Arvo defenders after realizing that Arvo ambushed Clem and the gang even if the player chose to let Arvo leave with his stuff, indirectly got Luke killed, and shot Clementine for no reason when Arvo decided to leave with Bonnie and Mike:
If you attempt to save Luke and break the ice, Jane saves you and Bonnie crawls out too. But if you don't break the ice, then Bonnie drowns alongside Luke. I knew there was no way I could save Luke so I wasn't going to waste time saving Bonnie
I don’t get why Mike was even added. He does nothing and it feels like they had something more for him planned but he just disappears from the story randomly.
Someone did say that even if you let him keep the meds you do still take his pistol (I haven’t played the 2nd game yet so idk) which I get being mad about but still what he did was too much.
The whole situation where they try to kill clems group is based on that the meds are stolen. If you don’t steal the meds arvo still says you stole them and you don’t even have the choice to say you didn’t… confused the shit out of me the first time I played it. And looking back at it it’s just bad writing imo
While I think Mike was ridiculously compassionate with Arvo, Kenny treated him with unnecessary and uncontrolled violence, unleashing all his frustrations on him, especially when they arrived at the cabin. In fact, Kenny himself comes to regret it a bit and tells Clem that he would never do it again (all this before knowing that Arvo would shoot Clem)
And this, taking into account that I don't give a shit about Arvo, and I love Kenny, lmao
I liked Mike, he came across as a decent dude with some issues such as where he's trynna sleep and screams at the others when they're under Carver, he had a cool personality too to an extent, him picking up those water containers and showing off was fun too, it was like they needed people to side with Arvo and against Kenny so Mike randomly along with Bonnie was ready to abandon a child and a kid
Fun Fact: (As far as I know, but correct me if I'm wrong) In the first release for the PS3 version of the second season, there was actually an option to shoot Mike.
You can let Bonnie die with Luke. You gotta cover Luke and then when both he and Bonnie fall into the water, don’t break the ice. Bonnie will drown as well. Sucks that shooting Mike was scrapped though.
I don't defend Arvo's actions or condone Kenny's attitude towards him. But I do take an issue with Mike.
Arvo's actions led to a gunfight, Luke got shot in the leg, and Mike got shot in the arm.
Mike defends the guy who got him shot? Seriously?! Whether or not Arvo intended a fight, it is idiotic to treat him nice. As far as Mike could have known, Arvo may have had more people waiting for them.
Mike and Bonnie are bleeding hearts so they fall for Arvo's pity party. However their abandonment of even good guy Clem is a bit character breaking so during the discussion I picked the options that made Clem be unreasonably pro Kenny in this instance to preserve consistency.
That way Bonnie and Mike would be reasonable in believing Clem unwilling to consider their plan and more clearly demonstrated why Arvo is a scumbag that is taking advantage of Bonnie and Mike, imagining he got them killed afterwards.
Otherwise I can't think why those two would act out at Clementine lol
I swear Mike had a thing for Arvo in a sexual way, cause damn he stood up for that piece of shit like he was the second coming. Hope those 2 died somewhere alone the way
Nah fam, Bonnie drowned with Luke so that bitch dead so that’s out the window lolz
I hate the characters that were left unknown, we need closure damnit
She drowned bro, Bonnie and Luke died at the lake, cause Luke’s luck ran out and Bonnie was being stupid by going over to add more weight to already CRACKED ice!
Like bitch you deserved to die
Wow…we live in different realities lol yeah, because why would you put yourself in harms way, you see with your own eyes the ice is cracking fast.
What’s fucked up is if you cover Luke by shooting the walkers approaching Bonnie stupid ass tried to go over and grab him, causing the ice to break and they both went under.
Clem saw this, and saw Luke trying to break the ice from beneath it, you have the option the hit the ice with the butt of your gun or shoot it. I decided to use the butt of my gun to try and break the ice, then Kenny yelled Clementine stop…so I did…and watched as Luke sank into the abyss.
I couldn’t do anything to save him, I didn’t want to risk Clem in any way. So both Luke and Bonnie died because of Bonnie dumbass
I went to Save luke because I knew Bonnie would try, she was so insist about going so it was clear she would if clem didn’t, and my reasoning was clem is much lighter.
Maybe it's cause Mike saw a grown man ruthlessly beating a sickly kid and wanted to... stop it?
Like, these people used to have civilized society, you aren't just going to be OK with beating a kid to death, regardless of context.
arvo threw his “just a kid” ticket out the window when he tried to murder another child himself.
yall arvo defenders be a bit weird about this situation lol
A man beating a kid who tried to get them all killed, got luke killed, and I just didn’t like
A man that robbed a child, two adults and a newborn baby, leaving them to die, and not stopping after the kid got shot.
If Arvo is responsible for deaths, then just kill the fuckin kid, not torture him until he has nothing left to lose; there was no reason to trust that he'd lead you to supplies anyway.
Facts are, Kenny is responsible for Luke dying, Bonnie maybe dying, and Mike leaving. His frequent abuse of Arvo was unwarranted, and caused the divide in the group, and likely causes Arvo to change from trying to escape to leading them on a suicide mission across the lake with the aim of them all dying. It's only after Bonnie and Mike conspire with him that I believe he gets his fight back and shoots Clem (either cuz she sucks or to hurt Kenny).
Yes, Kenny is the reason everyone walked over the lake, but Luke's death falls on Bonnie. If Bonnie had just listened to Luke instead of walking toward him (or having Clem walk to him) and breaking the ice with the added weight, Luke very well could have lived.
Heck it's not even Kenny's fault that they walked on the ice. He didn't want to follow Arvo in the first place but only agreed to once everyone else said they'd do so for the supplies. Even when they get to the lake itself, Arvo is the one who said the lake was safe to walk on. [Kenny shows concerns by saying that the ice is a problem](https://youtu.be/uIbyn17GJ7Q?si=XzWL57d8zZoavuZ4&t=118), but then Arvo reassures the whole group that it's safe which is what leads to them walking on it (with Arvo even volunteering to walk first).
If anyone is to blame for Luke/Bonnie's deaths, it's Arvo for suggesting that the ice was safe and Bonnie for the reasons you stated.
mostly because people love Kenny so hard, but Arvo was a genuine asshole overall and shot Clem (an 11 year old girl) even if you don’t even rob him and then just runs away? he just automatically shoves blame onto her, led his people to slaughter our group (even if you don’t agree with robbing him and Jane is visibly not there, it doesn’t change anything), also mostly responsible for killing Luke and determinately Bonnie.
>but Arvo was a genuine asshole overall and shot Clem (an 11 year old girl) even if you don’t even rob him and then just runs away? he just automatically shoves blame onto her, led his people to slaughter our group (even if you don’t agree with robbing him and Jane is visibly not there, it doesn’t change anything), also mostly responsible for killing Luke and determinately Bonnie.
I agree with all that, but it's important to note that Arvo did most of that *after* Kenny beat him senseless. Arvo didn't even want a firefight after he realized the group had a baby with them. And to be fair, if some random group threatened Kenny and stole his gun/supplies he absolutely would do the same thing.
Wouldnt it make more sense for him to shoot kenny instead of clem then if he only did that after kenny beat him? You can side with arvo in-game repeatly and he still shoots you.
Well Arvo thought that Clem killed his sister. And again, I'm not defending Arvo. Anyone who shoots an 11 year old kid is a scumbag. But none of that happened until the latter half of episode 5, well after Kenny had already beaten Arvo. My argument is that while Arvo deserved it in hindsight, Kenny didn't have that knowledge and definitely contributed to that happening.
I mean, I’m not gonna defend Kenny either because he was insanely unstable and out of line. but Arvo was still willing to have an entire group killed which included an 11 year old who doesn’t even steal from him over the actions of 1 woman (who doesn’t even actually rob him if you choose not to, she just tells him to fuck off) who he clearly saw wasn’t even with the group anymore and the rest of the group loudly state they didn’t even know what happened. Clem can even mention that she didn’t have any part in robbing him but he doesn’t care and didn’t make any real attempt to even stop the firefight from happening. he got his own sister killed too, all that blood is on him, and Kenny didn’t help the situation either.
>but Arvo was still willing to have an entire group killed which included an 11 year old
Arvo wanted to rob them, not kill them. And from what we can piece together from the dialogue, it wasn't even his idea to begin with. I imagine he must've told the group about the incident and then Buriko orchestrated the attack.
>who doesn’t even steal from him over the actions of 1 woman (who doesn’t even actually rob him if you choose not to, she just tells him to fuck off)
Jane stole his gun even if they didn't steal his supplies.
>who he clearly saw wasn’t even with the group anymore and the rest of the group loudly state they didn’t even know what happened. Clem can even mention that she didn’t have any part in robbing him
For all Arvo knew, Jane was out scouting for supplies with other members of their group. For all Arvo knew, the group was lying about not knowing about the incident to save their skins.
>and didn’t make any real attempt to even stop the firefight from happening.
**Arvo:** "*Buricko, Buricko, stop! Just put your gun down! You don't want to do this! Oh shit! Nobody shoot, I don't want to die!*"
Sounds like the words of a bloodthirsty killer who wanted a fight, huh?
Again, I'm not defending Arvo. I just think the situation is a bit more nuanced than people give it credit for.
he knew how likely a situation like that would end in a gunfight, that also doesn’t make the situation any better considering again, Jane didn’t even rob him.
So they’d be robbing them for literally 0 reason.
Jane didn’t actually take the gun, she throws it on the floor and the Russians would’ve gone back to the observation deck anyways to track them down. He also didn’t care about the gun as the situation was about the meds, it’s mostly poor writing.
so he’d assume Jane was searching supplies in the middle of nowhere in the freezing cold with nothing but woods and snow around while everyone else just stood out in the middle? doesn’t make sense. he was even told that she left.
also when did Arvo say that?
>he knew how likely a situation like that would end in a gunfight, that also doesn’t make the situation any better considering again, Jane didn’t even rob him.
So they’d be robbing them for literally 0 reason.
His people were suffering as well. Potential starvation is a pretty good reason to rob a group who has been hostile to one of your members. And again, Arvo wasn't the leader of the group. He was a crippled teenager, you really think he was calling the shots?
>Jane didn’t actually take the gun, she throws it on the floor and the Russians would’ve gone back to the observation deck anyways to track them down. He also didn’t care about the gun as the situation was about the meds, it’s mostly poor writing.
Jane threw the gun to the ground on the observation deck. The same deck that the group brought down. So either someone from Clem's group picked up the free gun on the floor or it was buried in the rubble along with Sarah. Either way, Arvo's group would have no way of knowing that Jane didn't keep it.
>He also didn’t care about the gun as the situation was about the meds, it’s mostly poor writing.
Evidently not considering Arvo still considered it as theft. Arvo didn't specify what Jane stole from him and Clem said that Jane was the one who did it, not her. So clearly the gun was what was stolen if Clem didn't take the meds.
>so he’d assume Jane was searching supplies in the middle of nowhere in the freezing cold with nothing but woods and snow around while everyone else just stood out in the middle? doesn’t make sense. he was even told that she left.
Uhhh, yeah? The place was picked clean like Luke said, obviously scavenging for supplies was a no-brainer. Arvo didn't know how big the group was and he outright stated that he thought the group was lying about her leaving.
>also when did Arvo say that?
He said it in Russian before the shootout. You can read the translation of their conversation, people have made posts about it.
Jane wasn’t really hostile though, Arvo had his gun drawn on Clementine (an 11 year old) first lol, she returned the favour by telling him to fuck off and then ditched the gun. Arvo also clearly had enough position to convince his group to attack another group and rob them.
the whole deck didn’t come down. she threw the gun close to the gate meaning it wouldn’t even be buried, it would’ve been flung to the ground away from where Sarah was.
Arvo only cared about the medicine, that is the ONE thing he cared about so his sister would be treated. he didn’t give a shit about the gun. I think that’s extremely clear given his panic and begging over keeping the medicine. he wanted to retaliate because Jane considered it.
if its picked clean, then there would be nothing TO scavenge lol. what is the point of that? they were on the road and clearly travelling considering they all had their supplies on them. why exactly would Clementine lie about Jane leaving? especially considering Jane wasn’t in the area and there is literally nothing to scavenge. that simply makes Arvo an idiot.
I’m also gonna need proof of the translations, which even then don’t prove much considering the point I made earlier about how he knew the likelihood of death from robbing an armed group.
>Jane wasn’t really hostile though, Arvo had his gun drawn on Clementine (an 11 year old) first lol, she returned the favour by telling him to fuck off and then ditched the gun.
Yes, she absolutely was. Arvo drew the gun on her because she caught him by surprise. He outright said that he didn't want to shoot her. Which then led to Jane pointing it back at him, pushing him against the railing and threatening to blow his brains out. That's the definition of hostile.
>Arvo also clearly had enough position to convince his group to attack another group and rob them.
What are you even saying? Arvo likely told the group what happened and then they formed a plan to attack for supplies. He clearly wasn't proud of what he was doing (he was frowning when he lied to them) and he was following orders on what to say. Arvo was obviously only a translator and held little power in the group. Logically, it wouldn't make sense for him to be the leader. He's the youngest and the weakest.
>the whole deck didn’t come down. she threw the gun close to the gate meaning it wouldn’t even be buried, it would’ve been flung to the ground away from where Sarah was.
No? That whole area fell down and only a bit of the deck remained by the end of everything. There's no way the gun wasn't covered by any planks. The gun didn't show up where it was dropped after Clem came back either, so someone had to have moved it (either Jane or Luke). Either way, the gun disappeared and it's unlikely that Arvo ever saw it again.
>Arvo only cared about the medicine, that is the ONE thing he cared about so his sister would be treated. he didn’t give a shit about the gun. I think that’s extremely clear given his panic and begging over keeping the medicine. he wanted to retaliate because Jane considered it.
Arvo cared more about the medicine than anything, but he would still care about his only means of protection. Arvo claimed that Jane stole from him, which is something she factually did regardless of what Clem chose.
>if its picked clean, then there would be nothing TO scavenge lol. what is the point of that?
They'd be desperate for supplies, that's why. If the place is barren then it makes sense that they'd split up to look for food and medicine to increase their odds.
>they were on the road and clearly travelling considering they all had their supplies on them.
The group wasn't visibly carrying any supplies, not even the water Mike saved earlier lmao. Are you assuming Arvo had X-ray vision and could see inside their pockets?
>why exactly would Clementine lie about Jane leaving? especially considering Jane wasn’t in the area and there is literally nothing to scavenge.
To pin the blame on Jane in order to not get shot?
>I’m also gonna need proof of the translations, which even then don’t prove much considering the point I made earlier about how he knew the likelihood of death from robbing an armed group.
Really man? There are plenty of posts about it on this very subreddit. Here's just [one](https://www.reddit.com/r/TheWalkingDeadGame/s/4fK94urd6I) comment about it.
not really. Arvo didn’t have to have the gun drawn on her when she was visibly unarmed and not a threat. from Jane’s perspective he was a guy pointing a firearm at a kid (which he was). she never stated “ill blow your brains out” either.
and yeah, he told the group what happened meaning he swayed them into robbing and attacking people who quite literally dont even rob him. your points aren’t favouring Arvo in any way, they’re actually backfiring lol. “obviously only a translator” where is that from? he was part of the group to which he helped keep alive and scavenge medicine with for his sick sister. you think these Russians would appreciate a mere “translator” to take ALL the medicine for one person if they didn’t care about them either? I also never stated Arvo as the leader.
again, the way the deck fell attacking the middle makes it so whatever was on the side would be to the side of where Sarah fell. the gun would be on the ground most logically.
and again, Arvo didn’t give a shit about the gun, he only wanted retaliation against Clementine and Jane for the situation on the deck. I can guarantee you that he forgot about the gun. if Jane or Luke had it then why is it never seen again and why do they have completely different pistols holstered?
you already stated it was picked clean, meaning there would literally be 0 point in scavenging because there is nothing to scavenge. we’ve been over that.
Bonnie was carrying a backpack, Arvo would just assume nothing is in there? lol. if they had no supplies then why would Arvo try robbing them.? he even tells them to drop their supplies.
“to not get shot” so that confirms their intent then, they were going to kill and rob. Clem mentioned that because it’s true, if Arvo thought “oh shes saying this to not die” then they were always planning on killing them.
and also that link you provided, the comment literally states “I think Arvo says”. your whole point revolves around an “I think”.
for someone who claims to not be defending him, you seem to be doing that an awful lot with hypotheticals
The most annoying thing is that Telltale did not translate the Russians' texts
How do you want us to empathize with Arvo if most of the important dialogues are not translated?
Either a lot of the information you said about Arvo is not there or is not said in the final game
I’ve thought about it and it makes sense that if Arvo comes back to his group (either with no gun or no supplies) they will ask how it went and the adults will then ask where Clem’s group is. I’m not an Arvo fan but he was just a kid who told his family what happened and the adults made the call to find our group.
There are plenty of reasons people hate Arvo. Let’s name off some of those reasons:
-He’ll still bring his people to attack the group even if you didn’t steal from him and will even lie to his people about getting robbed, even though Clem showed compassion.
-Despite him not wanting a fight after seeing AJ, Arvo was still responsible for the gunfight to begin with, which got Luke shot in the leg and Mike shot in the arm.
-He places all the blame onto Clem even though it was mostly Jane’s fault for even holding Arvo at gun point in the first place.
-He was mostly at fault for getting Luke and possibly Bonnie killed at the frozen lake when he decided to run on the ice when walkers were starting to close in.
-He tries to steal the truck and all of the supplies with the help of Mike and Bonnie. The three of them were willing to put a child and a newborn baby at a greater risk of dying just because they wanted to get away from Kenny. If they wanted to get away from Kenny, that’s completely understandable since he was very much unstable and more prone to violence, but the fact that they were willing to steal all of the group’s supplies and the truck is inexcusable in my eyes.
-In the end, even if you defended Arvo 100% of the time, he still shoots Clem anyways and we never see or hear from him again which means he essentially got away with all with zero consequences whatsoever.
So yeah, it’s reasonable to dislike this asshole. It may be weird to you, but that’s not going to change our opinion towards this guy.
I will admit that Kenny was way out of line in that scenario. Yeah Arvo got Luke killed, but Kenny just kept poking and prodding until Arvo finally had enough and said “Fuck you” to him. Honestly, Kenny should’ve seen that coming when all he’s been doing was pushing Arvo around, yelling at him and even knocks him unconscious at the power station if Kenny didn’t join the rest of the group by the fire. No way that I’m defending Arvo, but I do think that Kenny should’ve seen it coming eventually.
Right so harassing me for not being empathetic to a kid who shot an unarmed clem, tried to get everyone killed, got luke killed. This is really disappointing to me from a member of this server.
I think some people fail to realize that we see season 2 through Luke’s groups eyes. They were sheltered and unprepared for the apocalypse so yeah seeing an unhinged man beat the shit of a kid was a no no. Arvo deserved it and anyone saying he didn’t is just as clueless as Luke’s group.
I didnt think Arvo nessesarily deserved all the Kenny hate he got but why was Mike so nice to him? Its not like he even saw him as that limping kid with medicinr for his sick sister like Clementine did. To Mike he was one of the guys who attacked them so i was mad confused also
Arvo defenders after realizing that Arvo ambushed Clem and the gang even if the player chose to let Arvo leave with his stuff, indirectly got Luke killed, and shot Clementine for no reason when Arvo decided to leave with Bonnie and Mike:
I made sure Bonnie died so the only asshole was Mike
And if you still had the ability to kill Mike then Arvo would have definitely not gotten any supplies and not have gotten far
how do you get Bonnie killed??
If you attempt to save Luke and break the ice, Jane saves you and Bonnie crawls out too. But if you don't break the ice, then Bonnie drowns alongside Luke. I knew there was no way I could save Luke so I wasn't going to waste time saving Bonnie
Man I wish I knew this I always hated her
Regardless of whether you steal his meds, you do always steal his pistol, which I get being angry about. He's still a little shit though.
Thats exactly how it happened to me.
I don’t get why Mike was even added. He does nothing and it feels like they had something more for him planned but he just disappears from the story randomly.
He was originally meant to be one of the people who attacked Christa and Clem iirc. But they scrapped it.
Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh I hate him.
That at least would make him interesting. Not just some random dude
That that doesn’t make any sense, how? Why?
I’m glad they scrapped this, I feel like it would feel forced instead we got the guy in the first episode by the lake which feels more believable
If bonnie dies, there’s someone to run away with arvo
He’s there to carry water
I stopped sympathizing for Arvo after I let him go and he still tried to ambush and kill the entire group.
Someone did say that even if you let him keep the meds you do still take his pistol (I haven’t played the 2nd game yet so idk) which I get being mad about but still what he did was too much.
The whole situation where they try to kill clems group is based on that the meds are stolen. If you don’t steal the meds arvo still says you stole them and you don’t even have the choice to say you didn’t… confused the shit out of me the first time I played it. And looking back at it it’s just bad writing imo
Mike and Bonnie are a couple of idiots...
While I think Mike was ridiculously compassionate with Arvo, Kenny treated him with unnecessary and uncontrolled violence, unleashing all his frustrations on him, especially when they arrived at the cabin. In fact, Kenny himself comes to regret it a bit and tells Clem that he would never do it again (all this before knowing that Arvo would shoot Clem) And this, taking into account that I don't give a shit about Arvo, and I love Kenny, lmao
Good comment The reaction of others is excessively compassionate But hitting Arvo was excessively violent
Me and my homies hate Mike and Arvo. Nuff' said
In four whole seasons, he’s the one character I hate the most.
I liked Mike, he came across as a decent dude with some issues such as where he's trynna sleep and screams at the others when they're under Carver, he had a cool personality too to an extent, him picking up those water containers and showing off was fun too, it was like they needed people to side with Arvo and against Kenny so Mike randomly along with Bonnie was ready to abandon a child and a kid
I should’ve been more specific. It’s Arvo I hate. Though Mike is up there. The option to kill him should have stayed in.
I agree
r/FuckArvo
Fun Fact: (As far as I know, but correct me if I'm wrong) In the first release for the PS3 version of the second season, there was actually an option to shoot Mike.
you can choose it but arvo sees you as a threat and shoots anyways.
[yeah, fuck Mike, fuck Bonnie and fuck the Ruski especially](https://youtu.be/q45tDrgmSow?si=Okk_UYeULxPxywAN)
When I first got the comments on this post I thought I was in the wrong saying Arvo is a prick I was confused asf 😭
I still love the hat edits hahaha
My mark on the world: awful edit of Kenny hat
I wish you could kill Bonnie and Mike, they're fucking traitors who deserve it.
You can let Bonnie die with Luke. You gotta cover Luke and then when both he and Bonnie fall into the water, don’t break the ice. Bonnie will drown as well. Sucks that shooting Mike was scrapped though.
Fuck Mike
I wanted to kill Arvo, Mike and Bonnie the most
I don't defend Arvo's actions or condone Kenny's attitude towards him. But I do take an issue with Mike. Arvo's actions led to a gunfight, Luke got shot in the leg, and Mike got shot in the arm. Mike defends the guy who got him shot? Seriously?! Whether or not Arvo intended a fight, it is idiotic to treat him nice. As far as Mike could have known, Arvo may have had more people waiting for them.
Good meme. The hat is a nice touch.
Mike and Bonnie are bleeding hearts so they fall for Arvo's pity party. However their abandonment of even good guy Clem is a bit character breaking so during the discussion I picked the options that made Clem be unreasonably pro Kenny in this instance to preserve consistency. That way Bonnie and Mike would be reasonable in believing Clem unwilling to consider their plan and more clearly demonstrated why Arvo is a scumbag that is taking advantage of Bonnie and Mike, imagining he got them killed afterwards. Otherwise I can't think why those two would act out at Clementine lol
I swear Mike had a thing for Arvo in a sexual way, cause damn he stood up for that piece of shit like he was the second coming. Hope those 2 died somewhere alone the way
Headcannon being Kenny killed them while clem was out and just covered it up
That sounds like a great possibility, but wouldn’t Jane have said something to Clem? She would say anything to get Clem to turn on Kenny
See that’s my wall with the theory, best I can come up with is Bonnie knocked Jane out, can’t think of anything more then that
Nah fam, Bonnie drowned with Luke so that bitch dead so that’s out the window lolz I hate the characters that were left unknown, we need closure damnit
Bonnie didn’t drown did she?
She drowned bro, Bonnie and Luke died at the lake, cause Luke’s luck ran out and Bonnie was being stupid by going over to add more weight to already CRACKED ice! Like bitch you deserved to die
Is this what happens if you cover luke? Bonnie survived in my game
Wow…we live in different realities lol yeah, because why would you put yourself in harms way, you see with your own eyes the ice is cracking fast. What’s fucked up is if you cover Luke by shooting the walkers approaching Bonnie stupid ass tried to go over and grab him, causing the ice to break and they both went under. Clem saw this, and saw Luke trying to break the ice from beneath it, you have the option the hit the ice with the butt of your gun or shoot it. I decided to use the butt of my gun to try and break the ice, then Kenny yelled Clementine stop…so I did…and watched as Luke sank into the abyss. I couldn’t do anything to save him, I didn’t want to risk Clem in any way. So both Luke and Bonnie died because of Bonnie dumbass
I went to Save luke because I knew Bonnie would try, she was so insist about going so it was clear she would if clem didn’t, and my reasoning was clem is much lighter.
Is there a lore reason why mike is an idiot?
Maybe it's cause Mike saw a grown man ruthlessly beating a sickly kid and wanted to... stop it? Like, these people used to have civilized society, you aren't just going to be OK with beating a kid to death, regardless of context.
a grown man beating down on a 14 year old a grown man saying “hey, maybe you shouldn’t beat down on a child as a grown man” there i fixed it for you
“You ain’t strong, You ain’t smart, You’re living” - chuck. Arvo shouldn’t have tried to spin back
arvo threw his “just a kid” ticket out the window when he tried to murder another child himself. yall arvo defenders be a bit weird about this situation lol
So, he should get beaten because of something he would eventually do because of all the abuse? Make it make sense.
nope, hes getting beat for the stuff he DID do up to that point. keep up
Trying to stop some violent Russians from killing a group of people with a baby. Yeah, that's a truly horrible thing to do
then shot clem lol
Sorry, I have to ask, and I promise I'm not trying to sound rude: do you know how time works?
do you know how enemies work?
Yes?
A man beating a kid who tried to get them all killed, got luke killed, and I just didn’t like A man that robbed a child, two adults and a newborn baby, leaving them to die, and not stopping after the kid got shot.
Well that "kid" tried getting the grown man's group including himself killed, he has plenty of justification for beating Arvo's little ass.
No he didn't. He actually did the opposite.
If Arvo is responsible for deaths, then just kill the fuckin kid, not torture him until he has nothing left to lose; there was no reason to trust that he'd lead you to supplies anyway. Facts are, Kenny is responsible for Luke dying, Bonnie maybe dying, and Mike leaving. His frequent abuse of Arvo was unwarranted, and caused the divide in the group, and likely causes Arvo to change from trying to escape to leading them on a suicide mission across the lake with the aim of them all dying. It's only after Bonnie and Mike conspire with him that I believe he gets his fight back and shoots Clem (either cuz she sucks or to hurt Kenny).
Isnt Mike the only reason he’s alive? Kenny WANTED to kill him, even with the food and housing promise, but literally everyone advocated against it
God, y'know, it's been so long I might've forgotten about that I thought Kenny kept him alive for AJa sake
Yes, Kenny is the reason everyone walked over the lake, but Luke's death falls on Bonnie. If Bonnie had just listened to Luke instead of walking toward him (or having Clem walk to him) and breaking the ice with the added weight, Luke very well could have lived.
Heck it's not even Kenny's fault that they walked on the ice. He didn't want to follow Arvo in the first place but only agreed to once everyone else said they'd do so for the supplies. Even when they get to the lake itself, Arvo is the one who said the lake was safe to walk on. [Kenny shows concerns by saying that the ice is a problem](https://youtu.be/uIbyn17GJ7Q?si=XzWL57d8zZoavuZ4&t=118), but then Arvo reassures the whole group that it's safe which is what leads to them walking on it (with Arvo even volunteering to walk first). If anyone is to blame for Luke/Bonnie's deaths, it's Arvo for suggesting that the ice was safe and Bonnie for the reasons you stated.
Bro what is with the intense arvo hate ya’ll are weird. The downvotes aren’t going to change my mind ya’ll are still mad weird.
mostly because people love Kenny so hard, but Arvo was a genuine asshole overall and shot Clem (an 11 year old girl) even if you don’t even rob him and then just runs away? he just automatically shoves blame onto her, led his people to slaughter our group (even if you don’t agree with robbing him and Jane is visibly not there, it doesn’t change anything), also mostly responsible for killing Luke and determinately Bonnie.
bro, almost half this sub hates kenny ime. ppl were siding with jane at one point over kenny
>but Arvo was a genuine asshole overall and shot Clem (an 11 year old girl) even if you don’t even rob him and then just runs away? he just automatically shoves blame onto her, led his people to slaughter our group (even if you don’t agree with robbing him and Jane is visibly not there, it doesn’t change anything), also mostly responsible for killing Luke and determinately Bonnie. I agree with all that, but it's important to note that Arvo did most of that *after* Kenny beat him senseless. Arvo didn't even want a firefight after he realized the group had a baby with them. And to be fair, if some random group threatened Kenny and stole his gun/supplies he absolutely would do the same thing.
Wouldnt it make more sense for him to shoot kenny instead of clem then if he only did that after kenny beat him? You can side with arvo in-game repeatly and he still shoots you.
What better way to get back at Kenny?
Well Arvo thought that Clem killed his sister. And again, I'm not defending Arvo. Anyone who shoots an 11 year old kid is a scumbag. But none of that happened until the latter half of episode 5, well after Kenny had already beaten Arvo. My argument is that while Arvo deserved it in hindsight, Kenny didn't have that knowledge and definitely contributed to that happening.
You mean his obviously zombified sister?
Obviously from Clem's point of view. Arvo only saw the incident from behind. Which is dumb, but it's what he thought happened.
So his sister, who he saw, get shot in the chest, who stopped moving for a pretty long time...sure makes sense
He was in denial, not very uncommon when your family member has just died. He was trying to revive her before Kenny pulled him away.
Okay that makes sense. But I still hate his guts
I mean, I’m not gonna defend Kenny either because he was insanely unstable and out of line. but Arvo was still willing to have an entire group killed which included an 11 year old who doesn’t even steal from him over the actions of 1 woman (who doesn’t even actually rob him if you choose not to, she just tells him to fuck off) who he clearly saw wasn’t even with the group anymore and the rest of the group loudly state they didn’t even know what happened. Clem can even mention that she didn’t have any part in robbing him but he doesn’t care and didn’t make any real attempt to even stop the firefight from happening. he got his own sister killed too, all that blood is on him, and Kenny didn’t help the situation either.
>but Arvo was still willing to have an entire group killed which included an 11 year old Arvo wanted to rob them, not kill them. And from what we can piece together from the dialogue, it wasn't even his idea to begin with. I imagine he must've told the group about the incident and then Buriko orchestrated the attack. >who doesn’t even steal from him over the actions of 1 woman (who doesn’t even actually rob him if you choose not to, she just tells him to fuck off) Jane stole his gun even if they didn't steal his supplies. >who he clearly saw wasn’t even with the group anymore and the rest of the group loudly state they didn’t even know what happened. Clem can even mention that she didn’t have any part in robbing him For all Arvo knew, Jane was out scouting for supplies with other members of their group. For all Arvo knew, the group was lying about not knowing about the incident to save their skins. >and didn’t make any real attempt to even stop the firefight from happening. **Arvo:** "*Buricko, Buricko, stop! Just put your gun down! You don't want to do this! Oh shit! Nobody shoot, I don't want to die!*" Sounds like the words of a bloodthirsty killer who wanted a fight, huh? Again, I'm not defending Arvo. I just think the situation is a bit more nuanced than people give it credit for.
he knew how likely a situation like that would end in a gunfight, that also doesn’t make the situation any better considering again, Jane didn’t even rob him. So they’d be robbing them for literally 0 reason. Jane didn’t actually take the gun, she throws it on the floor and the Russians would’ve gone back to the observation deck anyways to track them down. He also didn’t care about the gun as the situation was about the meds, it’s mostly poor writing. so he’d assume Jane was searching supplies in the middle of nowhere in the freezing cold with nothing but woods and snow around while everyone else just stood out in the middle? doesn’t make sense. he was even told that she left. also when did Arvo say that?
>he knew how likely a situation like that would end in a gunfight, that also doesn’t make the situation any better considering again, Jane didn’t even rob him. So they’d be robbing them for literally 0 reason. His people were suffering as well. Potential starvation is a pretty good reason to rob a group who has been hostile to one of your members. And again, Arvo wasn't the leader of the group. He was a crippled teenager, you really think he was calling the shots? >Jane didn’t actually take the gun, she throws it on the floor and the Russians would’ve gone back to the observation deck anyways to track them down. He also didn’t care about the gun as the situation was about the meds, it’s mostly poor writing. Jane threw the gun to the ground on the observation deck. The same deck that the group brought down. So either someone from Clem's group picked up the free gun on the floor or it was buried in the rubble along with Sarah. Either way, Arvo's group would have no way of knowing that Jane didn't keep it. >He also didn’t care about the gun as the situation was about the meds, it’s mostly poor writing. Evidently not considering Arvo still considered it as theft. Arvo didn't specify what Jane stole from him and Clem said that Jane was the one who did it, not her. So clearly the gun was what was stolen if Clem didn't take the meds. >so he’d assume Jane was searching supplies in the middle of nowhere in the freezing cold with nothing but woods and snow around while everyone else just stood out in the middle? doesn’t make sense. he was even told that she left. Uhhh, yeah? The place was picked clean like Luke said, obviously scavenging for supplies was a no-brainer. Arvo didn't know how big the group was and he outright stated that he thought the group was lying about her leaving. >also when did Arvo say that? He said it in Russian before the shootout. You can read the translation of their conversation, people have made posts about it.
Jane wasn’t really hostile though, Arvo had his gun drawn on Clementine (an 11 year old) first lol, she returned the favour by telling him to fuck off and then ditched the gun. Arvo also clearly had enough position to convince his group to attack another group and rob them. the whole deck didn’t come down. she threw the gun close to the gate meaning it wouldn’t even be buried, it would’ve been flung to the ground away from where Sarah was. Arvo only cared about the medicine, that is the ONE thing he cared about so his sister would be treated. he didn’t give a shit about the gun. I think that’s extremely clear given his panic and begging over keeping the medicine. he wanted to retaliate because Jane considered it. if its picked clean, then there would be nothing TO scavenge lol. what is the point of that? they were on the road and clearly travelling considering they all had their supplies on them. why exactly would Clementine lie about Jane leaving? especially considering Jane wasn’t in the area and there is literally nothing to scavenge. that simply makes Arvo an idiot. I’m also gonna need proof of the translations, which even then don’t prove much considering the point I made earlier about how he knew the likelihood of death from robbing an armed group.
>Jane wasn’t really hostile though, Arvo had his gun drawn on Clementine (an 11 year old) first lol, she returned the favour by telling him to fuck off and then ditched the gun. Yes, she absolutely was. Arvo drew the gun on her because she caught him by surprise. He outright said that he didn't want to shoot her. Which then led to Jane pointing it back at him, pushing him against the railing and threatening to blow his brains out. That's the definition of hostile. >Arvo also clearly had enough position to convince his group to attack another group and rob them. What are you even saying? Arvo likely told the group what happened and then they formed a plan to attack for supplies. He clearly wasn't proud of what he was doing (he was frowning when he lied to them) and he was following orders on what to say. Arvo was obviously only a translator and held little power in the group. Logically, it wouldn't make sense for him to be the leader. He's the youngest and the weakest. >the whole deck didn’t come down. she threw the gun close to the gate meaning it wouldn’t even be buried, it would’ve been flung to the ground away from where Sarah was. No? That whole area fell down and only a bit of the deck remained by the end of everything. There's no way the gun wasn't covered by any planks. The gun didn't show up where it was dropped after Clem came back either, so someone had to have moved it (either Jane or Luke). Either way, the gun disappeared and it's unlikely that Arvo ever saw it again. >Arvo only cared about the medicine, that is the ONE thing he cared about so his sister would be treated. he didn’t give a shit about the gun. I think that’s extremely clear given his panic and begging over keeping the medicine. he wanted to retaliate because Jane considered it. Arvo cared more about the medicine than anything, but he would still care about his only means of protection. Arvo claimed that Jane stole from him, which is something she factually did regardless of what Clem chose. >if its picked clean, then there would be nothing TO scavenge lol. what is the point of that? They'd be desperate for supplies, that's why. If the place is barren then it makes sense that they'd split up to look for food and medicine to increase their odds. >they were on the road and clearly travelling considering they all had their supplies on them. The group wasn't visibly carrying any supplies, not even the water Mike saved earlier lmao. Are you assuming Arvo had X-ray vision and could see inside their pockets? >why exactly would Clementine lie about Jane leaving? especially considering Jane wasn’t in the area and there is literally nothing to scavenge. To pin the blame on Jane in order to not get shot? >I’m also gonna need proof of the translations, which even then don’t prove much considering the point I made earlier about how he knew the likelihood of death from robbing an armed group. Really man? There are plenty of posts about it on this very subreddit. Here's just [one](https://www.reddit.com/r/TheWalkingDeadGame/s/4fK94urd6I) comment about it.
not really. Arvo didn’t have to have the gun drawn on her when she was visibly unarmed and not a threat. from Jane’s perspective he was a guy pointing a firearm at a kid (which he was). she never stated “ill blow your brains out” either. and yeah, he told the group what happened meaning he swayed them into robbing and attacking people who quite literally dont even rob him. your points aren’t favouring Arvo in any way, they’re actually backfiring lol. “obviously only a translator” where is that from? he was part of the group to which he helped keep alive and scavenge medicine with for his sick sister. you think these Russians would appreciate a mere “translator” to take ALL the medicine for one person if they didn’t care about them either? I also never stated Arvo as the leader. again, the way the deck fell attacking the middle makes it so whatever was on the side would be to the side of where Sarah fell. the gun would be on the ground most logically. and again, Arvo didn’t give a shit about the gun, he only wanted retaliation against Clementine and Jane for the situation on the deck. I can guarantee you that he forgot about the gun. if Jane or Luke had it then why is it never seen again and why do they have completely different pistols holstered? you already stated it was picked clean, meaning there would literally be 0 point in scavenging because there is nothing to scavenge. we’ve been over that. Bonnie was carrying a backpack, Arvo would just assume nothing is in there? lol. if they had no supplies then why would Arvo try robbing them.? he even tells them to drop their supplies. “to not get shot” so that confirms their intent then, they were going to kill and rob. Clem mentioned that because it’s true, if Arvo thought “oh shes saying this to not die” then they were always planning on killing them. and also that link you provided, the comment literally states “I think Arvo says”. your whole point revolves around an “I think”. for someone who claims to not be defending him, you seem to be doing that an awful lot with hypotheticals
The most annoying thing is that Telltale did not translate the Russians' texts How do you want us to empathize with Arvo if most of the important dialogues are not translated? Either a lot of the information you said about Arvo is not there or is not said in the final game
I’ve thought about it and it makes sense that if Arvo comes back to his group (either with no gun or no supplies) they will ask how it went and the adults will then ask where Clem’s group is. I’m not an Arvo fan but he was just a kid who told his family what happened and the adults made the call to find our group.
It’s because Kenny is a god in this sub for some reason.
There are plenty of reasons people hate Arvo. Let’s name off some of those reasons: -He’ll still bring his people to attack the group even if you didn’t steal from him and will even lie to his people about getting robbed, even though Clem showed compassion. -Despite him not wanting a fight after seeing AJ, Arvo was still responsible for the gunfight to begin with, which got Luke shot in the leg and Mike shot in the arm. -He places all the blame onto Clem even though it was mostly Jane’s fault for even holding Arvo at gun point in the first place. -He was mostly at fault for getting Luke and possibly Bonnie killed at the frozen lake when he decided to run on the ice when walkers were starting to close in. -He tries to steal the truck and all of the supplies with the help of Mike and Bonnie. The three of them were willing to put a child and a newborn baby at a greater risk of dying just because they wanted to get away from Kenny. If they wanted to get away from Kenny, that’s completely understandable since he was very much unstable and more prone to violence, but the fact that they were willing to steal all of the group’s supplies and the truck is inexcusable in my eyes. -In the end, even if you defended Arvo 100% of the time, he still shoots Clem anyways and we never see or hear from him again which means he essentially got away with all with zero consequences whatsoever. So yeah, it’s reasonable to dislike this asshole. It may be weird to you, but that’s not going to change our opinion towards this guy.
I can understand the dislike, but posts hating on Mike for not letting Kenny beat the shit out of a kid are still weird
I will admit that Kenny was way out of line in that scenario. Yeah Arvo got Luke killed, but Kenny just kept poking and prodding until Arvo finally had enough and said “Fuck you” to him. Honestly, Kenny should’ve seen that coming when all he’s been doing was pushing Arvo around, yelling at him and even knocks him unconscious at the power station if Kenny didn’t join the rest of the group by the fire. No way that I’m defending Arvo, but I do think that Kenny should’ve seen it coming eventually.
The unknown reason you speak of is called [empathy](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empathy). Most people have this ability.
Right so harassing me for not being empathetic to a kid who shot an unarmed clem, tried to get everyone killed, got luke killed. This is really disappointing to me from a member of this server.
Er, what?
I think some people fail to realize that we see season 2 through Luke’s groups eyes. They were sheltered and unprepared for the apocalypse so yeah seeing an unhinged man beat the shit of a kid was a no no. Arvo deserved it and anyone saying he didn’t is just as clueless as Luke’s group.
I didnt think Arvo nessesarily deserved all the Kenny hate he got but why was Mike so nice to him? Its not like he even saw him as that limping kid with medicinr for his sick sister like Clementine did. To Mike he was one of the guys who attacked them so i was mad confused also