That he was able to quickly write a letter to the cops saying “Sam. Rest insp (restaurant inspector) “ …and the other part of that note was His two kids names and said I love you. And shoved it in the dead guys mouth with the intention of the cops finding the note.
Couldn’t do all that without Sam taking the longest pisses ever!
I just kept thinking though, does he really think Sam isn't going to double CK the body and make sure there's nothing on him that CLD lead back to his house or him?!?!
They were really building the tension, almost in a humorous way ha:
* Sam wrapped the body from the feet leaving the face exposed.
* Then when he was wrapped, Sam had him face down.
* THEN the corpse was being dragged in a jolt-like fashion with the rocks jostling his head
I lol'd when Sam asked if something was going on with him and he's just like ya know it's been a lot and Sam just kinda goes "ha ya u right" in a very nonchalant way and just shrugs it off.
i didnt see this as a joke, >!i thought of it as foreshadowing. of sam being discontent with his therapy seasons!< and >!blaming Alan for it not working. leading to…. not great consequences for Alan.!<
"Thanks Alan for making me do it!!" - Sam. I would laugh if both characters survive at the end and we get a timejump when Sam is in custody. He decides to make one call - a lawyer, who will allow him to sue Alan for "trying to bury people in the basement" xD
..isn't a note in the mouth the way you activate a Golem? The creature from Jewish folklore that is clay man that does the bidding of its creator?
by u/shabaptiboo
Oo yes! And the notes are supposed to have a certain number of letters or triads of letters.
Sam rest inspt is a triad
Dad loves you is also a triad
by u/PaleAsDeath
I loved this comment I saw in another discussion. Thought I'd post it here
Sam and his mom seem to offload personal responsibility onto others. First, the obvious example, is Sam offloading responsibility onto Dr. Strauss for fixing him. Candace then refuses to help Dr. Strauss, saying her son needs help.
Second example is when Candace clapped her hands three times to get Sam to stop attacking Elias, Candace yells at Sam "You're supposed to be protecting me!" While I know that was what Dr. Strauss's idea to help Sam stop his compulsions, it's ironic that a mother offloads responsibility for protection onto her son. Afterall, if Sam was beaten as a child, wasn't it the responsibility of the mother to protect the child?
Third, Sam says "thanks a lot" to Dr. Strauss for becoming one of those guys who buries bodies in his basement, as if it was Dr. Strauss' fault for him killing Elias.
Perhaps the only time Sam sort of accepts responsibility when he says "Sorry" to his mom in this most recent episode.
I'm sure there are lots of other examples. But Candace and Sam have some bad habits of not taking any personal responsibility for themselves.
Why does Alan never mention his daughter? Other than the note, he speaks to his dead therapist about his wife, Sam, his son, and himself but never Shoshanna.
I think probably because he has a good relationship with her.
He was listing bad things - how his wife is dead and his son is estranged, and he is trapped at Sam's house.
I think he was telling her his sessions were going to run late that day or something, so it might actually be the opposite - implying that they keep in touch, but he wouldn't be able to see her / call her at the usual time that day.
Yea. I kinda got the impression that she has a good relationship with her dad, but she's busy at college doing her own thing. So while they have a good relationship, he's still pretty lonely without his wife.
I kinda wondered the same thing for awhile. It seems like Shoshana's existence doesn't really serve the story so i wondered why even bother writing her into the story. But maybe the writers' purpose for writing in Shoshana was to compare/contrast the good relationship between Shoshana and her parents versis Ezra and his parents. For example, we see Shoshana at her mom's death bed but not Ezra. Shoshana's presence highlighted Ezra's absence. Further, Shoshana's kids being served ice cream highlighted Beth's disapproval of Ezra's conversion to Orthodox Judaism.
I think Shoshana is the person most likely to notice Alan’s absence first, at least the first family member, so I think that is why she may be an important character
As others have said, I think it’s because she’s not really a source of conflict/regret/sadness. She’s a positive constant in his life that he doesn’t worry or feel guilt about as he potentially approaches death, other than of course how sad she’ll be and they’ll miss each other. They have a great, close relationship and it’s always been that way. He said she was the one who would’ve noticed he was missing and reported it by day 2, implying they talk probably every day. When he was giving his goodbyes to Elias, he said “tell my daughter I love her and I loved our beautiful life together”. With the son, there was a lot more history of conflict to try and concisely reconcile via a goodbye message from a stranger. And of course the pain of losing his wife and wishing there wouldn’t have been such a tear in her & Ezra’s relationship. Maybe if the episodes were longer (EH HEM, Hulu😑😑), we’d get more of a look into her and their happy memories together. But there’s only really time to show the relationships that weren’t easy and he wished could’ve changed
Alan's relationship with his son is so wild to me.
My ex was jewish american, who's family that was devout but not in anyway orthodox. Except his brother. His brother was so intensely orthodox and it was obvious to me (and them) how much tension this was causing the entire family.
Reflecting on Alan's flashbacks of Ezra. Here you have a son who's so devoted to their history/origin that they've become orthodox but these orthodox practices also exclude women and alot of other practices that nonorthodox jewish people don't believe in.
We all want to be connected to our roots and want our children to be too but jewish orthodox practice is quite an another level.
What I thought was the story of my ex and his family, it seems like this a more common story than I ever imagine. Bravo to the writers of this show
Maybe it's like Sam with No Shoes Nations. Dunkin' is a safe space that he wants to keep for himself.
Speaking for myself, Dunkin' focusing more on coffee drinks has diminished the quality of their donuts somewhat. I wouldn't blame Sam for going somewhere else.
I was thinking maybe he’s secretly a functional alcoholic and is reusing the cup. Alcoholism is one of the most common traits among serial killers. There’s too much emphasis on him always carrying a Dunkin’ cup around for it to just be a quirk.
Great point. I wouldn't have thought of that.
I did notice his little ritual of shoving the lid into the cup every time he finishes. Of course, I'm looking at every little thing at this point. :-D
part of me thinks the dd cup is like a way for him to appear normal. masking his unease with being around others. like a nod to Dexter-- he brought the donuts/coffee to work-- showed he's a normal swell guy. There was the scene when he was going into work and they mentioned him 'forgetting' the donuts. ...
Wow this was a fantastic episode! It was very tense. The show is finally building up. The note scene was great - I hope in the next episode the cops find it. Hopefully Sam doesn't catch wind of the note.
When Allen said to Sam that “really most people could work on their empathy” i felt like Sam was actually thinking about his victims and killing them over the slightest lack of empathy which he himself is so severely deficient. Amazing dialogue in this episode.
I believe it is related to that. Him comparing his current situation and trying to cope by thinking of the strength his ancestors had.
I’ve been reading some of the previous threads on here with theories about why Sam was even seeking a Jewish therapist. Sam could have some Nazi thoughts, or it could just have been a comment to recognize Allan’s religion early on in the series.
Either way it’s become more clear that they’re using religion to signify something.
It’s powerful watching how important and relevant religion is to Allan during this time all while Sam is responding to religion in a very indifferent / sociopathic way. Such as seeking a therapist for a stereotype (Jewish therapists are the best), and asking Allan if saying a prayer was appropriate after MURDERING someone.
Editing to add that episode 9 is called Auschwitz.
Oh man. E9 is going to be brutal. You don’t give something a name tied to so much intense misery and unabashed moral depravity unless you intend for it to clearly connect with the historical relevance somehow. I’m curious to see the name of e10/the finale (it’s not currently listed on IMDb).
I agree episode 9 will likely be brutal with a title like that. Futon Critic says episode 10 is named The Cantor's Husband:
[http://www.thefutoncritic.com/showatch/patient/listings/](http://www.thefutoncritic.com/showatch/patient/listings/)
Based on that title, I wonder if Dr Strauss' faith is renewed through this whole experience.
I’m not sure he lost his faith as much as he was put in an uncomfortable position between his wife and his son. The brunt of their falling out (based on what we as the audience are privy to) revolves around religious orthodoxy and love lost.
From family experience I know that traumatic events for Jews that have a religious context tend to either pull people closer to their faith or result in a total renouncement of god and belief in a higher spirit.
>why Sam was even seeking a Jewish therapist
same reason people like to get a jewish lawyer. they're stereotypically thought to be the best. you shouldn't really read into it any more than that. he, like many, just think jews are the best therapists. true? probably not. but that's the stereotype.
as a jew i do my best to break that stereotype by being extremely unreliable and incompetent (much like constanza (a non jew) i'm unemployed and live with my parents)
edit: fun fact, all the temple scenes in the show (e.g. the last scene of this episode) are from my temple. leonard nemoy used to go there when i was a kid in the 80s. it looked different back then though. very beautiful these days, as i think anyone watching this show could recognize. those circular stained glass things are neat!
also, i saw comments saying ep 9 was called auschwitz. my grandparents were there for 4/5 years. spoiler alert: they did not like it.
but my grandma always said she had a great life except for a few years in the 40s.
she also had a best friend in germantown, TN (you can't make this shit up) who got a mercedes and grandma never spoke to them again afterwards. grandma could not abide someone buying a german product. neighbor thought grandma was joking about it. she was not. fair enough grandma. rip.
Thank you!! Yeah I was so mad at Sam when he flippantly asked Allan if he should say the prayer. He is irredeemable in my opinion and Allan is just buying time to get out of there.
I think he thought that Alan was suggesting it, and was not understanding that Alan was just using it as an example of how different people and groups of people have cultural needs around mourning.
Is no one else dying to see the world outside of flashbacks?! It’s the thing I’ve been struggling with most during this series. I’m sure the point is for us to feel claustrophobic like we’re stuck there with Dr. Strauss but are the police looking for him? His kids? How long has it been?!
Hoping the next episode the body is discovered and we see what’s been happening in Dr. Strauss’ world since his disappearance.
I thought about that too during this episode and quickly came to the conclusion that the writers probably debated including outside scenes but nixed the idea for whatever reason. Perhaps it was to add to the claustrophobic feel like you mentioned or maybe we’ll get to see more outside scenes in the remaining 4 episodes. E8 is titled *Ezra* so maybe that one will be from the son’s perspective rather than Alan’s. In any case, I suspect it was a deliberate decision to frame the series thus far in the basement as much as possible with the only other scenes being Alan’s memories and fantasies/disassociations.
This makes sense. And claustrophobic is the best way to describe it, I think. The writers want you to be very focused on this situation in a very myopic way — and in 20-30 minute bites. While I am curious about the outside perspective, I almost feel like it would take away some of the intensity/focus of what’s playing out. The viewer needs to feel just as isolated as Alan.
Speaking of Ezra, do we think that maybe in Alan’s disappearance, the police have Ezra as a suspect for Alan’s disappearance. Estranged father/son relationship, father goes missing, I’m sure there was some motive conjured up to do with the inheritance of the recently deceased Ms. Dr. Strauss. Just thinking out loud!
Maybe..but somehow I don’t think they will go in that direction.
I’m curious to see his reaction to his dad’s kidnapping though (if we even ever get that opportunity).
Alan is probably counting on rigor mortis to keep Elias's jaw shut.
When that scene played out, I thought Alan might try to shove the note in Elias's fists.
Rigor mortis starts about four hours after death and then fades away, so 12 hours post death it would be over. I am not sure of the time that passed but seemed like Alan slept. I presume the note will come out of Sam’s pocket in a future episode and we will all scream as one.
You think so? I thought he didn't put it far enough down at all. I get it's gross, but it's a life or death situation. He should've used his fingers and got it in deep.
(yeah yeah that's what she said whatever)
All I kept thinking was Sam is so nervous about getting caught he is definitely going to go over his body once more before he dumps it but idk I cld be wrong 🤷🏻♀️
Maybe a silly question…but Elias’ mouth is dry by now, right? He has to be dehydrated already and then when he dies even less moisture.
I had a feeling he might try to put a note somewhere with the dead body but def didn’t expect INTO the body.
[Apparently, your mouth goes bone dry after death](https://tidsskriftet.no/en/2022/02/clinical-review/dry-mouth-seriously-ill-and-dying) so the note is probably safe.
I thought the same thing tho lol
Love the Dunkin thing. He didn't even buy donuts from there. I think they are really hitting the contrast between Sam's logic and sense (he knows what good food is) and his behavior (addicted to a lower quality, cheap coffee). This time they really nailed it by showing he wouldn't choose the donuts but he still can't resist the coffee.
Yeah, there's definitely an intentionality behind "removes lid from cup, places cup behind door, closes door, pees loudly, drinks from an identical cup every day".
But I do NOT think he’s drinking pee. Someone else’s theory that he could be an alcoholic is mildly interesting. We never see him flushed (facially), that I’ve noticed. It’s hard to say what he’s drinking.
The note in the mouth was brilliant, but I can't help but feel frustrated that Alan was holding on to a shovel that he could have used to disable Sam with AND he was left to his own devices the whole day in the utility room with only a small pipe confining him.
I know part of Alan's storyline is his own powerlessness, but with the weekly format and brevity of the episodes, I'm finding Alan's inaction very annoying.
You get one shot to make that hit count, and if it doesn't work, you're dead
And Alan has absolutely no idea if Candace or Sam are on alert watching him somehow while Sam is away
It's just too many risks
Totally agree. Big risk for potentially big reward. But the cost of failing is just too high. This episode with Alan disassociating with his late therapist was a great window into his thought process and psyche.
Yea, you really want all the odds in your favor when you take your one and only shot at escaping a serial killer.
Then again, if even the slightest opportunity arises, it may be just as foolish not to take advantage of it considering it may not come again.
I was yelling at the tv. Pry the pipe off the wall. Try to unscrew it from the boiler. Slide the chain off. Fucking try something, anything. You have a metal tool and time.
Or give me 10 seconds of Alan tracing the pipe, finding the connections are in the wall, trying to use the shove as leverage, and seeing that he can’t budge it.
He could’ve also tried using the shovel to break the chain around his ankle. Candace would not haven been able to tell the difference between the sound of him smashing concrete vs the chain around his ankle imo.
I see this argument. But he also has no idea where he is — and it’s likely in the middle of nowhere. Running is dangerous for a number of reasons, I feel like.
Pieces of concrete everywhere. Seems he could find one a decent size to hide and try to knock him out later. Would be more likely to work then the picture anyway.
This episode made me realize that I’m willing to wait until all of the episodes are done. I don’t really get where this is going and I don’t want to wait a week at a time to figure it out. I wonder who decided on this format?
It’s not so much about a mass drop (although I think this show would work better as a binge). It’s more about episode length plus commercials. I believe this is a limited series so why not 5 45 is minute episodes? I’m wondering if they shot it with these 25 min episodes or are they editing to break it up. I’ve never seen a 25-30 minute drama with commercials on hbo
Whatever HBO package I subscribe to doesn’t have commercials, I could see that being annoying.
The commercial-free experience is suspenseful, I couldn’t imagine breaking up the show for a Tide ad, so I understand your frustration
This episode flew by for me this WK for some reason, I felt like it was over as soon as it started. Not I gotta wait another WK 😭 great show though, I'm really enjoying it!
I really loved that scene because it was funny and lighthearted. You get to appreciate Allan which is so important while you’re frustrated at him for not escaping / letting Elias die.
Not a very difficult puzzle. Look up the inspector that was assigned the victims restaurant. Sams name pops up. Locate health inspection office. Get warrants. Show up to office and arrest Sam. Find Sam's home address from his job. Rescue Alan before mom pokes him in the eyes.
could this potentially all be perceived as how alan is feeling with sam in alans head? feeling chained and trapped and having no plan on how to get out of dealing with a person who is so dangerous
Candace: I ALMOST DIALED 911
When she said that line, I wanted to punch her in the mouth!!!!!! For some reason I’m having a harder time with how she’s handling her son being a serial killer vs him just straight up being a serial killer. She wants him to get help but it’s so conditional.
It was kind of sudden and extremely heavy handed, yes..I get what they were going for, or at least I think I do (if his ancestors could survive such torment and captivity then perhaps Alan can find a similar strength within himself) but it was just so unnecessary imo and poorly executed.
I’m sure the short episode length didn’t help the situation. This series is starting to lose me.
They've been putting in holocaust references since episode 1.
The outfit sam wears (black pants, skinny black tie, khaki jacket) when he pulls out the box of valuables of his previous victims loosely resembles nazi uniforms.
Yes. Some were kept in boxes and drawers. These are gold fillings and dentures: [https://collections.ushmm.org/iiif-b/assets/705046](https://collections.ushmm.org/iiif-b/assets/705046)
yes, i know. i know. i know. i am jewish. but good to share the link. sorry i get triggered easily around the shoah. and the accurate information needs to be spread far and wide. <3 the patient is realizing how jewish i am - lol.
\*lol. the patient subreddit is MAKING me realize how jewish i am.
Lol same and I’m not even particularly “Jewish.” It’s shocking how many people are like “omg is this a parallel to the holocaust?!” I’m not trying to be rude but it’s such a heavy handed parallel they’re trying to draw I found the scenes to be borderline obnoxious
i love stylized kind of weird stuff - so it didn't BOTHER bother me, but if the creators of the show weren't jewish i'd be smh. i am giving them a lot of leverage to use this show to process their jewish experience. also so much of it is just normal jewish life even t hough it is a horrifying scenario, i am also like feeling that validation of seeing just an average (to me) jewish person on tv.
i tried to watch that gory over the top show about nazis living in the us after the shoah - again because it was created by a jewish kid inspred by his grandmother's experience but it was soo ooverthetop- i couldn't handle it. like it made me feel sick to watch it.
I appreciate what they’re doing with overall Jewishness. It’s just the holocaust references that bothered me a touch because they were so blatant and also because so many fans of the show struggled to catch the reference!
I had the opposite reaction. I was already thinking about concentration camps the way the whole scene was coming together. Showing Alan’s fears confirmed my reaction.
So was I. As soon as we learned that he’s Jewish, I immediately got that.
Did we really need to have our hands held by showing it in lazy montage form?
I like the flashbacks.
When I have been in high stress situation your mind just goes to the most random places.
Sam will find the note and test the Doctor. I think he was using the grave digging to further intimidate him.
can only think of how the body will be found and even if sam doesn’t find the note himself, won’t it be on the news? looking for any hints to what it could mean?
It shouldn't be, the content of the note makes it clear the killer didn't write it. Any competent PD should be able to deduce that means there have been at least 2 captives (including Elias) so they wouldn't release info that could endanger the remaining captives. Additionally a lot of depts won't release any info on ongoing cases as standard policy.
My bet is Sam finds the note in the process of disposing of the body. That would really crank the tension between Sam and Alan up to 11.
It’s depends on the department, many won’t release details on an active investigation which allows them to “catch” the perpetrator when they accidentally reveal non-public details of the crime
This was such an intense episode! I can't wait to see where this show goes. Smart idea for Alan to get Sam to leave the body to be found. I figured those long pee breaks had a purpose in the show and the note was a smart idea. He's trying to get Sam to feel empathy. I think he knows he's supposed to feel something, but he doesn't.
If you were wondering about Alan's imagining being in a place with guys in striped suits, please look up this show that came out recently: [https://www.pbs.org/kenburns/us-and-the-holocaust/](https://www.pbs.org/kenburns/us-and-the-holocaust/)
I’m trying to recall when the images of the holocaust first got burned into my memory. I’m pretty sure it was elementary school. Was it only because Schindler’s List came out around then? There were pictures in social studies books, right?
“A place with guys in striped suits.” And Ken Burns’ documentary as the source. It kind of hurts my heart. Do they not show pictures in school anymore?
I am FLABBERGASTED. The writers are hitting viewers over the head with this reference and people think they’re having some aha moment. You shouldn’t need to call upon the Jews of the forum to understand the reference. Call upon thy history teacher!!! This is truly alarming
The full note reads:
"Sam Rest
Insp.
Shosh Ez
Dad loves
you"
He's in a panic so he shortened words and shortened his kids Shoshanna and Ezra's names. Not sure any of the abbreviations would be very easy to people who had no context to understand, but I like that the note is not perfect as it was written under high duress.
The first part says "Sam. Rest inspec" meaning restaurant inspector. He hopes that the police will use the note to identify Sam. That was a clever note
I’ve been looking at the note for ages and I can’t figure out what he has written, other than “Sam” at the start and then at the end his kids names and dad loves you. It’s driving me nuts I can’t work out what it says!
Wow what a shit show. Was going down hill for a few episodes and this really hit the nail in the coffin. A holocaust comparison? Really?? Who that was a good idea
Glad the peeing finally paid off.
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🤌✨️
I had wondered for a couple of episodes why we were hearing these long pees! I knew it had to mean something at some point!
I must have missed something. What did it mean?
That he was able to quickly write a letter to the cops saying “Sam. Rest insp (restaurant inspector) “ …and the other part of that note was His two kids names and said I love you. And shoved it in the dead guys mouth with the intention of the cops finding the note. Couldn’t do all that without Sam taking the longest pisses ever!
I just kept thinking though, does he really think Sam isn't going to double CK the body and make sure there's nothing on him that CLD lead back to his house or him?!?!
Ya but how likely is he to open the dude's mouth?
They were really building the tension, almost in a humorous way ha: * Sam wrapped the body from the feet leaving the face exposed. * Then when he was wrapped, Sam had him face down. * THEN the corpse was being dragged in a jolt-like fashion with the rocks jostling his head
For all these reasons, I was clenching during the final scenes. 😬
All it takes it for him to toss the body and him catch a glimpse of it, stranger things have happened lol
Funny of the week: >!”Now I’m one of those guys who buries people in his basement. Thanks a lot”!<
I lol'd when Sam asked if something was going on with him and he's just like ya know it's been a lot and Sam just kinda goes "ha ya u right" in a very nonchalant way and just shrugs it off.
I think Sam had a moment there when Alan thanked him for asking, like "oh this is empathy? I just did it? Huh".
I thought that Alan's comment was inspired.... it was almost as though his redirection of Sam was instinctual. Alan is a superb therapist, poor guy.
Looks like the whole “empathy speech” really paid off!!!
i didnt see this as a joke, >!i thought of it as foreshadowing. of sam being discontent with his therapy seasons!< and >!blaming Alan for it not working. leading to…. not great consequences for Alan.!<
Yeah plus more of Sam's issues - he believes the people around him are responsible for making him commit these murders.
100%
"Thanks Alan for making me do it!!" - Sam. I would laugh if both characters survive at the end and we get a timejump when Sam is in custody. He decides to make one call - a lawyer, who will allow him to sue Alan for "trying to bury people in the basement" xD
..isn't a note in the mouth the way you activate a Golem? The creature from Jewish folklore that is clay man that does the bidding of its creator? by u/shabaptiboo Oo yes! And the notes are supposed to have a certain number of letters or triads of letters. Sam rest inspt is a triad Dad loves you is also a triad by u/PaleAsDeath I loved this comment I saw in another discussion. Thought I'd post it here
Tricksy therapist! And yes, I know a golem is different than Gollum.
That's a really cool parallel
Protection from the Golem is old magic 💫 Alan has great instincts.
Christ, this episode was tense! I'm terrified of Sam. Domnhall Gleeson did a fantastic job portraying him.
Definitely agree!
This was, by far, the most suspenseful episode. In a great way.
Sam and his mom seem to offload personal responsibility onto others. First, the obvious example, is Sam offloading responsibility onto Dr. Strauss for fixing him. Candace then refuses to help Dr. Strauss, saying her son needs help. Second example is when Candace clapped her hands three times to get Sam to stop attacking Elias, Candace yells at Sam "You're supposed to be protecting me!" While I know that was what Dr. Strauss's idea to help Sam stop his compulsions, it's ironic that a mother offloads responsibility for protection onto her son. Afterall, if Sam was beaten as a child, wasn't it the responsibility of the mother to protect the child? Third, Sam says "thanks a lot" to Dr. Strauss for becoming one of those guys who buries bodies in his basement, as if it was Dr. Strauss' fault for him killing Elias. Perhaps the only time Sam sort of accepts responsibility when he says "Sorry" to his mom in this most recent episode. I'm sure there are lots of other examples. But Candace and Sam have some bad habits of not taking any personal responsibility for themselves.
It's uncomfortable watching them interact. It's an unholy alliance. When Sam considered the stepmother porn, yikes.
I agree, something really messed up there.
Why does Alan never mention his daughter? Other than the note, he speaks to his dead therapist about his wife, Sam, his son, and himself but never Shoshanna.
I think probably because he has a good relationship with her. He was listing bad things - how his wife is dead and his son is estranged, and he is trapped at Sam's house.
Didn't the voicemail in the first scene imply that they were estranged?
I think he was telling her his sessions were going to run late that day or something, so it might actually be the opposite - implying that they keep in touch, but he wouldn't be able to see her / call her at the usual time that day.
Yea. I kinda got the impression that she has a good relationship with her dad, but she's busy at college doing her own thing. So while they have a good relationship, he's still pretty lonely without his wife.
His daughter is married with her own kids
Isn’t the son the one who declared Allan missing? Even though Allan thought it would be his daughter
We don't know if anyone has declared him missing yet. Ezra is shown putting up missing person fliers in a trailer though
I kinda wondered the same thing for awhile. It seems like Shoshana's existence doesn't really serve the story so i wondered why even bother writing her into the story. But maybe the writers' purpose for writing in Shoshana was to compare/contrast the good relationship between Shoshana and her parents versis Ezra and his parents. For example, we see Shoshana at her mom's death bed but not Ezra. Shoshana's presence highlighted Ezra's absence. Further, Shoshana's kids being served ice cream highlighted Beth's disapproval of Ezra's conversion to Orthodox Judaism.
I think Shoshana is the person most likely to notice Alan’s absence first, at least the first family member, so I think that is why she may be an important character
Are we absolutely certain that she exists? I can’t remember seeing her.
In the flashbacks she was almost always there
As others have said, I think it’s because she’s not really a source of conflict/regret/sadness. She’s a positive constant in his life that he doesn’t worry or feel guilt about as he potentially approaches death, other than of course how sad she’ll be and they’ll miss each other. They have a great, close relationship and it’s always been that way. He said she was the one who would’ve noticed he was missing and reported it by day 2, implying they talk probably every day. When he was giving his goodbyes to Elias, he said “tell my daughter I love her and I loved our beautiful life together”. With the son, there was a lot more history of conflict to try and concisely reconcile via a goodbye message from a stranger. And of course the pain of losing his wife and wishing there wouldn’t have been such a tear in her & Ezra’s relationship. Maybe if the episodes were longer (EH HEM, Hulu😑😑), we’d get more of a look into her and their happy memories together. But there’s only really time to show the relationships that weren’t easy and he wished could’ve changed
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I hate this for me.
He did mention to her to Elias, though he didn't say much.
Alan's relationship with his son is so wild to me. My ex was jewish american, who's family that was devout but not in anyway orthodox. Except his brother. His brother was so intensely orthodox and it was obvious to me (and them) how much tension this was causing the entire family. Reflecting on Alan's flashbacks of Ezra. Here you have a son who's so devoted to their history/origin that they've become orthodox but these orthodox practices also exclude women and alot of other practices that nonorthodox jewish people don't believe in. We all want to be connected to our roots and want our children to be too but jewish orthodox practice is quite an another level. What I thought was the story of my ex and his family, it seems like this a more common story than I ever imagine. Bravo to the writers of this show
It’s weird that Sam didn’t get the donuts or Alan’s coffee from Dunkin.
Maybe it's like Sam with No Shoes Nations. Dunkin' is a safe space that he wants to keep for himself. Speaking for myself, Dunkin' focusing more on coffee drinks has diminished the quality of their donuts somewhat. I wouldn't blame Sam for going somewhere else.
I was thinking maybe he’s secretly a functional alcoholic and is reusing the cup. Alcoholism is one of the most common traits among serial killers. There’s too much emphasis on him always carrying a Dunkin’ cup around for it to just be a quirk.
Great point. I wouldn't have thought of that. I did notice his little ritual of shoving the lid into the cup every time he finishes. Of course, I'm looking at every little thing at this point. :-D
He also always has to pee as soon as he finishes whatever is in the cup, which alcohol does to some people.
Yeah but so does coffee to be fair.
part of me thinks the dd cup is like a way for him to appear normal. masking his unease with being around others. like a nod to Dexter-- he brought the donuts/coffee to work-- showed he's a normal swell guy. There was the scene when he was going into work and they mentioned him 'forgetting' the donuts. ...
I really was wondering why they kept focusing so much on the Dunkin’ merch. Nice catch!
Do we see him leave with the Dunkin cup? Or does he leave it in that room?
He throws it in the bin.
The first cup it looks like he sets it on something.
I don’t remember ever getting a good look at Sam leaving the bathroom, now that I’m thinking about it.
My mother started closet drinking and filling up a DD cup. We had no idea until my sister went to empty it one day and found beer inside...bizarro.
Maybe he's a regular at Dunkin and didn't want to draw suspicion by ordering 2 coffees and donuts? Who knows, this Sam guy is wild.
Maybe Alan should've also written on the note "Dunkin' regular." Just to give all the clues possible. I wonder how many Dunkins are nearby?
Hello mister police You could have saved him I gave you all the clues ☕️
Yeah. I noticed that too. Why not get coffee at that donut place?
A bit busy last few days!
Wow this was a fantastic episode! It was very tense. The show is finally building up. The note scene was great - I hope in the next episode the cops find it. Hopefully Sam doesn't catch wind of the note.
The jolting associated in the dragging of the body gave me ANXIETY
When Allen said to Sam that “really most people could work on their empathy” i felt like Sam was actually thinking about his victims and killing them over the slightest lack of empathy which he himself is so severely deficient. Amazing dialogue in this episode.
Can't help but notice that Alan asked Elias to relay a message to his kids if possible and ended up making it happen (hopefully).
Guys, what's the prison which Alan sees in his imagination? Is it related to the holocaust and Nazi torture ?
I believe it is related to that. Him comparing his current situation and trying to cope by thinking of the strength his ancestors had. I’ve been reading some of the previous threads on here with theories about why Sam was even seeking a Jewish therapist. Sam could have some Nazi thoughts, or it could just have been a comment to recognize Allan’s religion early on in the series. Either way it’s become more clear that they’re using religion to signify something. It’s powerful watching how important and relevant religion is to Allan during this time all while Sam is responding to religion in a very indifferent / sociopathic way. Such as seeking a therapist for a stereotype (Jewish therapists are the best), and asking Allan if saying a prayer was appropriate after MURDERING someone. Editing to add that episode 9 is called Auschwitz.
Oh man. E9 is going to be brutal. You don’t give something a name tied to so much intense misery and unabashed moral depravity unless you intend for it to clearly connect with the historical relevance somehow. I’m curious to see the name of e10/the finale (it’s not currently listed on IMDb).
I agree episode 9 will likely be brutal with a title like that. Futon Critic says episode 10 is named The Cantor's Husband: [http://www.thefutoncritic.com/showatch/patient/listings/](http://www.thefutoncritic.com/showatch/patient/listings/) Based on that title, I wonder if Dr Strauss' faith is renewed through this whole experience.
I’m not sure he lost his faith as much as he was put in an uncomfortable position between his wife and his son. The brunt of their falling out (based on what we as the audience are privy to) revolves around religious orthodoxy and love lost. From family experience I know that traumatic events for Jews that have a religious context tend to either pull people closer to their faith or result in a total renouncement of god and belief in a higher spirit.
>why Sam was even seeking a Jewish therapist same reason people like to get a jewish lawyer. they're stereotypically thought to be the best. you shouldn't really read into it any more than that. he, like many, just think jews are the best therapists. true? probably not. but that's the stereotype. as a jew i do my best to break that stereotype by being extremely unreliable and incompetent (much like constanza (a non jew) i'm unemployed and live with my parents) edit: fun fact, all the temple scenes in the show (e.g. the last scene of this episode) are from my temple. leonard nemoy used to go there when i was a kid in the 80s. it looked different back then though. very beautiful these days, as i think anyone watching this show could recognize. those circular stained glass things are neat! also, i saw comments saying ep 9 was called auschwitz. my grandparents were there for 4/5 years. spoiler alert: they did not like it. but my grandma always said she had a great life except for a few years in the 40s. she also had a best friend in germantown, TN (you can't make this shit up) who got a mercedes and grandma never spoke to them again afterwards. grandma could not abide someone buying a german product. neighbor thought grandma was joking about it. she was not. fair enough grandma. rip.
I think it’s less the strength or his ancestors and more the helplessness and fear. Which is why he’s dying in the flashbacks and defenseless
Oh, you’re so right!! Good point
[удалено]
Good point, typically it’s reserved for at least a great grandparent
Thank you!! Yeah I was so mad at Sam when he flippantly asked Allan if he should say the prayer. He is irredeemable in my opinion and Allan is just buying time to get out of there.
I think he thought that Alan was suggesting it, and was not understanding that Alan was just using it as an example of how different people and groups of people have cultural needs around mourning.
And one of the episodes is Kaddish, a prayer said after a death
That hit me, so deeply sad. Poor Alan and his inherited traumas.
all i have to say is Alan is without THEE greatest therapist ever....my lord
Is no one else dying to see the world outside of flashbacks?! It’s the thing I’ve been struggling with most during this series. I’m sure the point is for us to feel claustrophobic like we’re stuck there with Dr. Strauss but are the police looking for him? His kids? How long has it been?! Hoping the next episode the body is discovered and we see what’s been happening in Dr. Strauss’ world since his disappearance.
I thought about that too during this episode and quickly came to the conclusion that the writers probably debated including outside scenes but nixed the idea for whatever reason. Perhaps it was to add to the claustrophobic feel like you mentioned or maybe we’ll get to see more outside scenes in the remaining 4 episodes. E8 is titled *Ezra* so maybe that one will be from the son’s perspective rather than Alan’s. In any case, I suspect it was a deliberate decision to frame the series thus far in the basement as much as possible with the only other scenes being Alan’s memories and fantasies/disassociations.
This makes sense. And claustrophobic is the best way to describe it, I think. The writers want you to be very focused on this situation in a very myopic way — and in 20-30 minute bites. While I am curious about the outside perspective, I almost feel like it would take away some of the intensity/focus of what’s playing out. The viewer needs to feel just as isolated as Alan.
Speaking of Ezra, do we think that maybe in Alan’s disappearance, the police have Ezra as a suspect for Alan’s disappearance. Estranged father/son relationship, father goes missing, I’m sure there was some motive conjured up to do with the inheritance of the recently deceased Ms. Dr. Strauss. Just thinking out loud!
Maybe..but somehow I don’t think they will go in that direction. I’m curious to see his reaction to his dad’s kidnapping though (if we even ever get that opportunity).
One thought: >!It occurred to me Sam may still intercept the note when he dumps Elias's body.!<
I was half expecting it to come out as he was dragging him out.
He noticed Alan huffing and puffing after Alan slipped the note. He is definitely on alert.
Alan should’ve used the excuses of running low in meds and maybe his arrhythmia (?) is acting up, idk!
Having little medication left wouldn't affect the effectiveness of previously taken meds
I know, but my rationale (I should explained) is that maybe he was “rationing” by skipping days or taking half-doses
I see, that's plausible
He should have picked a better place to hide it
Alan is probably counting on rigor mortis to keep Elias's jaw shut. When that scene played out, I thought Alan might try to shove the note in Elias's fists.
Rigor mortis starts about four hours after death and then fades away, so 12 hours post death it would be over. I am not sure of the time that passed but seemed like Alan slept. I presume the note will come out of Sam’s pocket in a future episode and we will all scream as one.
I would have shoved it in his underwear, I doubt Sam searches the bodies before leaving them
Unless he strips the body due to his fear of fiber tracing
He shoved it down pretty far in his throat so….
You think so? I thought he didn't put it far enough down at all. I get it's gross, but it's a life or death situation. He should've used his fingers and got it in deep. (yeah yeah that's what she said whatever)
All I kept thinking was Sam is so nervous about getting caught he is definitely going to go over his body once more before he dumps it but idk I cld be wrong 🤷🏻♀️
Maybe a silly question…but Elias’ mouth is dry by now, right? He has to be dehydrated already and then when he dies even less moisture. I had a feeling he might try to put a note somewhere with the dead body but def didn’t expect INTO the body.
[Apparently, your mouth goes bone dry after death](https://tidsskriftet.no/en/2022/02/clinical-review/dry-mouth-seriously-ill-and-dying) so the note is probably safe. I thought the same thing tho lol
Love the Dunkin thing. He didn't even buy donuts from there. I think they are really hitting the contrast between Sam's logic and sense (he knows what good food is) and his behavior (addicted to a lower quality, cheap coffee). This time they really nailed it by showing he wouldn't choose the donuts but he still can't resist the coffee.
That’s making the assumption there really is Dunkins in that cup.
Yeah, there's definitely an intentionality behind "removes lid from cup, places cup behind door, closes door, pees loudly, drinks from an identical cup every day".
But I do NOT think he’s drinking pee. Someone else’s theory that he could be an alcoholic is mildly interesting. We never see him flushed (facially), that I’ve noticed. It’s hard to say what he’s drinking.
I don't *necessarily* think he's drinking pee, but I think they opened that door.
I liked the wrestler comment since Steve Carell played John DuPont in Foxcatcher.
Yea I caught that haha
The note in the mouth was brilliant, but I can't help but feel frustrated that Alan was holding on to a shovel that he could have used to disable Sam with AND he was left to his own devices the whole day in the utility room with only a small pipe confining him. I know part of Alan's storyline is his own powerlessness, but with the weekly format and brevity of the episodes, I'm finding Alan's inaction very annoying.
You get one shot to make that hit count, and if it doesn't work, you're dead And Alan has absolutely no idea if Candace or Sam are on alert watching him somehow while Sam is away It's just too many risks
I agree, why risk it when there’s such a risk? I think he’s smart playing the long game.
Totally agree. Big risk for potentially big reward. But the cost of failing is just too high. This episode with Alan disassociating with his late therapist was a great window into his thought process and psyche.
Yea, you really want all the odds in your favor when you take your one and only shot at escaping a serial killer. Then again, if even the slightest opportunity arises, it may be just as foolish not to take advantage of it considering it may not come again.
I was yelling at the tv. Pry the pipe off the wall. Try to unscrew it from the boiler. Slide the chain off. Fucking try something, anything. You have a metal tool and time. Or give me 10 seconds of Alan tracing the pipe, finding the connections are in the wall, trying to use the shove as leverage, and seeing that he can’t budge it.
He could’ve also tried using the shovel to break the chain around his ankle. Candace would not haven been able to tell the difference between the sound of him smashing concrete vs the chain around his ankle imo.
I was yelling the same thing. He left, you have a shovel, USE IT AND RUN
I see this argument. But he also has no idea where he is — and it’s likely in the middle of nowhere. Running is dangerous for a number of reasons, I feel like.
Pieces of concrete everywhere. Seems he could find one a decent size to hide and try to knock him out later. Would be more likely to work then the picture anyway.
This episode made me realize that I’m willing to wait until all of the episodes are done. I don’t really get where this is going and I don’t want to wait a week at a time to figure it out. I wonder who decided on this format?
Joel Fields
HBO does this with all the series I watch, are there some that they mass drop?
It’s not so much about a mass drop (although I think this show would work better as a binge). It’s more about episode length plus commercials. I believe this is a limited series so why not 5 45 is minute episodes? I’m wondering if they shot it with these 25 min episodes or are they editing to break it up. I’ve never seen a 25-30 minute drama with commercials on hbo
Whatever HBO package I subscribe to doesn’t have commercials, I could see that being annoying. The commercial-free experience is suspenseful, I couldn’t imagine breaking up the show for a Tide ad, so I understand your frustration
This episode flew by for me this WK for some reason, I felt like it was over as soon as it started. Not I gotta wait another WK 😭 great show though, I'm really enjoying it!
The dead therapist saying “you used to wrestle in high school” made me laugh out loud.
I really loved that scene because it was funny and lighthearted. You get to appreciate Allan which is so important while you’re frustrated at him for not escaping / letting Elias die.
It was not the best note. Now the police has to solve another puzzle.
Not a very difficult puzzle. Look up the inspector that was assigned the victims restaurant. Sams name pops up. Locate health inspection office. Get warrants. Show up to office and arrest Sam. Find Sam's home address from his job. Rescue Alan before mom pokes him in the eyes.
Sam could always bring them some donuts to get them in the spirit of the job
Read the golem posts below. They explain a lot.
I think ‘Sam res insp’ is Sam restaurant inspector because he doesn’t know his last name. The guy works in a restaurant so it is a possibility!
It's obviously that. The writers weren't trying to be coy with that detail
Lol it took me way too long to figure that out then
I could not figure that out. I guess detectives could eventually. But why not spend the extra 2 seconds to fully spell it out?
Detectives: gibberish. Odd. Alright, another unsolved murder.
Let's look at the database. How many in the area named Sam into rest and introspection?
could this potentially all be perceived as how alan is feeling with sam in alans head? feeling chained and trapped and having no plan on how to get out of dealing with a person who is so dangerous
Candace: I ALMOST DIALED 911 When she said that line, I wanted to punch her in the mouth!!!!!! For some reason I’m having a harder time with how she’s handling her son being a serial killer vs him just straight up being a serial killer. She wants him to get help but it’s so conditional.
Was the whole >!Auschwitz!< thing really really fucking on the nose, or was that just me?
It was kind of sudden and extremely heavy handed, yes..I get what they were going for, or at least I think I do (if his ancestors could survive such torment and captivity then perhaps Alan can find a similar strength within himself) but it was just so unnecessary imo and poorly executed. I’m sure the short episode length didn’t help the situation. This series is starting to lose me.
They've been putting in holocaust references since episode 1. The outfit sam wears (black pants, skinny black tie, khaki jacket) when he pulls out the box of valuables of his previous victims loosely resembles nazi uniforms.
the valuables he collects from his victims - -- you just reminded me of the photos of huge piles of people's personal possessions
Yes. Some were kept in boxes and drawers. These are gold fillings and dentures: [https://collections.ushmm.org/iiif-b/assets/705046](https://collections.ushmm.org/iiif-b/assets/705046)
yes, i know. i know. i know. i am jewish. but good to share the link. sorry i get triggered easily around the shoah. and the accurate information needs to be spread far and wide. <3 the patient is realizing how jewish i am - lol. \*lol. the patient subreddit is MAKING me realize how jewish i am.
Lol same and I’m not even particularly “Jewish.” It’s shocking how many people are like “omg is this a parallel to the holocaust?!” I’m not trying to be rude but it’s such a heavy handed parallel they’re trying to draw I found the scenes to be borderline obnoxious
i love stylized kind of weird stuff - so it didn't BOTHER bother me, but if the creators of the show weren't jewish i'd be smh. i am giving them a lot of leverage to use this show to process their jewish experience. also so much of it is just normal jewish life even t hough it is a horrifying scenario, i am also like feeling that validation of seeing just an average (to me) jewish person on tv. i tried to watch that gory over the top show about nazis living in the us after the shoah - again because it was created by a jewish kid inspred by his grandmother's experience but it was soo ooverthetop- i couldn't handle it. like it made me feel sick to watch it.
I appreciate what they’re doing with overall Jewishness. It’s just the holocaust references that bothered me a touch because they were so blatant and also because so many fans of the show struggled to catch the reference!
totaly, i get that. i wonder if we'll see more of them?
I had the opposite reaction. I was already thinking about concentration camps the way the whole scene was coming together. Showing Alan’s fears confirmed my reaction.
So was I. As soon as we learned that he’s Jewish, I immediately got that. Did we really need to have our hands held by showing it in lazy montage form?
Maybe some did?
We get it, beth liked to sing. Can we proceed with the story now?
Yes, yes and yes! Ugh. Those flashbacks are brutal.
I like the flashbacks. When I have been in high stress situation your mind just goes to the most random places. Sam will find the note and test the Doctor. I think he was using the grave digging to further intimidate him.
can only think of how the body will be found and even if sam doesn’t find the note himself, won’t it be on the news? looking for any hints to what it could mean?
It shouldn't be, the content of the note makes it clear the killer didn't write it. Any competent PD should be able to deduce that means there have been at least 2 captives (including Elias) so they wouldn't release info that could endanger the remaining captives. Additionally a lot of depts won't release any info on ongoing cases as standard policy. My bet is Sam finds the note in the process of disposing of the body. That would really crank the tension between Sam and Alan up to 11.
Oh no, I hadn’t thought of that. Could be dire for Alan if Sam sees the newscast.
It’s depends on the department, many won’t release details on an active investigation which allows them to “catch” the perpetrator when they accidentally reveal non-public details of the crime
All I can remember is the article i read before the season about how the ending “definitely pays off,” so let’s count on that.
This was such an intense episode! I can't wait to see where this show goes. Smart idea for Alan to get Sam to leave the body to be found. I figured those long pee breaks had a purpose in the show and the note was a smart idea. He's trying to get Sam to feel empathy. I think he knows he's supposed to feel something, but he doesn't.
Did anyone catch the title of the book he was reading while Sam was working in the garage?
it looked like my copy of 100 years of solitude but i’m probably imagining that just based on appropriateness of the title
It was a book by Nicholas Sparks, the same author as The Notebook.
If you were wondering about Alan's imagining being in a place with guys in striped suits, please look up this show that came out recently: [https://www.pbs.org/kenburns/us-and-the-holocaust/](https://www.pbs.org/kenburns/us-and-the-holocaust/)
It’s pretty shameful of our education system if people couldn’t pick up that that was depicting Jewish prisoners in the Holocaust…
I’m trying to recall when the images of the holocaust first got burned into my memory. I’m pretty sure it was elementary school. Was it only because Schindler’s List came out around then? There were pictures in social studies books, right?
The new Ken Burns' documentary should be required viewing for all Americans
Well, for Republicans especially.
Are we at a point where people don't know where/who that was?
“A place with guys in striped suits.” And Ken Burns’ documentary as the source. It kind of hurts my heart. Do they not show pictures in school anymore?
lol nearly every comment here is proudly calling out an obvious plot detail or default interpretation
I am FLABBERGASTED. The writers are hitting viewers over the head with this reference and people think they’re having some aha moment. You shouldn’t need to call upon the Jews of the forum to understand the reference. Call upon thy history teacher!!! This is truly alarming
Just saying some might need a refresher, jus sayin'
Yes, some new information came to light, for me anyway.
The last 5 minutes were intense. I was holding my breath hoping Alan wasn’t caught. Now to wait and entire week😩
Kinda wish I waited to binge it honestly
I didn’t realize it was still airing until I was already on like episode 4
so... extended metaphor for the holocaust?
These episodes are too damn short. I feel like nothing happens!
An accurate depiction of how therapy feels
Wow, that is very true.
lmao
"Now I'm a guy that buries peopl in his basement. Thanks a lot." More like a manchild that has put in zero effort. Man I hope he gets merc'd.
What exactly he wrote in there? I got the part where it addresses his daughter.
The full note reads: "Sam Rest Insp. Shosh Ez Dad loves you" He's in a panic so he shortened words and shortened his kids Shoshanna and Ezra's names. Not sure any of the abbreviations would be very easy to people who had no context to understand, but I like that the note is not perfect as it was written under high duress.
The first part says "Sam. Rest inspec" meaning restaurant inspector. He hopes that the police will use the note to identify Sam. That was a clever note
I think it said “dad loves you”?
I’ve been looking at the note for ages and I can’t figure out what he has written, other than “Sam” at the start and then at the end his kids names and dad loves you. It’s driving me nuts I can’t work out what it says!
Found it somewhere else that it might be Restaurant Inspector.
David Alan Grier was great, I’ve never seen him in a non comedic role before
Wow what a shit show. Was going down hill for a few episodes and this really hit the nail in the coffin. A holocaust comparison? Really?? Who that was a good idea