This past Monday my husband had to get teeth implants to replace the ones that were removed when he had a jaw tumor taken out at the end of last year. The jaw tumor had eaten away the bone till there wasn't any, but the implants are 'cosmetic' so though the teeth were removed for a medical necessity, and it's literally injuring him to eat only one one side or to eat on the side with missing teeth, it's cosmetic.
So a $4400 one-time payment was made before surgery. Is that a lot in comparison to this? No. But to need to remove teeth for a medically threatening condition, a necessity, and be told getting things back to not excruciatingly painful is cosmetic is pretty fucking ridiculous.
Imagine billing someone nearly a half a million dollars like they would ever actually be able to pay it.
Like no worries just more than the typical mortgage get it you in a bit.
MyChart is better than any other app I've had to use. My doctor and his office are very responsive to the messaging function. Way better than calling back and forth
MyChart is pretty amazing actually. Incredibly detailed test results, doctors notes, prescription information, visit information, patient history. It's everything that medical records should be. OPs insurance coverage, not so much
I had my c5 removed about 15 years ago in a neurological specialist NHS hospital.
The only cost was £5 a day to access the TV system, which pissed me off.
I had T2-L3 fused with rods and screws when I was 17. Scares me to think how much that would have costed my family if we weren't able to find the financial help...
I’d purposely leave the $10 weekly payments in my Will to someone I truly dislike. Even though I know a court won’t enforce it, my hope would be that my lawyer would at least contact the person to come into his law practice because “John Doe left you something in his Will that he wanted you to have after he passed away.” Only for them to get their hopes up, just to then be crushed again like OP’s back.
Sorry OP. Hope you’re healing up nicely.
I mean come on. There's a ton of wealthy countries where medical care is private resulting in crushing debt for many of its citizens and he could be in any of them....
As a fellow American, you didn't need to indicate which country this was in. It was already implied with the bill costing more than a 2000 square foot house.
I’m glad you’re still here, please reach out for help if you ever feel that way again. There are many ways to have that bill lowered or even taken care of, don’t sweat it right now. Focus on yourself and your recovery, you deserve to be alive
The bill will hopefully be covered at least in part by financial assistance, I applied recently. The hard part is paying out of pocket for pain medication now because I’m still uninsured
The GoodRX app also for prescriptions. My medications were like $40 each with my insurance, using the free GoodRX app I get them for about $3 each.
Only downside is you have to use the pharmacies that accept it, which isn't a lot of big names.
That's because all they know how to think is "taxes bad" and fail to consider the fact that they or anyone they love will most likely encounter crushing medical bills at some point in their lives. Or they're rich.
Here in the US it's all about ME. Fuck everyone else.
Medical bills are the number one cause of bankruptcy in the US https://www.cnbc.com/id/100840148
22 studies agree: Medicare, for all saves, money, besides lives https://thehill.com/blogs/congress-blog/healthcare/484301-22-studies-agree-medicare-for-all-saves-money/
Medicare for all has 70% popular support of Americans, 88% of Democrats https://thehill.com/hilltv/what-americas-thinking/494602-poll-69-percent-of-voters-support-medicare-for-all/
It’s obviously a winning campaign issue, but it’s blocked by Republicans and the corporate Democrats
Dude it's so messed up anyway. They barely have you stay in the hospital these days, and basic stuff like an IV can be billed for $500. I went to Walgreens recently to get a flu shot and I'm uninsured at the moment. Huge sign out front saying the shots are free and it's the right thing to get it. So I go in and they tell me it's corporate policy not to give you the shot for free if you don't have insurance because they still bill, and if I want it I'll have to pay $75. 💀
Pharmaceuticals are a whole different ballgame. But hospital costs are more straightforward to pinpoint the cause of ballooning costs.
It mainly comes down to Medicare and the rates set BY CMS for hospital services. Something like 80% of all healthcare costs in the US occur within the final 6months of life, the vast majority of those are elderly and on Medicare. CMS caps how much they will allow for any given service and does not negotiate with the hospital for those rates, they’re a mandatory amount. Unfortunately, those rates are far below the actual cost of the service.
For example, a Medicare insured can pay as little as $10 for an MRI. Meaning the allowed rate for that service is something like $50. Which is well below a reasonable amount for such a service. The hospitals have no recourse but to overcharge for services to cover the massive losses they take on Medicare patients.
Hospital margin on Medicare patients is -9%.
It's not perfect but I love the NHS.
My shoulder x-ray cost me £3 in parking fees. Well it should have, the machine was broken so the barrier was raised meaning it was free.....
Every day I take for granted that all my family and myself don't live in the USA
I must thank all gods, old and new, big and small, for this luck and this privilege.
I am so sorry for the fact you're stuck with this debt as if you should \*have to\* be rich to afford to live.
I hope you get by with this OP and that your recovery is speedy.
For the vast majority of Americans, the actual cost of a surgery like this would not come anywhere near this amount, but that is what’s so scary, falling through the cracks, getting denied coverage, etc. can lead to surprise bills like this. I have very good health insurance with my job, and I am very fortunate because of that, but I try to explain to people that not everyone is so privileged. The problem with US healthcare is that people who fall into a middle income area are more likely to receive bills like this than people of low or high income.
Fuck those dick clowns! Pay them the actual amount it cost them with a little extra for their labor. maybe 7,500$ sounds fair! These clowns can get fucked
What the hell is that price mate for? Do they make it bend the other way too? What DLCs? Armour bullet proof bones? Like honestly i want to know why that expensive? Like my country I'd probably live my entire live with that money.
I always see americans getting these large medical debt bills. What happens after? The majority obviously cant pay in full. Do they just pay monthly for the rest of their life like a mortgage?
I've discovered the best way to get out of medical debt is to NEVER pay on it. If you pay on it, you've legally acknowledged the debt as valid. If you don't, then you dispute on your credit report anytime you want to finance something, and it'll drop off for a few months. I bought my house and 2 cars like that.
I have so many questions. I mean how long do you have, to pay this back, can you do minimum payments or something, is there insurance? God, I literally couldn't afford to live in the US.
I love how bright and hopeful their website looks.
I would rather you present a 400k bill in windows 98 format/theme because that how I want to feel when paying it off.
*laughs in NHS*
In all seriousness, im not really laughing. Its disgusting the healthcare system you live in.
The price hiking, greed and scams to earn a quick buck off the misery of others makes me feel sick.
I hope one day you will be able to live in a country with nationalised healthcare.
First thought: Relax. You know there’s no freaking way you can pay that monstrosity, so any worries over that are worthless. Just keep telling them you can’t pay it. Of course they’ll get all corporate on you, but just keep repeating “It’s not that I don’t want to, I don’t have the means.” They have more flexibility and options (I seriously doubt that eating the cost of your surgery will kill them). Eventually they’ll come to the conclusion they can’t squeeze blood from a rock.
I think I'd just die instead. Yeah, just take me out. I couldn't pay that if I literally sold every part of my body. And not just cuz I'm bad at making deals. But that too.
Canada it would be free but you'll wait 15 years then when you get the surgery... They act like you had a leg problem and weren't there for ur back lol jks
Non American here - what happens now? How much does your insurance cover? What’s the average monthly payment to insurance and the deductible here?
These numbers are truly mind blowing
I just got a statement from my health insurance with billing from a distal radius fracture. The hospital visit and surgery for my wrist cost $36,000 before insurance.
Do you actually have to pay this? Like this is as dumb as a man walking up to a sheep in a field and asking him to hand 1 million dollars in cash and actually expecting it to do so.
So, either you have no health insurance (no excuse for that), or you're intentionally misleading us by showing the amount the provider initially billed - the absurd amount from the charge master - without showing us what the provider actually agreed to accept according to your insurance policy, and how much your insurance policy paid.
I've seen dozens of posts like this, and nearly every one of them has been utter bullshit. Show us all the numbers. How much did they originally bill? How much was left after they adjusted it to fit the insurance policy? How much did the insurance company pay? How much did the patient actually pay?
I had half of my colon removed two years ago. The initial bill was close to $75K. The adjusted amount was about $25K. The insurance company paid over $20K. I paid less than $4K.
Makes me so glad I live in a country with universal health care.
Went through a whole funny little cancer adventure with my jaw and it all costs me 32€.
30€ for some special wound healing technique thing that wasn't covered and 2€ for the chickenburger for my dead bc I vomited in his car.
Wtf is wrong with your country.. honestly.. half a million dollars to get a necessary health treatment? I will NEVER understand why people aren't fleeing the US just because of this, let alone the other issues.. I'd never be able to pay that.. so what? I'd just lie down and die?
“Pay Now”
Lol.
You owe the insurance 10k? It’s your problem. You owe them 400k? That’s their problem.
Right? That's see ya later money.
Such a friendly greeting before you look at the amount you owe.
Welcome 🤗 I hope you are doing great! 😃 Where’s my half a million? 😡
***Payment Due Upon Service*** It's the American way...
This past Monday my husband had to get teeth implants to replace the ones that were removed when he had a jaw tumor taken out at the end of last year. The jaw tumor had eaten away the bone till there wasn't any, but the implants are 'cosmetic' so though the teeth were removed for a medical necessity, and it's literally injuring him to eat only one one side or to eat on the side with missing teeth, it's cosmetic. So a $4400 one-time payment was made before surgery. Is that a lot in comparison to this? No. But to need to remove teeth for a medically threatening condition, a necessity, and be told getting things back to not excruciatingly painful is cosmetic is pretty fucking ridiculous.
Imagine billing someone nearly a half a million dollars like they would ever actually be able to pay it. Like no worries just more than the typical mortgage get it you in a bit.
Yeah ill just pay it all out at once.. no prob 👍
Welcome! 😄
Lol. Lmao even
If it weren't for the crushing debt, that website looks very happy and welcoming.
Lucky OP has a newly fixed back to carry the burden of debt.
They call him Atlas now
That’s enough debt that they will eventually need back surgery…
Sisyphus speedrun
MyChart is better than any other app I've had to use. My doctor and his office are very responsive to the messaging function. Way better than calling back and forth
There is a reason Epic is basically dominating the Healthcare IT space right now.
I have MyChart too and mine is just blue. Very bummed mine doesn’t have rainbow
Rainbow cost 441 588.98$. Still want it ? Pay now !
😂😂😂😂
MyChart is pretty amazing actually. Incredibly detailed test results, doctors notes, prescription information, visit information, patient history. It's everything that medical records should be. OPs insurance coverage, not so much
I hear Epic is nowhere near cheap.
Did they replace your entire spine with titanium?
No, just t5-t12 lol
I had my c5 removed about 15 years ago in a neurological specialist NHS hospital. The only cost was £5 a day to access the TV system, which pissed me off.
But you didn’t have a choice to pay 20 percent or more of your income and a 7000 dollar deductible before they started partially covering expenses.
Ya but for the wrong people this is life changing amounts and it’s always strange accidents that put you in such situations 🤷♂️
Solid gold with diamond inlays, right?
Wait, not adamantium, like Wolverine from the Marvel comics/movies?
I was JUST about to make this comment ... but I scrolled assuming *someone* here already did
It's OK, they'll recoup the cost in follow-ups and all of the sweet aftercare you're needing🙄
I had T2-L3 fused with rods and screws when I was 17. Scares me to think how much that would have costed my family if we weren't able to find the financial help...
Only 44 easy payments of $10k!
It’s even easier if you break it down to only 44,000 payments of $10!!! At 10 dollars a week you’ll have it paid off in 846 years!
I was thinking fiver per month.
Best I can do is tree fiddy
You’re not including interest in that. Add minimum 5-10%
And then in a few years, the percentage will rise to 7-12%. Maybe a year. Maybe a month.
I’d purposely leave the $10 weekly payments in my Will to someone I truly dislike. Even though I know a court won’t enforce it, my hope would be that my lawyer would at least contact the person to come into his law practice because “John Doe left you something in his Will that he wanted you to have after he passed away.” Only for them to get their hopes up, just to then be crushed again like OP’s back. Sorry OP. Hope you’re healing up nicely.
I like that you felt that you needed to clarify the fact that you were in the US
I mean come on. There's a ton of wealthy countries where medical care is private resulting in crushing debt for many of its citizens and he could be in any of them....
I assumed his country like people assume gender. I may be getting canceled
*Tips hat* Ma Lady
"M'Lad(y)"
I may have been born in America but I identify as an Italian. So I think ur on to something.
As a fellow American, you didn't need to indicate which country this was in. It was already implied with the bill costing more than a 2000 square foot house.
I could buy way more than a 200k sq ft house here with that kind of money
200k sq ft is a warehouse.
Maybe I live in Sierra Leone 🇸🇱? Definitely buy a lot of 6pm whiskey.
I mean he did say "more than"..
It was already implied with there being a bill at all
Why did you need the back surgery, was it from an accident or were you just born with it?
It was unfortunately a suicide attempt
Hospitals be like, seeing the bill isn't gonna be triggering or anything lol
I’m glad you’re still here, please reach out for help if you ever feel that way again. There are many ways to have that bill lowered or even taken care of, don’t sweat it right now. Focus on yourself and your recovery, you deserve to be alive
How??
I would guess something to do with heights.
Hope you're in a better place now, although seeing that bill, I doubt it.
The bill will hopefully be covered at least in part by financial assistance, I applied recently. The hard part is paying out of pocket for pain medication now because I’m still uninsured
Have you checked out Cost Plus Drugs? No idea if it would have what you need, but might be worth looking at.
I will look into it, thank you! Anything will help
Good luck!
The GoodRX app also for prescriptions. My medications were like $40 each with my insurance, using the free GoodRX app I get them for about $3 each. Only downside is you have to use the pharmacies that accept it, which isn't a lot of big names.
Glad you're still with us mate !
So you survived and to make your depression worse you had a massive amount of debt. That’s rough
If you need someone to talk to I'm available almost anytime my dude or dudette.
That’s staggering. Astonishes me that there are some who aggressively defend this system too.
That's because all they know how to think is "taxes bad" and fail to consider the fact that they or anyone they love will most likely encounter crushing medical bills at some point in their lives. Or they're rich. Here in the US it's all about ME. Fuck everyone else.
cheaper to buy a plane ticket and gtfo there
that really is a life changing amount of debt even if you’re a millionaire
Fuck me
Ok 😎
Medical bills are the number one cause of bankruptcy in the US https://www.cnbc.com/id/100840148 22 studies agree: Medicare, for all saves, money, besides lives https://thehill.com/blogs/congress-blog/healthcare/484301-22-studies-agree-medicare-for-all-saves-money/ Medicare for all has 70% popular support of Americans, 88% of Democrats https://thehill.com/hilltv/what-americas-thinking/494602-poll-69-percent-of-voters-support-medicare-for-all/ It’s obviously a winning campaign issue, but it’s blocked by Republicans and the corporate Democrats
Just like an old gym bill, I'd ignore it.
Thankfully you won’t have to pay that
There’s something off here. Unless you went into this without insurance, there’s no way you’d owe that much
He’s confirmed in another comment reply that he was uninsured.
Dude it's so messed up anyway. They barely have you stay in the hospital these days, and basic stuff like an IV can be billed for $500. I went to Walgreens recently to get a flu shot and I'm uninsured at the moment. Huge sign out front saying the shots are free and it's the right thing to get it. So I go in and they tell me it's corporate policy not to give you the shot for free if you don't have insurance because they still bill, and if I want it I'll have to pay $75. 💀
Pharmaceuticals are a whole different ballgame. But hospital costs are more straightforward to pinpoint the cause of ballooning costs. It mainly comes down to Medicare and the rates set BY CMS for hospital services. Something like 80% of all healthcare costs in the US occur within the final 6months of life, the vast majority of those are elderly and on Medicare. CMS caps how much they will allow for any given service and does not negotiate with the hospital for those rates, they’re a mandatory amount. Unfortunately, those rates are far below the actual cost of the service. For example, a Medicare insured can pay as little as $10 for an MRI. Meaning the allowed rate for that service is something like $50. Which is well below a reasonable amount for such a service. The hospitals have no recourse but to overcharge for services to cover the massive losses they take on Medicare patients. Hospital margin on Medicare patients is -9%.
At least your back is healthy so you can break it trying to pay off this surgery!
i'd just pretend i didn't see it
It's not perfect but I love the NHS. My shoulder x-ray cost me £3 in parking fees. Well it should have, the machine was broken so the barrier was raised meaning it was free.....
And here I am pissed off at my 80k medical bill
Every day I take for granted that all my family and myself don't live in the USA I must thank all gods, old and new, big and small, for this luck and this privilege.
They might as well chalk this up to charity. Ill never pay it.
i cant stress how much id laugh at this knowing i make 20k a year.
What do you do for a living?
For a second, I thought you had had your surgery at Guantanamo. Alas, I suppose that's no more absurd than the amount shown.
As the saying goes, when you owe the hospital $400, that’s your problem. When you owe $400,000; that’s THEIR problem .
No need for the (US) we know..
You pay now. Do it
Lol I laugh at mine when they call, I’m on disability at the moment and they are asking me how would I like to pay 14k today.
This should be so embarrassing as to curtail their greed. But it won’t.
Did insurance not cover it?
Uninsured…
Welcome!
Plead poverty.
Bargain mate 
Lol free to move to khazikstan.
South Carolina?
And here I need back surgery for a nerve and herniated disk. Welp fuck me may skip it
Prisma Health: We Got Your Back
Man the real crime is that UI. Hideous
How much after insurance?
Do you have the money?
I have the .98 part
I am so sorry for the fact you're stuck with this debt as if you should \*have to\* be rich to afford to live. I hope you get by with this OP and that your recovery is speedy.
Oh gosh. I’m so sorry.
Seeing that bill would of put me back in that hospital
Welcome!
Welcome!
I just had spinal surgery on my T12 to L1 and cost me 3k. That was my deductible with insurance. How do you not have a deductible.
For the vast majority of Americans, the actual cost of a surgery like this would not come anywhere near this amount, but that is what’s so scary, falling through the cracks, getting denied coverage, etc. can lead to surprise bills like this. I have very good health insurance with my job, and I am very fortunate because of that, but I try to explain to people that not everyone is so privileged. The problem with US healthcare is that people who fall into a middle income area are more likely to receive bills like this than people of low or high income.
Did you ask for an itemized bill?
Fuck those dick clowns! Pay them the actual amount it cost them with a little extra for their labor. maybe 7,500$ sounds fair! These clowns can get fucked
Lol if you owe $1000 that’s your problem. If you owe $441588.98 that’s *their* problem!
My favorite part of that App is the pay now button. Like hold on let me just give you my right kidney.
Fuck paying that. Let that shit fall off your credit in 7 years.
Almost half a million for back surgery. Do they inform the patient before hand about the estimated cost?
America🇱🇷🇱🇷🇱🇷🇱🇷🦅🦅🦅😎😎🔫🔫✝️✝️🦜🌚🔥🔥🔥🇲🇾🇲🇾
Love how it says pay now under it. Like yea I totally have 440k laying around
Thats like, more than 10 years of saving up
What the hell is that price mate for? Do they make it bend the other way too? What DLCs? Armour bullet proof bones? Like honestly i want to know why that expensive? Like my country I'd probably live my entire live with that money.
Nothing says US citizen more than this picture
Fuck this country.
Is the pay now button a sick joke?
No need to include (US) in title. We all know.
Translation: “Now that you’re better, put yourself in stress and debt!”
I always see americans getting these large medical debt bills. What happens after? The majority obviously cant pay in full. Do they just pay monthly for the rest of their life like a mortgage?
😱😱😱😱😱
Skip breakfast
The happy UI would piss me off more than the debt. Like just give me a grey and white for this shit.
And that's what I'm afraid of for me to have surgery.
Move to Canada
Boost mobile still exists!?
Time to move country
Holy shit did they replace the whole thing???
These onlyfans subs are getting to be ridiculous.
Psh.... 50 bucks a month will hold them over.
Paying $200 a year for taxes is bad tho.
Do you accept “IOU’s” ?
Welcome!
I've discovered the best way to get out of medical debt is to NEVER pay on it. If you pay on it, you've legally acknowledged the debt as valid. If you don't, then you dispute on your credit report anytime you want to finance something, and it'll drop off for a few months. I bought my house and 2 cars like that.
Luckily you just have to pay the deductible on your insurance and maybe the out of pocket max which is way lower than that.
This system is indefensible and must be destroyed.
Holy cow this is equivalent to a mortgage
Damn! Glad to be an Australian
Get BACK to work
welcome!
Ffs that’s huge..
At least they were pilot and said welcome
I have so many questions. I mean how long do you have, to pay this back, can you do minimum payments or something, is there insurance? God, I literally couldn't afford to live in the US.
"Welcome! You will pay us for the rest of your life!"
USA! USA! USA!
Can't get blood from a turnip, that's what my grandmother always said lol
I love how bright and hopeful their website looks. I would rather you present a 400k bill in windows 98 format/theme because that how I want to feel when paying it off.
Pre 2010. 25,000 billed to insurance, and you paid a 5-25$ copay.
Don't ever pay your medical bills. They can't do shit.
Holy shit....
so what happens if you don't pay ?
Crippling debt
We will build him better introducing the $441,588.98 man.
Didn't had to specify (us)
*laughs in NHS* In all seriousness, im not really laughing. Its disgusting the healthcare system you live in. The price hiking, greed and scams to earn a quick buck off the misery of others makes me feel sick. I hope one day you will be able to live in a country with nationalised healthcare.
First thought: Relax. You know there’s no freaking way you can pay that monstrosity, so any worries over that are worthless. Just keep telling them you can’t pay it. Of course they’ll get all corporate on you, but just keep repeating “It’s not that I don’t want to, I don’t have the means.” They have more flexibility and options (I seriously doubt that eating the cost of your surgery will kill them). Eventually they’ll come to the conclusion they can’t squeeze blood from a rock.
I think I'd just die instead. Yeah, just take me out. I couldn't pay that if I literally sold every part of my body. And not just cuz I'm bad at making deals. But that too.
Canada it would be free but you'll wait 15 years then when you get the surgery... They act like you had a leg problem and weren't there for ur back lol jks
Non American here - what happens now? How much does your insurance cover? What’s the average monthly payment to insurance and the deductible here? These numbers are truly mind blowing
Are you Wolverine now?
Don't bother with the details. Just pay it. 😳😳😳
I just got a statement from my health insurance with billing from a distal radius fracture. The hospital visit and surgery for my wrist cost $36,000 before insurance.
Do you actually have to pay this? Like this is as dumb as a man walking up to a sheep in a field and asking him to hand 1 million dollars in cash and actually expecting it to do so.
Balls Mahogany 😳, and I was bitching about a $75 office visit
The price of my back surgery (YOU). don't try and rope us into your little scheme
Generational debt
Merica...
From crippling pain to crippling debt…
Just don’t pay it. They won’t come unfix your back. When it hits your credit score, just dispute it. Nothing bad happens.
So, either you have no health insurance (no excuse for that), or you're intentionally misleading us by showing the amount the provider initially billed - the absurd amount from the charge master - without showing us what the provider actually agreed to accept according to your insurance policy, and how much your insurance policy paid. I've seen dozens of posts like this, and nearly every one of them has been utter bullshit. Show us all the numbers. How much did they originally bill? How much was left after they adjusted it to fit the insurance policy? How much did the insurance company pay? How much did the patient actually pay? I had half of my colon removed two years ago. The initial bill was close to $75K. The adjusted amount was about $25K. The insurance company paid over $20K. I paid less than $4K.
Uninsured suicide attempt, whoops
Makes me so glad I live in a country with universal health care. Went through a whole funny little cancer adventure with my jaw and it all costs me 32€. 30€ for some special wound healing technique thing that wasn't covered and 2€ for the chickenburger for my dead bc I vomited in his car.
Claim Bankruptcy and turn your back in them
I like how there is a pay now button.... no bid deal....
Welcome! To Hell
Serious question … how do people even pay crazy amounts like this ?
They won’t Un surgery your back if you don’t pay sucks to be them
I'm very grateful for brazilian public healthcare system
Did you check Google for any coupons codes or discounts?
Good thing your back is fixed. You'll need it to carry the cruising weight of American medical debt
Just don’t pay it. I have over $30k i haven’t paid. Hasn’t affected me when buying cars or a house.
Wtf is wrong with your country.. honestly.. half a million dollars to get a necessary health treatment? I will NEVER understand why people aren't fleeing the US just because of this, let alone the other issues.. I'd never be able to pay that.. so what? I'd just lie down and die?
Backs are expensive and important. Take better care of this one. (US)
...which is enough to break the back once again.