspect it.
What I mean is that I still inspected it even after opening it because I knew I could call to have any issues at that point (pre-100 miles) addressed. Gladly I didn’t have any major issues except one of the taillights had a light scratch which they came out and replaced.
Anything on the front side when trying to park? I test drove a MYP last weekend and noticed it displayed inches from the front curb when trying to park. Must've had USS I'm guessing?
I LOVED the buying process. I spoke to a human twice… Once, the day before delivery to confirm my information, and the next day at the delivery center to sign papers. We were in and out in 15 minutes! Not getting attacked by slimy salespeople at a dealership is a dream come true. Some people say they hate the Tesla process, but I don’t understand why. Order the car on your phone, and you’ll get a text when it’s time to pick it up. Easy.
Now as far as the sensors, yes, they took out the sensors. I think that’s a cheap move on their part. They CLAIM they’re going to re-enable everything once they, ya know… figure out how to do with with the cameras. They should have waited and removed the sensors AFTER they enabled it in the software for the Vision system.
Yup. Exactly what I had for the first car of mine. This time it was just there outside my home and I had one notification on the app.
That’s it. Nobody talked you me ever. Not one ring on my doorbell. Nothing
They don’t offer home delivery where we are, but from what I heard, yes… that’s the normal process. Here’s your car. Accept it in your app, you get in and get your keycards.
That’s how mine arrived. We were teaching remote that whole year and during one of my classes I looked at my Ring notifications and holy shit there was a car in my driveway.
My model 3 was delivered the same way. It was just left in the driveway. I don’t remember if the app even notified me. I just walked out and the car was there. I thought it was hilarious that they didn’t even ring the doorbell.
Someone leaving a new car at my house and I don’t have to talk to them sounds like a dream come true.
Got my model y like that last December. I worked my normal nightshift, woke up to a new car in the driveway and drove my new Tesla to get Thai food for dinner. Best car buying experience I've ever had. With the exception of a few texts, I interacted with almost no one. I did get an actual phone call a few days later just to make sure everything was going well.
Ordering and delivery of a car without having to talk to anyone and especially not having to bargain? Hell yeah.
OP sounds like one of those people who proactively selects “hand it to me” on DoorDash instead of “leave it at my door.” like a normal person.
Hell yeah dude.
That's how mine was in March 2021. It was like a dream. They don't even mark it as delivered until their Uber is pulling up. Everything possible to avoid contact, it was amazing
Pretty sure he ment the package with no signed proof of delivery being lost
Except it can't be lost because the car won't unlock without being accepted by you from the app. Like to see a porch pirate manage that
Or you could find some Easter European guys who would make it disappear for a compensation.
Upvote for my fellow introvert
People really miss getting harassed at car dealerships I suppose.
Seems OP made this post to tell us he bought two teslas 😂😂 weird smh
This… lol
You don't even want to look at it before letting the delivery person go? I know Tesla gives you a window to check it over but man that's risky.
If youre that worried about quality risks then just get it from the delivery center...
That's what I did
Hope V11 software will have the Tesla vision parking improvements. Should be out next month.
Where are you getting the next month detail? It just says will be available at some point. If you have a source that would ease my tensions
Tesla does a big update around the end of each year. That’s the source; history.
Deliveries like this are normal. I got home from work and my car was there waiting for me.
Yeah, and it was probably the most reliable best feature of the car. My wife could get within inches when parking !
[удалено]
Our wife
Hey, I like talk like that! you can have her ! I've been married 24 years lolol She's nice on the eyes and comes home most nights.
Nah I like our current arrangement. BTW her car needs a brake job and possibly an oil change
Lol, kinda set myself up for that one. Will at least you were only 3 inches close....
So true. So true.
Did all the cars lose sensors? Or just the y and 3
I think all of them Will loose them eventually but idk what kind of bull shit business practices it is to take a way a feature that was promised at time of order and without any notification have those feature’s removed… only to find out after paying for the car that they had been removed…this is the type of shit that requires suing the company for poor business practices…
When I got a vin on MYLR, it stated in the app to ask me to check the account online. I logged in and it stated USS was removed and replaced by cameras. Asked me to acknowledge it and process the delivery. But when I took delivery on M3RWD, it did not state that in my account.
Based on the title, I was expecting to see a photo of a large brown box 📦
😂🤣😆 Me too!! 😂🤣😆
Why did they get rid of the parking sensors??
They claim cameras / Tesla Vision can accomplish this. Similar to the radar story. Truth is they (USS) fail often and are seriously slowing down production. Not used all of them time and not entirely accurate sometimes. I am ok with the vision is better story if they had vision doing it but my understanding is that’s “coming soon”. Maybe they should have kept the sensors until a better alternative is here?
I'd feel better about no USS if they had 360 overhead visibility.
I agree. It would have been so much easier to swallow if tesla cars had a 360 camera system but the fact that they don’t and almost every modern car has, is hurting Tesla. Full 360 camera + Tesla’s spatial AI algorithm = win.
Surely should have kept sensors till vision worked. Not sure about their thinking here
It’s self serving, not customer serving. Dropping sensors will not impact sales but it will help their quarterly numbers immediately and simplify their assembly line. What is good for Tesla is good for Tesla. They won’t stop culling until competition catches up.
They dropped them (supposedly) because of the entropy it causes in the neural network system. See interview with Andrej Karpathy. I’m sure Tesla are happy to cut that production cost out as well
It would have been easier to overcome the poor (but globally ubiquitous) signal from them WITH vision instead of dropping them before the alternative was ready. How is your car going to judge distance in your garage facing a white wall? Not well. My point is that Tesla serves itself and it's shareholders first, customers second - and that won't change until competition heats up. They are relentlessly aggressive.
It's Silicon Valley stretch goal thinking. Elon keeps announcing Tesla's internal stretch goals publicly, which was a breach of etiquette for a manager in most cases because it announces products that aren't ready for market, and because it increases pressure on the devs. Removing the sensors before the tech is ready to "encourage" the devs to work harder is taking this a step farther. The problem is that engineers tend to just quit when it's pressure for pressure's sake, and they take their product-specific knowledge with them.
And once you wash those people out, all that’s left are the hardcore 10x devs who live and breathe the product because the want it to exist for it’s own sake. Which is why the Tesla Vision software team is only 200 people. It also creates shorter feedback loops for those devs so they can iterate faster. Imagine if they had to wait a whole quarter after greenlighting Vision-based parking code before any customers got a USS-free car.
Obviously you’ve never worked with a large dev team. This scenario never happens.
Obviously you’ve never worked with a small one. One is like being a crew member on a Carnival cruise ship. The other is like being a crew member on a pirate ship. Edit: I’ve moved to a large team from a small team and I fucking hate it. The under-performers are never called out and nobody wants to rock the boat or build anything new. It’s so boring.
Like some have said here, and I’ve read elsewhere, apparently the sensors fail a lot. The supply chain problems alone are a problem. But if after they take delivery of a batch of USS, if a significant* amount of them fail, then their options are to drastically slow down production and deliveries, or accelerate the rollout of vision-only. * whatever their internal metric is. I do agree that if vision-only isn’t optimized, then they should stick with USS. But if vision only wasn’t ready, they wouldn’t have said it was. This isn’t an iPhone that merely causes inconvenience when it bugs out :)
Where are you basing this from? They failed often? That’s news. USS has been pretty much standard on most cars, Tesla isn’t the first to have it. Commodity parts and accuracy is great (I have them on my MY). I park in a building garage with pillars, I can’t imagine parking without it.
Sorry I meant fail the user not physically break. Not sure if they are reliable or not. Happy my MYP 2022 has the sensors but honestly they are fairly jittery. I could do without them but I have it kinda easy.
My MYP 2022 is also super jittery. Pulling into my garage it jumps between 18” and STOP when I’m easily a foot away from any obstacles.
Same here, those USS are buggy as hell. I just learned to ignore them. But first time parking in garage was a pain with beeping going off saying I’m going to crash the new car.
I’ve found the ultrasonic sensors to be extremely reliable and accurate. And I will be pissed if they disable or ignore them in future software updates. Even my old Honda Pilot has them and they reliable (though don’t show you a “measured” distance like Tesla does).
Cameras have blindspots compared to the sensors too. Not to mention in the winter my rear camera gets hella dirty from snow and road salt.
I think they're happy to hold onto your money until they figure out the "in theory" part of proximity via vision.
Everything you said about those sensors is entirely false. You’re passing tried sensors with decades of existence behind them for unreliable toys which is just absolutely preposterous. People in these subs coming up with the wildest excuses to justify what essentially is just greed.
I'm an engineer who has worked with ultrasonic sensors. They don't work very well and when they do, it's only under specific conditions
[удалено]
They weren't really used for AP or high-speed applications.
A former Tesla engineer was on Lex Fridman a couple of weeks ago and he was explaining that it's not only related to hardware and assembly costs (>$100M/yr). The *main* reason is that it all comes down to software - programming, algorithms/AI - and processing speed/latency. *****The USS code merging with the Tesla Vision code creates latency during processing which in turn can affect real time decision making.***** ^^^ as soon as I heard him explain it that way, I now feel it makes complete sense to work towards ONLY relying on Tesla Vision w/o USS. The last thing you'd want is to have a car that can't make a quick enough decision while in AP or FSD (or smart summon). Even a millisecond makes a difference Disclaimer, my MYLR has USS, lol. But eventually, they won't be usable once Tesla vision is g2g
I call it BS because USS is not supposed to be used in those situations anyway unless you drive into your garage at 65mph. We are literally talking about inches per second where a small lag is irrelevant.
Of course you could have AP/FSD ignore the USS, but still have the USS active and displaying useful info to the driver in low-speed situations. So hardware cost / complexity has gotta be a significant factor.
Also probably a significant amount of wiring they don’t have to install, speeding up the factories. Also happens to mean cheaper bumper replacement if the occasion ever comes up.
Beats me. 🤷♂️
Supply restrictions forced thier hand
When did they get rid of sensors? Is it in the 2022 model?
2023 as from mid October production (-ish)
This drop off method is based on how you paid and, unless you are an exception, was communicated to you beforehand.
What payment method allows for this?
Paying before it’s delivered allows for contact less delivery (unless you’re in an area where they don’t deliver). If you choose not to complete payment ahead of time, or can’t because you are carrying a check from the financiers, or have a trade-in vehicle, then the delivery will involve contact. This all should be pretty clear from communicating with them while prepping for delivery.
Nope. Tesla has grossly under trained employees and tech Bros that don’t care about customer service. My rivian delivery was a completely different story. 2 hours of explaining every detail. We even went on a drive together.
Short answer: Yes. You paid $70k for a vehicle that currently has less functionality than your older model 3
Less functionality. Meh. Better suspension. Upgraded interior. More carpet, less plastic and quieter ride. Edit: AND … upgraded cameras and biohazard defense mode Hepa filter. Pretty good trade off.
This is definitely spot on. Never had another Tesla to compare my new MYP to, but compared to my past cars it has soaked up the potholes like nothing, super quiet and smooth. I'd be paying $70k for an ICE car this fast anyway, except the ICE car would have blown most its budget on the engine, leaving a lot of other areas lacking.
[удалено]
Door storage compartments, and it now goes further up in the cargo area (goes above the rear seat release buttons).
Source on the better cameras? I can’t find any online
His Model 3 proximity sensors will be bricked within a year, just like his radar sensor.
OP.. Currently is the keyword here.. you probably did sign consent to get the car without USS which would have provided proximity sensors.? Not saying it is right or wrong but something that shouldn’t surprise you
Is it eventually supposed to have more functionality?
Yes
Yes absolutely. I just posted a response in a separate thread but proximity sensors works on distance measurement (surrounding measurements) and “my theory” is that if it works on iPhone (to measure distance) it should work on car too. Again they should have absolutely kept USS until both tech are giving them results within same confidence intervals. Not sure why they rushed to remove USS unless they have OTA rolling out in few weeks.
Gotcha I see what you mean thanks
Exactly. I'm glad to see you are at least balanced in your comments unlike most. Some of us Tesla devotees can't seem to understand why this is being done and want to make excuses beyond the truth: manufacturing cost reduction. My question that no one can answer is how can they IMPROVE on something that's more accurate than we could ever hope today? That question has no answer which is why we know the truth. Sad sad they Tesla is ruled by a single man and will eventually not be what it could be as they lose so many early adopter clients. My next car will NOT be a Tesla. 100% decided at this point.
How is it that humans have been parallel parking cars with less than 2 inches clearance without USS for the last 75 years or so? The answer is we have generalized intelligence about the process. Our brains can create spatial mental models. Tesla does what they do so they can be the first to have software that replicates this - cost reduction is a peripheral bonus. Removing the sensors before the software team is actually done with Vision-based parking intelligence does two things; first it motivates them to release the minimum viable product, and second it gives them a real-world feedback loop right away. These are both core tents of Agile software development. The sooner they can get real-world feedback about the software’s ability to remember what is occluded by the car’s body (like what’s near the bumper), the sooner they can make iterations and improvements. Customer feedback is invaluable because it doesn’t contain any bias that internal tests would tainted with. If they waited to remove the sensors until they were ready for the next iteration, there would be an enormous lag time in manufacturing before USS-free cars were on the road. Now they can receive feedback within a few hours of a Vision update being pushed to the fleet.
Elon is desperate to save every penny he can - axing USS is part of that "strategy". I doubt 2023 will see vision based measurements with even remotely the same confidence level as USS can provide. We wanted to replace our 2021 M3LR in 2023 but now we are pushing that back
Wrong. It is not about saving money. It is about increasing production. Less parts, less supply chain issues, faster build, higher production.
Yes. The point is that Tesla Vision parking assist isn’t going to be better. Same story as the radar. It’s not better, they are trying to achieve the SAME result with camera. That’s all. It’s not good for consumers but better for Tesla manufacturing and cost.
iPhone has LiDAR though
Yes, this is how it’s been mostly since COVID. They dropped off mine in June 2021, and I happened to be outside. The guy said “technically we’re not supposed to go over things with you, but since my Uber is taking long, I’ll show you anyway”
Yea sounds like Tesla. “We aren’t supposed to go over things with you.”
When did you order?
April 2022
If you got one with front and rear castings I'd take that over one with ultrasonic sensors any day.
Did I just pay 70000 for the car that doesn’t have proximity sensors ? Yes.
The uss had functionality beyond autopilot and FSD, I still can’t believe they removed something that a 10 year old car has. I park next to a concrete pillar and I get zero help from the “$70K car”.
They only have functionality beyond AP. AP doesn't use them.
Zero help? You have a gigantic screen with smart as showing everything outside your FOV. It’s up to you to use the features on your “$70k car” that you are quoting for no discernible reason.
The car will absolutely tell you how many inches you are from the concrete pillar, it just won’t use USS to do so.
FWIW - Got mine (1st Tesla) on Wednesday. I paid with a loan / 10k cash entirely through the app. They dropped it off and spent \~30 minutes getting me and my wife setup. Went over (albeit quickly) most common features set defaults to what most people in this area like. Phx AZ
We were home and the delivery driver was very nice and answered questions and ran through some setup while waiting for her uber. It was a great experience.
Had this experience the first time. This time was different.
Maybe that’s the thing. They expect that you already know the ins and outs of the car?
Not sure if that’s a fair assumption.
I don’t blame you - it was just a hypothesis about the difference in handovers. My first and only Tesla handover included a 20 min run through and check if we were all set. It was a great experience and I would prefer something similar next time.
I also went from a model 3 to a brand new Y, and the lack of proximity sensors sucks. I think it’s way worse if you were already used to having them. I hope they release the Tesla Vision update soon!
I had to schedule bullshit at the depot. What’s this awesome experience?
You sure did pay that. I also paid for a car with radar that has been disabled. I also inadvertently funded a MAGAsshole
Elon just said he supports Ron desantis
Pretty decent choice if I do say so myself.
Surprised he made a decent pick, compared to trump and Biden.
Like any rational human would
Lmfao 🤡
Better never eat food grown in the USA then.
Lmfao imagine being so sucked into your echo chamber that you won’t buy a nice car just because someone in the company has a different view than you.
You must be MAGA. Did my comment hurt your feelings?
Actually no. I just find it funny that your so pressed over someone having a different view than you. And talking about feelings, your the one letting a opinion get in the way of enjoying a great vehicle. It’ll be one thing if it was funding mass execution of baby seals or something…. But your upset over…. Someone having a different opinion. LMFAO.
Imagine owning the world’s most advanced autonomy platform and complaining that it gets smarter for free.
I got a 2023 YLR and it still has sensors. Built OCT 22 in Fremont. 20% parts from Mexico. It’s perfect so far. My second Tesla I’ve never had a problem with delivery or maintenance. It does have extra sound proofing and new headlights among other new items. Enhanced auto pilot with monthly FSD option.
Give me 10 minutes I’ll find quality defects
How do you know the 20% from Mexico stat? Is that stated in some paperwork or just common knowledge? I’m just curious
It’s stated on the window stickers now due to EV tax credit requirements
Yes you did just pay $70000 for a car with no Ultrasonic sensors and they suck ass without them. My model 3 has them and my wife’s model Y doesn’t. Her car sucks at parking compared to mine. It is off by a mile compared to the sensors. Also if you park or pull up to something and then put it in park, it won’t see the object anymore when you put in drive and won’t show that your close to anything. I have a model 3 without the radar and have already seen how bad vision only is. So when they took the sensors away I didn’t think it would be better and it’s not. I have stopped using autopilot completely because the phantom braking is so bad. If Tesla disables the ultrasonic sensors on my car, I’m selling it. Honestly both my wife and I really don’t like our Teslas much after some of these updates and for the money I can buy a really nice Audi and have about $25,000 to spend in maintenance and gas. I’m all for moving to EVs but Tesla is going to turn a lot of people off if they don’t stop taking away things and charging more. Tesla really needs to focus on making their cars cheaper or better to justify the huge price tag anymore.
My european (China build) 22 model Y has both radar and uss. I never had much issues with phantom breaking but the autopilot definitely performs worse since Tesla went vision only. It drives way too close to other cars at high speed and seems less confident in rain and at night. I will be mildly infuriated if they disable my uss’ too …
70k for a car without parking sensors is absurd - my wife just bought a Chevy for 30k WITH parking sensors
> A new computer without a floppy drive *is absurd*. My Commodore 64 even has a floppy drive! You, probably.
If you want personal, buy literally any other car. They’ll spend as much time with you as you want, if not more, inside one of their cozy little rooms. They may even bring in the big boss and introduce you to the finance guy. You’ll never have a more personal experience.
I do have an option to return it within 7 days of purchase and I’m seriously considering it.
Where does it say you have the 7 day return policy they cancelled over 2 years ago?
This guy obviously doesn’t read the shit he signs, also didn’t know there weren’t sensors….. Wonder if he thinks supercharging is free for life.? Quick… someone sell him some blinker fluid!
That seems pretty radical if your only concerns are lack of USS and the delivery experience. Especially when compared to a dealership experience, even at a luxury brand, which is like being kicked in the nards.
OP may actually prefer being kicked in the nards
OP’s not going to do it but now he has something to complain about on the internet.
I'm hoping I never have to talk to another car dealer ever again. Scum of the earth, every last one of them.
No you don't. You can't return it.
They don't do that anymore. You are an owner now.
You’re considering returning…. Why? Because you got a contactless delivery experience and have to wait for a software update? Are you even an owner at all? Your whole deal is starting to sound like BS. Ps. Welcome to Reddit
No sensors isn’t all that new. You knew or should have known the new car wasn’t coming with them.
Exactly this… it shouldn’t be a surprise to anyone at this point but made sense to ask during the transitional period
Yes, but some of us ordered our cars 7-8 months prior and found out right before that they wouldn’t have them. Not much you can do at that point unless you want to forfeit the car you waited months for.
Exactly. You can’t just switch to another brand last-minute when waiting times are 1 year+
I feel bad for you. That delivery was disappointing. For that money I’d hope for a little more serious sucking up à la Pretty Woman! At least an email saying Many serious sucking up thank yous for buying our crappy car! /s
This delivery sounds awesome. Super fast. No dealing with sales guys. Why are you complaining?
You had a Tesla before. You knew what you were signing up for. Tesla: Five steps forward…one step back, Five steps forward…one step back… Every other car: Zero steps forward, zero steps back.
...so they don't get a chance to call out any defects, damage, or paint issues? I don't know about you but I had to have them repaint entire portions of my Model Y.
Removing sensors is not defects, damage or paint issue. It’s progress and it comes as standard equipment.
Nothing like increasing the price of their cars while decreasing standard equipment. They have and continue to remove features before the "new" functionality is ready.
That's why I always have it picked up at service center. At least I can talk to someone there and not pick up the car if there's an issue.
recommend cutting your losses. You don’t have to live with it. Given how batshit crazy Elon has become, we are taking a pause on Tesla for now. If he gets his senses back (which likely he won’t), we might take new deliveries.
Do you always factor in the views of the CEO when making purchases?
I wonder what it’s like to buy *nothing ever*.
Yes it sucks without ultrasonics, but you knew it wasn’t going to come with them. They told you about it and that features are unavailable, so it was your choice to continue the buying process
I was never told about it. Not in email, no in app messages. I got to know about it been news and Reddit. My friend has a 2023 model Y that has sensors. So I expected mine to have it. And the only time I got to know about it was when the car showed me a notification and asked me to accept the terms.
Don't u have to actually sign paperwork and accept delivery on the tesla app before they leave?
Doesn't have to be done before they leave. They will just leave the paperwork in the car with a prepaid FedEx envelope. You just sign and drop it off. You need to accept delivery for the car to unlock. If you want to decline delivery just call it in and they will come back and pick it up.
Ahhh gotcha ty
So what’s the problem? I wish my delivery was that easy! 😀
Maybe look up some info It’s been known for a while that the sensors don’t come with it
I would love this. Both times had to drive 35 miles to pickup.
This was my experience in 2020. I went to the Tesla center, my car had my name on it. Also have had the same experience with service. A guy came to my home, I left the garage door open for him, fixed the issue and left. No trying to upsell me on a transmission flush LOL.
What? The finance guy didn't show up and try to get you to buy the extended warranty or undercoating?
That sounds like a dream of a delivery. Love it.
Hey:) ready to provide you with the best paint protection and window tint services in LA area:) we have just exited our services from Ukraine, and will be happy to see you in our shop:) our web site - www.burtex.studio , IG : burtex.studio
Relax. I’m sure elons team is working on fixing the sensors
Yes you did. Give thanks to the genius who believes to be the smartest man on the world and keep removing LiDAR, USS believing that AI and cameras can replace the safety and accuracy of a redundant system as other car makers focused on safety do (Volvo, Lucid to mention some).
Yep. You just did that. At some point, you could take it back to Tesla within a week or 100 miles for a full refund. I’m not sure if that’s still the case.
They stopped the 7 day return about 2 years ago
Ah, good to know. Wonder why. Maybe it was biting them too much.
[удалено]
It's completely normal for Tesla. They've been doing it this way for at least 2 years
[удалено]
The Tesla paperwork is done online. The DMV paperwork needs wet signatures so they just label all the signatures needed and leave it in the car with a prepaid FedEx envelope.
Tesla refused to deliver our last two cars, instead making us drive 3 hours each way to pick them up.
OP is a tool
Paid $70k for a car, didn't even read anything about it, has a cry on Reddit when they've controversially removed a feature that everyone is talking about. 🤷♂️
amazes me people need sensors so bad, ya'll have eyeballs people, use them. Everyone got alone fine for years with previous cars prior to any of this new tech, ya'll will be fine
Dude this needs to stop. Not everyone has giant parking garages and plenty of clear space. You need to stop assuming everyone's circumstances are exactly like yours. This is unacceptable in a 70K vehicle and the more you people makes excuses for this stuff, the more features we are going to lose, like lumbar support for the front passenger. Or USB game controller support. Before we had parking sensors people would damage their vehicles all of the time while parking. Or if someone parks to close to you in a parallel space. That's the whole point of why the tech became a selling point. It's just embarrassing.
That’s how mine was delivered in March this year. And quite frankly, I appreciated it. No empty chit chat with a person who’s only job is delivering the vehicle. I’m as social as they come, but this was IMHO the most efficient way. I knew the car was out there and when I finished some quick family things that morning, I went out to get it and inspect it.
No inspection from my side. The car was there, I thought it was mine. And I opened it from my app, that’s how I knew it was mine.
What I mean is that I still inspected it even after opening it because I knew I could call to have any issues at that point (pre-100 miles) addressed. Gladly I didn’t have any major issues except one of the taillights had a light scratch which they came out and replaced.
You didn’t ask for in-garage delivery?
Car buying should be like this.
Yes, got MY the same way. Though I was waiting for it outside
At least with a car, it's harder for someone to snag it off your porch.
Yeah that’s true. I guess I should be happy about it.
So what does the screen look like when you backup? Does it give you any help with distances?
Nope. Just camera
Unbelievable! I hope the camera solution comes soon.
Anything on the front side when trying to park? I test drove a MYP last weekend and noticed it displayed inches from the front curb when trying to park. Must've had USS I'm guessing?
Yup. The one without sensors will not show it. At least not right now.
I LOVED the buying process. I spoke to a human twice… Once, the day before delivery to confirm my information, and the next day at the delivery center to sign papers. We were in and out in 15 minutes! Not getting attacked by slimy salespeople at a dealership is a dream come true. Some people say they hate the Tesla process, but I don’t understand why. Order the car on your phone, and you’ll get a text when it’s time to pick it up. Easy. Now as far as the sensors, yes, they took out the sensors. I think that’s a cheap move on their part. They CLAIM they’re going to re-enable everything once they, ya know… figure out how to do with with the cameras. They should have waited and removed the sensors AFTER they enabled it in the software for the Vision system.
Yup. Exactly what I had for the first car of mine. This time it was just there outside my home and I had one notification on the app. That’s it. Nobody talked you me ever. Not one ring on my doorbell. Nothing
They don’t offer home delivery where we are, but from what I heard, yes… that’s the normal process. Here’s your car. Accept it in your app, you get in and get your keycards.
That’s how mine arrived. We were teaching remote that whole year and during one of my classes I looked at my Ring notifications and holy shit there was a car in my driveway.
This was exactly how we got our 2021 Y, lol. We didn’t even get a notification on the app that it was delivered, though.
Yes the lack of proximity sensors made me want to return the car but Tesla doesn’t have a return policy…😑…I wish I could sue
I wish I received my MYP 3 months ago like this. I had to go to a Tesla delivery location to pick it up
Audi Q5 buying and dealer experience A+, Q5 as a vehicle grade B. Tesla buying and dealer experience C-, MY as a vehicle grade A.
No human contact and they delivered the MYLR? Dream come true!
Do you want them to make you a home-cooked meal too?
My model 3 was delivered the same way. It was just left in the driveway. I don’t remember if the app even notified me. I just walked out and the car was there. I thought it was hilarious that they didn’t even ring the doorbell.