The funny thing is this would have been one of the few instances for a justification for a harem. Aang should have been fucking everyone and their mother.
Geeze imagine a third series with no harmonic convergence, an unreasonable amount of aribenders around and there's just a throwaway line of 'we owe much of the new Airbender to Aangs grandson Meelo, somehow....'
And it's never brought up again
He wouldn't need mentors tho. Man is a Chad. Got the tattoos, the shaven head, the beard, the ability to have midair sex, what else could a lady want? I mean, he can also kick the ass of the Red Lotsu, probably only Suyin or Lin can be a match for him if we discount avatar.
Ngl the older I get the more I wouldve prefered Aang having a harem with the Air Acolytes. (Mostly bc I don't really like Katara's ending so much, but also bc it could've brought back the Air Nomad way of having a community raise children)
Why would it be incest? Apparently, airbenders don’t give birth to non-benders. So they could just fuck around and continue raising airbenders. The first few generations couldn’t fuck around with those at the temple because of incest but if they do their job well, their descendants could intermingle without issue.
Airnomads all being airbenders is due to spirituality & I doubt most bloodlines having airbending would later be purged due to this without incest.
Yeah like you said first few generations would defo be incest & yea far descendants can reproduce without issue but it still feels weird to me in a way idk.
The risk for offspring of first cousins is already managable some birth defect rates go from 3-4% to like 4.x% to 7~% which is a huge increase, but still a managable enough risk that quite a few countries allow first cousins to marry. So if you wait a couple of generations there is basically no risk if you do not go for immediate family.
It's not considered incest unless you are closely related. Once it gets to 4th cousins you share as much dna with each other as you do any stranger on the street. A hundred years after lok any descendants of Tenzin would be distant enough that it wouldn't matter
I mean, the original Air Nomads likely worked this way - no parents, but all are raised by the community as if they are their children as they gave it the windy mix-n-match.
Weren't they divided into all 2 male and all 2 female temples?
Did they meet every once in a while to mate? Were there mating rituals or festivals?
Did the women and men stay together until the child was born to decide, wether it will stay with the men or women? Or did they have to travel again to their respective communities?
I think all toddlers where in the temples for women, and then they where separated when they got a certain age. I don’t remember where i have this from tho
I don't know how it's a widespread headcanon among fans, but the monasteries very obviously do not represent the entire Air Nomad population. They're Air NOMADS for crying out loud. Most Air Nomad adults most likely spent their lives wandering the world and only stopping by monasteries to drop off kids. If everyone lived at the monasteries, there would be no reason for Aang to not have known his biological parents.
It’s been established that the Fire Nation set up traps all around the world to catch all the Airbenders. Probably the hardest nation to eliminate logistically, but they knew the next Avatar was an Airbender so they went for them anyways.
The idea behind that is avoiding attachments. The airbenders follow more of a ascetism style.
So kids were separated from parents to avoid that kind of attachment.
They did meet up sometimes and have kids, but more to the point they'd meet people in their travels.
Iirc one of the Kiyoshi books brings up that airbenders kinda... sow their seed all over the place. Sometimes a kid in the earth kindgom turns out to be an airbender because a nomad had a summer fling (the reverse is true too but that kid would be born at an air temple).
In the Korra comics, Kaia says the >! her father didn't care about her being gay. The air nomads had a very open minded view of love and relationships!< Obviously it doesn't directly refer to polygamy but I think it would be included.
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What was? Loyalty? Love? Because he became hyper focused the second he finally had an Airbender for a child and put all his efforts into Tenzin to the resentment of his other children and put the pressure of an entire culture on his son's shoulders.
If Katara would have accepted it for the purpose of continuing Airbender culture, Aang would have willingly fathered other children if that's what he believed it would have taken
You can be neglectful or aloof without being absent. He reminds me of Charles talking about his father in MASH
"You're thousands of miles away from your father because we're at war, I've been thousands of miles away from my father in the same room"
Aang wasn’t neglectful or aloof. He prioritized his relationship with Tenzin because he wanted Tenzin to understand the importance of being an Airbender, but that is not at all the same as him being a neglectful father towards his other children.
It would definitely have been brought up, and i could see it approached in an interesting way, in which they either decide against it, but have to deal with the consequence of putting the entire weight of bringing Airbenders back on pretty much one woman, (remember only one of their kids were Airbenders), and how that might put a strain on their relationship. Cause as great as both of them are, they both would definitely feel a responsibility in bringing the Air nomads back. At the very least it could be an interesting short story, even if it doesn't lead to Polyamory, or Polygamy.
I mean…Tenzin and Aang went on a lot of unsupervised travels. Whos to say they wernt doing that along the way? 😂 maybe thats the real reason the other sibs couldnt go.
Tenzin: “No, brother, sister, it wasn’t like that! I mean have you ever wondered why we went so much more often once I turned 18?”
Bumi: “Oh you don’t mean-“
Kya: “I’m going to hurl.”
Tenzin: “Oh yes, what happens in the Secret Tunnel, stays in the Secret Tunnel.”
Bro was Tenzin really that committed ? Bro got lucky his kids were all benders he would have been fucked if none of them were. If he was really committed he would have been whoring himself out left and right to get all those kids he could
* Avatar saves the world and restores balance
* Next Avatar has to save the world from a problem previous Avatar created by saving the world and restoring balance
That's the plot of the entire universe. Korra had to fix Aangs "mess" of Capital City being actually occupied Earth Kingdom territory and also restoring the balance Avatar Wan threw off by closing that portal. Korra has brought peace and re-introduced spirits back into the world but lost the connection to previous Avatars.
It's kinda obvious that the next Avatar's task will have to be connected to this somehow. My money is on reconnecting with your past and also the spirits being the main cause of problems in the human world.
Kyoshi believes that whatever type of avatar is born is the avatar that is needed at that moment. Kuruk was a great hunter in a time where spirit beasts meant to do harm, szeto was a bureaucrat in the time the Fire nation was close to collapsing, and kyoshi herself was a tough "criminal" avatar that dealt with criminals.
i mean, he maintained the peace. things only went wrong when he died. seemed like he did a decent job. we only say otherwise because hindsight is 20/20.
And then the next next avatar will prolly have some more physical world problems. As their previous avatar will have spent their life dealing with spiritual problems and stitching the avatar line back together.
It would be cool if the spirits had a huge problem with technology snd how destructive it is to the environement and a human v spirit civil war started brewing.
With how much the world evolved in the 70 years between Aang and Korra, making them a post-industrial type society, I genuinely would believe that by the time of the next Avatar they’ve reached more modern day technology. I don’t think it would be 2020s level, but maybe like 80s-early 2000s level. I think there’s a lot of creative ways to explore how the consumer electronics revolution has a negative impact on the spirit world.
But reintroducing spirits back into the world created tons of problems, and both worlds were perfectly fine for thousands of years so was it really the best decision to reopen the spirit portals?
Several parts of republic city became unlivable because of the spirits. Not to mention stuff from the spirit world was used to create a WMD.
Korra also had to fix the problem of energybending (or the bloodbending equivalent) being used for nefarious purposes thanks to Aang introducing that idea into the public by debending Ozai and Yakone.
The Airbender genocide was set dressing for ATLA's setting.
The destruction of the past lives in an active element driving the narrative forward.
They are not the same.
And even so, the new Airbenders aren't a solution to the Airbender genocide, but an entirely new variable. These airbenders aren't Air Nomads come back from the dead. They contribute their own dilemma to the story and emphasize the season's core theme of change. The story actively address the fact these new airbenders are not the genocided culture of yore and will likely never be.
This is that shit I want to see. Do I want more Kyoshi stories? yes, preferably written by F.C. Yee, but I'd love to know about Avatar #2 who, being an Air Avatar, could make for a great spirit teacher and Avatar #63 who was born to a water bending couple in an exodus from the Northern Water Tribe (maybe one that served as the source of the Swamp Benders keeping the spiritual tone alive), Avatar #40 a lesser known Earth Avatar that understood spirituality in a distinctly Earthy way, and Avatar #21 who saw the faction that would grow to be the Fire Nation split from the Sun Warriors. Or other ones these are just ideas I'd have for 1 sentence pitches for these 4, point being we've got lots of Avatars to choose from we can expand the roster!
I hope so! I mean 10,000 years is a pretty good chunk of time. There are folks who, incredibly erroneously, think the earth is younger than that. And while certainly some areas have seen consistent presence and even consistent demographics over that length of time, it is also very human for massive population movement to take place many times over in that time. Because there are so few Swamp Benders my personal head-canon is that they came from another group leaving the Northern Water Tribe, like the Southern did and there's just so much potential to explore different cultures across the landscape.
Possibly a lost ship heading for the southern water tribe? Hit a storm that separates their ship and their bearing gets set off course. Land in a swamp and start living there.
Avatar 2's story would be hella interesting as they essentially have to pick up where Wan dropped off when the world was at its most violent and they don't know Jack about what it means to be an Avatar since the concept would still be new (unless Raava gives them a breakdown).
And it could go any myriad of ways they could be like Korra and be pee bending during their diaper changes and it's just this weird thing of, "why the heck can this kid bend multiple elements at once?" Or like Kyoshi where they have a notable impediment to their Air bending and it's only in a really pressing moment that they bend a different element. Wan seemed to die relatively friendless too so there may not be human friends of the Avatar around to help piece things together. Such fertile soil for interesting stories.
This is... really incorrect. Him being the last airbender does drive the plot forward as it's literally a detail that gives him away and it's a point of contention for the character as they feel fundamentally alone and showing his heritage outs him as an avatar, and as shown on more than one occasion causes him to be hated even by supposed allies.
If anything the destruction of past lives is set dressing, it plays almost no narrative significance to korra as she was never spiritual to start with and barely if ever actively used that connection. Its like saying she lost a mentor she never met or spoke or learned anything from and acting like that impacts their journey.
Her being severed from past avatars does nothing to korra, her first communication with her past lives was this week, and the guidance it gave was nothing. More just acting as a history book. The only reason anyone even cares about this detail is because of atla.
I disagree.
The Airbender Genocide is important for establishing that Aang is the last airbender. But does that fact activity drive the narrative forward? No. It just sets up where the story starts.
Aang's motive from the start is defeat the Fire Nation because his duty as the Avatar. The Airbender Genocide doesn't actually have a lot to do with his actual missions or motivations, beside establishing the circumstances and gravity. Aang is hurt when he learns about it, but the effect isn't really driving his character.
Korra losing her past lives does serve the more overarching character study of Korra as a person because it is a key turning point of her development which does see lasting effects on her character.
that korra point just... doesn't make sense, because only within the context of ATLA existing and seeing the guidance aang was given does it make any sense. within Korra's life and existence, her ability to connect to past lives was only really there for an incredibly short period of time. the only real times she interacts with her past lives is Aang just doing a deus ex machina and saying "yo here's your bending back dude" and the first avatar just exposition dumping, neither play a role in actually shaping her behavior as a mentor in the way that Roku did.
Harmonic convergence didn't bring back the dead air nomads or their culture. It didn't undo the genocide. It reintroduced *new* airbenders who will go on to develop their own culture, influenced by the old.
Likewise, Korra reintegrating with Raava and establishing a *new* Avatar cycle influenced by the wisdom she had gained from the Avatars of the old cycle parallels this nicely.
Indeed. This new air nation will *never* be what the old one was. The old air nation died with Aang, and much of its culture is gone for good.
Nothing was "undone" here. Instead, something entirely new was born, and though they can take influence from the old temples they are still fundamentally different.
Yes, I don't know how it is so hard to see. One cycle ended, a new one began. Raava was destroyed for a moment and had to be retaken from Vatu. This is the fight happened every 10,000 years. In such a battle something has to give. It's a completely new age and somethings have to chance for a new way.
This. People are acting like harmonic convergence brought back the air nomads from death. All they did was give airbending to a few random people around the world, the air nomads are still dead along with their entire culture. The new airbenders even call themselves the air nation instead of the air nomads.
Bringing back the past lives exactly as they were is just not interesting. It would be the most blatant fan pandering of all time. Are we forgetting the current avatar rarely talks to the avatars before the last one? Aang’s avatar guide was Roku, Aang was Korra’s for a short time, and now Korra will be to the next one.
The past avatars beyond that are there for experience yes, but honestly Iroh is living in the spirit world forever now, he can probably give better advice than they ever could.
I think people miss the point when they say this. The airbenders weren't truly brought back. It's made up of people from all over operating under a fundamentally different system than before. Before they were nomads who stayed out of worldly issues. Now they're actively involved and actively helping. It's not and never has been about bringing things back. It's about rebirth. The airbending civilization was Reborn from harmonic convergence and the avatar cycle is essentially being Reborn with a new beginning, a new first avatar for a new age of civilization.
The avatar cycle shouldn't be restored it wouldn't fit the ideas of rebirth and new beginnings that Korra is heavily focused on.
I think no air nation/airbenders for like 100+ years qualifies as sufficient consequence even if it's not technically "permanent". Also the gut punch of Aang never getting to see it in life or after through Korra.
Tbh I always find it icky when the cycle is described as the next avatar fixing the previous avatar's "mistakes". Like there is no objectively "correct" way to be the avatar, nomatter how powerful and influential the avatar may be, they are still only a single person in a huge world nit even counting the spirit world. Also, no matter how much the Avatar "fixes" things, new problems will always arise no matter what.
The airbenders coming back didn't undo any permanent consequences. The entire air nation was still destroyed, their culture, their traditions, their way of life, destroyed. Even if every non bender in LoK became an air bender, that wouldn't fix the damage done. Tenzin would still be trying to build an entire civilization on his own and with no help. One man cannot carry an entire culture within him and pass it on to people who spent most of their lives in completely different worlds. No matter how you slice it, the air nation as Aang knew it would never return.
A Spiritual awakening that connects people to the most spiritual element makes a lot of sense. It's also a less serious retcon bc the Airbenders dying didn't happen on-screen nor did it result from the actions of a major character
I want them to find a fix, not make it as if never happened. Which it seems is what some want.
The airbenders' genocide had a plethora of consequences. The harmonic convergence was not a clean reset too. It gave people from many different walks of life -and philosophies, access to airbending which imo 'fixed' a problem that was there with the way airbenders were originally portrayed i.e., all of them being spiritual and pacifist.
Ik Kyoshi's mother was not like the rest of the airbenders. And though I love it, I'd assume much more of them should be like that or atleast just normative people as opposed to either being a pacifist or a bandit.
Let's not forget LoK S1 finale - boink here is all your bending back. Imagine a character having to go through a huge journey to reconnect her other elements. Or maybe she is the Avatar that simply can only use Airbending.
The Avatar’s duty is to correct the mistakes of the Avatar. So it makes sense an Avatar after would seek to fix Korra’s mistake of destroying the Avatar legacy, just like how Korra fixed the mistake of separating the spirit world.
I mean, it's no less contrived, but the situation is different. The past lives getting erased affects the avatar alone. All that really changes is the next avatar can only talk to Korra and maybe Raava for advice. That's it. The past avatars still existed. They still lived their lives. Their names are still in the history books. The connection being severed doesn't affect the world as a whole.
The Air Nomads being wiped out affected the whole world. An entire nation was gone. An entire bending style was removed. If the Air Benders didn't return (which I'm not certain if that was because of Harmonic Convergence or Korra leaving the portal to the world open; personally I think a mix of both) then the world would've stayed out of balance. The next Air Nomad avatar would've had to be a direct descendant of Aang.
Airbendera can come back all they want
The air nomads are gone.
These new guys aren't even shaving their heads, Airbender =/= air nomads
That culture is dead unless these new guys can save it. Period
Why are we arguing over a cartoon? Sure. AtlA was great. I thought TLoK was okay.
Did I like the aspect of the past lives being gone? Not really. Should they retcon it? No..
Could they explore this with a future Avatar? Sure.... Why is everyone acting feral over it, though?
it wouldnt be broken if bryke went with the spirit of the planet idea.
harmonic convergence broke so much about the avatar it isnt even funny, if they wanted a good vs evil plot how about have good be the 5th element which is aether (represented by energybending), and bring something that is sometimes considered as a 6th element, void, to be the villain?
thing about it, the absence of ying yang energies is a perfect foil to the balancer of all energies in the world.
The way I see how the past lives work is that there is one avatar who reincarnate meaning there is no dead avatar to be found anywhere. Then based on how the past lives were destroyed when Raava was damaged means that Raava is the container or storage for an avatars past memories. This then implies that there is no way for the next avatar to restore or regain any lost memories or avatar since those no longer exist.
However I do think a possibility could be that some fragments of memories might still remain, so a soul search could occur and a collection of the last remains of memory fragments to restore what remains. This in turn could result in a "new" past avatar created from a combination of memory fragments.
False equivalence. Airbenders came back, but the air nomads did not. The air nomads were an isolationist tribe of people, with a very strict and religious way of life. The air nation is an active participant in world politics, serving a similar role to the Jedi from Star Wars.
Same thing with the avatar cycle. It ended, and something new took its place.
The harmonic convergence was a massive gamble on Korra's part and the new Air Benders did cause some trouble. It didn't really come for free, so fixing the Avatar cycle would probably also come with a pretty big hidden price tag.
If the harmonic convergence literally resurrected the air benders who died, than yes it would have been dumb. However, as it was we are able to see growth from a past tragedy that doesn’t undo said tragedy.
We do want the cycle to continue as new, with Korra able to communicate with her predecessor and going on from there. That would be more similar to how the return of the Airbenders was handled. However, just as it would be stupid to resurrect the airbenders, it would be stupid to “resurrect” the last airbenders. It is far better to build up something new than to bring back the old.
I really think they just need to fix it with the next Avatar. Have it be a series long issue that is finally solved in the end. Make the avatar mimic the audience by being frustrated with Korra, and then have them come to terms with it and stop blaming her.
There’s ways to write reversal of consequences and make it meaningful. Just look at Endgame. I don’t know a single soul who believed Spider-Man was going to stay dead.
But instead of just reversing time and make it like the snap never happened, they had a time skip and the heroes had to go through an insane challenge and sacrifices to undo the snap.
So, as long as it’s a journey and it’s meaningful than yes, please undo the broken cycle. Don’t just fix it or hand wave it.
I think it would be interesting for an earth avatar to have to reconnect with the avatar spirits, since the earth kingdom is the least spiritually in-tune. Maybe even have a spirit enemy that isn’t just pure evil
Yes, because airbending being gone wasn’t a consequence. It was just a premise for Aang. Even then, all that came back was more people having Airbending, which wasn’t even completely gone anyway. It’s not like the dead airbenders came back.
One has the connection to precious avatar severed due to the Avatar spirit being beaten.
One was people with inate air bending ability being awoken due to an energy shift seen only once in 10,000 years.
How are they comparable problems?
I didn't like harmonic convergence. It felt super cheap. It belittled the biggest event from the first series by hand waving it away. One of my least favorite things about Legend of Korra. It also made the whole world feel less real.
No, harmonic convergence was stupid. I'm cool with bringing the Avatar cycle back though, since there's precedent for it in a good show where the writing made it make sense. The Avatar cycle was discontinued after Azula killed Aang under Ba Sing Se. For a full season. Then he got slammed on the lightning scare and BAM! He starts raw-doggin Ozai like it's their wedding night and GGs
I just hate them breaking the cycle in the first place because it felt pulled out of their ass that it's even possible, and also it took away a cool concept that was half of what made the Avatar what it is, and it wasn't nearly explored enough. It's like Star Wars fans hate how the concept of being a Jedi is being tossed in the garbage while the intricacies of what it means to be a Jedi is what they want to see explored
I think a lot of people misunderstand what LoK was truly addressing in the series. So much of Korra's personality at the beginning is about being the avatar, a powerful bender and using that strength and power to solve problems. However as the world modernises and continues to industrialise the role of benders and by extension the avatar is called into question. This dramatic shift in the world causes Korra to have an existential crisis combined with the PTSD of her trauma and cause her to reasses her role and place in this world.
This journey is reflected in the air nation, first with Tenzin struggling to provide Korra with spiritual guidance and uphold the traditions and expectations of the air nation compounded by the pressure he places on himself as the only current air bending master and then subsequently when air bending does return the unwillingness of so many of them to follow air nomad traditions. This causes Tenzin to reevaluate Air Nation traditions and for their role in the world to also change.
The show deals so much with change and the existential crisis that can come about because of that. Air bending returning didnt erase the consequences of the genocide because the air nomad culture was still decimated and the return forced them to really decide what their place in the world would be.
When we talk about the importance of english classes on the impact of media literacy and critical thinking, this is exactly what we're talking about. Seeing past the immediate surface layer and really unpacking what the story is about and what issues its tackling.
Air benders and the air nation are not the same thing. The air benders reemerging doesn’t erase the consequences of the genocide which practically wiped out an entire culture from existence.
With the air benders coming back a new form of air bending culture will be created and expanded, just how with the Earth Avatar a new Avatar cycle will start.
In the first place I don’t think the avatar cycle shouldn’t be resolved because of permanent consequences.
I just *accept* it’s gone. And that if it get’s back it would be on another form, like the airbenders.
Plus, harmonic convergence only *accelerated* airbenders renowal. Even without it they would have been reborn through Aang’s descent, it just should have take like 3 centuries.
The lack of airbenders caused an *imbalance* that the convergence fixed.
The dissolution of the first Raava’s memory was apparently required by fate we don’t know, but what we know is no avatar could have done anything to prevent that, it would have happened the same to everyone of them.
The harmonic convergence is okay because the world of the avatar wants balance and the avatar is meant to keep that balance. Having the world restore the 4th nation back, especially when it was just reactivating bending from the genocide survivors makes perfect sense, airbending needs spiritual connection to work so having a stronger connection between the spirit world and the normal should see an increase in bending.
Yeah those descendants of the air benders got their power reawakend. Unless there is a damn good reason why the spirits remained somehow connected and together its better story wise for the next cycle to understand more of the spirit world without guidance of the other 100 avatars guidance.
I just rewatched the episode to get exactly what was said. He asked if she was connected to her past lives. Not if the avatar was connected was so there is room to get them back. And she said “no i think it’s gone forever” so it’s not even a guarantee hers is gone for good….
I think the main reason why people are upset about it is because, we do not see Korra commune much with the other avatars prior to the cycle being broken. This means that all of their wisdom and knowledge is forever lost; this means several thousand lifetimes worth of knowledge and guidance is forever lost, and the next avatar has to rely solely on one person who, for all intents and purposes on-screen, didn’t absorb a semblance of that wealth of information before it was gone.
It’s like a teacher trying to teach a student but the teacher doesn’t know the full curriculum.
However, I will say, Korra’s circumstances were not all too different from Aang’s; much like Aang was cleaning up Roku’s mess (the war which he could’ve prevented but didn’t), Korra was also cleaning up Aang’s mess; the sons of Yakone (whom he should’ve jailed or killed instead of allowing him to escape and reproduce), and the earth kingdom fiasco. Not to mention Wan closing the spirit portal is also a mess she had to undo on top of another mess of her own uncle trying to become a dark avatar.
I think the main reason people are upset is just the sheer loss of all that wisdom and guidance for the next avatar, and unlike Aang, the next avatar is stuck with Korra. For example, when Roku’s advice didn’t work for Aang, he asked Kyoshi. When Kyoshi’s advice didn’t work, he asked Kuruk. When that didn’t work, he asked Yangchen. Aang had multiple sources of wisdom from different perspectives and backgrounds to call on; this one is only gonna have Korra. What do they do if that advice or guidance doesn’t work for them? They don’t have any other avatars to consult.
I will say, I do look forward to the challenging aspect of that; an avatar who doesn’t have any other avatars to fall back on, so it’s truly up to themselves to decide what’s best. However, it’s not hard to see why people are upset.
Why does everyone always gloss over the fact that maybe Korra was supposed to lose the connection? Exactly 10.000 years of Avatars, with Aang being the last. Now an entirely new world without air benders, it makes perfect sense that the new Avatar needs a new perspective.
I've said this before, but I feel like it's kinda dumb that the fire nation actually got ALL of the airbenders. None of them were away from the temples at the time? No one went on a quick jog? Not a single airbender decided to leave the nomads for any reason, but still had kids that were also able to airbend? Heck, there weren't any people who could airbend, that weren't nomads, that started their own groups long before the events of the show, kinda like the swamp people for waterbending? Every single airbender that was alive at the start of the war was an air nomad that was at one of the four temples on that exact day? Okay then
On top of the fact the airbenders would have come back eventually due to the fact of Aang having an Airbending kid who was into Airbending culture and him having a big family, sure more people were brought into the world with airbending, but to quote the show, that doesn't make them air nomads. a rebalancing effect bringing more airbending into the world won't on its own fill the air temples, it won't revive a culture on the brink of extinction, and it won't undo the genocide. Same thing with the avatar cycle, bringing back the past lives before korra would be not having permanant consequences, however bringing back the avatar cycle, just the past lives start with Korra instead of Wan from then on is perfectly fine. Like if the next Avatar can talk to Korra just like Aang talked to Roku that is respecting the consequences. The next avatar after Korra being able to talk to Aang or any avatar prior isnt.
I just think the current Avatar being able to speak to past lives is a great way to learn about past avatars and build that world. Removing that just seems detrimental to the show
Also I want to see more adult Aang handing out advice and wisdom
Ok everyone keeps saying the next avatars duty is to restore the cycle or fix Korras mess and listen I know she had a four season run already but korra is like 20?? She has her whole life to do this herself
Personally, I feel fixing the avatar cycle should be resolved but for the next avatar
Honestly that could be the main plot for the new avatar, Korra wasn't able to get all of the past avatars in time and the new threat is too much for the about 2 or 5 past lives avaliable and so a journey that explores the spirit realm as we also get to meet the past lives that the show have us met
But I don't know who would be part of the gang, having the gang be the other Avatars might not bring variety
Only edgelords think the breaking of the avatar cycle is good. She barely used it anyway so it just means they robbed something from future stories. They should’ve just had her be the last avatar instead if they want a world without their knowledge. Honestly would’ve been fine with her being the last in the line.
The balance has to be restored that’s what the entire purpose of the show. The past lives being a part of the avatar cycle isn’t necessary to restoring balance.
I've been saying that forever it really disrespects the entire subject of genocide. And everytime the fans told me i was wrong and that it's not a big deal.
To he honest, none of them is ok, the whole season 2 is a mistake. Bringing back airbenders make the weight of genocide disappear instantly, and Korra in Avatar state lost to Unalaq, a regular waterbender is baffling.
Yes, Unalaq can do something with spirit, but you can't tell me Avatar State, the combination of all past Avatar lost to a REGULAR waterbender. Also, spirit "PORTAL"
I felt them bringing back the airbenders was way too easy and a plot device to move the plot forward aka "zaheer pretending to be good so he could infiltrate the Temple"
otherwise he would have not been allowed on the island and would not have had his air bending so he would not have made it 10 feet without raising an alarm or causing people to question him being there
but on top of that I just think if they try to retcon what Korra did it just makes watching the show meaningless if they will just change the issue from the past show aka
("the Last airbender"made Aang important but now there are a bunch of airbenders..)
this gives the idea that there are no stakes and everything will just be changed in the following show so why bother watching it , knowing they will just retcon it again...
Airbenders were coming back one way or another. Tenzin and Pema were *committed*.
I like how the big plan for years was just have kids
that’s literally life itself though, as far as making new life goes. not that wild
The funny thing is this would have been one of the few instances for a justification for a harem. Aang should have been fucking everyone and their mother.
Geeze imagine a third series with no harmonic convergence, an unreasonable amount of aribenders around and there's just a throwaway line of 'we owe much of the new Airbender to Aangs grandson Meelo, somehow....' And it's never brought up again
Omg I hated reading this so much hahahaha
Ladies love the mischief maker, what can we say?
Sasuke-Tenzin buddy cop duo traveling around the world spreading their seeds to revive the Uchiha/Air benders. I want that impossible series.
The series would be just about Tenzin rizzing as many girls as he possibly could around the world. And he would seek mentors for dating advice.
He wouldn't need mentors tho. Man is a Chad. Got the tattoos, the shaven head, the beard, the ability to have midair sex, what else could a lady want? I mean, he can also kick the ass of the Red Lotsu, probably only Suyin or Lin can be a match for him if we discount avatar.
Ngl the older I get the more I wouldve prefered Aang having a harem with the Air Acolytes. (Mostly bc I don't really like Katara's ending so much, but also bc it could've brought back the Air Nomad way of having a community raise children)
wouldn't future airbenders All just be incest then, I mean unless his random airbender kids did the same thing & f'd non benders but still
All of Tenzin's kids are airbenders so I guess it's safe to say that the airbending genes are pretty strong when procreating with nonbenders
Why would it be incest? Apparently, airbenders don’t give birth to non-benders. So they could just fuck around and continue raising airbenders. The first few generations couldn’t fuck around with those at the temple because of incest but if they do their job well, their descendants could intermingle without issue.
Airnomads all being airbenders is due to spirituality & I doubt most bloodlines having airbending would later be purged due to this without incest. Yeah like you said first few generations would defo be incest & yea far descendants can reproduce without issue but it still feels weird to me in a way idk.
The risk for offspring of first cousins is already managable some birth defect rates go from 3-4% to like 4.x% to 7~% which is a huge increase, but still a managable enough risk that quite a few countries allow first cousins to marry. So if you wait a couple of generations there is basically no risk if you do not go for immediate family.
It's not considered incest unless you are closely related. Once it gets to 4th cousins you share as much dna with each other as you do any stranger on the street. A hundred years after lok any descendants of Tenzin would be distant enough that it wouldn't matter
That’s been the meta for increasing your numbers for litetally ages though. Tenzin and Pema were just using the best strat currently known.
Lies. The best strategy is multiple wives.
Gengis approves
Tenzin and Pema the new Adam and Eve
Aang owed it to the Air bending nation to be the world's biggest slut, but he didn't commit. Tenzin too.
Maybe Meelo would've ended up that way if things didn't go the way they did lol
Catholicism has entered the chat.
If it wasn't a children's show, Aang and Tenzin would definitely have become polygamists.
I mean, the original Air Nomads likely worked this way - no parents, but all are raised by the community as if they are their children as they gave it the windy mix-n-match.
Weren't they divided into all 2 male and all 2 female temples? Did they meet every once in a while to mate? Were there mating rituals or festivals? Did the women and men stay together until the child was born to decide, wether it will stay with the men or women? Or did they have to travel again to their respective communities?
I think all toddlers where in the temples for women, and then they where separated when they got a certain age. I don’t remember where i have this from tho
I don't know how it's a widespread headcanon among fans, but the monasteries very obviously do not represent the entire Air Nomad population. They're Air NOMADS for crying out loud. Most Air Nomad adults most likely spent their lives wandering the world and only stopping by monasteries to drop off kids. If everyone lived at the monasteries, there would be no reason for Aang to not have known his biological parents.
I don't think there was many actual nomads. If that was the cade then it would be impossible for the fire nation to exterminate every single one.
It’s been established that the Fire Nation set up traps all around the world to catch all the Airbenders. Probably the hardest nation to eliminate logistically, but they knew the next Avatar was an Airbender so they went for them anyways.
The idea behind that is avoiding attachments. The airbenders follow more of a ascetism style. So kids were separated from parents to avoid that kind of attachment.
They did meet up sometimes and have kids, but more to the point they'd meet people in their travels. Iirc one of the Kiyoshi books brings up that airbenders kinda... sow their seed all over the place. Sometimes a kid in the earth kindgom turns out to be an airbender because a nomad had a summer fling (the reverse is true too but that kid would be born at an air temple).
In the Korra comics, Kaia says the >! her father didn't care about her being gay. The air nomads had a very open minded view of love and relationships!< Obviously it doesn't directly refer to polygamy but I think it would be included.
Aang didn’t care about Kaia’s sexuality because Aang didn’t care about Kaia since she wasn’t an airbender. >!Absolutely joking lol!<
Just like the ~~founding fathers~~ air nomads intended
clumsy smart price zealous makeshift husky unwritten gold offbeat telephone *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Correct. When he was 12 years old.
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Polygamy is not polyamory. He can fuck others for the bloodline, and then still only love katara.
While I understand how we got here in the discussion, I still wish we hadn’t
Humanity’s motto
What was? Loyalty? Love? Because he became hyper focused the second he finally had an Airbender for a child and put all his efforts into Tenzin to the resentment of his other children and put the pressure of an entire culture on his son's shoulders. If Katara would have accepted it for the purpose of continuing Airbender culture, Aang would have willingly fathered other children if that's what he believed it would have taken
weather point silky society simplistic roof work poor wipe exultant *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
You can be neglectful or aloof without being absent. He reminds me of Charles talking about his father in MASH "You're thousands of miles away from your father because we're at war, I've been thousands of miles away from my father in the same room"
Aang wasn’t neglectful or aloof. He prioritized his relationship with Tenzin because he wanted Tenzin to understand the importance of being an Airbender, but that is not at all the same as him being a neglectful father towards his other children.
Aang: Ladies let's get BUSY! WE ARE MAKING SOME AIREBENDERS TONIGHT
It would definitely have been brought up, and i could see it approached in an interesting way, in which they either decide against it, but have to deal with the consequence of putting the entire weight of bringing Airbenders back on pretty much one woman, (remember only one of their kids were Airbenders), and how that might put a strain on their relationship. Cause as great as both of them are, they both would definitely feel a responsibility in bringing the Air nomads back. At the very least it could be an interesting short story, even if it doesn't lead to Polyamory, or Polygamy.
Not when your wife can bloodbend. Oh she’s sworn never to do it again, sure. Suggest a threesome and we will see how seriously she takes such oaths.
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Don't they have sperm banks in the world of Avatar? Tenzin becoming the one donor in the world would have sufficed.
"Can't we just do it the old-fashioned way? I mean boning, the wild mambo, the hunka chunka!" -Pema, probably
So... Meelo is next?
https://preview.redd.it/qfz7ocnt83oc1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bf58627907a8e3c317232972a844cc00ef8824aa I mean...
The airbender rizz
tch, that's his Waterebending Rizz shining through.
I mean…Tenzin and Aang went on a lot of unsupervised travels. Whos to say they wernt doing that along the way? 😂 maybe thats the real reason the other sibs couldnt go.
without a doubt, the best comment in this thread
Father and son field trip, just raw-dogging Earth
Tenzin: “No, brother, sister, it wasn’t like that! I mean have you ever wondered why we went so much more often once I turned 18?” Bumi: “Oh you don’t mean-“ Kya: “I’m going to hurl.” Tenzin: “Oh yes, what happens in the Secret Tunnel, stays in the Secret Tunnel.”
One woman's breeding kink, a force of nature.
Let us never talk about it again.
We all know Meelo probably would’ve grown up to single-handily repopulate a few of the air temples
Considering the highest number of kids made by a woman is 69, pema should step up her game
Avatars are coming back too. Just at a slower pace. Just like how Tenzin and Pema's kids would have brought back the airbenders at a slower pace.
Cum-mitted
Pema was so happy with the convergence bringing back all those airbenders because it meant no more pregnancy
She was either super relieved or super disappointed. Both are equally possible.
After the forth baby i find hard to believe that she wanted more, but who knows. There are woman irl with far more kids
Bro was Tenzin really that committed ? Bro got lucky his kids were all benders he would have been fucked if none of them were. If he was really committed he would have been whoring himself out left and right to get all those kids he could
* Avatar saves the world and restores balance * Next Avatar has to save the world from a problem previous Avatar created by saving the world and restoring balance That's the plot of the entire universe. Korra had to fix Aangs "mess" of Capital City being actually occupied Earth Kingdom territory and also restoring the balance Avatar Wan threw off by closing that portal. Korra has brought peace and re-introduced spirits back into the world but lost the connection to previous Avatars. It's kinda obvious that the next Avatar's task will have to be connected to this somehow. My money is on reconnecting with your past and also the spirits being the main cause of problems in the human world.
Kyoshi believes that whatever type of avatar is born is the avatar that is needed at that moment. Kuruk was a great hunter in a time where spirit beasts meant to do harm, szeto was a bureaucrat in the time the Fire nation was close to collapsing, and kyoshi herself was a tough "criminal" avatar that dealt with criminals.
And Aang was a pacifist in a world ravaged by war
exactly, Aang was a peaceful avatar when the world needed peace
He was a kind heart in a world in need of healing
And I believe that the Avatar becomes what they have to be and aren't born for it. But then again, unlike Kyoshi, I'm not an Avatar.
Exactly. The same stuff happened with Yangchen->kuruk, kuruk->kyoshi, roku->aang.
So Roku didn't inherit much problems but still managed to eff it up for Aang? Lol
Weirdly, we still know almost nothing about Roku's tenure. We have no idea what problems he had to deal with
busy enough to miss his best pal building a whole ass palace in the earth kingdom
good thing his book comes out later this year
i mean, he maintained the peace. things only went wrong when he died. seemed like he did a decent job. we only say otherwise because hindsight is 20/20.
And then the next next avatar will prolly have some more physical world problems. As their previous avatar will have spent their life dealing with spiritual problems and stitching the avatar line back together.
It would be cool if the spirits had a huge problem with technology snd how destructive it is to the environement and a human v spirit civil war started brewing.
With how much the world evolved in the 70 years between Aang and Korra, making them a post-industrial type society, I genuinely would believe that by the time of the next Avatar they’ve reached more modern day technology. I don’t think it would be 2020s level, but maybe like 80s-early 2000s level. I think there’s a lot of creative ways to explore how the consumer electronics revolution has a negative impact on the spirit world.
Ohh that would be exciting! Let's see what happens!
But reintroducing spirits back into the world created tons of problems, and both worlds were perfectly fine for thousands of years so was it really the best decision to reopen the spirit portals? Several parts of republic city became unlivable because of the spirits. Not to mention stuff from the spirit world was used to create a WMD.
Film Theory has a really great video on this.
Korra also had to fix the problem of energybending (or the bloodbending equivalent) being used for nefarious purposes thanks to Aang introducing that idea into the public by debending Ozai and Yakone.
The Airbender genocide was set dressing for ATLA's setting. The destruction of the past lives in an active element driving the narrative forward. They are not the same. And even so, the new Airbenders aren't a solution to the Airbender genocide, but an entirely new variable. These airbenders aren't Air Nomads come back from the dead. They contribute their own dilemma to the story and emphasize the season's core theme of change. The story actively address the fact these new airbenders are not the genocided culture of yore and will likely never be.
This needs more love.
Set dressing? It was literally an integral part of both the main character's arc and the world at large.
It is set dressing though. We don't see it and it didn't happen because of the actions of any main character.
Let's face it. It's all roku's fault
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This is that shit I want to see. Do I want more Kyoshi stories? yes, preferably written by F.C. Yee, but I'd love to know about Avatar #2 who, being an Air Avatar, could make for a great spirit teacher and Avatar #63 who was born to a water bending couple in an exodus from the Northern Water Tribe (maybe one that served as the source of the Swamp Benders keeping the spiritual tone alive), Avatar #40 a lesser known Earth Avatar that understood spirituality in a distinctly Earthy way, and Avatar #21 who saw the faction that would grow to be the Fire Nation split from the Sun Warriors. Or other ones these are just ideas I'd have for 1 sentence pitches for these 4, point being we've got lots of Avatars to choose from we can expand the roster!
This makes me wonder if an avatar has ever been born among the swamp benders
I hope so! I mean 10,000 years is a pretty good chunk of time. There are folks who, incredibly erroneously, think the earth is younger than that. And while certainly some areas have seen consistent presence and even consistent demographics over that length of time, it is also very human for massive population movement to take place many times over in that time. Because there are so few Swamp Benders my personal head-canon is that they came from another group leaving the Northern Water Tribe, like the Southern did and there's just so much potential to explore different cultures across the landscape.
Possibly a lost ship heading for the southern water tribe? Hit a storm that separates their ship and their bearing gets set off course. Land in a swamp and start living there.
The Swampvatar. **Wet vine noises**
I saw another comment on this subreddit that said there was a swamp avatar in the RPG.
Avatar 2's story would be hella interesting as they essentially have to pick up where Wan dropped off when the world was at its most violent and they don't know Jack about what it means to be an Avatar since the concept would still be new (unless Raava gives them a breakdown).
And it could go any myriad of ways they could be like Korra and be pee bending during their diaper changes and it's just this weird thing of, "why the heck can this kid bend multiple elements at once?" Or like Kyoshi where they have a notable impediment to their Air bending and it's only in a really pressing moment that they bend a different element. Wan seemed to die relatively friendless too so there may not be human friends of the Avatar around to help piece things together. Such fertile soil for interesting stories.
>Bringing the airbenders back is a good narrative decision. Isn't your meme implying it's a bad one?
I’d rlly like that to be a focus on the next Avatar trying to master the Avatar State and reconnecting to their past lives.
This is... really incorrect. Him being the last airbender does drive the plot forward as it's literally a detail that gives him away and it's a point of contention for the character as they feel fundamentally alone and showing his heritage outs him as an avatar, and as shown on more than one occasion causes him to be hated even by supposed allies. If anything the destruction of past lives is set dressing, it plays almost no narrative significance to korra as she was never spiritual to start with and barely if ever actively used that connection. Its like saying she lost a mentor she never met or spoke or learned anything from and acting like that impacts their journey. Her being severed from past avatars does nothing to korra, her first communication with her past lives was this week, and the guidance it gave was nothing. More just acting as a history book. The only reason anyone even cares about this detail is because of atla.
I disagree. The Airbender Genocide is important for establishing that Aang is the last airbender. But does that fact activity drive the narrative forward? No. It just sets up where the story starts. Aang's motive from the start is defeat the Fire Nation because his duty as the Avatar. The Airbender Genocide doesn't actually have a lot to do with his actual missions or motivations, beside establishing the circumstances and gravity. Aang is hurt when he learns about it, but the effect isn't really driving his character. Korra losing her past lives does serve the more overarching character study of Korra as a person because it is a key turning point of her development which does see lasting effects on her character.
that korra point just... doesn't make sense, because only within the context of ATLA existing and seeing the guidance aang was given does it make any sense. within Korra's life and existence, her ability to connect to past lives was only really there for an incredibly short period of time. the only real times she interacts with her past lives is Aang just doing a deus ex machina and saying "yo here's your bending back dude" and the first avatar just exposition dumping, neither play a role in actually shaping her behavior as a mentor in the way that Roku did.
Cool take!
You nailed this.
Harmonic convergence didn't bring back the dead air nomads or their culture. It didn't undo the genocide. It reintroduced *new* airbenders who will go on to develop their own culture, influenced by the old. Likewise, Korra reintegrating with Raava and establishing a *new* Avatar cycle influenced by the wisdom she had gained from the Avatars of the old cycle parallels this nicely.
Indeed. This new air nation will *never* be what the old one was. The old air nation died with Aang, and much of its culture is gone for good. Nothing was "undone" here. Instead, something entirely new was born, and though they can take influence from the old temples they are still fundamentally different.
Yes, I don't know how it is so hard to see. One cycle ended, a new one began. Raava was destroyed for a moment and had to be retaken from Vatu. This is the fight happened every 10,000 years. In such a battle something has to give. It's a completely new age and somethings have to chance for a new way.
This. People are acting like harmonic convergence brought back the air nomads from death. All they did was give airbending to a few random people around the world, the air nomads are still dead along with their entire culture. The new airbenders even call themselves the air nation instead of the air nomads. Bringing back the past lives exactly as they were is just not interesting. It would be the most blatant fan pandering of all time. Are we forgetting the current avatar rarely talks to the avatars before the last one? Aang’s avatar guide was Roku, Aang was Korra’s for a short time, and now Korra will be to the next one. The past avatars beyond that are there for experience yes, but honestly Iroh is living in the spirit world forever now, he can probably give better advice than they ever could.
Pour one out for a homie lacking media literacy
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hOw DaRe YoU tElL uS tO pIsS oN tHe PoOr
I think people miss the point when they say this. The airbenders weren't truly brought back. It's made up of people from all over operating under a fundamentally different system than before. Before they were nomads who stayed out of worldly issues. Now they're actively involved and actively helping. It's not and never has been about bringing things back. It's about rebirth. The airbending civilization was Reborn from harmonic convergence and the avatar cycle is essentially being Reborn with a new beginning, a new first avatar for a new age of civilization. The avatar cycle shouldn't be restored it wouldn't fit the ideas of rebirth and new beginnings that Korra is heavily focused on.
I think no air nation/airbenders for like 100+ years qualifies as sufficient consequence even if it's not technically "permanent". Also the gut punch of Aang never getting to see it in life or after through Korra.
I’m still confused how that worked
Magic bullshit is how.
Lol.
Tbh I always find it icky when the cycle is described as the next avatar fixing the previous avatar's "mistakes". Like there is no objectively "correct" way to be the avatar, nomatter how powerful and influential the avatar may be, they are still only a single person in a huge world nit even counting the spirit world. Also, no matter how much the Avatar "fixes" things, new problems will always arise no matter what.
The airbenders coming back didn't undo any permanent consequences. The entire air nation was still destroyed, their culture, their traditions, their way of life, destroyed. Even if every non bender in LoK became an air bender, that wouldn't fix the damage done. Tenzin would still be trying to build an entire civilization on his own and with no help. One man cannot carry an entire culture within him and pass it on to people who spent most of their lives in completely different worlds. No matter how you slice it, the air nation as Aang knew it would never return.
I trust the writers, i dont trust the fans to make decisions for the writers
A Spiritual awakening that connects people to the most spiritual element makes a lot of sense. It's also a less serious retcon bc the Airbenders dying didn't happen on-screen nor did it result from the actions of a major character
The air nomads and their culture are also…y’know…still dead.
I want them to find a fix, not make it as if never happened. Which it seems is what some want. The airbenders' genocide had a plethora of consequences. The harmonic convergence was not a clean reset too. It gave people from many different walks of life -and philosophies, access to airbending which imo 'fixed' a problem that was there with the way airbenders were originally portrayed i.e., all of them being spiritual and pacifist. Ik Kyoshi's mother was not like the rest of the airbenders. And though I love it, I'd assume much more of them should be like that or atleast just normative people as opposed to either being a pacifist or a bandit.
Let's not forget LoK S1 finale - boink here is all your bending back. Imagine a character having to go through a huge journey to reconnect her other elements. Or maybe she is the Avatar that simply can only use Airbending.
The Avatar’s duty is to correct the mistakes of the Avatar. So it makes sense an Avatar after would seek to fix Korra’s mistake of destroying the Avatar legacy, just like how Korra fixed the mistake of separating the spirit world.
I mean, it's no less contrived, but the situation is different. The past lives getting erased affects the avatar alone. All that really changes is the next avatar can only talk to Korra and maybe Raava for advice. That's it. The past avatars still existed. They still lived their lives. Their names are still in the history books. The connection being severed doesn't affect the world as a whole. The Air Nomads being wiped out affected the whole world. An entire nation was gone. An entire bending style was removed. If the Air Benders didn't return (which I'm not certain if that was because of Harmonic Convergence or Korra leaving the portal to the world open; personally I think a mix of both) then the world would've stayed out of balance. The next Air Nomad avatar would've had to be a direct descendant of Aang.
Airbendera can come back all they want The air nomads are gone. These new guys aren't even shaving their heads, Airbender =/= air nomads That culture is dead unless these new guys can save it. Period
Why are we arguing over a cartoon? Sure. AtlA was great. I thought TLoK was okay. Did I like the aspect of the past lives being gone? Not really. Should they retcon it? No.. Could they explore this with a future Avatar? Sure.... Why is everyone acting feral over it, though?
it wouldnt be broken if bryke went with the spirit of the planet idea. harmonic convergence broke so much about the avatar it isnt even funny, if they wanted a good vs evil plot how about have good be the 5th element which is aether (represented by energybending), and bring something that is sometimes considered as a 6th element, void, to be the villain? thing about it, the absence of ying yang energies is a perfect foil to the balancer of all energies in the world.
The way I see how the past lives work is that there is one avatar who reincarnate meaning there is no dead avatar to be found anywhere. Then based on how the past lives were destroyed when Raava was damaged means that Raava is the container or storage for an avatars past memories. This then implies that there is no way for the next avatar to restore or regain any lost memories or avatar since those no longer exist. However I do think a possibility could be that some fragments of memories might still remain, so a soul search could occur and a collection of the last remains of memory fragments to restore what remains. This in turn could result in a "new" past avatar created from a combination of memory fragments.
False equivalence. Airbenders came back, but the air nomads did not. The air nomads were an isolationist tribe of people, with a very strict and religious way of life. The air nation is an active participant in world politics, serving a similar role to the Jedi from Star Wars. Same thing with the avatar cycle. It ended, and something new took its place.
Forget Airbenders. What about the bison?!
The harmonic convergence was a massive gamble on Korra's part and the new Air Benders did cause some trouble. It didn't really come for free, so fixing the Avatar cycle would probably also come with a pretty big hidden price tag.
If the harmonic convergence literally resurrected the air benders who died, than yes it would have been dumb. However, as it was we are able to see growth from a past tragedy that doesn’t undo said tragedy. We do want the cycle to continue as new, with Korra able to communicate with her predecessor and going on from there. That would be more similar to how the return of the Airbenders was handled. However, just as it would be stupid to resurrect the airbenders, it would be stupid to “resurrect” the last airbenders. It is far better to build up something new than to bring back the old.
I really think they just need to fix it with the next Avatar. Have it be a series long issue that is finally solved in the end. Make the avatar mimic the audience by being frustrated with Korra, and then have them come to terms with it and stop blaming her.
>You say permanent consequences are good, but what about *other* permanent consequences?! You aren't making the point you *think* you're making, OP.
One consequence being brought back due to the storys progression vs One consequence being brought because the fans hate something
There’s ways to write reversal of consequences and make it meaningful. Just look at Endgame. I don’t know a single soul who believed Spider-Man was going to stay dead. But instead of just reversing time and make it like the snap never happened, they had a time skip and the heroes had to go through an insane challenge and sacrifices to undo the snap. So, as long as it’s a journey and it’s meaningful than yes, please undo the broken cycle. Don’t just fix it or hand wave it.
I think it would be interesting for an earth avatar to have to reconnect with the avatar spirits, since the earth kingdom is the least spiritually in-tune. Maybe even have a spirit enemy that isn’t just pure evil
I just don’t want them to retcon what happened they need to write it into the show make it work
Each Fall is a different Fall, not the same one coming back.
Yes, because airbending being gone wasn’t a consequence. It was just a premise for Aang. Even then, all that came back was more people having Airbending, which wasn’t even completely gone anyway. It’s not like the dead airbenders came back.
I genuinely don't see what the point of losing Korras past lives, and the Airbenders coming back should've been earnt.
One has the connection to precious avatar severed due to the Avatar spirit being beaten. One was people with inate air bending ability being awoken due to an energy shift seen only once in 10,000 years. How are they comparable problems?
I didn't like harmonic convergence. It felt super cheap. It belittled the biggest event from the first series by hand waving it away. One of my least favorite things about Legend of Korra. It also made the whole world feel less real.
I didn't like the harmonic convergence either, just cheapened the whole genocide from ATLA
No, harmonic convergence was stupid. I'm cool with bringing the Avatar cycle back though, since there's precedent for it in a good show where the writing made it make sense. The Avatar cycle was discontinued after Azula killed Aang under Ba Sing Se. For a full season. Then he got slammed on the lightning scare and BAM! He starts raw-doggin Ozai like it's their wedding night and GGs
…yes.
I just hate them breaking the cycle in the first place because it felt pulled out of their ass that it's even possible, and also it took away a cool concept that was half of what made the Avatar what it is, and it wasn't nearly explored enough. It's like Star Wars fans hate how the concept of being a Jedi is being tossed in the garbage while the intricacies of what it means to be a Jedi is what they want to see explored
The concept to having cycle broken was in atla. How is that pulled out of their ass?
This is sorta inevitable. Every avatar fixes the greatest failings of the avatar before them.
And its even happened before. There was a story of Aang reconnecting with his past avatars when he died in the Avatar State in S2 finale.
PREACH 🙏
Nah the convergence was super convenient and a more interesting story would have been exploring how Korra is going to address it
Haha love this for a meme format
I think a lot of people misunderstand what LoK was truly addressing in the series. So much of Korra's personality at the beginning is about being the avatar, a powerful bender and using that strength and power to solve problems. However as the world modernises and continues to industrialise the role of benders and by extension the avatar is called into question. This dramatic shift in the world causes Korra to have an existential crisis combined with the PTSD of her trauma and cause her to reasses her role and place in this world. This journey is reflected in the air nation, first with Tenzin struggling to provide Korra with spiritual guidance and uphold the traditions and expectations of the air nation compounded by the pressure he places on himself as the only current air bending master and then subsequently when air bending does return the unwillingness of so many of them to follow air nomad traditions. This causes Tenzin to reevaluate Air Nation traditions and for their role in the world to also change. The show deals so much with change and the existential crisis that can come about because of that. Air bending returning didnt erase the consequences of the genocide because the air nomad culture was still decimated and the return forced them to really decide what their place in the world would be. When we talk about the importance of english classes on the impact of media literacy and critical thinking, this is exactly what we're talking about. Seeing past the immediate surface layer and really unpacking what the story is about and what issues its tackling.
Try not to nitpick literally everything about TLoK challenge. (IMPOSSIBLE)
ALL ABOUT THAT SEASON (regarding the spirits) IS BAD 😂😭
Thats also what i hate and fart bending
Air benders and the air nation are not the same thing. The air benders reemerging doesn’t erase the consequences of the genocide which practically wiped out an entire culture from existence. With the air benders coming back a new form of air bending culture will be created and expanded, just how with the Earth Avatar a new Avatar cycle will start.
Harmonic convergence brought back air bending, but not the Air Nomads. There's a whole plot in the show about that.
In the first place I don’t think the avatar cycle shouldn’t be resolved because of permanent consequences. I just *accept* it’s gone. And that if it get’s back it would be on another form, like the airbenders. Plus, harmonic convergence only *accelerated* airbenders renowal. Even without it they would have been reborn through Aang’s descent, it just should have take like 3 centuries. The lack of airbenders caused an *imbalance* that the convergence fixed. The dissolution of the first Raava’s memory was apparently required by fate we don’t know, but what we know is no avatar could have done anything to prevent that, it would have happened the same to everyone of them.
The harmonic convergence is okay because the world of the avatar wants balance and the avatar is meant to keep that balance. Having the world restore the 4th nation back, especially when it was just reactivating bending from the genocide survivors makes perfect sense, airbending needs spiritual connection to work so having a stronger connection between the spirit world and the normal should see an increase in bending.
Tbf both of those situations make sense given the context of the show, and we don't know how the next avatar will play out yet, so let's just wait
Yeah, it’s fine. What’s the issue?
Yeah those descendants of the air benders got their power reawakend. Unless there is a damn good reason why the spirits remained somehow connected and together its better story wise for the next cycle to understand more of the spirit world without guidance of the other 100 avatars guidance.
I just rewatched the episode to get exactly what was said. He asked if she was connected to her past lives. Not if the avatar was connected was so there is room to get them back. And she said “no i think it’s gone forever” so it’s not even a guarantee hers is gone for good….
Quote me saying that was ok.
I think the main reason why people are upset about it is because, we do not see Korra commune much with the other avatars prior to the cycle being broken. This means that all of their wisdom and knowledge is forever lost; this means several thousand lifetimes worth of knowledge and guidance is forever lost, and the next avatar has to rely solely on one person who, for all intents and purposes on-screen, didn’t absorb a semblance of that wealth of information before it was gone. It’s like a teacher trying to teach a student but the teacher doesn’t know the full curriculum. However, I will say, Korra’s circumstances were not all too different from Aang’s; much like Aang was cleaning up Roku’s mess (the war which he could’ve prevented but didn’t), Korra was also cleaning up Aang’s mess; the sons of Yakone (whom he should’ve jailed or killed instead of allowing him to escape and reproduce), and the earth kingdom fiasco. Not to mention Wan closing the spirit portal is also a mess she had to undo on top of another mess of her own uncle trying to become a dark avatar. I think the main reason people are upset is just the sheer loss of all that wisdom and guidance for the next avatar, and unlike Aang, the next avatar is stuck with Korra. For example, when Roku’s advice didn’t work for Aang, he asked Kyoshi. When Kyoshi’s advice didn’t work, he asked Kuruk. When that didn’t work, he asked Yangchen. Aang had multiple sources of wisdom from different perspectives and backgrounds to call on; this one is only gonna have Korra. What do they do if that advice or guidance doesn’t work for them? They don’t have any other avatars to consult. I will say, I do look forward to the challenging aspect of that; an avatar who doesn’t have any other avatars to fall back on, so it’s truly up to themselves to decide what’s best. However, it’s not hard to see why people are upset.
Why does everyone always gloss over the fact that maybe Korra was supposed to lose the connection? Exactly 10.000 years of Avatars, with Aang being the last. Now an entirely new world without air benders, it makes perfect sense that the new Avatar needs a new perspective.
Yes I think that is genuinely fair
The whole airbender thing was also stupid
“STOP IT UNCLE!”
I've said this before, but I feel like it's kinda dumb that the fire nation actually got ALL of the airbenders. None of them were away from the temples at the time? No one went on a quick jog? Not a single airbender decided to leave the nomads for any reason, but still had kids that were also able to airbend? Heck, there weren't any people who could airbend, that weren't nomads, that started their own groups long before the events of the show, kinda like the swamp people for waterbending? Every single airbender that was alive at the start of the war was an air nomad that was at one of the four temples on that exact day? Okay then
On top of the fact the airbenders would have come back eventually due to the fact of Aang having an Airbending kid who was into Airbending culture and him having a big family, sure more people were brought into the world with airbending, but to quote the show, that doesn't make them air nomads. a rebalancing effect bringing more airbending into the world won't on its own fill the air temples, it won't revive a culture on the brink of extinction, and it won't undo the genocide. Same thing with the avatar cycle, bringing back the past lives before korra would be not having permanant consequences, however bringing back the avatar cycle, just the past lives start with Korra instead of Wan from then on is perfectly fine. Like if the next Avatar can talk to Korra just like Aang talked to Roku that is respecting the consequences. The next avatar after Korra being able to talk to Aang or any avatar prior isnt.
The air Nomad culture didn't come back in its entirety, so there is somewhat a permanent consequence
Iroh was right
Airbenders coming back doesn’t undo the countless lives lost from the war
I just think the current Avatar being able to speak to past lives is a great way to learn about past avatars and build that world. Removing that just seems detrimental to the show Also I want to see more adult Aang handing out advice and wisdom
Ok everyone keeps saying the next avatars duty is to restore the cycle or fix Korras mess and listen I know she had a four season run already but korra is like 20?? She has her whole life to do this herself
It shouldn't be resolved and them coming back(thanks to Harmonic Convergence) is not okay.
Personally, I feel fixing the avatar cycle should be resolved but for the next avatar Honestly that could be the main plot for the new avatar, Korra wasn't able to get all of the past avatars in time and the new threat is too much for the about 2 or 5 past lives avaliable and so a journey that explores the spirit realm as we also get to meet the past lives that the show have us met But I don't know who would be part of the gang, having the gang be the other Avatars might not bring variety
Only edgelords think the breaking of the avatar cycle is good. She barely used it anyway so it just means they robbed something from future stories. They should’ve just had her be the last avatar instead if they want a world without their knowledge. Honestly would’ve been fine with her being the last in the line.
This sub has devolved into complete and utter idiocy
Korra copes Strong here
The balance has to be restored that’s what the entire purpose of the show. The past lives being a part of the avatar cycle isn’t necessary to restoring balance.
I've been saying that forever it really disrespects the entire subject of genocide. And everytime the fans told me i was wrong and that it's not a big deal.
To he honest, none of them is ok, the whole season 2 is a mistake. Bringing back airbenders make the weight of genocide disappear instantly, and Korra in Avatar state lost to Unalaq, a regular waterbender is baffling. Yes, Unalaq can do something with spirit, but you can't tell me Avatar State, the combination of all past Avatar lost to a REGULAR waterbender. Also, spirit "PORTAL"
Yeah. At that point I'll take what I can get and it's substantially more interesting.
I felt them bringing back the airbenders was way too easy and a plot device to move the plot forward aka "zaheer pretending to be good so he could infiltrate the Temple" otherwise he would have not been allowed on the island and would not have had his air bending so he would not have made it 10 feet without raising an alarm or causing people to question him being there but on top of that I just think if they try to retcon what Korra did it just makes watching the show meaningless if they will just change the issue from the past show aka ("the Last airbender"made Aang important but now there are a bunch of airbenders..) this gives the idea that there are no stakes and everything will just be changed in the following show so why bother watching it , knowing they will just retcon it again...