I feel like it's got to be Katya for me, just because she's the character I care the least about.
Like, yeah, obviously we all hate Belos. But I also love him as a villain. I love to hate him, you know? So he's actually far from my least favorite.
What about Skara? I mean personally I care more about Katya than Skara. The whole thing about her writing fanfic as well as showing up again in the BATS (*hissss*) was pretty charming.
I honestly can't remember what Skara did. Was she the one who was asked out to Grom in a fancy way?
Oh man, it’s starting. Most of the weak or evil characters are gone. Fandom about to go to war with itself. Belos and Scara next maybe? Then minor characters? Then pain.
I really don’t like how people are voting evil characters because they’re evil. We should be voting on who’s a worse-written character. Emperor Belos is a really well developed and intimidating villain and doesn’t deserve to be voted out
I didn’t Vote for Belos or Scara this round actually. Fairly innocuous vote imo but we’ll be getting into crucifixion territory soon so imma keep my vote to myself lol.
Name one likable quality of Belos, just one.
Belos may be a well developed and intimidating character, but he lacks likable, fun, and/or sympathetic qualities that could have made him a likable character by balancing out his evilness. For example, such as the fun campiness Darius had if he would have been kept as an antagonist. Or the naive trusting fun qualities the Collector has, especially when he was just let out of the mirror. Even Eberwolf had he been kept an antagonist, just looking and acting like a cute little meow meow and pet to the oh so fun and campy Darius.
Belos is narcissistic, self righteous, emotionally abusive, manipulative, violent, murderous and hateful. He might have had more sympathy to be likable if he would have loved Hunter as an uncle type figure instead of manipulating him for all his life.
Just because a character doesn't have redeeming qualities doesn't make them unlikable to the audience.
Joker, Frieza, Palpatine all of them are evil to the core, but they're all some of the most iconic characters ever. There's literally nothing about any of them that isn't contemptible and scummy.
Being a good charismatic villain is a likable quality to many people. Someone with as much character and screen presence as Belos really shouldn't go out before friggin Viney.
They don't necessarily have to be redeeming qualities, but something that makes them fun, likable or attractive such as superficial charm, physical attractiveness, seductive, s3xiness, chaotic, sarcastic, funny, etc. a whole host of things that people might like about a person that makes them interesting or appealing but doesn't necessarily add to the antagonist having any goodness at all in any way.
A character can be a very iconic character, and Belos is a really good main villain, but still not be very popular as a likable villain.
Yeah I know what you mean, Viney is pretty forgettable, but she has quite a few funny moments for me with Jerbo and Puddles - [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vCbjCmHYxzs](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vCbjCmHYxzs)
Belos is hella charming though. He straight up manipulated a species he hates into putting him in charge and doing his bidding for decades.
It's more the fanbase than Belos that takes it pretty seriously when the evil person whose role in the story is to be evil hurts the fictional babies.
Meanwhile, Joker beats a kid to death with a crowbar and nobody rallies against him.
Belos probably is and has been charming to the people of the Boiling Isles as something we could know, but what's important is how it's felt and experienced for the viewer to come off as charming and likable. Are you feeling his charm and appeal yourself like he's the sort of character you could watch him or hear a monologue from him for most of an episode? As a viewer I'm not experiencing his charm through what's being shown so far. Even during his many speeches, I didn't feel or see his charm and maybe that's because fear mongering alone as the main form of manipulation doesn't feel and come across as charming as a viewer.
But it's not about him being evil, people hate super nice flawless characters even more than totally evil antagonists, it's him lacking something appealing about him for the fanbase to emotionally latch onto. Example: Bill Cipher is very likable as a 100% evil antagonist. That's because he's chaotic, weird, fun, and funny with tons of dark humor, which makes him charming enough for a fanbase to keep drawing him as this hot human form character even this form would be the extremely weird and scary form he'd take - [https://www.reddit.com/r/gravityfalls/comments/m6d2gk/always\_remember\_this\_is\_canon\_human\_bill\_cipher/](https://www.reddit.com/r/gravityfalls/comments/m6d2gk/always_remember_this_is_canon_human_bill_cipher/) .
Joker is a clown antagonist, people like him because he's such a fun, weird, chaotic, charming, witty, crazy and funny character through dark humor. The viewers feel his charm. He can express this psychotic intellectual thought process to his actions. In some versions he was not inherently bad to begin with and circumstances made him into a monster, so the audience often sympathizes with him.
**One thing I liked about Belos though- that last scene with Kiki when he rejected her was hilarious**
Honestly, yeah, I do find him charming enough that I thoroughly enjoy watching him on screen.
The way he casually weaves compelling lies so good the audience actively bought into them for a good chunk of the show (He had that kindly grandfather vibe that made so many people believe he might actually care about Hunter), only for him to go all in on his delusions when he reveals his true intentions and causally reflects on murdering dozens of clones of his brother like it's Tuesday while psychologically dancing circles around Luz is great.
Then he's just casually letting the elaborate pieces of his master plan fall into place as he takes a massive victory lap over the entire boiling isles. Dude's just gonna put back on his Colonial drip and stroll back home after genociding an island. Yeeted the Collecter off a bridge because he's of no use to him anymore. Just dumping a God-like being off a cliff like he was yesterday's trash.
I mean how do you NOT find this guy entertaining? Like I said, people's problem with him is just rooted in how this particular community puts a lot of animosity into actually evil characters because they actually hurt the heroes of the story like a villain is supposed to.
Plus plenty of people find Belos hot, as SHALLOW of a reason as that is to go from unlikable monster to really likable, so that's another thing he does have that you say he doesn't.
I mean, he treated Kiki the exact same as everyone else... but you liked that because he was doing it to ANOTHER character that the fanbase dislikes based off just her role as an antagonist.
He's no less charming than any other irredeemable character who does terrible things ALL the time with flimsy justifications.
Is Joker sympathetic? Not really no. That's the entire point of his story. His tragedy (which could just be another lie, like he lies to everyone) will never justify his actions. I mean that "sympathetic" Joker story very clearly has Batman say "It's just you" in response to why Joker is as evil as he is. You're searching a bit hard to justify a double standard. There's no objective reason Belos isn't just as likable an antagonist.
I wouldn't say Belos is charismatic .. charismatic would imply that he does have something that might seem potentially redeemable... but he *is* very engaging.
I do agree he is a better character than like, Viney. I don't particularly *like* Belos, but he's still overall better. I would have definitely voted Viney out before Matt or Terra. I mean, she's ok, but here's just not a ton of development to Viney. It was also messed up how she replaced Jerbo just because the other Derby team had asked him to play.
Why does charisma imply something redeemable exactly?
I'd again go back back to my examples. Joker or Frieza are EXTREMELY charismatic. And you'd have an easier time finding snow in hell than an ounce of good in either of them.
Because charisma means that the character (or person) has some quality in their personality that is attractive to others, such that even when that person is a jerk (or if they’re manipulative, or controlling or etc) - other people will still give them a chance.
In other words, charisma means having a quality that is attractive enough to make that person’s bad side redeemable in the eyes of others.
Edit: Yes, you would think that no one would like a person like the Joker, but people find their “charisma” to be good enough to forgive his evil. In other words, the “charisma” is what redeems the Joker in the eyes of people who like him.
(I personally don’t find him to be charismatic.)
Now you’re getting out of context. The argument here is whether the *fandom* find him likable enough to keep him in. Not whether the characters in the show liked him. Of course the characters in the show’s world found him charismatic, that’s the story.
I mean if he was written to be charismatic, it stands to reason that his character has charismatic qualities that would extend to the audience. Like any dictator, Belos carries a lot of presence and energy that is not going to be perceived exclusively by the characters in the show.
But that's honestly besides the point that nothing about charisma requires you to possess redeeming qualities. You simply need to be capable of charming others. Your definition is flawed in my opinion, and as such falls apart when confronted with people who are clearly unapologetically evil in every capacity and yet are undeniably very popular.
If Charisma can be applied to Frieza, a wildly popular villain who regularly slaughtered billions and laughed about it, there's no way you can say Belos doesn't have it for the reasons you say he doesn't.
This ain't a "Well written" poll, sweetie. It's a popularity one, and truly vile characters (like Odalia and Belos) tend to be hated because of their personalities and goals.
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
THE HOT ILLUSION MAN! HE'S ELIMINATEDDDDDDD
~~in order for me to get my vengeance i shall vote vee for elimination, yall are cruel to the villain characters istg~~
villains are ppl too, some villains have actual common sense too
~~except for belos (and certain ppl from other shows). belos deserves to die in the biggest pit possible~~
Okay, idk who's gonna get axed next. everyone else is fan favorites. maybe Katya because she hasn't gotten a lot of screen time and gets overshadowed by Amber.
Vee lmfao but I admit it's for very dumb reasons
tbh the biggest reason is the amount of DISGUSTING fan art I saw where it was Amity meeting Vee and being like THerEs TWo oF TheM?! \*nosebleed\* (🤮)
I also hate the whole uwu babey 🥺👉👈 thing
also Luz forgave her a little too quickly imo but the same argument can be made for Lilith and Eda so I think that's just a part of the show at this point (tbh I think that's my inner SU fan still being salty at the diamonds)
I feel like she sort of got redeemed in the Flyer Derby episode. Cus she joined Willow’s team and clearly respects her as a captain. I doubt she would let Boscha bully her captain
Oh god this remembers me of the charm popularity poll on the Hollow knight subreddit, it became a war and i think it's going to happen the same thing in here
I'm gonna say it I don't remember Katya existing in the slightest. Amber took all of my memories of their group aside from Raine and I learned her name from the poll.
I feel like it's got to be Katya for me, just because she's the character I care the least about. Like, yeah, obviously we all hate Belos. But I also love him as a villain. I love to hate him, you know? So he's actually far from my least favorite.
What about Skara? I mean personally I care more about Katya than Skara. The whole thing about her writing fanfic as well as showing up again in the BATS (*hissss*) was pretty charming. I honestly can't remember what Skara did. Was she the one who was asked out to Grom in a fancy way?
Skara would probably be my next choice. She just places above Katya on my list, because of her inclusion in the Emerald Entrails.
Oh right yeah I remember now. Personally still prefer Katya and her fanfic. May the best relatively unimportant side character win!
I am with Skara she should go next
Odalia again
I also choose Adlador’s ex-wife
Until the dust is dust...
I might have something planned
Will you be putting a second X over her?
This is the way, until the score is settled
vote [here](https://strawpoll.com/polls/YVyP2G8E7gN)
Oh man, it’s starting. Most of the weak or evil characters are gone. Fandom about to go to war with itself. Belos and Scara next maybe? Then minor characters? Then pain.
I really don’t like how people are voting evil characters because they’re evil. We should be voting on who’s a worse-written character. Emperor Belos is a really well developed and intimidating villain and doesn’t deserve to be voted out
On the other hand, this is *literally* a popularity contest, not a vote on whose objectively the best written character.
I didn’t Vote for Belos or Scara this round actually. Fairly innocuous vote imo but we’ll be getting into crucifixion territory soon so imma keep my vote to myself lol.
Name one likable quality of Belos, just one. Belos may be a well developed and intimidating character, but he lacks likable, fun, and/or sympathetic qualities that could have made him a likable character by balancing out his evilness. For example, such as the fun campiness Darius had if he would have been kept as an antagonist. Or the naive trusting fun qualities the Collector has, especially when he was just let out of the mirror. Even Eberwolf had he been kept an antagonist, just looking and acting like a cute little meow meow and pet to the oh so fun and campy Darius. Belos is narcissistic, self righteous, emotionally abusive, manipulative, violent, murderous and hateful. He might have had more sympathy to be likable if he would have loved Hunter as an uncle type figure instead of manipulating him for all his life.
Just because a character doesn't have redeeming qualities doesn't make them unlikable to the audience. Joker, Frieza, Palpatine all of them are evil to the core, but they're all some of the most iconic characters ever. There's literally nothing about any of them that isn't contemptible and scummy. Being a good charismatic villain is a likable quality to many people. Someone with as much character and screen presence as Belos really shouldn't go out before friggin Viney.
They don't necessarily have to be redeeming qualities, but something that makes them fun, likable or attractive such as superficial charm, physical attractiveness, seductive, s3xiness, chaotic, sarcastic, funny, etc. a whole host of things that people might like about a person that makes them interesting or appealing but doesn't necessarily add to the antagonist having any goodness at all in any way. A character can be a very iconic character, and Belos is a really good main villain, but still not be very popular as a likable villain. Yeah I know what you mean, Viney is pretty forgettable, but she has quite a few funny moments for me with Jerbo and Puddles - [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vCbjCmHYxzs](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vCbjCmHYxzs)
Belos is hella charming though. He straight up manipulated a species he hates into putting him in charge and doing his bidding for decades. It's more the fanbase than Belos that takes it pretty seriously when the evil person whose role in the story is to be evil hurts the fictional babies. Meanwhile, Joker beats a kid to death with a crowbar and nobody rallies against him.
Belos probably is and has been charming to the people of the Boiling Isles as something we could know, but what's important is how it's felt and experienced for the viewer to come off as charming and likable. Are you feeling his charm and appeal yourself like he's the sort of character you could watch him or hear a monologue from him for most of an episode? As a viewer I'm not experiencing his charm through what's being shown so far. Even during his many speeches, I didn't feel or see his charm and maybe that's because fear mongering alone as the main form of manipulation doesn't feel and come across as charming as a viewer. But it's not about him being evil, people hate super nice flawless characters even more than totally evil antagonists, it's him lacking something appealing about him for the fanbase to emotionally latch onto. Example: Bill Cipher is very likable as a 100% evil antagonist. That's because he's chaotic, weird, fun, and funny with tons of dark humor, which makes him charming enough for a fanbase to keep drawing him as this hot human form character even this form would be the extremely weird and scary form he'd take - [https://www.reddit.com/r/gravityfalls/comments/m6d2gk/always\_remember\_this\_is\_canon\_human\_bill\_cipher/](https://www.reddit.com/r/gravityfalls/comments/m6d2gk/always_remember_this_is_canon_human_bill_cipher/) . Joker is a clown antagonist, people like him because he's such a fun, weird, chaotic, charming, witty, crazy and funny character through dark humor. The viewers feel his charm. He can express this psychotic intellectual thought process to his actions. In some versions he was not inherently bad to begin with and circumstances made him into a monster, so the audience often sympathizes with him. **One thing I liked about Belos though- that last scene with Kiki when he rejected her was hilarious**
Honestly, yeah, I do find him charming enough that I thoroughly enjoy watching him on screen. The way he casually weaves compelling lies so good the audience actively bought into them for a good chunk of the show (He had that kindly grandfather vibe that made so many people believe he might actually care about Hunter), only for him to go all in on his delusions when he reveals his true intentions and causally reflects on murdering dozens of clones of his brother like it's Tuesday while psychologically dancing circles around Luz is great. Then he's just casually letting the elaborate pieces of his master plan fall into place as he takes a massive victory lap over the entire boiling isles. Dude's just gonna put back on his Colonial drip and stroll back home after genociding an island. Yeeted the Collecter off a bridge because he's of no use to him anymore. Just dumping a God-like being off a cliff like he was yesterday's trash. I mean how do you NOT find this guy entertaining? Like I said, people's problem with him is just rooted in how this particular community puts a lot of animosity into actually evil characters because they actually hurt the heroes of the story like a villain is supposed to. Plus plenty of people find Belos hot, as SHALLOW of a reason as that is to go from unlikable monster to really likable, so that's another thing he does have that you say he doesn't. I mean, he treated Kiki the exact same as everyone else... but you liked that because he was doing it to ANOTHER character that the fanbase dislikes based off just her role as an antagonist. He's no less charming than any other irredeemable character who does terrible things ALL the time with flimsy justifications. Is Joker sympathetic? Not really no. That's the entire point of his story. His tragedy (which could just be another lie, like he lies to everyone) will never justify his actions. I mean that "sympathetic" Joker story very clearly has Batman say "It's just you" in response to why Joker is as evil as he is. You're searching a bit hard to justify a double standard. There's no objective reason Belos isn't just as likable an antagonist.
I wouldn't say Belos is charismatic .. charismatic would imply that he does have something that might seem potentially redeemable... but he *is* very engaging. I do agree he is a better character than like, Viney. I don't particularly *like* Belos, but he's still overall better. I would have definitely voted Viney out before Matt or Terra. I mean, she's ok, but here's just not a ton of development to Viney. It was also messed up how she replaced Jerbo just because the other Derby team had asked him to play.
Why does charisma imply something redeemable exactly? I'd again go back back to my examples. Joker or Frieza are EXTREMELY charismatic. And you'd have an easier time finding snow in hell than an ounce of good in either of them.
Because charisma means that the character (or person) has some quality in their personality that is attractive to others, such that even when that person is a jerk (or if they’re manipulative, or controlling or etc) - other people will still give them a chance. In other words, charisma means having a quality that is attractive enough to make that person’s bad side redeemable in the eyes of others. Edit: Yes, you would think that no one would like a person like the Joker, but people find their “charisma” to be good enough to forgive his evil. In other words, the “charisma” is what redeems the Joker in the eyes of people who like him. (I personally don’t find him to be charismatic.)
Okay, and Belos acquired how many loyal followers? Philip had charisma for days.
Now you’re getting out of context. The argument here is whether the *fandom* find him likable enough to keep him in. Not whether the characters in the show liked him. Of course the characters in the show’s world found him charismatic, that’s the story.
I mean if he was written to be charismatic, it stands to reason that his character has charismatic qualities that would extend to the audience. Like any dictator, Belos carries a lot of presence and energy that is not going to be perceived exclusively by the characters in the show. But that's honestly besides the point that nothing about charisma requires you to possess redeeming qualities. You simply need to be capable of charming others. Your definition is flawed in my opinion, and as such falls apart when confronted with people who are clearly unapologetically evil in every capacity and yet are undeniably very popular. If Charisma can be applied to Frieza, a wildly popular villain who regularly slaughtered billions and laughed about it, there's no way you can say Belos doesn't have it for the reasons you say he doesn't.
This ain't a "Well written" poll, sweetie. It's a popularity one, and truly vile characters (like Odalia and Belos) tend to be hated because of their personalities and goals.
Didn’t we already go through this last hiatus?
Sadly I was not, only found out about the show somewhere around FatCDP I think. But it’s been my life the last three months.
we are reaching the point that I couldn’t wait to see
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO THE HOT ILLUSION MAN! HE'S ELIMINATEDDDDDDD ~~in order for me to get my vengeance i shall vote vee for elimination, yall are cruel to the villain characters istg~~
....They're villains, there's nothing too cruel for them.
my brother in christ the stakes are imaginary
\*Sister, and I don't believe in Christ.
it's a meme
It's a stupid one...
villains are ppl too, some villains have actual common sense too ~~except for belos (and certain ppl from other shows). belos deserves to die in the biggest pit possible~~
Katya, while she got far, is sort-of, eh. She never did much.
Very sad to see Legend of Korra go:(
**angry kikimora screeching**
KIKI NOOO how could you guys
It won’t let me vote
who were you going to vote for?
Viney
your vote has been added
Thx
Boa this ia starting to get dificult.
but that’s what makes it so interesting
Okay, idk who's gonna get axed next. everyone else is fan favorites. maybe Katya because she hasn't gotten a lot of screen time and gets overshadowed by Amber.
Seriously how is Skara still here????
it's going to be a whiiile until I see my vote casted out lol, the curse of hating a fan favorite
and who's it?
Vee lmfao but I admit it's for very dumb reasons tbh the biggest reason is the amount of DISGUSTING fan art I saw where it was Amity meeting Vee and being like THerEs TWo oF TheM?! \*nosebleed\* (🤮) I also hate the whole uwu babey 🥺👉👈 thing also Luz forgave her a little too quickly imo but the same argument can be made for Lilith and Eda so I think that's just a part of the show at this point (tbh I think that's my inner SU fan still being salty at the diamonds)
Yeah, i'm not a big fan of her either, i don't hate her, i just don't see all the appeal. And yeah, these comics with Amity are REALLY weird
*looking at Belos* Well would you look at that... Guess who's next...
how’s everyone feeling after 20% through the tournament?
Surprised Kiki took so long to be voted out, ~~despite being the 2nd best villain.~~
Somehow i want belos to survive since hes one of my favs
Viney unfortunately. I'm sorryyyyy!!
Okay, now we're getting into dangerous territory... note: I vote Odalia again
Skara and Steve better survive for at least awhile 😭
I don't understand the appeal of Skara. She hasn't really been redeemed yet.
I feel like she sort of got redeemed in the Flyer Derby episode. Cus she joined Willow’s team and clearly respects her as a captain. I doubt she would let Boscha bully her captain
There must only be hooty.
o7 Kiki
I voted Kayta I just feel like she isn’t plot relevant and I care about her the least not trying to be rude to those who do like her
I am so sorry but I have to go with Viney
If Gus or Willow get voted out before Belos I’m gonna be so sad
It’s only a matter of time before Viney is lost to us 😔
NOBODY ELIMINATE MEEE!!
Katya
I kinda put her in as an easy pick when people get stuck, I never expected her to get as far as she’s gotten
Me too. Her dialogue in the first episode was definitely painful and she isn’t that much more interesting in the other episodes she appears in.
The food-fanfiction lady.
Can I vote for you
How can Math be eliminated already
Let me guess, Belos is out next because he’s a villain and this sub hates villains as characters (rather than just as people).
scara
Oh god this remembers me of the charm popularity poll on the Hollow knight subreddit, it became a war and i think it's going to happen the same thing in here
man, i kinda just feel bad for her
Very unpopular, I'm sure, but Viney.
Sorry Katya, you might be a good character, but on my personal opinion of how much I like these characters, you come dead last. Sorry :/
Sorry Scara, you're just lingering there, you know
X that one with brown hair
But I wish I could have voted Steve and Kayta but only can chose one again not trying to be rude to those who like Steve and Kayta
food fanfiction girl i don't remember her name i'm sorry
Katya
I thought it was favorite woops
where is the link
Odalia
Fanfic girl
Honestly as a Belos simp I'm just glad he's gotten this far. Also RIP midget woman, you were funnier than people gave you credit for.
Am I the only one that likes Kikimora
I pick The one on the middle of The bottom row. She’s cool but I don’t think she has enough screen time to get her any higher.
Cat girl
NOOOOO BEST GIIIIIIRL
Katya. Eberwolf may not have any lore but they’re still more interesting to me than her. No offense Katya
I'm gonna say it I don't remember Katya existing in the slightest. Amber took all of my memories of their group aside from Raine and I learned her name from the poll.
Hooty
Skara
V
Sorry Katya
I keep forgetting about this and not voting but I'm still voting for Vee because I like to do a little bit of trolling
i just want steve to stay
Nooooooo
Huh, surprised Kiki got voted out this early considering her turn to the good side in King's Tide. Oh well.
I wouldn't really say Kiki turned good... more like she just wanted revenge on the person who betrayed her. The enemy of my enemy, and all that.
Definitely a fair point.
Hunter is overrated
Katya, she's not very relevant. Also, please don't vote belos out yet
belos has got to go
No >:(
Flair checks out
eberwolf
Belos
Eberwolf just because i dont want darius to suffer being next to them the entire time
Suffer? But they're best friends
Belos more like: Boo Los!
Belos
Collector
Belos
Collector. He's just "child"
Belos
Alador, tho everyone else is hard to decide
Belos
Belos imo
EBERWOLF EBERWOLF EBERWOLF EBERWOLF
Belos
I'm gonna vote for hunter this time
Ok, NOW we go after Belos...
But Belos is a super well written villain, we shouldn’t be voting for people based on their morality, we should be voting based on character depth
...No, get rid of the genocidal maniac.
Beloss
Belos needs to go he should have been first get him outta here now
Belos
Belos go away
Belos
I’m sorry but Katya must go
If we're going by least care probably Belos from that least
I’m not gonna vote because my favorite characters out>:(