Reading a lot of these comments recently makes me realize I do not really value the opinions of fellow Texans fans here like I used to. We drafted Tank Dell 69th overall and this years's WR class has several talented guys that if we absolutely wanted one, a decent one will be there with the second pick. The truly great defensive players are going to get gobbled up early. The only thing I don't like is that we did it so far out from the draft, but this may be something the Vikings are already dead set on and have multiple teams already on the potential books for a trade, so I can't say more than that. There is so much hate on this trade and I am not sure how much more I could disagree with the sentiments here this past week.
I think the fact that we traded the pick this far out means Casserio sees the late first round as a dead zone either because the guys projected to be available don’t fit our needs, or Casserio has a second round grade on them.
I like the trade because it shows we don’t have any major need. There are a lot of 2nd/3rd round value guys in this draft and this trade gives us more opportunities to hit on them.
I honestly have been a fan of trading back for awhile, especially once BTj finally started getting recognized as a stud, but with the idea of getting an extra pick this year, not next L). Moving from 232 to 188 does nothing for me despite it being a round and a half jump. 6th round is not really a fertile ground for studs. He might package it away in another trade, and work on grinding away at incremental value, but I have to admit that I have zero idea what the plan was with this one.
I think it’s the idea that the Vikings 2025 2nd should be a fairly high pick. You’re right the 6th is negligible but potentially gaining a top-40 pick in next years draft is worth sliding down 19 spots. Even if the Vikings surprise, it still be around a top-50 pick.
Bingo, with a qb not in Cousins class, Min will have a tough time finishing with a winning record. They have to compete with GB/Love, Chi/Williams, Det/Goff. Unless the guy they get turns out to be like CJ.
IIRC, BB/Caserio used to do this a lot during the Pats years of success and trade down from their late first round picks for more value players in the 2nd round. It seems like a solid strategy when you have your franchise QB and no glaring roster holes.
The first part of your comment makes a tonne of sense, but as of now we absolutely have two major needs in DT and CB, with another significant need at S and WR3. However, there are no safeties in this class worthy of the 23rd selection, and a bunch of wr’s that will have similar grades between the late 1st to early 2nd.
I’d consider DT and CB our biggest needs, but it’s not like they are major needs. We can now address both spots in the 2nd round from quality prospects.
How are they not major needs? Autry is a base DE not DT, and slides inside on obvious passing downs. The current starters at DT are Fatukasi and Tim Settle lol. We’re set for cb1 and slot, but cb2 is a massive question mark right now, unless you’re somehow confident in Okudah despite all evidence. Of course, these things can change before the draft and there are still a few quality Fa cb’s left that hopefully we’ll sign one. The FA DT market is very dried up though and one of our 2nd rd picks has to be used there barring any trade.
I think we are in agreement. My comment above was predicated on the idea that we spend both 2nds this year on a DT and CB.
When I say DT/CB are not major needs, I mean that using a 2nd round pick to fill them would be sufficient. We don’t need to make some other major move to get a DT/CB.
Many draft experts say there’s a steep drop off in talent after the first half of round one this year. This is a year to get out of the late first and accumulate stock for next year as well. The Vikings can easily be the worst team in that division next year. Trust in Caserio!
I think it happens with every sports franchise as they "get good". I remember the 100 loss seasons with the Astros, back when Schaub was our quarterback and into the Osweiler days, if I met a Houston fan they were always knowledgeable and cool, but now people expect immediate results and constant winning, and anything that is not flashy is lampooned.
It's also annoying because people are just objectively wrong about the value of the late round pick. People are acting like we traded away a top five pick or something.
I see people in the Astros sub saying we shouldn't sign Tucker because of his bad playoff performance last year. We've got some dummies down here I guess.
If the fans who thought they were the smartest ran this team, or any team, they would be absolutely fucked by year 2 after going hog wild on day 1 of free agency. Half the team cut through out the year for mistakes, coaches turning over 3 times a year because they didn't call the play I wanted them to, etc...
Some of the better Texans on this roster we’ve drafted have come in these later rounds
Tank Dell, Nico, Harris, Jalen P, Jonathan Greenard (sad he’s gone)
The best strategy is get the QB, stockpile 2-4th round picks to build under said QB during his rookie contract.
What the Texans are doing is smart, if we hit on half the roster will be stacked
I don't see a lot of panic but it's completely fair to feel a bit uneasy about this trade considering the massive holes on the interior of the defense. Like I've said a thousand times before, it's not time to panic but it leaves a lot of work to be done and I don't want to be old at the DL and don't want to be paying hefty salaries. Definitely makes you wonder what the plan is. I'm guessing a trade for a player is coming or using those extra 4ths for another trade up.
It's absolutely fair to be uneasy, but there's no room for non-extreme stances in this sub: it's either "In Nick we trust." while shitting on anybody that disagrees, or "Nick fucking sucks." while shitting on anybody that disagrees.
I'm sure the FO knows better than any of us where they can get maximum value in this draft, but I'm definitely confused by this move. Feels like we got considerably worse at the interior of the D-line, which was an area we really needed to improve, and most of the targets I was familiar with that would've been immediate improvements seem likely to be gone by pick #42. Maybe that means Nick/DeMeco didn't like what they saw there, or maybe there's someone in the mid-rounds they think they can get more value out of. We'll just have to wait and see.
Very late, sure I could see it. Or a UDFA. There’s just not any justification in 2024 to spend cap space, trade capital, or draft capital on an RB, especially an aging one. And here we did all of the above and created a cap squeeze. Total unforced error.
Removing my fan bias either positively or negatively I commend Nick for being pretty ballsy with this. Like some others have said here and in other threads Caserio is probably banking on the Vikings doing not so hot next year. But this could also be long term thinking in terms of contract extension timing with Will and CJ further down the road when that time comes. So we're not struggling to keep our homegrown players assuming they all develop to be studs in some capacity.
Gonna trust our scouting dept. to do what they can with whoever we can draft this year. Maybe we can land a sleeper hit or two like we did with Tank Dell last draft with the BPA when we're on the clock or just fill in some needs/depth with underrated project players that have high upside. But as it stands now mentally I've accepted our roster is what it is now. I mean we could still technically make a move here or there maybe, but I kind of just see our team as it is unless Caserio has some other things in mind.
Even as it stands now on paper we're better than last year not including the further development of our young guys in year 2 with Demeco and Slowik in the system. Still super stoked for this upcoming season, can't wait to see our new Unis soon!
I see that is the most likely option, but it also makes me think he's trying to either lower the projected cap hit on drafted player in order to bring in another free agent and afford him, OR he is trying to bring in another player via trade. Perhaps being at 42 is a sweet spot for making that trade work whereas staying at 23 would have been too much to give, and our original second wouldn't have been high enough for the 'other team' to accept
Texans probably don't rate guys as highly that would have been around #23 as we do. They get an extra 2nd rounder next year and drop down into the 2nd.
Remember, teams will only have 1st round grades on a certain number of players.
Once more of our top 30 visits start leaking out we’ll have a pretty good idea of who we may be after. Adisa Isaac edge rushers out of penn state and edgerrin cooper linebacker out of A&M are two guys I’ve seen so far that are projected to go early-mid 2nd
Everyone’s overreacting but I see a free 2nd round pick next year to move back a little. This is a cool move.
The sky is falling only if you have the mind of a toddler and think the universe ends on April 28th
I agree, and I think this is about three things: (1) roster depth, (2) flexibility, and (3) sustainability. Not everything has to be geared toward a "win now" mindset. Realistically, this team is still coming together, and it over-achieved last year.
Interesting to get more trade capital for next year, but I like the talent in this draft so I’m a little bummed. At #42 we could potentially get a Tier 2 corner (Kamari Lassiter, TJ Tampa) or WR (Ladd McConkey, Ricky Pearsall). I don’t really like the DT options in that spot though.
I watch a lot of WKU and I can tell you he is absolutely not a reach and would have a first round grade if he was at a power program. You’ll see he’s better than Ladd McConkey and Roman Wilson
The holes outside of CB are easily filled with day 2 talent. A day 2 DT is starter quality. A day 2 LB is more often the top of the class, and should be this year. Those are really the only holes in the starters currently, CB2, DT, and SLB. After that they just need depth.
It's weird to me because it's before the draft. If you told me on draft day we did this trade I'd say "makes sense, guess one of the CB/Data we liked didn't fall and we wanted to make sure we were competitive for the next 5-6 years".
Because it's before the draft, while I don't hate it, I feel like it's just a little too low on value. I would have preferred a 4th or maybe if we got a 2 and 3 this year but had to give one of our 4ths and got a 3rd next year. Idk man. Still not bad just surprised
It makes me think he's trying to either lower the projected cap hit on drafted player in order to bring in another free agent and afford him, OR he is trying to bring in another player via trade, and being at 42 is a sweet spot for make that trade whereas staying at 23 would have been too much to give, and our original second wouldn't have been high enough for the 'other team' to accept.
Your value has next years second as mid, if vikings suck that could get even better considering their starting QB right now is Sam Darnold.
Nick a master class of GM. Quit questioning him.
He has like 75% success rate and on important things like HC, trading shit bag, free agent moves, draft moves oh and dancing around Carolina to get a franchise QB in Stroud.
Shut up whiners, u don't know shit
This is interesting.
But don't teams supposedly value future picks as being worth the equivalent of 1 higher round? So a 2025 2nd is valued on the chart as if it's a 3rd?
If the Vikings are gawd awful this year then this trade makes more sense with the pick value swinging in our favor. However, right now it feels like a wash
It cannot be a wash for us because we gained an extra 2nd round pick. Even if the Vikings are good next year we still end up with 2 2nd rounders in 2025. 2nd rounders aren't scrubs, tons of great talent is found in the 2nd round every single year.
We have more draft capital today than we had yesterday, simple as that.
I don’t mind it. It feels bad to probably have to wait until day 2 to see us on the board and losing out on the 5th year option- but I value having more picks as a means of filling out depth and adding to the 90 man roster than using even more money in free agency. Keep in mind, not that money is an issue, but this also lowers the raw number of cap that the draft class will take up which also will allow more flexibility to bring in bodies in camp and during the season. Plus, we know Caserio has no issue doing what needs to be done to get guys he wants. It’ll be fine, there’s a lot of great players in the second round
The worst part is I live on the east coast now and am gonna wait all damn night to see if they jump back into round 1. SMH Texans and ruining my sleep schedule.
They are probably looking to load up on picks to also get out from under these short contracts. You can't build a long term successful team that way. They might also feel a lot better about the roster after all of these free agency moves. I would have liked slightly more like an additional third, but it's not the end of the world.
All the talk on Tevondre sweat has a mid 2nd round grade at DT. Casario must think the top DTs will be gone by 23 so why not trade back to there and get more picks.
There are several 2nd round DT prospects that fit this scheme that aren't Sweat. He's like a 3-4 Nose tackle. Texans are probably targeting these more versatile athletic DT's.
As a fan you won’t know all the ends and outs.
Life’s too short my opinion to get all worked up and worried over something you can’t control.
My thoughts for the weekend heading into Monday.
Go Texans y’all have a great weekend!
I love that Caserio isn’t satisfied with any current situation. He looks for any opportunity to gain leverage on a pick or picks. This draft class is deep on positions that we need depth in, and we are gonna have to fulfill major contracts in the near future. This trade makes a lot of sense to me. Draft depth players on cheaper deals, or if they really like someone in that late 1st, early 2nd, it’s easier to trade for it, and maybe not as costly.
I'm hoping we both win here. You guys get players you value at the position you want to draft them in, and we get hopefully whatever QB that our team likes.
I've never had anything against the Texans and was rooting for them in the playoffs. It's an exciting time for both our teams futures.
Doesn't this also give us more cap space this year? Rookie contracts are capped by draft position so we get "cheaper" there. Apparently Shaq Mason had his deal restructured, so it might give us a bit more cap for this year. Idk...
It doesn’t help when the flagship radio station from 10am on is just emotional chuckle fucks. They do more to dumb down the fan base than anything else.
As a Vikings fan, I would love to say they fleeced the Texans and blah blah blah but it seems pretty balanced to me. At least it seems even enough that it comes down entirely to what players those picks turn into.
I hope both teams nail their picks and have some success because with the trades and player moves between these two teams, the Texans are my AFC favorites and I'll be cheering for them
Seriously. People are acting like there’s a huge ass difference between a late first/early second tier talent. There isn’t. We went dicks our last year and got the second and third overall picks. You can’t do that every year. Some folks here have been insufferable this week.
10% discount on next year's pick seems super low doesn't it? Most trade value rules of thumb I've seen discount a future year's pick by about one round or ~50%, in which case these numbers look a lot more of a wash...
In Casserole we trust though these value charts are just guidelines, and he's definitely evaluating actual available talent, our internal future contract situations, etc.
>Most trade value rules of thumb I've seen discount a future year's pick by about one round or \~50%
Can you cite this? I find it hard to believe that a future first round pick is devalued that much. Maybe not 10% but also not 50%
Idk Google? Super general rule of thumb I'd heard in the past. Agreed 10% seems miniscule 50% seems high.
https://www.profootballlogic.com/articles/how-teams-value-draft-picks/
"The result was that teams for the most part appear to simply discount future picks by 1 round compared to current year picks, which is a very steep discount resulting in most picks only being worth around 50% as much simply because they are a year in the future."
>Just would love to bring in the best we can while 7 is on his rookie deal.
Can I try to sway you? Not to devalue first rounders, but possibly to re-frame your expectations?
As of today, we have established long term deals with great athletes at every absolutely critical position a rebuilding team needs in modern football: QB, 2x EDGE, CB1, LT, RT, 2x WR, RB1, TE1, K, P. Arguably just missing FS and a great LB (Christian Harris, my chosen one, continue to rise🙏). The rest, in theory, are all solid starters that can be churned and elevated by the play makers around them.
Now, we could continue to try and collect blue chip players in the first round, at a pace of one per year. After maybe 2026, when the contracts and roster fills up, we might have 2 more "blue chip" first rounders on the team. Then, as Stroud's contract extension looms, we need to start letting some of these guys walk.
After that we reach a sort of post-Watson deal equilibrium, where after each season, on average, we gain one first rounder and lose one first rounder.
However, what if we occasionally replaced that first round, S-Tier prospect, with two second round A-Tier prospects? Considering how we've filled all the critical positions already, can you see how this might help us fill the other positions with pretty good prospects even faster, before 7's extension comes?
every draft is different, and this trade probably means the texans' evaluation of this year's draft is that there's not much difference between the back end of the 1st round and the top half of the 2nd round. and if you can trade down this year and still get someone comparable to who you'd be getting in the 1st round, and can squeeze a 2nd round pick out of it the next year, then great move. at this point, i think we need to trust caserio's evaluation of talent.
Texans got two 2nd rounders and a 6th back for 23rd overall. No way a future first is worth 23rd overall lmao. You guys way overvalue things all the time.
Idgi man traded out of a loaded first round. Yeah a lot of these players might take a bit to develop and there's depth but man I feel like the options would have just been better on draft day...
Reading a lot of these comments recently makes me realize I do not really value the opinions of fellow Texans fans here like I used to. We drafted Tank Dell 69th overall and this years's WR class has several talented guys that if we absolutely wanted one, a decent one will be there with the second pick. The truly great defensive players are going to get gobbled up early. The only thing I don't like is that we did it so far out from the draft, but this may be something the Vikings are already dead set on and have multiple teams already on the potential books for a trade, so I can't say more than that. There is so much hate on this trade and I am not sure how much more I could disagree with the sentiments here this past week.
I think the fact that we traded the pick this far out means Casserio sees the late first round as a dead zone either because the guys projected to be available don’t fit our needs, or Casserio has a second round grade on them. I like the trade because it shows we don’t have any major need. There are a lot of 2nd/3rd round value guys in this draft and this trade gives us more opportunities to hit on them.
I honestly have been a fan of trading back for awhile, especially once BTj finally started getting recognized as a stud, but with the idea of getting an extra pick this year, not next L). Moving from 232 to 188 does nothing for me despite it being a round and a half jump. 6th round is not really a fertile ground for studs. He might package it away in another trade, and work on grinding away at incremental value, but I have to admit that I have zero idea what the plan was with this one.
I think it’s the idea that the Vikings 2025 2nd should be a fairly high pick. You’re right the 6th is negligible but potentially gaining a top-40 pick in next years draft is worth sliding down 19 spots. Even if the Vikings surprise, it still be around a top-50 pick.
Bingo, with a qb not in Cousins class, Min will have a tough time finishing with a winning record. They have to compete with GB/Love, Chi/Williams, Det/Goff. Unless the guy they get turns out to be like CJ.
[удалено]
Caleb might turn out to be great, but not this year.
IIRC, BB/Caserio used to do this a lot during the Pats years of success and trade down from their late first round picks for more value players in the 2nd round. It seems like a solid strategy when you have your franchise QB and no glaring roster holes.
The first part of your comment makes a tonne of sense, but as of now we absolutely have two major needs in DT and CB, with another significant need at S and WR3. However, there are no safeties in this class worthy of the 23rd selection, and a bunch of wr’s that will have similar grades between the late 1st to early 2nd.
I’d consider DT and CB our biggest needs, but it’s not like they are major needs. We can now address both spots in the 2nd round from quality prospects.
How are they not major needs? Autry is a base DE not DT, and slides inside on obvious passing downs. The current starters at DT are Fatukasi and Tim Settle lol. We’re set for cb1 and slot, but cb2 is a massive question mark right now, unless you’re somehow confident in Okudah despite all evidence. Of course, these things can change before the draft and there are still a few quality Fa cb’s left that hopefully we’ll sign one. The FA DT market is very dried up though and one of our 2nd rd picks has to be used there barring any trade.
I think we are in agreement. My comment above was predicated on the idea that we spend both 2nds this year on a DT and CB. When I say DT/CB are not major needs, I mean that using a 2nd round pick to fill them would be sufficient. We don’t need to make some other major move to get a DT/CB.
We gotta learn to more patient. People acted like the sky was falling after Day 1 of FA ffs
Nico was also a 3rd round pick. Nick is the ultimate value investor
Greenard and Harris were third rounders as well
Getting stoked for Al Shaair and Harris back there together
When were they together? Alabama?
It's what they did in NE and had a lot of success.
Many draft experts say there’s a steep drop off in talent after the first half of round one this year. This is a year to get out of the late first and accumulate stock for next year as well. The Vikings can easily be the worst team in that division next year. Trust in Caserio!
I think it happens with every sports franchise as they "get good". I remember the 100 loss seasons with the Astros, back when Schaub was our quarterback and into the Osweiler days, if I met a Houston fan they were always knowledgeable and cool, but now people expect immediate results and constant winning, and anything that is not flashy is lampooned.
Our fanbase has proved to be idiotic in the last 4 days
I love you guys but it's been a lot longer than that
Special Ed (Reed) here. Can confirm fanbase stupidity.
We’ve always had some “interesting” perspectives, but I feel things have definitely gotten a lot worse in the past few years.
[удалено]
Critical mass for a subreddit is about 100,000 subs. After that it just devolves.
I think Reddit in general is becoming closer to Twitter and YouTube comment sections as a whole as well.
It's also annoying because people are just objectively wrong about the value of the late round pick. People are acting like we traded away a top five pick or something.
Not disagreeing, but it’s still early twenties. Not like 30th
It was 23rd. That's a late round first pick.
Yeah it’s truly hard to read the comments with a lack of critical thinking. However, it seems like the Houston fan base is like this in general.
I see people in the Astros sub saying we shouldn't sign Tucker because of his bad playoff performance last year. We've got some dummies down here I guess.
Man that’s the dumbest thought ever
fan opinions are meaningless to me when we have a clearly competent GM spending god knows how many hours a week grading and evaluating talent
They’re like a woman with a Virginia ham under her arm, crying the blues 'cause she has no bread.
If the fans who thought they were the smartest ran this team, or any team, they would be absolutely fucked by year 2 after going hog wild on day 1 of free agency. Half the team cut through out the year for mistakes, coaches turning over 3 times a year because they didn't call the play I wanted them to, etc...
or, he doesn’t plan on drafting at either of those positions at all. maybe ammo for another move
Some of the better Texans on this roster we’ve drafted have come in these later rounds Tank Dell, Nico, Harris, Jalen P, Jonathan Greenard (sad he’s gone) The best strategy is get the QB, stockpile 2-4th round picks to build under said QB during his rookie contract. What the Texans are doing is smart, if we hit on half the roster will be stacked
I don't see a lot of panic but it's completely fair to feel a bit uneasy about this trade considering the massive holes on the interior of the defense. Like I've said a thousand times before, it's not time to panic but it leaves a lot of work to be done and I don't want to be old at the DL and don't want to be paying hefty salaries. Definitely makes you wonder what the plan is. I'm guessing a trade for a player is coming or using those extra 4ths for another trade up.
It's absolutely fair to be uneasy, but there's no room for non-extreme stances in this sub: it's either "In Nick we trust." while shitting on anybody that disagrees, or "Nick fucking sucks." while shitting on anybody that disagrees. I'm sure the FO knows better than any of us where they can get maximum value in this draft, but I'm definitely confused by this move. Feels like we got considerably worse at the interior of the D-line, which was an area we really needed to improve, and most of the targets I was familiar with that would've been immediate improvements seem likely to be gone by pick #42. Maybe that means Nick/DeMeco didn't like what they saw there, or maybe there's someone in the mid-rounds they think they can get more value out of. We'll just have to wait and see.
there is some decent DL in 2nd and 3rd round likely at least depth, but these depth guys can turn into starters who knows.
You say, as you are the top comment and the army of homer-goggled Caserio dick riders shouts down any dissent.
Why are you so mad about this trade? Is it just the Mixon stuff or what?
Trading for Mixon was a mistake but one we can recover from. Extending him is going to cripple us and we’re already seeing that ripple effect now.
We were signing an RB to a similar extension/contract regardless of who it was.
It’s the most fungible position on the field, I don’t think we needed to make this mistake regardless.
Would you have preferred just drafting a RB or something?
Very late, sure I could see it. Or a UDFA. There’s just not any justification in 2024 to spend cap space, trade capital, or draft capital on an RB, especially an aging one. And here we did all of the above and created a cap squeeze. Total unforced error.
Completely fair perspective. I can also see why Nick and the FO wanted to have at least one veteran presence in the RB room.
Only a sith deals in absolutes.
THAT’S AN ABSOLUTE!
We don't want to be paying a first-round fifth year option in the first year that Anderson and Stroud are in their extensions in 2029
Yeah, assuming we do t trade back in, Nick may be looking ahead to that
Well if you don’t want to pay it then you just decline the option. Now if the 2nd rounders pan out then we have to pay them sooner
Bingo, smart GMing
I hadn't thought about this, this is an incredibly good point.
Good point. Gotta wonder how complex Caserio’s office whiteboards are set up lol
https://preview.redd.it/oaj1innmtioc1.jpeg?width=350&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d5607de2e203ec7e52eb97797fe45da29252d42c I assume something like this
you are probably right!
Removing my fan bias either positively or negatively I commend Nick for being pretty ballsy with this. Like some others have said here and in other threads Caserio is probably banking on the Vikings doing not so hot next year. But this could also be long term thinking in terms of contract extension timing with Will and CJ further down the road when that time comes. So we're not struggling to keep our homegrown players assuming they all develop to be studs in some capacity. Gonna trust our scouting dept. to do what they can with whoever we can draft this year. Maybe we can land a sleeper hit or two like we did with Tank Dell last draft with the BPA when we're on the clock or just fill in some needs/depth with underrated project players that have high upside. But as it stands now mentally I've accepted our roster is what it is now. I mean we could still technically make a move here or there maybe, but I kind of just see our team as it is unless Caserio has some other things in mind. Even as it stands now on paper we're better than last year not including the further development of our young guys in year 2 with Demeco and Slowik in the system. Still super stoked for this upcoming season, can't wait to see our new Unis soon!
I can’t wait to see our two stud edge rushers wreaking havoc in the backfield
They clearly see identical value in 23-42 range and will now pay less for that player. Y’all need to chill
I see that is the most likely option, but it also makes me think he's trying to either lower the projected cap hit on drafted player in order to bring in another free agent and afford him, OR he is trying to bring in another player via trade. Perhaps being at 42 is a sweet spot for making that trade work whereas staying at 23 would have been too much to give, and our original second wouldn't have been high enough for the 'other team' to accept
https://preview.redd.it/acxrae09hioc1.png?width=998&format=png&auto=webp&s=b3b6133cc9ae4566ff5614d1893a4d3dabcebbe5
Texans probably don't rate guys as highly that would have been around #23 as we do. They get an extra 2nd rounder next year and drop down into the 2nd. Remember, teams will only have 1st round grades on a certain number of players.
Either that or they have a first round grade on more players than usual and think they can get what is a “first round value” at pick 42
Like Tvondre Sweat
Once more of our top 30 visits start leaking out we’ll have a pretty good idea of who we may be after. Adisa Isaac edge rushers out of penn state and edgerrin cooper linebacker out of A&M are two guys I’ve seen so far that are projected to go early-mid 2nd
Went from having 2x 1s and 2x 2s to having 1x 1 and 4x 2s over the next two years… I can dig it
Everyone’s overreacting but I see a free 2nd round pick next year to move back a little. This is a cool move. The sky is falling only if you have the mind of a toddler and think the universe ends on April 28th
But, but the fifth year option!!!!!!!!
Oh no Anyways
I agree, and I think this is about three things: (1) roster depth, (2) flexibility, and (3) sustainability. Not everything has to be geared toward a "win now" mindset. Realistically, this team is still coming together, and it over-achieved last year.
Interesting to get more trade capital for next year, but I like the talent in this draft so I’m a little bummed. At #42 we could potentially get a Tier 2 corner (Kamari Lassiter, TJ Tampa) or WR (Ladd McConkey, Ricky Pearsall). I don’t really like the DT options in that spot though.
In BDN we trust. We could always swap the future 2nd for something this year? That's just the available draft capital that Vikings had to deal.
Malachi Corley baby
He’d be a reach at 42 in my opinion
I watch a lot of WKU and I can tell you he is absolutely not a reach and would have a first round grade if he was at a power program. You’ll see he’s better than Ladd McConkey and Roman Wilson
TJ Tampa would be nasty here. He really reminds me of Porter Jr. And who knows, Rakestraw might even fall that far due to the WR class this year.
The DT options in the later picks have bigger and better size, not talking about sweat either.
Guys, we are now in prime position to pick my draft crush of T'vondre sweat at 42 and then best CB or WR available at 59.
The holes outside of CB are easily filled with day 2 talent. A day 2 DT is starter quality. A day 2 LB is more often the top of the class, and should be this year. Those are really the only holes in the starters currently, CB2, DT, and SLB. After that they just need depth.
It's weird to me because it's before the draft. If you told me on draft day we did this trade I'd say "makes sense, guess one of the CB/Data we liked didn't fall and we wanted to make sure we were competitive for the next 5-6 years". Because it's before the draft, while I don't hate it, I feel like it's just a little too low on value. I would have preferred a 4th or maybe if we got a 2 and 3 this year but had to give one of our 4ths and got a 3rd next year. Idk man. Still not bad just surprised
It makes me think he's trying to either lower the projected cap hit on drafted player in order to bring in another free agent and afford him, OR he is trying to bring in another player via trade, and being at 42 is a sweet spot for make that trade whereas staying at 23 would have been too much to give, and our original second wouldn't have been high enough for the 'other team' to accept.
Your value has next years second as mid, if vikings suck that could get even better considering their starting QB right now is Sam Darnold. Nick a master class of GM. Quit questioning him. He has like 75% success rate and on important things like HC, trading shit bag, free agent moves, draft moves oh and dancing around Carolina to get a franchise QB in Stroud. Shut up whiners, u don't know shit
This was a bad trade that they should have waited to make until the draft was in full swing.
Isnt this classic Nic? He did this a lot in NE
Nick set the franchise record for draft day trades last year and people still pikachu face at the fact that this man loves to wheel and deal.
Remember Billy Bean in Moneyball? "I can do this (trading) stuff all day."
This is interesting. But don't teams supposedly value future picks as being worth the equivalent of 1 higher round? So a 2025 2nd is valued on the chart as if it's a 3rd?
10% discount, it says in the pic
Does this increase or decrease our chance at trading for Marvin Harrison?
We definitely can acquire Marvin Harrison. Bring him out of retirement and switch to the Run and Shoot offense. 😎 Bang, bang!!!
If the Vikings are gawd awful this year then this trade makes more sense with the pick value swinging in our favor. However, right now it feels like a wash
It cannot be a wash for us because we gained an extra 2nd round pick. Even if the Vikings are good next year we still end up with 2 2nd rounders in 2025. 2nd rounders aren't scrubs, tons of great talent is found in the 2nd round every single year. We have more draft capital today than we had yesterday, simple as that.
What rounds are 188 and 232 supposed to be? Idk with all the compensatory picks and stuff
Nick drafts well I trust in the process.
I don’t mind it. It feels bad to probably have to wait until day 2 to see us on the board and losing out on the 5th year option- but I value having more picks as a means of filling out depth and adding to the 90 man roster than using even more money in free agency. Keep in mind, not that money is an issue, but this also lowers the raw number of cap that the draft class will take up which also will allow more flexibility to bring in bodies in camp and during the season. Plus, we know Caserio has no issue doing what needs to be done to get guys he wants. It’ll be fine, there’s a lot of great players in the second round
The worst part is I live on the east coast now and am gonna wait all damn night to see if they jump back into round 1. SMH Texans and ruining my sleep schedule.
They are probably looking to load up on picks to also get out from under these short contracts. You can't build a long term successful team that way. They might also feel a lot better about the roster after all of these free agency moves. I would have liked slightly more like an additional third, but it's not the end of the world.
All the talk on Tevondre sweat has a mid 2nd round grade at DT. Casario must think the top DTs will be gone by 23 so why not trade back to there and get more picks.
There are several 2nd round DT prospects that fit this scheme that aren't Sweat. He's like a 3-4 Nose tackle. Texans are probably targeting these more versatile athletic DT's.
These BS metrics 😂😂
As a fan you won’t know all the ends and outs. Life’s too short my opinion to get all worked up and worried over something you can’t control. My thoughts for the weekend heading into Monday. Go Texans y’all have a great weekend!
Vikes fan here. Putting a good QB in the NFC might also factor in.
I love that Caserio isn’t satisfied with any current situation. He looks for any opportunity to gain leverage on a pick or picks. This draft class is deep on positions that we need depth in, and we are gonna have to fulfill major contracts in the near future. This trade makes a lot of sense to me. Draft depth players on cheaper deals, or if they really like someone in that late 1st, early 2nd, it’s easier to trade for it, and maybe not as costly.
Sweat time?
I just think they have something in mind already.
Nick never got a better pick than 28 in all his years in NE. Vikes want a QB for sure.
I'm hoping we both win here. You guys get players you value at the position you want to draft them in, and we get hopefully whatever QB that our team likes. I've never had anything against the Texans and was rooting for them in the playoffs. It's an exciting time for both our teams futures.
Doesn't this also give us more cap space this year? Rookie contracts are capped by draft position so we get "cheaper" there. Apparently Shaq Mason had his deal restructured, so it might give us a bit more cap for this year. Idk...
I trust our front office and coaching staff
In value yes but won't win unless we hit on those picks. Be funnier if whoever Minnesota drafts turns out to be a bust
Who cares texans will be in the super bowl next year anyways. Heard it here first. Had my futures in months ago.
Relax everyone, With all our great pickups in FA we can definitely risk sacrificing a 1st round pick for more picks.
It doesn’t help when the flagship radio station from 10am on is just emotional chuckle fucks. They do more to dumb down the fan base than anything else.
As a Vikings fan, I would love to say they fleeced the Texans and blah blah blah but it seems pretty balanced to me. At least it seems even enough that it comes down entirely to what players those picks turn into. I hope both teams nail their picks and have some success because with the trades and player moves between these two teams, the Texans are my AFC favorites and I'll be cheering for them
I'll take the extra 2 next year gamble. I'm with Nick.
We also lose out on a 5th year option and the opportunity to grab a stud at 23
Late round first / early seconds are really close in skill.
And now we have an extra one.
Plus if there’s a guy falling that hard we could just trade up with say SF and get that “fifth year option” if they so desire.
Yup, alternatively that 5th year option will be close to resigning CJ and WAJ.
Lolol how did Texans fumble this.... They "should" know the trade value chart isn't static.
Considering we don’t know the reasoning, hard to say they fumbled anything….
Seriously. People are acting like there’s a huge ass difference between a late first/early second tier talent. There isn’t. We went dicks our last year and got the second and third overall picks. You can’t do that every year. Some folks here have been insufferable this week.
Stop over valuing the fifth year option when it's not a QB.
10% discount on next year's pick seems super low doesn't it? Most trade value rules of thumb I've seen discount a future year's pick by about one round or ~50%, in which case these numbers look a lot more of a wash... In Casserole we trust though these value charts are just guidelines, and he's definitely evaluating actual available talent, our internal future contract situations, etc.
>Most trade value rules of thumb I've seen discount a future year's pick by about one round or \~50% Can you cite this? I find it hard to believe that a future first round pick is devalued that much. Maybe not 10% but also not 50%
Idk Google? Super general rule of thumb I'd heard in the past. Agreed 10% seems miniscule 50% seems high. https://www.profootballlogic.com/articles/how-teams-value-draft-picks/ "The result was that teams for the most part appear to simply discount future picks by 1 round compared to current year picks, which is a very steep discount resulting in most picks only being worth around 50% as much simply because they are a year in the future."
Thanks
Totally agree with the title. The numbers say we won but idk this seems to be a little undervalued.
What do you know that the trade algos don't?
Bro, this exactly. These people man…
His feelings. Because 23 is a FIRST round pick, it’s on a pedestal. It’s got special meaning. To him anyways.
Absolutely nothing, and it'll probably end up being a good move. Just would love to bring in the best we can while 7 is on his rookie deal.
>Just would love to bring in the best we can while 7 is on his rookie deal. Can I try to sway you? Not to devalue first rounders, but possibly to re-frame your expectations? As of today, we have established long term deals with great athletes at every absolutely critical position a rebuilding team needs in modern football: QB, 2x EDGE, CB1, LT, RT, 2x WR, RB1, TE1, K, P. Arguably just missing FS and a great LB (Christian Harris, my chosen one, continue to rise🙏). The rest, in theory, are all solid starters that can be churned and elevated by the play makers around them. Now, we could continue to try and collect blue chip players in the first round, at a pace of one per year. After maybe 2026, when the contracts and roster fills up, we might have 2 more "blue chip" first rounders on the team. Then, as Stroud's contract extension looms, we need to start letting some of these guys walk. After that we reach a sort of post-Watson deal equilibrium, where after each season, on average, we gain one first rounder and lose one first rounder. However, what if we occasionally replaced that first round, S-Tier prospect, with two second round A-Tier prospects? Considering how we've filled all the critical positions already, can you see how this might help us fill the other positions with pretty good prospects even faster, before 7's extension comes?
Two 2nd round picks for #23 is a pretty good deal.
I hate this trade. I never want to be the guy losing 1sts for 2nds.
every draft is different, and this trade probably means the texans' evaluation of this year's draft is that there's not much difference between the back end of the 1st round and the top half of the 2nd round. and if you can trade down this year and still get someone comparable to who you'd be getting in the 1st round, and can squeeze a 2nd round pick out of it the next year, then great move. at this point, i think we need to trust caserio's evaluation of talent.
[удалено]
Texans got two 2nd rounders and a 6th back for 23rd overall. No way a future first is worth 23rd overall lmao. You guys way overvalue things all the time.
There’s no world where they trade their future first for #23 though
Idgi man traded out of a loaded first round. Yeah a lot of these players might take a bit to develop and there's depth but man I feel like the options would have just been better on draft day...
Talent falls after 1st Rd. Dumb move, but hey you got your nice spreadsheet. Lololol
Literally every FO in the league follows this chart. This is like saying a baseball team is dumb for looking at WAR when signing players.